Nightcap Hour 1: Cade Cunningham & Pistons SNEAK by SHORT-HANDED Thunder + Odds for NBA MVP have TIGHTENED + NBA sends DOCTORS to CHECK Lauri Markkanen

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It's good to be right. Good evening ladies and gentlemen and thank you for joining us for another episode of Nightcap. Y'all know who I am. I'm your favorite Unc and there's my partner and co-host Liberty City's own Bengals Ring of Fame honoree, a former pro bowler and an all pro. That is Chad Ochocinco Johnson And the third member of the Big Three joins us two nights a week, Monday and Wednesday, University of Arkansas alum, Little Rock, Arkansas native, a seven-time NBA All-Star, and he was recently nominated for the Basketball Hall of Fame. Here he is, ISO Joe Johnson. Joe, what do you do? Man, what's happening? What's happening, fellas? We good. What's happening? Please make sure you hit that subscribe button. Please make sure you hit the like button. And do us a favor. Go subscribe to the Nightcap Podcast feed wherever you get your podcasts from. We would personally like to thank each and every one of you, as always, for your eyes, ears, and your word of mouth. Thank you for making Nightcap what it's become. And because of you, we shall continue to grow. So again, thank you for your support and your continued support. Those looking to purchase a bottle of shade by LaPortier, head over to LaPortierCognac.com if it's unavailable in a state or city near you. It is a premium VSOP cognac, the best tasting, smoothest VSOP cognac on the market. Remember, it's two sizes, the OG, which is the 750. and now we have the junior, which is the 375. The same great quality, the same great taste, the same smoothness. But I implore you to guess what? Try it and compare it against other brands, and you'll see our cognac is the best. Please drink responsibly and stay safe. Guys, the Pistons beat the shorthanded Thunder by the score of 124-116. Jalen Durin had 29 points, 15 rebounds. Cade Cunningham, 29 points, 13 assists. The Thunder started a game without five of their six starters. Shea Gilgis nursing an abdomen injury. Isaiah Hardenstein with a calf. Chet with a back. A.J. Mitchell with an abdomen. And Jalen Williams with a hamstring. The only one of the six starters was Isaiah Joe. And he left at halftime because of a bruised hip. The Thunder's a good team because when you can start a game without five of your six starters, Joe, and that's the best team in the Eastern Conference, and you take them all the way down to the wire, that lets you know they are a very good team. and it doesn't matter who's on the floor, they're going to compete. Joe, what did you like about what you saw? Because it seemed like they bounced back. Cade was 11 of 16, 3 of 5 from 3. Jalen Durbin, 12 of 17, 5 of 7 from the free throw line. They shot 54%, unlike the 38% that they shot the other day. Got on the boards there, very good rebounding team. 59 rebounds for them, only 37 for the OKC Thunder. So, Joe, watching this game, what did you like about what you saw from the Pistons? Oh, man. I thought the Pistons, they got off to a slow start, Uncle Ocho. But for the most part, when we talk about Cade Cunningham and his MVP status, he has to play like this, Uncle Ocho. You know what I mean? 11 for 16 from the field. You know, he's efficient, 13 assists. He's getting other guys involved. It's a recipe for them to win if he's playing at a high level like this. And for OKC, it's plug and play, bro. It don't matter. Whoever plays, gonna come out there, they're gonna give you their work. And these are the hardest teams to play against because, Uncle Ocho, you really don't know who the real game plan is for. You know, they got so many guys. If you look at it, they got so many guys who got off tonight. McCain had 20. Big J-Dub, he had 30. Wiggins had 20. Kaysom Wallace had 23. It's just so many guys they can beat you with, man. They fearless. They play hard. They compete at the highest level. So it don't matter who out there on the court for them, man. You're going to get their best game for sure. Look, when you look at the Pistons, if you tell me Kay Cunningham, and I'm saying, you know, if he's going to be somewhat efficient, they're unbeatable if he plays like this. Ain't nobody in the Eastern Conference beating them. If he's going to be this efficient, shooting over 50% from the floor, they're not losing. They are not losing. And you get, like I said, Derren is going to give you what he gives you. He's going to give you somewhere 16 to 20 on a given night. probably double-digit rebound somewhere between 10 and 15 rebounds tonight. Tonight he gave you 29 and 15. But if Cade Cunningham plays like this, they're virtually unbeatable. Yeah, it's going to be hard, fellas. I mean, he's got to put Durin in those positions to be successful as well by getting in the teeth of the defense, making the game easy for everybody around him, you know, Ocho. You need more from Harris, man. Damn, what are we going to get from the guys here? Come on, man. Come on. You already know. He can't do too much of your witness protection. You can't blow his cover, Joe. Uh, uh, uh. Look, he played 23 minutes. I need more than five attempts, bro. Like, four points, that ain't gonna get it. Not, cause they short-handed. Yeah. They short-handed. They don't have their emotional leader, which is Big Stewart. And you can tell he's missing, man. They, you know, I thought, don't get me wrong, I know OKC got some guys who can go off the bounce, but I think defensively, they've kind of slacked a little bit. Hey, Joe and Unc, isn't there a pecking order when it comes to – think about the situation, right? Excuse me if I'm wrong. Correct me, actually, if I'm wrong. Think about Kaminga when he was with the Warriors, right? And him wanting to be the focal – not the focal point, obviously wanting to put up just as many shots as Steph or wanting the offense to kind of run through him. You think Tobias Harris sees it that way and he's kind of gun-shy, not wanting to shoot as many shots? Nah. Making sure Cunningham is the one that does all the work? Nah. All the hip lifting? Nah, Ocho, he just got to assert himself. He has to be a little more assertive out there on the court. They're show-handed, man. They got two guys who really lead them, but they gonna need a third guy who can consistently step up and make plays, give them some points, anywhere from 12 to 18 points a night. They gonna need that