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It was a pleasure to get dinner with Wendy last night even though we might as well put the check. Bond temps. Well, let's see what happens tonight. That is some disappointing behavior. Disappointing behavior. By the way, today McMahon and I were on NBA today and during one of the blocks of the show McMahon and I were off. I believe that was about WNBA. It was a WNBA segment. Correct. We're also on mic'd up and you know, doing an interview. What? This was during the commercial break. Just go on. You can continue but I want that fact out now. Okay fine. It was there in the commercial break. Was I saying it differently? You were acting as if it was mid-show. Go on. Anyway, we stay wired up even though we're not on the air right? So Bond temps, we're sitting there in the break and all of a sudden we start hearing water running and the sound of paper towels being dispensed. The producer, Jaren, goes, I think we're hearing McMahon in the bathroom. It was like we're on a naked gun. Well done, man. Hey, it was a fastball, not a curveball. But it relaxed. Anyway, okay, speaking of fastballs, the players union issued a few edicts on Tuesday. A little brushback pitch. Yeah, which you know, this doesn't happen often, Bond temps. So the first one was in relation to Yannis Tenicumpo and as was been out there reported over the last few days, Yannis, he's coming back, he's dealing with a knee injury right now. The Bucks have about 10 or 11 games left. And Yannis would like to play when he's healthy and the Bucks do not want him to play. And there was a statement made by the Players Association. Now, part of this statement is about tanking and I'm going to ignore those things about the tanking because we don't talk about tanking here. However, this part is relevant. Quote, the player participation policy was designed by the league to hold teams accountable and ensure that when an all star like Yannis Tenicumpo is healthy and ready to play, he is on the court. Unfortunately, anti-tanking policies are only as effective in there as their enforcement. Fans, project partners and the integrity of the game will continue to suffer as long as ownership goes unchecked. Bond temps, as long as ownership goes unchecked, that is an interesting word, ownership. This to me is a sign of a player and a team, not only not on the same page, but not communicating because they are now communicating through the lawyers. And I don't think this is a good sign in any way, shape or form. And I do not think that this season has been an exemplary way of handling business by the Bucks organization, including Mr. Tenicumpo. Yeah. I mean, I don't really have a lot else to add. I mean, what has changed about the situation in months? Not really anything, right? There's been a lack of communication. There's been a lack of mutual trust, I would say. There's been a lack of organizational alignment. I mean, it's just a complete mess. And it's been a complete mess for months and months and months. And I don't think that's going to change in the next three weeks. I would say to Yanis, I think he should take the next three weeks and not play. This is a guy who's had, I think, four different calf strains over the last year and a half or two years. He should get his body right. But the part of the problem here is I think the Bucks have not really had an ability to sit down with Yanis and have frank, productive conversations with him for an extended period now. I'm not sure why the situation is where it is. Like if you sit down with Yanis today and say, listen, the future pretty clearly should be for us to shake hands in the summertime and to send you to another place where you have a chance to win and we could turn the page into what's been an incredible run with you and the best player we've ever had here in Milwaukee. And we'll celebrate you then. We'll celebrate you after that. And there'll be a statue and there'll be a jersey in the rafters. And you brought us our first title in 50 years. And it was an incredible thing. Put up a 50 piece in the deciding game at home. It was one of the great finals closeout games we've seen in a very long time. And all that will be celebrated. But right now we're in a position where we're trying to maximize our future over the next three weeks and we need to maximize your future over the next three weeks. And I think the ultimate problem with everything that's gone on in Milwaukee for months now is an inability to have that kind of conversation. And that's why statements are being made. That's why this thing has been so messy. And it's why I think I speak for everybody when we're all just pretty tired of it. Like it's just the story is beyond played out and the team isn't going anywhere. And, you know, I think sometimes there is a bit of a rush for people to try to get guys out of town and to change teams and go somewhere new. But the way this thing is played out, I think it's going to be best for everybody to just start fresh next season with Yanis somewhere else and a whole bunch of assets coming back to the Bucks for them to start a new era of their franchise. I mean, this has been a saga that's played out for over eight years. Right. Like literally you go back to when the Mavericks drafted Lucan, the last pick of that draft, they took Coastal San Jacopo because they were among these