S2 EP 24 - Gamified Self-Regulation: The Final Countdown

Well, hello everybody. It's a beautiful day to bust a few cognitive distortions. How's it going? Well, my name is Suzanne M. Swain, EDS, LMSW, and I am your friendly navigator through this emotional world of teens. So today we're actually going to continue this Internet Safety and Technology series that I basically started last episode because I feel like it's really important to delve deeply into the safety and technology issue because a lot of families are really confused about what to trust and what not to trust. And I have a specialist degree in educational tech. So I thought if I could find some really good examples for you of a positive use of screen time, I think it's worth noting. So this particular one, this episode that we're doing today, I think a lot of families really need to hear this because we're going to sit kind of right in the middle of something that creates a lot of tension. So let's do it. Screen time. So in our last episode, we were talking about how kids are using screens, not just for entertainment really, but for regulation and calming down for connecting and sometimes just for getting through the day. I mean, that's hard enough. So if you're a family listening, you've probably felt that internal conflict, you know, on one hand, we hear limit screen time, get off the devices, screens are a problem, yada, yada. But you know, on the other hand, we're watching our kids use those same screens to decompress and regulate and sometimes even to just feel better. So which is it? I mean, how do you know the difference? So the shift that I wanted to introduce today is not just about how much time kids are spending on screens, it's about what they're actually doing on them and their usage of their time because it's not all screen time is created equal. I mean, you know, as someone who studied this intensely, one of the things that's always stood out to me is that technology itself isn't inherently harmful or helpful. It just depends on how you use it, kind of like when I was doing AOL as a chat host, it's how are you using your time and is it the best use of your time. So I started building on this series and I really got excited about using that educational tech and I intentionally went looking down the rabbit hole for days looking for something that kind of challenged my ideas that the answer is just to remove screens because I want to bust that. Absolutely. It's not the screen's fault. So if we can find a better way to use it, it's worth our time. So I wanted to find something that's screen based, game oriented and something kids actually like, you know, kids don't learn from things they don't like. So simple as that. So, but it could also be a healthy and productive use of their time. That's the key. So I came across a company called Mightier. Awesome. Great name too. I have to tell you, I was so surprised by what they're doing. It's amazing. I was just literally like, oh my gosh, screen from the rooftops. What immediately stood out to me is that they're actually combining what kids like. So video games, but cute ones, like really well designed video games with real data to create a much bigger and meaningful picture of how the kid is doing emotionally. So in other words, emotional driven video games. Cool, right? So I reached out and I wanted to learn everything. So I sent this big email and had lots of questions and totally impressed right from the get go. They were super quick to write me back and not just with like surface level information. They actually shared their research and data and took the time to explain how everything works, talked to me on the phone. I mean, and even sent me a package so I could check out their product just to vet it. How cool was that? I mean, that's, that's bravery. You know, you really stand behind something if you're willing to do that. So, so I would like to introduce you to someone named Jessica Rajneo and even got on the phone with me personally to walk me through that platform. So she is a rock star and as a therapist myself, I really appreciated this. She's a fellow social worker and that kind of accessibility and willingness to connect really meant a lot to me. So I decided to pretty much devote this episode to talking about this software and explain why it is really worth our time. So these individuals also have a background in education, which I think is really neat. You know, the people that work there from what I found out from, you know, digging a little deeper is that these are educators, social workers, therapists. These are all people with a genuine interest in the mental health and well-being of kids. You know, they understand kids and emotional development. So that gave me a lot of confidence in the trying it out myself, you know, and I'll be honest, I found the games kind of addictive and super engaging. And apparently you only need about 45 minutes, you know, to work on this to really help yourself. But you know, for kids, that's an incredible amount of time. So they're getting plenty of screen time, but doing something super fun and engaging. I mean, honestly, I didn't want to put it down. So that alone told me something kind of important, because if I'm engaged, then