Rock Bottom For Tanking? + Major Playoff Seeding Drama In Final Weekend & A Special Guest

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And you know I don't have guests very often. I mean you gentlemen of course but I don't have player guests very often. I only do it a few times a year. It gets offered to me fair amount. Not that you know I'm not getting offered you know. You know LeBron and Shay you know just to be clear. You know I like talking. I like the people that we talk about the NBA with. But I have an interest. I think people should know more about Maxime. And also I like French guys. What do you want me to say? He's the brightest spot in their season. Might be true. It certainly wasn't the brightest spot earlier this week. I ended up spending multiple phone calls. And I know you did too Slater. On Wednesday talking about a Kings foul that I can't believe I talked about. And I actually I do not want to necessarily go over the chapter and verse of this because it received heavy coverage. This foul that Doug Christie called. I just want to say that I think we have reached rock bottom. I hope it is rock bottom but we have reached rock bottom of this tanking era of the NBA. Because the Kings went under an NBA investigation this week for tanking. The amount of tanking on a daily basis in the NBA is beyond laughable. You could have offensive, shameful, whatever, like wherever laughable is it's beyond laughable. And we don't almost ever talk about it because you guys have heard me say probably I don't want to. It's good people doing a bad thing that makes sense. So I don't want to judge. But I can't help this. And the reason I want to say it's rock bottom Slater and you know this is that the Sacramento Kings. Look off the NBA in general investigating this all the tanking thing that's going on on a day to day basis. This is what they actually call an investigation on. There probably has been other investigations that we don't know about. But the fact that this was an investigation, I don't even know where to start on that. Well, I mean, I know why it happened. But you can go and yes, but you can say in a second. Yeah, I don't necessarily need to go over it. Dreymon called it out. By the way, Vince, something that I've learned this week, number one, Dreymon, no matter what anybody says, Dreymon greens power. Yes. Dreymon can put a spotlight on something and the league hops to. I think that should be one thing that we should take away. Second thing is I have gotten so much lobbying about awards and I'm not talking about the team sending out stuff. I don't let the teams mostly have my address. I don't put my address in the book so they can't find me to send me some teams still like get through the thicket and send me stuff. When I a few years ago when I got like an eight foot long box from the timber wolves, it was filled to the brim with packing stuff. And when you opened it, it just exploded out with Carl Town stuff. After that, I said no more. I know there's sometimes cool stuff. It was like Carl Town's fat head that was like life size. I remember that in Chris. Did you get that giant box? Chris. I did not get the giant box. I remember it was in that because you know, coach of the year. Yeah. There's and no, again, no offense to these PR departments. These are good people. But anyway, I'm not talking about the teams. I'm talking about like agents, coaches, just, you know, lobbying hard. Not only that, guys bedding themselves into pretzels to get to 65 games. I don't want to hear anybody say they don't care about awards ever again. Actions over words. All right. Having said that, I have to just say that the Kings defense Slater, the Kings defense was that our coach completely screwed up and was not paying attention. Made a strategic error. Yeah. I said, we were not tanking. Our coach made a stupid play. Yes. That's where we are. Well, because that's the truth. That's what happened. I understand. He fouled Seth Curry, believing he had a foul to give and he wanted to, you know, use the user or lose it timeout, which by the way, then he went in the huddle, did drop a play for McDermott who committed the foul and they hit a three and went up three after they were down 16. But yeah, I mean, I feel a little at fault because I roped Dre Mungering into this conversation a bit because I was right. No, we were not at fault. So, I'm writing that big tanking story that we had on the website that morning. Oh, you saw him reading it on his phone or whatever? So I use that Dre Mungering quote and the one about finding teams because I thought it was useful, you know, everybody's trying to find a solution and I agree with Dre Mungering. I do think one of the more unused hammers in this is just like, find teams, maybe even talk, you know, you can get to the level of if teams are doing it so agree just at least for such a long period of time. Hey, your draft picks go to the end of the first round, whatever. You can get into that or not later. But yes, Dre Mungering insinuated that the foul was done for, you know, intention to lose and I think, you know, the case is very obvious that it was just a Doug Christie mistake. No, the Kings organizationally, they deactivated DeMar DeRosin, deactivated Russell Westbrook in the game. They've already had season ending injuries to their other highly- Right, but the Kings of all the teams that are tanking, the Kings are not doing the best job of tanking. They have a better record than the Warriors since the All Star match. And almost won that game and, you know, we're still up late in that game. So yeah, they're there are frustrating. Can I just say Slater as a quick aside, which I've known to do, has anybody looked at the Warriors three-point defensive numbers for the last two months? Do you know what teams are shooting in the corners against them? This is like a decade long thing, but go ahead. Okay, well, in the last, since the All Star break in the right corner, they're allowing 56% three-point shooting. Prior than normal, but, but you know, that's that's been a frustration for Warriors followers for a long time. Well, those Warriors followers have never been this frustrated. But although now they feel less frustrated now, the games feel quite a bit less consequential. Well, that's true. But yeah, I'm sorry. So you're correct though. It did feel strange that the Kings got the microscope yanked at them when the reality is they have gone from pole position in the tanking sweepstakes to, you know, tied with the jazz and not doing any of the really egregious stuff that the jazz are doing. And yeah, if they had won the other night, they would have hopped ahead of the jazz, but they ended up being kind of the poster boy of it. But that was that that's probably a little bit more of an indictment on the consumption and modern, you know, age of, of, I don't know, just the media. I mean, we don't need to get into a media podcast, but they should have never been getting killed specifically for that. Well, the thing, the problem is that the Kings as a franchise have not earned benefit of the doubt. Not that any of the other, like we saw the Pacers doing this, I don't think I think we would have said, oh, maybe Carl, I'll just screw it up there. Or Carl, I'll set after the game came out immediately after the game and said, hey, I screwed up like that sort of reading the room and giving the franchise a certain level of respect. The fact that I don't know if Doug Curse came out and said anything like Doug. I would say two things. Number one, Dremon talked after Christie. It wasn't a really big topic until Dremon made it a big topic. And, you know, there was not a ton of local Sacramento media that was there, you know, for the game. It's the end of a whatever season. So and then they had yesterday off. So he wasn't able to address it until practice today. Number one, number two, I would almost say if Rick Carlisle and the Pacers did it, it would be more like, no, Rick Carlisle didn't make that mistake. I almost think