Hi, this is Kylie. I hope you're loving Lent with the Saints. Do you have any questions about anything you've heard so far? Well, we'd love to hear your questions and answer them in a special episode of Lent with the Saints. To tell us your question, ask your mom or dad to help you record it on lentwiththesaints.com slash questions. It's easy and a lot of fun. We'll choose a few of your questions and answer them in a special Sunday episode of Lent with the Saints. I can't wait to hear from you. Send us your questions now at lentwiththesaints.com slash questions. Carthage, 373 AD. Two years after leaving Tagaste, Augustine revels in the decadent pleasures of his new home. His unexpected meeting with Aurora leads him further astray. But when the writings of Cicero and Virgil arouse his deep longing for beauty and truth, he questions everything, including his wayward life. You are the life of souls, O Lord. Deep within, I longed for you. But I was too in love with love, and I sought to fulfill my desire with lustful pleasures. Yet somehow, I did fall in love. and was loved in return. But, O God of mercy, in your goodness, you would not let my heart find rest in tainted things. But for me, I must depart and learn to sing my verse to the shepherd's pipe. I know well that it is better to suffer in the woods and to carve my love upon tender tree trunks, for as they grow, you, my love, will grow with them. Love conquers all. Let us yield to love. Let's stone the crows, Augustine. I don't think I've ever heard Virgil delivered with such passion. Huzzah! We'll have to come again and bring... Augustine? Are you all right? These words, Olypius, they stir up so many... Such a deep ache. Olypius out of all the speeches and lectures we attended together nothing punctures my heart like the dramas of Virgil But why do you keep returning if it causes you such pain It not that kind of pain It catharsis Longing A deep desire A pull Do you not feel it? I feel enlivened by the words. Impressed by their delivery. No, no, no, no, no. This isn't that. Nearly two years of companionship and I still don't understand you. There's something present within Virgil's words that stirs. So avoid the theater and you'll avoid the pain. The pain has been there my whole life. The words merely fan the flame. Then avoid the words and you'll avoid the fanning. I don't wish to avoid it. That's my whole point. There's something beautiful about this pain. Something deep-rooted, unavoidable. I need to follow and see where it leads. To what end, Augustine? I wish I knew. I desperately wish I knew. I think what you need is a stiff drink. Some other time. I told Aurora I'd meet her and Adiodoptos at the market. I suppose that's a more goodly remedy. Give her my greeting. Maybe she can help you better understand these passions of yours. Of passions? We do indeed have an understanding. Off with you, you scoundrel. What do you say to plums, Ariadatus? Or maybe, what about pears? Is that so, little man? Aurora! Here comes Papa. Now who is this absolute vision standing before me? Sir, I would hope that you'd refer to her as the love of your life. That sounds right to me. Don't worry, little man. There's a kiss for you, too. How is the theater? Oh, stunning! I've never heard Virgil like this. Will you take me? I was hoping you'd ask. And how is our little talker today? Does that answer your question? Did you enjoy your visit with Cassia? I did. What's wrong? Nothing. Rubbish. It's only... She's so glad to be married. She can hardly speak of anything else. Letter. Marriage means nothing. To her it means everything. Then let's hope it lasts. I want to be married, Augustine. Marriage wouldn't be any different from what we have now. It would be very different. I would be a wife, not a concubine. Aurora, please. You know that... Go on. What do I know? Let's forget it. Forget it? How could I forget that I'm a freed slave? How could I forget that the law won't allow you to marry someone so far beneath your station? Aurora! Don't speak to me as if I were a fool, Augustine. You're not a fool. That's not what I'm saying. But we've had this conversation before, and having it again won't change what we can't have. I'm not vying for what we can't have. I'm just telling you that I'm sad we can't have it. I know you are. And I'm sorry I can't mend that. But we have exactly what all married persons do. We have deep affection. We have understanding. We share humor. We have a beautiful son. A beautiful son We live just like every other family does What marriage other than religious pressure and social niceties We don need that We have passion Aurora Your father really does have a way with