kids are going to be engaged because really, but what I really kind of sealed it though was that I had my neighbor's five year old try it. Now this little dude is gifted, brilliant, I mean, just sharp as a tack. And I figured if anybody would know if it's good or not, it's this guy. Well, guess what? He was so into it in the first second, he picked it up and he's like, what's this? Question, question, question. And then he was off and running, like no problem whatsoever, fully engaged, excited, wanting to keep playing. I was mesmerized. I was like, yes, this is awesome. And his mom, and this is the part that actually really stood out to me, his mom, good friend of mine. She was so excited about the data and the insight into his emotional regulation. So she had questions like, you know, as you play the game, and if, you know, he gets stressed out or anything, what does it do? And I said, well, it, you know, it adjusts to your kid, you know, it adjusts to what he's actually doing. And that combination, you know, the enjoying it, parents getting that data, she was blown away. She's like, so I get a report, you know, telling me how my kid is doing, but he's just playing the game and thinking he's having fun. I was like, exactly. So it clicked. And so this is about using technology intentionally. And when I talked to her about that, she was like, you know, I wish I had known about this, you know, how do I find out? So we want to support our kids' development, but so often we teach kids coping skills in theory, right? So we tell them, you know, box breathing, take a deep breath, calm down, use your strategies. But, you know, when a kid is overwhelmed, their brain isn't in a place where they can easily access that. So if instead, we gave them a way to practice regulation while they're already activated, or if we gave them feedback in real time, or what if we help them actually feel what it's like to regulate and connect to something meaningful? So that's where this becomes really powerful. And because we're not asking kids to perform skills under pressure, they've only talked about, we're giving them a space to build those skills through their experience. Pretty cool. So I tell you, one of the things that really stood out to me when I was using was how intuitive it felt. So when a child's stress level starts to rise, there's a visual cue and they're prompted to regulate before they can continue the game. Right? Super cool. So as they do that, they're getting rewarded in the game. So it's almost like they're learning that calming down actually gives them superpowers. And that's really important for kids, I think. So, you know, I want to say something a little bit different, before we jump into something. You know, if you've been listening to the podcast for a while, you know that I don't ever have guests. I've never had a guest before. But this is actually my first interview episode I've ever done. So I was super intentional about this. You know, my first guest had to be somebody that I really got behind. So I didn't want to bring on someone just to bring somebody on and chit chat. You know, I wanted to come across this like I felt like this is somebody worth hearing directly from this earth. You know, not because it's perfect or because it's the only solution, but because it's really an interesting example of something useful that people don't know about. So I am super, super excited to introduce a representative from My Dear who makes these amazing games. And I like to introduce Miss Jessica Rajneau. She's a clinical social worker and therapist, the clinical director at My Dear, and also a mom of three. And she really brings both the professional experience and the real life parenting perspective. So Jessica, thank you so much for being here. Yeah, thanks for having me. And I feel like a big, big deal to be your first guest. I'm like, oh, see, hope we get this right. Well, you already did as far as I'm concerned. I mean, that little dude, he just, you know, he was popping with that. I was so impressed. That did it for me right there. So I'm really, really glad to have you. And thank you for being that very first guest. So, okay, so to start us off, can you tell us a little bit about your background on My Dear and where it came from and, you know, what makes it such an accessible and easy to use tool for families so they can feel better about screen time usage and the best use of it? Yeah, definitely. So I'll give you some background where My Dear, what we came out of our initial research. So initially, way back, probably starting in like 2010, we had this core concept of can we get a child to practice emotional regulation, like actually use like vital feedback, which means like having something that senses, we're using heart rate, like senses what's going on with your heart rate, and it gets you, knows when your heart rate's going up, gets you to practice bringing your heart rate down, but actually pairs that with a video game. So you're playing a video game and the game itself responds to whether your heart rate's up or when you bring your heart rate down. So it's kind of, it makes it fun and your goal in the game as you play these different games is to bring your heart rate down, encourage