SC EP:1217 Memorable moments from 2025

It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind and it either heard me or smelled me and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up and that shocked me. They don't make people that big. The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the beach. I've never seen anything moves like that in my life. They were screaming at each other in gibberish. It sounded like a language and they were chuntering away back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet but what I saw was. What do you think? Jesus Christ you better. Hello. Get somebody out here. What's going on downstairs? It's a lot of a mess. It's about 6 foot 9 on all. Easy to mouth, sir. Yes, but we're going to ride in. Oh, oh, oh, very Christmas. Merry Christmas. Wishing you peace, warmth and a little bit of wonder this holiday season. May your days be filled with good stories, good company and moments that stay with you. I wanted to share with you some memorable interviews from 2025. The very first one that came to mind was Andy, who is a retired NYPD police officer. He moved to Pennsylvania and went fishing late one night. As he approached the dock, he saw what he thought was a bear. Andy says, I saw it from behind and it was been over with its arms in the water. This thing was making strange sounds like it was talking to itself. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, chew me an email. My email address is west at saskwatchcronacles.com. And if you get a chance to check out saskwatchcronacles.com, you can become a member and get additional shows. Andy later said, I never believed in Bigfoot until I saw it. I'm originally from New York City. I moved out here about maybe up to about five years now. I really like it out here. It's quiet. I like nature when you get out of New York. But I never thought that these things were real. You know, New York City. The most we have, you see out there at raccoons maybe once in a while at nighttime or a rat or something like that. Yeah, I've heard New York has some pretty big rats. Oh yeah. I've got rats and dogs and things like that. And occasionally homeless people, you say, but this was something totally different. Well, if you would take me back two years ago, kind of start from the beginning, what were you doing and what happened? Would you end up seeing? Okay. Well, about two years ago, well, I live in a part of Pennsylvania called Kingston. And if the Sasquahana River separates Kingston and Wilkesbury. And the Sasquahana always had good fishing in about two years ago, a guy called a Reconnaissance Catfish. And he was in a news and he explained that he'd go out at nighttime and shine light and call him a nice big size catfish. And I think when I was in New York, I enjoyed fishing. I'm sort of peed on my fishing license and I said, you know what? I'm going to go out there early. Very early like Sunday night going into the morning time. I went out about three o'clock. And to get over to Wilkesbury, so you have to cross the bridge. And there's like a college community up on the side. And there's steps that you can walk down going to where the Sasquahana is at where you can fish. So I parked my car and got all my gear together and I go up on the steps. Because I'm walking up the steps to go down to where the fishing area is at I hear like mumbling, mumbling and grunting. And I'm thinking maybe somebody's already done it fishing. You know, I purposely picked Sunday because out here it's kind of a fashion. People sleep late on Sunday. Nobody would be out there. I thought I'd be by myself. And I went over and I started going down the concrete steps and I looked down. They have lights that's all, I don't know if you would call it a pier or it's like a park area in this woods and in this river. And the lights is not directly there, but you can see what I thought I saw was a bear bent over. And right away I'm thinking where there are any cubs around around. You know, I don't want to get attacked by a bear. But this pier was grunting and mumbling. It would not explain it. It was like, like he was talking to somebody. Like he would bring noises like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then you did it with snort and grunt and pull back. Like you've pulling something out of the water. So I stayed quiet and I watched it. And as I'm watching it, just then the light that was above me on the steps clicks on. And that's when this thing stood up, turned its torso and looked at me. And I'm looking at it. I'm trying to figure out what it is. It's not a bear. I dropped the fishing rod. And I remember I dropped the rod and I stepped on it because I didn't want it to roll down the stairs where it was at. And looked at the rod and then looked back up at me. And it did like a, like showed its teeth. Like you ever see how to chip the chimpanzees showed it teeth? Like you ever seen that show BJ in the bear? No, I don't think I've seen that one. BJ McKay, he was a trucker and he had a pet chimpanzee. It was called BJ in the bear. He used to come on when I was little. And every time you say something, it would like smile at him and show his teeth. Like you know how the chimpanzees do? Yeah. They like this. Yeah, it did something like that. It had like these square teeth. I didn't see canines or nothing. And it looked at it. Look at that. My fish and poll looked at it. Then it raises its arm. And it has like this long hair is dripping wet. And it raises its arm and it pulls up a catfish. It was about maybe, I don't know, a foot foot and a half long. And it starts swaying back and forth. And I'm looking at it and I'm still, my mind is like, what the hell is that? And it had big round eyes. Very muscular. The fur, the hair or whatever one of the quality was because it was wet. It was clean to its body. But you could see the muscles. Like you know the five muscles and the shoulder muscles. Very skinny waist. And I went down slowly to pick up my fishing rod. But I'm not keeping my eyes on it. And it's swaying back and forth and it starts swaying the fish in the water. And when I couldn't, because I'm what I'm watching it, I couldn't see where the rod was at. I looked down and picked up the rod. And when I look back up, it's going underneath the bank of where the river is falling underneath there somewhere. And that's when I grabbed my rod and I went back and I went back to the car and I sat down and I'm like, what did I just see? And it's been bothering me ever since. That was pretty much the whole experience. But I wasn't a far away from it. I was maybe 15 feet. 15 feet is pretty close, ma'am. It's really close to one of these things. When the creature made its exit, what did it do? It crawled underneath the bank. Have you ever been by like the bank of a river and it's like you can go underneath the bank? It looked like it did that. It looked like a crawl. I don't know if it has a cave up under there or it dug out a hole or something but it crawled up under there. And I turned around and I went back over and I went to my car and I was like, what did I just see? I know it was in a homeless person. It looked like... It looked like... You never see like a person has like mental issues like a mental retarded person. It looked like somebody like that had sex with a ring of tang. It had that type of look in the face, very wide mouth, but the eyes had that type of... You know how I'm trying to think of? Like people with Down syndrome, you know how all the Down syndrome people look alike, no matter what ratio they have that type of look? It had that type of look around the eyes. Yeah, I've heard that from other eyewitnesses as well. When they talk about it, they'll say it kind of has that look. And I've wondered over the years if it's something with the eyes because other people describe the eyes as being kind of sunken. So when you walk up on this saying and you're watching it, are you at an elevated position? Right, right. I'm looking down at it. And you have to go down the stairs to get to the rivers at where you can stand on a... I don't know what you would call that, I guess, right on the bank of the river and fish. So I'm looking down at it. And when the light came on, when the light came on overhead of me for some reason, that light that wasn't on, it clicked on. I dropped a pole, it heard the pole. And it turned around like re-sliding. It's whole body, not its head, not as the top half of the body turned and later turned around. White one too. And it just looked at me. Then it looked at the stuff in my hands and looked at the pole and raised its arm like to show me the fish. I don't know if that's what it was doing. Raised its arm and then I can see the hair hanging from the arm who was dripping water off. And it held the fish and it started swaying back and forth, swaying and slapping the fish in the water. Like if to say, look what I got, don't come down here or something like that, you're not getting this fit. That's the impression I got. I don't know if that's what it was doing, but it was swaying back and forth. And it showed me its teeth. I don't know what that means in the primary world. I know if a dog shows you his teeth, he's going to bite you. Something told me to freeze. I don't move. Because I've been around other type of animals and I don't want this thing to set off. You know, you run and it starts to go after you. It starts like a prey drive or something. So I just rose. And when I slowly went down the pick up the rod and I was so busy looking and I didn't see where I was reaching, I looked down for two seconds, two seconds to grab the rod. I looked up. I saw the back of it going up under the bank of the river. That's how fast it moved. There was two seconds. Yeah. You know when nonhuman primates smile at you and show you their teeth, it's not a good sign. I think we're actually the only primate that shows its teeth and smiles. And it doesn't mean I'm going to kill you. You know, I was curious about the swaying. Was it swaying from side to side? Yeah, it's swaying from side just like the chimps do when they, I don't know if you watch these national geographic things and they grew up something and it's swaying and it's swinging it. And you just what he's doing, he's making the grunt snort noises and something like something like that and everyone's all going to go and do that. That was pretty much the whole thing. I think that the color was a tannish color but the skin was like a, it was like a, I wouldn't call it a gray, like a slate. Maybe a slate color, a light gray, kind of leathery looking. Um, that's what the skin on the face. Then the rest was here and then you could see the belly skin and the rest was standing in the water. Yeah, my opinion is when they're swaying like that from side to side, I think they're nervous. This is my opinion, of course. But you'll see it in gorilla behavior. Um, they'll rock, often rock themselves if they're stressed or anxious or even we do that. We'll kind of humans will as being primates, we will rock ourselves too as kind of a comforting behavior. But I kind of think when these things do that, they're swaying from side to side. I almost think it's like a nervous, a nervous reaction. Um, you did a pretty good job at describing it. But when you were looking into the face, what are their details kind of stay with you today, even beyond the face? What kind of details stay with you today? And did it remind you of a human? The eyes didn't look huge. The eyes were like big round eyes. I didn't see any whites, like big round black eyes. Um, far as human. The only thing I could say is a downstairs syndrome thing. It sticks in my head. And the mouth was really wide. Like there was the eyes and those in the mouth went from cheek to cheek. And when it smiled, it had square teeth. Uh, smiled or showed me a teeth. It did with square teeth. It looked like, it looked like, like I said, a downstairs syndrome person has sex with an orangutan. It looked like, just when it looked like, when I dropped the rod, the rod in real, it looked down at it. It's like, it was watching me and it, it looked, it's like it followed it for. It looked down at it. It looked back up at me. It looked down at it. And I, it was my ride was going to fall down the stairs. I didn't want it to go near it. I didn't want to threaten this thing in any way. I stepped on it. And I reached down. It was like to pick it up and it, it watched me and it started swaying like, I don't know what it thought the rod was. Did it, I was going to try to hit him with it. I don't know. And it, uh, started splashing the fish in the water. I looked down to grab the rod when I look up. It was almost gone. I know your background is from New York and your former, uh, NYPD and, uh, you know, cops, especially in New York are very no nonsense. And, um, I get that, you know, but you're having this in Canada. You're in Pennsylvania and you're seeing this saying before any of this happened to you, what was kind of your take on the whole subject of Sasquatch? What was your feelings about the subject? You know, it's funny when I first moved out here about five years ago, I saw these guys and these cars and they were like, if you've seen a sauce watch contact us and hit the numbers on the cars, I laughed at it. I didn't, what really says something about it, but I would always seem drive around Sasquatch hunters are numbers such and such. If you've seen a Sasquatch and blah, blah, blah, um, I didn't think anything of it. I didn't, I didn't, you know, I always thought it was a joke. I always thought it was somebody just open the suit trying to do things for you to try to do. Um, but then after this, I've been doing research on research. I've listened to your show YouTube videos. Um, on my lunch break, I go on the thing I had just trying to make sense of it, trying to, and then I find out that, um, these things are all over the world. People have seen these things, but I, I saw one for my own two eyes. So I know they're real. Let me ask you, you know, you went from not really believing in this and not really putting too much thought into it and kind of maybe thinking it was a little nonsense. And that's okay. I mean, I think the overall idea of Sasquatch does sound ridiculous until you run into one. Uh, but how did this kind of affect you afterwards? A change my life, um, I don't, I used to, when I first see, I retired from the police department in New York. When I