What I am seeing is more private sector engagement in the delivery of SDGs and certainly from the global compact perspective, a strong desire by leading CEOs who can really influence and shape to have dialogue with government and wanting to really work alongside government to raise ambition and push momentum and drive for success. I think that is absolutely important. Welcome to the special English edition of De Gorsa Neustadt, a German podcast series by Zabilla Bug, in which she talks to pioneering leaders who, inspired by the World Economic Forum's Great Reset Initiative, create revolutionary projects that actually do make our world smarter, greener and fairer. Today we have the honour of hosting Sanda Ojambo, the Assistant Secretary-General and CEO of the United Nations Global Compact. This organisation stands as the world's largest corporate sustainability initiative, with over 18,000 corporate participants across 160 countries. The UN Global Compact calls on companies worldwide to align their operations with 10 principles in areas such as human rights, labour, the environment and anti-corruption. Its mission is to drive global business to uphold these principles and advance the 17 global development goals. The current numbers show that there is much to do. Only 15% of the SDGs are on track to be delivered by 2030, while 30% have stalled or gone into reverse. Sanda Ojambo will talk about why we need more ambitious action, forward thinkers and doers who see the SDGs for what they are, the driver for growth. A very warm welcome to you and good morning, Sanda, in New York. Because we have quite limited time, I will go straight into my first question. It was a very busy summer. First we had World Water Week in Stockholm. You attended the Africa Climate Summit in Nairobi and now the SDG Summit and Climate Week in New York. What are your overall impressions of these events? Yeah, well first thank you so much for having me and it's great to have this opportunity to reflect on the state of the world. Yeah, you're right. It's been a busy season, a season of reflection I think. A few months prior to the SDG Summit, the Secretary General released a report on the state of the attainment of the Sustainable Development Goals. I think that has really framed a lot of discussion around the SDG Summit. The clarity that only about 15% of SDG targets on track is quite sobering and is a wake-up call to the collective impact, I think not only of the past three years of the COVID pandemic, the climate crisis and conflict, but really I think the general lack of clear momentum and shared decisiveness around delivery on the SDG. That I think is an overarching and then framing piece of positioning around the work that's happening. I think there's two other key things. One, the multilateral framework is not perhaps as strong as we would like it to be. We are seeing increasing frustration, I think widening of gaps between the North and the South. I think how the world is meeting and convening perhaps is not at its best or it's ideal for the multilateral space. So widening inequalities, widening gaps. And then I think an overarching other narrative really is just around the financial architecture and the fact that even though we are clearly united around the need for a just inclusive and sustainable climate transition, energy transition, food systems transition, we recognize the potential for the digital transformation. I think the fact is that given the current financial architecture system, countries and economies that need to borrow to be able to finance these transitions, unable to do so on terms that are just and equitable, when an era of hyperinflation, there is a liquidity crisis that many governments are facing. So we stand at the cusp of opportunity, but are lacking the financial muscle or the investment climate to be able to do so. I think for me, those would be my three big pieces. The DSDGs are off track, that there is a widening gap between North and South and the financial architecture present isn't robust or financial and investment climate. I think I'd put those three together. Yes, yes. We will come back to the financial architecture in a moment. Let's just dive briefly into the water week in Stockholm, because regarding the issue of clean water scarcity, we have at the moment around 2.2 billion people worldwide who lack access to safe drinking water and approximately 4.2 billion people lack access to safely managed sanitation services. That is every second person. Where do you see hope and progress? Yeah, I mean, those statistics are indeed dire. Lack of access to safe drinking water. I mean, just that's a first. I think water obviously is used for a lot of other things, agriculture, supporting education, you know, a near access to water liberates a lot of women and girls from the simple chore of having to go and gather water. Water is so critical to a lot of business operations, but this needs to be done sustainably. So what is, you know, a public good that I think perhaps isn't valued or priced enough to make so that's used appropriately? Where do I see hope? I see within the work in the context of the global compact, we have a strong private sector coalition, the water resilience coalition. We had some meetings here on the margins of the SDG summit, really driving up support from the private sector to achieve a net positive water impact over by 2030. It's a forward looking group of corporates who are