the benefit of the doubt helps the Kings in this scenario. If you know the benefit of ineptitude, like we think that they are just that bad, badly poorly run that of course they would do something stupid like that. Why would you hack a curry? Like, it's not, you know, that's the I take someone from the leader like, yeah, they're so great. They hack the curry. And I was like, oh, that makes that makes perfect sense. So to me, that's the coaching blunder makes all the sense. It does put I wonder if Doug Christie, all right, that's I'm fascinated by that whole Kings thing because I don't know if Doug Christie should Doug Christie still be coaching the Kings after this season? I'll say this. I think there is a decent chance Doug Christie remains the head coach of the Kings going into next year. That's all I'll say at this point. Obviously, that's not, you know, confirmed we'll see. But I sometimes young coaches make mistakes. Jackson, have I told the story about Brad Stevens? Is that something I've told in the pot or is that something? Didn't quickly before you maybe tell that because we can do a story time, right? Didn't Spolstra, what was the thing? Didn't Spolstra do something really agree to see almost all the time out again? And he didn't have NBA Cup games against Detroit like Detroit called a sideline out of bounds. They got an alley you part of it and Spoe literally walked with like one second left to tie the game and Spoe as Spoe does like stomped into mid mid court called a time out and all his assistants are like, bro, we don't have one. And that pretty much gave the Pistons a chance to win the game. That was a couple of years ago. Yeah, that is much worse than the mistake Christie made, by the way. Let's just say that more group collective podcast after this. I don't know if I've told the story before. If I have, you're all going to have to put up with it. But this is story time brought to you by SoFi. Get your money right. Brad Stevens told me this story. OK, Brad Stevens comes into the NBA from Butler. He obviously was very good coach at Butler at the time, like there hadn't been a college coach come in and have any success. He comes in and instantaneously. It's like, oh my gosh, Brad Stevens is an amazing NBA coach, blah, blah, blah. Not only that, what was he known for like more than anything? Team still using to this day. His in bounds play is from out of bounds, right? Like, you know, like, oh, that's a Brad Stevens play, whatever. All right. So his first year, what people don't remember, which Brad will gladly tell you. I mean, they weren't tanking by today's measure because taking by today's measure is, you know, sitting 17 players, by the way. And one of the biggest tank, you know, it doesn't matter because it'll be over by the time this podcast comes out. But one of the biggest tank games in the league is happening on Thursday night. Indiana versus Brooklyn. Indiana needs to win to guarantee itself a top four position, which they really, really need each position up to Indiana is the better it is because, you know, like, like, let's say Indiana gets to number two position and then two teams pass them, you know, then they're fourth. They keep their pick. If they get the number three position and two teams pass them, then they fall to five and, and they lose their pick to LA for the Zubat's trade because their pick, if it falls between five and 10 or five and nine, whatever it is, goes to LA. The point is this is a really important game for Indiana to lose. Brooklyn has won its last two games. They are in danger of falling out of the top four. Tank, a thaw, Super Bowl Thursday night. By the way, there are 17 players out for that game between the two teams. Seventeen. Obviously, many of them have legitimate injuries. I'm not saying that, but I'm just telling you, 17 players are out. And by the way, Tyrese Halliburton announced yesterday he's back to playing five on five. OK, Brad Stevens, his first year is doing like, you know, they're, they're, they're rebuilding in Boston. OK, they're not under any pressure to win. Midway through that first season, it's a clutch situation. The Celtics are down one or two points, have a chance to tie or win. Stevens calls his last time out. Team comes around. He pulls out the griefs board, draws up the play. You go here, you go here, you go here. It's probably some brilliant play. All right, guys, let's go win this game. It's a sideline out of bounds play. He specializes in those sideline out of bounds plays. Slabs, they call them. They go to line up. The ball's on the baseline. He didn't realize the ball was on the baseline, not on the sideline. Drew up the completely wrong play. Players had no idea what to do. There's no timeouts left. Play is botched. Nobody ever knows, right? And the great Brad Stevens has botched a game. As a, because he's a rookie head coach, because this stuff happens because, you know, however the rules are, he didn't quite understand the rules. So I'm never going to get on a coach for making a mistake, you know, especially a rookie head coach like that. Having said that, we are at a point in the league where our team has to say, we are, you know, we are not cheating. We're just, you know, dumb. That was their defense. And that's why we've reached rock bottom. Okay. Let's move on. And I'll tell you something else. I'm not going to really talk much that much to Max about it. I did talk to Kings players yesterday and the Kings players I talked to protected Doug Christie. They didn't say what really happened, even though they knew it wasn't until later when there was going to be an investigation that the team was like, listen, this is what happened, you know, I just want to say that I actually learned something about the Kings yesterday, which was the Kings players that I talked to. And just crazy, I'm talking to another Kings player on this podcast. I'm just before you even hear that, I'm letting you know, I'm not going to make this a big deal with Max. Okay. And if you want to get mad at me, fine. You think that's a mistake, Vinny? Kings take over, dad. All right. We're talking a little bit about Max, who, by the way, grew up a little bit with Victor in Paris. Okay. Vince, Joel and Bede. This is a big game that's happening Thursday night for the Sixers. Sixers are trying like desperately to get out of the play-in. The Houston Rockets are trying to get to the four seed right now as we do this. They're tied with the Lakers. Lakers have the tie break. You know, there's a number of important games over the next few days. We're going to talk about them in a minute. And Joel and Bede, I hope he's going to be okay because this is serious. Joel and Bede has appendicitis and needs an acbedectomy and is going to be out. And almost certainly will be out for whatever play-in that the Sixers have. And I hope he recovers well, but I don't know how long it will take him to recover. It's possible that his season might be over. I don't even know what to say. The Sixers are finally like healthy and Joel and Bede come down to the appendicitis. I don't even know, man. I don't even know what to say. I hope he's healthy. I hope he gets healthy, but what can you do? There's nothing you can do. You've got to be banged your head against the wall if you're a Philly fan. It's odd because when I was in Philly over the weekend, when Detroit clinched the best record in the East and I was going in thinking, OK, let's see what Paul George looks like. And of course, everybody's fascinated with the back court of Maxi and Edgecom. And that was the day before or the day after. Embiid was talking all the stuff about they won't let me play and everything else. And then this and then all of a sudden this comes up. But during that game, I'm sitting there thinking with Embiid there or not. I'm like, does this seem to have interest in defending tonight? Or is this just a bunch of guys who feel good about being able to get their own shots because they're finding their own way? I didn't know how much of