You're listening to the GoBirds podcast. Come on, Red! GoBirds! GoBirds! Hey, hello! It is the GoBirds podcast, the unexpected Friday afternoon emergency GoBird podcast where Elliott Short Park is on vacation. How you doing, Tucker? I'm doing great, you know. Nothing, it's a beautiful day outside. The Masters is on TV. I spent the afternoon hanging out in my backyard, but I'm really excited to come down and sit in my basement and talk about Eagles football with you. Yeah, it's a beautiful thing. Not quite on vacation, but Elliott, very funny. He is lamenting the fact that he just laughed for where he is this weekend. You know, the show tomorrow, the Phillies, and he took the weekend, and he's like, I can't believe this is happening to me. You know how this kills Elliott. You'll hear Elliott's thoughts on this, but look, let's dive in, because, you know, quick emergency pod, let's get it out, let's get it to the people, because it's, you'll trade for a receiver. And it's not like a big, huge deal. A fifth and a sixth round or a fifth this year, a sixth next year for Don Tavion Wicks from the Packers, but it is like a guy we've heard of, a guy we've played against, a guy who's played in the NFL for a few years, has had some moments, you know, we'll get into him as a player, you know, what we think he could be, but the Eagles traded for him, gave him a guaranteed contract for next year. We don't know what the numbers will actually be, but I believe up to 12 and a half million, which I'm sure it won't quite get there, but, you know, I, you know, we'll get to the AJ Brown thing, but I think just to not look, they didn't give up a ton of cable. I don't think this is necessarily like their only thing they'll do. They could still draft one, they could still trade for another, whatever. But I think we keep seeing there. They're throwing some darts on guys who have experience and guys who have, you know, done something in the NFL, who maybe they feel are undervalued assets. And I also have to think, Tucker, last thing I'll say, Sean Mannion, I'm guessing had something to do with this after having been with him the last couple years. So, you know, you're, they're betting on Sean Mannion. I doubt they would trade for Don Tavion wicks if Sean Mannion weren't either pushing forward or the least like, you know, a fan of it. So your thoughts, the Don Tavion wicks trade. Yeah. I mean, it's funny. You mentioned the AJ Brown thing. I think that's kind of the bigger angle. This is yet another kind of hint as to where this is heading, whether or not it's two weeks. Well, when you text it, you're like, well, AJ's gone. I'm like, what happened? I didn't even know the wicks trade. You didn't lead with the Eagles trade over Don Tavion wicks. You led with, well, I guess AJ's gone. You know, that's how you peak someone's interest. That's how you get people excited. If I just texted Don Tavion wicks trade, we would be doing a pop right now. But, you know, when you look at kind of what they've done with Elijah Moore, with Hollywood Brown, with Don Tavion wicks, you're right. I mean, they're just kind of throwing darts at the dartboard for guys who are either maybe distressed assets who haven't necessarily performed to their highest level or someone like Don Tavion wicks, who's only 25 years old. He's only played three years in the NFL. He's on his last year of his rookie contract. Like you say, he's going to make about $3 million a year. And he's had moments like he had 97 yards this year and Thanksgiving. Like, and then he just didn't have a catch the rest of the season. They get five catches the last four games of the year. And I look at kind of the situation he was in, in Green Bay. And if you look at the situation where the Eagles might be with AJ Brown gone and Demonte Smith kind of being the number one receiver, they're pretty similar wide receiver rooms. Now the Eagles are going to be a little bit older because the Packers have so many young receivers. Yeah, they were all young guys there. But the idea of, you know, you have maybe a number one receiver. Demonte is better than Christian Watson if he's the number one. Or Jaden Reeder, whoever you want to say is there. That's the thing is with that, my feeling it was really flat across that group, you know. Right. And now he kind of ends up in a situation where, you know, maybe Sean Mannion or the Eagles looked at it and said, well, in Green Bay, he only averaged, I think, 300 yards per year. But he was in a really crowded wide receiver room, right? He was, you know, competing for targets with all these guys. And now you kind of look at it and he's in a similar situation with the Eagles where I know, obviously, you had to replace Johan Dotson and then you had to kind of upgrade your wide receiver three. But, you know, after the first move when you went out and traded for Hollywood Brown or signed Hollywood Brown, it was like, OK, well, he could be a wide receiver three. And then you had Elijah Moore and it's like, well, OK, maybe he could be a wide receiver three. And now that you had Don Tavion, like, so you have