several teams trying to line up to land Yanis in free agency when he left Milwaukee. Now, to the Bucks credit, that time with the Drew Holiday trade and on multiple other occasions, they were able to make moves to get Yanis to extend, get Yanis to commit, you know, and the Drew Holiday move in particular was a move that was able to bump them into being a real championship, not just contender, but a championship team. So, but like there's no more moves to make that are going to make the Bucks a championship team. There's no more moves to make that are going to make the Bucks relevant in terms of like anything right now in the NBA. They're not a good team. They are way underwater in terms of assets. They still not only owe Damien Lillard a ton of money after stretching and waving him, but they owe Portland all the draft capital for that deal. They have to finally trade Yanis not because he wants out, which, you know, obviously he does, he just isn't willing to come to them and say that. They have to trade them because they're impergatory right now. Their only chance to dig out is to get real value for him, which means it is in their best interest to shut Yanis down for the season, not to tank, to protect him from catastrophic injury, which is clearly the concern with these repeated cap strains. The guy needs some real significant time off to rest and fully recover and to, if not eliminate the risk, at least really drop the risk. But like the tanking thing, that's a completely disingenuous mention of tanking because it's a hot button issue because really, if the Bucks tank the rest of the season, there's barely any benefit. Oh, whoa, though, instead of being tense, they'll be nice. They're tied right now for ninth with the bowls. The team they would catch possibly would be the Pelicans, which by the way, the Bucks get the worst of those two picks anyway. And let me just also add, the Bucks stink with Yanis on the court. The Bucks are a bad team. They've lost nine to 12 with Yanis on the floor. It's not like, oh my gosh, if Yanis came back, the Bucks wouldn't have come. No, they wouldn't. It's a bad team that needs to move on despite, and they're bad despite the fact that they've got an all time grade. He needs to move on. They need to move on. And we can talk again about the Bucks when they become relevant in like 2032. Last week, Ramona Shelburne published a story where she interviewed Bucks Governor Wes Edens, where he said, quote, Yanis is going into the last year of his contract. So one of two things will happen. Either he will be extended or he'll be traded. The likelihood that you'll let him play out the last year, we can't afford that. It's not consistent with what's good for the organization. That's not a Yanis issue. That's any player that's in there last year of their contract. This is a Max player. This is an elementary statement. It's not like a hot take or whatever. It's how any team would treat this. But Bon Temps, what struck me about that quote, which I'll bring, come back to it now, that Yanis is communicating with the Bucks through the players union. Wouldn't they have a good idea whether Yanis was going to extend or not? Like they would, you know, like if you just ask him, are you going to extend? Well, and I think that that's again, I think it goes back to the fundamental disconnect that existed here for quite a while. There's just not been a lot of communication, I think, between Yanis and the Bucks. And I think that's where, you know, going into this off season, I think that's what has to start to change. Like they've got to sit down and it probably should start today. Like should sit down and have real honest conversations about where this thing is going and what they're doing and what the plan is. Because like I said, the best thing for Yanis is to get himself healthy. I want to see Yanis out on the court doing awesome stuff and playing at the highest level, which he showed this year when he was on the court again, he's still one of the five best players on the planet. He's still an unstoppable force with the ball. And in transition, he still is a guy who can make game changing plays on the defensive end. He's still a guy that can be a massively important piece of a championship level team in the league, but that situation is not going to be in Milwaukee. It's not going to be in the final 10 games of the season when they have no chance to do anything. Right. And I also think like, yeah, it stinks in general that the tanking conversation includes things like it's not good for the Bucks to have a guy like Yanis play in a vacuum. Like, yeah, that's true. But right now for where the Bucks are at, the goal for everybody involved should be for Yanis to be 1000% healthy going into the off season. And it should be for the Bucks to be able to start to reorient this franchise about the next era of its existence. Because the bottom line is they've been on borrowed time the last couple of years trying to drag this thing out. And it's been band-laid out before. There's just no path to this team having a chance to be competitive in the East, not not right now and not as we move forward with some of these young teams continuing to get better. And it's just time for everybody to move on. And again, that conversation about that has to start now and it has to start with, you know, like you said, go right back to