a chance, Wendy. I was really going to give them as a whole, like with Paul George missing the 25 games, like that's a pretty big piece and as fresh as he was coming back. That slides guys into roles that they aren't going to play in when the team is whole. Embiid being in and out when he plays. He's fantastic on offense. Maxi is great on offense. Edgecom, I think is going to be a star. But I don't I maybe I was a little more pragmatic or negative, whatever you want to call it. But I didn't give them much of a chance once they got whole. You don't see teams that don't play together for the entire season. All of a sudden put us together in the last week of the year and then going to the play and upset somebody or whatever it was. Like I just thought this was going to end. It's just unfortunate for us and Joel Embiid that he has appendicitis. Like who could have imagined something like that right now, Wendy? Like it's just it's like a black cat following this organization has been for years. And like you can't count on him to come back and play like he's going to. He's getting the procedure as a time of discord. He's going to done this afternoon. Can't expect him to go out there and play and be any reasonable version of himself. The top four in the East has felt settled for a long time, right? But it did feel like a couple of weeks ago, three weeks ago, whatever, like five through 10 was getting more fearsome. Obviously, you got the rise of the Hornets and what Atlanta is doing. And, you know, the Sixers, this theoretical idea that maybe they would be fully healthy. You know, come tip off a game one. It feels like that part of the East, especially with the magic, it's kind of wacky last couple of months. It's just losing its teeth a little bit. I just kind of think it's going to be those four moving on. And I don't know how y'all feel. I mean, are you still feeling like, oh man, you don't want to face this team. You don't want to face that team in the bottom part of the bracket or is it not? Charlotte or Atlanta? You're not a believer in me. Charlotte has shown, I think, Brian, maybe you would think differently over the last month. They're just, you know, when they face like the Boston or some of these other more marquee matches lately to me, that it's just still a year away. I mean, maybe it's the Cnipple struggles or whatever, but yeah. Cnipple's had a couple of down games. They've lost some big games, three or maybe three or so and three or four in a row. By the way, like say whatever you want to say. When Bon Temps' poll came out last week and it showed the con Cnipple had a commanding lead. The next game, the Mavericks were basically feeding Cooper Flag like he was bam at a bio. And I'm not taking anything away from his 50 point game. I'm just stating those two things happened. And then he had like a high point game after that. But don't worry, do not worry. The Mavericks aren't going crazy. Last night they were playing, you know, Tuesday night or Wednesday night, they're playing in Phoenix. It's a one possession game. Like three minutes to go. Cooper Flag is on the bench. Let's not, let's not get crazy and try to have Cooper Flag win you a game. Oh, no. Get him 50 in a loss. Sorry, I digress. But, you know, you know, I would say Charlotte is a team that if they're able to win their way into the play in, it would be awesome. It would be great experience for those guys to maybe, you know, get a couple of home playoff games. Great for that fan base. If they can win a playoff game, they get into the playoffs and win a game. It will be great. Do I expect them to pull an upset? I do not. And do I did I see Philly under that same situation? No, I see Philly as a team that you would want to try to avoid if you could in the play in. So, or, you know, coming out of the plan. I mean, does that change with this in beat news? Of course. Yeah. Of course, because the their ceiling is affected, you know, and beat is a guy who can, who can score 50 in a game. Score, you know, have 37 and 17. Not only that, he can, he can draw eight fouls in a game and mess up your whole rotation. So, and by the way, when he's been healthy and out there, he's put up big, giant numbers. So, he's had a great offense. He's had a great offensive year. Yes. So, yeah, that's, that's just crazy. I don't even want to say we'll see how that affects tonight's game. But certainly, if you're the Lakers, you're not really happy about that because the Lakers were trying to figure out a way, I think, to get away. I don't know if they can win, you know, tonight, Wednesday night in San Francisco. Well, let me tell you, they got a note of good luck themselves tonight because Steph Curry was going to play on one side of this back to back. The thought was he was going to play against LeBron for the only time this season, Thursday night. But late morning, Thursday, the Warriors decided to sit Steph Curry in this game, play him in Sacramento Friday night. So, the Lakers, I would expect to win. We'll see. You know, people are listening after the result, who knows, but it's not going to be a terrific Warriors lineup out there against the Lakers. Let's take a look at some games on Friday night. A game that has been defanged, Thunder at San Antonio. We will see, I'm sorry, Thunder, I'm sorry, Thunder at Denver. We will see who the Thunder play in that game. The Thunder have now clinched the number one seed. Denver is highly motivated to win to try to hold on to the three. And frankly, the Thunder are motivated for the Nuggets to win this game, too, because I think the Thunder would like to see Denver stay in the three so that they have to only play Denver or San Antonio, not both. Forget about just the appeal of avoiding Denver. How about now the appeal of keeping it Rockets Lakers in the four-five? I mean, that match up looks a lot more tastier to the Thunder than it did, you know, two weeks ago. For sure. So, you know, by the way, the Thunder can sit five guys and still win. I just don't think they're going to win in Denver, who's won nine in a row. And so I'm not expecting to see a premium effort from the Thunder on Friday night. So that game is not as important. Another game that will be interesting, Cleveland at Atlanta. Now, Cleveland won in Atlanta, won against Atlanta at home on Wednesday. They had a great second half as one of their best halves they've had in a few weeks. Their defense is still worrisome. They gave up 67 points in the first half of that game. However, in the second half, Donovan Mitchell played great. James Harden played very well. Evan Mobley ate up the Hawks interior. By the way, it's a 66% chance that the Hawks and Cavs are going to play in the first round according to BPI. I think Evan Mobley would potentially feast in that series because while the Hawks have really good perimeter play, they're weak on the interior. And we saw Evan Mobley go for 22 and 19, I think, in that game. However, the Cavs are, you know, we'll see what happens with the Knicks tonight against the Celtics, but the Cavs are right on the heels of the Knicks for the three seed. And I think the Cavs, I think it behooves Vince, I think it behooves the Cavs to stay in four. They have struggled against the Celtics. The Celtics are the hottest team in the East. The injury report I don't think has come out quite yet. I saw the Cavs put out pictures that, who was boarding their plane. And Donovan Mitchell was on the plane. So he's definitely went to Atlanta. But if the Cavs all of a sudden have a whole bunch of guys on their injury report and they don't play full power and Atlanta hasn't secured getting out of play in yet. Atlanta has lost two games this week. They lost in New York at the at the buzzer and they lost in Cleveland. Atlanta needs a win. You know, they may just, you know, Cleveland can play their whole team. Atlanta could beat them anyway. They're 18 and four in the last 20 years. Did you see the finish of that Atlanta New York game? Yeah, that was a really big game for the Eastern