three guys who at the very least are a huge upgrade over that number three spot. But based on how the Eagles have built their roster under Howie Roseman, like, I don't think these are wide receivers three, four and five on the depth chart. It's kind of obvious that there's going to be another move made. And I think we all know what it is. Yeah, I agree. I think that and look, I think they might be three, four, five on the depth chart if they draft someone in the first round, which I still think is a high possibility or even a second rounder. Maybe they're, you know, three, five, you know, or four, five and three, five and six. Who knows how it all plays out. And look, Elijah Moore has had injury issues. Howie Brown's had injury issues like these guys. And Wix hasn't been on the field his entire career. Here's what I can say to your point about Wix doing stuff just from an anecdotal perspective. We don't watch the backers every week. You know, we've seen the Eagles play the Packers quite a few times and in some big spots the last couple years. And look, we all play fantasy. We all gamble like we watched the national games on. So we've gotten a feel for the Packers, a pretty good feel because they've been a good team. They've been on TV a lot the three years of Don Tavius Wix's career to this point. But, you know, we don't watch him every day and we don't know what, you know, the ins and outs like we do with the Eagles players like we always do. What I can say is anecdotally, I always feel like he does stuff. I always feel like I'm watching a Packers game and and up there's Don Tavius, Don Tavius Wix with two touchdowns or he's in the end zone or whatever, you know, like, and I, the other part of that is what you were talking about where whenever I watch the Packers, I'm just like, well, who's going to be this time? You know, like it seems like Christian Watson kind of would stand out the most because he had the most specific skill set as the tall, fast guy and they would, you know, get a connection here and there. But look, Dubbs got a bunch of money based on what he did there, which was kind of like a possession guy, you know, like classic number two maybe. Reed can't stand on the field, but when he is, he's, you know, flying all over, it was such an interesting thing. And I think that offense, you know, is, is potentially a sign of what we're going to see here and a potentially a sign with these moves of, of getting guys who like not just raising the floor for your third wide receiver, but your fourth and fifth, like having guys where you can put five wides out there or put four out there and like, theoretically, as Jaylin learns the offense, like Jaylin can survey the field and say, who's open? I could throw it to Elijah more because he's good. I could throw it to Holly Brown because he's good. I get good enough, you know, better than those. And that's what the Packers offense has felt like where it's like, all right, who's the open guy? Let me throw to it. We got all these dudes in one game. It's Sharon Reed's game, one game. It's Christian Watson's game, this and that, you know, so I think it's an interesting, you're right. He's kind of coming potentially to a similar thing. It is interesting that they're all more or less, that's maybe a little bigger than Elijah Moore, but like, or Brown, but like kind of similar. They're all kind of the smaller, faster, undersized kind of guys, which is interesting because Devontae, you know, similar, you know, a little taller, but you know, similar. I think Wix is like 6'1". So he's like similar size, you know, obviously bigger, but like, it's not AJ. It's not that 6'3", big body guy, even 6'2", big, but whatever. So I do think that that, and again, Manion coming from there and LaFleur and McVay all this stuff, like, I do think that idea of having like multiple receivers out on multiple places that you trust throwing to any of them is like potentially a goal for this offense, you know, I mean, and again, hoping that one of these guys takes a step. Dontae, Dontae, can you be a 2 in this or whatever? You know what I mean? Yeah, and I think, you know, what's kind of interesting is, you know, you talk about, you know, who he's not necessarily an AJ Brown replacement, you know, his longest career reception is 35 yards. Like he's not a game breaker. He's not a guy who's going to go over the top and beat you with a 75 yard catch. But, you know, as you were talking, I was kind of looking at the target distribution for the Green Bay Packers last year. And Roby O'Dobbs did have the most at 85. But then Christian Watson at 55 targets, Don Tavion Wicks at 46, Tucker Kraft, Matthew Golden, and Josh Jacobs all had 44. Like you had five guys in that offense who would, you know, 40 to 50 targets. Yeah, he only played eight games and they had to bring in Musgrave. And Kraft kind of emerged last year as like, whoa, look at this dude. But yeah, it's interesting because, and I felt like to the point I mean, I feel like you could watch any game and any of these guys could step up. I felt like it could be a Wicks game. It could