came up here, I bought two family home and the home needed some some work and I would do a door dash job. And the best time of your job door dash out here is the nighttime. Friday, Friday, Friday, Saturday nights, people all over the country making nice a bit of money. I couldn't go out at night time anymore. Um, there's a place called mountaintop where it's pretty much like country. And if people order, I'm in the city part. You can drive up the indicator, big tip to bring the food. There's all trees. There's no lights up there. There's no anything. And one night I went, I just got out of cap and he says, well, leave the water on, on the porch. And as I get out the car, I got that feeling like something's watching me. I got the same feeling is when I stared in the eyes of this thing. I'm looking around. It's pitch black. I can't see anything. I put the order on his porch and I ran to the car as I'm driving. I'm looking at all the trees from side to side. Aside as like a nervous wreck. I don't, I don't go out at night. I got something to do at that job. I got a job with the hospital police and the guys in your hospital up here. And I, um, I work from seven to three. I get home, I come inside, I put spotlight in my yard, I have a couple of dogs. I won't let them out. And so I make noise and put the lights on if anything's back there. Um, I mean, I've had a couple of dreams about it. Right. It's like your brain is trying to figure out something that's not supposed to be real. Yeah, that's exactly what it's like. And I was curious if you had dreamed about it. I think it's a pretty common thing. I mean, even after my encounter, I dreamed about it for months. And I think maybe it is a way of the brain, kind of our subconscious trying to heal or trying to maybe deal with what we've seen. Um, you know, I always say fisherman get the brunt of the aggressive behavior. You technically weren't fishing. You walked up on one that was actually trying to get food. And you would think that would be very dangerous, you know, a lot of times with these things, when it comes to hunters, they're aggressive, but not quite like the way they are with fishermen. And I kind of think it's because of the gun. Um, you know, I even had a, I witnessed on the show one time. He had a walking stick and he had kind of pointed it towards them. Like you would a gun and they reacted like it was a gun. And it makes me wonder, you know, in this situation, you drop your, your rod and reel, um, and then you're reaching down to pick it up. I almost wonder if it was thinking that's a weapon. And then it kind of quickly exited. I mean, well, why do you think it quickly exited and just try to get out of there? Obviously you weren't a match for it. I think that's what it was. And you know, it's a foot in the thing. I don't go anywhere. This is, uh, this is a, um, concealed carry state. I don't go anywhere without my, my, um, nine millimeter on my hip. I had it that day and didn't even think about using it. I had it right on my side, the old time. It's like your brain freezes. Like people say, well, why don't you take a picture? Why don't you take your, it's like seeing the ghost or something. The mind freezes and it's trying to process it. Um, I think that when it's, so many reach for the rod, it probably thought it was something. But it was going within two seconds. I just caught the tail end of it going up under the bank. Now, I don't know if it has a cave up under there, but I remember since I've had this experience, listening to shows, I don't know if it was one of your shows or another show, but a gentleman was talking about how he lived in the South and his grandfather told him, don't go to a certain lake because the boogers live up under there. And even during with his friend, something grabbed his friend's leg and pulled him down. He saw the thing was like up underneath the bank and he had caves. So I don't know if this is something he do. If they live up under the caves up underneath the banks and dig out caves and, but when that, when I heard that, it kind of clicked. And I'm like, well, maybe that's what this one is doing. I don't know. Yeah, I do remember that now. I can't remember which episode it was, but I do remember that. You know what's fascinating is the creature was smart enough to fish kind of like they do in the South. I think they call it noodling when they're trying to get catfish. You put your arm down there and the catfish basically bites onto your arm and you pull the fish out. That's kind of sounds like that's what that thing was doing. You'd mention the chattering. You were kind of hearing this weird chattering and then it would snort like a pig when it was trying to pull the fish out. Did it remind you of the Sarah sounds at all when you were hearing that chattering? Sierra, what is that? Yeah, I know you're kind of new to the subject. The the Sierra sounds you'll hear people refer to it as like the samurai chatter. This gentleman Ron Moorehead, great guy. He captured them back in the early 70s. I want to see the activity actually started in the late 60s where they were interacting with these things. And the guys ended up setting up recorders and they captured these things vocalizing back and forth through each other. You hear them in the intro of the show when Claire is talking. Claire is from Great Britain. When she's talking I plug in some of the Sierra sounds. Actually, you know what I have a different clip for you. This is Ron Moorehead's Sierra sounds but this is a little bit different than what you hear in the intro. This is when the two creatures were actually fighting over food. Is this kind of what you heard? cheering Having that pig snort. I swear I've heard some of the pig snorting in there or what I would interpret as that But was that kind of what you heard something like that? Yeah, it was it was like I don't know like something like that but more like Alomax type would talk like somebody that had mental it was like Every time I would tug you would make a snort sound and I sit there and watch it Must've been like three minutes before I like clicked on And it was pullback and it was hunched over so I'm seeing the the rear of it and it looked like a like a bear And it was bulky like that like a bear's reach so we had a hunch in its back And I'm watching it and I'm like what is it doing? Was it trying to pull is it stuck is it in a light clicked on? It it it it raises up This is turns torso looks up at me and we just lock eyes Have you ever come back to that place? I've gone back in the daytime and I've seen people fishing there and I just didn't watch them and I look all around I watch it because I've talked other people about this and They look at you like your crazy you get all type of I told the buddy that girl put these like my little brother We grew up little together and he'll joke you call me names. They're gonna be a foot guy this and that will send me Funny things to my fun. They don't take you seriously So I just stop talking to people about it, but it really it really shook me up Like I said, I won't go if I go out at night. I'm in the car and I'm there. I won't go anywhere Is any woods or anything? Because this thing look like you get ripped into pieces Just a muscular friend didn't look like I've heard stories there like already 19 feet tall wasn't at all maybe I'm a big guy. I'm six foot about 280 pounds This thing look like it was maybe six six four Six five, but it was all muscle no fat no It look like the legs look like he could elite the onto the stairs and jump on me That's how that's a muscular thighs were Yeah, listening to the behavior of kind of what it was doing Makes me think that it was a juvenile or a younger one and Hearing that it was probably six five makes me even more think that it was probably a juvenile When you went back there did you kind of look over the edge to see if you can see where it went? No, I can work myself up to do that I would I'll go by the stairs and I watched the people fish all look over but I won't um I Wanted just the way this thing looked at me in the face like It was I think if you bite you'll bite your wrist off or something I couldn't do that There's only one gentleman that took me seriously The job that I'm working at now he told me a story About how before he was doing this jump see where I live at There was a lot of coal mines and before they can build buildings on the coal mines they have to fill them up with concrete So it does I guess the foundation is strong enough force of building or collapse in or whatever and that was his job He was a driller and he would fill up and he said a lot of places he went to remote areas They were start to drilling he would see them run out the caves um and How I got to meet him is because I would go on a lunch and I would listen to your show by listening to any says you always listen to stuff. He said you seen one And I decided to tell my city. I saw one you so I used to see him too and that's when he told me story about The job he did so I guess he's living to live in the mines they live in the caves on the ground they come out and Do what they do I don't know Yeah, and you know there's a lot of reports of them and it looks like they're utilizing caves Or abandoned buildings as kind of a shelter or a temporary shelter It makes you wonder sometimes. You know it. I've been in this for a little bit of time now And sometimes it feels like you're chasing a ghost. Sometimes it feels like it's like where do they go? Um, I was real curious if there was some sort of cave system Up underneath that You know cliff or the edge of the water But I get why you didn't go back down there and take a look I really think that you ran into a juvenile of one of these things and even with your description, you know Um, a lot of eyewitnesses will describe the teeth like you did And it's probably the most common way people will describe the teeth. They'll say they look like chicklets Sometimes other people run into what I think is the subspecies of these things and the teeth are very different But I've had eyewitnesses go yeah their teeth look like chicklets and when it opens its mouth This thing look like it could put a couple baseballs in its mouth no problem This thing look like it should uh A cannibal pumpkin and just Trap it in half. That's how wide the mouth was softball easy um Like um, I'm just looking at it like look the hell is that I don't think you did it did it did it in our rangatang escape From zoo But then when I look in the face I'm like that's not a Is that a person? They look like both that's the same thing I can say it look like both I don't know if there was another one there and it was all because I was fixed on this one And it could have been another one there like this is three something in the morning And maybe I don't know because there's nothing but woods all all up and down the um Susanna Yeah, through eyewitness testimony. I mean I can tell you my opinion of course I don't think that they're ever really alone This one being what I think is a juvenile the way it was acting how reacted to you You know what the one thing that really uh stays with me about your encounter I've had other eyewitnesses report Uh the pig snorting sound I'll or they'll say it sounded like a pig, but it wasn't quite a pig And just now listening to the syria sounds again that other clip I played for you Uh, and maybe I'm maybe I'm dreaming, but when you listen to that there's a few times where it sounds like it stores like a pig Yeah What is it doing? I'm first I thought it was stuck. I thought it was a bear in it stuck But then I'm like here's don't talk I When the turn on look to me it's like My heart stop Your brain is trying to process something that shouldn't be there. That's the only way I can describe I think these things like I've been doing my research. I think these things sit and watch people Um, I heard a lot of stories where they say they uh There'll be no woods and they watch everything you do they watch it I had a uh I had a fission pole and I had a knife full so a knife was in my pocket But I had a fission pole with the little um Bucket had a bucket and I had a little woot tackle box And I don't know maybe you figured the pole was a weapon And when I went to pick it up it took off Um, I'm glad it didn't attack me Yeah, I'm glad it didn't attack you either You know and and like I said before I think most of the time they'll leave you alone It's only when you engage with them people get hurt I know that you're kind of new to the subject Andy and I ask everyone on the show What do you think Sess Quatch is and there's no wrong answer of course because no one really knows But what is your opinion? What do you think Sess Quatch is? This is the part that that bothers me like Because I believe in God believe this creator But since I've been doing my research on these things, I honestly at the at these things that are original Neanderthals that everybody thinks is extinct because they're They have them here. They have an in Russia. What did they call it? The Elmastia something? They have an uh China uh, uh, uh, it's called the Aaron They have And Himalayas, what is it? The uh, a Bible snowman? The Eddie? Well, I think there's even a little one on it. I think they never really went extinct. And maybe something, or railings or something, she seemed to have been on a mess with the DNA and, and we're the out, we're the, we're the outcome of it. I don't know. I'm thinking they, I think in the end of the post didn't really go extinct. I think they're original inhabitants and maybe we're where the abominations and they stay away from us and maybe they're waiting for us to kill ourselves over so they can come back out. Maybe they don't have children as frequent as we do. That's why we don't see as much of them. Maybe they go into there. Their females go into their, uh, their cycle once every couple of years or something like that. I don't know. But I think they're, I think they're the, uh, they're the, um, what would they say was any, the end of those and, uh, and us, right? And then we were supposed to, we killed them all out. But I think what they didn't, I think, uh, because I watched a lot of this stuff. Like, I was watching a program where a whale was up on a beach. It was a whale, a great whale, and it was bitten in half. What, what the hell bites a whale in half? It's gotta be like a man with a lot of stuff like that, but those are