From Furman to Greece with Mike Bothwell | Legends Edition

This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human. Okay, it is time for another SoCon fast break legends edition and it is our pleasure and our honor to bring in one of the SoCon legends and he's always going to be a legend there with the firm and paladins. That's Mr. Mike Bothwell. Hey, Mikey B. We can't thank you enough for joining us here. I know it's selection Sunday has passed. We know where the firm and paladins are going here in this 2026 NCAA tournament and I would imagine it was be damned. I'm staying up the entire time to watch selection Sunday for you, my friend. Yeah, I had to watch selection Sunday had to see where we're going. I was too curious. There's no way I'd have been able to sleep. No way I was going to be tired. It was I think it started at midnight. So that's not too bad. You know, no, that's easy. Yeah, I'm not that old yet. I'm usually up around midnight anyway. So it was it was good. I love it. All right. So just even walking back through memory lane, so to speak, as you're seeing selection Sunday on TV this year. But what about your memories there? Selection Sunday back in 2023, that magical run for the paladins. Yeah, I think the selection Sunday was like everyone I've heard people keep talking about like 2023, the NCAA tournament was like icing on the cake. And like that, I guess, election Sunday was like when the cake first came out the oven, you know, like we were so excited about winning the soul con. But then like this, the selection Sunday was like, oh, wait, there's more like there's more to be excited about. There's more cool stuff that's about to happen. Like that was that was what I remember about selection Sunday being so excited about that happening. Yeah, of course. All right. So I also want to get your perspective now that it's been three years removed since that magical run. And more importantly, your time behind the cameras in front of the cameras, all of that as I embedded that film crew there for the entire season for the better together Firm and Championship Quest docu series, five episode docu series, or you were a big part of that a star and I'm forever grateful for having the opportunity of being part of the team, so to speak, and being able to capture that so con tournament title that you're talking about. And obviously we talked there after the season and you got to reflect on what that season meant. But now that you've watched the series and even had more time to reflect, what's some of the big takeaways for you for that season and just even the opportunity of having a legacy piece like that docu series? Yeah, I want to say I want to thank you and your crew for capturing that. And just having a belief in us that we were going to make some special happen that year because that's something I'm going to cherish forever, just being able to go back and look at that. So I want to thank you for that. But just going back down every lane, it's just about the journey. The journey was so special every day of that season. I feel like the docu series could have been like three seasons, 10 episodes. We just had so much happening. It was just so much great memories and moments, even the hard times, they ended up turning into positives. I think that's one good thing about that season. We never let any hard moments boil over for multiple days and multiple weeks. Even the roughest practices, the roughest film sessions, they always ended up making us better and making us stronger, making us closer. So looking back, that's what I always remember. Yeah, what was your thoughts though, just in terms of when you guys got an understanding and realization that you do have a film crew following you around? How much did you guys talk about that? Because I know Coach Richie and I, we were intentional in terms of not trying to make it a big deal because we don't want any added pressure in terms of thinking, oh, well, we've got to play better. We've got to win this year because there's a camera crew. Yeah, I don't think it added pressure about us winning. I feel like we had enough of that on our own, just wanting to win and wanting to have an amazing season. I think if anything, it made it cool or when we would win a big game or have fun moments in the game, we're like, oh, I hope that makes the doc. It was more like a thing like that. Oh, this is so cool. We got guys, we're pulling up to Chatnuga. We're at McKinsey Arena and guys are hiding in the bushes with cameras. Like, this is cool. This is what we do it for. A guy like me, I like the big time moments. I like to feel like I'm showtime. So that just added another element to that season, having you guys around. It was just like, yeah, I hope they see this. I can't wait for everybody to see this. Yeah, Mike, you bring up how we seem to really learn from every rough moment that year. I think you had been around long enough at that point to know that that was unique. That's not necessarily the norm in a lot of programs. Obviously, I think the leadership from the top down from Coach Richie to you and Slaugh, being such great leaders and balancing each other so well. Can you talk to us about how that flushed itself out as to how we were able to take every single kind of negative scenario and