Six Feet Under - Miz talks backstage bullies, Logan Paul stealing his gimmick & WrestleMania

So just forget everything you know about podcast. Throw it out. We're going to throw it out the window. I love it. Great. Good thing I don't know too much about podcasts, just listening to them. I just got to get my head on straight here. Why is it crooked? It's your beanies crooked and your hats crooked, so both are crooked. You know, if I could get... You're trying to go this too. Oh, that's awful. Just wear the beanie. Hmm? Just wear the beanie. Call it a day. Because what happens with the beanie... Oh, my gosh. What is happening today? It slides up my head and then I got it like a... This is not The Undertaker I know. No. Dude, hey, it's gone. This isn't The Undertaker I know. No, no, no. You're worried about a hat? The guy's gone. A hat? What is happening? I mean, what are we doing here? This is a Fanatics and WWE original production. Hello, everyone. Get your shovels out. We're about to go six feet under. I am the OD, the original dead man, the beautifully and talented Michelle Money McCool. Today on Six Feet Under, we have a guest that has more accolades than I have breath to even give him out. So he made it easy for me. He made it really easy for me. He is the first two-time Grand Slam champion. He is a reality TV star A movie star Quite the dancer And an adequate golfer Definitely okay golfer Well, did I go too far? Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, let's go There you go, man Honor to be here Awesome What an intro Movie star Movie star So you saw a Marine 3, 4, 5, and 6 straight to DVD I love it 8, 9, 10 There was an 8, 9, 10 Sean was in the last one Oh, man. They just went to the bottom of the barrel, right? They went to Shawn Michaels, and they were like, all right, we're done. Yeah, well, there's no following this. There's nothing. You can't get any higher. Dude. But adequate golfer? Huh? That was a little harsh. I would say, like, I'm the best golfer in WWE. That's, yeah. Which does not say much. Okay. Because nobody golfs here. Nobody golfs anymore, right? Yeah, exactly. Now, back in the day, like, Brian Adams and myself and Big Show even played golf for a while. You played golf? I used to play golf. Chavo played golf? You live on a golf course. I do. I live on a very nice golf course. Yeah, and you just don't just look at it? I go there to eat. I go to the club and eat there. I hadn't played in probably, what, two? Probably since we played a scramble. Three years I hadn't played. Do you play? I don't have the patience for it, one, but I'm very good for a scramble. She's great. I can drive the ball pretty darn far, and I can putt. In between is a little, eh, hit or miss. She can put it out there, what, 250, I bet. you guys just don't want to golf spend four hours on a golf course i have no patience for i think it's because my dad i grew up he he would play 36 holes straight every day of his life still does i take my daughters all the time it backfired on me to do it okay yeah we went every day after school and i think i just got tired of going to the golf course every day after school every day he played every day i should do that yeah her dad is yeah he's still i should do that with my daughters. Yeah. Instead of taking them to gymnastics. Quality time. I should take them to golf every day. Well, I didn't play. I was just drug, like, walking, you know. I didn't play. Like, I'd buy them a bucket and then they will, like, just hit balls. And the problem is, I have to, you really have to watch kids on a golf course. It's crazy. You can't just shoot a ball. They will literally run out into, just to grab more balls. I'm like, what are you doing? People are shooting. Don't go out there. You know. Or move into your back swing. Yes. You crank one in the head, and then you got to go home. Yeah, you hit one, and you got to go home and say, she was in my backswing. Did I tell you that we were playing Topgolf? I took the kids to Topgolf a few weeks ago, or like a month ago. We were on the second level, so there was a deck above us. A kid fell into the net above us. I'm like, holy crap. It was a kid, or was it an adult to the head of? No, it was a kid, and I for sure thought one of ours would have done that. And all of a sudden, I was like, see, it can happen. Yeah, dumbled right over. Yeah, but he was fine. He probably thought it was the best thing ever. He probably thought it was cool, but yeah. They probably got a picture and video of it. He was safe. His parents were probably filming him, yeah. I love Topgolf. I do, too. That's a good time. I do, too. It's so much fun. The Topgolf here, the last time that I went, the bar, imagine me knowing something about a bar. the the bar at the at Topgolf was the most successful bar as far as selling drinks over the weekend and it was crazy what is it what an ingenious concept really right I mean I love it it doesn't matter your skill level you know and then you do you have a huge that bar was slammed it was big yeah and it was just yeah bay after bay of people who's the worst celebrity you've played with the worst yeah like i am usually the worst okay besides yourself like out of my group like usually it's like really bad but like who is like bad um i played with nick chubb once and we did really bad together um it was it was for uh somewhere in california but man we were terrible and then reggie bush was just amazing he was really good and uh we were really hurting our team like we're really causing a lot of trouble for our team you know that's the deal though with other you know other sports like they get half the year off that's all here's another thing though with wwe like i'm the best golfer in wwe i go to play at like american century championship and i'll play with like travis kelsey or jason kelsey i'll play with all these like celebrities and they'll beat the holy hell out of me and i'll be like i don't know how it happens like i i don't know if it's because we're in a tournament and maybe i get nervous and you can't you got to learn how to use your nerves like in wwe i learned how to use my nerves inside a ring to where it doesn't affect me anymore with my nerves in golf it still affects me so i haven't figured out that i guess the the way to swing without with with the nerves i guess you can say but man i play with a lot of celebrities and most of them are really good. And it's for the example that you just said, they get an off season. What do they do there in the off season? They just play golf every day, all day. Like Reggie was like, yeah, I dropped my kid off at school and I go play golf. I go, every day? He goes, every day. And I go, wow, maybe I should do that. But then I'm like, well, I can't because I gotta make sure I work out. I gotta train. I gotta watch matches. Like I still do that to this day. I don't know if you still do that. No, I didn't do it when I was active. Really? No, I worked out on that. But I didn't. It's funny, but people ask me that a lot. Like once I got here, like the only things that I watched, and I watched it usually live, was what was going on within WWE. Like I wanted to know, like I watched my own stuff back because I'm obviously my harshest critic. And I always had to do that alone. But like I always cognizant, like one, who's on top? what are they doing and i kept up that way but to go back and look like uh you know go back to the old uh nwa stuff back in the you know or the crockett stuff and the eight no i i just never did um i watch like i try to watch as much as i possibly can just to see like it's different than it was five years ago oh yeah 10 years ago and then 20 you look at it when i first came in to where it is now it's just it's so different it's it's a different pace uh the style i feel like is still the same you could still do the same style um but it's just it's it's different and uh i i enjoy the uh the critiquing myself it's funny that you used to watch your matches alone a lot of people don't even like watching their matches i'll ask them i'll be like did you watch your match no i don't watch my matches i'm like how are you gonna learn yeah if you're not watching your matches like i watch everything and nitpick yes to this day i'm 20 what 23 years in i will still look at my footing and go you're taking extra steps there right you could have done this better oh you didn't have to take that bump you shouldn't have done that you know but i feel like that's why you're still on top like i feel like that's why you're so good and have been here so long and oh thanks because you care because that passion's there to you know keep learning yeah i could never i can't watch like you know they always back in the day they had her on at catering right The day after PLE, you know, everybody's sat there and ooh and ah and whatever. I don't want people sitting there, oh, man, that was awesome. That was great. I don't want to hear that. Like, I want to be sitting there watching with no noise and then same exact same thing. Like, man, one more punch right there. Oh, if I had taken a bump there, if I had went out, you know, that's how you get better. I could have gotten the crowd better. Yes, exactly. And then you're listening now. Like even now, like I always listen to a crowd and hear a crowd. And Cena, whenever I'd be in the ring with him, he'd be like, dude, you got to listen. And I'm like, I'm listening. I hear him. I know. I know. I am listening. But it's like there's a difference of listening and really understanding what they want from you and what you need to do to get there. And now I can sit there and be like, I'll be in the ring and I'll be like, oh, I'll even think about it in the ring. I'll go, I wonder if I would have done that if that would have gotten even better. yeah i could have waited a little longer there oh yeah oh but timing uh we we only have a minute left i gotta go gotta go you know yeah do you find it amazing like from when you started to what your thought process was in a match to where you have the ability now you're you're in the same match the same pace and everything else but now you're you're so comfortable and and you've mastered your craft to such an extent that you can sit there and process in the moment yeah you Remember when you first started? I was like, oh, my God. Do you remember our first match? I was thinking about that. I remember backstage going, don't forget I'm left-handed. Yeah. Threw me off. I can't. I bet two or three in my career left-handed people. I always remember that was like, don't forget I'm left-handed. The punches come in from a different angle and everything. I'll never forget we had a TV match we called nothing. Zero. row yeah and this was a timed match where someone had to like we had to hit a time right like it's one of those matches where it's like uh you had to beat a certain amount of time in order to pin me right and to advance on and so i remember i was like oh my god and you're like you i remember you asked me do you drop kick and i go yeah i can i can drop kick in my head i'm going i haven't drop kicked in probably three years yep yes sir because what do we say what do we say right Whenever someone says, do you know how to do something? Yep. No problem. 