us practice. That actually started some, from some clinical research at Boston Children's Hospital and Harvard Medical School Teaching Hospital. So we had some clinical trials going on there, found like, whoa, this is working, this is impactful, kids are building the skill of emotional regulation, right, like calming down more easily, more automatically, able to actually able to use coping skills, like deep breathing, progressive muscle relaxation, like it's translating out to the real world, saw this great impact, or like, okay, we have to make the product, like we have to make that real and bring that to people in, in their home. So that's the other piece that I really want to call out is, you know, like I, I'm a parent, I have my back, like my background in therapy of working different settings, the system is messy and complicated. If you are like, okay, my child needs something, I want to help my child. Oftentimes we kind of fall back on, what does that mean? That means usually therapy. But now it's like, okay, who's in my network? Are there wait lists? Who's covered by my insurance? Do I have to travel somewhere? Like it gets really hard and are there enough therapists around, right? Like we know that there's this difficulty with accessing care in general. So we really wanted to make something that like a family could use in their own home, on their own time in their own way, right? Like we want to make this accessible and make it fun. So wrap everything around play, make this an intervention that is really like engaging for kids, fun, it works with how they actually learn and how they want to spend their time. So my dear kind of came out of all of those ideas, all of those things. And we've been building this product for the past 15, 16 years now where, you know, we have this team of clinical folks, game designers and engineers and, you know, this nice mix coming together to build something that is playful and engaging and actually like clinically impactful for kids and families. That's amazing. And that's, that's the key is, I think a lot of folks don't realize the importance of play in learning, you know, when the brain is open and happy and joyful, you know, anxiety and creativity are right next to each other. It's kind of one in the same. And you can have you stress or, you know, happy stress, which is great, or you can end up with anxiety. And this actually, you know, provides that happy feeling, that excitement of playing a video game, while giving, you know, the important data that we need. So it really, it's so smart and it's designed in that way. And it's so innovative because this is something that nobody else is really doing. And yet this is the core of what we should be doing. So it's, it's really brilliant. It's, you know, I'm so glad. And the fact that Boston Children's Hospital and there's so much backing from the medical community on this and that you all took the time to really bring in a great team is, is just one more thing that's like, wow, that's, that's fascinating. So, but can you explain a little bit more about the biofeedback and why it's such a helpful tool when it comes to learning emotional regulation? I think that families need to understand how important that is. Yeah, yeah. So I think so oftentimes when we think about like, for ourselves or for your kids, right, you think about like how what happens when we feel really anxious or really angry about something and, you know, your heart races, you feel like that heat in your face, your muscles get tense, and, you know, you have this whole like, full body physiological reaction that's happening. And then you know, as a therapist, we might be like, okay, like, let's recognize what's happening in our bodies and let's talk about the coping skills we can use to help us feel better and manage those emotions. And then we like kind of send kids out into the world and they can't access any of that. No, Suzanne, you were kind of talking about this, like what's happening in the brain a little bit earlier, like they can't access those coping skills necessarily because they're totally flooded with that anxiety, that anger, whatever that is. So the way biofeedback games work is kids who are heart rate monitor as they play my ear, it is where it's on their arm, and it's sensing when their heart rate goes up a bit and when their heart rate comes back down. And it's sending that information to the actual game. And, you know, the whole game world, a bunch of games kids are playing, you know, levels, they're, they're leveling up their collecting characters, they're going on missions and class, all these things. But the heart rate component is layered on top of all that. And when a child's heart rate goes up, maybe they're a little frustrated as they play. Maybe they got a little excited. Maybe like a sibling walked in and like interrupted them and they got annoyed with that, like whatever it is, their heart rate goes up a little bit. The game itself changes, gets a little more challenging. There are a lot of visual and auditory cues to let you know, like, oh, you're getting into your red zone. We have something in my ear called the gizmo and it lets you know, like, that you're in your red zone or you're in your blue zone. And