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Everybody's on the edge of their seats here Hannah. The sprinkles were red, white, and blue. And I thought, right, of course. It's almost summer. It is almost the 4th of July. It is almost the 250th birthday of America. So red, white, and blue, which are everywhere anyway, was going to be especially everywhere lately. And then I thought, you know, I really wish that I could ask for regular rainbow sprinkles. But what would that say about me? Probably that you're more red than you are red, white, and blue if you know what I'm saying Hannah. Probably. So today, where for the American obsession, devotion, adoration, deification of the red, white, and blue. Now Nick, hours is not the only flag with these colors. By a long shot. Oh, absolutely. There is France, Norway, the Netherlands. Great Britain, notably. Oh, yeah. Duh. In fact, there are dozens and dozens of countries and territories with red, white, and blue flags. But here, those words in that order are shorthand for America. All right. So just the other day, I took a bus from Portland, Maine, where it was cool and breezy, to Manhattan, New York. And as we're pulling into the city, I look out the window at all the breezy, dressed people gliding around. And I realize, oh no, I forgot to check the weather. So there I am, melting my way down 43rd street. And this effortless creature crosses my path, wearing a dress so perfectly cool and light and chic. And I think to myself, I want that dress. And then I think to myself, wait a minute, I know that dress. And I know where to get it. And that would be Quints. This summer, as in summers past, I am looking to Quints for the light and airy fabrics that will make me look and even feel put together, even as the sidewalk is begging for an egg to be fried. I'm someone who needs a summer uniform, especially for those days when the heat and humidity render me incapable of creative choices. 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That's qince.com slash civics for free shipping and 365 day returns. That's quints.com slash civics. So I wanted to know, everyone's heart be true for the red, white and blue or their nation's equivalent or is it just us? But first, where did it come from? Come from our flag? Like who designed it? Well, we've talked about that a bit before on the show. It likely was not Betsy Ross, despite the way the story goes, but it is possible. It is far more likely it was a guy named Francis Hopkinson who designed flags for the Navy. He is the only one who made a documented claim to it in his lifetime. And there is evidence that he requested payment in the form of a quote quarter cask of the public wine. Only a quarter cask? In exchange for the enduring symbol of American freedom, equality and union? Well, whoever did design it had no idea what the flag would come to mean. And at the time, it really was not that big a deal. How could that possibly be the case? Well, let's get back to where the flag came from. Or maybe a better way of putting it is what the flag was for, because the first American flag was a basic necessity during the Revolutionary War. The Continental Army, who entered armed conflict with the motherland in 1775, needed to distinguish itself from the British Army. Specifically, it needed an ensign that was different from their ensigns. An ensign? Yeah. Like in Star Trek? Like in Star Trek and also in militaries in the real world. Still holding out hope, of course, that Star Trek is the future of the real world. But I digress. Ensign can be the title of a ranking officer in the military, or it can be the name of a flag. Specifically, a flag that identifies a ship as military or civilian. So for the British, they took their existing flag, the Union flag, or the Union Jack, and they shrank it and they stuck it in the canton. The canton, well, I know what that is as a self-described amateur vexillologist, and this is something we've talked about before on Civics 101. It is the upper left-hand corner of a flag. For us, at least today, it is blue with stars. Bingo. So in the British ensigns, the Union Jack was in the canton, and the rest of the space might be blue, it might be red, it might be white with a red cross. And the revolutionaries looked at that and realized they needed something different. States had flags, but the army and congress did not. So we also shrank that Union Jack down for our canton and made the rest of it red and white stripes. And keeping that Union Jack, that was to symbolize loyalty? Like, we're fighting with you and we're different from you, but we're still part of you? Well, historians haven't actually come to a consensus on that point. In 1775, when we first started using it, we hadn't yet declared independence. We hadn't yet blamed King George for our ills. Our beef was with Parliament. Now, one theory is that this was a way for the continental army to, yes, show loyalty to the king. Another is that it was supposed to show resistance to Parliament. Or both. And one way or another, it is nearly identical to the British East India Company flag, which was a