from him, man. Four points. Yeah. Joe, you understand what I'm talking about, how Kaminga wanted to assert himself a little bit more offensively with the Warriors, but it's sort of a pecking order on being able to have that green light just to shoot at will. But they don't really have any other than Cade. That's really the only guy that they have like that. They running Duncan Robinson and Herter off picks to try to get through. Right, right. Yeah. To try to face the floor. But when you look at Tobias Harris, Joe, as you mentioned tonight, I mean, look at guys that coming off the bench play 17 minutes, got up seven shots. Ronald Holland. Now he normally comes in and he's going to get points up. He's going to get points up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was four of nine. You get Karis LeVert play 17 minutes. He's three of six. And I agree with you, Joe. He needs to be a little bit more aggressive, but I'm resigned to the fact this is what he is. Because I think the thing is, the biggest mistake that we can make is continually expect something when he's already shown us what he is. He's not changing. Joe, he's made $400 million and I ain't going to count his pockets, but he's made $400 million and never been an all-star in all-NBA selection. So we can't... Whoa, whoa, whoa. Bring that back. Time is everything. Timing is everything. Exactly. It's all about timing. A restaurant is all about location. In pro sports, it's all about timing, timing, timing. Yeah. Hey, he happened to be – the NBA was taken off, and they had to give max contract. Yeah. But when you look at his play, like I said, a lot happened in Philly, and you looked at – because Ben Simmons was low-hanging fruit. So he was just easy to reach up there and pick. But Tobias Harris was a max contract guy too. And when Tobias Harris didn't show up, which was Austin, they blamed Ben Simmons. Well, Ben Simmons is the all-NBA guy. He's the all-Defensive guy. He's the rookie of the year. But the guy's on a max contract. I should expect him, as Joe say, to give me 12 to 16 on a given night. I don't think that's asking too much. Nah. What I'm saying is, fellas, I mean, with five attempts, you know, I think he can get up more than that. I mean, like you say, Unc, I know Hollins, he come off the bench. Oh, yeah, he's ready to get right to it. I think Tobias, he has opportunities where he can be aggressive. He just don't. I think he got to step that up a little bit, man, for the Pistons to make this late surge. Because when you look at it, Joe, I mean, Cade only got up 16 shots. Joe, you remember the other night? He was, what, 5 or 20? And when he was at the Knicks, he got up 34 shots. So he only got up less than half the shots that he put up two, three games ago. He got up far less shots than what he put up the other night. But when he's this efficient, they're going to be virtually damn impossible to beat, especially coming out of the East. If he's going to play like this, Durin going to play like that? Now, I'm expecting a hurt to, you know, he's working his way back in. He only played eight minutes, Joe, and only got up one shot, and it was a three-point shot. But we know the Red Rifle can get it going. When he can get cooking, he and Duncan Robinson are going to be running off a lot of picks. And they got Stewart and they got Dern and they got guys that can set picks for him. But Cade Cunningham, he's the engine. And when he's playing like this, when he's making shots, getting into the teeth of the defense and dropping the ball up to Dern, and he's getting dunks and layups. Yeah. Yeah, they got a nice squad, man. Nice young squad, too. Because they got some guys capable to come off that bench. I don't know who can really get to it. I thought Reed, he's been playing well. Yeah. You got Laverte to come in. He'll get some great minutes. Remember he was at Brooklyn before Kyrie and KD was hurt? And he was dropping 30, 40, and had a 50-point game. So, yeah, he's instant offense now. Yeah, yeah, they got some guys capable of helping them advance. But, you know, I just want to see a little more of it. I thought they – I just thought, you know, obviously OKC going to compete. I just thought they should have had their way with him, me personally. I mean, you ain't got no check, no J-Will. no Shea I know a lot of times them are hard games to play but you gotta get them guys up out of there early the longer you leave a team like this around Joe the more difficult it is to beat them because they gonna start ain't nobody expect them to win anyway so the longer you leave Ocho you know how it is you got a team you have a team that oh we better than this team we should beat them and here you are you look up in the fourth quarter and they're still hanging around. Now you got hell on your hands because they believe you that they can beat you. You didn't put them away in the first quarter, this first half. You didn't put them away in the third quarter. Now here we are with eight, ten minutes in the ballgame and it's a nip-tuck ballgame. It's three-point win, lead one way or another. Now you got hell on your hands the rest of the game. And that's what, you know, OKC Thunder, but this tells me more. This tells me more about OKC than the Pistons. This tells me that they are a deep team. They play for one another and they're a very well coached team because ain't no way you're supposed to be without five of your six starters. And we know two of those guys are all NBA selections and one guy was the MVP last year. And you play them right down to the wire? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Plug and play, fellas. Them guys compete. They compete. Hey, Joe and Uncle, I know we're at the halfway point, but obviously out of the East, I'm assuming both of you have said that if Cade Cunningham plays the way he's playing right now and he's as efficient as he was tonight, you see them coming out the East? Yeah, hell yeah. I do. Yeah. Well, hold on, hold on. Wait a minute, wait a minute. We forgetting about Boston and how Boston is playing. So we just forgetting Boston now. No, I forgot Boston. But for me personally, I don't know what you think, Joe, but with Cade Cunningham and Durin playing like this here, it looks like, look, anything can happen to last. what they got 22, 25 games left Joe. So anything can happen, I think they got a six game lead. So you don know but it looks like they gonna be the number one seed I just don see a situation where Boston Now look the way JB is playing but if you make me bet some money that means something to you to me and if it's my money it means something to you, to me, I'm putting my money on Detroit. Okay. Hey, look, me too. And on another note, Ocho, both of these teams have 14 losses coming into today's game. That's why I say if you Detroit, man, I'm going to get these people up out of here so we can, you know what I mean, so we can continue on our way because we want home court advantage throughout the entire playoffs. You don't just want it throughout the Eastern Conference. You want it throughout the entire playoffs. That's going to make a huge difference. Yeah. And you saw it play out. I mean, they had the home court against the Nuggets, and they won game seven. They had home court against Indiana, and they won game seven. Now, obviously, Halliburton got hurt. It would have been very interesting to see how the game plays out. had he been able to play the entirety of the ball game. But it happened what had happened. Just looking up at what you call him, Ocho. He's made cash earning. He probably made over $300 million at the end of 24-25 season. And I think he has a two-year deal for about $52 million, Tobias Harris. Oh, my God. They got to pay somebody. But I think the thing is, when you go back to the Thunder, Joe, I don't think they're expecting Jalen Weaves to drop 30 on him. Nah, they didn't. Because he can shoot the three now for a big guy. I mean, you don't expect him. But that's what he'll hover around the three-point line because I've watched him play against the Lakers numerous times and hit five, six threes on him. Yeah, he's an Arkansas kid. He a Razorback. Oh, Joe? Oh, yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah. plug and play. Look, he ain't got no he ain't looking over his shoulder. He know he gonna get all the minutes tonight. The man played 35 minutes. He normally get like 15, 20. Yeah, he can play. He can play and I think what helps is you see he was 5 for 10 from the 3. He can shoot the 3 and he can put on the floor and make some plays. So, he a great piece, man, to that championship team. These dudes ain't stiff just playing behind Check, Hungry and J-Dub. You know, these dudes can play. He knows his minutes. Look, Hartenstein and Chet going to get the line share of the minutes. Now, as long as they don't get in foul trouble, now Hartenstein has a propensity to getting in foul trouble. So he might get a few more minutes. But tonight, he knew he was going to play in excess of 30 minutes. So now, my mind is already fixing it. I already know I'm going to get me 30 tonight, Joe. I'm getting 30 minutes. Hey, look, you know for sure you're going to get them attempts. You're like, if I make a couple now, somebody in trouble. Yeah. Somebody got to get him. They got up 96 shot attempts. So it wasn't nobody bash with Joe. Listen, that's a center. He shot five for 10 from three. That's your center shooting 10 threes. Damn. You know what I mean? That says a lot. Okay, Ojo. And also even 7-7 from the free throw line. So y'all know he had 14 shot attempts, but that tells me he was able to put the ball on the floor and get some fouls because he was 7-7. Then he was 20 or 21 from the free throw line. this is a good team but I think the thing is in order for them to go far I agree with you Joe they're going to have to have that third option to give them consistent look it doesn't have to be Tobias but they need a third option somebody that can consistently give them 16 to 20 points now whether it comes from Tobias whether it comes from Duncan Robinson or Sue Thompson I don't Ronald Holland I don't care who it comes from I know my two big guns are going to give me what they My all-stars, I'd write them down. My all-stars going to give me somewhere. They give me 45, 55. They're going to probably, K is going to give me somewhere about like 9 to 12 assists. Between the two, they'll give me maybe 18 to 20 rebounds. I done wrote that down. Right. As long as they give me those, as long as everybody else do what they're supposed to do, we're going to be great. I mean, hey, listen, it's easy for us to say it, but listen, in needing those people, in needing those players, to show up when it matters most in the playoffs for them to actually have a chance. If they haven't done it at any point during the season on a consistent basis, the chance of it happening when the games matter more, it ain't going to happen. No, I think – But they got here, Ocho. I mean, like Joe said, they're 43-14. And I know we got the two guys and we – look, that's the way it works on a team. You're going to talk about your two best players more so than anything. Right, right. Just like J-Dub and Shea gets all the credit. People don't really – Chet. Chet was an all-star. J-Dub was an all-star last year. Chet is an all-star this year. They got guys, Lou Dort, Isaiah Joe, Wiggins, Wallace. They got guys. Oh, we ain't mentioned Caruso, the Caruso. He's a three-and-a guy. He can knock down shots. Put it on the floor. He can defend at a high level. All these guys can defend at an extremely high level. Yeah. Yeah, all of them. And they play extended defense. That's why they pick you up 94 feet to weigh you down. And when that fourth quarter get here, Ocho, that's when we're going to pull it. We're going to pull it when that fourth quarter get here. And that's how they be winning, bro. That's how they be winning. But Detroit is pretty much the same way. They picked up – they kind of mimicked that same model as far as extended defense, weighing you down. And Cade and Duren got to be special, bro. They got to be special every night, Ocho. Joe, you look at the Thunder. They got McCain now. Remember how the kind of start he got off last year in his rookie season? Yeah. He became a kid when they got Edgum. So now all of a sudden they don't need him. But he was – And so now you got another guy that can give you 20. Because I don't know if people remember, he was doing tremendous. Before he got hurt last year, he was doing an outstanding job. So now you got another guy that can give you 20 in a spot. Yeah. Yeah, they got some guys over there, Uncle Ocho, who can get to it now. Oh, yeah. I wonder how bad Shea is injured or how much longer he's going to be out. Well, he can only win six more games. creativity, knowledge, and passion will all be on full display. And the winner of the iHeart Podcast Award is... See all the nominees now