THE HIDDEN POWER BEHIND CONTENT CREATION: DISTRIBUTION EXPLAINED || DAVE BEHAR || EPISODE 052

We actually started ION in 2000. So turn of the century, if you will, and we started out as before the pipes were really opened up on streaming and such, so we were in multiple media categories and of course things like surge and e-commerce. And then we developed further into our production, our distribution, and this is where we are today. So ION basically, it was about multi-platform, primarily viewed over any screen, versus being about the disks or anything like that, back in what would be the blockbuster, even early Netflix days. So yeah, in this case, it's all screens. And so we're excited about that, between of course, Mobile and the internet and OTT. So much a campaign for a YouTuber or somebody out there, like with the podcast, how can distribution and how can ION end up helping get more reach for me and end up building more of my personal brand as well? I love the term personal brand because everyone today's a network. The code to winning insights you need today to seize the world tomorrow. Yet again, we are still in the Golden State and of course the city of angels. We have a wonderful guest. If you are very curious and interested in learning about distribution as well for your business, this is the episode for you. I have the founder and the CEO of ION Network in the studio. He's also a co-author of one of two books that are best selling in the United States as well. Peak Performance and also Winning Mindset, how ironic and perfect to segue into the code to winning as well. So without further ado, our amazing guest in the studio today, we have Dave Behar. How you doing today, sir? Absolutely awesome. Awesome stuff. It was great to bump into you in VidCon. Hell yeah, good seeing you. You recognized me, you thought it was somebody else and I was like, you know what? I never ever seize an opportunity for me to be able to have a conversation with somebody. When you bump into me, I'm like, well, that's my chance. So let's talk and figure out. And then I think I know that you do a lot in distribution. You have, you work a lot in the media field and so forth as well. And when I spoke to you about like needing a studio, I know you offered your services and all that. And I think I never heard a response about like a few hours. I saw this studio and I'm like, you know what? I'm gonna bring Dave over here as well. I'm hoping you're enjoying it. Yeah, that's great. I think you like the scenery. Great studio. Awesome stuff. Let's just segue straight into ION Network. ION. ION. Well, same thing. There's those three letters too. Okay, perfect, perfect. Thanks for the correction there. Can you tell us a bit when you started the company? Yeah, we actually started ION in 2000. So turn of the century, if you will. And we started out is before the pipes were really opened up on streaming and such. So we were in multiple media categories and of course things like search and e-commerce. And then we developed further into our production, our distribution and this is where we are today. Awesome. Our platform is a great platform. All right. And if you were to tell, I mean, it's such a, when you speak about the streaming services and all that, I think the year 2000, I'm from South Africa. So Blockbuster was still big there, but we had our own called like Mr. Video, which is very similar to Blockbuster. So going out with my father on a Friday night, getting rush hour, rush hour, two, rush hour, three, renting it out and returning it the next day when you had to like rewind the VCR as well. I'm old enough to remember that. That was also like early Netflix. You think of DVDs? I only found it out and I never even heard about Netflix until like later on. Yeah. So was that like a market was, it was very new, right? And so was that an opportunity for you to end up like starting ION? Well, so ION basically, it was about multi-platform, primarily viewed over any screen versus being about the discs or anything like that back in what would be the Blockbuster, even early Netflix days. Okay. So yeah, in this case, it's all screens. And so we're excited about that, between of course, mobile and the internet and OTT. Awesome. And right now with about 25 years into it, going to 26 as well, what was the vision that like painted this picture for you to be able to start this? Well, the opportunity. I mean, I spent many years in with my, a couple other startups that I exited. And those are in primarily sports. And we built a couple of companies. One was worldwide. And we definitely had utilized media and we did many events over, well, broadcast and cable, which was what we did in part of our, kind of multi-channel mix to promote those events and those leagues, those brands. But then basically the opportunity, and as the internet opened up, saw it early of being where things were going to be viewed, watched. And it's not like fast forward to today where it's like, it's another set of things to be considering. And the first thing you think about is maybe AI or something. So we have Ion Intelligence, which is prevalent today in our world and our DNA. But then it was about starting out with our brand Ion. And, you know, being the original, there's been a few knockoffs since. And of course, several we've had to take to justice, you know, in the federal court, but likewise, it's a great run. It's a great team and the team is growing. And now even more so, we accept all sorts of content creators into the network because they're looking for distribution. So, you know, the vision was really all about being a dominant player in the platform space. And certainly we have a great brand. No, I love that so much. And, you know, in this day and age, 2025, where content is literally everywhere, in what role does distribution and what does the distribution power actually look like for content? Well, are you talking about in terms of just simply like online or over the air? Over the air, over the air. Well, over the air, I mean, I think that