looking at really, you know, making more efficient and more effective the way that they use water within their businesses. And I'll come back to talk about that, but also investing in restoring, protecting and promoting a hundred water stress basins around the world. And those water stress basins have the potential to support close to three billion people. So not only is it a look inwards at building efficiency around how they use water, but outwards investing in the sustainability of our water systems. Some incredible work going on, you know, in the in the textile or fashion industry, just looking at more efficient ways of using water, using less chemicals in the productions processes. Those who work in enzymes and biotechnology, making sure, for example, that, you know, one wash, you know, can can use as less water provides much more cleaning action and results. So there's a lot of really innovative work that is ongoing. The coalition was launched in 2020. I think we have about 35 global companies operating 140 countries really helping to promote these shifts. Got a lot more to go in terms of our ambition of membership and engagement, but we have a really strong start around commitment to those two areas. If we go quickly from from Stockholm to Nairobi, in the context of the UN Global Compact, African business leaders coalition and the funding challenges, of course, faced by African countries and businesses, can you elaborate on the impact of the financial commitments made during the summit or maybe even also in New York? Yeah, I mean, I'll just talk about ABL, ABLC and the Africa Climate Summit. As you said, I mean, our business leaders coalition is there to just advocate for fair and equitable, you know, transitions around climate and also demonstrate that the African private sector also has a contribution to make their group of, I think, close to 60 CEOs who are demonstrating climate action within their own companies, but also calling for, you know, commitments to be fulfilled and to be honored at the global level. I think one of the key takeaways I took from the summit was a key recognition that the private sector is absolutely critical for the climate transition in many ways, the actions that they can take, the innovations that they can bring, but also in terms of mobilizing the necessary capital for the transitions. Statistics say that, you know, climate action represents a $3 trillion investment opportunity on the African continent, and that's incredible. And it's really time to look at the African continent actually as an investment destination for climate. The transition won't happen without strong investments being made on the continent. And for that private sector partnerships will be absolutely essential. Yeah, yeah, because you focus on the finance. We also have seen that in your I read your new global sustainability development report that we have currently a gap of $3.9 trillion. So what what are the steps to overcome this massive gap? In terms of the funding and the financing. I think that there's quite a lot. It sounds like a lot. You know, $3.9 trillion. I think it's very clear that investments are definitely not flowing enough. I think there's really the opportunity to make sure that subsidies and incentives are flowing in the right place. In terms of financing. But also, as I said, it's really important to look at that $3.9 trillion as an investment opportunity. And when you do that, I think you will be able to attract the right kind of capital capital that is patient and willing to look at at returns in forms of sustainable development changes as well. There's a lot of a significant amount of assets under management that are not geared towards sustainable development. There's the stranded assets. There's under invested assets. I think we need to present the SDGs and what lies under theirs as projects and partnerships as true investment opportunities. And I think we can then therefore attract this $3.9 trillion or even more. I think for me, that's the first. You know, the second is really to look at incentives. As I said, you know, right now, you know, statistics say that more incentives go towards, you know, subsidizing with fossil fuel. For example, then a subsidizing clean green energy. You know, what do governments need to do to negotiate to legislate to shape an influence behavior in that regard so that incentives go towards more sustainable opportunities. I think other pieces, you know, within the context of the SDG summit last week, the Secretary General called for the formation of a leaders group to help really steer and enable the development of the industry. And also for countries, developed countries to meet the ODA assistance targets. These are targets that have been set many years ago. So the $3.9 trillion is not out of our reach. It's not an incredulous figure. We just need to have all incentives pointing to the right direction. Yeah. And that's of course where you and the work of the Global Compact come into the game. Because as we heard at the beginning, you work already together with 18,000 companies in 160 countries. And all of it began with a speech actually in, I think, 99 or 2000 by Kofi Annan, who wanted to engage the private sector. Can you talk us through to the last two weeks of the meeting? Yes, indeed. We were formed in, I think it was in Zabroth in 1999 when SDG Kofi Annan spoke about the formation. We were formally created in July 2000, so just