100%. Let's go get them. So you're like, do you do a dropkick? Yes. Yes, sir, I do. And I'll never forget, you called everything. And when I mean everything, he's covering me. Kick out. No kidding. Kick out. I've never had anyone, even people that call everything, he'd be like, kick. Somebody might forget. Somebody might forget. We can talk about this now, by the way. It's pretty cool because there's Unreal on Netflix, which gives the whole thing up. So I imagine this is probably rubbing you the wrong way of us talking like this. I'm in therapy. Oh, wow. Yeah. I understand. I kind of like it. I figured you would. Do you want to know the reason I like it, though? Is people now understand how hard it is to do what we do. and what we are actually doing inside a ring. I understand the whole lore of it, but I feel like the lore of, the number one question I got on The Real World was, is it real or fake? Number one question I get in WWE, is it real or fake? And the fact is, it doesn't matter. It's entertainment. It is entertainment. And if you're going to watch it, you're going to watch it because you're entertained and it's fun and it's entertaining and the storylines and the larger-than-life characters. and nowadays I don't think people care as much as they used to. Yeah. I don't really think – I did this discussion recently with people. I don't think even back in the – I don't think people like genuinely thought like, all right, this is all – it's all a shoot. I kind of thought you were dead. People genuinely – I kind of thought you were a dead guy. When you came out, I was scared. No, I mean I get that. As a child, I was scared, yes. So I believed. Well, I know, but as a child. Sure. But I'm talking about, again, our demographic now is, you know, it's a very wide demographic. I don't think anyone didn't understand what wrestling is unless you are a child. I don't know. The whole McCool family thought. Well, they still think. Okay. Okay. Okay. I mean, they watched you work, right? But I legitimately thought the McMahon family, well, and then they might be, but like cuckoo. I thought they were cuckoo from watching them on TV. Like I believed everything that they were doing was actually who they were. But also the 18 to 34-year-old men that are so-called like in the know, what's the number one question you guys get asked? Exactly. Is it real or is it fake? Hey, when that guy did this or when they did this, did it really happen? And that was always like when I approached a match, and I get all the entertainment value. But my goal when I put a match together is have one moment. Have a moment within the match where all of that gets thrown out. Like I wanted one moment where that was real. And then you've got them hooked. If you have somebody that believes that, I don't care what you say. Take care and just smashed him. That's legit. Now what? That's my only problem. is everyone understands what we do. Again, I am notoriously old school, but it's not like I don't care for it in the sense like, oh man, we gave up the business. Come on. Everybody knows where that is. But there is, I don't want to know, personally, I don't want to know how the magician cuts the girl in half. Yeah. Right? I want to think about it. I don't think the magician, like, so like, I've heard this analogy of like, we're like magicians out there. But the magician, there's a lot that goes on into it. But with us, I feel like it's so much more. WWE has prepared me for everything. I'm talking going on podcasts, hosting, acting, improv, anything that comes my way, WWE has prepared me for that because of what we do inside the ring. And people don't understand that. People look at it as like, I could do that. It's like, no, you could. Exactly. And all of us literally go, it's a lot tougher than what you think. And it's as simple as run the ropes. Right. Tell me how you do. If you want to come back tomorrow after running the ropes. I remember Tough Enough. When we did Tough Enough, you guys did Diva Search. Your first day of, I remember a guy quit because we ran the ropes and took like 300 bumps. We took 300 bumps, got quit. And this guy was like an army ranger. Yeah. like it's just so different the toughest of the tough and all of us were looking at each other just drained and the goal of back then you were there deep south wrestling what was the goal the goal was to get people to quit absolutely yep and that's always been the mantra if you really wanted it if you really wanted it you would make it and by the way we're gonna put you through so much stuff down here that when you get up there you're prepared for everything that makes zero sense did did y'all like carry the logs in the parking lot and have to go around the whole mall like a huge log on our shoulders and just go around the truck around the truck around the truck around the thing truck around like did y'all have to stand on the top turnbuckle what yes do squats had to do squats on the turnbuckle while people were hitting the crisscrossing while doing crisscrosses in the ring and in my head i'm going i don't understand why just why why and also saying like i'm not gonna quit i'm not gonna get knocked down i know what you're trying to do and you didn't want to sit on the bleachers with all the sick kids everyone was always sick oh everyone had a i gotta go sit on the i gotta go sit on the bleachers yeah i prided myself i was like i will never sit on those freaking bleachers over there and we would roll until oh my gosh and gosh forbid somebody come in with a hangover we were rolling 500 times and then remember the 20 minute uh we would have to he'd come in give a guy five head tosses five arm drags five and they would blow up drill and then Bill would get in to lay on you. Just lay on top of you. Oh, my God. Were you there when Khali came in? Because once Bill would lay on you, then he'd bring Khali to lay on you, too. Mm-hmm. After you're completely blown up. Khali? Just because. Mm-hmm. This message is sponsored by Raycon. When you train like a WWE superstar, your soundtrack matters. The right music, the right voice in your ear. That's what gets you through that last brutal set. Silence is for the graveyard. That's why I've been using Raycon's Essential Open Earbuds. Regular earbuds block out everything, but these sit just outside the ear canal, so you get crisp, powerful sound, and still hear what's happening around you. It's like having entrance music quality everywhere you go. They're really light. The ear hook rotates, and they actually stay in. In the gym, on walks, around the house, no slipping, no pressure, no nonsense. Raycon's got over 3 million customers and the sound quality is right up there with the most expensive brands. Plus, they're half the price of those big brands. No massive markup, no smoke and mirrors, just great sound. Plus, if you don't like them, there's even a 30-day guarantee. Open ear design so you hear your music and the world around you. Multipoint connections so you can switch between phone and laptop. Ultra light, flexible hook and 36 hours of battery life with the case. I charge them maybe once a week. I've been using these pretty much every day since I've got them. In the gym, running errands, working around the house, they're the ones I actually reach for because I still can hear what's going on around me without sacrificing sound quality. They've just become part of my daily routine. The essential open earbuds are here to bring you premium salve without premium price. Go to buyraycon.com slash six feet open to get 15% off. Thanks Raycon for sponsoring. I remember waking up every morning at deep South going one more day. Yep. One more day. You can do this one more day. You can do this one more. You did, but it never got like the physicality got easier a little bit. I guess when you come up here, but mentally, you are drained at all times because you're trying to get over you're trying to do your best trying to do everything you possibly can to show your worth and that you could put asses in seats right and then you're like you know you have one bad match or you have or someone doesn't believe in you or something happened there's so much stuff that goes involved that takes you every which way like when you were coming up like how did you get into that like what was your mindset because Obviously, you're tall, you're big, but then you have to. So I had to weed my way through from day one. I had to weed my way through the old timers, right? The guys that were on the way down that were a little bit disgruntled and having to put the kid over. Once they decided that they were going to go with me, then it's like, oh, man, we got to put this guy over and do this and do that. there were a few, but those are the kind of things, you know, and then dealing with some of the guys that were above me, the politics there, right? When I started to dabble into some main event