at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app, Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. I'm Daniel Jeremiah. And I'm Greg Rosenthal. And this is 40s and free agents. The games may be over, but the NFL never stops. This is my favorite part of the calendar. Yeah, mine too, Greg. Free agency, the combine, the NFL draft, pro days, trades. This is where teams reshape their future. This is where Daniel Jeremiah makes his money. On 40s and free agents, we break down every move that actually matters. From my draft evaluations, mock drafts, and team fits. To my top 101 free agents and how real rosters are built, cap space, contracts, and all the tough decisions included. You got quarterbacks on the move. We got teams rebuilding. It's hope season. Yeah, absolutely. It's hope season. We'll tell you what's real, what's noise, and what it means for your favorite team. Smart analysis, real conversations every week. I don't know about the smart, but definitely analysis. Listen to 40s and free agents on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Ready for a different take on Formula One? Look no further than No Grip, a new podcast tackling the culture of motor racing's most coveted series. 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Every week, we're breaking down the unique world of men's health, from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility, and things that happen in the bedroom. You mean sleep? Yeah, something like that, Jordan. We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about. It's going to be fun, whether you're 27, 97, or somewhere in between. Men's Health is about more than six packs and supplements. It's about energy, confidence, and connection. We don't just want you to live longer. We want you to live better. So check out the mailroom on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows. Okay, let's go ahead and get into that right now. Speaking of injuries, the NBA regular season MVP has tightened in recent weeks with the two top betting favorites, SGA and Nikola Jokic, at risk of not qualifying for the award because of the NBA rule. Tonight was SGA's 11th missed game of the season. So he'll need to play at least 16 of the remaining 22 games this season to be eligible for the second consecutive MVP award. Jokic has already missed 16 games this season. He will be ineligible if he sits out two more games. That's why the race is tightening up because Jokic can only miss two games and SGA need to play 16 of the last 22. So now you see Cade Cunningham, he's rising. You see JB, he's rising. Because now your two favorites might not be in the situation. Lucas is hovering around. We'll see how they finish. They're going to probably need to finish in the top four in order to get some serious consideration. Go ahead, Joe. What you thinking? I think I don't got Jokic missing no more games. He going to be eligible. Yoke leading the league in rebound and assist. He's second in – well, I think Cade was leading. But I think Cade is leading for the simple fact Yoke hasn't played enough games yet. But with that withstanding, so he's what? Seventh or eighth in scoring? Ninth in scoring? First in rebound and second in assist? Yeah. Man. He got another MVP coming this year? Or they going to give it to Cade? I think it's going to determine – These last some odd – 20-something games? Yeah, yeah. It's going to determine a lot, I think, as far as, like, the MVP race. Obviously, we're going to see who's going to be able to finish, who's going to be in line to even compete for it. Right. But it's going to come down – it's going to probably come down to, like, the last week. I'm going to be honest with y'all, man. These dudes playing some ball. And I'm ready to see Shea get back, but I've been watching Jokic. I mean – He ridiculous. He's still putting it down. He ridiculous, man. It can't be a numbers because you're going to lose a numbers battle to him because his numbers are going to be so exemplary. Yeah. I mean, he's at what? I think he has 21, 22 triple doubles this season. He just passed Oscar Robinson. When it's all said and done, in the next two, three years, he'll pass Russ. Oh, man. I mean, like I said. The game comes so easy to him. It does, Joe. and it's not like it's a lot of strain on his body. He doesn't play above the rim. He got a freak injury, which is somebody fell into him and hyperextended his knee. But when you look at the numbers that he's, I mean, man, he ain't supposed to be doing this. And he makes it look so easy. Did you see the shot he just hit tonight? A one leg step out of bounds? Yeah. And people are like, oh, that's not. Y'all better go back and watch him when he played the Lakers in the playoffs and see how many times he hit that one leg AD. Hit it on AD several times. Hit it on bronze several times. That's his shot. Hey, I'm on here looking. K averaging 9.8 assists. Jokic averaging like 10.5, something like that. But had he played enough games to qualify? Oh, you're saying he ain't played enough games to qualify. If he played enough games, yeah, he's averaging a triple-double, Joe, again. so that's why I'm saying you can't you can't you're gonna lose a numbers game to him right because you're looking at what is the average 25 25 what 25 12 and 10 25 yeah yeah yeah he's disgusting out there bro what what what hell at that rate at that pace shit they basically might well give him the MVP now it's only 20 some games ago he's averaging basically 30 13 and 11. Yeah, Joe. We might as well get to him that, Joe. I'm saying where they going to finish up at because winning is going to, honestly, he's going to probably be in the top five or six. Right. But if you got Cade and them finishing, they got the best record throughout the entire league. Right. A lot of it's going to swing his way. Okay. Based on the record. Yeah. Because a lot of times they look at best player on the best team. Who's the best player on the best team? Last year, with Shea. They had the best record and they were clear. They were, what, 10, 12 games clear of anybody in either conference. Yeah. But he's going to be, for the next three to four years, he's not falling out of the top three, as far as top three, four, as far as MVP. He's going to be on the street like LeBron. Every year LeBron either won it, he was second or third. One, one, second, second, second, third, fourth, third, third second second That how Yoki going to be He just that good And now he has Murray Murray the