self-governing company that managed to take over India while remaining loyal to the king. So it's sort of like we could be our own self-governing entity and maintain Britishness. Yes. And again, who knows if that's what we were trying to say exactly. The symbolism of flags has always been important, but not in the same way it is today. We have to be careful about giving 18th century flags a 21st century interpretation. At that time, flags were almost entirely about military operations. The Continental Congress passed the flag resolution on July 14, 1777. It says, quote, resolved that the flag of the 13 United States be 13 stripes alternate red and white, and that the Union be 13 stars white in a blue field, representing a new constellation. And this was because we had actually become the United States at this point. We had finally blamed the king. We are finally thinking about ourselves as an independent nation. There's a bit of that. There is also a bit of, uh-oh, when we have the Union Jack on our flag, we might accidentally get fired on by our own side. Better switch it up. And we already have the stripe thing going. That's pretty familiar. So let's just change the canton. Anna, was it really that casual? I think it's more like one small detail among many decisions being made about the operations of a burgeoning military with an a tenuous brand new country. And for years to come, these United States flags would be haphazard. There was no standard design, no direction on how many points the stars should have, how the stars should be arranged, how many red versus white stripes. I mean, some of the flags even had blue stripes. Blue? Even though Congress passed an act saying red and white stripes? Also, Anna, if you're going to say this is our flag, why wouldn't you, I don't know, include a picture or a press release of some kind that says, and this is what it looks like? Well, over the course of the revolution, there were a lot of questions about the standard people wanted to know. You know, like, what exactly is the design? Do we have some standard that we can use to base our military flags on? But again, the flag is part utilitarian object, a military tool. Was a flag representative of shared ideals and solidarity, the sort of thing that could remind people, namely soldiers, what they were on about? Totally. Was it this near sacred beacon for all citizenry to fly with pride? Uh-uh. It was far more a way of saying, hey, don't shoot. We're friends, or we're still here, or this is ours now, or this is not a warship. Or watch out, we're going to get you. Sure. But you weren't walking down to the corner store to buy a flag to hang by your front door. The average person is not flying the flag at all. All right. So obviously something changed majorly. What happened? We're going to get to that after the break. I want to cut my energy bill. Can solar panels help? Yes, that's good energy. And they'll help lower my carbon emissions too. That's good energy. And I can get paid for the energy I don't use. Yes, that's good energy. And you have 25 years experience in house engineers and a five star rating on trust pilots. Yes, that's good energy. Sounds great. One more thing, the solar panel's battery is another hardware. It's all quality tech that's built to last. Of course, making solar simpler for your home. That's good energy. Visit goodenergy.co.uk. 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And there is yet another global conflict I missed in grade school. You and me both. Anyway, yes, during the War of 1812, Francis Scott Key wrote the poem that would eventually be excerpted for our national anthem. Now what happened was this. The British Royal Navy bombarded the American Fort McHenry in Baltimore. And when all was said and done, the American flag was still there. Huzzah. And that success was immortalized in poetry. And so the star spangled banner, our national anthem is actually a war poem. It is very much a war poem. And it isn't even called the star spangled banner. It is called the defense of Fort McHenry. The song, our national anthem, leaves out a lot of the war stuff. So Francis Scott Key was documenting the horrors of war and the success of this new country, the land of the free and the home of the brave. Right. And if you think of the line, does that star spangled banner yet wave? He's saying, do we still have the fort? And also, more broadly, will this free and brave country prevail in this war? The flag is the signifier that we are continuing. If it is still there, we are still here. And yes, the tattered Fort McHenry flag was trotted out for special occasions in the decades following the war. It was representative of something far greater than itself. The star spangled banner was revered, make no mistake. But we are trying to figure out when this symbol became something that we all possessed, something that projected our Americanist others, something we revered, something we put on our hats and t-shirts and pillows and mugs and rugs and shorts and bikinis and anything else we can manage to stick it on. So when did that happen? Right? Right. Civil war, my