stuff, man, then that's when you get a whole nother level of politicking. Because when you're at the top of the mountain, there's only one place to go. Yeah, there's only one way to go and ain't nobody want to give it up, right? I mean, And so, yeah, it's difficult. And you have to, you know, back then, anybody really give you advice, you really had to sit there and dissect it and discern, like, is this advice going to help me or is it intended to hurt me right Because you hear things sometimes and you like that doesn really sound right but this is this is you know this is a top top guy and then you have to then you have to play that game like oh okay yeah he's trying to he's trying to squash this a little bit right and then you have to deal with okay well now what are you going to do like you're not there on that rung yet but you're you you have to work with that guy and then you have to decipher all right how much juice does this guy have okay this is what he's telling me i'm not gonna do that so you get i got put in a lot of situations early on in those first two three years of like like a lot of quiet moments of like, I know this guy is trying to do something to derail my ascension here, and I've got to figure out a way to not blatantly go against him, but also I can't do that. It's difficult. Back to your point, once you kind of master it and you master the psychology of not in-ring psychology but the dressing room psychology back then, then you're like, okay, right? And honestly, I'm glad that it happened because it helped me later on dealing, when I was in that position, it was like, it really left a bad taste in my mouth. So crazy you say that. I didn't want people coming up to have to deal with the same thing. In the same exact way. Like when I was at Deep South, people were like, do you have any regrets? or do you have anything like i'm proud of what i was able to do at deep south and i imagine you are too like when you had to go through that much pain and agony or whatever it helped groom me into what i needed to be in wwe and it prepared me for what i needed to do so i know some people have gotten flack um you know trainers like bill have gotten flack i i'm i'm happy that i was trained by bill i was happy that i was trained by al snow because they taught me what i needed to know to get to here to this level and then working my way up and i've had the opportunity to be in the ring with some of the greats you sean michaels you know you look at all these people that i've been able to john cena randy orton like gotten to like harness me like i've gotten to do live events with john cena and randy orton for numerous times like that is unbelievable like the the amount of stuff that you learn from those people because they've taken it from you know the triple h's and and and you as well and and and and Kurt angles and all those greats they've taken those and now they're passing it along and passing along now I feel like it's my turn to pass it along and make sure that what has taught been taught keeps getting taught right yes that you know that that whole I think I think the bill DeMott and Al Snow I mean that was just that was always the process generation right it was well I mean it was that was the way it was done for generations you you and whether right or wrong but they're trying to weed out the weak, right? Because you can't come up here and be weak. The grind is too hard. It's too hard physically. It's too hard mentally. So that's where that came from. Now, I think the process obviously is way different now. Way different. Right? The locker room's different. Everything. I mean, the process, I mean, it makes me proud in an extent to know where I came from to where we are today, where we're actively recruiting athletes and then they have this incredible facility to go to and be taught in a manner, you know. They're getting taught the right way. They're getting taught the right way. There is, I got to walk this line. I know exactly where you're going. I got to walk this line. I know where you're going, because there's a part of you that literally goes, I wish some people were still getting that a little bit. You need a little something that gives you a little more edge, right? Right. That's that's that's the that's the fine line. Does it need to be the extreme that I went through and you went? No, no, absolutely not. But there is there's that sense of true struggle. Like for me, you know, once I decided I left school, right, I left school, I had a basketball scholarship. I want to I want to be a professional wrestler. Right. This is my passion now. And everyone tells me like this is the stupidest. Are you crazy? Are you stupid? Starting with my parents. I'll never forget my dad said, son, all you have to do is put a silly ball through a hoop and you are getting an education for free. I know, dad, but this is what I want to do. Son, I understand that. You get to go to school for free to play a game. I understand, dad, but I'm not there now. So it started there, which they both of them became obviously my biggest fans and very proud, but that was a tough conversation to have. Because everyone told me, you're stupid, you're making a mistake, then I refused any help whatsoever. After they realized. Put a chip on your shoulder. Yeah, I put a huge chip on my shoulder. And although they were like, all right, do you need anything? you know you guys don't believe in what i'm doing i don't want i don't want any help right so i end up you know there's times where i'm sleeping in my car and i'm you know i'm bouncing all these clubs and busting heads and doing all this stuff just to scrape up enough money to to go to wrestling school and go to these shows where you lose money and that gave me an edge though because i had a struggle i i had a i had a real real struggle to get my foot in the door and because i wasn't a legacy i didn't you know back we're talking we're talking late 80s here you know there it helped to have you know be a legacy and it wasn't even huge back then right like we're not like are we talking wrestlemanias yet or wrestlemania i think they see an eight by the 87 they had wrestlemania three. I started at seven. They were around WrestleMania. Okay. So you saw, you saw what could be. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, to be completely honest, I was a WCW guy. Like, it was, it was real wrestling. Got it. Right. Okay. Right. I just didn't, I didn't care for the over top character over the top characters. Yeah. I was like, oh man, I was, you know, I was a flair and a four horseman guy, but, but to back to like, obviously we don't need that kind of struggle but there is something that i think is missing um with the edge of when people do get up here like a little grit a grit that's a good yeah that's a good grit is a good deal and i don't know how you create that maybe you don't need to now in this day and age but to me a lot of times you can you see it in the product right and just the little bit of struggle that you have to go through it translate to just to what you do it's funny you say that because like you see boxers right when they're first coming in and they get that and then they get to the championship once they get championship get a little notoriety get a little this they start falling off it's like you saw it with every popular you know boxer or ufc fighter when they start getting money and fame they kind of lose almost that edge where they're used to like used to fighting in like small circles and that kind of stuff i mean hell rocky did a whole rocky three or what is no rocky five Russian yeah I mean the Russian was in a facility and then Rocky was like Rocky 4 was like in he was like training in like the woods right I mean it's like that grit is what you're talking about like I completely understand that I've always like with boxing that's a great deal like I don't know how if you've made I will just you you make a hundred million dollar payoff right like Tyson how many how do you motivate yourself to go to camp for 16 weeks or however long your boxing can and starve yourself and go through the grind of that, and you know that, like, I don't have to do this. There has to be something really, really special. You have to be able to maintain that desire, which has got to be incredibly hard. I mean, even for us in our industry, I think sometimes it's like, yeah, you know what? I'm doing pretty good. Big news. WWE and sports fans. The world's number one sports fan festival, Fanatics Fest, is making its return to New York City. Fanatics is bringing you closer to the league's team, superstars, and athletes you love across four action-packed days in July. Meet your favorite WWE superstars. Get your hands on exclusive merch, catch live podcasts, and interact with the biggest names in sports. Tickets are on sale now, and fans of the podcast get a 10% discount by using code TAKER10 at checkout. I didn't really put it over, but the fact that you still are watching, you know, watching tapes, what are you in? You're like 38th year now? Wow. Thanks. Oh, sorry. I think it's 20 years in WWE, but I've been doing wrestling for like 23, 24 years. Something like that. Dang. Believe it or not, I did do indies for like three years. I could see that. Yeah. I could see you as an indie guy. Did you? What is that supposed to mean? Huh? I mean. I'm just asking. What is that supposed to mean? I mean, you were told earlier. When I was 21, I started at UPW, Ultimate Pro Wrestling. I won my first challenge off the real world. And the money I won, I invested in wrestling school. Paid $2,500 to start wrestling school at UPW. And then I did acting classes, improv classes. Got a nutritionist. I basically paid my rent. I used all the money for that just to invest in this. And then, you know, WWE didn't want any part of it because I was on the real world. And back then, when you're on a reality show, nobody wanted you. This was before Tough Enough, before all those shows. It was just real world survivor and I think big brother maybe. And so we were like the