immediately just really turn it into a positive and frankly, I don't know if we achieve what we achieve without almost every single hurdle that we dealt with that year. Can you talk to us a little bit about how you guys led that way? Yeah, I think it was really, I mean, Coach Richie, it all starts with Coach Richie in a way he approached every day and had made sure our moms are in the right place. But I feel like you got to give a lot of credit to our underclassmen that year. Of course, me and Slaugh is going to lead. We're seniors. This is our last year. Of course, we're going to try to do everything the right way. For guys that were super talented and deserve to be starters in our league, but came off the bench and died to self, I just think of a guy like Joe Anderson. We saw what he was able to do when he went to Lipscomb, but he didn't play a lot. But he still was the greatest teammate. He could have been dying in self-pity. He could have not have practiced hard, but every day in practice on Scout team, he was pretending to be the other team's best player and giving us a great look. We got other guys that could have been and should have been playing more minutes, maybe, arguably. But I think it was like midway, beginning of conference play, especially probably after the Western Carolina game. We had so many people that just died to self and was just like, you know what, I'm going to really put the team's needs, whatever they say they are, whatever Coach Richie says it are, whatever Mike and Slaugh say, we're going to just try to follow that. And I could really feel that. And that's why I feel like even if we did have a hurdle here and there, it wasn't long. We could snap back into just being connected. Yeah, no doubt. And one of the true connectivity points there for you, where you were totally connected out on the court. And that's that game at Sanford. My goodness. My 18 straight points for the Paladins. Have you ever been in a zone like that in your life? Definitely never in a game of that magnitude. You know, that's something you could just dream of. And like the coolest part about it was just how much I was struggling in the games before that. You know, like, I think Coach Richie and everybody wanted to hire a shrink for me because I was just so mentally down and just so not being myself. Like I wasn't taking shots. I was passing up open looks. I wasn't I was leaving games, not even just about the points. Like I just wasn't even attempting to score. Like I just was in my head. I don't know what it was going on. But the fact that, you know, I was able to release all of that and just say, hey, you know what, I've been saying all year, I want to be the one seat. I want to be the one seat. Am I just going to try to see if it happens or am I going to try to do something to make it happen? And thank God, like the shots were falling and I felt the energy and the crowd of the gym and I just was able to feed off that. And just it was a great night in Birmingham or a great afternoon in Birmingham. No, no, no. No, that was a magical moment in that, as you talked about a big time game because that clinched the Southern Conference regular season title and gave you that number one seed heading into Asheville. And then I know we've talked about the shot against Chattanooga and then one year later, you have the opportunity of laying on the exact same spot where you were devastated after that shot. So just let people know just that emotional, I guess, release that you had of all of that year long waiting and being able to finally grab that Soak on title. Yeah. I mean, people always just talk about beating Virginia and even my teammates out here in Greece asked me, have you ever played in March Madness? I'm like, yeah, like we play, we, he like, did you win? Like, yeah, we actually won a game and that's all what people are going to remember. But for a lot of us, especially me, that season, the most special moment was just finally winning Southern Conference. Like 1980, that was a long time. Like thinking about that for Furman fans that come out year in and year out and support us for them to not see us win a tournament championship in that many years to finally do it, especially how it went the year before. That just meant the world. Like it is hard to explain. It's so special. Especially just how the tournaments have gone in my five years. It kind of felt like in that moment, like, oh, everything I've done since my first day ever on Furman's campus, just all built up into that moment. And it was just so much joy and release. And just, I just got to just feel every bit of hard work pay off in that moment in that day. So yeah, I mean, it's hard to explain how good that felt. Oh, for certain, I can only imagine. And also, I would say that you and Slaul, I mean, your rare type of players that you did have that fifth year super senior type of situation, but you guys didn't transfer. And I know now even more so, the transfer portal is wide open. NIL dollars are different than they were just a few years ago, but you guys could have easily left and you guys both decided to stay. So was that something that both you and Slaul talked about that you had unfinished business? Yeah, I mean, I just remember staying up after the Chattanooga loss until about