playoff Murray has showed up in the regular season Yeah. Because we know what that duo does in the postseason. That pick and roll is committed. I like the Watson kid too. Okay, Ocho, they got over that, what is it, Pat? Yeah, yeah, he hurt right now, Joe. Yeah, he's hurt. He was getting money over there. about it. He's hurt and they've been out without Aaron going for a while, like a month. Oh, yeah. He should be. What's wrong with AG? Is it hamstring? Yeah. Hamstring. You know that hamstring. That's something you do not want to play with. Nope. We. No, sir. But they're going to be in the hunt, though. They get health at the right time. You know, everything about basketball is you want to be clicking going into, obviously, you know, the March and April, you want to be playing good basketball, man, going to the playoffs. Yeah. Yeah. Look, I get it, Joe. I understand why they implemented the rules because you got these streaming services and everybody paying max dollars, and it's a very important game, and the best player, they sitting out two, three players. They said, no, no, no, no. Okay, y'all want to load manage your ass out of an NBA, all-NBA selection, an all defensive selection and an MVP or a sixth man of the year. You're going to load manage yourself out of that. Now all of a sudden they're trying to sling and snot because, oh, man, that everybody would, okay, play. Play. Yeah, yeah. Because you got guys, Uncle Ocho, who will play a couple games, get their average up real high. Next thing you know, they sitting out the next two, three games. Well, look, you ain't never going to be 100% throughout the whole season. Everybody going to have knickknacks. Everybody going to be a little banged up. It's just throughout the duration of a season, six to eight months, bro. Like every other day, you know what I mean? Like it just adds up. So it's wearing a tear on the body. But, yeah, man, they made it to where you really got to go out there and compete for what you want. Yeah. I like it. And you're right, Joe. I mean, and I think you see that a lot more in baseball, especially with guys with a batting average. I don't want my – I'm a couple of points in front of somebody, and I don't want to go over and drop my batting average if somebody passes. Yeah. So, yeah. Because that's what you used to have. Hey, look. You got a car. I think in the 20s and 30s, if you won the batting title, you got a car. Yeah. When you guys got the lead, like, well, I'm good. I don't got to be enough games here. Yeah. You know, back there the car probably cost like maybe $1,500 on Joe, but that was a lot of money back in the 20s at $3,500. Yeah. Hey, listen. Boy, it'd be a time if we get it like that again. If you get it like that again, you ain't going to be making the money. You ain't going to be making the money. There's a reason why prices, wages went up so much because prices went up. I mean, a home. A home cost you $30,000. you ain't getting no you can't even be a down payment on the house for 30 grand hell i'll be i'll be my grandfather bought a brand new i think caprice classic back in 73 74 that was like 2900 3000 yeah big 454 big boy so uh nah um but i but i agree i i think the thing is it's gonna lie to five to the guys and get guys like, you know what? This load, man. And plus, man, Joe, you making 60, 70 million? And you mean to tell me you be sitting out? Especially on national television. You can't sit out no game that's a Saturday or a Sunday. Man. Joe, everybody sitting around watching. Hey, what if players are really hurt, though? What if something's really wrong and they really need to take that time off? Well, you can't say that Saturday and Sunday and then play on Monday. Well, I can't play back-to-back. Huh? Yeah. You want the season to go year-round? Because the only way that you're going to be able to get a lot of 82 games in is that if you have to have some back-to-backs. What you have, Joe, about seven, eight back-to-backs in the season? Probably a little more than that. But, yeah. Yeah. Man, listen, it was one year. Okay, Ocho, we had to play – you had to play three games in three nights, back-to-back-to-back. Yeah. Look, we played a back-to-back-to-back. We played three games, three nights, and then last night we went in three overtimes. Oh, man. Got us a couple days off, though. But, you know, sometimes, Joe, they play back-to-back. They stay in the same city. They play the same team. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's easy. Okay, okay. You know, but back then they didn't do that. You play back-to-back. You might play Atlanta. that you had to go down to Orlando or you had to go to Miami and play. But now sometimes they'll play a back-to-back, and you play that same team back-to-back. Yeah, yeah, they've been doing it now. Oh, Joe, I thought you meant y'all played back-to-back but had to fly at different places. Yeah, they did. Yeah, we did. We had to play three different teams, three different cities, yeah. I mean, it wasn't no East Coast to West Coast or West Coast to East Coast, nothing like that. No, no, they probably were in range. Not with a back-to-back, Joe. They got to have it on the East Coast. So you might play Brooklyn. You might play the Knicks, Brooklyn, and Toronto. Something like that. Okay, that's not bad. That's not bad. Yeah, that's not bad. Okay, okay. Or you play Atlanta, Orlando, Miami. Right. So, you know, keep it close. No, they're not finna send you to Atlanta, and then you got to go to Portland, and then you got to play. The ways of the, yeah. And then you got to play Phoenix or Houston or Dallas. They're not going to do it like that. But, boy, it's rough. They'll give you San Antonio. They'll give you Dallas. They'll give you Houston. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of, the NBA is sending their own independent doctors to verify Laurie Markin's MRI from an injury and to practice today per NBA porter Tony Jones. Joe, is this what it's come to? Yeah, because the NBA say, man, we ain't going. We ain't going. Matter of fact, we've been sending our doctors down there to see what's going on with these dudes because this tank of stuff, man, they got out of hand, and I think that's what the NBA think. That's why they say we're sending our own doctors down there to check on Lloyd Markham and see what's going on. Yeah, this is what it comes to. But the thing is, Joe, you know your body. I mean, the doctors say you seen five, but no. My ass hurt. So what do we do? What do we do, Joe? I mean, most guys, I mean, a lot of times if it's something serious, they go get a second opinion. They don't never take the guy's first opinion. I mean, you got something going on, Joe. I don't know if you missed any time during the season. But if somebody said, well, Joe, you got this, you're like, you know what? Let me go grab that second opinion. Yeah. Yeah, you go get a second opinion for sure. I guess this may be the second opinion. I don't know, but the NBA say they want to know. Hey, they starting to investigate a lot more, man. It's been a lot going on. You see they just shut Jaron Jackson down. He had to have surgery. He hasn't said he has a surgery for some. Joe, you mean to tell me you're going to trade all that, give up all those picks for a guy that you got to have surgery? What they do that at? Think about what they gave up to get him. And now you get a guy who played a couple of games. Now he played a couple of games going off, and then the fourth quarter you sent him. Lauren Barkley was going off, sent him in the fourth quarter. NBA said, man, y'all full of caca. That's why they sent them people down there. Yeah, we ain't trying to hear all that. Yeah, yeah, we gonna be able to determine this here. Hey. Yeah. And you see the NBA say, you know what? Ain't no more lottery protected. Y'all want to take? You do the game with the picks? Let somebody, land them top three picks. Somebody got it. Because you know how to joke, top three protected, top five protected. NBA say, hell no. Ain't nothing protected. Listen, because I think Utah can still, I think they can get the number one. If they can. And I believe if they get the number one pick, they're taking the bonzer. That's what I think. I think for whatever strange reason, I feel like he's going to stay in Utah. Yeah. I don't know why. So, I get it. I mean, I think the thing is that when you play, and it's like they're playing too many games. Well, damn. Okay. Too many. I'm sure the NBA won't have a problem cutting the game, but they want to cut that pay too. So because the thing that the players want, Ocho, is that they want less games, but we still want to make 70, 80 million dollars. It may say, oh no, here you go. Yeah. Yeah, I don't think we need less games, man. It's been like this since... As long as I can remember. 70s. As long as I can remember. And I've been a lot longer than both of you, so as long as I can remember, Joe, they played 82 games. Hey, listen, them dudes playing in Chuck Taylors and Converse out there. have technology. Shell toes. They didn't have the, like Joe said, the shoe technology, the eating technology, the training technology, the medical equipment technology, the doctors, everything is so much more advanced. So can you imagine? And if you look at track and field, Loto, when these guys were running these fast times with just regular shoes. Yeah. Just imagine if they had those carbon fiber shoes and they had these Mondo tracks like they got right now. Man, you say both by the man 9-3. Yeah. Ain't no telling how far Jonathan Neville would have jumped. He jumped 60 and a half feet. Bob Beeman when he went 29, 2 and a half of the altitude in Mexico City. Man, they have no technology like they got now. And I'm not saying athletes. But when you combine athletes getting better and technology right alongside it, you got the perfect storm. Yes, sir. Hey look I kept me a fresh pair of orthotics In my shoes What? A pair of who? Orthotics You ain't had that old Joe? Nah yeah I had them Hey Joe I had obviously I was a Reebok During that time I had them take all the lining out my shoe I had no support Why is that? Because I need to feel the floor you know what I mean Joe you ever had on a track spike or like a waffle shoe that's what I wanted my cleats to feel like I need to feel the floor every time I step and touch and when it's time for me to break down I don't want no support I don't want nothing restricting my ankle damn I gotta feel the floor I don't know it's weird I got taped directly to my skin my bad hell nah I look at these guys right now I look at the Montee Adams. That man out there playing with no, he played out there with footage and no tape. I say, what? Yeah, same, same. Listen. The only time I put on tape, Joe, it was more for like fashion. It wasn't for my ankles and done. It was just laid on there. Cause I wanted to make sure everything was able to roll and be real smooth. It was weird. Oh Joe, I had to have some tape. Yeah! I had to be taped. I had that pre-rap jumping. Nah. You can't feel nothing, Joe. I need to be secure. Boy, my ankle bone be on the ground. Babe. Oh, nah. Ocho, you gotta understand, I was a hard planner. I'm talking about, I'm not like you, Ocho, under 200. That's 230, getting moving and having to stop on a dime? Oh, no. Right, right, right, right, right. I forgot, Ocho, a little dude, he wouldn't understand. No, Joe, Joe, don't do that, Joe. I had a little size of him when I was playing. Hey, Joe, if you take my cleat, right? If you take my cleat, you get bended like this. Oh, no. Oh, no. You can fold it. But it felt just like a track shoe. I just had a cleat bottom on the bottom. Nope. Oh, man. Man, Joe, I had mold skin, you know, one of those strips that you put up there like that? And then I had the mold skin taped around directly to my skin. That's what I had. Hey, listen. I needed mine to feel secure, Ocho. Hell yeah. I'm telling you. Man, listen, I ain't play, boy. I used to get heavy tape. I didn't get it like that for practice, now Ocho. You know I just go out there with pre-wrap and regular tape. Right. When it came down the way in, I go out there for warmups with the regular, like practice tape. Soon as I come back in there, I take that off. All right, let's get it. Yeah. Yeah, I don't understand how people wear ankle braces on. They tape up their shoe, then they put on the ankle brace, then they put their shoe on. That's Lyman do that. Everything is restricted. I'm like, what are you doing? It made no sense to me. It made people comfortable. I say Lyman tape up all that stuff. Because you know them Lyman, they have on high tops. But they have rubber-bottom shoes on. They don't do studs. Most linemen don't do studs. Right. I played with Zim. He's the only offensive lineman I've ever seen wear low tops. For real? I've never seen an offensive lineman. Hey, it is never. In no span. Is it mandatory to wear knee braces if you're a lineman? In college? Most