redheaded stepchild. We were the no talent hacks that were on television just because we lived our lives in front of a camera. We really have talent. So I said, okay. So then I went to, did the challenge, won that, and I started wrestling. And like I was in college. I was Miami of Ohio. I was doing pretty well, business classes. and I just, I told my dad, I was like, yeah, I'm, I'm going to move to LA and become a wrestler. It's like, excuse me. Yeah. I'm just going to, I'm going to leave Cleveland, you know, my home that I've been living in. I'm going to leave Miami of Ohio and I'm going to go to California and I'm going to become a wrestler. And it was just, it was not a good, it was not a good and like positive, like you can do it. I believe in you. It was like, that's the stupidest thing I've her. That's dumb. What are you kidding me? You could be the king of... My dad told me I could be the king of Cleveland. And I was like, yeah, he told me I could be Mike. Don't you get it, Mike? You could be the king of Cleveland. Everyone knows who you are. You're off the real world. Biggest show on cable television. On MTV. Every time we walk out people are knowing exactly who you are. Be the king of Cleveland. And I was like, I don't want to be the king of Cleveland. I want to venture out. I want to try to do this. And so I went to UPW, and I will never forget, this ring, the spring underneath would always go crooked, and so there would no give. So we'd always have to go underneath and just kick it. Nice. And kick the thing so it would do it. And then I learned from a ton of people actually stopped by there. Ballard Brothers, Tom Howard, Samoa Joe, Hardcore Kid, Frankie Kazarian, all came there. DDP, Diamond Dallas Page came there. I got to tag with him once at a galaxy show in front of like 500 people. But I actually did some stuff for IZW in Arizona, and I would perform for like at festivals or like, you know, there would be like, not festivals, but like, what is it? What do they have? Like carnivals, you know? Carnival? There was like 200 people there, most drunk, and not really caring what we're doing or whatever, but it was learning. It was learning the art of professional wrestling until Tough Enough came along. And I wanted to try out. They wouldn't let me because I was on MTV and Tough Enough was on MTV. So they were like, you can't be on two MTV shows. I was like, but I'm on The Challenge and Real World. Like, yeah, but those are sister shows. This is not part of that. All right, fine. I'll just keep doing it the right way. And so I went on Tough Enough. Finally, when it went to the CW and it was part of SmackDown's actual show. and so once I got into that I was like oh man but but before that uh before trying out I called uh Simon Dean do you remember Simon Dean yeah uh I called him because he was part of UPW and I said hey I want respect in the business like you know and I know if I go on tough enough I won't get any respect like I didn't do it the right way and he goes it's for a million dollars like it's for a million dollar wwe contract you know how many how many opportunities do you think you're going to get right like to to get into this is your opportunity this is your time and so i said okay i'm gonna i'm gonna try out i'm gonna do it because i tried to go to japan they wouldn't take me like every time i tried going to zero one they would come in and they we would wrestle we'd do a match i think my match would go great it wasn't but i thought at the time i was really special you know and so So, but yeah, they never, Japan would never take me. So I was like, ah, I mean, this is the opportunity. So tried out and then gave it full fourth and didn't win, but got a contract to go to developmental. I don't think there's a better story, like literally like a more beautiful story. Oh, come on. Your story's great, isn't it? No, but I mean, everything you did from real world to now, like you literally did everything to get here. Like you, everything you, even on the show, you were cutting promos, right? Like that, isn't that where Miss TV actually started? Well, Miss TV was Paul Heyman. Okay. That was at OVW. But you were cutting promos of Miss all day long on Real World. The weird part with Real World was there was never like, my friends never called me Miss, like in high school. Right. It was always Mike. Right. You know, and so when I got onto the Real World, I just got uncomfortable. I was in a new place, New York, melting pot. Like I was with seven strangers I never met before and no one liked me because I'm loud. Like, believe it or not. What? Believe it or not. I'm loud. I'm obnoxious. Really? Yeah. Yeah. Believe it or not. Yeah. People, when I first meet people, people don't like me. Come on. Shocking. I know. Hey, but the right one did. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Exactly. So I'm not sure if she liked me in the beginning. Okay. Fair enough. I think I aggravated her the first time she came on Diva Search. She started cutting a promo in front. In English, but she couldn't speak it. I remember. And so I just, I said, can you just not give us a cookie cutter answer? And I didn't know that she practiced this speech for like days. Like she was like practicing in English days. And I just went out there and it was just, she started cutting it. Like I'm going to give 110. Can you save us the cookie cutter answer and just give us a real answer? And she didn't speak English. So that was our first interaction. and you can see it on the Diva Search. It was fun, but man. You had a little digging to do, right? A little digging, yeah. But then the next one I said, hey, just cut a promo in French and she, I don't know what she said, but it worked. Oh my God, it was the sexiest thing. I believed everything. She was very mad. Whatever she said, she was very angry with me. But you were good with it. You loved it. I was very good with it. That's so funny. So in the beginning, I think you were telling me that so who did someone actually tell you that you're never going to make it in this in this business i think everyone told me i was never going to make it in this business were you not the one that told him you you could have been you could have been the person hey you i never come on i don't i don't know if you actually told me verbatim that i was never going to make it in this business never would i do that no i don't think you you actually you actually didn't you were actually very uh you know it's weird a lot of people get a lot of like JBL gets a lot of flack for like bullying and like was an asshole or whatever. I'm not sure if we're allowed to swear, but he gets a lot of that. It wasn't really him. He was the person that would take me aside and go, Hey kid, you're doing a good job. You know what? Keep doing this, keep doing this, do this, this, this, this, and this, and this, but keep it up. You know, you, you would be like, we would have to have a hundred shots of Jack, but you know, we would literally like sit there and you would, you would educate me. And I would just sit there and be like uh-huh uh-huh uh-huh like it was more the people around that weren't in the spots right right yeah you see what i'm saying like it was the people that didn't have that weren't solidified that were like trying to be like hey watch me get this real world kid right i'm gonna really stiff tonight watch this you know that kind of stuff so but you guys were like if anything it would push me more right right yeah like uh i mean i mean i still remember to this day our first match i remember seeing your entrance i remember i i like i remember you throwing me through a table um and me thinking please get up please get up please get up because your move right you know you know last ride you got to get up you got to and i was i never really did that right so i was like all right just gotta push off his legs and flip my thing up and i remember i almost didn't get up and you just muscled me up boom and boom and i was like in my head i'm going yes i did it it was good going up the landings were a little rough sometimes but oh i'll take that all day and the chokes oh man what do you say the easier you go up the easier you come down yeah yeah that was i always told people that you got a lot did you get a lot of backlash just obviously just from being on reality tv because i know i mean god even marice i'm sure yeah i think it was it's it's a couple things right so coming into wwe at the time if you're off of a reality show or anything people all think you're 15 minutes fame and you have to prove yourself not only do you have to and it's understandable on why you have to prove yourself right in wwe because if you don't prove yourself we think you're just gonna go to the top and leave right but we need you if we if you make it to the top we need you because you're the person that everyone's relying on you're that you you have all the pressure you have the ratings if you have the title on your shoulders like like i always told cody like when he first won i go you feel it yeah you feel that weight it's not the belt it's it's the pressure of the title and you've always had the pressure because even without the title you're still the undertaker right and you still have to put on amazing incredible uh storylines as well like you're very vital important you leave someone better be able to you're you better have prepared someone to take that spot and if you don't then that and if that person's like you thought he was there and then he leaves how many times have we had people where they've invested yeah and they give them win after win if win and they just leave yeah and it's like wait a second we need we needed that like the whole team like as much as we're individuals fighting for we are a team it's a it's a valiant team effort to try to make it the best show possible from the front first show to like if the first match sucks guess what you've just set a tone for the entire show now that second match is like oh man that first match darn it i gotta get this and if they and if they build it build it build it and then by the main event you're like you guys just did everything like what are we supposed to do now you know it's like it's it's it's such an art form on what we do and how we do it and how the the matches are set up and how the superstars are created people are always like asking me like how do you know who's getting over you go listen and you go yeah but they cut a promo crowd seems pretty yeah but you start seeing the shirts you start seeing where the stuff you start seeing them do the chance you start seeing you know people gravitate towards them nowadays you can look on the internet and you can see who trending what going on you can feel an energy i mean take jay uso for instance last year i mean we saw you know a rise yeah in a in a superstar like going from a tag team is so difficult that to being a a single star and he has been not to be able to do it, but propel himself to do it. And now he's in that spot where he has to keep it because he doesn't, he doesn't have the title. Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, you know, when you got the rocket and you got the title, it's cool. When you get the title off of you, you have to continue. And that's when my first time I had my first title I had, I didn't know how to keep it without the rocket. Yeah. You know what I mean? I didn't know how to keep that steam. I didn't, I didn't know. Like I was like, wait, I don't have the title. I don't have the rocket underneath me anymore. And then I just started losing and losing and losing. And sometimes losing matters, but you can make it to where it doesn't. And I didn't know how to make it to where it didn't. And it took me a couple years to figure that all out. Does that make sense? No, it makes absolute sense. I don't know. Do you remember our conversation at my Hall of Fame induction? We had a discussion where I really gave you, I felt my props that I'd never really. It was on camera, wasn't it? Was it? I hope so. I thought it was. He did remember. In my head, I was going, is there a camera around? Please, God, someone get this. I'm going to let you in on something, too. So about, it was a solid six, seven years ago. Six, seven. I thought you were going to do it. We were down at the Performance Center. It may have been longer than that. Yeah, it may have been longer than that. But we were in front of all the kids. he was talking to him and I was just kind of peeking around listening. He said, and he kind of stopped and he's like, he goes, I can't believe I'm about to say this, but you don't have to give all the details of details. And it's like, he was struggling with it. And I'm thinking, what is he about to say? He goes, okay, I'm just going to say it. The miss, he is the guy. Every last one of y'all need to study what he is doing. He is the top hill. He is master in the heat. just gave you your flowers and it was beautiful but he really struggled at first oh wow i love to see you struggle i don't know if the hall of fame was on camera and then that hall of fame when we were talking i was just in my i was in awe so he's done it a few times well i had to credit i have said it like in the in the confines of the of the pc i may have put you over a little bit but i felt you know at that point like i didn't know how often i was going to be around and and you know I was all in my feels that day and I saw you. He was not in his feels at the PC. He gets people to hate him and he gets people to hate him no matter what he's doing, whatever storyline is, whoever your tag partner is. That is a true gift. Major props. It is a true gift. I mean, you can't teach what you have. Yeah. Oh, thanks. No, I mean, really. You embraced, I think you embraced being a bad guy. and that it's difficult for people to do that it really is for i don't know why everybody wants more fun right everybody wants that that adulation and that you know but if you can tap into it and be comfortable with it like you you've met and and and to to her credit marisa as well but you just said it can't be taught have you met his dad because yeah that's where i get it from And have you met Marisa's mom? And Marisa. But I'm just saying, though. But when you get here, everybody kind of starts to want that. They want that. You get it. Obviously, you get it. It's just from a completely different perspective. And you've embraced it. And you don't try to. I've seen you on several occasions, even when, because in this day and age, the heels are cool and people want to get with you. And I've seen you shut that down. I don't want to be cool. No. If it's my job to get people that, because my job is to get this baby face over. And if the baby face is brand new and they don't really know him and I have all the equity because I've been here for 20 years, it is my job to make that audience absolutely despise me and I'm not going to do any. So now sometimes I'll be like, I'm not going to do anything cool in my match. Nothing cool. Because I don't want them to cheer a cool move. I'm just going to do dirty stuff, mean stuff. And hopefully this crowd will start understanding, oh, wow, I want this guy to win because that guy's such a jerk. And so now it's been tough this past couple, like I would say past year, because now I feel like the audience kind of knows me, not just from WWE, but all the other adventures of Miz and Mrs. dance with stars whatever it real world whatever it may be that now they just know the work ethic and they know what it takes to do that and what i'm doing and then i come on podcasts and i put everyone over and i'm like ah well this is gonna make my job really hard tonight you know yeah i i get that but it is it's uh i mean it really is a testament to to be and i to to the to the fan reaction now i i think it's just it's simple appreciation really yeah it's appreciation for your craft yeah what you've done with what what you have and and been able to tap in that way i just think it's the nature now of the business like they'd really truly appreciate like dang man especially when you come in plus years yeah and especially when you have a celebrity come in because your match with bad bunny i mean that whole card i that match was yeah oh thank you it was my favorite like it was I was blown away and that's kudos to you I got a lot of credit for that I don't think John Morrison Damian Priest as well as Bad Bunny get enough credit for it because I remember Bad Bunny training and this was during like COVID times where we were at the baseball field in Tampa and every time I would come to the show he was there early in the ring I love that and he would be practicing then he would go sing at the Grammys he'd be right back in the ring he'd go to SNL and he would have the title the 24-7 title that we as much as like it's a prestigious title whatever it was like a fun title right it was a ha-ha title but he would have it and hold it and sing with on snl with that title in his arm and i was like man this dude just loves what we do and gets it and he wanted to do something special he wanted to do something great i remember they were teaching him he wanted to learn like lockups and headlocks and i was like dude i'm not doing any of that and so and so when he was doing all that i was like you know what everyone out of the ring i just gave him heat for like 15 minutes and i go sell this because this is what you're going to be doing a lot of and he did so good and the thing is i also wanted i feel like a lot of times celebrities we hide them you know we hide their flaws whatever i was like we're not hiding you if you are literally going to be doing the entire intro you're going to be involved in every aspect of this match because no one will expect it and everyone will expect you to just come and hit a clothesline and hit this and hit it it's boring right it's boring they want to see you the reason that this crowd is into it and we have developed this storyline he let us like spray paint his five hundred thousand dollar car real spray paint what i remember yes and it was his idea and i was like that's i was like bunny i was like man dude like i'm a little nervous and he goes no no you you spray paint it and i go dude you do he goes we'll have someone wash it afterwards i go it might not come off he goes it'll be all right i'll be like oh my god this guy this guy's in it's in so me and morrison spray painted this 500 000 i think it was like a bugatti like it was yes it was like yes and we're like spray paint every week he'd come in that car and i was like oh my god spray paint it and then i remember ellis just being like like as soon as are you done he was standing on the side with like uh like before oh my god he was like waiting he's like three two one we're done like i mean he got it all off and everything but still that that's how into it bad bunny was and then like that bunny had the the happy feet right uh when we were doing we were rehearsing before the day before i was like dude your feet you're happy, man. Just remember, just relax. Think about how, like, is a person doing this, you know, when, when they're strong and they're, and he's like, no, no. And he's like, okay, good note. So in the match, he started creating stuff in there. Like he was like doing, like, he'd do something and be like, awesome. I'm like, yes, the in-betweens, that's where you get the audience. That's when the audience knows, Hey, this guy, this guy gets it. This guy's part of us. this is what it is i remember training logan and like as much as bad bunny trained logan trained as well but logan was the fastest i've ever seen anyone pick up wwe in my life i've never and i like i know i've said this before but it still blows my mind how good he is and how good he can be right like i do feel he's the future of this business and i know and the funny part is he's doing my gimmick oh that's what i was about to ask you that's what i was about to ask gimmick and he's doing it and it's like oh it's i i when he said yeah i'm an outsider i was like i wonder who the first outsider was you know i was on the real world coming