Conference standings. Did you see what happened at the buzzer? Of course. That was, you know, I don't know if you talked about it, maybe on the last ball. But we talked about it a little bit. That says close. CJ McCollum hits like a beyond half court bank shot to tie. It was similar to the Aaron Gordon dunk last year in the playoffs. Yeah, it was like Leather was scraping his fingertip right when the buzzer hit. Right. It was, you know, it tells you how much I feel like players like no, like he didn't celebrate hitting it, which would have been one of the craziest shots of the year. I felt like he knew. Yes, it was like touching my fingernail at the time the buzzer went off. That was a crazy finish. But go ahead. So I don't know what the Cavs are going to do quite yet, Vince, but it's possible because they play the Cavs last game is against Washington. I'm not sure they could lose to Washington if they tried. So their chance, their quote, chance at a loss would be to lose to Atlanta. Like I said, Atlanta could beat him anyway, but and they haven't maneuvered yet. So I don't want to, I don't have all the information. But if the Cavs maneuver to try to stay on the side of the bracket is the Pistons, how do you think that will be received in Detroit? I think you can all imagine how it's going to be received in Detroit if the Cavs are telegraphing like it. I think Wendy, they've telegraphed that they want to stay on this side of the bracket. The one person who doesn't agree with, I think was Donovan Mitchell, said you shouldn't be playing with the playoff guys that way. But Kenny Atkins said that you have to strategize and know where you are and everything else. And as great as Evan Mobley is or will be against the Hawks. You put him and Jared Allen, two guys that we say are not necessarily the toughest set of big man in the league or in the Eastern Conference. And you put them against the healthy Isaiah Stewart and Jaylen Dorn. I think they should go play with something safe. I think. And you and then JB Bickerstaff as the head coach of Detroit, who used to coach the Cavs. Do you think that he won't use this as a motivational tool for a team that operates out of spite and you're giving them more spite? Like, I think Cleveland's more talented than Detroit. I think their A game is better when you get hardened and Donovan, you know, being supreme shot creators and everything else and they have more shooting. But you're going to tell that you're going to telegraph that to Detroit, that you want to play them. Wendy, I don't know if that's a safe thing to do. Well, first off, let me just say, and again, the Cavs have not done anything yet. They got to win the first round before they got to worry about who their second round opponent is. And the Cavs have a very good record since the All-Star break. I think they're 19 and six when James Harden plays, but their defense is like 17th or 18th. And their three point defense is the bottom 10 in that stretch. So I'm looking at a team. In fact, I was talking to, I was doing some some interviews for the the story that Bon Temps and I do every Friday. We talked about the Cavs a little bit and I talked to this executive and he goes, I watched the Cavs the last few weeks. He goes, they're going to go as far as Donovan Mitchell's offense carries them. That's what his opinion is. And Harden, I mean, can help with that. And, you know, that by the way, that that might be the conference finals, but that's the position Donovan Mitchell's teams have been in for years, that they'll go as far as his offense carries them. And so far that has not carried them to the conference finals. I mean, you make obviously a good point about like, you know, telegraphing some bullets in board material and certainly like that will be a storyline heading into that potential second round series. And the Pistons aren't necessarily the type of group you want to like light a fire under, but I mean, they just were just basically saying they would prefer the Pistons over the Celtics, which I think is fair. You know, if you have to manipulate, don't feel a certain way about it. Yeah. And you know what? That's part of it. But if you think you just got a better chance on the floor, like light a little match over here and avoid the Celtics over here, that I mean, it might be a good idea. I could see why. My thing is, and I get this, like I get that the Celtics look good and they look great. But this ain't the Celtics of last year that we thought was the juggernaut going into the second round of the playoffs where they came up short. Like the Celtics and the Jason Teddim is playing well, Jalen Brown is playing well. I don't think there's any team in the Eastern Conference that is so far ahead and shoulders above any other team that you need to be avoiding them and then pissing off the other team on the back end. Like I agree that the Celtics playing their best game is probably a team that can get to the NBA finals presently constructed. But I think this overwhelming fear of Boston, I don't I wouldn't have it if I were a team like and I don't think I think that's the wrong message to send to your club like Cleveland's goal is not just to get to the Eastern Conference finals. Cleveland's goal when you go get a James Harden, when you've had the best record in the East last year, when you won 60 plus games, should be to get to the finals, which means you're going to have to see Boston in theory, no matter when it is. So to send a message to your players, hey, we don't want to play them just yet. That that's loser ish to me, honestly, it really is. That's some lose. They haven't done it yet. They haven't done it yet. So we'll see. Maybe that maybe that'll by the way, maybe they'll play full out and the Hawks will just beat them. Like I said, all right. Minnesota is playing at Houston on Friday. A minute. You know, Houston's looking at this at one point going, all right, we got the one of the hardest schedules. We got to play Philly on Thursday, Minnesota on Friday. Indeed is in a hospital in Houston. And then I'm not sure whether Ant and Edwards is going to be ready to go. He I think is going to try to get back, but Minnesota is locked into the six. They can't fall. They're not going to be able to catch Houston. So I don't know how much incentive they have to do that. I think they they're incentive is to just get healthy. But that's that's a potentially key game. Another key game on Friday is Clippers at Portland. That's the one I'm watching. Yeah, so that is going to be pretty much for the eighth seed. The Clippers are a game ahead as we record this. And not only will that game be worth a one in the standings, but it controls the tiebreaker too. So if the Trailblazers win that game, they move into the eight. Yeah, and they face the Kings, which who knows, Kings could come after you Sunday, but then they face the Kings on Sunday. Meanwhile, the Clippers face the Warriors who will get one of the Blazers or Clippers on Sunday or no, they face the Clippers Sunday, but they'll get one of the two in the nine 10. So that they'll have a little bit of influence, maybe come Sunday, you know, to try to beat the Clippers or not. So the Clippers got a break when the Blazers blew that big lead against Denver a couple of days ago. That pushed the Blazers back to ninth. So the Blazers have actually lost two in a row. So that's actually, you know, it's probably the biggest home game for into it. Or not a Portland. Portland, something important in two, three years, right? Like, unless I forget something. OK, on Saturday is a gigantic slate. Some of the teams actually there's no games on Saturday. Everybody's off Saturday, then everybody plays on Sunday. There's only two times a game, two times games, right? Right. That's right. There's an early slate and a late slate. So nobody has a quote unquote advantage of those games, the games that are potentially important. The Lakers are playing against Utah. It is possible the Lakers could win, you know, if they able to win