what West Seedon said last week, get an answer to that question and then move forward. You know, the only thing I would say is why do you need to answer that question? Because I don't think extending Yanis is in the Bucks best interest. So you can do what? Be expensive and mediocre? Well, listen, if Yanis Senekupo announced, I want to spend my whole career in Milwaukee, I would understand if the Milwaukee Bucks said, OK, we're going to have Yanis Senekupo spend his entire career in Milwaukee, we'll try to be as competitive as possible. I don't think that would be a bad thing for Yanis or the NBA or the Bucks. I think to your point, though, McMahon, everybody's been dancing around the idea that Yanis is not thrilled to be in Milwaukee for a long time. And that is where it's a problem. If Yanis was going to stand up and say, hey, listen, I'm going to be in Milwaukee my whole career. I'm happy like Dirk did basically. Like it was clear. Dirk, similar careers, right? Won a title. Sound like he has to go try to chase the ring somewhere because he hasn't done that. If he just stood up and said, hey, listen, I love my time in Milwaukee. I want to spend my whole career with one team. I want to try to be as competitive as we possibly can be. You know, let's let's just go forward and try to be competitive and see what we can do. That would at least be a clear direction for the franchise to go forward. I get all that. But we're not here. And I just it's more to me about what the lack of communication shows about the underlying situation there. That's what I'm taking away from today. Yes, I agree. Do you think Ramona will remember her conversation with the West Indians? I know those tend to be forgettable, according to some folks. The reference that McMahon is making there is that at the beginning of the season, Eden said he had this very crucial conversation with Yanis last spring after the season. And then when Yoss was asked about it, he said he had no recollection. So all right, the union made a second statement on Tuesday, unusual to get two statements in a day. This one is Roe in reference to Cade Cunningham. Cade Cunningham's potential ineligibility for postseason awards after a career defining season is a clear indictment of the 65 game role. And yet another example of why it must be abolished or reformed to create an exception for significant injuries. It went on, but I'm going to cut it short. Also, Jeff Schwartz gave the following quote. Jeff Schwartz is the power agent. Represents Cade. This is said to Shams. Cade has delivered a first team all NBA season. If he falls short of an arbitrary games played threshold due to a due to a legitimate injury, it should not disqualify him from rep for from recognition. He has clearly earned over the course of the season, et cetera, et cetera. He finishes with an exception needs to be made. OK, I just want to say a couple of things here. I am bummed that Cade potentially will miss out on these awards. I don't think he's going to play in the regular season. He seems very obvious he's not going to play. Yeah. He's let's just be honest. These statements will not be coming out if Cade was going to play. Correct. He has played 61 games. However, the 61st game he played four minutes. I don't know if they would count that because it's the threshold. I can tell you they would not count it. He's 60 games played for awards. So there is a specification in the CBA where if you suffer a season ending injury and have played 62 games, you could qualify for the postseason awards. Yeah, I don't. He doesn't qualify. So I mean, that's the exception that could be made, I guess. Well, that is I mean, the thing about this that I would say is silly is one, the players association collectively bargained this rule with the right to get several years ago in the last CBA. So they agreed to the rules to there is literally a carve out in the rules for an injury like this. It's if you play 62 games and this happens, if Cade had played two more games, he would have been eligible for awards. Now, I agree with you. It's very unfortunate that Cade has had this tremendous season and is going to miss out on getting on to one of the all NBA teams and to be on MVP ballots, because he would have been on MVP ballots. And he would have either been the top of the second team or first team on the player. He's had a phenomenal season. But the rule exists because the NBA put the rule in with the PA's approval several years ago. And no, they're not going to create an exception for it, just like they didn't create an exception for it to give Victor defense player the year last year, just like they're not going to give an exception if Nikolay Okic misses two more games and falls below 65 games. Like the rule exists. And like we could sit here and say it's dumb that we have to decide. We get it decided for us who we can vote for as opposed to being able to decide if we're going to vote for Cade or not. But the rule is what it is. And the idea that you're just going to arbitrarily create a rule because Cade had an unfortunate change in the rule because Cade had an unfortunate injury. It's just not how reality works. This unfortunately is completely out of the spirit of the rules. Spirit of the rules, that load management had become such an issue for the league and a public relations issue, a, honestly, a disservice to fans issue. This