it's more about like appointment type of TV. And that's a good thing, but at the same time, we're talking about distribution where people already are and want to watch that affinity and us being able to be the organization behind a significant amount of that organization in terms of distribution. So, we basically have our ION network in thousands of channels, both from a local standpoint and a categorical standpoint, like ION Sports as just one of the many categories. And that's a place for folks to distribute their shows, their content. And so, there's a number of platforms that you would think of first, historically, and you two being one of them, of course, but some of the other social media platforms, but in our case, we're about business. We want to help people succeed and monetize their great work. And at the same time, be a great place for viewing. Okay, and now for my example, so I do, I have a YouTube channel, probably gonna touch 35,000K. I have a team where, a media team back in Utah, and also have my YouTube partner manager. What happens is that we do customized campaigns. Right now, we have performance max campaign where people are looking at their Google Maps and they'll be like a pop-up ad or so forth as well. And at the same time, it's just been so much a campaign. For a YouTuber or somebody out there who like with a podcast, how can distribution and how can Aeon end up like helping get more reach from me and end up like building more of my personal brand as well? Well, I love the term personal brand because everyone today is a network. And so, you're just simply gonna become an iron ear. And for that matter, the levels that you have, you're following, you're already in many ways an eye influencer. And so, we're gonna have you come into our world. And for instance, this particular episode, it'll probably be on Aeon. And as a result, of course people love you. And rather than just being, let's call it a YouTuber, you'd be an iron ear. So, let alone being a pioneer. So, is there a way, does it help build more of my social media presence if I end up utilizing Aeon? Well, big time, yeah. Because basically, there's a few things. One is, we would have local channels in the case of Salt Lake City, not just Aeon Salt Lake City, but also the suburbs. And basically every town in Utah as an example. So, in this case, you're going to be seen in far more places. And in this case, you're talking about, we're marketing within those communities. It is the community's channel. And so, they have a de facto channel for their town. In that case, you're localized as well as, a leader in the space category. Love that, love that. And just another follow-up. So, obviously with over 25,000 local channels and also affiliations, you did speak about that. And how would you also follow up on that, ensure that it reaches the right audience as well? Like what does Aeon do to ensure that? Well, first of all, we've got a great team to ensure that. But at the same time, by the nature of the channel itself, is how then the affinities take place. That's where the reach happens. So, if you're on, as the example would be Aeon Salt Lake City, Aeon Los Angeles, Aeon any small town in North America, and for that matter beyond, you're going to be found there's a marketing strategy behind those channels. All right, so what kind of content performs best on Aeon? And what are you looking for in deciding what to bring someone on a show? Well, content-wise. So, first of all, we have this localized reach. Localization, one of my favorite Aeon words, where you're going to be hyper-local in any town in North America and to some extent globally, of course. I mean, the networks is viewed globally. And then categorically, if you have a sports show, whatever it is, including what is live sports, where there's competition going on such, we have the ability to distribute that multi-platform in every town, let alone under Aeon sports. So, example, if you're into nutrition, or you're into, well, health or your kid's content, whether you're a kid's influencer or not family, that's where Aeon Kids, Aeon Family comes and is distributed on all the local channels also. So we have our categorical networks, we have our local network. And there's more that goes into it, because it's simply having you reach your targeted audience where there is very little, you know, I mean, you have a lot of people snacking and watching and all that from all sorts of places, but organizationally, that's how we organize the content, how we organize the shows. And even if it's the smallest of small pieces of content, but we do like the idea of also having shows. And in the case of, you know, obviously now with how popular shorts and reels and so forth is, we have additions, you know, so it's kind of edit.ions. Editions. Now I like that. And so, but looking back obviously in 2000 and right now 2025, how has Aeon ended up like transforming over time to try and utilize AI and also how technology has just quickly rapidly like moved towards this industry? Yeah, so, you know, we don't, it's the best way to describe it. We don't incorporate what you would call AI and utilizing it, hey, this is an AI platform in any means. Is there some automation? Absolutely, there has to be in order for people to rapidly find, you know, shows and assets and things like that in the network. But the evolution, there was definitely a vision and then intuition what was ahead. So we're actually in many ways, right where we'd like to be. And it's even hard to argue that because we just are who we are. And that's our DNA and our vibe. So it's an exciting place to be right now. Would we have liked to have been there back then? Well, there wasn't the, things weren't being consumed the same way and being looked for the same way 25 years ago. But we still had our revenue. We still had our purpose, always purpose driven, you know, with the Aeon brand of course. And I know one of the things you mentioned. It's evolution. And then collaboration more and more really helps things along. And