about 23 years old. And I think when Kofi Annan articulated it, he said, it was really the Global Compact was put in place to give a human face to the global market. We started then with about a year and a half ago, and we started in the same way. We started then with about 40 bold leaders who took the stand and now up to about 18,000 in about over 100 countries and with close to over 60 local networks as a local chapters on the ground. Our mandate is conferred by all 193 member states of the United Nations General Assembly. And they have acknowledged the role of the Global Compact in terms of advancing the United Nations values and responsible business practices. So it's great to be able to draw on the UN, especially in this era of the sustainable development goals and the business and investment opportunities they're in. But also to speak to business around the real importance of sustainable and inclusive and responsible business practices. Like the world of East Fatal, both worlds, we are anchored in 10 principles of the Global Compact that are around human rights, labor, the environment and anti-corruption. That we firmly believe are the foundation of any good business, but they also give a competitive edge to business. And I think that's very important as well. So it's not simply principles for principles sake. have sustained over time and through economic or political shocks, others are ones that have been able to to have principal businesses that rely on responsible business practices and behaviors. I took in summer one of your SDG course at the UN Global Compact Academy, which was great. Can you share a little more about the academy, its purpose and who can participate? Okay, well glad that you are officially an academy graduate. I hope it was worth it for you. So the academy is our leading edge learning platform that provides business leaders, practitioners skills and knowledge to move their companies further, faster in understanding and implementing the 10 principles of the global compact as well as driving forward the sustainable development goals. All employees of all companies that participate in the global compact have access to the academy, as do some of our government partners and other key partners as well who want to access content. I think we've had a staggering close to 70,000 participants in the academy over the last year and it really does demonstrate that not only for the on-demand, the archived content, but also for new and released content, there's true relevance. So the academy helps build knowledge within companies, within employee basis, but also helps us, I think, build our overall strategic intent of making sure companies can be more responsible and sustainable in their work. And it always sounds good that companies sign up for partnerships with the UN and they do the course and they pledge and what so ever. Have you got any observation, any idea of how much they actually implement? Oh yeah, absolutely. And that is actually really important because we're not sort of offering content or training for training sake. What is really important is how do companies then use these skills and knowledge to drive it forward. And there's a couple of things. I mean, I can talk about some of our work in climate and I'll also talk about gender, just as concrete examples. I think any academy courses we've offered around climate have one, first created the knowledge about what a climate or environmental footprint looks like within a company, what they need to do to make it more clean, green and efficient. And then thirdly, depending on the nature and scope of their missions, to then see how they can use science-based targets to be able to create pathways towards transition. So that's the practical steps that we would take. So a company would, for example, take a course, understand their footprint, see what actions they can take, and then depending on their emissions and the nature of their emissions, then ultimately sign up for science-based targets initiative and be able to drive those pathways forward. Or if they're not that level of emitter, then suddenly still take key actions to green their operations as they go forward. So clarity on what scope, one scope, two scope, three emissions are and the actions they need to take. Let me talk a little bit about gender, where we've also worked around our women's empowerment principles and use those as a lens to assess a number of things. Not simply, you know, what the gender balance is in an organization, but whether there's meaningful participation, whether there's equal pay for equal work and equal opportunities across genders, for example. So companies would then do a gender gap analysis and tools are provided. Based on that analysis, then they develop work plans with concrete actions to help them bridge all of those gaps and then report on them. Specifically on gender actually did an evaluation of the program, I think just about a year ago, to check those actions. So it's not simply training for training sake, companies are then accountable for developing work plans and reporting against them, you know, over the course of the implementation year. So Sandra, does it mean any company can come to you and say, look, we want to do it, but we have no clue how it works. Can we take part? Or are there any challenges? Do you say only medium and big sized companies can do it? Oh, no, no, no, I mean, first, you do have to be a participant of