be a read game. It could be a Watson game. And that is dangerous. Like theoretically, like from if we strip out names and titles and this and that, like on a basic level, you know, like it's kind of like a pitcher and baseball. You know, David Cohen always said, and it's a great, and it's not, you know, rocket science, but a great way of putting it is like a pitcher's best pitch is mystery. Like that's his best pitch is that whatever the pitch is, you know what it is and the hitter doesn't. And it's kind of a similar theoretical philosophical concept of like, if you've got a bunch of guys on a plane, you don't know who to shade your coverage or who to this or that. Like, and you're obviously going to want to be better. So you're going to. But the point being that they really will spread it around, throw it to different guys and move the ball around. Like that can be such a dangerous thing from a philosophical perspective. Like that's what you want. You want an offense where everyone, it's open guy gets the ball and they can make a play, you know. And so I do, I like where their head is that we don't know if Jaylen can execute it like I am bullish on him. Obviously others aren't. But I do think it's I think that they are telling us what the offense, what they want the offense to look like with the moves that they're making a little bit. Yeah. And I think it's another indication that, you know, Sean Mannion is putting a stamp on his thing on the offense. But you know, like he should, it's not a problem. It is. But I look at it on the other side and the other person who kind of has to buy into this is Jaylen Hertz. And this isn't an anti Jaylen Hertz thing, but the Eagles have tried to bring in more weapons on offense and they have. Right. Like they've built a pretty big, you know, arsenal of weapons in the past. And I'm sure how he was not expecting the, I bet you if you told him the total number of career targets Sean Dotson got in his legal how he would have guessed it was triple that or something. You know, I'm sure he wasn't expecting him to have 18 catches last year. But you know, if your whole goal is spreading around the ball on offense, that's not something Jaylen Hertz has ever done. Right. Like even as Rick, I'll go back and kind of see that. But I mean, last year, AJ Brown had 121 targets. Devonte Smith had 113. And then Goddard had 82. Right. And that's kind of what he's done. He did the similar thing in 24, 23, even back to 22. Like they had two high volume receivers at the top of their depth chart. And he went after them. Like, you know, on the other side of the spectrum is not of a McNabb, who in his career seemed to have, you know, five or six games every year was all man. He completed the past eight different receivers. That's never really been Jaylen Hertz, whether that's been the design of the offense, whether that's been what he's comfortable with, what his progressions are. Like we don't necessarily know what he's supposed to do, but you know, it's interesting that if you're building this offense where you're going to get rid of a guy in AJ Brown, who's, you know, an old man. Maybe he still is. Maybe he isn't, you know, as a pro bowtower, not, you know, old school. You're getting rid of a guy who potentially is a top 10 wide receiver and replacing him with three bodies that you can kind of spread the ball around. And that's just not something Jaylen Hertz has ever done. So I think, you know, from that perspective, it's a really interesting move. If we're going to roll out week one with, you know, four guys wide and, you know, just see who can get open because Jaylen Hertz has never really been a quarterback. Who's had to look for three, four, five wide receivers, you know, in a game. Yeah. No, it's a great point. And look, I think that good on the Eagles for, you know, challenging Jaylen and trying to get the most out of him. I don't think that just because he hasn't done it means he can't do it. We've seen Jaylen excel at things that we didn't see him excel at earlier in his career. We know he works hard and all that. Look, we don't know that he can do it, but I do think that if he can, if they can turn him into this, if he can do it, I mean, think about what a dangerous weapon he can become with them. When you add the stuff he's already great at to that, like it really, look, and I think for Jaylen, if Jaylen, I hope that Jaylen can understand that if like that this is an opportunity, and I'm sure he does. I mean, he is, you know, we know a Japanese and all that. But I do think that this is not, this is a bit of a show me. Obviously, we know the situation. We know that the articles and this, but I also think that if Jaylen can look at it the right way, like this is an opportunity not just to cement himself here, but to make himself into a great. He wants to be great. Like if he can do this thing, if he can learn to play football this way, add it to what he's already done, like that's the thing that can carry him into the future to be one of the greats, you know? So I just think it's such a fascinating situation we're in