supposed to be extinct, right? Um, they're still around. I think, I don't know, the same thing I could think of that will bite a whale in half. I think that there are a lot of this stuff we, we think is not as gone. Maybe it's all not gone. Maybe still here. We're so busy on day to day lives. That maybe we should just stop and take a look. You know what I mean? You know, I do remember that blue whale that was bitten in half. That was like 10 years ago or something like that. Maybe a little bit more. Um, and a blue whale, if you remember his right, they're like 110, 120 feet long. I think they weigh over like 300,000 pounds. Um, and I do remember that because they stacked a bunch of school buses. And it was several school buses for the length of this whale. And it was bitten in half. I mean, it, it doesn't make you wonder what bites a whale in half. It's got to be like a megalodon or maybe a pierce or something that's still in the water. Um, I think a lot of the stuff is still out there. And we as people, we think that we're the only thing. I was watching another thing when they have teradactos in the Midwest. People say they see things like teradactos in the, in Arizona hills and the mountains that come down in a nighttime and hunt. Like, and then the Congo distorts to be dinosaur. So we're like way like a, some type of thing that that that chases off elephants and hippos. Who says this stuff all that out? You know what I mean? Yeah, I definitely understand where you're coming from. It reminds me of, uh, what was that fish? The seal of camp. Uh, that fish that they rediscovered, quote unquote rediscovered. I think it was back in almost a 1940, might have been 39. Uh, but it was this fish that scientists said, oh, yeah, that thing, you know, it's been gone for 360 million years ago is the last time it was on this earth. And sometimes I wonder where they get some of those, those time frames. But I think it was a bunch of guys in Asia that were catching them. And they're like, oh, yeah, we eat them every night. What are you talking about? These things are extinct. You know, uh, they had no clue. So I do understand where you're coming from. I can tell you my hang up with, um, Sasquatch being a neanderthal. But I'll come back to that in a second. You know, you'd mentioned they're all over the earth. I mean, there's reports in Russia. There's reports in Australia. There's reports in Asia. Uh, they're everywhere. You know, when you read a report from Russia, like with the almas, it sounds like, uh, a big foot report from North America. Uh, they're seeing the same thing we are. It might be slightly different, but generally speaking, it's the same thing. And you know, even when I have people who have these things on their property, and it's not one encounter, they're seeing it multiple times over multiple years. And even then I'll ask them, where do you think that they're going? This is your property. You know, your property. Well, where do you think they go at night or wherever? And the answer is always, I don't know. Can I ask you a minute? Why do you think it's so hard to catch up with them? Um, I think they use the night. I think they've become nocturnal because of, I guess, people on machines or weapons or stuff. Maybe they use the night. They can use the night to hide and move and do what they got to do. Most of times we sleep at night time. I think they just master's of their environment. And they move so fast. Like, you're not going to outrun this thing. You're not going to outmuscle it. You got a gun. You better have good shot placement or something like that can blow off its arms or something like that. Because it's an way to build a number of pieces. I just think that's what it is. They come on at night, do what they got into, and they go back and sleep during the day. And I'm like, I remember hearing watching a program in the Native American said that they would come and they would smell them in a night time. And they would inept their device and their kids and stuff like that. But they would always come out at night and they would come out at a mile. So maybe that's just, maybe they're nocturnal. Yeah, it could be. It could be. I'm more skeptical. I guess it just seems weird to me. And I have thought about them being in the Anderthal before. And I actually like that theory a lot, Andy. But where I kind of get hung up with in the Anderthal is they weren't that big. I think your average female was about five foot tall. I think your average male was about five five. Your average Sasquatch report is like seven feet tall. So that's my only hang up with the Anderthal's. Not only height, but I don't think there was big as like Sasquatch is reported or eyewitnesses have seen. The Anderthal, while more stocky than us, more sturdy, more thick than us, doesn't come close to a Sasquatch. That's my opinion, of course. But is it the one that they found what is that total of all of the Anderthal's? And the goals I remember they showed the Hobbit people they had said it was the family was loose. He shows a Hobbit person. It shows only four foot something. Or maybe another region they grow bigger. Maybe I don't know. It's just like people we come in all shapes and sizes. Maybe the one that they've done the skeleton they found were five something. But did I have stories of the fine skeletons of giants that are. Eight, nine, ten feet. Like, I don't know. Yeah, you're right. You're right. It's hard to argue with that. We do pull giant skeletons out of the earth and it makes you wonder what they are. You had brought up Lucy. Lucy was actually an Australia epithicus. She wasn't actually a Anderthal, you know, for whatever that's worth. It's such a weird fossil record we have. And, you know, I just kind of got cut up on the Anderthal thing when I researched him. This is many years ago. There's actually a guy named Danny Vindermini. He wrote a book called Them and Us. And he talks about the Anderthal. And he thinks that they're alive and well, even up until today. I try to get him on the show. But he didn't want his theory being confused with Sasquatch so he wouldn't come on. Which is okay. You know, let me ask you. I mean, if you had the chance, would you want to see another one? I would. But I'd have to be more prepared. I have to, I don't want to see one by shock. I want to know that I'm going to look and it's going to be over there. Can have the right five power to find myself. And I would just. I want to be able to take a photo or just sit and watch and. Cause it's like. You're looking at it's like seeing the ghost, you know, you're looking at something that. I've never seen a ghost in my life, but I guess this would be the equivalent of seeing one. Like, what is that? Is that supposed to be? Is that what is a million questions go through your head? And you just freeze. You just freeze. Yeah, you're right. You do freeze. You do freeze for sure. I've often said it wouldn't be bad to see another one, maybe from a helicopter or from a tank or something like that. It's an amazing account. And I want to thank you for your service as a police officer. And I know that's a tough gig. I know many years ago, I thought about becoming a cop. And now I'm kind of glad that I didn't. But I do respect the guys that serve our country, put the badge on and try and keep order. You know, after all your years as a cop, is there one call that kind of stays with you today? Something like you couldn't forget. It was a real odd call. One call that I can remember was we got called with domestic violence and we've showed up to the house. Women were screaming, but it was towards the back of the yard. And we ran around the back up on the porch. They had a sliding glass doors where you can go into the deck to the kitchen. We looked at the glass door and there was a sky attacking the woman. So we broke into the glass to stop them. This guy was like, he felt like a broad iron. Like a piece of steel took four of us to hold them down. These people were, they were all flattened. And when one of my partners looked around the house, there was a lot of, what did you call that stuff, the statues of the Ladins Saints, Santa Maria, all the stuff. It's not pentagrams, but they had the statues of the Ladins Saints and candles and stuff. Apparently she was telling us that he was possessed. We thought he was on drugs or something like that. He took them to the hospital, he tested them. There was no drugs in the system. She told us he was possessed by a demon. He could have been taken to the psychiatric place over in New York City. But that's the one thing that stands out the most. That's sorry. But I never forget how strong this guy was. Lila, who is from Tennessee, writes, I grew up knowing about these things. They were on my grandfather's property. He used to feed them. I was terrified of them. My grandfather told me, if he don't hurt them, they won't hurt you. I don't believe that. Lila describes growing up on her grandfather's farm. Well, my grandparents owed 89 acres here. We lived with them while I was growing up. The first thing I really remember was my bed was next to the wall and the window. I can remember every night just looking out the window and thinking this man was standing outside looking at me. When I finally got old enough to tell my grandfather, I said, why is this man watching me every night? And he was like, what? I said, there's a man watching me every night when I go to sleep. Sometimes there's two. And after I told him that, yeah, the window was like a big picture window. And it wasn't very long after that that he redid that window where it was just a tiny window up on the wall, instead of reaching down nearly to the floor. And I would see things in the windows occasionally after that, but never when I'd go to bed, see him actually watching me after that. Yeah, do you think your grandfather knew what it was? Oh, I know he did. He didn't speak to me very much about him, but he would feed him. I, once I got old enough, I would tag a line. And he told me he was feeding dogs. And we were, he had set to play on the ground. And I thought they would stay behind the bushes where we couldn't see him. And I saw the arm come through the trees and grab a chicken leg. I remember it was chicken leg and go back in. And I tried to run away, and I said, Grandpa, that's not a dog. And he said, well, let's just say it's my special dogs. And that's when I knew he knew that he wasn't going to really tell me. And the only class after that that he ever say anything to me once this when I was a teenager. And I heard what sounded like a newborn human child crying in the woods. And it was to middle the night. And I walked into the house and I said, Grandpa, I said, there's a baby over there crying in the woods. He goes, that's not a baby you want to go find stay inside. We had a trailer. And we kept the lawn mower in underneath the trailer in a door where it was underpinned. And I went to go get the lawn mower out to mow farm. And one of them was laying up underneath the trailer. It looked like a piece of road up, a dead carpardine, a lot cancaller. But you could tell the back was to me. And you could tell it was the outline of what looked like a man laying there. But he was to say his fur looked like that old chag carpardine from the 70s. And he never turned around when I opened the door. And when I seen him, I slammed his shot. But he was just like laying on his side with his back, came he. And he couldn't have been more than 15 feet from me when I did that. And just a minute I cut outside, I slammed the door and I went back around. And I came back out and come around and Grandpa says, I thought he was going to mow the lawn. I said, I'm not getting it with that thing in underneath there. And he said, he laughed and he says it's not going to hurt you and he went and got the lawn mower for me. Yeah, I've had a few accounts like this before Lila where coincidentally enough, it's usually the World War II generation, the men now are grandfathers or women or grandmothers. And you'll hear accounts like this. I mean, they're have come forward in the last like 10 years. Makes me wonder why he was feeding it. Growing up on this property, did you ever have run-ins with them when you were out running around on the property? I know they had come up to your window. But did you ever encounter them when you were out just playing in the woods? They, I did it with some people that, their next door neighbor is married, a woman from Mexico. And her family had come up to the visitor and they didn't speak English. And we always picked blackberries in the summer because this place is full of them. And we were picking the blackberries and I was sitting the one woman started screaming and we said, what's going on? What's going on? And she goes, there's a face and a vicious. My grandfather laughed, he says, oh, it's just a cow. And she was going, no, no, this was a human. This is not a cow. And I finally got her sister to ask her, you know, how do you know it wasn't a cow? She goes, I've seen cows, this is not a cow. And they laughed and never came back. The one time that I really seen one good face to face, I was playing and felt like something was watching me. And I looked up and there's, I was in what we call carport. And it was across the road in the woods looking at me. And it scared me so bad that I crawled up an underneath a car. I stayed under that car until I heard voices. And when I came out, there was some men standing and almost at the same place. And they were a good two-fit order than what I had just seen. And it was at least seven and a half foot tall, had black hair and the hair on its head was longer than the hair on its body. And the hair was kind of curly. It was totally, it was so black that it kind of shone blue into sunlight. It had brown eyes, I remember that. And it was just sitting there or standing beside a tree staring at me. It didn't move when I thin it. And it didn't really have any facial expression just staring. And like I said, it scared me so bad I went up an underneath a car. Now remember I went underneath the car because I thought it could get under the truck. But the car was slow enough to the ground where I didn't think it could get its arm up and underneath it to get to me. What was it about it that scared you so much, do you think? Because you already knew at this point they were there. Right. The fact that it was that close, just the way it was staring