Welcome to the Get Obsessed Podcast. We are obsessed with romance. We are obsessed with all things, love, sensuality, dreaming. We have Pamela Tibido here to talk to us about the writer's journey. First of all, I am a journalist. I like to say I'm a writer. I haven't written a novel yet. Like Pamela has written many novels. And my mom always has told me, if I die and I have not written that great American novel, then my life has not been worth living because that is in my nature. I've been writing since I four years old, three years old, since I could hold a pen or crayon. The thing that I find so fascinating about Pamela is that she is on the edge of sensuality and romance that she really holds close to her faith. And blending those two factions together, faith, sensuality, romance, and the written word, I find so fascinating how she can balance all that. I want everybody, big round of applause to welcome Pamela Tibido here, writer, extraordinary, Pamela. Tell us a little bit about yourself, your writer's journey, and how you've gotten to be where you are today. Thank you, Julie, for having me, Julie and Mika. I appreciate the opportunity to share with y'all. And you are a writer, even though you haven't worked on a book yet, but that might be something that we can talk about at a later time because I also teach writing. But anyway, as far as my journey, I started writing in five subject notebooks when I was in my 20s, and everything evolved from there. When I first started, I didn't have a typewriter, anything. I would rent a typewriter every now and then or go borrow one, and then started submitting. And I sent to, I didn't even know there was a Christian market. There was such thing as a Christian market. I just, you know, sent the books out. Well, then I discovered the Christian market, so I started sending them there. And I had so many editors or acquisition people tell me, oh, it just doesn't fit our guidelines. And I'm like, okay, so what are your guidelines? And they would send them. And the Christian market, the CVA market, which is a Christian booksellers, they want the conservative sign of love, you know, not the passionate sign. They want to chase the kids if you're lucky. They won't, they are, you know, the, the, the thing that face, the hero and heroine cannot appear outside of the bedroom in their pajamas. They cannot be alone together in a house. Just this guidelines, there's no euphemisms for cuss words like heck or dawn or gosh, dawn, none of that. So I'm like, okay, well, mine were just so, so ready out there. Because I started writing, I wrote regular, I wrote romance. Then one day I crew, I re-concuted my life to God and said, I never want to write just another romance. I want to write something that glorifies me. So I went back through the stories. And I just let the fake element evolve throughout the stories on its own. And, but they were still way too central or gritty for the Christian market. Then when I would pitch to traditional publishers, they would say they had too much God in it for the American Booksellers Association. So I found small press publishers that would accept they loved them, accepted them, published them. And then as I got my rights back, they're indie-published now. That's so fascinating because it's so boring. You can't even say heck or dawn or you can't kiss passionately. Definitely, definitely no tones or none of that's not real, that's not real life, even for Christians. To God make us not to feel passion, you know, do really think God created man and woman not to feel passion. I don't, you know, but there is a sect of Christianity and we won't we don't have to get into this where it is about courting and you don't have your first kiss till you're in the altar. What do you think about that? Well, I really think it's wonderful if people are committed to that chastity, you know, throughout their relationship. You know, I always say about my own writing. I don't say mine is better because everything that gives God glory deserves to be praised. I just say mine is different. And it's a unique combination of sensuality and spirituality. And really realism. A realism, especially your book covers. I remember looking at your book covers, I'm like, wow, sensual and beautiful, romantic. And I get, excuse me, for a Christian market, a very, you know, they're trying to, it's a bit strict, a little more confined, but they, you know, they could look at that cover and go, oh, not for us, but your message is so profound. Your message, you know, about this union between these two, you know, these two lovers, it's just, it's something that is full of passion and realism, like you just said a moment ago. And it just, the stories are so beautiful. Well, thank you. Thank you. If you look at most book covers, even mine, their couples may be omelettes, they're not necessarily embracing. So they don't have any, you know, cleavage, no bodice, rippers or anything like the, you know, some of the secular, the historical novels, they call them bodice rippers because they were showing all kinds of stuff. Well, I don't want to do that either. I mean, you know, I, I think there's a certain poignancy to just having the sensuality and getting carried away with a kiss or a passionate embrace up to a certain point. And usually in my, after, after this incident or whatever, after this, this section or this sensual scene, there's usually a message either within it or afterwards, presence in my book, Tipperards, they're, they go out dancing and that's another thing that's frowned upon in the Christian market. So unless it's a square dance or something, or used to be, they're, they're changing their