that's with great folks that have great shows and content and other things. And as well as what is the monetization factor of being a great business solution besides simply transactional e-commerce, et cetera. And so just over the course of time we've gotten better and better at it. And how expensive or like what are rates looking like for somebody who's trying to get distributed this content within ION as well. ION. For you, five bucks. No, listen, you know, part of it is how wide you're looking to go. And you can say kind of like the cost per thousand changes. But in there's a traditional sense. And then there's also, where do we wanna go and how quickly? Because we are also talking about not to be suggestive of AI not either playing a role or automation. And that is to scale as quickly as possible. So, you know, your show. But what happens is that, you know, we might get into a more creative partnership to help make it happen versus say this is what we're charging. So that all relates to that, let's call it that creator, but also the brand and any other organization that wants to come into the ION network and succeed by our model, which is a great one, you know? So we're open as far as our pricing model and so forth. We do have what you would call, you can call it a media kit, but at the end of the day, there's a distribution fee per market, per town, et cetera, and it is based on population. But, you know, those kinds of situations, it does come down to what that show is and what that brand is trying to achieve. Because we'll be consultative about it. I think that's really, really important. Because at the end of the day, there's not meant to be any price barrier. It's an open platform. So. Then from entrepreneurial perspective and also like content creators, what would you say is probably the biggest misconception people have with media distribution? Well, you've got to figure just like a great startup is who's your audience? It's like, who do you want to reach, need to reach? You might want to be having viewers and an audience in the millions and that's fine, but where's your core? Where's your core audience? Are you a business guy? Have you had this business success? Are you a, you know, again, it could be like a fitness guru or some kind of influencer in a certain specific space or wanting to only reach a certain demographic. And in that case, that's of course who you want to reach first and who you're there to influence. And then you scale from there. So that's just, you know, I think that's a fundamental, right? But rather than just kind of spring it out and hope people like me, people like us or whatever the show is, you know? Cause, yeah, you know, where do you resonate most? And, you know, just like, well, we're focused here and this is what market we want to win. And I think that's, you know, just part of your winning mindset as an entrepreneur. And how would you say then these content creators? Cause right now I realize, especially when you and I had VidCon that it's not just people that are YouTube as I came across a lot of streamers that were streaming on like, some were even rumbles, some were streaming on Twitch 24 seven, just like streaming. And then you even had others. I had other people that were like TikTok streaming. And then one guy had like a massive following and people like watching as it was going about as well. And so one of the things you did stress on is that the fact that it's not necessarily in competition but it's more complimentary with what Ion is doing right now. So it works and like with those that are in TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, you know, YouTube as well, right? So it compliments it rather than competing with it. Right. So there's a couple of things. One is we love marketing again, shows and content creators and whatever it is that's on the network, that's one. Two is there's a number of platforms out there. And the ideology is that everyone either has their favorite the way that they operate, whether it be ease of use or their reach, or at least the intended reach. At the end of the day, we're actually proactive. You know, we're proactive network. So we really seek, you know, great people and to be part of us in what we do but not to be competitive with those other platforms because it's a big world out there. Every individual, whether you want to say, hey, your personal brand, everyone who has, you know as a network, it has their personal brand too, of course. They should be in a number of places. And for that matter, as far as we're concerned as part of our audience network is if you're coming into Ion then we're gonna also reach others in other networks as well. Mm-hmm. Okay. Now I'm glad you kind of stressed in on that. I think obviously before you and I started, I told you the amount of knowledge I have on distribution because in my mind, there's only like one way it's all Google Ads and getting to reach out the collaborating with bigger brands, collaborating with like bigger guests, sharing stuff on their social media vice versa, which has been working as well a lot. But in terms of distribution, I've never really thought about things that way but like with your network and like potential for growth. It just sounds amazing. Every time somebody hears a network you're always just thinking cable and that's... Cable is in TV cable? Yeah. So you know like a network or like media network. So that's like what comes in mind, you know? Because I don't think, I think I don't think people watch cable no more. It's become an obsolete form of like market, you know? Unless you're watching sports or the Super Bowl or football and stuff like that. But for the most part, you can get that on like a Hulu kind of like additional sports subscription. And so yeah, media distribution, it's getting it obviously the right faces and the right people and the right audience. And I think that's very important because would you say then there's a bigger problem with people sometimes growing too fast? Because one thing is that I