guys, if you wear a knee brace, you've had a knee injury. Like you look at Brady, Tom Brady, I'll be scuba, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, John played his career John never had an ACL he tore his ACL in high school and they removed it so he didn't have an ACL at all damn when I first got there he didn't use to practice with a brace no as a matter of fact he really didn't he didn't practice with a brace he only played in the brace but he practiced without it but most of the time Joe if somebody's had especially linemen offensive linemen they'll continue to wear it quarterbacks will wear it Tom Brady, once he tore his knee, I don't think Brady ever took the knee brace off. Peyton, you know, guys like that, yeah. I mean, I could imagine a skilled position player playing with a big old Dunn Joy on. Nah, I couldn't. But I noticed a lot of them linemen dudes. I know they be, because they always getting rolled up on. Yeah, exactly. I think in college it might be mandatory. Most college teams have all their offensive linemen wearing knee braces because of that what you said, Joe, they get rolled up on. But nah Nah But no I don know how y do it I be looking at them guys in amazement with no tape I like man that must be real I do too I could do it though too. And in football, hey, I be thinking the same thing because in football, especially the way they be tackling them receivers, the ones who be out there with them little no-show socks on, I be like, man, how this dude, it's like every play, it's almost a career in them play. man, especially because the hip drop. That's what got me, Ocho, taping my ankles like that because guys were hip dropping you. Yeah. And see, right then, they didn't call it a high ankle sprain. They just called it an ankle sprain. And so you're like, man, this thing taking forever to heel. This ain't no typical ankle sprain. And I never rolled my ankle like most people rolled an ankle over the top, rolled it like that. I probated in. I rolled mine in because I got dragged down from behind don't you like that there I know that passion will all be on full display. And the winner of the iHeart Podcast Award is... See all the nominees now at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app, Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. I'm Daniel Jeremiah. And I'm Greg Rosenthal. And this is 40s and free agents. The games may be over, but the NFL never stops. This is my favorite part of the calendar. Yeah, mine too, Greg. Free agency, the combine, the NFL draft, pro days, trades. This is where teams reshape their future. This is where Daniel Jeremiah makes his money. On 40s and free agents, we break down every move that actually matters. From my draft evaluations, mock drafts, and team fits. 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We have one man who, upon hearing that he was going to be fired, freaked out, and apparently climbed out the window of the bathroom. And was Daniel Ricciardo's illustrious F1 career a success story, a cautionary tale, or some combination of both? He started getting all this attention, and he maybe started to think, I'm bigger than this, I'm better. And plenty of other mishaps, scandals, and sagas that have made Formula One a delightful, decadent dumpster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to No Grip starting March 4th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. and switchbone. Well, that's true. Every week, we're breaking down the unique world of men's health, from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility, and things that happen in the bedroom. You mean sleep? Yeah, something like that, Jordan. We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about. It's going to be fun, whether you're 27, 97, or somewhere in between. Men's Health is about more than six packs and supplements it's about energy confidence and connection we don't just want you to live longer we want you to live better so check out the mailroom on the iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your favorite shows well that must have been real nice to be able to run no tape ocho huh that must have been real nice um hey and that you know what honestly for For me to be able to do that, playing at that level, as quick and as fast as I was, it all had to do when I was little, running around with no shoes on. I could not play throw-up tackle in the street. You know, when you play freeze, you're in a car coming. I always either had on socks or I had on no shoes. So I needed to be able to feel the floor even once I made it. It's weird. But you played in molded bottles. You didn't play in studs though, did you? Oh yeah, Moldy, I don't play no studs. Even when we played the Steelers, even when we played the Steelers, remember how the Steelers purposely had that bad feel for as an advantage to them? I still wore, I still was- You still roll Moldy by them? Yeah, still wear Moldy. I never slip, never slip. I'm always over, what's the word I'm looking for? I was always over my- Oh yeah, on the ball in your feet. Yeah, always. And I never, yeah, I never extended. I never extended. Or play, oh you're playing on your inside foot and slip like, bro, you know it's wet out here. You trying to play it like you trying to speed cut like it's dry. Mm-hmm, yeah. Man, drop your hips and get up, put that weight on. The guy start skating, put the back of the foot down, Ocho. That's it, man. But my first, I think my first like 10 years, Ocho, I wore molded and then I went to the Speed TDs. Speed TDs more than two in it, right? Okay, okay. What they actually call tempo bottoms. Yeah, I know you're talking about it. Tempo is a nice boy. Hey, so how often did y'all go through like different shoes? Every week. You play a new pair every game? Yeah, every week. So what I would do is that I would wear a new pair of shoes on Friday to get them broken in, and then I would play in them. then I would practice in those Wednesday and Thursday, break out a new pair for Friday, play in those on Sunday. Yeah, I like new shoes. I hate it when my shoes got too broken. Brand new shoes? Oh, hell no, man. Yeah, I probably played in a new pair of shoes like every three games on the old Joe. Cause I hate it when they got too broken and too loose. I like my shoe to be snubbed tight. Okay, that's... Yeah, okay. Yeah, I was gonna say you're playing a new pair of shoes, but I think Jordan played a new pair of shoes every game. Yeah, yeah. Damn. Man, you