five in the morning in the meeting room, just reflecting on our years at Furman, not just me and him, but like all the guys on the team. And on that moment for me, it was just like, I can't leave my guys like more than anything, more than the coaches, more than the other opportunities out there that could have been. I just knew that like, these guys are really my brothers, these guys are guys I'm gonna call on them for my whole life. You know, like, I can't imagine having another year of playing college basketball and not these guys that are coming back, not be my teammates. Like that, that for me was the deciding factor right there more than anything. Obviously, there's other things that played a part. But for me, it was just about, we set out a goal and I wanted to accomplish it with my best friends in the world. And it was just like that trumped any other, any other thing to look for, you know. Yeah, Mike, what was, what was you looking back on that year? What was your fondest memory of that group in 2324? Is that something you look to like, hey, on the floor or is it just, hey, this group was so connected. My favorite memory is that doesn't even have to do with basketball. Yeah, DA, how are you going to put that on? How are you going to ask any question like that? We had so many good memories. I know, I know. Yeah, man. I'm trying to think, we had so many good memories, you know, like just like hanging out at the guys apartment, watching games, you know, like going to other sporting events and cheering on the football team, the soccer games. Like, I don't even know if it's like one specific moment. Like we had good away trips that year and fun trips. We took some flights together. Like, ah, man, it's hard to just point one, but the whole year, we just had so much fun just being around each other. And like, honestly, before the season, before the games even started, you know, like I remember that year, the football team played at Clemson and the however many people we had on the roster, we all found a way to death Valley and we sat together and watched the game and then went back to the apartments on North Village and watched the rest of the football games that night. And that was every Saturday thing. And like I talked to guys that went to other schools and that was that's not common. You know, you might have your groups of people to hang out, but like for a whole team to be in one apartment, watching football on three different screens every weekend, every weekend, not every year now when it's a college game day, big game, like this is just the normal. We're watching SCF football games together. Like if it's on, we're watching it together. Like that was a normal thing. So like stuff like that stuff like that is just hard to hard to replace that once you leave college. Yeah, and Darren asked you a tough question like that. That's like asking some parent, what's your favorite child? It's hard. Yeah, come on, man. I should have answered, man. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. That I should know better too. Right. Like I know exactly wasn't it? I'll tell you what, I can't pick out one. I can't. I love that group. That group will be connected for hours. You are right there with us every day. Man. Yeah. Hey, and Mike, I think that even dovetails right into like what you're still continuing to do with the three P's in a pod with Garrett Heen and Tyrese Huey. I mean, you guys are still going strong. Talk about that relationship and how much fun you guys are having with the podcast. Yeah, it's super fun. Like we're really casual right now. We're really not really taking it too serious, but me and Garrett both have like aspirations of getting into a media career one day. So we both know from just like the firm and communications department that like put content out there, like work on your craft. And to us, this is just like practice and like getting stuff out there just to work on our on our craft. But you know, Tyrese too, like he he's such a good storyteller. He's so funny and he was there for all our greatest memories. And he has, he's a super opinionated person, super opinionated. He has some of that crazy hot take. So we're trying to get that out of him. We're trying to get him to, you know, like give us some good, some good content, some good stuff. But no, it's fun. And with us all being overseas right now, this is perfect. Like we all have completely different perspectives. Tyrese and Garrett are both in their first years, but Tyrese is in Taiwan right now. Garrison in Belgium, you know, this is my third year playing pro. I've been in many different countries. We just have similar perspectives because of the firming program, but also different because we've been away from it and been in different places. So I think it's just, it's a, we have a good group. And I think hopefully we can keep growing and keep putting more out there and people enjoy listening to us. I love it. Yes. Three P's in a pod. Go check it out, people. And what is life like overseas international basketball for you, Mike? What's like a typical day and how has that transition been for you? Yeah, the transition definitely was not easy. I had like some hiccups my rookie year was just the country I was in going through having to leave and come back