to wwe when it was hard to do that now you're a youtuber and we applaud it oh he's in here but our audience won't but everyone else is like yeah but i was like oh man this dude's stealing my gimmick and he's doing a really good job of it too i don't remember when he first and he first started he's like man i don't want to be a heel i go come on dude you're you don't have a choice you don't have a choice yeah heel and in this match if you remember it was me versus logan it was heel versus heel and uh we had to like almost not like flip it but in the match you know when you're feeling something yeah you know i could either lean it if one of us is getting cheered like in my mind they're going into this match with logan i was like if one of us is getting cheered we're going into that right because it'll be too hard to and this is a lot of things going on in your mind while you're doing a match well and this is it at summer slam like this is like a big big match right and it's in front of a huge crowd a stadium and so i was like all right in this match what they're gonna cheer someone they're just going to and whoever it is that's what we're going with and i it was like they were cheering me in the beginning and i was like all right we're going with this but i bet i bet that they'll be cheering for you by the end and so he did the when he did the uh no one expected him to do the the splash off the the rope onto the table i actually asked him i was like do you think you could do that and he goes yeah i think so and then we rehearsed it up at stanford uh we didn't have the the the table but we had the crash pads we stacked up we put it really far away and i was like it's about this far he looked at it he goes i can do that and he did it and i went let me do it a little further away just in case and he did it again i was like this dude is a superior athlete like he is unbelievable and he understands the psychology so cut to now looking at him when him telling me i want to be a baby face like guess what you're a heel dude and i was right and he is a heel and he's doing a phenomenal job at it and he can really i mean the world is his oyster yeah whatever this kid wants to do he can do because he's that good at it at everything all facets of it yeah that's why i hope he doesn't and he loves this yeah that's why i hope he doesn't get in his own way with the baby face wanting to be a good guy no that was in the beginning that was like first match you know like it was i think it was me and uh i think it was me and him versus ray and dom and uh It's funny. Dom as a baby face now. Can you even see it? No. Can you even see that? Remember, he was cleanly shaven, short hair, just a smile on his face. So happy to be here. Now you look at him. He's just Eddie Guerrero. Dirtbag. Just like a dirtbag. Talk about honing a craft and locking in and being able to utilize live events to find your character and develop your character. and then be aligned with people like Finn Balor and Damian Priest and putting him in that judgment day where he can literally find his own way with these people that can really elevate him and teach him. Talk about elevating. Even the vision now and looking at Braun Breaker, it gives me goosebumps seeing these young guys getting put in the proper positions to succeed and really be able to hone it in and lock it in because it's to their credit. you can be put in the position, but you can fail really easily. You can get taken out of that position, yeah. If you get put in that position too soon, yeah, that second climb is a lot harder than the first one. Oh, yeah, especially. And then even the third and fourth and fifth climb, man, like, you know what I mean? No, absolutely. You know what I mean? It's like you get the title, that's a climb, and then you get the title taken off of you, that's a climb. Then it's like finding the climb back to getting the title again. Then you're like, okay, what did I learn on my first title? How do I make it even better? It's just, it's a never-ending, revolving evolution of your mind and your brain in trying to make this product the best you possibly can for the audience that we see out there. Are you ready to hold WWE history in the palm of your hand? Topps is bringing you closer to the action than ever before with WWE Topps Now. highlighting the biggest matches and milestones from WWE shows and PLEs throughout the year. Topps Now is enhancing the fan experience by connecting collectors to superstars and spectacles that ignite their passion. Featuring stunning event-exclusive photography, each card is made for the moment. And for some lucky collectors, the moment could be the pull of a lifetime. Along with serial numbered parallels, some Topps Now releases offer a chance at rare short prints, superstar autographs, and even pieces of the mat, gear, or other items used during the featured match. So which moments will you collect? With each card only available for a limited time, you won't want to wait to begin your Topps Now journey. Be sure to subscribe to WWE Topps Now mailing list on Topps.com and follow Topps on all social media platforms so you never miss a single moment. Can I ask you a question? Sure. When did you know you were done? 18 different times. No, no, no. And I'll ask you the same question. When did you know you were, and you're not really done yet. I don't know if you are. I mean, mine was a little different situation. I don't know. Are you done or you're still abled and willing and ready to go? If they called me, I would feel comfortable saying yes, I can 1,000% do it. Yeah. Okay. So we're not done. I could do that. Okay. Great. Phone call. We're waiting for it. But hey. I'm done. We know you're done. I'm done. We know you're done. When did you know? So I knew, so those last few years for me were like a struggle. Can I ask your age? Those last few years, how old were you? I think I retired when I was 55, I think. Yeah. Okay. And I tell you, I really hadn't talked about this a whole lot, but I was so envious of Sean, right? When he retired, we did 25 and 26, WrestleMania 25 and 26. And he walked away at 26, the most content, at peace. Like he was at 25. He knew like what else is left, right? What is what's left for me to do? And then we came back with the retirement match and seeing the peace that he was in, it was always in my head like, man, that's what, when my time comes, and we're the same age, when my time comes, that's how I want to walk away, right? And then as you get older, and at this point now, I'm only working two, three, four times a year. Which might be harder. It is very much harder. The older that I got, it becomes extremely difficult. Yeah, you lose the calluses. You lose the calluses. You lose calluses. You lose timing. You lose, even although I wasn't taking trauma on my body, you still lose. Just father time is undefeated. But my mind, my mind's eye had that envisioned that match that I want to go out on, right? I want to go out on a five-star, hang my six shooters up on the mantle, say, kiss my ass, follow that, I'm done, right? That's what I was looking for. And I don't think I was really honest with myself, knowing with the injuries and everything else that was going on that I wasn't going to be able to do that. And I thought my best last shot was going to be with AJ. COVID hits, right? That match, the Boneyard match, is supposed to happen in the ring in a stadium. COVID hits, all that gets shut down. So, again, I'm having to think in my – and that camp that I always called, like those last few years that I was – I'm going into camp to get ready for mania, right? There was a strict regiment that we did. Always, you know, cardio had to be – that's the biggest thing is the cardio. Like when you're not getting reps. And it's a different cardio too. It is a whole. It's not running on a treadmill. No, no, no, no. No, it's different. You cannot emulate it. No, you can't. You have to be in the ring. Yes. And not having those reps, getting older, it just became increasingly difficult. Plus the injuries. You know, this is my knee injuries, my back injuries, everything else. And not giving myself any grace with that either. Yeah. Right? Because the people don't care. Because we need you. Yeah. Yeah. And the people don't care. Right? I mean, they expect when they pay money to see the underdog, they expect a certain quality. And so I'm trying to process all of those things, put that kind of pressure on myself, and still thinking I can get myself to where I need to be. I can do this. And it was well on my way when I started training for that match with AJ. Everything was going, hey, I'm feeling good. Everything's moving around. then COVID hits, everything shuts down. We get stuck in Florida, right? We spent, I don't know, a couple of months in Florida, right? But there's no, you know, now I'm away from my home gym and everything else. We're stuck in a condo on the beach in Florida. And, you know, the PC shut down. Everything is, you know, so I'm just like, oh, crap. So that, long story short, we get into the Boneyard match. And I think it's probably three or four in the morning. and we're still shooting, and it hit me. Really? Yeah. Which is weird because I remember you saying that. You did have clarity for some ungodly reason. You're like, I'm done. And I'd heard it a million times before. So you've heard it many times. Many times. Did you believe him this time? I believed it that time. What was it? I don't know. Was it the way he said it? The way he said it, it was because when it happened, and I never really heard him say it, like how he said it, like how he delivered it. It was just I could tell that he meant like that he had peace about it. All the other times it was like I was like, okay. I don't know that I had peace, but I knew what the reality was. But you were clear. I was clear. Like, okay, you got everything out of this body that you could possibly get. My mind and my heart, man, I would still be doing it right now. But in that moment at three or four o'clock in the morning, it hit me. It like