friend. No way. Oh yeah. So that is like a hundred years of the flag, mostly being this military symbol, not something that everyone or anyone else really displayed. And then all of a sudden it's everywhere? Well, in terms of the stars and stripes, the defining moment was the capture of Fort Sumter by the Confederacy. When they took it, they raised a new flag, their flag. Right, the stars and bars. So Hannah, was this the Confederacy purposefully riffing off the stars and stripes? Oh, very much so. And very quickly here, the stars and bars is not the same thing as the Confederate battle flag that many Americans display proudly to this day. The stars and bars has the blue canton with a circle of, as the name suggests, stars and three bars of color, two red and one white. As one newspaper put it, it bore, quote, a sufficient resemblance to the old one to keep an everlasting remembrance, the glorious deeds achieved beneath its fold, unquote. The idea was not to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but to retain an old patriotism while building a new one. So Sumter was captured and then what? Suddenly everyone, or every unionist, I guess, wants to display old glory? Basically, yeah. Flag culture took off very quickly. Flag Day, which we now celebrate on June 14th, was proposed shortly after the capture of Fort Sumter, conceived of as a way to support the Union troops. We were a nation divided, clashing ideals. So on the battlefield, flags signified literally and politically, spiritually, where you stood, where the lines were drawn, as brothers and fathers, sons and friends killed each other for what they believed in. The flags were the objects that told everyone who you were, what you represented, and what represented you. And I guess if you're going to roll out a brand new flag to represent your side, your movement, and I'm talking about the Confederacy here, you're going to want a lot of people to see the stars and bars. Yeah, and there were these local flag-raising ceremonies throughout the South. There were schematics of the design available for people who wanted to copy it. It appeared on newspaper mastheads, on envelopes, on railroad cars, courthouses, hotels. Likewise, in the North, the stars and stripes was displayed on schoolhouses, churches, and even tucked into hats and lapels. Lapels? So people are wearing the thing that used to be reserved for the military and special occasions? That's right. During the Civil War, displaying your flag became fully entwined with patriotism for whatever side you were on. And a lot of historians think of this as the beginning of the American flag as a symbol of devoutness to the only national religion America has itself. It has been referred to by some as a flag cult. Wait, what does that mean? Officially, Nick, we have no religion, right? Though I'm sure many would beg to differ. We have no national religion. We have no king. But people are people, and a lot of the time, they need fervor. They need to worship something. And after the Civil War, after so many had died for an idea and by transference for a flag, and the idea and the flag that won out was the stars and stripes, old glory, its sacredness took hold. Well, Hannah, is it treated as sacred though? Like if we're putting it on beach towels and underwear? Well, I mean, Nick, that's an issue in religious sects around the world. Is it right and pious to create physical representations of something you worship? Is iconography holy? Or is it blasphemy? And in the United States, that truly runs the gamut. There are those who see their Jesus t-shirts or car decals or any number of other objects as a signifier of their devotion. And those who see it as oppositional to real Christian piety. All right, so speaking of the iconography thing, Hannah, when did we start putting the flag on everything? By the first centennial, 1876, photography and lithography had made it possible to stamp the symbol of freedom of persevering ideals on loads of commercial products. It also allowed politicians to stamp the flag on their campaign materials. All right, so the flag became a tool for commercialism and politicking. Just as it is today. Simultaneously, there were those who saw this as an exploitation and desecration of the sacred symbol of the United States. We established flag day in 1877. Flag committees were formed around the country to dictate the proper use of the stars and stripes to learn, by the way, how the Pledge of Allegiance came to be. Check out our episode on that. World Wars one and two certainly catapulted the flag to a new stratosphere of reverence and representation of liberty. And finally, Congress approved a flag code that would tell people exactly how they should and should not treat the flag. To that point, Hannah, the flag code says that the flag must not be used for advertising purposes of any kind whatsoever. So what does that make all those old Navy shirts? Well, the flag code is more guidelines than actual rules. You're always finding a way to sneak it in here. And by that, I mean it doesn't contain much in the way of enforcement. Are the old Navy T-shirts