to America and find a new team to go to. And it's just, it hasn't been smooth, but it's been worth it. That's one thing I always say, but a typical day, you know, depending on what team you're on, you might practice in the morning, you might practice in the afternoon, but you really is really just being a pro is about how you manage your time. Like if you just want to sleep in all day and not take care of your body, not eat right, no one's going to tell you not to. So if you don't want to, if you want to show up to practice right before, like it's not going to be good for you in the long run, but you can do it if you want. So it's like typical day, you know, I wake up, eat breakfast, maybe go for a walk, maybe get a coffee, watch some film of other teams are about to play, watch some basketball content. Maybe catch up with some sports I missed from the night before, then get to the gym about 45 minutes before good tapes start stretching. It's one thing I have to do a lot more now. Not that I don't have games, coach Matt every day. Like I have to stretch my own, take care of myself, maybe get an extra lifting. When, when people aren't telling me I have to live, maybe lift extra, then get shot sub before and after practice. And, you know, it's, it's, it's like I said, it's worth it. You know, the games are fun. You get to play in front of these rowdy environments. And even if it's only 500 people in the crowd, these, the fans that show up are going to make themselves feel they're going to be blowing the horn. They're going to be blowing, beating on the drums, the whole game. And it's definitely worth it. It's so fun getting to just be able to still play past college and just be able to that is keep the dream going. And it's something I've always wanted to do. So I'm glad to be living in it. Now, Mike, can you tell us now? I know, I know it's different a lot of times in each country. Like it's just different style of play, depending on where you are. But are you able to pinpoint one or a couple of things that are stylistically been the biggest differences between the college game and the program overseas? Well, the first thing that jumps onto my mind is just like freedom of movement. Just like off the ball for sure. Like you have to be able to be low, play low and play strong base. Or if not, people are just going to bully you away from screens. Like if you're trying to go set a screen, you're trying to come off the screen. People are going to just move you out the way. So you have to be able to be willing to be physical. Like you have to give the physicality first before they get to you. That's one thing for sure that I think is a is a big difference. And then also, too, it's just like it's coaching. Like a lot of times coaches and like we had Coach Richie, like Coach Richie was caring about Alex Williams, who was our seventh eighth man. He had plays for him that if he needed to get going or if he needed to get a shot in pro, unless you're a million dollar player, which I am not yet. But coaches aren't really giving you draw ups like that. They're going to give you their system and you're supposed to figure it out. It's going to be a lot of ball screens. It's going to be a lot of maybe some some pin down actions for shooters. But other than that, you kind of just have to know how to play the game. And if you if you don't, coaches probably aren't going to just oh, he's having a rough time getting open. So let's draw him up this. Let's let's find a way to get him this. No, like they're just going to find someone else that can get open. So you better figure it out that no coach is going to be sitting down for hours thinking, oh, Mike's having a bad day today. How can we get him going? No, you you you probably need to make sure you're having a good day. There you go. Yeah. Hey, well, you didn't have too many bad days there. Firm and I are that 2000 point score. That's for certain. And how much then did Furman help you prepare for that, especially with Bob Richie's offense? Because you have to have high basketball IQ for his offense and being able to understand it's not just straight set plays that you have to read the defense and be able to react. Yeah, I think Coach Richie and just like the offense of Furman assistant coaches that I had in my time there, they all helped me for sure. I think just being able to read read and react. Like I'm right now I'm getting more assists than I even did in college just because now that I'm playing with all pros on the floor, people are having to help and kicking out. And I'm just seeing seeing things that even in college, like I wasn't a high assist guy, but, you know, I was just because I could score more times out of 10. It didn't matter if a team was helping, like, you know, I would still be able to score, maybe finish over the big now. It's a seven footer probably coming over. So probably, you know, not going to be, you know, body and all of those guys. So now I got to be able to make the extra pass. Now I got to be able to see it before it gets there. But also, I think mentally is where Coach Richie helped me and just Furman coaches and players, everything helped me to be able to become a pro and in a way of just like, you can't make excuses for yourself. Like at the end of the day, you're either