dude you you done And for what it worth that was a five match in my book I love those cinematic matches I love them I very proud of that And obviously, you know, it's another part of the career and some of the really cool things that I got to do in my run. But obviously, I would have loved to also have had a match with AJ Styles in the ring. Right. That's why I came back that last time. That was the whole reason he taught me, you know, he called me and said, Hey man, come on. If you got one left in you, can it be me? And I was like, damn, he's going to do it. He's the one guy that I didn't, you know, and he is special. He is. And so, but that's where it ended up. And that's how it, yeah, I was just like, it's over. I still had another, another hour and a half of filming to do, but but I knew like I knew when I walked off that set or not the set, but wherever the boneyard was at, I was like, yeah, I'm done. Wow. Yeah. That's crazy. So that's amazing. So you, so you are now you're like the OG bro. No, I'd say Randy's the OG both of you there. And then me, I think it's Randy than me right now for full-time superstars. It's nice. It's, it's, it's crazy. I didn't think I'd ever, like when I first came into WWE, did you think I would be one of the last ones or did you think I was going to be gone in three months? I lost the money. I lost the bet. To your credit. But you let him back in the locker room. He did let me back in the locker room. But you let him back in the locker room. Lost the bet. I don't know. I second-guessed that decision. Wow. That was one of the happiest moments of my career, I would say. because when you're kicked out of the locker room there's like there's some people that wanted people to see that i was kicked out of the locker room and would change like in front of i found my own like locker room which was usually in like a broom closet or like in the back or wherever but i didn't want anyone to see me and it was like it was like six months i think it was even longer than that wow really yeah it was a long time because i think at that time like i think the whole thing went down and i don't know all the story but it probably started in a live event and i think at that particular it did start a live event i ate a piece of chicken over someone's bag and the way it was brought to the attention was that i was in the locker room throwing chicken everywhere right and it was like i remember and i kind of dismissed it i guess you can say and it probably wasn't the wrong way to do right so the person walks in goes oh you're eating chicken over my bag like oh man i'm sorry you know and then another person walks in oh you're eating chicken over his bag oh yeah and i knew what was happening so i literally got up and left because i saw the i saw the oh it's gonna start yes it's only here to here to here and it's gonna it's gonna go so let me get out of here i apologized walked out and then i remember i was watching we used to watch them on vhs tapes our matches back remember that in those days yep and so i was watching my match back and i just hear wasn't you um uh and i got yelled at probably the worst i've ever been yelled at in my entire life and i didn't get kicked out there i was yelled at and then that that night I went to Chili's and got a, got a gift card and I gave it to the person. I was like, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I didn't mean to, you know, you know, eat chicken over your bag. Like I, I, you know, Oh man, it's okay. Bah, bah, bah. Uh, the person that yelled at me goes, uh, yeah, chewing on a straw. I think you need to be kicked out of the locker room just for live events. Okay, sure. No problem. Let me get out of the locker room. There we go. And my heart sank, right then uh the next day was tv i see the person chewing his thing hey you're kicked out of the locker room tv and uh this i go okay yes sir didn't have to go to uh court by the way which i was shocked i was read i was like oh man i had my jack daniels ready like like i was ready to go may have behooved you to go to court oh my god i don't know i don't know but uh but yeah then like I would find places to go and then the person told me you can come in when I tell you you can come in something happened to that person and that person went away and so I had no way of getting back in so I was like oh man so I went to the person I ate the chicken over I was like can I how do I get back in the locker room you're still in the locker room I go yeah I had no idea man like you should talk to Taker I go okay I go I've been oh you have you knew but you're like oh you have what'd you get kicked out for i ate a piece of chicken over a person's like oh you did i'll get back to you on that and then i was like oh man oh so i waited till the end and then i think you probably forgot but i walked up and said mr do you think i could like come into the locker room and you were like you're back in kid and i I was like, oh, I remember I remember driving with Punk and it was like Ryder and Brian Myers and Hornswoggle. We would stack like a caravan. Oh, man. Swoggle would be in the back. Did he ever drive? We'd have no. Because he got that pedal thing. No, he would never drive. He would always sit in the back because we had to fill bags. Right. And he's the only one that can fit in the back. And so we would put one, two, three, four, five people in and we had five bags like. Wow. And we'd all stay in the same hotel. He would always take the cot. And so it was always way cheaper. Honestly, I spent maybe $100 a weekend. That's how much we were able to split it up between all of us. Oh, Dylan. But yeah, I remember being in there and being, guys, I'm back in, man. I'm back in. They were like, yeah, let's go. Let's go. So I probably knew that at one point you had been kicked out. I wasn't doing live events at the time. I was only doing TV. So a lot of things, people always are under this impression. Oh, he was locker room leader. He knew everything. It was like I'm Don Corleone. There's a lot of times things happened, and then they get filtered to me later. And then you find out, too, a lot of times people would go, oh, Taker's going to be pissed. And I have no clue about whatever. But you've got to understand, the mid-card and under-card was always like, yeah like we're taker it's taker but also you i don't think you understand your aura when you walk into a place your aura is on it's it's even like whether you you still feel like undertaker or mark or whatever when you walk into a room your aura puts people towards you and it literally you could either scare a person or you can like like or you could be the nicest person in the world. I try to tell him that at home. I don't think you, you probably don't know because most people with that kind of aura, they don't get it. Yeah, but I'm literally not trying to be funny. I tell him that at home too. Notice everyone in here going, yep, yep, everyone. See? I'm like, if you don't say anything in the mornings, like, it changes the whole mood of the house. And like, you don't even mean to do it, but it's just your, Craig, what's he doing now? I made a lot of people uncomfortable. I'm eyeballing everybody right now. Everyone literally went yep he's absolutely correct yeah i'm a teddy bear and you can feel that sometimes and then other times you can be like a what i don't know the right word well you're gonna bail on that one hey don't be a coward oh that's like in wwe terms that's when a person gets really angry is it that's what i feel like we're in a thing it's weird that's what i've heard and it's like anybody ever called you a coward? Oh my God, every day. I mean, honestly, like in WWE, yes, many times. I mean, I feel like that's the standard. Like in particular, maybe Daniel Bryan? Oh, you've called me a coward? Oh, Daniel Bryan. Oh, shoot, we're getting there. I know. You thought he was calling me a coward? You thought he was calling me a coward? So here's how I do that one, right? So I remember, so it's, I've been called a coward a million times, right? A hundred times. Okay. when he called me a coward it was a different and it was different i would say so oh it was i i knew what he was saying and i was like all right and so yeah i i blacked out i don't black out usually when i cut promos that was in a moment where it's gonna sound so stupid but i was going through an acting phase where i read a book and it's like try to memorize like when you're happy try to think about it in the back of your head that you're happy and what your body is doing what you're feeling so whatever emotion that i was feeling if i was in an argument i was literally in the back of my head going all right you're an argument what's your body doing what are you feeling because i wanted to be a better actor if you will so every conversation that i would have like even right now now i'm doing it i'm like what am i doing what am i oh okay i'm doing this so whenever i would act i would be able to do that right so i remember when he called me a coward and i remember oh you're getting mad oh you're getting really angry and then i remember the words coming out and i went oh no and then he left and i didn't know what to do because i was like i was i thought i thought he was gonna hit me like i was like all right i'm going he's probably gonna hit me what was the difference like i don't know around i thought you were gonna hit him yeah you seemed really no no i was i was not in no i wasn't gonna hit him i was gonna let him know but you did and and then i was waiting for him to hit me and he just left and when he left everything went everything went off like i i mean it literally i i couldn't make when i get really really mad i can't speak it's my brain is going so fast and so mad that i can't get words out so everyone's like oh it's the greatest promo ever oh my god blah blah blah and i was i watch and i go that is terrible i'm not getting my words out correctly i was so angry and i was not scared but like i've never lost it like that before in my life and so and i just cut it right