words, doesn't he, Adiodatus? Well, I'm grateful for the endorsement. Let's say we go home. Let's walk a little longer. I'm afraid I have some important studying to do if I'm to turn this gift for words into a successful profession. I suppose I'd rather be seen arm in arm with the best rhetorician in Carthage. Then I'd better get to my books. Olympias! Olympias, over here! What's all this? The result of an excellent argument between the professors. About Cicero's canons? About the very purpose of rhetoric itself. But what about the canons? Enough! Enough now! Quiet down, all of you. I'll remind you, Counselor, that this entire discussion began because you claimed that an orator must have an understanding of what is truly moral in order to properly carry out his profession. In fact, Headmaster, it was Cicero who made that claim. But I do agree with it. Morality has nothing to do with proper rhetoric. Rhetoric is a matter of what to say and how to say it. Morality oppresses that with questions of why. The question of why is inseparable from the question of what. Words are spoken with an end in mind. The very purpose of rhetoric is learning how to use words to achieve that end. In essence... Then it would be very dangerous indeed to foster persuasiveness without good intention. You fear a compelling fool? I fear an eloquent devil. Uh, devil, good intentions, truly moral. So, even if you're correct about all this, how are we to determine what's truly moral? I think it begins with determining the nature of the intention. Is it vainglorious or humble? Self-serving or benevolent? You make it sound as though rhetoricians should behave as public servants. And so we should! Our words are only valuable inasmuch as they guide us deeper into the eternally true. I quote Cicero. I think I've heard plenty from him. I quote Cicero, law in the proper sense is right reason in harmony with nature. There will not be one such law in Rome and another in Athens. One now and another in the future. But all peoples at all times will be embraced by a single and eternal unchangeable law. When do you think they'll get back to Cicero's canons? Forget the canons, Olympias. This is... this is indispensable. It been on my mind for days now Olympias Oh you poor excuse for a gladiator The question of eternal truth. Get up and fight back. What could be of greater significance? Ha ha ha ha, that's more like it. Are you hearing anything I'm saying to you? Augustine, I'm watching the games. That isn't half as important. Well, it's twice as interesting. Olypius, my mind is caught in a stalemate. All right. All right, explain it. Briefly, if you can. I'd never given much thought to the Eternal before. Suddenly, thanks to Cicero, it's all I can think about. So, what exactly is the problem? As I see it, there are three. Good heavens. First of all, I do long for wisdom of the Eternal. But I also desire sensual delight. Do you have to choose one over the other? The senses distract me from the discipline of thought. But my mind can't fulfill the needs of the flesh. They tear me in opposite directions. I would simply embrace the stronger. That's problem number two. I don't think I could give up either of them. Then they have to be reconciled to one another, yes? Possibly. But that's what brings me to problem three. The more I wrestle with this, the less sure I am of the virtue of bodily pleasures. Wait, wait. Did you just use the word virtue? For lack of a better word, yes. Now this is extraordinary. Is Augustine developing a conscience? Don't count on it. Virtuous! What prompted you to even consider such a concept? I don't know. I came to Carthage all too happy to embrace the sensual. Now, thanks to Cicero, I find myself questioning that. And I'm not sure how to proceed. Forgive me for distracting you from the games back there. I'll get over it. Just try and pick a more suitable moment for your philosophy next time. Agreed. I'll see you later then. So long, Olympias. Great cosmic battle that, to this day, is waging between the God of Light and the God of Darkness. What was that? Yes, friends, gather closer. Listen to my preaching if you would hear the truth. This world is a battleground between the God of Good and the God of Evil. We are all of us caught up in it. Your many sins of the flesh bear the mark of the god of darkness. This is no Christian dogma. But don't be disheartened. The fault is not yours, but the darkness within you. You long for answers, for justification. I can see it. Manichaeism holds the key. Manichaeism holds the key? Sir? Please, tell me more of this Manichaeism. The Human Battleground The Merry Beggars is the entertainment division of Relevant Radio.