producing or you're not. So you can find 10,000 reasons a lot of things aren't going your way. But at the end of the day, nobody really cares. Only thing that people care about is are you showing up every day? Are you being a professional? Are you having the right attitude, the right spirit? Are you making your teammates better? And are you are you doing what you're supposed to do? And, you know, it's a lot of ways that you can get in the self pity. But out here, people are just people are just going to eat that up. People are going to take advantage if you're out here in self pity. If you're out here feeling sorry for yourself. So I think mentally having that that always pops in my head. Like at the end of the day, nobody really cares. You know, they're going to find a way to find a reason. And I try to find a way as much as I can because it's not going to look. No question. Yeah. Well, you sound like a coach already. So you might if you don't go that media route, you could be a coach also. All right. So now we've got to talk about this 2026 firm impaled and steam gets another Southern Conference tournament championship in a season where it looked a little rough for a period of time. The injuries obviously were a big part of the firm and team, but they got hot at the right moment. Things came together, especially on the offensive side. And they go on that three O run in the Southern Conference tournament and take care of ETSU. So your thoughts on what Furman was able to do this season. And I imagine you had to be watching that game too. Yeah, I was watching as many games as I can, you know, Greece have a seven hour time difference. So it's a little rough for this year to watch some of the games. But, you know, I was obviously it's just like a wild run of a year, you know, rough start, but again, some playing, get some great teams, get hot and guys to start falling out, getting injured. And I ain't go lie. I was calling. I was calling some of the guys after some of the games and like, I'm not going to lie, you all, like I had to turn it off. I couldn't watch. I couldn't watch. You guys make me too mad. I was telling them, like I'm turning your games off in the second half. Like I'd rather go to sleep than watch y'all blow a lead again. So like I was I was getting on. I was telling them, like this, this, like y'all got to get it together. But now I'm definitely proud of of them, them figuring it out and getting meshing together at the perfect time. You know, that's that's all everybody say. There's got to be hot at Asheville and if you can play the best ball, I don't think anybody leaving Asheville would be able to have any doubts that they were the best team, you know, so obviously super proud of that. And it's it's just good to see the program still doing well. They've been doing well, even without winning the championship. Yeah. Just being able to put a whole season together and, you know, see them come together and be a brotherhood and be connected and just be so selfless. That was just amazing to see. Yeah. Well, now we know when people ask, how did Furman get so motivated right there at the end of the year? Now we know this. Mike Bothwell texting guys and saying, hey, man, I'm turning it off. They didn't want to disappoint their true leader over in Greece. I love it. Um, let's say most important question. Where's the closest Chipotle? Is there any Chipotle in Greece anyway? You won't believe it. If I told you I haven't had Chipotle since October. This is the longest. This is the longest since I've known what Chipotle is. This is the longest since I've known what Chipotle is that I've gone without it. So it's a that's a trigger word. That's a trigger word. Yeah. Oh, love it. All right. So now turning to this matchup, Mikey V, here we go. Yukon Huskies, a two seed as the Paladins are a 15 seed there in Philly on Friday. Approximate tip time is 10 p.m. Eastern. So it is a late one even for Furman, Paladin fans. Yes, your initial reaction when you saw Yukon. My initial reaction was honestly like, what an honor, you know, like to for Coach Richie, for the players to be able to compete against the program. They're blue blood, you know. So yeah, just being able to put that brand. Everyone's going to tune in. Everyone wants to see what Yukon is going to do. And then it's not that far from us. Like just seeing people all online talk about, oh, 15 seed. This is the danger of 15 seed. Like what an honor for people to like really consider Furman and Yukon being a good game, being a being a potential upset again, like Yukon and knowing that Yukon is going to have to take us serious. Like that's my first. That was my first reaction. Like, wow. And of course, also thought Philadelphia, the Paladins have had had some good times in Philadelphia before. So, you know, it's maybe magic in the city. Still, if Matt, if Matt Rafferty can still find a turn away, if that fade away and Villanova is still around somewhere, you never know. No one thought we was going to win that game either. So you never know what happens. That's the beauty of this time of year. Yeah, Mike, speaking of the success in Philly, what do you think Furman can do here to try to neutralize Yukon and give themselves the best chance to go out there and shock the world with an upset? Well, my