the UN Global Compact. That's the first step. But secondly, no, I think our offerings are open to all sizes of companies. Incidentally, right now, the membership of the Global Compact and historically has always been pretty much split between small and medium enterprises and large companies. And also just recognizing that most large companies or multi-nationals actually have SMEs in their value chains as well. So, you know, I think what's unique about the Global Compact is our membership spans a very broad scope of companies as a whole. We can't necessarily tailor make responses at 18,000 companies big, but certainly where we do have offerings, we try to make sure that the offering is relevant to small and large companies. Last year, it's been over about a year, we launched our SME program specifically looking at the small and medium enterprise sector simply because we thought that those are neat perhaps to tailor make some of the offerings to fit into this sector as well. But by and large, everything is applicable to all sizes of companies. I really think you have probably the best job in the world. I mean, you're on the world's largest corporate sustainability initiative, aren't you? And the partnerships are growing and growing. And yet we still have, and I'm currently in Germany, the amount of companies who actually still resist the ESGs and the SDGs and sometimes have not even an idea of what it is, what can they do? What is the first steps they can do towards you? Yeah, and I think you said it right. At 18,000 companies, it's literally a drop in the ocean. There's millions of companies around the world. And so I think the task at hand lies in, first of all, examining the ecosystem. I believe there's immense opportunity for the global compact to grow, but we do want committed leaders. So that's why the CO sign up is absolutely important. This isn't simply about joining the global compact or movement, it's about real commitment from the CO level to effects change. And I'm really grateful to have some bold, forward thinking CEOs who are not only showing leadership within the global compact, but also influencing their peers, their value chains and supply chains to model responsible and bold leadership and responsible business behavior. So I think that's the first. I think the second is really to acknowledge that there are some fundamental challenges to the ESG movement, I think primarily in the US and really understanding what lies at the heart of it and seeing what the most appropriate responses are and should be. I just think that there is no reason why society should be divided, why inequality should widen. There is a climate crisis we see it around us every single day from floods to heat waves to tornadoes to wildfires. There is no doubt there is a climate crisis and there is the firm need for action on that. So I think whatever I take to be able to convince and get more leaders involved and engage, I think is absolutely important. The other factor to look at is regulation. I mean you sit in Europe, as you said, where there's immense regulation ongoing, there's a very rapidly evolving, sorry, reporting environment. What does that mean when we're also here promoting more voluntary initiatives such as of course the global compact and the sustainable development goals? And how do marry the idea of getting a smart mix of both regulated mandatory actions as well as voluntary corporate responsibility actions and where do those stand? So there's lots of opportunity, we've spoken about US, we've spoken about Europe, huge private sector emerging opportunities in Asia and in Latin America and we also need to see how to bolster and really mobilize cohorts of businesses there. Huge opportunities also lying on the African continent amidst all of the focus of the transitions, climate, energy and food systems lying on that continent as well. So I think there's such a great continuum within which responsible business leaders can shape, can influence and can grow the movement. But I think what is most interesting to Billy is the fact that CEOs now want to be engaged. I can't tell you how many CEOs we meet to say, you know, how can I lend my voice? How can our company demonstrate action and influence and shape? And I think that's where it's really important. Seals are calling out to have more dialogue with governments. They want to raise ambitions to make sure that policies and incentives are in the right place. They want to have that public-private dialogue more. Sandra, I would really like to ask you a couple more questions and go back to the financial architecture you were talking about at the beginning. In my previous conversation with the president of the Rockefeller Foundation, he said and I quote him, we need to reimagine the Bretton Woods institutions. Multilateral development banks can lend far more if allowed. They could unlock up to a trillion dollars in new lending while still maintaining their triple A ratings. I found that really fascinating and I wonder, is that something you have already discussed? Yeah, I mean, and I'll just draw on the secretary general and some of the work that some of the the statements and the discussions that he has led and the meetings that he had had. I think, eight years on, every institution is probably ripe for reflection. But I think, as Dr. Raj Shah said, there is sort of unlocked potential within the multilateral lending system to be able to deliver on that. I