is not a load management issue with Cade clearly. Also, like when you're the primary reason that your team is the number one seed in the Eastern Conference, like this, it's a tough pill to swallow. Under the rule, though, there's like there's no wiggle room. You know, Mark Falwell, who's the longtime mask, play by play guys doing some play by play with NBC and Peacock. He he's been on a on a little rampage is too strong. But, you know, he's made the point several times on social media. Hey, the cutoff for league leaders, you know, the scoring title, you know, assist title rebound and title, etc. is 58 games. Why is it 65 games for awards, but 58 games to score and very simple reason because the NBA fought to put this rule in because they wanted star players to play in more games. And guess what? The harsh truth of the rule and the dirty secret of it is it's working. The rule is working. Guys are playing in more games. That's why it's not changing. It's why it exists. Like I don't think I think we'd all agree. I don't think it was a coincidence. Nikolai Okic came back from this bone bruise. Oh, no. After missing 16 games. It's not a, you know, Victor Webanyama has played in dozens of games in a row now and hasn't missed any games because he's three or four games away from when we did miss one game against the Nuggets, but they know exactly where he is. He knows, he has come out and said he doesn't want to miss any games for the award purpose. That's right. These guys want, and look, I'm not saying I, I'm not talking about whether I think the rule should exist. I, I've made my points on that in the past. I think Pete, the media has always done a very good job of deciding where the line is and how much guys have played. I don't think we need a rule to decide that. However, that's why the NBA fought for this rule. They fought for it to be 65 games. They fought to put it in because they wanted to have incentive for guys to be playing their star, the star players to play more. And the star players are playing more. And it is very unfortunate for Cade. And frankly, I'm really happy that this is not a year ago when Cade qualified for the Super Max and it would have been extremely unfortunate if something like this happened and it cost him tens of millions of dollars. Like that, I would have really felt bad if that happened. But look, we also saw Tyrese Halliburton two years ago limp through the second half of the season, playing 22 minutes a game and a bunch of games to be eligible to get his own Super Max. Oh, by the way, when, remember when Wimby came back from his extended absence early in the season, his minutes limit was 20. That was not picked out of the hands. The reason why that's the number is because that that's the limit they've set for the game to count for towards the 65 games. Speaking of that, you may remember that Cade Cunningham did sign a contract extension a couple of years ago. He did hit the Super Max provision. He made third team all NBA last year, got a $45 million bonus. So while he wants this because he's he feels and he's correct that he is earned first team all NBA, for sure. Not this would be different if he was trying to get that money. I think that would be a different situation, but that money is secure. More Hoop Collective podcast after this. Another morning, another reminder, there's a gap to be careful of. But maybe it's time to bridge the one between your nine to five and your dream of living life on your own terms. At HSBC, we know ambition looks different to everyone. Whether it's retiring early or leaving more for your family, we can help because when it comes to unlocking your money's potential, we know wealth, search HSBC wealth today. HSBC UK opening up a world of opportunity. HSBC UK current account holders only. Victor Wimbanyama, he controlled the the discourse of the NBA on Tuesday because he went on. I mean, he didn't grab the microphone and announce the reasons why he should be MVP. He was asked a question. Why what his case was for MVP, but he had answers ready. And he, you know, as we've talked about with Victor, not afraid to extol his own virtue. Is that is that artfully said enough or or ruffle some feathers, extol his own virtue and take a little jab at a team and a franchise and a player that could be a decade plus long rival of the Spurs. Well, it wasn't just him. Like he definitely is, you know, sort of trolling, I guess you could say. Shea Gildes Alexander by saying that they went four and one against him during the season, but he is trolling. I mean, I don't I is that part? Is that part trolling? It's it's it's truthful. It's truthful. Yeah, I mean, that I mean, I'll just I mean, he's also as I've said many times, Victor is not afraid to be wildly arrogant in a matter of fact way. I would say that's just being very matter of fact that they won four out of five against like if you are, if it does get down to a Victor versus Shea one and two, like, yeah, I think an argument in his corner is they won four out of the five games. Yeah, it's just it takes you back a little bit to hear a guy be that blunt and pointed out. And what was I said? Yeah, as I said to somebody last night, finals might have just gotten a little even more interesting. As I said to somebody last night, as the person who has done the straw poll now for several years, there are all sorts of people