then you, your goal is to bring your heart rate back down, bring it back down to your blue zone. And there are different strategies that you're introduced to deep breathing, progressive muscle relaxation, little games you keep in play that are going to help you bring your heart rate down. So you're practicing that calming strategy as you're playing, you're practicing regulating. And when you get back to blue, you earn rewards for that. So it's really this like reward system built around calming down or staying calm, but really like that's what gets kids to practice it, right? And so we think about anything that takes practice, shooting a basketball, playing the piano, like anything that really takes about muscle memory, you have to like just do it over and over and over again in order to build a skill. This is what's happening in my ear. Kids are just practicing, calming down, practicing, regulating their emotions over and over and over again. And that's what sticks and translates to real life eventually. Absolutely, absolutely. And, you know, they don't even realize they're practicing it, which keeps them in that creative brain and, you know, out of the emotional brain so they can stay, you know, somewhat logical, but yet, you know, creative and excited and so on. So, you know, that's where we want them to do the, you know, predominant amount of their learning. So this is putting them right in that headspace that they need to be in from my teacher perspective. And then from, you know, the therapist's perspective, certainly it allows them to, you know, learn those coping mechanisms and they become muscle memory. So what I liked is in the game when I was playing it, you know, I got stressed out. It's like an RPG type of game. It reminds me old school folks. It reminds me of like a combination of Sega's fantasy star mixed with Gavellius. So that's kind of like really deep, but it actually really is. But it's like kind of an RPG game, but it's cute. Like it has this, you know, you go on these quests, but like I was up against this, you know, villain who's like an emotional, like he's angry and whatnot. And so I had to regulate myself. The screen went kind of red all the way around the screen and it was like, oh, you're getting stressed out. And then it taught me through, you know, regulation, like you said, but what happens is in this particular case, like you earn these little snowflakes, and the snowflakes, you throw them at the villain and then it calms them down and then they, you know, everything's fine again. So you beat the villain that way. So it's cute, you know, it's like, oh, okay, that makes it so it's very logical to kids brains as well, that that's what they're doing, but it stays fun. So it's really colorful and cute. And I like the design. I really do. I think it's super, super cute. So, you know, it's easy for the kids to assimilate to it, I think. So, but one of the things that really stood out to me when I was using it was that moment when, you know, that heart rate does go up, the visual cue, and they do have to prompt, you know, the kid to regulate. So the moment, you know, can you just talk about that specific moment of that realization of need to regulate? And why does that matter? Yeah, yeah. So that moment, so you have, again, we call it the gizmo. So this little thing that was on your screen, and you can always see where your heart rate is, is your heart rate in your blue zone, or is your heart rate in your red zone, or somewhere in between. And because part of this is we don't notice necessarily like the second our heart rate starts going up, but an heart rate monitor does. And so we want to help kids tune into that awareness, like that mind-body connection of like, okay, like, well, my heart rate is starting to drop. I need to, I need to bring it back down. I need to calm myself down a little bit. So as your heart rate goes up, you get into that red zone, there are a lot of things letting you know that you're in the red. And kids have a choice at this point. Some kids, we actually see kids playing either way. And I actually think both are great. Some kids, they pause the game in this moment, you know, they take that, that pause and they decide like, my heart rate's up, I need to take a moment, right? They're being very aware or very intentional. I need to take a moment. I need to regulate. I need to use a calming strategy and do that. They get back to blue. They earn that reward. And then they go back to their gameplay. So I think that that's a great little process of like, wait a second, I'm in my red zone. I need to take a pause. I need to stop for a second. I need to use a calming strategy, get back to blue, ready to go again. Some kids don't take that pause. Keep playing. Just go go go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Which actually, initially we thought like, okay, maybe kids who play in that way, they're kind of missing that moment, that awareness. But actually, what they're doing is they are playing the game while calming down. Which is you think about like, real life when you're in the middle of a game, you're playing with friends, you're in the middle of a presentation and you're anxious, but you have to keep going and you have to stay