guidelines on every year. But anyway, when, as I started and as I've come through the market, it was very frowned upon. So they go out dancing and then they have a real passionate embrace. They're in separate hotel rooms. So he leaves or whatever. And the next morning, he, there's no newspaper on the, the tray for breakfast. So he picks up a Bible and it opens up to Galatians and he reads it and he comes to realize that because he's more experienced in the ways of the world and the ways of the flesh, he's the one that has to maintain control. Because she doesn't, she doesn't, she doesn't necessarily understand. I mean, she does, she's not stupid, she's a veterinarian, she's a beautiful woman. She knows, but she hasn't crossed those lines, consciously crossed those lines. So she, she doesn't realize, you know, the depth of passion and what that is for a man to have that self-control. So I had a reader that contacted me and she said, I learned it. The man finally got it. She can, I can't explain what it is, whether he finally got it. And it was conviction. It was conviction. So, you know, they, they're more realistic. I had readers review them as steamier and grittier than the typical Christian novel without decreasing the message. All of them have an underlying theme. They may deal with domestic violence. They may deal with adult survivors of child abuse, but there's always a romantic thread and there's always a happy ever after. I love the happy ever after. But does that make you, in your opinion, an edgy author? Does that make you an edgy Christian author? Well, I was, you know, when I first started, they, I got into it whenever I was talking about taglines, well, now it's a brand. It's not a tagline. But I thought, man, I would love to be the norrovers of Christian fiction because I love norrovers. But I wasn't sure if it was legal to use that or how norrovers at her, you know, her people would feel about it. So I said, now I can't do that. So I was calling a bookstore, setting up a signing, and the manager was asking, well, what are you right about? Love all my soul is telling them about both. He said, oh, so you're right, inspirational with an edge. I'm like, well, there's my tagline. Yep, that's it. So it's funny how these things come to you when you least expect it and they just, they just sink in, they make sense. Everybody needs a message, Pamela. And regardless, if you are faith-based or not, do you feel like your message is primarily directed towards Christianity or can someone else pick it up and receive a message or a story that speaks to them? I have always felt like I wanted to write for, I don't want to write to those that are already steep in their religion. I would like to write to those that may never pick up a Bible or want to go to a church. And the message is, it's never preached. It's not real preachy. It's just, you know, there's scripture about, but it's usually somebody saying it. Well, you know, have you done this or have you done that? And so like the, in the, in the first book, Tifford Hearts, his grandfather, he has an experience with God where he hears the audible voice of God. And so he tells his grandpa, he said, I don't know if I was just hallucinating or what? And his grandfather says, well, no, he says, very real, you know, he said, don't dissect it with your mind, listen with your heart. And so, he said, and the hero says, well, I can't see myself grobbing on my knees in front of some unseen deity. And his grandfather just laughs and says, that's not what it's all about. That's not what faith is all about. Faith is a heartfelt commitment to get to know God and to honor that relationship. So, it's, it's not a preachy type of message. So yeah, I think anybody could pick it up and get the message that God is, God is, God wants a personal relationship with us. That's so, I'll go ahead and make my head. I have a juicy question. I'll save my juicy question. I have a juice question because I think this is a hard, a hard platform to stand on while I love your platform and I 100% agree. I, I believe every voice, every, every book has an audience. But what I see is that as a kid, I was always told when you go to dinner parties, you shouldn't talk about religion or politics. And you're talking about religion, sex, not necessarily politics, but that's probably brought in a little bit with the religion and sex part. How do you go and promote a book when you're talking about basically religion and sex? And who is that audience? And how do you keep talking about us without upsetting somebody? Oh, well, I'm sure I upset plenty. And I just know there's got to be people I write for myself first. So if I love this mixture, this combination, there's got to be other people that love it too. I don't talk religion as far as denomination. So, you know, the Christian market, they don't want, you know, you can't discuss baptism, war or our spirit baptism and divorce is a no-no. You know, things like that. So, yes, it does religion as a broad Christianity, but the broadness of Christianity, not my, none of the worst, my characters don't go to church. They don't necessarily go to church. Some of them do, but it's not, you know, if you don't go to church, you're not in relationship or right relationship and, you know, all these rules and regulations. It's more of a personal relationship with God, not so much a religion with a personal relationship with a religion, a personal relationship with God. So, and, you know, to me, you can't have, for me, I cannot have the spiritual, the emotional side of love without the physical. Because if you don't have one, the other is not going to get you anywhere. There's going