who lobby about MVP awards and awards in general. We just the last segment, we talked about this whole thing with Kate Cunningham. Very rarely do you see someone on camera on the record completely lay out their position? Well, normally that's done earlier this year when he's like, I'm the best player in the league. Jay Jaylin did that. But that it's it's rare. Usually this is done in a little more subtle manner. But Victor, Victor doesn't do a lot of things subtly, either on the court or off the court. And this is the latest example of that. I will say this. Don't you think that this will like you're not going to do the straw poll for a little bit here, but it would be fascinating if you did the straw poll two days ago, then you did another one today. I don't know. I don't I don't think I do. Oh, I don't think it's changing who's in the lead. I think I don't. I don't think Victor giving a postgame speech is changing a lot of votes. I wish you were wrong. But I mean, I wish you were right, but I'm afraid you're wrong. You know, that is like, listen, none of this matters if Wimpy's not just absolutely dominating. And he absolutely dominated the Miami 83ers in a complete blowout win. But but seriously, like the guy. OK, let's just let let's look at what he says. The most dominant defensive player by far. There is no question that the gap between Wimpy and the next best defensive player is much more significant than the gap between the best offensive player and number two. By the way, is he trolling? Is he trolling Shay saying Shay doesn't defend or is he saying that about Luca and Yoko? On that one, I think he's I take him. I take that one at face value. Hey, defense is half the game and I'm OK. And he's by far the most dominant. Again, yeah, what he's trolling everybody because I don't think he's. I don't think it's true. I think that's fine. Use a different verb. He's I'm just I think he's making his argument is so valuable defensively that you have to consider that as he's saying that in reference to the other MVP candidates. That's the current of what he's saying. Sure, that his value on defense way based his cases. My value on defense way outweighs the difference in any of these guys value offensively versus mine. And he's you know, his thing on offense is it's not just scoring points. Basically, he talked about his gravity and some of the other things he does. And then the stuff about we beat the Thunder four out of five bases. He's a basis for three times at full strength. That's that is him saying, hey, Shay's the favor now. But when we played, I'm up the floor with it with Shane and the defending champions. And that's him trying to make up for the biggest thing that I think is going to prevent him from winning the award, which is that the Thunder. We'll talk about later have gone 15 and one since the All-Star break with a bunch of guys out and have stayed ahead of the 16 and two Spurs since the All-Star break. Have kept this three game lead and are now very likely to have the best record in the league and the best record in the Western Conference. And as we've said the whole time, if Victor and the Spurs were able to get ahead of the Thunder and finish the season with the best record in the Western Conference, I think there was a very real chance Victor was going to be the MVP of the league. I think if Shay stays ahead and the Thunder win the West, particularly with the amount of injuries the Thunder have had and the season Shay has had, I think Shay's winning a second straight. And when he says the part where Victor is trying to take out the wind. And this is Dr. MVP here, McMahon speaking. No, but I agree. Can I say something real quick? Sure. I believe Dr. MVP there said when the before the last draw poll came out, I think Wimbanyama was 35 to one on DraftKings. Is that correct? I believe that was right. And I said at the time that that was a ridiculous line and people should bet it. Well, it's down 18 to one now. So rare win. I mean, that's that's way too high. I still think 18 to one is pretty good on draft. I would have him second on my ballot behind Shay. I would have Luke a third. Wimby, you had Joker third, but whatever. Wait a second, wait a second, put a pin in that for a second. So you have Yolkich out of the top three. Yes, because honestly, dude, if we're going to value winning, then it's hard for me to make a case for Joker over Luca. Well, when Luca is leading the league in scoring with remarkable efficiency, filling out the box score, holding up, frankly, pretty well defensively, making plays defensively, holding a much better defensive than the Joker. Making plays defensively. Winhorst, what is happening here? Dude, the guys, the guys got, we've got some, some Luca pom poms out here. There's no Luca pom poms. Look at this. I've got half. I've still got half of Slovenia and certain segments of Los Angeles and Dallas. Let's get the book in this frame. But no, but seriously, the wonder boy, go buy it. But my point is like, if his team's third in the standings and he's got that kind of statistical case and Joker's team is, you know, what they might end up fourth, but there's significantly, you know, there's a significant gap and Joker has not played his typical level of basketball since coming back from the injury. So he remains leading the league and rebounding assists. He is a first team, all