have been seeing growth but the nice thing I'm enjoying right now is the people that have been subscribing to my channel are actually watching it. So I don't have to have dead subscribers. Right, exactly. And so it's like one of those, the reason we've been releasing content every day in terms of who started in June till December, every day, Monday to Friday, with the entire goal of trying to get 100k subscribers in terms of like obviously performance max campaigns, Google ads, whatever it may be. Well, subscriber wise, I mean, that's not the only people watching, of course. That's the people who decide to subscribe. Exactly. And then we'll seek you to go back to without a subscription. So I think that that could be a misunderstood term also. It's nice to have that many subscribers, but people do hit the subscribe button and don't necessarily go back and watch again type of thing or watch with frequency. So that's where metrics come into play. And distribution, it's very interesting. It's still what you call early, even though distribution over the internet and mobile, even OTT, it's in many ways still in its infancy, even though there's 15, 20 years at it type of thing. So end of the day. And then it's also gotta consider the groups that are on the platforms, not just, hey, look at my channel here or there. It's who are in these groups and that those are also your audiences that are affinity based, whether it be in a locality or in a, some kind of sports group of certain sport, et cetera. So the ability to reach those, doesn't just happen by chance. You generally have to create a relationship that is relational to them. And so they become your, ultimately your consumers. And for that matter, subscriber. And if you got some swag in your studio store, or guess what? They're more likely to buy versus a general audience, if you will. So what goes along with distribution is targeting. So. And one of the things I liked a lot, and obviously stressed a lot on like sports nutrition, because Ion really operates on many verticals. And so, but with when you spoke about like sports, nutrition and business, how do you keep those brand lanes sharp and also effective? Oh, you mean the network brands like Ion Sports? Exactly. Well, you gotta have continuous, great programming. You know, come in and connect with your audiences, communities, events, things like that. But at the same time, it's, you know, making sure that the Ion integrity of our brand continues with how we're shown and branded. And so we try to continuously update what that is. Of course branding is in our DNA. I mean, my brand and business development background. So I make sure that our team is sharp in those areas. And for that matter, on behalf of the content creators. So if anything, we again want to champion great content creators and great brands for sure, which is part of even the monetization puzzle. And I think that's the entire purpose, which I want to say when you spoke about monetization right now, because. It's a great ironware, man. No, I think at the end of the day, this is the capital of capitalism. Like, you know, the United States as a whole. And I'm originally from South Africa, born and raised, obviously there. And I've realized how many people have found joy in building personal brands, networks, but also doing what they love and monetizing. You gotta love, you gotta love what you're doing. You gotta have fun. Exactly. And it's not like, hey, it just comes by chance by itself. It's like, okay, now it's like how to better connect your brand DNA, whether it be a true scaling business or just your personal, you know, passions. And so that's, it's critical. And which segues right now, because I've seen extremely big and massive channels. And I found out that like, even though they monetize, like the engagement and stuff and like the endorsements are not really there. And you even get smaller channels that are doing super well in terms of just constantly being consistent doing the lives, getting the super chats as well. How can Ion end up like helping content creators get monetization and like maximize as much as possible? Well, so our business was more or less founded on those principles versus it's true that we are a technology and media company. But, and often, you know, let's call, you know, years past, et cetera, companies, great technology companies have failed because they didn't have the business component, the monetization component with how they actually make money. In our case, I mean, I could throw out just some, you know, simple words, but, and one of them is like, the word sponsor, although people, oh, I know what a sponsor is, well, is there the alignment? Is there the actual alignment with your brand, with your, again, content, your message, frequency? And so we put that all in the perspective because we're used to doing those deals. We're actually then at the same time, because of the distribution and all those things that happen on the hyper-local level, that is where the money is, and that's where we can really perform great for those that are in the network that want distribution. So, you know, that's what's key, has a differentiation, but at the same time, also rely on ION for the, you know, what is the vibe of your style of content? Okay, perfect. And so we're gonna, you know, in other words, you might just simply upload like you would on, there's a few other platforms that you can simply upload and do. Exactly, I was gonna give you an example about what I do. We're going to say, guess who's here, besides inviting you into our family, right? But you're there so we can, not to say how we're gonna start throwing some ads in there and do that, but at the same time, get into what you want to achieve. If you don't know what you want to achieve, whether you're, you can call yourself a content creator or you're a brand and you're doing your own stuff in-house or even have somebody else doing it for you, we're still gonna go in from like an agency level, we love working with agencies because at the end