at me, plus how big it was. Because when I was little I didn't realize how big they were when I was looking through the window. It wasn't until several years later that I realized, okay, wait a minute. This window is good four to five foot off the ground. And where I'm laying, I'm looking up at the top of the window, which was about three to four foot tile. And this, the head is over the top of this window. And it didn't really hit me until I seemed to one staring at me, just how big they were. Did you ever touch your grandmother or what was her thoughts on it? I never talked to my grandmother about it until right before she passed away. And that was in 2006. And she asked me something. And she goes, well, how are you dealing with the big foot? And I turn around and look there and said, what about the big foot? I said, did you see them? I don't know what you're talking about. Well, if you don't know what I'm talking about, why did you just ask me this question? I don't know what you're talking about. And that's all she would ever say to me. My mother, I know, saw them. But she would never admit that that's what she was seeing. That was a old, I think it was weekly world news that back 30 years ago, had a picture of what was supposed to have been the Russian bigfoot capture on the front page of it. And she looked at it and she goes, I've seen something like that. I said, Mama, you've seen the big foot then. No, no, but I've seen something looks like that. After that, she was coming in home from going shopping. And when she come in the door, she says, that big man just ran across the road in front of me. And he wasn't wearing anything. I said, whoa, I said, I said that big foot just ran in front of you. No, no, it was a big man. He wasn't wearing anything. But he come across one fence, landed in the middle of the road. And she goes and just pushed off and went over to fence on the other side and down through the field. And I said, Mama, that was a big foot. And she goes, no, it was not. It's just that big man. And that's how she would ever admit to me. It's just a big man. Why do you think your grandfather was so open to it as far as feeding them? I mean, was he doing this on a regular basis? He was for several years. And then until he got to the point where he couldn't know more. And I don't know why he did it. I think I don't know if he was trying to form a relationship. If he had a relationship, did I just didn't really know that much about? Because apparently he had been feeding them before I was ever born. So I don't know how he came to know that they were here or anything. But we would go up at least once or twice a week to feed them. And but after I saw the arm come out, I would never go with him again. You really didn't fear him? He didn't seem to have any fear. He let us wander all over this place and never said, watch out for anything or anything. So I don't know if he felt they were harmless. I don't trust that. I'll just be honest with you. I do not trust that they're harmless. Because they scared of out of me. And like I said, I won't walk around outside at night. You can't pay me to go into woods half the time. I have to be with somebody to go into woods. I'm sitting out here right now on the back porch, but I won't sit out here at night by myself. Did you end up taking over that land after your grandfather died? I live on the last free acres that's in the family. I've been so down, but I have the last free acres. And do you think, I mean, this is many years on this property and your neighbor even had that incident? Did you ever hear any more from the neighbors over the years? Well, the lady that lived down from us, he was actually, her family had been, my grandfather bought this place in 44. And her family had already been living here at that time. And by the time I was a teenager, she was in her 80s. And she couldn't get around very well. And she had what an old root cellar in the back is where she kept over canned stuff. And she asked me one day, go out to that root cellar and get her some green beans. And I started out her back door and she stopped me and she was waiting for me. She just made me, let me make certain that dams sit here and anywhere. And I knew what she meant to me and she said that, but I'd never heard that word before. And she went and she looked, she came back and she goes, OK, it's safe for you to go out. And that always stuck with me that she wanted to make sure I was safe walking out that door. Yeah, it's interesting what she called them. That's actually a Native American word here in the Pacific Northwest. And the local Native Americans, that's what they called them on top of Mount Sayhelens. That's the name they used for them. Right. And I knew her first husband had been an Native American from the Pacific Northwest. So I just always figured that's where she got the word from. And then I found out years later that it's sure enough that it's from the Pacific Northwest. They're not here like they used to be. And I think it's because there's been a lot of construction and logging done. But occasionally I can tell you when they come back through. If you've been around them and they come through, it's like the hairs on the back of your neck just go to standing at. And I'll hear wood knocks occasionally. And I have heard them flute occasionally. Out of the weirdest thing I ever heard was back a few years ago, my grandparents' old house was empty. And I walked outside to go to my van. And I heard what sounded like a two-year-old throwing a temper tantrum on its matter. But it was all gibberish. You couldn't understand what was being said. And it came from their old house. And every once in a while you would hear what I guess would have been the parent grunt. But I mean just like a two-year-old throwing a hissing fit from hell, to use my language. And I walked back inside and grabbed my niece's boyfriend. I said, come out here and listen to this. And he walked out and he goes, I've never heard anything like that before. And it was so loud that there's no way a child could be at large for me to be that loud. Because it sounded like they was right on top of me. But I could tell they were on the other side of that house. And you're talking about your grandparents' home? Yes. I live about 50 yards from it, but my property is separate from that property now. I wanted to ask you a lie-luck back in the day. There was all this land to kind of run around. And I know it's been sold off over the years. But did you ever notice an area where they hung out the most? Or do you think they were passing through it certain times? Or do you think they were just there all the time? They kind of stay in what I call the back 40. The way the property is set up is you've got like the house and the barn next to the road. And there's a ditch line directly in behind the house. Then a field, which is about a five-acre field, and another ditch line and another five-acre field. And then there was woods on the other side of that field. And those woods back there, it's where they usually would stay. But now when I was real little, it was woods all the way up to the house. And he cut all that down. I was about five or six years old and cleared it out and made it into other fields. I got you. On this property at any point, did you ever see any weird lights? I never saw any weird lights. I've heard, I've listened to your show and heard Eddard's talking about them. The only weird light I've ever had is sometimes when I'm laying down trying to go to sleep. You know, you'll be laying there with your eyes closed and it's like a bright flash of light goes across the bedroom. Like somebody just took a picture with one of them old flash cameras. And you know, open the eyes and there's nothing in the room. No reason for there to have been a flash of light. But I've never seen an orb. Yeah, that's strange. Makes you wonder what it is. What do you think that these creatures are, Lila? What's kind of your take? Well, because I have heard them speak before and actually make out words. I think they're yours some kind of a human. I don't know if they're any underfile. I know scar, carpenter felt they were necklums. And that's about as good as any explanation I can come up with. Now, that's changed over the years. I used to think they were the Jack Antipificus. But just some of the things that I know they did, I don't get that they're just a big eight. They're too smart for that. Yeah, I'm really curious on why you fill that way. Is it based on things that have happened that you've talked about or was there other things that made you kind of come to that conclusion? Well, I'd be unable to get in underneath the house. That was a closed area. And they were able to open that up and get into it. Knowing that a freezer held food, they would open the freezer sometimes and get them. We had a freezer on the back porch. That was accessible. And they would open the screen door and then open the freezer to get some food out. And I don't know any dial or anything that can do that around here. And then when they wouldn't pop out, I could go welcome through the fields to get the horses in. And I always when I hit one area, I'd be welcome. And I was sitting, it'd be okay, you need to run now. And it'd be straight from walking, I got to run. And I always felt like one of them chased me. And he thought he was playing with me. And it was a weird feeling because I'd be running. At least two or three times a year, I'd go through that area and I'd think I got to run. And that went out for about five years. It had to have been a juvenile. And I really think that he thought he was playing with me. Because he never tried to catch me. He just would chase me. And I wouldn't turn around what the scene, you know, how close I was like, I don't even want to see it. And that's what I wanted to take at that time. I wanted to take that time at that time. And that's what I wanted to take at that time. And that's what I wanted to take at that time. And that's what I wanted to take at that time. And that's what I wanted to take at that time. towards me. And they knew to stay hidden. I could tell they knew to stay hidden. I'd have to walk through a wooded area to get to the field. And it was when I would walk through that one wooded area about halfway through it. And like I said, it wasn't every time. It was maybe two or three times a year that would happen. But it would be okay time to run. It would just instantly, and I just always followed my gut. I took off. But you could hear something moving in behind of you. And like I said, I wouldn't turn around and look. I was too scared to look. At any given one time, I mean, how many do you think that there were on the property? I know there was the one I would call the Alpha and his mate. And then there was the black one that was staring at me and the brown one under the porch or under the house. So that'd be at least four. And I took it. Those two were the children of the Alpha one and his mate. And they, I think one of those children is the one that still comes through occasionally. And they don't stay more than a day or so now when they come through it. Why do you think after all the years of being on this property, they were coming up to your window. Your neighbors have seen them. And I know there's a few other things we're going to talk about. But after all the years, you know, them pacing you out or chasing you out, why do you think that they never hurt you? Because a lot of the behavior doesn't sound like I want to kill you type behavior. And even going off of your your theory, Lila, of it being primate, probably something closer to human. You know, even humans will hurt you. There's some bad ones out there. But why do you think you never hurt anyone? The only thing I can think is because grandpa must have had some kind. Because he did feed him. He had been feeding them before I was ever born. Maybe they saw him as a friend. And we were just an extension of that. I know after he passed away and he died in 96, they did tend to be a little bit more aggressive after he was gone. Never outright aggressive, but just breaking branches in behind the house, throwing rocks on top of the house. And they never did that when he was still living. They never came up and hit the house until after he died. So I don't know. Because he had finished. He hadn't been feeding him for at least 10 years before he died. So I know it wasn't just sitting and stomping over the food or anything. So it could only have been they got more aggressive after he passed if they respected him or something. Yeah, it could be. Makes me wonder why your grandfather started feeding them. And I get it. We're all curious. We're I mean, human beings are curious. And sometimes that's the reason. But most of the time when people live out in the country, if you start asking follow-up questions and really drill down on it, what you'll find is a couple things. One, they will do it to get them to back away from the home or trying to get them to back off. You'd mention the freezer. How they would just come up and take food out of the freezer or you'd made mention of your grandfather cutting the forest back. And even with gardens out in the country, a lot of times I'll talk to people in the country and they'll start feeding it so that these things will leave their garden alone. Makes me kind of curious if that's why he was doing it. It might have now he did keep a garden, but the garden is a half mile from the house. And that garden is pretty much right smack where they would stay. So I don't always wondered why he planted the garden so far from the house. And that's the only fact I could ever figure is because he was sharing it with them. Yeah, and that could be the case. That's one thing you'll find very common too is when people have these things on their property and they have a garden, I'll ask them, you know, how far is the garden from the house? And it's always way away from the house. So never hear of it being right next to the home. I wish your grandfather was still around. I'd love to pick his brain, find out when all of this started. And what kind of led up to this whole piece treaty of, hey, I'm going to bring you food. Well, I never found about it until you said this when my matter was a child, there was a fruit orchard in behind the house. By the time I come along, grandfather had cut every bit of those trees down. And all that was left was a