calm. Like, that's kind of what's happening for those kids, right? Like they are doing like, they're doing two things at once. They are attending to their task, their gameplay, and they're regulating at the same time in the background, which is also really cool. So we see kids playing both ways and seems to, you know, kids are learned like we see improvement happening for regardless of which way kids are playing. Right. Well, and it gives us safe space, you know, to practice that. But you know, I think of, you know, as a kid, I had some social phobia and because I was just always afraid of doing something awkward in front of people and standing out, you know, so in this case, I would have been, you know, my kid self would have said in a heartbeat that if I had a game like this that I could play and kind of practice being stressed out and how to calm down, you know, before I go to the eighth grade dance on Friday, you know, just to have that extra help, that's amazing. You know, that gives you that safe space to practice those skills without, you know, putting yourself in potential embarrassment, which is important for a lot of tweens and teens who are kind of socially sensitive and things like that. They can have that, you know, safe ability to, you know, go through those feels and how to be a little bit better with them. So I think, you know, kids themselves can say, oh, wow, I am getting better at that. And that's really great. So, but why is practicing, I'm sorry, why is practicing regulation in real time, you know, more effective than just talking about those coping skills? I think it comes back to muscle memory, right? Like, so you are in the moment training your body to, like, the second you start, those heightened emotions start coming in, your heart starts going up, you start calming back down, which is different from, you know, we hear all the time therapeutically, right, that we, okay, a child, when they're calm and they are thinking clearly and they are in a certain brain space, yeah, they know their coping skills, they know how to identify their emotions, they know what they should do in real life moments to help themselves feel better to calm down when they are upset about something. And then they get into those moments and they can't access it, right? But it's because their brain is just working in a different way where, like, it's prioritizing that heightened, like that reactivity, right, like they kind of need to be in that reactive state to manage whatever is happening and makes it hard to think clearly and remember, oh, right, we should take deep breaths right now, it'll help me feel better, right? You can't really access that. So practicing in real time in the moment is really the key. The metaphor I really like for this is, it's almost like, you know, if we were teaching a child try to bike, like, we couldn't just look at a bike and talk about a bike and then expect the child to get on the bike and be able to have balance or reaction times or know when to brake, right, like, they have to get on the bike, they have to physically practice riding a bike and then all those things develop and their body knows how to respond. But that's kind of what's happening with my dear. Absolutely. You know, it pulls it out of that theory space, which, you know, I can say of, you know, sitting through therapy sessions with kids, you know, I wish I had that, let me show you this, let me, you know, and I try to come up with examples, but, you know, here you have this perfect example that, you know, kids can just hop on and, you know, go for it and practice those skills. So, so, I mean, how do these changes, you know, begin to carry over into real life, like school and friendships and stress and so on? Yeah, yeah. So we parents kind of, they fill out some, like, information about their child as their child's playing and they report back on progress. So what we hear parents reporting, something that kind of falls into two categories. One category is that like emotional awareness category. So like my child is more aware of their emotional state. They are more aware of when they are feeling anxious, angry about something. They are better able to use coping skills or conning strategies in real life, right? Like if they, they have those, that intention has been built. And then there's the side that's more like automatic. My child's frustration tolerance is just better. They seem to be recovering, calming down more easily, you know, without even trying. Like it's almost like I don't even know, they know that this is happening, but they seem calmer. They seem like they are better able to handle things that used to be really tough for them. And so we see all that translating out to real life, whether that's school, friendships, being able to get on the bus, just all of these real life situations. And parents saying, you know, like my child seems more confident. We're able to talk about how we feel. We hear a lot of parents also saying like, I'm playing my dear because I realize I need. That's right. I'm like, where's the, yeah, I'm like the adult version totally. Yeah. Like blinged out little like, you know, tablet cases and stuff like that. So, so you're talking about some of these changes that parents