favorite thing about this team this year is the size of the players, the size they have. You know, like usually playing against high majors, mid-majors, struggle, strictly also just size at position. But this year, you know, we have a 65 point guard. You know, we have two, six, nine, six, ten, six, eleven bigs, you know, that we can throw at. So we should be able to be able to compete on the glass. Guard plays obviously always a strong suit for Furman. So I think to neutralize it, we're just going to have to just play and just make some big shots down the stretch. You know, like I remember before we played Virginia, Richie told us like he didn't tell us like, oh, we're going to we're going to whoop them. We're going to come out and beat them about 20. He said, no, we just got to keep it close. We got to keep it close. The fans are going to get hype. Everyone's going to start pulling for you. They might get tight and we can make the plays late. So I think that's the recipe. You know, we obviously firm out of the 15 C playing with house money. You have everything to gain, nothing to lose. So I think that's just got to be the mentality. Come in, keep it close, make them feel the pressure. And then, you know, Ace of Thomas, Tom House, Alex Wilkins, Bang a couple of threes late, give me a give me a Charlie Johnson shot at Bronson, had my guys make some big shots late, even Cole, like how did guys come in there and just play fearless and just just let the cards fall where they may. Yeah, no question about it. And I think Alex Wilkins, if he can get downhill, if he gets the defender on his hip, he is so hard, even with Yukon size, I'm telling you, he finishes at the rim for a wiry type of guy. He finishes really strong. That is for certain. And to your point, Mike, keep it close and we know Furman, they can get hot from beyond the arc. And that's the ultimate equalizer, that three point shot. You hit some perimeter shots. That changes the complexion of the game for certain. Yeah. And it's demoralizing, you know, you're going to have Dan Hurley screaming, that is guys that they keep leaving shooters open if they have a defensive breakdowns and you know, some, I mean, obviously, you kind of strong team. They were really good this year, but it's never easy when you feel that pressure, you know, and then your coach streaming at you, your fans saying what is going on? And we've seen it. We've seen guys get hot. We've seen things happen in March. We've seen crazier things than this. So I'm excited to see them guys go out and compete and give their all for it. Yeah, no question. And speaking of that, you know, in terms of keeping it close and you talked about that Virginia game, what was it like though for you having to sit on the bench? You fouled out with just about six minutes to play and just the challenge. Now, I know you challenge the team. And again, the speech that you had there on the bench, your lip is bloody. You're giving it all that you have right there. You take over coach Richie's seat. He doesn't even know what to do because the seat is taken by you. But how difficult was that for you to sit there and not be out on the court? It was extremely difficult, mainly just because not many times in my college career have I been in foul trouble, let alone foul out. So like it was just from that perspective. And then on the biggest stage that I've ever played on to be not be able to finish the game, it hurt a lot. But honestly, I just had to just rely on the things I've learned over my five years, like, OK, you've been dealt a bad hand. What are you going to do? Are you going to cry about it? Which I wanted to cry. I did. But are you going to do everything you can to help? And honestly, with the help of like, I remember looking over to my mom and she looked at me like, clapping and like, basically her facial expression was like, help your team, like cheer on your team, like give, like be a good leader. So honestly, after that, I just kind of just did whatever I saw fit in that moment to try to help and the guys really stepped it up. And it was I think that makes the story of that game. That's like one of those small like intricacies of the game that just made it even special for me. But just people that remember that and can talk about that. That's something that I think is going to be remembered more than how many points I scored or, you know, or that's right, anything like that. Yeah, I agree. I think it was a seminal moment in that game. And as hard as it might be for you to sit on the bench and hard for you to hear this, that I think it was the that was the turning point within the game that allowed you guys to stay close and then ultimately win that game. And again, I know that's very difficult. You want to be on the court. I get it. But I think you provided so much more than just scoring and stuff on the court by sitting there and the team believing that they could still go out there and win it because they knew that you believed they could go out there and do it. And that was a big point, you know, in that game. And how many times have you watched that shot, though, from JP? No, be real. Tell me how many times you've watched that shot. Go in. It's probably been more than 500 times. Like that weekend alone, you know, like it was