think it's unfortunate, no country should really be able to be forced to choose between eradicating poverty, building climate resilience and honoring its debt. I think there really is the opportunity to look at a new structure that will allow economies to be able to do so. I think the most vocal challenge has probably come from the Africa group and leaders there saying that they do want to transition, but you can't, you don't have to make a choice and it's very unfortunate if you have to. I know there's lots of cause for debt negotiations and looking at what a refreshed approach to debt and lending could look like on that. So I fully agree. I think more capital is needed, different terms. We need to create incentives for more private capital investment as well. I think often terms, the countries where we seek to see the most progress on the transitions are also not necessarily rated for positive investment climates and there needs to be a question around how ratings are done and what opportunities can be unleashed by re-looking at what country analysis risk ratings look like as well. Yeah, I mean looking at the lending architecture now and interest rates, I think wealthy countries have a pay interest, I don't know, between one and four percent and poor countries pay up to 14 percent. That can't be right by any means. And so is there movement? Do you see movement that they write off the debt or they change the conditions? Well, it's, you know, not an area that we particularly engage in by directors of global compact, but I think from discussions and even, you know, that the SG is leading the charge on this one as well as many other leaders who are truly investing, creating a more equitable lending and investment in environment. But I do see movement, I think if I can quote, you know, two or three years ago, perhaps this wasn't on the agenda. But now I'm looking just even most recently at the Paris summit where we had leaders such as Mia Mothly, I think President Macron and others really raising and lending their voices to this. Again, coming to the SDG summit was a topic of discussion. We also held as the global compact, the Global Africa Business Initiative convening, where we had a great panel with the leaders of the IFC, with the African Development Bank, as well as the President of Kenya and Gail of the one campaign, also speaking out about it. So if anything, I mean, one clear piece of momentum is it's on the agenda, you know, voices are leading the charge. And I think it's really over to the institutions to see what opportunities there are. Sanna, okay, I know you're very busy, you're very much in demand. And I promised my last question. I would ask you a more personal question, because you previously worked in the private sector at Safari, right, in Kenya. And so you worked private sector development and United Nations, you have a very good idea of what's going on in the world. Where do you see the challenges, and what is working well? You know, I think across all of those sectors, and it has certainly spanned 20 plus years, I do feel that what is really working well or where the real opportunity lies is the SDGs as the North Star. I think the framework of the SDGs has been able to unite ambition, action between all of those three sectors, you know, for actually government, and because that's the center of it. So government, private sector, the non-government of the NGO sector as well as the United Nations, I think it's really important to have a North Star. And I truly affirmably believe in spite of the fact that we have been set back over the last couple of years in terms of success, the SDGs remain the only one thing I think that unites all sectors, all countries, all economies towards progress for people and for planets. So I think that for me is one that remains a resolute. What I am seeing is more private sector engagement in the delivery of the SDGs and starting from the global compact perspective, a strong desire by leading CEOs who can really influence and shape to have dialogue with government and wanting to really work alongside government to raise ambition and push momentum and drive for success. I think that is absolutely important. So I think we can summarize that we have the UN Global Compact to breathe more life into the 17 SDGs. You created the foundation for businesses. You have already 18,000 companies by your side. So we need more engagement from businesses, right? That's what we need. Absolutely. And as I said, I think it's really keen to see the private sector a lot more engaged, engaged with government and really driving innovation, technology, consumer, customer knowledge, the desire to drive an engaged in public policy, but also to contribute to the SDGs. That's really key pieces for where we need to go forward. Okay. So thank you very much for joining us. It was lovely. It would have been even lovelier if we had two more hours to talk to because I have probably another 50 questions. But thank you very much and thank you for your great work and your energy. And yeah, good luck with the next steps. Thank you. Thank you very much. You've been listening to a special English edition of De Gorsa Neustadt, a German podcast series by Zabilla Barton, in which she talks to pioneering leaders who are committed to making our world smarter, greener and fairer. For more information, please visit www.zabillabarton.com and the official site of the World Economic Forum. Thank you.