right now with and we'll get to the other thing before you get out of here in a sec. But like just like it's really there at to your point, they're asking Jen, Jason Kelsey said we was on the MacCabe show. He was like, they, and he said it authoritatively is like they're going to do more under center. They're going to do blah, blah, blah. They're going like, you know, and so I think it's going to be such a fascinating thing for us to see this guy who has accomplished so much already. And Jalen Hurts at a young age at the highest of levels to have to kind of try something completely different. And and also with a brand new, you know, coordinators have done it. There's so many little factors and the pressure of it all. It's a really it's one of the more fascinating Eagles seasons we've had it into. And we obviously off seasons are going, but in a long time from that perspective. Yeah, it's just interesting, you know, you don't want to say rebuild, but the way they've kind of retooled this offense and they're trying to kind of rebuild it around Jalen Hurts, maybe asking him to do more. And, you know, the motivation of Jalen Hurts, I don't think it's ever been a question, right? Like that guy clearly wants to be great. And, you know, maybe he is stubborn, but you know, as Jason Kelsey said, like it's probably good for him. Yeah, yeah, like he should have some ownership because it has been a revolving door at playcaller, right? And to something like he's real quick, and it's something you always say, Jalen has had a lot of success doing things a certain way. You know, like you can understand where it might take a second to step back and say, oh, maybe I do actually need to do this. You know what I mean? Yeah. And you look at some of the guys and, you know, he's not necessarily in the category of like Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, but like he wants to be right. He carries himself that way. And those guys, you know, by year seven, eight, nine of their career, they were running their own offense, right? How many of their, you know, Josh McDaniels or Adam Gase or whoever it is, how many of their offensive corners went elsewhere? And I was like, oh, just kidding. They actually were running the offense of the Hall of Fame quarterback. Not that Jalen Hertz is necessarily in that category yet. But I mean, at this point, and I think it was said a lot during the regular season, as a negative, but like it is the Jalen Hertz offense, right? Like what we are going to see is what Jalen Hertz is capable of doing and willing to do. And I don't know. I look at what they've done with retooling this offensive coaching staff, bringing in not just Shawn Manson, but Gerard Johnson and a couple other pieces. I look at how they're kind of retooling this wide receiver room. Is there the whole thing? It gets there as well. It's hard. It's gizzard on this spot. It's just, it's fascinating because they did take a huge step back. Sorry. Sorry. But they did take a huge step back in 2025, right? Like it wasn't like 2023 where the results weren't there, but it was mainly because their defense was terrible. Like you were 27th in points last year and that's just not good enough when you have that kind of talent on offense. And maybe the offensive line rebounds because people are going to be going to be healthier and as bad. I don't think, you know, just health wise, but it's just fascinating. Like even looking at the Stoutland thing, the way they've kind of rebuilt this offense for better or worse, I think it's going to be a lot of pressure and a lot of attention on Jalen Hertz. Because guess what? Like if the offense sucks a month into the season and AJ Brown isn't there, like no one's going to point to Dontevian Wicks and say like, oh man, like this guy is killing us. No, it's going to be on the shoulders of Jalen Hertz. Maybe Sean Manny and those two. Yeah, Jarts first, Manny and second. I think you make so many great points there. And last thing I'll say, and then we'll get to the AJ part before we get out of here. I do think that like, first of all, the manian thing is a massive part of this. And that is a, and I'm excited about that. Right. Young mind on, but there is, he is really stepping into a pressure filled situation for a lot of people and they're giving him a lot of a lot of leeway. Like they are, they are, you know, they are changing the offense here. But to like, look, whether it works out or not is, is remained to be seen. Howie Roseman and Jeffrey Laurier had a lot of success by taking big swings and by willing to being willing to hire someone you might not think they'd hire or fire someone when people think they wouldn't or whatever, you know, and this is another one of those. I mean, they are, how often you hear about like usually about coaching changes and then you'll hear these high profile story in national they're changing their offense with their superbowl winning quarterback and Kenny. Like this is a pretty unique situation. And I do think whether it works or not, like I appreciate that they're still taking big swings and they're