everywhere, you know, everybody was everybody was putting it on Instagram and then in the years following, you know, it's something that's just living on and living on. And in the moment, we knew it was a big deal. But like the fact that it's four years later and March Madden is posted today on this day, like, yes, really something that's still going to live on for years and years and years. And like, that's super cool. So, yeah, the counter of how many times I watched that whole sequence go down. It's a lot. I just love I also have like an angle of my phone of somebody recording it from the from like our fan section. And that's my favorite to watch because you get the they like pan to all the parents and everybody that was like, yeah, our like Furman like section that that's my favorite. They're like, I can see like my mom is like crying. My mom is crying. Parents are just hugging each other. Everybody jumping up and down. Like being able to see that view of it to as this. Yes, etched in the brain for sure. Yes. And I will tell you that that's definitely one of my regrets as far as putting the docu series together is that I wanted to be able to capture a lot of those cell phone footage coverages of that because I knew that it was going to show the raw emotions of everybody in the stance. And just as the process was going to just one of the things that just couldn't get done, unfortunately. But I know that was a special moment to see, you know, from that type of angle. And I wish I could have gotten that in the docu series. But Mike, we can't thank you enough for joining us here on the legends edition of SoCon Fastbreak. We know you got to get some rest. It's late your time. But man, it's an honor. You can join SoCon Fastbreak at any time, especially as we can need to get some breakdowns. Of the teams for next season in the Southern Conference and who you might think will be contenders. But man, can't thank you enough. Yeah, I think you guys are having me. I remember you telling me that you were going to you got you two are going to be doing this this season. I was so excited. I've been watching every episode. Just two guys I know very well and respect very well. And, you know, it's I'll be I'll come on any time, any time you guys. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's all me. And you know, you guys are doing this. Yeah. Hey. And you know, when you're back in Greenville, you come on the radio show too, brother. Any time, man, we'll have you behind the mic. It's for certain. Yeah. It's a blast. Every time I've done it, I tell people like I have so much fun every time I come on your show and just get able to talk sports and just sit there and put the headphones on and talk in front of the mic. I'm like, I feel like I made it, you know? Yeah. Hey, we'll try to figure out some ways to talk about Cleveland sports. But man, you're Browns. Hey, do something, man. Well, story of my life, story of my life, the Browns got to do something. That's the story of my life. Hey, the cat, the cat, the cat might be making a run right now, though. They're playing good basketball. Yeah. I love the James Harden pickup. You know, James Harden is one of my favorite players. It's just being a left handed guy. You know, people say he can't get it done in the playoffs. They said the same thing about Donovan Mitchell. So hopefully those guys are in the facility out there in Independence, like saying, like, come on, we got to put wrong this year. One of us got to get past the second round for once. That's right. Oh, I love it. Mike, thank you enough, my friend. Look forward to connecting with you again real soon. Mike, always a pleasure, man. Thank you. The best. Same here. All right, Darren. Absolutely fantastic. Be able to have Mike on the show again. You talking about the heart of Furman basketball. He's the epitome of a go to guy, a leader, and there's no doubt he's one of the reasons why Furman is in the position they're in right now. Absolutely. I mean, I think you talk about the success of that program has had and the success that they've been able to sustain. Mike Bothwell is at the center of that conversation and is a centerpiece in the building blocks as to what has allowed this program to reach the heights that it has. Just a high character, individual, incredible player on the floor. I mean, as you mentioned, 2,000 point score. He will go down as an all-time great for the Furman Paldons. And look, you can't ask for a better representation of the program. You just can't. I was not an inner board, which is a coach in the year that I had him. Yeah, for certain. And I know he's going to do big things in the professional ranks. And even once he gets into media, I'm telling you, he's going to be a star. Watch out. He might be taking our spot on Saucon Fast Break. So we've got to be careful. That's the problem. That's for certain. Hey, and also all of you, make sure you hit that subscribe button or follow wherever you get your podcasts. But more importantly, on YouTube, hit that subscribe button. We're trying to get our followers and our subscribers to increase. And we know you can do it. Saucon fans, you want more Saucon hoops coverage, just hit that subscribe button. Until next time, may all your jumpers hit nothing but the bottom of the net.