tend to notice when their kid starts my dear and certainly that ability to cope quicker, you know, to, you know, re-regulate, you know, more effectively. So, you know, these kinds of, so let's talk about that. Some of the changes that people might notice off the bat. Yeah. So in actually early on, we always suggest like you know, we recommend kids play 45 minutes a week, you know, break that up every like, and then it's going to take a few like two to three months, probably before you're in a really starting noticing significant changes, right? But in those early days, you might be like, oh, like my child is, they're using, I see them using coping skills. I see them understanding when and how to use them. I see that that frustration tolerance has improved. They seem a little calmer. Things like that, you might, it might be some of like the early signs that you notice. And then later on, maybe some of that like greater emotional awareness, like, hey, we're like, we're talking about anger right now. We're talking about the things that make us upset. And we're having those conversations more productively as a family. Or like my child's teacher is noticing that they are, they're, they seem calmer in school. They are, you know, where things are used to make them anxious, aren't making them as anxious, things like that. Absolutely. Well, and the families also get a report periodically. Yeah. Right. So if you need to talk about that a little bit. Yeah. So, so kids play my idea on like their app, that's sort of their world. And then parents have like a companion app, we call it my dear parent. And it, it tracks alongside your child's gameplay. So it has some like education on there, some resources, but it also has play data and stats. So you can see how much time your child's been playing right here, like, you know, time per week, things like that. You can also see cooldowns. So we, cooldowns are our measure of how many times your child brought their heart rate down. So it's like a really good way to see like, okay, I can, I can specifically see that my kid brought their heart rate down and is practicing emotional regulation this many times. So we give you, so you can track that. And you can track fun things like they're at this level, they entered this world, they collected these characters, you can see the fun gameplay stuff like that so that you can talk to them about their achievements. Yeah, that parents can track alongside their child and see more if you have like a few kids playing, you can, you know, you can see that for all your players. Oh, cool. So the kids can connect with other friends and whatnot as well. It's not, so it's not like an actual multiplayer game, but if you have friends playing, yes, you could like share your progress about those things. Exactly. Yeah, I wanted to make that very clear because, you know, safety-wise, you know, we don't, it doesn't open it up so just any person can become their friend and it could be some, you know, whatever. This is all, you know, checked out and it stays to your child and they're not, you know, meeting weirdos on the internet or anything like that. It's not that kind of software. So, yeah, that was just your child playing their, you know, their gameplay experience. They aren't interacting with anyone else. Exactly. All right. So, okay, so like, let's zoom out a little bit. How do you see tools like this shaping the future or supporting kids' emotional health? Because you guys have something truly innovative. This is, you know, nobody's really doing this. So how do you see my dear and how it's going to shape his emotional health in the future? Yeah, I mean, I think play is a big one. Wrapping therapeutic approaches in play for kids is huge. And, you know, as teachers and therapists, like, as individuals, like, we've been doing this forever and there are like so many programs out there that are so great at wrapping concepts into play and getting you to engage with something through play. But I think in the healthcare space, that doesn't necessarily always exist. And so pushing that forward into the system is a big deal. And then, I think just like the at-home, the ability to use tools, resources, interventions at home is a big deal rather than having things almost like behind a gatekeeper in a way. I think that's like, empowering families to be able to say like, oh, hey, like, I know my child best. I know my family best. I know what we need. And I can access this tool. And, you know, I can put this is in our hands. I think that's a big deal. Absolutely. And now just the awareness that this even exists, you know, is a lot of the problem for families because, you know, they don't have the time to go research all this and so on, which is why, you know, if I can do my part to try to bring this out there. So I was so glad that I was able to find you as well. But I was actively searching. So I, you know, and hopefully this will, you know, open this up. So, you know, white elephant, everybody wants to know costs. You know, what are they looking at? I mean, it's very affordable. So can you talk a little bit about the price point and what families, you know, might incur that way? Yeah, definitely. And hold on. Now I'm calling you that up on my