still willing to go with what they believe in because they believe they saw it too. We all watch it off and they're like, this isn't going to work. Like we have to, it's not just players have to ask you better because they do, but we have to philosophically change what we do. And I appreciate that's a big swing tuck. And I, and I appreciate that. Yeah. The only question I have is how, how involved Jalen Hertz has been in this decision making process because they, if you're changing it for him, is he sitting at home on the couch and saying like, oh, we brought this guy, that that's interesting. Or has he been in lockstep with the front office and the coaching staff about kind of kind of what they're doing? Because if you want to take ownership in the scheme and everything, that's great. But also, as Bill Parcell said, you know, I can't cook the meal without buying the groceries. Damn straight. Tell them, Bill. Okay. I didn't think you were going to say that. That was it. That was it. That was it. All right. Last thing and debt to end with it, like the AJ of it all, like I have at no point in this whole saga and it's wild, Tucker. We did a poll on the morning show today asking, do you think AJ Brown will get traded? And 51% of people said yes, but 49% said no. Like I am surprised that there is still a large portion of Eagles fans who ultimately think they will hang on to him. I am like 99% that AJ Brown will be traded. So for me, any move they make that kind of pushes the, you know, belief further down the road, like trading for receivers and whatnot. I like it doesn't. I'm just like, yeah, sure. Like, yeah, I think he's gone. But do you think for those 49% of people out there, you know, who maybe are like, you know, I don't know. Do you think today is going to push people that way? Or do you think they're just kind of like, nope, they're just building up the room and like, how sure are you that AJ Brown has gone? Because I feel like I'm sure and I feel like a lot of people I talked to are sure, but there's a seemingly a large percentage of Eagles fans who think that, you know, and that's the question. Like if how you can only get a thirdly trade him like where you at? Yeah, I just think it moves it from like 97% to 98%. Like it just, it has felt like a foregone conclusion for a while. And listen, like, AJ Brown has been a great eagle, right? Like they won the Super Bowl with him. He's put together a couple of the greatest wide receiver seasons we've ever seen in the franchise's history. Like, but at some point, you know, whether you feel differently about, you know, Diana Racini now or like whatever the reporting is, even if you don't like it, there's enough smoke that there has to be this much fire, right? And the Eagles front office from what? Howie Roseman and Nick Siriani and Jeff Lurie have all said in the last month where they didn't necessarily come out and say like, he's definitely going to be on the roster week one, which if all of this was made up, you would 100% say that. I just at this point, I would be shocked if he came back and I really think the question is, does he get traded in two weeks on draft night or does he get traded on June 2 to help the Eagles cap wise in 2027 and beyond like that. Those are the only two options, I think. Like it truly is a matter of when and not if. Yeah, I, it feels like I don't know, like I know people have theorized about a handshake deal forever. Maybe, you know, I don't know. It's certainly possible if there's a framework of a deal that's ready to go, but like risky, but maybe it's there and look, it's all about relationships. Like, you know, how he's an important GM who doesn't, he wasn't going anywhere. Like you don't want to piss Howie off by, you know, going back in your word. Who knows? But I still think there's a real possibility goes on draft night just because it does make the most sense to capitalize on the moment and the teams wanting a player this, that, whatever it is. But it's going to be fascinating with you. I'm I, again, I'm still 99%. I would be Florida if he's back. But I do think the most interesting part of the AJ thing is they keep adding receivers if they draft on this, that or whatever, like we'll never know. Yeah. So like, like, it's not a surprise. Like at the end of the day, what how he's going to get, I think it's so fascinating because he has, you know, done all this bluster and stuff like at the end of the day, will he just take a second? You know, if that's what it is, you know, I'm fascinated. I'm fascinated. So yeah, I just, I don't know where it goes, but I just I would be shocked if we go to training camp at the end of July and he's still on the field. Totally agree. All right. Our final thought is we love you, Elliott. We miss you. Happy we could do a final thoughts. Quick ones. Yeah, Kate May. I didn't want to give it out to my people mobbing him. But yeah, he's go mob Elliott and Kate May. Yeah, he's love it. It'd be great. You know. All right. Everyone have a great weekend and if AJ's trade will definitely be there. But until then, he's stuck around games.