to be passion. There's got to be a spark. Otherwise, it's just a friendship, you know. Why are we told that? Like, why, why are we taught that? So, you can't, before marriage, or a child lot, like, you don't need that physical side. Why do you think we're taught that? I don't know why. And I was raised in Christianity. Well, I think the, because nobody wants to think of themselves or their daughters or sons as promised to us and just not having a, a boundary when it comes to their body. Because when you share your body, you share your energy. So, and it goes deeper than that within the churches, you know, per se. But I don't know. That's the only reason I can figure that we're taught that. It's just, we've been taught it for so long. I don't even really know the reasons behind it, you know, purity, chastity, all of those are virtues. But they say, poverty's a virtue. And I tell you what, I see nothing virtuous about being broke, busted and discussed it all the time either. So, you know, it's just different, the difference in, in the generation since the church was established. And a lot of it was way back when was control, control over women. Yeah, like, isn't marriage bondage? No, I'm just kidding. I'm, I, I, I, because it's going to get mad at me because of this. And honestly, I was growing up, I grew up Christian, I go to church with my husband. And I, I'm sorry to say this, Mika's going to get my, be uncomfortable, but I was divorced. And when you said marriage isn't something, how could I get uncomfortable with that? Well, I don't know. Like, I hope I don't make Pamela feel uncomfortable, but I was divorced 20 years ago. My ex-husband's come to Thanksgiving. So, whatever. But it was the right thing. You know, we, we figured it out. If I was married to my first husband at this point, God would not be happy with me because I would probably be very, very, very, very, very, very, very angry person. But Pamela, you've been divorced. Oh, Pamela, we're in the same club then. Okay. Yes. I'm just under stud. We're telephads. So Pamela, please share your story about your first marriage. Well, my first marriage, I was very young. He, he was an alcoholic. And it just didn't work. I didn't have the faith, the strength to stand on my faith, being that I do now. And I was, I was divorced. And I've also been remarried and widowed. So, you know, I don't have, I don't have any judgment against that. There's a lot of people that stay in relationships. And I'm like, man, you've got points with the angels, you know, and others just, they just can't. And I just got to a point where if I felt like if I did not get out, that one of us was not going to get out alive. So that was my fears. I mean, I'm not saying it would have come to that. I don't know what it would have come to. But it was just not a good situation. I had two kids. I was trying to raise them. And I didn't want them to be around all that violence and stuff. So, um, and then I've, you know, I've publicly forgiven my former husband. And when he passed away, which he passed away, I don't know, let's see what's 11 years, 12 years after my husband passed away. I felt like I was widowed all over again. So I mean, it's, you don't lose that love for the person. It just has to take on a different form. How do you think that first marriage shaped you changed you? How do you think it relates to your writing? Because you write so passionately and you write from the heart. Do you think the first experience with your first husband is shaped you, is changed your view on life, on yourself or do you see that in your characters? I think everything changes are that, you know, every situation in our life affects our lives. And for me, for the characters, I've written books again, domestic violence and the healing that she has to go through. I wrote a book. Now this has nothing to do with with my first marriage or anything else in our life. I have a book where the it's set of male female twins are the main characters and they are adult survivors of child abuse. And it's their healing. My book is all God. I mean, I wrote it in four months, the first draft in four months between January and April while working as a full charge bookkeeper and a tax preparer. So that was all God. There was not much of Pam in there. Now the editing and the cleaning up and you know, all of that was me and tweaking it. But I just, I just follow the guiding of the Holy Spirit or God or whatever terminology people like using or feel comfortable using. For me, that's God. And I just write, I just write the story. I let the characters come to me and I just record it and get it out there for the world. But I'm sure it did affect it because it affects every part of your life. You know, divorce does abuse does being truly loved does. I loved writing. I wrote again, I started writing when I was in my 20s. I was still married, began and I wrote in five subject notebooks. So then I graduated to a word processor, then graduated to a computer. So I've been writing for a long, long time. My daughter was just a few years old and she's in her 40s now, several. It was a long time ago that that happened. But it did help me to be stronger in my second marriage to know what I was not going to tolerate in my second marriage and to build some self-esteem because if I didn't have any, so I had to build it. So yeah, that all shows through my characters and all as well. I love how you, your characters are an extension of who you are because they cannot be. You are giving parts of your soul to every single book that you write. Yes. And, gives me chills and you seem to love cowboys as well. Oh yeah. I love cowboys. I love Bandera Texas