couple of apple trees in the front yard and a couple of peach trees in the backyard. So I just wonder if maybe he cut them down to keep them from coming up to the house. Yeah, because otherwise, why would you cut down a fruit orchard, you know, especially on the country? Right. And I never found about that before, but I remember my matter telling me that there had been a fruit orchard in behind the house. The crazy part is, you know, your grandfather kind of comes across like he really didn't fear them one bit. And you know, these things, I was trying to put myself in people's shoes. And you know, if my granddaughter came in and was basically saying, hey, there's these two guys looking at me through the window. And all these other things that happened, I don't know, your grandfather is a better man than I am. Because I probably would have put it into it real quick. But I mean, he really, it's like you guys played out on this property. Well, why do you think he took you that one day to go, quote unquote, feed the dogs? I thought I got the impression that he was letting them know that we were his family and not to mess with us. That this was his family. You've got yours. I've got mine. And like I said, he did feed him. He let him take out that garden outside of coming up to the house occasionally. They didn't really bother us unless we were out in the fields. And even then they didn't really get aggressive. They just be, you could tell they were there. Like I said, that one like he was trying to play. I know they watched the house occasionally because you could, you know when something's staring at you. And you could feel that when he were outside. And I know after he got to where he couldn't feed him anymore, my mother had a trailer in front of the, where he lived at at the time. He had moved in with my matter. And then my mother ended up buying another smaller trailer. That sat like 20 feet in front of the first one. And it had a sliding glass door on it that faced the woods. And she got to the point where she would not stay in that trailer unless somebody else was with her. Because she said she felt like something was going to come through those doors after her. The minute he died, he moved that trailer six miles into town. He never did spend another night out here. Yeah, it's too bad that your mom is in such denial. You know what a lot of people are. It's I think it's kind of a coping mechanism that they do. You know that feeling of being watched and around the home. Sometimes people say they saw a glowing eye. Sometimes people will say it was kind of a reflection and you know your mom specifically saying, hey, I feel like I'm being watched directly from the forest. Did you guys ever see them come in closer to the home and catch eye shine or anything like that? I never saw eye shine. I think my husband has, but he thinks it was something else. So he want to meet to it. He thought it was actually the reflection of the law enforcement badge. And I was like, well, were you say that that was at that way too tall for somebody with a bad. They were writing to people next door. But it was he thinks that he saw him before they actually read it to house. He thought I'd say, fair for nights before they read it to house. He came in and said, I just seen. He is the only fact I can think it is is a reflection of the police badge crossed road in the field. I said, oh, he goes, yeah, he goes. It was in the field and it was above the explorer. And I'm like, somebody standing at field, their chest is not going to be up above the explorer. And this was about 10 o'clock at night and he says, no, no, he goes, had to have been a police badge. That's all it could have been. And just, you know, I was sitting there going, but if it was above the explorer, that's not a bad. Nobody said, oh, I got you. So he was thinking he was seeing the sheriff badge kind of twinkle. But from the other side of the explorer, I mean, I stood on the other side of the explorer. You probably just sit at the top of my head. Very strange. You know, some people might ask, why do you fear them? Because you grew up on this property, nothing has happened in all these years. Yeah, you have this fear for them. And I get it. Believe me, I fear them. So this isn't a judgment call. But you're thinking maybe even that younger one is coming back. Why not kind of explore the property? I mean, three acres is still a lot of land. And to see if they're still in the area, to see if there's still that interaction that might happen. I tried to back a few years ago. And it was kind of, okay, you're falling out from the house. You need to go back now. And it's just that feeling when I do try my sister, Mal, actually was walking through the backfield. And she got chased back to the house. And when she came back to the house, I asked her what was wrong. She goes, something big just chased me through the field. I was like, well, did you see it? She goes, no, but it was huge. And I was like, well, how do you know it was huge if you didn't see it? Just trust me. It was huge. And that was about seven years ago. And so I just kind of stay on my three acres and don't venture off of it. Of the 89 acres that he had, I only have three acres. So that's all owned by other people who private property. So I don't want to intrude on their property. Yeah, I get it. I completely get it. And sometimes I ask questions that I think the audience might be thinking. But it's funny, believe me, I get where you're coming from. You know, your next door neighbor had the experience with them. And a lot of time has passed over the years. Have you ever thought about going and talking to some of your neighbors and asking them, have you ever seen any weird running around here in a weird wildlife? You know, that sort of thing? This is the weird thing back a few years ago. My one neighbor came to me and he goes, hey, he goes, you believe him big, right? And I said, yeah, I do. I've seen him. He goes, well, he goes, I've got something weird in my cornfield. And I said, what do you mean? He goes, there's a circle. He goes, it's not on the edge of the cornfield. We're there and everything. We're there. He goes, it's out in the middle of the cornfield. He goes in there, it's just an area where the eras have been pulled off the stalks, bitten in half and stacked up. I was like, do you use me? He goes, they've been broke off the stalk. They're bitten in half through the silks and everything. He goes, and then they're stacked up in like a pyramid shape. I said, would you see any footprints or anything? And he goes, no, he goes, the ground's too dry right to me in it. He goes, but I put out cages because of, I mean, the first I thought, you know, maybe rat tunes or stuff. And he goes, so I put out cages because I haven't caught anything. He goes, have you ever heard of this before? And I said, well, no, but the neighbor that you rent at the house to, down next to me, which was my grandparents' old house, they had puppies. And the mama dog had them in the ditch line and when they went to get those puppies, I'll six of them were laying in a straight row with the back half bitten off and you could tell they were bitten in half. But the back half was nowhere to be seen just a front half. And I know one other neighbor told me that their son wouldn't go outside because of the bears. And I was like, but the bears are, I'm about, oh, 15 miles from the Cherokee National Forest and about 50 from the Smoky Mountains where I'm at. And there's no black bears down here. So that was weird to us. That was terrible about the puppies. It makes me heat him even more. Yeah. My husband suggested maybe a wildcat had done that because there had been mountain lions come through. Yeah, nothing about that sounds like a mountain lion killed me. It sounds like the same thing that was down in the cornfields, stacking corn. And he said, I had lined up the puppies. They were laid out in a row. And there was six or seven of them. Yeah, mountain lions not going to put everything in a row. That sounds more like these things. They have like a crackhead way of with their food and other things. You'll hear a lot of eyewitness testimony to where they're very particular about stuff like that. What was going on in the cornfield with the corn being stacked up in like a pyramid? These puppies eaten in half and lined up in a row. You know, I really hate to hear that. And I felt like a terrible human being because a lot of times I have more sympathy for animals than I do for human beings, which is a terrible thing to say. Growing up on this property, I mean, you had animals. How did your animals kind of react when they were around the property? Well, we always had German chepherds. That was the only kind of dog we had growing up. And they would stay close to the house. Now, they would walk, if when we'd walk in the fields to get the horses and such, and they would follow us. But like when the one would start chasing me, the dogs would be gone. I never would even see the dogs leave this. They were gone so fast. And I had a big white German chepher at that time, and she disappeared a minute. I'd go through those woods. And the horses and cows, there would be times that it would be very hard to find them on the place. Like they were trying to hide themselves. And I'd have to walk, especially for the horses, sometimes I'd have to walk to a place for four times before I could find where they were. We had like three horses, and they would be like out together, and like as far away from certain areas as they could get. And as usually, you know, with horses they'll be around the field, standing around the field, and they'd be over in one corner. Now I have three dogs now, and they'll hit, I have a fence in backyard, and they'll hit the back fence, and then come up and underneath the porch. And we don't know what they're barking at. They'd put one camera out there in a motion light, but never could see anything. You know, one of the things I wanted to kind of pick your brain on, Lila. Earlier you had mentioned hearing that baby crying sound, and I'd have heard many eyewitnesses report that. Now, whether a Sasquatch is doing that or not, you know, you can argue that, but I kind of think that they are. I kind of think that they are mimicking that sound. And that specific sound, if you ask eyewitnesses, they will say, at first glance, it sounds like a baby crying, but there was something off about it. There was something not quite right. And you know, what's the easiest way to draw a human being out into the forest? Well, I have a baby crying. Anyone with half of a soul is going to go looking for that baby. And I've often wondered, I mean, it feels like an ambush like a trap. Yeah, that at the time, I was only 16 the last time I heard it. But it sounded like a baby, but it was really loud. And I don't think a baby would be that loud. A human baby would not have been that loud, especially the distance the woods was from the house. And I mean, babies can get loud, but they can't get that loud. And the youngest person around us at that time was my niece, and she was five. And this definitely wasn't her. So the direction it came from was to older lady that was telling you about. I hear you. Yeah, I, you know, one of the last things I wanted to kind of ask you, Lila. And everyone's opinion changes. I think if your opinion doesn't change, you've kind of put yourself in a box. Because our witnesses will come forward and they'll say, X, Y, you know, they're creature to X, Y and Z. And if it's one person, you can go, well, okay. But if it's multiple people that don't know each other, and they're all kind of saying the same thing, your opinion has to evolve throughout this whole thing. You, you would think anyway. And I know you went from this same being, Jagannapythogas, to now you're thinking it's some early man. And you could be right, 100%. And I get that because I've had moments like that where all here certain behavior and I'll think, man, you know, I don't know about this thing being an ape. But you know, as your opinion changed over the years, and you had these things on the property, why do you think that they're so hard to catch up with? Well, I started thinking back over different things that had happened. And I was like, okay, an animal wouldn't do this. They wouldn't have just come up and slap the house. Or not free times. And an animal, like I said, I have dogs in the backyard, and they get to back in the house occasionally playing. And it's a totally different sound. And they never do it free times in a row and then wait and do it free more times. And to me, that's intelligence. That's, they're trying to get your attention. Well, they don't want to be found. They don't want to be seen. They know to hide from us. And when you think about it, look at how humans treat each other. They're pretty smart not wanting to be around us. And that's why I'm thinking on what they were, can't. They know how to stay away from us. The ones I think we do see are the ones that are curious and the younger ones. John and Jane are from North Carolina. Both John and Jane admit they didn't believe in Bigfoot until they purchased this home. Things changed in a big way. So, we were moving out of our old house. We had the movers there. They were finishing up. And I told them, my husband, I said, I'll go ahead. I had my car was full. I'll go ahead and go to the house and start unloading it before he get there. So, I came onto the house. It was just getting, it was around 4.30 and it was in January. So, it got dark early. I got out of the car. I had my hands full. I was walking at sidewalk to come to the front door. And I had a pebble or something that was thrown at me and it landed in front of my feet. I thought that was odd. And I noticed that it was extremely quiet out. Of course, here I am. It's almost dark. In an unfamiliar place. So, I kind of thought my imagination was running wild with me. I think there's a couple more steps. And another one landed at my feet. I thought, okay, well, there has to be an acorn tree or something that is around that I can't see. And it did sound like a pebble or stone that hit. So, I went ahead and came on in. I stayed in the house until the movers and my husband come in. And I went outside and sure enough, there were two pebbles on the sidewalk. And it was a brick sidewalk. There was no other pebbles on it. And it was in the same spot that I was at. That