NBA, no brainer. He's an absolutely historically dominant player, but we're talking about, you know, we're splitting hairs here. And I, again, you asked me what my ballot would be. I would have Shay, Wimby, Luca, Joker in that order and fifth at this point. Okay, Jackson has to this moment updated DraftKings line. Shay is minus 1000. Oh, there's been some. Okay. Luca plus 1000. That's 10 to one. That's Luca. That's Laker fan. Those odds are poor. Wimby plus 1300. So 13 to one. Joker plus 4500. Yeah. But so Wimby says- I don't think a bet on Luca or Jokic, especially Luca at that number is a good bet. But Wimby could still, I still think Shay is going to win, but Wimby could overtake him. They could have a bet 10 days and it could happen. I think right now there is a debate. There should be, even though I think I should lead the race. I'm trying to make sure that at the end of the season, there's no debate. That's what Wimby said. Frankly, it's not within his power to make sure there's no debate. Because the only way there's, I think you can make a reasonable case that there's not a debate is if the Spurs overtake the Thunder in the standings. And that means that Thunder have to lose a few games. Even like the Spurs winning out, the Thunder still have to lose a few games. And they're not, the Thunder are helping them throughout the season and haven't been losing anyway. Well, I'll tell you what, I like the fact that it's late March and this is still up in the air and it could still go each way. At the end of the day, that's what I really like more than anything. And I love that Wimby is so damn entertaining. I tell you guys, he makes me crack up laughing multiple times a game just because he does things that are so ridiculous. And then it's willing to grab the microphone and very eloquently beat his chest and say, I'm the baddest bleep in the damn league. Okay, so the Denver Nuggets over the weekend, they play the Portland Trail Blazers. Their injury report was empty. That's right, the Nuggets who have been banged and battered and had four starters out of times this year, fully healthy. As we record this, they play Phoenix Tuesday night. Peyton Watson is sitting out of that game because they have a back-to-back and he's not going to play in back-to-backs coming off the hamstring. Additionally, over the weekend, I guess was on Monday, Jaylen Williams in Oklahoma City returned. And for the Thunders game on Wednesday, I can't remember who they're playing. They're in Boston. Playing the Celtics. Oh, that's right. Big game. There you go. Clean injury report. I mean, relatively clean injury report in terms of the rotation players. Their rotation players are all available for one of the first times this season. I think it's, I think it might be the, it's under five times. They've had their top nine players all available. And I mean, they're starting lineup. They've had six times all season. Right. Well, so I was doing it. I was at this game last night. I wrote a story about Jaylen Williams coming back, which I'll get to the overall number about it in a second. But McBan indicated something to me while we were, I was getting ready for the, the, the, the, to write the story that I wanted to just highlight. So McMahon, to set this up. How many times did the Thunders starting five that started last night, which is Che Guevara Alexander, Lou Dort, Jaylen Williams, Isaiah Hardestine and Chet Holmgren? How many times did they play together last season? Believe it was 14. It was 14 times. Plus the playoffs, but 14 times in the regular season. I'm just talking about the regular season. So last season, the Oklahoma City Thunder had their preferred starting lineup start 14 times. They went 68 and 14. This year, they've had their preferred starting lineup. They're like, if everybody's healthy, here's who they're starting. Played six times all season. They're combined record over those two seasons together when you add it up is 125 and 29. And that's with having massive health issues, both seasons. And last year, last year, Chet missed over half the season. This year, Jaylen Williams missed over half the season. These are max players. They have had key, they've had several key rotation players out for stretches of time of both last season and this season. And they've won over 80% of their games. It's just a, it's unbelievable. And it, I do think speaks to the fact that going into the playoffs, we just got done talking about Victor. Victor is amazing. The Spurs have had an unbelievable season. The Thunder are playing Boston. Jason Tatum is back. We're going to talk about him. They're having a great season. There's all these interesting teams atop the East. We'll see what happens with the Lakers and their late surge. We'll see what happens with Denver, Nicole Yocatch. We'll see what happens with Anthony Edwards and the Wolves. The Oklahoma City Thunder, if they are healthy in the playoffs, should be the gigantic favorites to win the title again. And it's going to be a huge disappointment if they don't, because this team is the deepest team in the league. I think they have the best player in the league. And again, they have won 80% of their games the last two years with all these injuries. So we haven't had a repeat title team in eight years. And that streak should end this spring. And if it doesn't, the Thunder will have given it away in some