against against Sacrum against Warriors, Thursday, Warriors on Thursday. I think they play Phoenix on Friday. So the Lakers have three games in four days. They pretty much, I think, need to win two or the three to have any chance. So that could be important. Well, the Utah, I mean, you mentioned it earlier, but like Utah right now tied with the Kings with a chance to maybe leap ahead or at minimum like coin flip with the Kings. They have been very creative in their ways to lose games. And I have a feeling they will be shoveling a win in the Lakers call. Right. So there hasn't been this influential of a Utah Laker game in the last day of the season since Kobe's last game. That was OK. We have Denver playing against San Antonio. I'm sorry. Denver playing against San Antonio. Maybe this game will matter for the three seed. Maybe Denver will have it locked up. I don't think San Antonio is going to be incentivized to show much of a hand. I don't think that's going to be that big of a game. Atlanta is playing at Miami. Miami is already locked into the play in. However, Miami is not locked into having the 10 seed. Miami could pass Charlotte. So that could be for for a home playoff game or home play in game. And the Hawks have not yet clinched being into out of the play in, which they very clearly want to, depending on what happens on Friday against the Cavs. So maybe that's a really important game. Maybe the Hawks just let Miami have it. Let's see here. Memphis plays Houston. That's going to be a buy for Houston. If Houston can get through these two games against Philly and against Philly and Minnesota, they have a chance to clinch the four seed with if the Lakers get a loss. So that potentially could be big. And that one, Brooklyn at Toronto. Brooklyn could have to lose that game. Absolutely. Toronto could have to win. Brooklyn could have to lose that game to stay in the top four. Toronto could have to win that game to stay out of the play in. That's a game that if it comes down to it, I cannot see Brooklyn winning. That could be a potential buy for Toronto. Charlotte plays at New York. That game for the Knicks could be whether or not they hold on to the three seed or it could be whether Charlotte has a home game in the play in or not. Right now they are in the home position, but that could be a game that has that has extra meaning. I don't know if I think that might be it. Am I missing anything, guys? Well, that Clippers Warriors game I mentioned, you know, theoretically dependent on what happens between Clippers and Blazers Friday night could have some influence. And then, you know, you mentioned the Denver, San Antonio one. I again, I don't know, like you said, who is or isn't going to play. But they had a game a couple of weeks ago that was awesome, right? Yolkich Wimby. And that is going. That's profiling to be the series of the second round, right? The one I think we're all probably monitoring most if those two clash at the two three. So you kind of hinted at it, but maybe San Antonio purposely doesn't want to go after it because if the Nugget speed them twice in a row, going into the playoffs in like high stakes type games, I don't know. I don't know if that does or doesn't, you know, impact a team's mindset, but something to watch. I just want to say that the Oklahoma City Thunder have won 19 of 20 games and their last three victories have been 13990. Last four victories have been 13996 over the Lakers, 146111 over the Jazz, 12387 over the Lakers and 128110 over the Clippers. Now, I know that there's some tankers in there, but they are beating all of these teams by 30 to 40 points. Chet Holmgren too. What are his stats? He was great in the two L.A. He's incredible at that. Yeah. The other night I went to the Laker game the other night on Tuesday night and I think Chet scored on three of the first four possessions. On one, he had a backdoor cut where Shay drove the lane. He'd chat backdoor cut. He threw him a pass and Chet dunked it. I know that there was a lot of attention given to JJ Reddick calling time out to take Jared Vanderbilt out of the game 16 seconds into the second quarter. But I'm just going to tell you. He yanked where we had Chamorro two and a half minutes into the game when Chet was putting him on the poster and didn't bring him back the rest of the first half, I don't think. So JJ was trying to set a tone and it was not just Vanderbilt who felt the wrath and Chet came out knowing the assignment for that game. So when the crazy thing is we were looking at Oklahoma City's path to the finals being almost like a treacherous one of maybe as recently as two weeks ago. Right. With, you know, maybe they would have to play the Clippers in round one and maybe Kawhi could have a moment and then in round two, that could have been maybe a healthy Lakers team or Minnesota or whom or Denver or whomever. Now is laying out that they don't get tested into the conference finals. They're going to be fresh and no champion, I think since 2018 has gotten past the second round. That was the 2019 Warriors that want to lose in the finals to Toronto. No champion since then has even gotten as far as the conference finals and it looks like Oklahoma City could very well cruise to the conference finals this year. While Minnesota takes a bite out of someone and San Antonio and Denver going to a slug fest for seven games, possibly like they're going to be fresh going into the first week, the, you know, was it the third week of May or whatever it is and J Dub gets healthier and Chet recovers more and a lot of that wear and tear that the champion goes through, they may not like, they may not see. They look at and they look as fearsome right now as they did during that 24 and one stretch. It's not being talked about as much because it isn't this idea of like, oh, they're trying, they might chase down history. They obviously had the role in the middle season. Jaylin Williams has had this like pretty turbulent year, but I, you know, they look as good as the team that we were talking about being historic early in the season. Yes. And I got to tell you, just spending a little bit of time around them this week. They're in a very, very good place. I know that's hardly a breaking news thing, but I can just tell you that they are, they are just as a team feeling in a very good rhythm. They're healthy. They feel confident. I know that San Antonio has come at them and Denver looks good, but that you ask a good points later, they started and finished like absolutely killer. And so it should be pointed out. Yeah. And look, you know, Shay, at this point, I think we all believe is kind of clinched MVP, they clinched the one seed and what Vinny laid out is correct. I think, you know, we know that's under an organization that like monitors, you know, the chess board in so many ways. And I think, you know, that it is setting up very nicely for them. I'll also say this from a big picture standpoint, because we've been talking so much about the ugliness of everything, like the tanking and the Kings and like 10, eight, 10 teams are tanking, so you're going to have less compelling games. True. You know, to really gauge things. But the fact that we are at this point of the season and there's so many playoff seedings let to let, you know, yet to be decided. I will give the NBA some credit that the play in has been a positive effect, because if it didn't exist, you wouldn't have teams worried about trying to get out of the play in teams worried about where they fit in that. I'll give the league some. I'll be the first one to bang Adam Silver over the head for some of the things that they have gotten wrong. This thing is something that they've gotten right. And throughout some of the ugliness of the regular season, like we've had some pretty good storylines and I feel like we're going to be in good shape for the postseason, at least in the East. The problem is what Brian mentioned earlier when he's going through the Sunday slate and he's like, bye, that team has a bye. That