was my first indication that something weird. Something was right, I guess, you might say. I went upstairs to the bathroom because the movers were down here. And I was going to use the restroom and I closed the door. And I looked out the window. It was a beautiful view. You can see the pond down below. There was no leaves on the trees or anything. And I noticed on the roof there, there was several pebbles on the roof. And I thought, that's weird. How did rocks or pebbles get on the roof? Didn't think anything else about it until we got in and got situated. And I can imagine in your shoes, Jane, you're probably thinking, what throws rocks trying to go through your head on what is actually throwing rocks at you, even though they're little pebbles. And then seeing them on the roof, what about yourself, John? Jane's having all these things thrown at her. She's seeing pebbles on the roof. What were some of the things that you noticed? Well, she immediately notified me of that. And when she noticed the pebbles on the roof, she showed them to me. We've had things happen before and hard things. And we've never seen anything. And the biggest thing that I noticed, because we're a little further out now from where I work, and I have to get up a little earlier to get to work. The first thing I noticed was the next day when I'm going to work, I step outside everyone else's. She's asleep and I walk out the front door, walks the front door, and I heard a real short whistle. Maybe sounded like it was within 50 yards of me into the woods. And then I hear another one out toward her driveway. And I'm like, again, that's weird. I didn't think a lot of it at the time. But every other morning or so, or any time I go outside, if we haven't been outside in a while, I'm here in these, and I'm just dons on me. I'm like, well, that sounds like an alert. That's like something. And I tell her about it, and we kind of start paying a little closer attention to things. And we love sitting outside at night, having to fire. And just listening to everything. And you never know what you're going to see here. We have a lot of manner of animals around here. But after the whistles started hearing woops on occasions. Every now and then we would hear some very loud vocalizations further out into the woods. Around us. Kind of sound like it would sound like an angry man sometimes. Like just wailing or mumbling. Yeah, you're mumbling, wailing. That's pretty much the juice of the things that are living, and leading up. So you guys are having a lot of weird things going on. Stuff being thrown, you're hearing odd vocalizations. The angry man thing is interesting to me because I've heard other eyewitnesses say that. Sound like a really pissed off big man just screaming in the woods. If you would kind of walk me into this night, it was about a year ago. And you guys, it became reality really quick for you guys because there was not only one creature, but you guys saw several. What were you guys doing and what happened? So it started a couple of knots prior to the night that we actually saw them. We were both outside. One of our dogs was out there with us. And he was laying, the dog was laying in his bed. Me and John were on the couch. And he had fallen asleep. It was probably around 10, 30, 11 o'clock that night. It was a beautiful night. There was no clouds. Stars were out. It was a good crisp night. And I was sitting on my phone enjoying TikTok. And from the front of the house, I could hear walking. And it sounded, I'm hunted and I fished like I said, since I was a little girl, I know what deer sounds like when it's walking. I know what squirrels and other animals sound like when they're walking. And this did not sound like it. It sounded like people walking from the front of the house to the left hand side of the house. And all you could hear was just the feet steps and the crunching of the leaves. As it got to the side of the house to where you could see us on the porch and immediately stopped. It got really quiet. There was no more walking for a couple of minutes. I sat there and I was listening. And I heard one walk and it would stop. It would walk and it would stop. Then the ones that were behind it walked a little further and then they would stop until they got in front of where we were sitting kind of down in the grass area. And I was sitting there and I was trying to wake him up without making a hot of noise. And I finally got him awake and I put my hand up to my mouth as to, you know, listen. And you could kind of hear them walk away, but it wasn't as noisy as what they were the first time coming around the house. That was the first night. But the second night we were sitting out there and around the same time here they come again. And this time I had, I managed to have a flashlight because we had nothing that night. The only thing that we had was our funds. So I thought, I'm going to have a flashlight. I did take the pistol out there with us, you know, just because it could have been people. And as far as I know, they were heavy walking, didn't care. And this time there was like, there was communication and I cannot explain. It wasn't really speech, but it was a mumbling and it wasn't quiet. Not even. It was like, you know, you have a group of people and they're talking with one another. They came around the side of the house. There was no stopping this time. They come on down, come on around and I woke him up and I said, and we took the flashlight then and was the flashlight. And I was looking around and I did not see anything. And there was no more feet, you know, they had stopped walking. I knew that they were in front of us somewhere and we could not see them. We could not see them. We looked up in the trees, we looked on the ground, we looked everywhere and there was nothing out there. And I thought, am I going, I felt like I was going nuts because I knew that I heard a group come around the side of the house. The dog, which never barks at anything, he just kind of plays there and he was focused very alert. The whole time he was like watching them as they come around. He never barked, never made a peep and he was sitting there, ear's parked and he was watching whatever it was down there. We could not see it. There was nothing there. We could put the flashlight everywhere. We sat back down as a couple minutes later. We heard them start back up walking and they were walking down towards the pond. We took the lights again, nothing. And I think he actually came in and got another flashlight. So now we had like two out there. We have cameras back there. Nothing was picked up on the camera. Nothing was picked up on the camera up front. It was maybe a couple nights later because I think it was on a Friday night, it was on a weekend. This was like Monday or Tuesday, this happened beginning of the week. So we were sitting out there again. I came in because it was cold that night. We were sitting here watching television and go ahead. It was lighter in the night and it's cold. I went to let the dogs out for the evening. We were getting ready to crash and go to bed. We'll let them have the last time. They stayed in the house. We don't leave them out at night. They were both out of the yard. Here is a very dry, glass fall. Here were red. Our pond, the water level, had receded a lot. It was so much so that you could walk across areas that hadn't been underwater since we lived here. I heard them coming from way off to the left of our home. It sounded like it was 400-500 yards away. The only way I know how to describe what I heard is a lot of red horses. It sounds like riding a horse through thick brush. I can hear limbs popping and breaking. I can hear stuff brushing around and moving. This is like I said, it's 400-500 yards away. I could hear it sounded like somebody talking. My oldest dog, he was sitting. He saw me when I heard it and he heard it. He came up next to me and he was focused on it. My call from another dog to come up and I put them in the house. The giant, I see you come out and he grabs the lights. I said they're on their way. We just sat down on the furniture rack there for a little bit and waited. I had all the porch lights off and everything. The heel to the left of our house down to the pond is very steep. It's 250 yards down to that pond. It's almost straight up and down. You almost need repelling gear to get down to the sink. We heard them cross this valley where the pond is. But it was dry at the time. They just came and crossed that and were chattering and talking the whole time. Came up the heel toward the house. We looked at one another. My wife and I knew that if they come up here we got them this time. We're going to see something. I think it's where we turned the lights off and were sitting quietly. They thought we were already in the house. They weren't being a big quiet. They were talking about they must have been having a good time because they just kept on talking. They moved right in front of us and they kind of paused there for a minute. We looked at one another and decided, all right, let's light it up. We put two tactical flashlights on it. Where we thought we heard it. Didn't see anything. I didn't notice anything. I'm moving my light to the left away from where we thought it was. She said, you know, it's right there. I brought the flashlight back over. I clearly saw something that judging by this observation deck down there that was standing next to the top of his head was about seven and a half foot tall. I saw the side of his face and his shoulder and eye shine. No more than I settled that light on it. It's fun and it tooks ran straight over this hill away from us. It covered a lot of ground quick. It probably ran. I know it covered at least 152 yards in just a few seconds. I could hear it on the opposite hill behind our house. We were both kind of shook and we're excited that we finally saw one. We split up. She goes to one side of the porch and I go to the other. We could still hear them. We could still hear multiple ones that had a movement that hadn't ran. While I'm focusing trying to find the one to the left of the house. He's focusing on the ones that you could hear to the right of the house. By that time he said, oh my god, come here. I ran to where he was standing. There it is. Can you see it? At first I said, no. I don't see anything. It's right there. It looks like a stump. I said, I still don't see it. About that time it was laying on the ground. It looked like it had its arms, like it was getting ready to do a push-up. It was what it looked like. It was solid black. It raised its head up and you can see its eyes blink. And its eyes were like an orange-red. And then it put its head down really fast as to they saw me. That's what we got. It was trying to keep its head down. I guess it thought we couldn't see it. About that time there was a tree behind that area. There was one behind that tree and it kind of like peeked out. You could see its head and it was blinking and it would pop back in behind the tree. It did this several times. As we said, they're focused on the one that was laying on the ground. And we saw these two behind it. The only way I know how to describe it is they were kind of weaving. They were kind of bobbing and weaving, peeking out around these trees at us. And the one laying on the ground, it wasn't budging anymore. It's almost as if it knew that I'm caught. I'm caught right here. But you can see its head and raise up every so many seconds to see if we still had the flashlight on it. By the end, I think the one that was to the left that I heard that was trying to get at the beginning, I think that it had went around the front of the house to where our buildings were. And you could hear and it sounded like there was two there. There was one kind of down towards where our path is going back towards the pond. And there was one closer to where the other building was. And they started raising cane. They started slapping the building. They were throwing things. There was tree limbs breaking. And the only thing that I can think of was they are trying to get our attention off of what we're standing here looking at right now. And this went on for maybe a couple of minutes. I never did, neither one of us thought to even look over at the building with the flashlight because we were so focused on the ones that we had right in front of us. And to me, I don't know if John feels the same way, but to me, the ones that were at the building, it was like they were older. Because what I was looking at didn't look like a full grown one. It looked like a purse, it looked like it was maybe six foot tall. The one behind it looked like it was about six or seven foot tall. The shoulders were not broad. I mean, it looked like a size of a man. The ground was red. It was my size. When it would raise up and look at us, I almost knew that it was a young one. Because it looked fluffy. The silhouette and the look of its face, its hair around its head was like fluffy. And so much so that its head was almost perfectly round looking at me. And so we're still sitting there trained on it. And these others are just going ballistic off in the woods behind our buildings. Jane told me, said, they're trying to distract us. She takes a lot of effort. Let them retreat. Let them go back and let them go on about their business. And we stayed there and listened. And you can kind of hear a little bit of movement. And directly behind where it was lying, there's a pretty deep ravine. If I go down, if I go get in the bottom of this thing, you wouldn't see me. The best we can tell, it was back in the torridet ravine. And we sat there listening and I'll let the area back up. And it was down in that ravine. And it was peeping around a tree at us. And you know, Wes there. I can't even, I'm still getting nervous about it because I can't even describe to you. What it felt like with this thing staring at us and blinking. And it's eyes look huge. And we were only 35, 40 yards from this thing. And we finally just killed the light. And we were so excited and kind of all struck at what happened. And you can just hear them start moving off. And they grew back up and they went straight out the ridge line, leaving our yard and stuff. And you know, I was a shock when I saw the one laying on the ground. I passed over it at first as I was scanning the flashlight. And you know, we'd buff the property. And I've done a bunch of clearing and cleaning