to a camera because i found something and then left and you ever you ever when you blackout i don't know if you guys have ever had this type of situation like you walk off and you're out of breath and you're like what just happened why did i just did i just do something bad did i like you know what i mean like did i not like hurt but like did i just say something that i didn't mean to say yeah or did i do something that's gonna you know retaliate and hurt the our our wwe am i gonna is i get into those mode i was there and afterwards everyone was like and i remember it was that the set was right in front of where everyone had to leave and it was back in the day when people actually waited till the end of the show to leave yeah and so people were waiting because we were filming and you couldn't so everyone was just like i remember seeing everyone just mouths dropped like holy cow i remember getting a bunch of texts and this was on a show by the way that no one watched and we were trying to get you know a little like going and i wasn't even supposed to be on the show that day the the long story short i was put in a dark match and i was very angry about it because it's the first match on a show and I wasn't on the show and I was the intercontinental champion. And I was like, you're going to put me in the dark match. Like I'm not even on the show. And then they're introducing two new titles. And I was like, what about this title? Like this title, like meant, I mean, that title still means so much to me because it's, it was the workhorse title. Like I remember always hearing, oh, you want to be the workhorse. You're the workhorse title, the workhorse title. It's the title that gets you to elevate to the, to the top. And that's what I wanted it to do. and all I was doing in that era, all that title was doing was you have the title and you just lose, but you still have the title. You're just going to lose. You still have the title. You're just going to lose. Now you're not even on TV. So I remember I went up to Road Dogg and I was like, put me on Talkin' Smack. He's like, what do you want to be on Talkin' Smack for? I was like, he's the general manager. I'll just let all my frustrations out on him. And then when he called me a coward, everything changed. Flip the script there. Yeah, everything got to change. I mean, Daniel's an immense talent. We know that, right? He is an incredible talent. But we just, we're like this. Oil and water a little bit. Yeah, man. We get along, but it's like we're not going to hang out with each other. Yeah, yeah. Right? I remember watching, and honestly, as a fan watching, I was going, is this real? I mean, or is this a word? You never know. Is this part of the storyline? Exactly. Is it real or fake? But I'll tell you when I knew, or when I had that real inkling of, no, this is like, there's something there, is by Maurice's reaction or non-reaction. She wasn't reacting, and I knew she didn't kind of know what to do. She was like, oh, this is for real. He is hot. So I could tell by her that there was some underlying, a little underlying issues there. I can get mad. It was good to see. It was fun. oh thanks i remember it happening i didn't like the feeling no no no obviously yeah you don't like that feeling but man when you now you have that you can tap into i can tap it so you know like going back like i can tap into that now whenever i need it right like it's like oh i know where that is yep so it's all like there but i don't like to yeah yeah unleash it never so i have i I don't know. This seems like an obvious question to me. What's next for you? And before I get that, why are you not doing this? He's a wolf. Time? You don't have time? I've tried to – so with WWE being a full-time talent, right? But WWE allows you to do other things. I'm the host of American Gladiators now, which will be coming out in 2026. Oh, fun. And so, yeah, we filmed it, and it's everything I thought it would be and more. Like, it has the nostalgia of the old, but also has new. It's the people that are trying to beat our gladiators, their stories are unbelievable. Like, it's life-changing money, but also not just them, the gladiators. this is a moment for them to like really step up and they're fans of the show before right and now having that so that's on my back um also trying to be the best dad and husband i could possibly be you have to have time right like i'm like changing schedules my schedule so i can see my daughter sing in a play right like these are the important moments that i don't want to miss right um and as far as podcasting i've talked about it like i've talked about it with maurice and it's like i just know i know the work it takes this is not easy it's not easy to come in here maybe it is for you take but for us for us it would not be i would put way too much work into it and i'd have to like make sure it's the best and i'd have to do this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this you would just sit there and tell stories I feel for you how much work do you put in for this? all of it she puts in all the work and then none of it comes to fruition it's fine don't worry about it why are you worried about it? do you feel my aura? I'm the undertaker you're going six feet under with the undertaker and guess what I'm going to tell a story and everyone's going to listen because that's what I do I'm a much better guest than I am a host I can tell you that. You're doing great. Are you kidding me? No, I'm getting carried, but that's fine. That's why I have guests like you. All I got to do is sit here and look cool. Have my aura. You do look cool. Have your aura. Normally, I would have some kind of boot on. That's what I was imagining. Right? It would go with the rest of the ensemble here. When I was getting ready, I was like, what should I wear? I was like, oh, I'm wearing all black, 100%. Baker's probably going to wear all black. Got to do it. You're the dead man. You're the good man. And hey, thanks for coming out, man. Thank you so much for having us. It is an absolute honor to sit here with both of you guys. Oh, you're the best. Thank you. I really appreciate it. And I really appreciate everything that you have done, not just for me, but for the entire WWE. Like watching, I don't think anyone will ever forget where they were, what they were doing when the streak was over. You never will. And I also wanted to tell you this. You don't give yourself enough credit for the John Cena versus Undertaker match where John Cena just barades you for like seven weeks and you come in and just do the hits. And he was in the best shape of his life. By the way, it's exactly what everyone wanted. Yep. And it was a, like, you can sit there and go, like all these people, five-star, that is a five-star match. Why? Because the crowd was on the edge of their seats the entire time. I mean, I remember watching that match going, that was perfect. That was exactly what I wanted. And I imagine you would have, you wanted to, And I hear you say it on, like, probably on this podcast, like, I wanted to do more. I wanted to do this, this. If you would have done that, like, it wouldn't have mattered. That was a five-star match right there. That's what the crowd wanted. I appreciate that. But so that was one of those instances where I had really gotten myself because I was really unhappy with my physical condition against Roman, right? Because I was really banged up and I didn't get in the shape and I don't feel like I did for Roman what I was supposed to do. He got his hand raised fine. but I had a real chip on my shoulder. I came back. I think I had one of my hips done and I really had something I wanted to prove, right? Because even at that point in my career, I'm always like, you know, I want to go out and steal the show. So I rehabbed the hip. I get myself in shape. I let the old man know, yep, I'm ready to do this. Let's go, full steam. So I'm training like a freaking maniac and then I get to, so I'm thinking that, right? I'm not thinking story. Yeah, I'm not thinking story as much of I am redemption as far as my in-ring, right? And yeah, I get there and Vince goes, yeah, three minutes. I'm like, what, excuse me? I'm the undertaker. Three minutes. That's John Cena. Yeah. I'm ready. Honestly, I was in shape. I could have done holding my breath. I bet I could have done 25 minutes. Didn't you bring John in with you thinking he had? Yeah. Yeah. No, Vince go. So I'm, I'm like, wait, like I can't hear. Like I just can't because I'm, I'm so my whole motivation and which it should have been, you know what? Undertaker and John Cena first time ever at mania, we should have been, I'm thinking all I'm thinking is like the last time you were in the ring, you stunk it up. My opinion, you stunk it up. I'm going to go out and show people I still got the motor. I can still do all that. So that's what the veteran in you didn't go, hey, kid, less is more. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm, I'm going to, I'm in a whole different frame of mind and then, you know, I get there and yeah, yep. It was perfect. Yeah. The way Sina berated you for like, it was, it felt like months and then literally comes out and you just come out and just beat the Holy hell. And the fact that it was Cena made it even that much more because it wasn't expected. Right. And it just, it had everything. So all that training, by the way, paid off because everything was perfect. Well, thank you. Yes. We're going to have to have him back. Push you over. Let's go. Let's go. Push him over. I didn't even get into her. I wanted to get into her career. Oh. Yeah. Well. Divas generation. Yes. I'm very familiar with the division. I know what you had to go through. I mean, it was like one minute. Get over. Go. With entrances. With entrances. You guys were able to do it. Oh, man. We'll definitely. I'd love to have you back, man. How about we have he and Maurice back? Yeah, game on. That would be fun. Yeah, that would be fun. Perfect. Thanks, guys. Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it. Thank you. You