team has a bye. I know, man. Well, at game 82, like no matter what's the set of it. I would agree with you that this is a normal time of year where teams are buys the problem is they've been buys since what, like mid February. But that's another story. We don't need to. We just need to get to the end here. We just need to get to the end. Like I said, the whole Kings experience, we need to get to the end. Play in league, by the way, should be good though. Like what's your, you know, play, just seeing the Warriors trying to play themselves out with Steph in the West and then the East. Steph for sure. You know, you have a play in night where you get to see the Hornets have potentially a home game where they, you know, it'd be the biggest game in Charlotte in years on end and like to see those guys take that on, that would be, I think that would be exciting. Then you follow it up with a Steph game. Like that's, I mean, that's what you want. That's the whole point of extending the playoffs is to see stuff like that. And no, it will not be probably as intense as the Western conference finals, but it's not supposed to be. Let's just get there. And speaking of getting there in the Kings, we'll be joined here in a minute. Bye, Maxime. Right now. Thank you so much, Vince and Slater. We'll talk to you guys next week. More Hoop Collective podcast after this. All right, we are now joined by Max Renault of the Sacramento Kings, who is having a fascinating rookie season. You're at the very end here, Max. You've played like, like over 70 games. So let me just ask you, after 70 games of playing in the NBA, tell me, tell me how your body is feeling. How's, how are you holding up? I mean, honestly, you're holding up on nothing right now. We have, we have two game left. Really just trying to push through it, but it's, it's more than anything I've done before. It's like what, two and a half college seasons, pretty much the pace way higher. She's got it way higher. So it's been a lot. And I'll definitely try to take care of my body after a season, but you know, the less push. When you went into the draft process as a four year college player, what did you, what did you think was going to happen? And when you ended up as a second round pick, you were picked 42nd. How did that make you feel? Cause I'm sure a year ago right now, you were thinking, you were visioning how this next year was going to go. How did you feel about the way that all played out? That's a great question. Honestly, I feel like I finished my college career pretty strong. I was talking about it with some of our local media the other day. I mean, I was the only player in the country I was in 2010 last year. Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. So, so obviously. And the teams threw everything at you. No offense to Stanford, but like, you know, it wasn't like there was somebody else they had to throw. I mean, I watched the teams, some of the film, like you were getting double teamed routinely. Yeah. Pretty much the entire year. I mean, obviously also going against teams like, you know, UNC, Louisville, Duke, like pretty much all year round, cause we had switched the ACC. So I took a lot of pride in that. And then the next step for me was obviously preparing the workout, preparing the combine. I think I did pretty well in the game. I played there as well. So everything was kind of going my way when it came to this to be completely transparent. I expected probably a late first round. I think that's kind of where some mug had me. That's also where I thought my, my talent level had me, but I ended up going to the 42nd pick to the Sacramento Kings. And as you mentioned, it actually turned out to be great for me. Obviously, I don't want to wish anyone to get injured, but we had a lot of injuries going on our team and that kind of opened the door for me. And I really just try to take full advantage of that situation. And so we kind of went from, you know, a 42nd picking to now, which you just mentioned, like 17 and nine since the All-Star break. So I feel like I've showed that I've belonged, especially with a second half this season and I'm really just trying to build on that for next year. So let me ask you this, right at the end of training camp, I don't know where you were mentally, but right at the end of training camp, the Kings sign Russell Westbrook. And as I've watched from afar, it seems like you and Russ have had a connection. First off, when you find out you're going to be Russell Westbrook's teammate, what did you think about that? And what is the Russell Westbrook experience been like this year for you? I mean, it's unreal. To be honest, we were about to play LA for one of our pre-season games, I believe, or maybe it was just training camp, I forgot, but I just walked into the training room as you were standing there and I'm like, you see visiting our team, what is he doing here? And turn out, we just had signing this morning. So it really changed everything for me. I think he had a great history of making his bigs better and making the people around him better. Obviously, he's top five passing passers ever. So we very quickly had a connection, especially in that short role and also in transition. And he was really that guy that gave me a ton of confidence. You know, like the one thing about Russ that he's going to keep talking to you. He's an amazing guy. You keep talking to you like, like how? Like always lovingly and support. Oh, no, no, I mean, you got to perform, right? If you pass the ball, you better make that shot. But he's always talking to you about your confidence, like always, like whatever happened the last play doesn't matter anymore. Let's move on. And then he always tells you about how he experienced his young days in KC and how he took care of his body, took care of his training and all this. But then at the same time, if you're not on par with your usual game, he'll definitely come at you and be like, all right, time to lock in. Now we have a second half to play. You better get better. And I think that's that's why he was also MVP. He just makes people around him better. And he has that level of intensity that you have to match. Yeah. So you talk about intensity. So one of the things like when I was talking to people in Denver, when his previous stop, they thought that like he one of his values sounds weird because the guys are former MVP like 10 time All-Star or whatever. But one of his values was in practice because like he like changed the vibe in practice, like he doesn't like take doesn't go easy. Do you feel like that's the way he rolls? Like he practices pretty intense too. Like for a guy who's been in the league, whatever, 15 years or whatever. Absolutely. I mean, in the craziest things, that he also feels like it's an extra coach out there. You know, like whenever we're running through defensive schemes or offensive schemes, he's always going to add something to it. And as soon as we, we roll the ball, I mean, he's 100% like just the other day. I mean, a couple of weeks before he got injured, we just rolled the ball first play of the practice two on one fast break, just dunk on a coach and you're like, OK, in right now, what's going on? But yeah, he's an absolute beast all the time, every day. And I think that's that's what's his great value in the league is to this day. One of the most impressive dunks I've ever seen in the NBA was a dead ball dunk that he made. Like it was it was an Oklahoma City. He was in his total prime and there was some foul out on the outside. And he just went ahead and went in and dunked it. And, you know, I've seen five thousand dunks and like he jumped so high in a dead ball situation that I like, I like gasp out loud. Like, and, you know, I can't remember which thunder player. Maybe it was like Steve and Adams who told me like he's done stuff in practice. And like, you know, now he's up there in age, but he's like, he's done stuff in practice that would like be like number one highlights of all time that no one will