of the day, they want the best outcome for their client. And of course you do too. So we wanna know that besides saying, oh, well, we know what you need as part of a solution. So it's not just again, random, you know, a random process here. It's, okay, now let's go make money together. Let's go kick some ass together. And in the category and that audience, which is probably pretty significant and for that matter, pretty significant in our own network. And if we don't necessarily have that level in our network today, we'll have it tomorrow because that's our goal and that's our plan. And then it's about campaign. Okay. Because we're marketing you, you know, type of thing. So it's an exciting place versus just being, let's call it a technology platform or even an age old media model or something like that. Like just television today. I mean, you even mentioned with cables, like, yeah, there's, there are some dying breeds. We saw and I saw all that at a very early stage, you know, of what was going to be happening with the thing called the internet. So, you know, and then digital and streaming and obviously mobile where most people are watching today, you know, making sure that, you know, horizontal or vertical, you know, but what about both? Versus it being only one size fits all. Perfect. So right now this is the interview you're going to be doing to me. So I'm in your office right now. Okay. And I've walked in and I'm like, okay, I'm going to tell him break down everything I'm doing. Okay. So I'm interviewing you, you're interviewing me. Right now I'm entering your office. I'm there, you know, everything I'm doing with like my content and stuff and what we're looking at and what the vision is and stuff like that. All right. So hi Dave, thank you very much for allowing me to come to your office. I want to let you know, I have a big vision, not just the hundred K subscribers. Right now I've been releasing content every single day. Right. And I'm breaking down my media team is cutting up a few reels and we keep like pushing it. It's doing super well, especially on Instagram. We have, it's just, it's popping on people's feet. So it's already being pushed by the algorithm as well. So we're doing fine there. Our subscribe account with the ads. We are, we are fearing the fact that we're spending way too much on ads, which is it's doing well in terms of getting subs there. But it's like, are they watching other episodes or cause we have a disparity between big ones that blow up and then you get your few that just like stay in like a thousand or so and you get others that are like 26, 27, there's no middle ground. So people like what they like and so forth. And then the next thing I have is that our entire thing is that I want to try and like utilize what I'm doing right now with like my content creation and trying to build like a massive community for like podcasts as well, where we kind of like just network with people. Well creating your own net. Exactly. This is basically what you're talking about. Exactly. And then furthermore, first of all, I love that thinking. Yeah. And that's, yeah, that's pretty much it. That's where it is. And then just continue to build, but at the same time still end up like monetizing, doing courses, helping people, start a podcast, elevate the podcast, upscale and reach a higher podcast. So we want to make sure that we use the right PR if we even need one, right? Me like Google ads, if we even like, so that's my goal. What can you do for me, Dave? I mean, your office now. Okay. Welcome to our office. In beautiful Hermosa Beach, well Manhattan Beach too. There we go. But we also might, by the way, be taking a walk down the strand cause that might be one of our most effective meetings. Love that. So basically you're able to, now it's really not meant to be a competitive product to Google ads. You know, you're buying Google ads, like you're buying those words and this and that and spending X amount of dollars. So in our case, there is some of that fundamental in our network, but it's much more than hyper-targeted towards the town. Because the town, our business operates more off of the database in every town in North America. We're talking about residents and businesses. Wow. You want to reach a business or business sector in that town or a, you know, the residents, let alone moving more and more into what is the demographics of those. Now, granny say, well gosh, I can kind of do that and somehow my targeting is on some of these networks will sort of. But the difference is you can call it algorithm, you can call it AI, whatever you want to call it. There's something about human driven workflow. Okay. So we have our platform, automated platform that's going to have you target anybody you want because we see it as a campaign that's not just based on an algorithm, but by hand holding it to happen. How do you do that though? Well, because we know our database, the database is the marketplace. Okay. It's not just, well, we think people are doing searches on these keywords and or I'm able to show an ad for your show or content, whatever it is, or do a reel and then it pops up in this and that. The reality is, is we're here to market your show. And that does take great automation. You can call it algorithm to a certain extent and AI, but we're talking about human powered stuff. Okay. It's about the vision in not just relying upon technology, relying on AI to do the work. Now you say, well, yeah, that's what everybody's doing, what everybody's thinking. It's the next thing. The end of the day, I mean, and still granted, AI is an example has been around for years. Just we're now noticing it from a consumer standpoint and the adoption of it. Precisely. So your content, you're here in the office, we want to get to know you. Whether you're in the office or not, because we'll go do it through a remote call or some kind of zoomer or whatever to get to know you, but what's your goals? You're at 100K now, that's called subscribers. What's your overall goal? And then who do you