up with the woods and stuff around the house in the yard. And I think we both were in shock because there was a, we had a dog bowl out there with full of water. It was a metal bowl that the dogs drank when they were outside. I kept kicking it. You kept kicking it. And it was so loud because the deckings actually concrete. So it would just like rattle on the concrete. And he kicked it like three times. And neither one of us thought, because we were in such shock, I think. And we just didn't realize, we realized what we were seeing. And it was, we were just in shock. And finally, I was like, stop kicking the bowl. And I bent down and I grabbed the bowl. And I put the bowl on the table that was there. It was, it was, I can't even explain the feeling that I had out there. It was a shock and awe. I guess is the best way to describe it. We kind of stood there and looked at one another like what? In the world did you just, we witnessed, you know, I, did you see what I saw? We spent 20 minutes on the back porch after they left asking each other, you know, I was crazy. Did I really just see what I saw? And we were up half the night. We couldn't go sleep after that. We were so excited about every single. Like I was saying, I mean, if I didn't, if I didn't take a second look at that thing, I wouldn't have even known it was there. When I saw it laying down, I thought it was a log. And then I realized that, you know, I scanned past it, and I realized, wait a minute, there's no log there. I just, I mowed that just a few weeks ago. And I brought my life back around, and that's when it peaked up at me for the first time. I saw the eye shining, and I've called her over to where it was. And it made me really think, you know, what got me was that as much as time as I was spending the woods hunting and stuff my whole life, how many times have I walked by one of these things? And never would have known. Yeah, the way this thing was on the ground, it was eerie, it was extremely eerie, but then again, because it didn't look like a person's arms. Like if you were down the ground, and you were getting ready to do a push-up, a person, it didn't look like that. It looked, and the only way that I could say that it looked, it looked kind of sparrosh. I don't know if that makes sense. Like they were doing finger-tip push-ups with a wide, real wide thing. Right. Right. It was, the arms didn't look natural. The way it was holding itself up. Yeah, it's kind of intriguing that you guys saw the spider crawl, as I call it. I don't know what else to call it. It's a weird movement. For the audience, though, would you kind of describe that movement, as far as what you were seeing? So, you know, when a human comes down and they're laying on the stomach, and they put their arms up to do, like, to come up in a push-up, it didn't look like that. It was almost like the arms went out to the side, like a spider would, you know, or a spider walks across, and its legs kind of goes sideways. And you can tell the back, the back was not coming up at all. It was just the front half with its head coming up. And the way its head came up, it didn't, it wasn't like the neck, like our neck is kind of long. It like swiveled up. I don't know if that makes sense. But it like, like our neck, you would have to raise like your chest and everything for you to come up to look that way. This didn't do that. It's head just like... It was a smooth motion. Yeah, swiveled back. And you could, I could see a little bit of the features of the face. The light that we had was pretty good. You could see it's eyes very well. You saw the first one's face pretty well. I saw the first one's face extremely well, and I think that kind of put me in the shock too. The face on it, it had, it was like it had a beard, and around its eyes, and around the bottom half of its nose was skin. But the rest of it was hair. And the hair was kind of long. It looked different than the hair of the one laying down on the ground. It wasn't fluffy like the one laying down on the ground. It looked like the hair was longer. And it was so black, the hair was extremely black. It was... In my mind, I'm trying to describe it, but my mouth won't let me. The first one looked a little ragged to me. You looked a little shaggy looking. Yeah, his hair wasn't definitely longer. Maybe it was older. This is the only thing that I could think of that he was older than the one that was lying down. And I want to kind of come back and ask you guys to kind of compare and contrast the faces. But you know, when either one of these creatures, when you guys were looking at it, and you know, that one that you're talking about, Jane, and then the one that's on the ground that kind of keeps rolling its head up, did you guys get the impression like, I'm looking at a human hair, or did you get the impression of, you know, this is an animal, this is some sort of like non-human primate, like a gorilla or something like that. Right. Yeah, the one that I... The first one that I saw, and I got a really good look at it, was more primate. The skin was dark. The nose was flat. The bridge over its eyes was a little heavier. The one that was laying down on the ground, it looked more human than the one that we first initially saw. It was... And it almost had a look of fear laying down there. And I was getting to the point where, you know, when I told John to take the light off its face, I felt sorry for it. I felt like we had trapped it. And that's when I was, you know, I asked him, I said, just take the light off. It's scared. Yeah, the two behind it. When we were holding a lot on the one laying down on the ground, and we could, you know, scan it up a little bit and see the ones behind it moving in and out. There was almost a cooling sound going on right before the others blew up. I mean, it was... And I don't know how to describe that. It was like a light, low cooling sound, it's all the way on the line of the sky. And then it sounded like we're three head over there behind our buildings. And after that started, I didn't hear any more of the cooling. It was just odd. John, do you think the little one was cooling? I think the two that were behind it were cooling. I think they were calling. They were trying to get held. I gotcha. It is kind of interesting how you guys got, cut them off guard just by being quiet and, you know, turning off all the lights. They probably had no clue that you guys were there, obviously. When part of this actually happening, you had mentioned hearing people talking. Did it sound more like humans talking like some language you couldn't understand or... Did it remind you more of... And I won't play them at the moment, but Ron Moorehead and those Sierra sounds, did it sound more like that? This sounded... It just sounded like a bunch of garbled talk. I mean, like nonsense speech. And they weren't really being quiet about it. They were... They were just sounded like they were having the best conversation ever was, as they were walking through the woods, you know, to do whatever it was they were doing. And, you know, it didn't sound like Sam Rouchad or it didn't sound like. I've listened to all of those sound clips and I couldn't hear anything on there that reminded me of it. Now, not that night, but, you know, maybe about back in the spring, I have heard like the start is like the samurai on Ron's... on Ron's recording there, how it does that real deep samurai talk. I have heard that several times, but it's cut short. Like it'll start and then it'll stop. But it was different that night. It almost sounded like they were talking but they had their hand over their mouth. It was a mumble. A mumble? And it was like that the night that I heard them talking the night before, it was the same way. It was deep. You could tell that there was words, but you couldn't understand it and you really couldn't hear it. Like it wasn't... Like it's not audible. It was almost like it wasn't audible for us. It was so low and so deep. That's the only way I could describe it. Can I ask you... It's kind of fascinating that the young ones held back while the adults were the ones in front. I know that you guys don't know, and I don't know, but what do you think they were doing? I think they were hunting. I mean this, where we are is covered up with wildlife. There's anything you want here. And I think they were just... They were getting ready to go out on a hunt and let's go check in on the human. It's kind of strange. But that doesn't add. It's a real deal that what they were doing. We've got chickens and stuff like that. And nothing has ever been bothered. So I think there's enough stuff here to support them. There's tons of deer here. A lot of deer. It's odd because we've been here almost four years. The first two and a half years, we've never heard them together. We've heard whistles and we've heard like... swoops. But it's always been like maybe one or two, not that many together. And then, you know, all of a sudden last year there was multiple ones. And that's the first time we've ever heard them like that together. So I don't know if they were just passing through our area and they hunt. Or if... Or if they've always been here. We just didn't. Yeah, we've just never heard it. We've never really sat outside maybe the first year on our porch until we got it. We redid the house. So we started sitting out on the back porch the last probably two years. But I just don't know if we just didn't pay attention. Yeah, I was kind of curious about that. I mean, you guys had bought this home three or four years ago. And within the last two years, this activity started kind of leading up to you guys seeing the creatures. Do you notice kind of looking back now at some of the weird stuff, whether it be the rock throwing or the vocalizations or... Because I know your siding was, you know, around this time last year, kind of leading up into September. But it's just certain times of the year you guys notice there's more activity, or is it just something that is ongoing? It seems like they're in... Well, I mean, we notice more activity from September to about March or April. But all throughout the year at random times, well, here we've... Weirdness going on. But nothing like we did that night. Yeah, it's been mainly... It seems like they come through here in the fall. And then we hear them... We'll be hearing the whistles and the whoops in the spring. I've tried so many times to capture it like the sound on recording, you know, on my phone. I've tried on the ring camera. And we ordered it as the recorders. Yeah, and we've got... We've got game ears. And we never have heard anything. And it's weird because I hear... I was working from home at the time. So I was home all the time. And I would take the garbage out or whatever. And you would hear a whistle from... from the house. And you'd hear a whistle from the back of the house. Or sometimes you would hear a whoop from one side of the house. And then a whoop on the other side of the house. And I actually took out the garbage one day. And the garbage can was empty. And it was extremely loud when I put it in there. And it actually scared me when I did it. Because it was loud. As soon as that trash can... Or as soon as that trash bag... Get that trash can and the lid come down. In the backyard, there was a loud, loud whoop. And that's the one that I sent you on the ring camera. And I thought, oh my God, I hope the ring camera picked it up. And I stood there and I kept moving in front of the camera to keep it active. Kind of on down maybe about 30 yards, 40 yards on over on the side of the chicken coop. And there was another one. And this was different. They sounded a little different. One sounded a little deeper. And the other one sounded not so deep. And it did it several times out there. And I was standing there and I was like, oh my gosh. And I was praying, I was like, please, please, please. Please let the camera pick it up. And came in and looked at it and sure enough it did. And I was so excited. He was at work and I sent it to him, you know, the right way I was like, you gotta listen to this. I pulled it up on my... We have trail cameras out in different areas throughout the property. Just looking for deer, you know, because during deer season, you're trying to figure out what their pattern is coming in now. And when they're coming, so you'll know what time to be out there. You just want to see what's moving too. We've had bagged Bobcat and big cats. We've had a big catman through here. And we blanketed the place with trail cameras. And could never get a picture of anything on a trail camera. You know, while I was being strategic about where I put my cameras and what they're looking at, I kept having there was one area. And it's a remote leech field for our septic system. So it's a good size open, maybe a third of an acre. And keep it mode real well. And that thing is off into woods by itself. And it's a good spot, you know, you're allowed to bait here in North Carolina for deer so I keep some corn out there instead. You know, hoping to get a glimpse of something in that field. And it's all kinds of deer and all kinds of animals. So I know there's a lot of animal activity out there. But could never get it off suddenly on my trail camera would glitch out. I'd go pull the Sims card out of it and I'd be checking. And the last few pictures at the camera would have taken. The pictures would be a real bright pink hue and you couldn't make anything out. And this would be a daytime shot from the time stamp on the camera. And then of course the batteries are dead. So I put brand new batteries in it and fresh Sims card and a few days later you go back and check it. And it's the same thing. You know, I get pictures of the squirrels and rabbits and foxes and everything. And then all of a sudden I'd run into a string of pink pictures and the batteries would be dead again. So I don't know what that's about or why that would happen. And he even tried. We thought maybe it was the camera was messed up. So we put a different camera out there and it would do the same thing. A lot of eyewitnesses will report electronics failing and a lot of researchers too when these things are in the area, their game cams will shut off or the batteries just magically will die. The light, the pink thing you're talking about, was it like a light John? No, it's almost like... Have you ever seen a trail camera when it's dusky? When it's right at