ever see. I mean, I can't believe that. No question. He's a freak athlete. He's probably up there. It was like, you know, five month that guy's in any history. I agree. I think he's one. I somebody asked me this recently who the greatest athlete I ever saw was. I think he might be up there. No question. Like if he played football and he was like a linebacker, he would I think he would been like a Hall of Fame linebacker anyway to digress. He's a he's a complicated guy, Max. But as I've talked to his teammates over the years, I'm like your age difference between, you know, what are you, 22? Yes. You know, it's a huge age difference. But even when I was talking to guys who were older than him and, you know, now all these years later, you know, guys who were much younger than him, like his teammates love him. Absolutely. Up and down the line. I mean, I mean, it feels like having another, you know, big brother on the team. Like it's awesome. He takes you under his wing and he just kind of show you what the NBA is like. He's he's the best. I mean, he's a social beast, too. You know, like very charismatic, is able to connect with everyone. So he's been the best. Yeah. Yeah. So you grew up in Paris or near Paris, right? Yeah, in Paris, absolutely. And you spent some time with Nanterre. Now, I have spent some time in Nanterre not as much as you. Because when I was learning all about Victor Wimbenyama, I went and spent some time with at their at their headquarters and Frederick Donadu, who I think is what you would you call him, the general manager? Is that what you would? Yeah, GM and president of Phil I. Yeah. And I saw the dorms where all the players live. Now, you do you do. Did you live in the dorms? I guess is it a dorm or an apartment? I don't know what you call it. I mean, yeah, it's pretty much just like a bunch of little apartments put together. Yeah. I did stay there during the preseason because we did the preseason was the pros together. So we're actually just, you know, like his door was right here. My door was right here. We're just neighbors. You know, there's all of these players coming out of France who are now making an impact in the NBA. You are one of the latest ones to do that. Another French player coming in. What is it about? Do you think the system because you you also developed in the US because you played four years at Stanford. But what do you think it is about this moment that's enabling so many French players to come to the US and have success? It's a great question. I feel like we started breaking the seal a couple of years ago. You know, back when Boris Deau with Tony Parker and them were killing it with the Spurs. And I feel like our generation grew up watching these guys when NBA championship, when European championships, competing the Olympics. So I think naturally the entire French community started like investing a ton into basketball and young kids are starting playing as well. I do believe we have a ton of freak athlete, extremely talented athlete all over the country. And over the past couple of years, we've just seen the result of that back to back first pick. I believe last year we had maybe six, maybe seven player drafted and which was the most in France history, right? Back to back silver medal in the Olympics. I think we can aim for gold for the next one. So we were just we're just on a really, really good train right now. I'm just trying to ride that way for as long as we can. Yeah, well, I was at I was at the game in China where the French beat the Americans in the World Cup. Yeah. One of Rudy Gobert's finest moments swatting down at the Mitchell at the rim. I can only imagine what Rudy said in French. I'm not going to tell you that. Yeah. And then I was there. I was there in Tokyo when the French beat the Americans in the first pool play game, which was and then obviously the two. So what was it like? What? So you played for the French national team. You played on the U 20 team that won the European championship. So I'm guessing a goal for you is to play with Le Blue in hopefully an L.A. Like, is that something you I'm sure you want to do? I don't want to put it in your mouth, but I'm sure that's something you're going for. I mean, no question. I feel like we have a cycle starting this summer, a couple of qualification windows for the World Cup and then the Olympics coming the year after. So definitely I want to be a part of this. I think every French player takes a lot of pride in playing for our national team. And me individually has been a driven mind. So I do believe guys like like Vic also really care about it. So oh, yes, we have a pretty pretty stacked team by 2028. And once again, we have talent for competitors. And I think France has a history of competing and succeeding at a very high level. So there's no reason for us not to aim for gold. Absolutely. And what was it? How did you feel about the gold medal game in Paris? Like, how did you take that in? Where were you in France when that went down? So actually, I was in France before during their preparation camp, but then I had to go there for it for summer practices. But obviously I was following the game. I mean, it's heartbreaking to see Steph just go absolutely. I know. I know, man. I can only imagine what that was like. I mean, the arena was so as you can imagine, the arena was just, you know, in an electric situation when the national anthem played before the game. All of the fans singing the national anthem, like, you know, it was an incredible thing to be there. Probably one of the most amazing things I've ever witnessed. So I can only imagine for you as well. Absolutely. No, I feel like our people bought in so much into the Olympics. I mean, it went from every single sport, but definitely making up that final. And I believe the girls did go to the final as well. So it was it was an unbelievable run. And I also love the fact that our team had a pretty good mix of, you know, all the veteran guys and younger guys that now are going to have a shot to take over over the next couple of years. So it's a heartbreak, but I do feel like you need this to bounce back and have the motivation to to go all the way 2028, 2032. So, you know, it's it's a necessary step. I feel like so. Yeah. So how old were you when you met Victor? I want to say the very first time we met were probably 11 or 12. Who was taller at that time? Because you had to be pretty tall. Actually, we're probably the very same high the first time. Yeah. But very quickly. He grew fast. Well, we probably had the tallest two, three zone in the history. I mean, you have three, seven, seven in the back line. He was absolutely ridiculous. But we met back then and then we started playing with each other under 16 European Championship, played against each other in some national championship before that. And then eventually I joined Ontario. So that's really when we got to to connect and now in the NBA as, you know, competitors, one against each other. Yeah. And I think people loved it when I don't know what kind of a minor viral where the I don't know if it was video or photo. I can't remember what you guys playing chess against each other. We know Victor is really into chess. Did you guys play chess when you were teenagers? Or was that is that a new thing that you guys play against each other? I mean, I've been playing for a little bit. I feel like he's he's been picking up things all his life. He's pretty curious. But definitely, I mean, lately has been something that, you know, has been kind of growing in the basketball community somehow. And so, yeah, we had the opportunity to play each other. I want to say it was last summer or two summers ago. Yeah. And I will just say, like, you know, I'm sure you had some of the same coaches that Victor had. And like he was I learned from talking to, you know, his coaches growing up. He was very headstrong, very headstrong young man. Like you really, you know, I mean, he was very motivated to get better. But he was very headstrong. Like he, you