really want to reach? And then we're able to put it into the proper, I'm gonna call it cylinder or silo or algorithm, but we're gonna do that based upon our model. So we have a very organized model and distribution capability in the network and then outside the network. So then we're driven by metrics. Of course, any network would want to have a growing number of subscribers for all of their content creators or just provide the tools to have you do that. And our toolbox is getting only better, of course, but at the end of the day, we make up for that because we actually care. It's the human element and it's the protocol by which, as if we're the agency, but we're like then, I'm gonna call it an agency of agencies, but we work great with being able to say, well, reaching those things that we have the capability to do. So we're able to reach into communities deeply and it is population-based. So you say, well, I mean, what about South Africa as an example besides, let's say here in North America? And it's like, well, do you wanna rock it in all of Utah? Let's do that. Well, okay. Now, it's not meant to be vague. It's meant to be, well, how many towns are in the state of Utah? Exactly. How many people are in Salt Lake City? Well, last I check, you know, million plus, right? Well, how many people are in Salt Lake City that are subscribed to your channel or subscribed to your content? So at the end of the day, we're now talking about, that would be goal number one if you wanna take care of your hometown. Take care of your backyard. And we wanna make sure that happens. And for that matter, you know, it's where collaboration plays a role. You know, we'll wanna make you a star, let's say more than you already are. Okay? That's music to my ears, Dave. Well, seriously, I mean, this is why we're here. This is what we're made of versus, again, just a platform where we're slotting in shows or something like that. I mean, we've had a Sioux people that are, you know, stole our intellectual property in having it be a different ion than what we are. And of course, fortunately, we were first and then that's, you know, the vision is to carry out what we're able to do from the original vision. And so a lot of collaboration, a lot of activation that plays a lot of role in events. I mean, the example is, I mean, here we are in studio in downtown Los Angeles, where the Great Lakers play and a number of other great sports teams. And do you wanna reach that audience during the game, let alone as a result of having an interview with one of those athletes in studio? And it's like, okay, well, they have their following, obviously, and they have their audience in greater fandom. And it's like, well, now you have a chance to reach them too, and that's part of the strategy. That's powerful. It's personal brands, it's brand brands, and you know, who's bringing it? And that's what we're here for, so it's kinda cool. Wow, you do a better job at interviewing me than when I interviewed you. Well, wait, who was interviewing you? We're in our office now, right? Yeah. So, it's all good, man. No, I think it kind of explains it a bit. I think it actually opened my eyes because, like I said, I never really understood distribution. I know you said it like when you and I were having, because I never see an opportunity, always like when I bump into somebody, I'll always have a conversation with almost everyone. And sometimes it's an inconvenience for the people I'm with because of that. So I wasn't the lucky few, I was part of the lucky many. I think you were the lucky few because I had to make sure I got you in studio. So there's a difference. Gracias. Many are called and few are chosen, so. There you go. No, distribution, I mean, you know, by default, we have to define what distribution is because there's a great three-letter word at the end of distribution, ion. So, you know, it's key. And so we're going to do whatever it takes. And if for some reason we can't get you there, which, gosh, that's where technology kicks in, right? Because utilizing our automation, our capabilities, besides saying, you know what, maybe we need to reversion this part of our network a little bit to better reach because it's continuous evolution, continuous improvement. And we want to make sure we're there with you the whole way. And that's part of the winning mindset, right? It's to win, you've got to be able to have that reach. And, you know, and then we're competing, actually with ourselves, not other platforms. We compete to continue to, you know, win internally or I internally. So it's like, and so that's why we also like to have athletes on our team, you know, all that, because, you know, about winning through the distribution pieces, those people who have, you know, granted, it's like, if you don't have a great following initially, it's like, let's help you get there. Which led to my next question as well, because I was going to try and say, I wanted to phrase it the way I wrote it down here as well, is that, I can't find it, but my purpose is, what about those people that have great content, great concept, and have a great message too, but unfortunately don't have the following as well? Like how do you, how does ION end up utilizing their tools to try and help boost their reach as well? Okay. Well, I mean, first of all, we are talking about business modeling, of one of the reasons we exist, and we are talking about distribution, so the ION Local Network has over 25,000 towns in it. So we're going to take your show, and we're going to broadcast it across all those channels. Immediately having the biggest distribution you could have, by far, then what you already may have. Now, if you're just getting rolling, okay, I mean, maybe we're your first place versus let's call it uploading into YouTube, or Instagram, or wherever you're going with it. Remember, this is, you've got to establish your followings in those, by having people like or follow or whatever it is, to get them in the first place. But we're much more of like a direct marketer that