computer. Sorry. I didn't, folks, I did not prefer for that. So sorry, my bad. No, no worries. So we have, so we have three different, maybe like a membership or like a subscription and we have three different ways you can subscribe. So one is like they're paying monthly or one is that you're, you have a six month, you pay every six months you pay every year. So it really, and what it brings down to is different depending on each of those. But if you were like paying monthly for my year, it's $40 a month. And if you buy a year up front, you're going to pay $336, which brings down to like $28 a month. Another thing we do that I didn't mention is we have, in terms of like add and play to therapeutic approaches, we have these skill packs that are, if you remember like Highlights magazine with like all the sun. Love it. Yep. Yeah. So it's like many, many versions of Highlights magazine. Each one has like a different theme. It might be anger. It might be perspective taking. It might be like mannequin negative thoughts. Anyways, we wrap that in the metaphor. We put some stories and games and crafts in it and we mail a little packet to a family's house every month. So that's another thing you're getting on a regular basis. Very cool. Yeah. And I got that kit from you all where it had the tablet and the arm band and it had a really nice set of the cards, like little coping cards that you can talk to your family about and nice little pamphlet with skills. I mean, they provided all these extra materials and things, which I thought was really neat too. And very visually oriented, very fun, very easy to incorporate debrief kind of talks with your kiddo after they go through my year and what not to kind of help them just discuss their feelings. And that teaches a whole other skill and also helps to bond the family with the kid playing my year, which is really cool too. So I like that additional piece, the follow-up piece that goes along with it. And the price point is really, really good. But let me say this, just let me know how you feel. But I do want to make sure that everybody knows I have not been paid a single dollar for my year for this. Is that true, Jessica? That is true. That is true. Okay. So this is not me making a bunch of money right now off of promoting something. This is literally me saying, I think this is great and it's affordable. So that's great too. Affordability is such a big thing. Everybody's struggling. But here's something where you can really, really help your child and have those skills. Maybe you live really, really, and you can't get a therapist. Maybe you have all kinds of situations in your life where something like this can be a real godsend for families who are just at their wits end and they don't really know what to do. So I know my kiddo down the street, it's kind of that situation where she just needs some help and a tool. And she was excited to know that she had a go-to now. So I really appreciate that, Jessica. So thank you very much for sharing all of that. It's so helpful. And for those of you listening, I want to leave you with this. The goal isn't to eliminate screen time, not at all. It's about being intentional about your screen time and using it to its full value. And to look for tools and experience that help our kids build skills and understand themselves and feel more in control of their emotions is gold. Technology isn't going anywhere folks. It's just how we use it and where the difference is and how much do you want to make the screen time usage from your kiddo to be purposeful and for their own self-bediment. So here's a tool that you can use. We're going to continue the series a couple more episodes on various other things. So stay tuned, more coming. And Jessica, thank you again for your time. I really appreciate you being here. Yeah, I really appreciate you letting me join. And then Suzanne, I don't think we even mentioned because we really do want to reach more families. For your audience, we are doing a promo code for My Dear, Mary Poppins, no space, just N-A-R-Y-P-O-P-P-I-N-S, will give you 15% off at your purchase of My Dear. Wow. And that's at MyDear.JustMyDear.com. Oh, that's so cool. Thank you so much. Wow. Awesome, guys. Thank you. That's really sweet. Now, so if they want to go ahead and find out more about My Dear, can you let them know the best ways to find out? Yeah, just go to MyDear.com. My Dear is spelled M-I-G-H-T-I-E-R, like you are a MyD, so MyDear.com. Honestly, that's the best way. You can learn about the program, dig into the science, see what the games look like. Yep. And there's lots and lots of data there. I was just pawing through all of that. So the data really makes a really good case for WEDD software is a good thing. Keep doing what you're doing, and thank you for making a really positive-oriented software for kids that really helps them. So thank you for doing what you do. Your team is amazing. Everybody is so sweet. And I hope families will find some really good resources out there like MyDear. All right. Well, everybody, I'll go ahead. Sorry. No, thanks for having me. Appreciate it so, so much. Thank you for being my first guest. That's awesome. All right, everybody, until next time, stay clever, little foxes. Take care.