know, they couldn't get him to stop shooting threes, for example. So that's why people say in the NBA, Victor shoots two, may three. Well, they've been telling him that since he was 12. So good luck. Good luck. And stop. It's funny you say this because earlier you were mentioning how so many French young players are coming into the league, right? I do feel like one of the things about us that very quickly we're being exposed to like the professional level. And with that comes certain mindset. And obviously you have a competitive mindset and you also have these development and performance. And I feel like sometime we might, you know, pick one in favor of the other or whatever, but I do feel like growing up, especially Vick, but all of these guys really took too hard to fight that. Yeah, we'll be competing and we'll be acting like pros very early on, but at the same time we're going to keep developing and we cannot just completely raise one part of the game, which is either maybe, I don't know, shooting, handling the ball, rebounding, whatever it may be. And so I think that's also one of the key to the success lately. That's how you play, right? I mean, you play, you play multi-positional. I mean, I guess you're, you know, you shoot from the outside, you move around. I mean, you're, I mean, certainly you can see some of the same development system with the way you play. And I think that's kind of the modern era, right? That's kind of how they've, kids have played in Europe for years and now it's sort of become more of a thing in the NBA. Like you can't, if you come into the NBA now and you can't shoot or you can't handle the ball, you better be like an incredible rebound or an incredible basket defender because that's the, that's kind of been the European way for a long time and now it's the NBA way. And I think that's probably why, one of the reasons why you're in the NBA in general. Yeah. I mean, I think you're right. I do believe they're always one or two skills that you're going to be really good at and you're going to, you know, make your money off. And that's, that's where they, they wait for you. But at the same time, like you need to have a bare, bare minimum in every other area, whether it is guarding, shooting, being able to pass, all that kind of stuff. So you're completely right. I also feel like lately the NBA kind of has shifted towards a, you know, not kind of like a prototype, like a six, seven, six, eight wing type of guy that can, you know, handle it, shoot it and cannot play every possession as you just mentioned. So you got to be able to, to, to do that too. If you want to, you want to stay there, the game evolves and you, you have to be able to, to, to match those, those expectations. What did you have a welcome? Cause I think most rookies have this, did you have like a welcome at the NBA moment, like where you guys hit with the pick or somebody hit you with an elbow, like, especially, you know, look, let's just be honest, as a European, some guys feel it. Okay. When you had the NBA moment, this is Russell Westbrook dropping this off. My locker, Spider-Man backpack, Spider-Man backpack that I have to carry everywhere. But could have been worse. I've seen worse than Spider-Man. I think I got, I got the better one out of Nick and I, I think Nick has some, like my little pony, very pink. Nick Clifford. Yeah. The other rookie. Yeah. I didn't get it too bad, but you got Spider-Man or Milo. Hey, you know what? In all honesty, if like Russ decided that you got Spider-Man and Nick Clifford got my little pony, like that's almost kind of like a little silent, like you're okay, kid. Exactly. I mean, you gotta know your place, right? Like you get off the bus, you pick up his stuff, you, you bring the suitcase back to his room and then, you know, whatever he needs, it's Russ. We got to make sure he's all good. So I've, I've learned to, you know, being a, being a public servant, you know, like helping, helping the team out. We have a lot of vets, Hame, Demar, Zach, Malik, Demas, everybody. So yeah, you learn your role pretty fast. It is a thing though that I think that some NBA players, sometimes they vocalize and sometimes they don't, they feel a certain way about European players. Despite the fact that European players are completely like dominating some of the awards and stuff, like, you know, there's certain perceptions and, you know, did you ever feel that that like, you know, you don't have to say it, you know, if you don't want to, but like, you know, guys talk trash about, even though you've been in the U S for years, like talk trash about you as a, as a, as a, as someone who's French. Well, honestly, I love it when they do because they talk trash and they think you're going to be terrible. And then it just opens up the game even more for you. You know, and I know the day I understand if you want to be very, you know, nationalistic and like, Hey, U S is the best, but look, if we're giving you buckets right now, like you better lock in because this is not going to help your case. So yeah, definitely people are talking a lot of trash, but I mean, I don't know. You just said earlier, like I feel like my system has been going pretty well individually. So lately not many people have been talking, talking trash. Yeah. Do you feel like you're, you're starting to show up on the, on the scouting report? Like you had a game recently where I think you had like 28 points and then you had another game where you had 15 rebounds. Like, you know, look, let's, let's just be honest. The Kings are not a team that teams are gearing up for right now, but obviously you're, you know, you've had a bunch of big games. Do you feel like that maybe as you've made the second or third trip through the league that people are figuring out who you are? Yeah, definitely. I mean, I love to play around that, you know, pocket area. So all of a sudden after you have to like back to back 30 point game, like the third game you come in, there's like four people in the pain. As soon as you catch it, it's like, okay, like I have to be able to, to work around that same thing if they had a, like a 20, 20 point game, 20 and 19, 20, 20, whatever against New Orleans. The very night I've never seen people box me out that hard. You know? Okay. Yeah. You have to adjust to it. But at the same time, I feel like it's a tremendous sign of respect. Like it means that you've been successful at doing what you're doing for the past, you know, couple of weeks you've showed your worth and, and now they, they take you more seriously. Um, and that's when you have to be able to, you know, go to some counters, be able to expand your game a little bit. And that's what I've been talking about with the Ros DeMar and Malik. Like you got to be able to add something. You know, I really like my little floater, a little push-down in the pain. And once the pain gets crowded, I got to be able to do something else. Um, so that's, that's what we'll be working on over the off season. Well, Max, thank you so much for your time. Listen, remember the name Max Ray. No, you will know it, uh, whether you want to know it or not. One of the reasons I wanted to highlight him and he will be on my all rookie team. So we'll see. Hopefully you, uh, are honored that way. I know it won't matter. You've, uh, you've had a great year. So, uh, I look forward to talking to you more. I look forward to talking to you after playoff games in the future, Max. I appreciate it. I look forward to it too. All right. Have a good summer. And, uh, um, I'm going to have to hope that the French win the silver again in 28. Sorry, I have to, to be an American. That's for you and I. All right. Thanks. Take care. All right. So that was Max Ray. No, um, and, uh, enjoyed that conversation with him, learning a little bit about him. Uh, so thank you so much for listening and watching who collective. Thanks to Jackson and Tucker who put this together. Thanks earlier to Slater and Vince Goodwill. And we'll be talking to you, uh, next week.