is going to the people ourselves to make sure that your show is distributed, no matter who you are. Now, it doesn't mean that all of a sudden, the playing field is leveled, because part of it is what is your content about, what is your show about, what is your, even if live competition, what's sport, do people want to watch that? So we're not going to be shoving stuff down people's throats in any community per se. But it is the opportunity for them to succeed at a far larger level in towns across, in this case, North America. Fascinating. So, and then we also categorize, hey, I want to watch great nutrition stuff in my town. Okay, hopefully there is local nutrition folks besides a national influencer, a national brand, et cetera. And one way or another, it all is one big happy family. You know? So just like minor people, great vibe, you know, and let's just get together and have fun, make money, bigger distribution, subscribers, which, you know, that's a great iron word in and of itself, of course. And so we want those things to happen for those that are in the network. And that's the network of champions. Oh, that's money right there, that's powerful. Well, it's winning. I mean, so we want to help you win. Exactly. It's not like, hey, we want to win, beat those guys. It's like, we're here to win together. And it's not even a participation trophy. It's like, no, let's go, let's get it done, you know? At 25,000, that's a lot. And is it done through short form content or is it done according to what the audience prefers? How do you, how do you? It's the audience's choice. Okay. They get to snack or they get to watch whatever is there, you know, and that's, that's important stuff. I guess you and I have to make an appointment before I leave. We already did. We were done. You already in our office and I'm kicking you out. No, that's, that's amazing because it's not just that. It's building a brand new studio like this was inspiration like in terms of this, I called like a few of my guys, I'm like, we're going straight downtown Salt Lake, right? By the Goldman Sachs and all the big commercial building, the tempels and all the stuff there. I just love like the scenery. Not trying to get like a thing and not just that, it's about trying to be unique for our market as well, to try and attract the right people that they end up like coming down there, utilizing, you know, the media team, everything from scratch. And I think it's one of those stuff that, yes, we can follow the traditional way of how we're doing stuff, but like let's try and test out distribution. And what would you recommend people do? How long would you say that you test out? Cause many people are very skeptical. Like I'm never shy of like investing in myself and like my businesses and stuff like that. But I'd say for most people are like, I don't want to keep paying. I don't know if I can trust this thing. Let's just do it the old traditional way. Let's go door knocking. You know what I'm saying? How would you say with someone like that, what's the timeframe would you say that could give this thing a shot and try it out? Well, I guess it depends on what you're talking about. Is it a show or is it a product or is it a combination? So why are you doing what you're doing and what is your cost and your expense part of it? Because if, you know, in a product sense, what's their cost of goods? What is it cost to produce something that they're on a daily, hourly, monthly basis. And then the ROI needs to be what it is. So obviously you want to make more money than you are spending. And it's like that timeframe, you mean if you're talking about building a company and building a business, it's like, I mean, at what point do you have to pivot? You just need to go and maybe get out and sell more goods, you know, sell more sponsors and brand partnerships. That might come differently than what you might think though. Like rather than, hey, you want to sponsor my show, it's like, what is your show doing? Who is it reach? Where is it integrated in? You can call it society or culture, let alone a locality. That all of a sudden enables for that monetization to exist and hit your numbers. Because now you have more value to the town, to the community, let alone the market category. And hopefully that makes sense. And then it's like, well, what is your business development capability? And that's where we come in also. It's like, well, we want to help sell your show even in your town. And because there's a channel in your town also besides a national network we have. Okay, so we want to be supportive because if you have ambition, we're right there with you versus, just another person or company we have to slay, no, just the opposite. Because it's a big world out there. This is about enablation and collaboration and all that good stuff. So I mean, it's like, we're going to want to be supportive of you in your local market, let alone help you grow globally for sure. And be relentless about it. And have those conversations about it. Doesn't happen just like that. So when you talk about time, how much time do you take before you have to say, well, we're out of this or we can keep. It's like, well, it depends on what your goals are and what your monthly nut might be. You might be operating at a pretty low cost. Therefore, hey, maybe have a little more space to grow more, but you don't want to spend your future. Even if you have all the money in the world. You gotta play it right. Make sure your model aligns with what the market will take. We'll allow. That's like, and then again, whether you're personal brands, like we could be talking about, well, there's a very good chance that you're a local hero already or you have a success path because of maybe a sport you played. Are you even reaching that fan base or that audience? They even know you have a show. So it's like, what performance metrics did you chase down as part of your model to success and to win? And you want to put on that, you want to be in it to win. So we're gonna just have, you don't need