form or fashion. I agree with everything until you said they will give it away, because listen, the Nuggets who are also healthy, damn near took it from them last year. It went to seven and seven. Aaron Gordon was playing on a hamstring that I can't believe he played on. It was a blowout in game seven, but still they pushed them seven games. And listen, man, I know the Spurs don't have a single second of playoff experience as a group. But as Victor Wim and Yama said, San Antonio dominated that season series. And Wimby is a problem that I don't care who it is, Oklahoma City, Denver, Lakers. Wimby is a problem that's going to be hard to solve in a seven game series. That's fair. I will just quickly put out two things before Brian jumps in. I thought it was really interesting last night here in Jalen Williams talk after the game. And he got asked about what's the difference between this year and last year for them. And he talked about their experience. And he said, I thought it was always kind of silly in the past when people talked about you feel different after you want. But I can tell you this year after we won, we're a lot more confident and it's really a real thing. And we feel it's a much different feeling having gone through it. And the other thing I'll say is he and you've chronicled this all year, McMahon. He was adamant. His wrist is 100% and is totally back to normal. And he's totally healthy. And, you know, somebody a few weeks ago compared this year's Thunder team to last year's Pacers team, which had sort of a similar path in the season where they had all these injuries and they never had anybody healthy until right about now. And they got in the playoffs and they were fully healthy when it mattered and they took off. And I just think if this Thunder team is fully healthy, they should beat everybody. And if they don't, yes, you're right. Victor's incredible. Like something like that might happen. But I think we'll look back on them losing if they're healthy as them giving games away rather than somebody taking it from them. Based off to me, the talent advantage they should have on everybody else. The wrist thing's a big deal because he missed the first 19 games. We all remember he put off the surgery until after the playoffs. He missed the first 19 games and then he shot it really poorly because he still didn't have full range of motion coming back off of that. And when he came back, it was just before the all star break, I covered the game here in LA when he came back and he said that night, he was like, my wrist feels much better just because I was able to do things with it, not playing games for covering from this hamstring injury that just helped a lot. And then the next game in Phoenix, he made his first 11 shots from the floor. He said last night he had 28 points of 20 minutes and then he heard his hamstring and missed another six weeks. Right. And so I'm not surprised to hear him say that the wrist feels as good as it has. If he's shooting the ball well and he's back to being that big time number two offensive option, that's huge. Don't tell him, I don't want to hear how good the Thunder's record is without J.L. Williams as if that's some kind of knock against him. If you watched the playoffs last year, I don't need to sit here and tell you how important he is to their hopes of winning the championship. Yes. And this is the thing. I don't know where to put the line because I want to honor what I think is an incredible phenomenon happening with Victor Wimbanyama and that he can be the type of player who can overcome. I mean, really one of the definitions of superstar for me is can you lead your team to a series where you don't have the better team? Which is what LeBron did early in his career. It's what Luca did early in his career. He did in 2011. Absolutely. It's like, you know, that's not the only definition of superstar, but it's one of them. And so I want to honor what I think is that power with Victor, but also don't want to disrespect what you are describing about Temps, which is a absolute growling powerhouse that is, you know, fully healthy. I want to point something out about Denver though, and we'll see what happens in tonight's game because I don't, you know, guaranteed jinx. After tonight when they play in Phoenix, they have nine games left. Seven of those nine games are at home fully healthy. Also, they finished the season playing Oklahoma City and San Antonio, I think in that order of the last two games of the season. Yeah. It's possible that those games will not matter, that the first and second seed will be established. It's possible that they will matter. We just don't know yet. But the quote unquote hard games that Denver has left might not see their best teams. You know, they may not play their best teams. So I would just say that Denver is in position to get that fourth seed, I think, if they handle their business and avoid injury. And I'll say something else. With the Lakers, they play the Pacers on Wednesday. I don't know if they'll win that game. The Pacers have lost 16 and 17. I've got a gas for going on. The Lakers next three games are Pacers, Nets, Wizards. If they beat the tankers, it puts the Lakers in very strong position to get that three. So what I'm saying to you is the Nuggets and Lakers are in position to take seeds three and four. Whether or not they actually do, I