and that's the cowboy capital of the world. So when one comes with one comes with the other, you know, and so I've written a lot of stories about cowboys and in set in the Texas Hill country. My tempered series is set there. Well, you're definitely not one dimensional for me, Pamela. I know you personally have had the pleasure of knowing you for over three years. Right. And because we have the Dr. Joseph and the meditation group that we're a part of and you're just multi faceted like you're this amazing talented writer and, you know, I know you personally where you watch the show chosen. You have the beauty that you own and you own several of those and you're totally devoted to this show is life-changing for you. And you have such a drive in interest in life. Like you are not only passionate in your writing, but I can see like in the way you live, like you're really passionate about life and you love family, you're very close to your children. And when you mention the twin characters, the male and female twins and that their survivors of abuse, you know, it makes me think of your two adult children because one is a sun that you have and the other is a daughter. And then you, you know, your first marriage was volatile. It's domestic violence. And what is there a connection or am I just following wrong breadcrumbs? Is there a connection? Yeah. There's no connection at all. These twins came to me. Actually, I thought this, but this, the title of that book is the visionary. And I thought it was going to be my life fun romance. It's settled in a piece of property that used to belong in my family. The property has been sold and developed since then, but it was, it had a lot of history to it. Jean Lafitte slept in the barn. There's stories of Jesse James visiting there and they had 23 children at one time. They took in strays. So there was a lot of history to the property. So my idea was to write a book, have the heroine fall in love with the, with the, the guy that owned the property that wanted her and her brother to develop it back to its original grander. And then to ma, but to up, you know, bring it up into the 21st century. So, um, started sending the book out, the first couple chapters out for readers, for beta readers. And they kept saying, were those twins are awfully close? They knew I wrote for the Christian market or, you know, not conservative Christian, but for a Christian viewpoint. And they said, you know, you need to be careful. Blah blah blah. Well, they're twins. But yeah, but no, nothing's not right, you know. And I don't know anything about it. To me, twins are going to be very close. They're mean, they're going to join at the hips sometimes. You know, they're, they're, they're from the womb own. They're always together. And so, you know, as a writer, I started asking, well, why would these twins be so close that they don't let anybody else in their world? You know, so what happened to them or between them that they don't let anybody else into their world? And I walked out of my office and my husband was watching a TV talk show and owned the stage. This guy was crying and apologizing to his sisters because he could not stop the abuse they had suffered at the hands of their father. And I felt every ounce of drangist blood, you know, blood just drain out of my, out of my body. And I'm like, Oh, no, God, no, I don't know anything about this. I'm not a counselor. I can't write this book. Well, remember now before I had recommitted my life to God and said, I didn't want to write just another romance. So about every, for three days, I'd sit down to write and I'd get up in a panic and I'd just pace and know I can't do this. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm not a counselor. I'm not equipped to do blah, blah, blah, you know, all of this. And if you've ever heard the audible voice of God, you know, when you hear that voice and this voice said, who are you writing for? And that's when I sat down and wrote the book in three, in four months, the first draft. During the busiest time of the year for a full charge bookkeeper and a tax preparer. So impressive to say the least, to have this flow of creativity on a very touching topic on on physical abuse. And to do that and to do a justification like, I think you did a beautiful job is poetry like you did, you did artwork. That was art. Thank you. That was all gone. There was that was not much of me. I just again, I just recorded it. I was I think you co-created. I think you co-created. Yeah, we co-created. And I want to say thank you so much for being on Get Upcess Podcast. Thank you for sharing with our audience your amazing story. We want to have you back. So thank you. Yeah. And so Pamela, please tell everyone how they can find you. Well, the easiest way is my website, Pamela-tivado.com. All one word. Google my name. It's going to come up. It's so okay. It's on Amazon. My books are on Amazon and other retailers. I have a YouTube channel called a novel lunch where I teach writing. And then I have a YouTube channel called Coaching in PJs where I share live tip tricks and hacks that when the implemented can help you live a more fulfilled life. So mostly basically if someone just Googles Pamela-s as in Sam, Tivado, they're going to find me. All right. We'll make sure to put that in the show notes. So thank you for listening to our episode of what the amazing Pamela-tivado. And please rate review and subscribe to the Get Upcess Podcast. And Pamela, thank you again for being with us. Thank you again for having me. Both of you. I wish you all the best of luck and God's blessings and everything. Thank you. We'll see you next time. All righty. Bye-bye.