us for that per se. You just need to be in your own mentality to win. And one of the things I did like, that you mentioned as well, is that you end up having a few of sports athletes that are that are partened up and that are in the ION. ION, I don't know. It's my accent. It's all good. One of the things, there's other three letter word brands. Some of them are ancient in some ways. I don't know why it's so hard to say ION. It's ION. It's ION. What do you have your ION? I'm out to making ION and ION. That's like, what the heck am I speaking in tongues? What's going on right now, KG? You got one job. It's almost like you can, whatever you can call me whatever you want, as long as you call me. I've never heard that one before, but I might end up using it. Go ahead. And actually you can use it royalty free. No copyright, right? No copyright. All right. Now we're good then. Now we're good. Realtty free license. Free license. Oh my gosh. One of my interviews actually got flagged on my YouTube. Oh man. Yeah. But anyway. We're gonna not flag you. We're gonna wave the flag. All right, here he is. That's exactly what I need. That's exactly what I need to say. Yeah. But how do you end up bringing those sports athletes to collaborate and work with you? And do you have any names or is it like confidential and stuff? It's not meant to be anything confidential, but what are you referring to like? The sports network, the ION sports. Yeah. We're open for business to broadcast all sorts of sports. Every sports, there's over 150 sports. Luckily there's athletes that work with you guys. Yeah. So we have athletes on the team. We also have athletes that are in the competitions and even have a few shows and stuff. So what the example would be is that it's related to the local market and or if they're nationally based. Because we accept content from everyone, right? So we don't necessarily, so let me see how better unpack this. We're wide open for any athlete to join the network, of course, and athletes and or folks that have played sports that may not be still active. Yeah, we have a handful that work in the business for sure. And then depending on the local markets, whether they're not as active in the day to day of our business, they're at least on the court, we're doing things that are event related. And I'll have to talk to you in person regarding that because it's something I'm doing as well, a business. We're doing with athletes and all that. But it's something that we should be launching the end of January next year. But just to give you a brief overview, I've interviewed a few athletes as well, a UFC fighter in Florida. I'm interviewing a lady. I'm gonna be going to DC. She plays for the DC as football team for women. It's like an NFL, like different league. I've interviewed like a basketball lady. Was it like bikini football? No, no. But it's women's football, what, flag football? No, it's actual football. Soccer. No, football. Okay, tackle. Tackle. Okay, well there's all sorts of renditions, which is, it really makes the world go around. It's interesting because, I mean, I love entrepreneurship. At the end of the day, you still, of course, have to attract those brand partners and have to have the viewership. And for that matter, butts in the seat if it's live competition. So it's that integrated stuff that is so important because nobody likes empty seats. But I mean, there's, I guess women's tackle football could be successful. I know there's been a few attempts. Oh, they're doing super well. But yeah, and it seems to be growing because it's beginning some endorsements from some retired NFL Hall of Fame. My enfranchises. Because right now, if you look at the WNBA, it's been blowing up, you know? You look at the class of 2024 that ended up coming through Angel Reese, the Kate and Clarks, and like how the trajectory of the viewership and like the drama on court, like it's just such a, like a fun sport to watch. What's it like, the LA Sparks, you know? Like people actually, you know? And I think maybe it doesn't have that much of a reach right now, but it seems to be doing super well, like from what I've been seeing, especially in bigger cities, like your coasts, Eastern West coast, not necessarily more than like. Everyone has their favorite thing to watch, right? Has their affinity, whether they were a former athlete or not, right? So yeah, I think it could all succeed, whether it be again in certain niches or the broad scale, depends on who's behind it and what they're made of and how much they wanna win. I love that. Yeah. Awesome. Now you wrote your co-author of Peak Performance and also winning Mindset. Yeah, they're winning Mindset. And the coach winning, obviously, we know I, for our guests, it's the insights they need today to seize the world tomorrow. And from co-authoring those two books that are best sellers and your experience in business, entrepreneurship, I always ask all my guests this question towards the end. What does the term winning mean for you? Victory. You've reached your goals. Typically it's a championship situation that you're at the top of your game and you keep it there. Love that. You know? Love that. And hopefully you've taken a number of people along with you for the ride. I think that's very important. You know? The ship rides with the tide up lift and help others as well. Because if you've seen the vision, it's good to bring others along with you. For sure. Well, Dave, if you could look at the camera right then, let our guests know where they could get a hold of you. If they want like media distribution, if they wanna like connect with you, if they wanna meet you in person, a schedule meeting, can you let our viewers know about looking at that? I mean, you can just reach me out at davidions.com. Throw me an email. I respond to my emails. And you can look around socials for me a little bit, but that's the easiest way to hit me and I look forward to seeing you. The Co-Twinning Insights you need today to seize the world tomorrow. Dave Bayer, thank you very much sir.