know how new shoes, brand new shoes hurt your feet? You know, Shade say it hurts like brand new shoes? Yeah. Hey, you remember when you was a kid, your shoes too small, you hitting the bottom with your heel, trying to get them toes down from the mouth. Oh yeah. But I hate that. I hate that. That's how I got that. That's how I got this whole hammer toe I got over here. From winning two little shoes. Yeah, you know you can go get a little surgery for that too now. Nah, I ain't hurt man. I'm playing, it took me through my whole professional career. Ain't no need to get any jacers over here. Jose, he ain't get no surgery unless he have to. What? No voluntary surgery? Cosmetic surgery? Oh, that is right. Hey look, I don't know how many times y'all ever been under that knife, but I done been under it quite a few times. It ain't pretty. I ain't never been under that, Joe. That's probably why I'm suggesting it, my bad. Hey, man, look here. I had broke my collarbone and it almost broke the skin, so I got a knot right here. Ah! I said, Mr. Sharp, we can file it down. I said, man, do you know how I pay for that to be to file a bone down? I said, it ain't bothering nobody. Always hurt. Right, right. And if I don't, I don't really walk around, I ain't at the beach, I ain't walk around with no shirt off, so ain't nobody gonna notice it. Right, yeah. And like when I do a photo, they just switch it to the opposite side. So if I'm facing this side, they'll take the bone and put it on this side so you won't even notice it. Damn. Okay, I see what you mean, okay, okay. Yeah, man. Uh-uh, nah, hell nah. One of that knife ain't no joke, boy. I got 18 screw, three plates in my face, man. Oh yeah, you got that fractal orbital. Damn, but you got elbow, Joe? I went up to dunk the ball and Stackhouse tried to block it and he kind of bodied me and I slipped off the rim, hit face first. I saw that guy happen to a guy in high school. He tried to dunk the ball and the guy undercut him. And the first thing he was hit was this. Ooh. Yeah. Yeah, I was in bad shape. I was in bad shape. How much time you had to miss, Joe? We was in the playoffs. It was the first round. It was the first round of the second round of the playoffs. And that was the first game. Damn. Man, I missed the rest of that series. I think we beat them in six. Right. I was out about two weeks. And that was early. I came back early, whole hour bloodshot red, you know, just from the surgery and all that. Right, right, right. It took a minute for that redness to get out my eye. Hey, you had the mask on? Yes, I had the mask. I had the mask. I still got the mask. I still got it. Batman Joe, whatever that I'm talking about. You can't breathe in there. That was back in 2005. You couldn't breathe with that mask on. I had to have a thing. You had to wear one up? I was blocking down, doing a combo block, power block on 16 power, I'll never forget it. Limon come around, pulling, fist go right through my face mask, bop. Damn. Fractured my orbital. Yep. I don't know about you, but mine hurt. What? That one hurt. Man, I remember I was laying on there, I had my face hand like this here, I was like, oh man. In Greek, Steve Antelobos, we call him Greek though. He called, Sharpie, what's wrong? I said, Greek, it just felt like my face exploded. So he said, hey, can you get up? I said, yeah, but I don't want to. Hey, listen. Man, that thing was hurt though, Joe. So they got me that X-rated. Had a complete blow out the floor. Cut your eye sits in the socket, the whole floor. Yeah. Ooh. I know I was in pain, boy. I'm telling you, I would tell them, give me morphine, give me something, man, y'all gotta give me something. Nah, I ain't want nothing. I ain't, I don't do the pain medicine, cause the pain medicine have you constipated. Oh, I had the, my head, listen, listen, I came down, hit my head on the floor, so I don't know if it was from that. Yeah, probably. My head was ringing so bad. Yeah. Yeah, and you know, like once that, once something like that happened, they don't want you to fall asleep. Yeah. They keep you up. That would just say, you know, you okay? Don't fall asleep. I said, man, as soon as I get home, I'm going to bed. Right. Fall asleep. Man. No, that thing ain't no problem. I think my orbital was more painful. But I don't know. Maybe I dislocated my elbow too. Cause you see how my elbow bent like this? It bent like that the other way. So it's bending like this, it bent like that the other way. Damn. What the hell happened? Tried to catch a pass and Romo had my arm, I couldn't get my arm through. So I landed, he landed on top of me and bent it up. Ah, God. That's what I'm saying too. I had elbow surgery. I had elbow surgery too. Huh? I had elbow surgery too. I had three chip bones in my socket. I woke up one morning, my arm was stuck like this here. I couldn't open it up. Oh, you had loose bodies in there, huh? Oh, man, yeah, Dr. Andrew got me right over there in Alabama. He died in Mobile or Montgomery? Birmingham. Birmingham, yeah, I think so. God damn, boy, y'all been on the table like the little operation, you know, Remember the game, Joe? Yeah, yeah. Remember Operation? Yeah, old Joe. But y'all had everything done. What? Man. Speak it up. This is the biggest night in podcasting. The countdown is on to our 2026 iHeart Podcast Awards. Live from South by Southwest, March 16th, we'll honor the very best in podcasting from the past year and celebrate the most innovative, talented creators in the industry. It's truly a who's who of the podcasting world. Creativity, knowledge, and passion will all be on full display. And the winner of the iHeart Podcast Award is... See all the nominees now at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app. Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. Ready for a different take on Formula One? Look no further than No Grip, a new podcast tackling the culture of motor racing's most coveted series. Join me, Lily Herman, as we dive into the underexplored pockets of F1, including the astrology of the current grid, the story of the sport's most consequential driver's strike, and plenty of other mishaps, scandals, and sagas that have made Formula One a delightful, decadent gumster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to No Grip starting March 4th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We'll tell you what it means and who really wins. Open your free iHeartRadio app, search 40s and free agents, and listen now.