and all of the other flag things illegal? There are those who say technically yes. But without any actual penalty, there's not much you can do. Now, there are state American flag laws as well. In 1907, for example, the Supreme Court upheld a Nebraska law prohibiting desecration of the flag when a businessman was charged for putting an American flag label on a bottle of beer. That said, Nick, if patriotism is one American deity, capitalism is another. The towels and the shoes and the board shorts and the rugs, they're here to stay. All right. So I am wondering if we really are a little bit more flag obsessed than other countries? Like, we clearly have a unique history with it. But are we the only ones who do this, who like print every object we can think of with the stars and stripes? Well, not exactly. The Union Jack is heavily merchandised in Great Britain, though the national devotion there is more intertwined with the royal family, admittedly a complicated and not at all universal devotion. In Denmark, the Danish flag is displayed everywhere, including on Christmas trees. In France, the flag, blue, white, and red continues to serve as a symbol of a successful revolution and of national principles of liberty, equality, and fraternity. But Americans are undeniably among the most fervent flag devotees on earth. All right. Last question here, Anna. We have talked before about the proliferation of different kinds of flags in the United States in recent years, flags that represent or signify movements, opposition, division, flags that say sometimes by way of redesigning the American flag, we are the true representation of America. And the American flag itself has become to some divisive, or at the very least conflicting, because what it means to be a patriot, to be an American, to honor and revere liberty, is incredibly fragmented right now. The flag itself by way of its use, or some might say overuse, in certain spheres has been perceived as politicized, as representing a party instead of a people. So my question is, has this ever happened before? Has the symbol of unity ever been a symbol of division? Now, whether it comforts you or not, it most certainly has. Overwhelmingly for the black American population of the United States, for whom the symbol of unity and of freedom did not represent their reality, whether under enslavement or in the ensuing decades of oppression and violence, the American flag has been conflicting or worse. And it was following the Vietnam War that flag burning was found to be a constitutionally protected form of speech after anti-war protesters burned old glory when, to them, it had become representative of the American government's transgressions. But I think if there were ever a time that the flag was as widely fraught as it is today, it would be the exact same era that made the flag what it became. You mean the Civil War? I do. There was pain, melancholy, longing, disgust, and fury in the South when it came to the stars and stripes. The Union, as they saw it, had been destroyed by, as one historian put it, quote, abolitionist fanatics and their unprincipled despotic president. It doesn't surprise me, Nick, that the Civil War complicated and cemented the American flag as something so much grander than a military tool. When we turned our resistance and weapons against each other, against ourselves, the American flag became a symbol of division, even as it fervently united one half of the nation. But even the Confederacy could let it go, not entirely. If they were going to have a new flag, it was going to honor what the original represented. Or what it had come to represent. Yeah, and I think that even if today Americans are once again looking at one another over that flag, it is hard, to the point of being painful, to ignore the people and victories and defeats and joy and anguish woven into it. I'm not sure we can stop the flag from meaning something more than any one era or body politic or movement or president. For what my two cents is worth, I think we threw that constellation of stars too far up into the heavens. It's more a question of whether we can still see it by the dawn's early light. So that does it for this episode. It was produced by me, Hannah McCarthy with Nick Capodice. Marina Hanky is our producer, Dana Cattaldo is our digital producer, and Rebecca Levoie is our executive producer. Music in this episode comes from Epidemic Sound. We have certainly talked about the American flag before on Civics 101, and we will almost certainly talk about it again. But in the meantime, you can check out our additional episodes on our website, civics101podcast.org, to fill in the gaps in the red, white, and blue. And don't forget to follow us wherever you get your podcasts, so that Civics 101 is always in your feed. Civics 101 is a production of NHPR, New Hampshire Public Radio. Have you ever wondered why Reese Witherspoon founded Hello Sunshine, or where Kevin O'Leary got his start? Or even how Alex Earl became the most accessible founder to someone who may not even consider this space? 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