dusk and it doesn't know if it's daytime or not time? And that's the only time I've ever seen one do that before. But it's like I would get us six or seven pictures in a row like that across a period of day that's not dusky. That's gonna be two o'clock in the afternoon and I get that. Yeah, and up to the time there would be like a deer actually out there around that same time on the camera. And then the next picture would be that pink wispy... It's weird looking. It's weird looking. Pink wispy pictures and then it would go back around the same time the pictures would be perfect again. And then it wouldn't pick up anymore because the batteries were dead. And we switched the cameras out multiple times thinking it was the cameras and it was not the camera. One time I had a dozen cameras out. Yeah, that's weird about the game cam. I said it gets reported though. There's people who have these things on their property and kind of report the same thing you did. John, the pink kind of streaking you're seeing. Most of the time the cameras are just turned off for they die from the battery. That is very, very strange. On this property, have you guys seen the lights by chance? So the... I hadn't really noticed a lot of that until the night that she... Jane killed her first deer. And we walked back up to the house and got her four-wheeler and a little trailer and we were going down to get the deer. My son was here. Let him know what we were doing and where we were going. And it's probably... I mean, through the trail to where we had to go get the deer is probably a half mile down there I'd say. And so we're riding down there and it's getting dark at this time. And we feel dressed the deer and get it in the trailer and we're coming back up. And as we're driving back up, our son's on the back porch and he's washing us come by the woods. I hang the deer up in our building. And he's after washing it out a little bit. And he says, as I come in the house, my son looks at me and says, did you see that behind you all when you were driving up on the four-wheeler? And I said, no, what are you talking about? He said, there was a bottle of white following you out of the woods. I was kind of shocked back because I've never really, never really thought about it until that point. And so then I'm... I was going to kind of raise my awareness and I try to keep an eye out for stuff now. And it was about a week later when we had the sighting in honor back yard it was about a week after she'd killed her first deer. And ever since that, we see stuff here and there. It's like a blue flash almost outside. When there's no storms, there's no lightning. There's a clear blue sky day and you'll be sitting here watching television. And you all of a sudden glance out the window and notice it's a flash of blue light. And then it's not been three weeks ago. We were sitting here and I don't know why. I turned and looked at the front door. I thought it heard something. I'm looking at the front door around and through the glass of the front door I see a blue light about the size of a baseball. And it just kind of went across the window. And it kind of made me pause for a second. I looked down at my dog's season, he's looking at the same thing I am. And it's daylight outside. It's not nighttime, it's daytime. It's just like a! And the dog and I look at one another, like, and we did you see that? And we kind of walked over and we're looking at the windows and don't see anything. Yeah. And you can be sitting here watching television. And we have big windows that go all the way across the living room and then French doors and then more windows that are in like a breakfast dining room. And you can be sitting here watching television and all of a sudden you'll see and they're all different colors. I've seen green ones, I've seen orange ones, I've seen blue ones. And they rise from the where the woods are and they kind of go up in the tree. And you can sit there and out of the corner of your eye and you're like, oh, and they're there. It's like it's about the size of a tennis ball sometimes, sometimes they're smaller. It's almost like they're trying to get our attention. I've seen them in every window in the back. Sometimes they're it's a flash, sometimes they just sit there and hover. We see those a lot and it's only during the time when we hear the whistles, when we walk outside or when we hear the whoops, when we walk outside, it's only during that time that we see it. I haven't seen any in the back for a while. The first ones that we've seen was the front door like three weeks ago, like you was talking about. That's the first one that we've seen so far going into the fall. I guess like, you know, since the spring. And jokingly, I turned to Harron and said to Todor, what I've seen. And I said, well, they must be back. We just kind of laughed it off. But, you know, it's kind of changed my perspective. I've never been scared. I'll go, you know, as long as I have a gun and I'll walk all the way back on our property. Now, second guess it. I'm even wary about being out in my yard to even walk out there to mo or do anything in the flower beds. I'm very hesitant and I've caught myself not doing it any longer ever since what we saw in the backyard. I say right by the door or something when I am outside. And basically it's just sitting, you know, in the rocking chairs up front or, you know, sitting in our patio set in the back. I don't, I don't venture out in the yard any longer. Who could blame me for what you guys have witnessed on that property? And, you know, many years ago, I would start talking to people who had these things on their property. They would always kind of end the conversation with, oh, and by the way, I'm also seeing these weird lights. And when I first started getting them, I was like, I don't know what that is. You know, but what's weird is you hear these lights being reported more often than not. What's your take, Jane? What do you think that these lights are? I don't really know. The only thing that I feel like when I see them is hey, we're out here, you know, where, why are you out here? That's kind of what I feel when I see them. I know it's not, I think it's, I can explain it. I don't know, I cannot explain it. I feel like it is something. I don't feel like it's like extraterrestrial or anything like that. I feel like it's something tied with what we saw that night. I don't know if it's them traveling here or, you know, getting to where they need to go. Or if that's how they are when they're not in a form, I honestly, I don't know. All I know is, I know what I see it when I see it. And I know that it's a ball of light. And now that's, let's see it. It's hard to explain. Yeah, and then that's kind of the weird part about the lights because, like on people's property, they'll report, you know, everything from red to orange to white to blue. And you're right, they do come in different colors. I've seen the lights, two of them. One was blue, one was kind of an orange, yellowish color. And I didn't know what they were. But it's odd that they show up so consistently when people have these things on their property, it makes me wonder, I mean, you know, this is kind of a weird coincidence that keeps happening over and over and over again. Are they related? What do you think, John? I think they're 100% related. But personally, I don't think they're traveling through a portal to get here. I might be wrong about that. We may find out one of these days. But what I saw, to me, I think that they're in ancient being that have always been here. And in that, I think that they may know more about our natural world than we know. And if that's a means of them communicating or whatever, you know, trying to... If they use that for a means of seeing in another area or something, I don't know. But when we've seen them, I know that it's a direct correlation. If I see... If I'm sitting in a house and I see one and I walk outside, I know that I'm on your side. I can write it down. You can just know that that's going to happen. The property's been here for over 30 years. And the fellow that developed it was an outdoorsman. It's interesting to me that, you know, I don't know if this place sat empty before we purchased it for a while. It almost looked like it had because we did a ton of work on the place. I think they've always been here or they've moved through here a lot. And if they're out there all the time, they've noticed the activity of us on the property. Because we made a lot of major changes outside too. We've got a real nice trail that goes down to the pond. And you want to ride a four-wheeler to get down there, it's too far to walk. And it's nothing to walk out there. There'll be a three-inch diameter tree across it that didn't come from there. And I'm a pretty practical kind of guy. I mean, if somebody's trying to fence you off or keep you from going somewhere, they're going to let you know that, hey, I'm here kind of saying. And from a perspective of the lights, I don't, I mean, I'll get back to that. I mean, I don't want to go there. I know 100% that they're related. But I can't explain what they're using it for other than trying to get our attention. That's the only thing I can think of that they would be, if they had the ability to do that, they're trying to get our attention. Kind of an interesting take on the lights. Because, you know, when you see the lights, you, at least for me, you feel like you're being watched and you feel like it's something intelligent. And why they would be around when these creatures are around. It does make you wonder. And I was going to ask you what you thought, Sessquatch is, and I'll ask Jane here in a minute, but going back to what you were saying with regard to what Sessquatch is, John, do you think it's more in our family tree? Or do you think it's more like a non-human primate? Or do you think it's just something completely separate? I think that could be a different, I think that could be something completely different. I think that they're their own species and they've been here and they've got their own tree with its own branches, if that makes sense. And, you know, they're species that branch off, branch off on parallel paths. And I almost think that, you know, the primates went in one direction, we went in another and this thing went its own path. Is that makes sense? Yeah, that's a fair answer, John. You know, it is hard to really put them in a category, but I appreciate your feedback. What about yourself, Jane? What do you think that these things are? Because you went from being pretty skeptical, thinking the whole thing is kind of nonsense. And not only seeing one, but you've seen a few of them and you're having all this stuff happen. I mean, it's become a reality for you living there. What do you think that they are? I think it's something, I think they are something that's kind of always been here. What I saw was a full, I mean, full-blooded being of some kind. I kind of feel like maybe, and I know this probably sounds weird that maybe they're not, they don't stay here all the time. I think maybe they come and go, and that might be what the ball of light that we see is them coming, you know, coming and then taking shape. But other than that, I don't know. I know that what was standing out there was actually standing out there. And it wasn't human, but it wasn't an ape or a primate, but it was something, and I can't explain it. I've read the Bible, and I've heard of people talking about the watchers. They're an ancient race that's here, and they're supposedly they're still here. And I kind of feel in another way that that might be what that is. Sometimes I feel scared that they're out there. There's been times that I've been out at the building getting ready to mow, that something has come over me, an intuition that has come over me, or something that has literally forced me. It was all I could do to run to the house, and it's a pretty good distance. It's all I could do to get to the house, to get inside, because I felt like there was something there, there was something behind me, it made me nauseous. It gave me an extreme headache, and this has happened to me twice. And then there's times I go out there, and it's fine. So I don't know if there's something that one of them is coming through that might not be happy that it's not out there. Sometimes I feel like they're there, and they're watching, but that's okay. They're staying on their part, and we're staying on ours. So it just, it depends, like I said, there's been twice that's happened to me, and I don't venture out too far out of the yard anymore. I just don't feel comfortable. And when I am out there, I always have a pistol, I always have mine on a millimeter with me, regardless. Yeah, like I said earlier, who could blame you? I wouldn't walk the property unless I was armed to the teeth as well. Kind of a last question I want to ask you guys, the previous homeowner, do you think that he knew they were on the property, or have you guys given that any sort of thought? My gut tells me that he did. There's a real nice observation deck built behind the plume, and we were told by him that they built that so that they could watch the herons nesting in the pond. But knowing what I know now, like since day one we've been here, we've heard things leading up to what happened last fall. I don't know how he couldn't have known that they were here, or known that something was weird, let me know. Especially blocking off property, to kind of save the trees. It makes me wonder if that is what he was protecting. We've talked to him several times. He's always told us that there was bear and stuff out here, and he's been explicit saying, when you go outside, have a weapon. And he's always made it to where, because there's bear. So I don't know if he was telling us that to kind of make us have a weapon, because of that, because of what we saw outside, or we do have bear, or if it was for bear, but he did warn us when we first purchased the place that to have a weapon when we went outside. If you've had an encounter, and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is west at saskwatchcronacles.com. And if you get a chance to check out saskwatchcronacles.com, you can become a member and get additional shows. I will see everyone after the holidays, and I'll see you a wonderful Christmas, and a bright new year ahead. I'll see you on the show. I'll see you on the show.