don't know. But we will definitely see. Bon Temps, you had a story that's publishing on Wednesday about Jason Tatum. One of the more interesting things happening in the league right now. There was a topic on First Take when I was on there today about whether or not Tatum's return is costing the Celtics in some way. Their offensive numbers are down. His shooting numbers are not great. I think it was spurred by Tracy McGrady. They were broadcasting a game in Boston on NBC the other night and he was speculating that Tatum was having a negative effect. That may be some truth to that in their terms of their offensive production, even though Jalen Brown's numbers are still, he's still getting this head number shot. It's not like he came in and Jalen Brown is not getting the ball. As you guys know, before Tatum even came back, I said, I don't care what he looks like in March. I don't really care how much he looks like in April. I care what he looks like on May 1st. I stand by it. But Bon Temps, you did a piece on Tatum and how he's looking and I will hand the floor to you. Yeah, I mean, I would say that was generally the opinion of everybody I talked to as well. I think everybody agrees that based off Tatum's timeline for return being 10 months out from a tourney, a tourney killies, he looks about as good as you could realistically hope for. And the question is, how is he going to look in two months or in six weeks? And nobody can tell you really for sure, right? Like nobody's got a crystal ball to know exactly how that's going to go. I think it's interesting in doing this story and looking at some stats and sort of analyzing how he's been, his usage rate going into this game on Wednesday is 30.8. He's had a usage rate somewhere between 30 and 32 each of the last five years running. So his usage is right back to where it was before he got hurt. Now, is that the most optimal thing? I would say probably not. However, Jason Tatum was probably going to come back and play like Jason Tatum whenever he came back. And to your point about, you know, is this hurting the Celtics or not? I mean, I'm sorry. I think this entire conversation is idiotic and I thought so from the moment it was brought up before he even came back. Because look, Jordan Walsh has had a really nice year. He's a good young player. Jason Tatum has essentially replaced Jordan Walsh in the Celtics rotation. There is no world where the Celtics are worse off with Jordan Walsh playing instead of Jason Tatum. Now, perhaps Jason Tatum will not get back to being Jason Tatum between now and the end of their season, whether it's in the finals or the first round or the conference finals or whenever. But what's undoubtedly true is the Celtics have a dramatically higher ceiling to try to win a championship. If they have Jason Tatum in the lineup, whether Jason Tatum is an okay player, a good player or something close to the first team all NBA player he was each of the past four seasons. So, of course, it's a good thing for the Celtics that Jason Tatum is back. Now, he's not shooting the ball well. He looks a little bit sluggish with the ball, which is again all normal stuff. His first step looks a little slow. That's all true. However, he remains a great rebounder. He remains a great rebounder. He's still a very good team defender. He still can make plays. And he's still a guy who fills in gaps across the board, which is why he's always been a very positive player that's lifted up whatever group of players he's basically ever been out there with his entire career with the Celtics. So, the biggest thing that the biggest message I got from basically everybody I talked to was it's just going to be a matter of time to see how he looks over the next six weeks or so. And it's impossible to know where it lands, but it, you know, credit to him for being back and you know, we'll see how he can develop between now and then. But the idea that there's somehow worse off with him playing, I just it's just a ridiculous conversation for anybody to have. Well, Jason Tatum's return is not going to cost the Boston Celtics a championship. Jason Tatum's return raises the ceiling to a championship possibility for the Celtics. It gives them a chance to win one as opposed to not having one. Now, that doesn't mean it's going to happen, but like to it's pretty ridiculous to jump to any kind of knee jerk reactions based on two weeks of you know, shooting numbers essentially from a guy coming back off of a 10 month rehab. Like, did you think Tatum was just going to hit the ground running at an all NBA level? Off of an Achilles? I mean, and the thing that spurred this story was Sunday night after said game that Jip Tracy McGrady and the NBC crew was at against the Wolves without anything yet. We're in Boston where the Celtics couldn't hit a shot and they were lead and lost. Tatum was had a pretty frank post game interview about all this stuff and at one point he got asked about, you know, how have you sort of handled the ups and downs of trying to come back? And he said quote, I didn't know how this blank was going to be. It's tough in the moment. You try not to think about it. You just want to be jacid Tatum and feel like yourself again, but I'm not Superman. So it's obviously going to take some time and it is obviously going to take some time. He wasn't going to come back and immediately be a first team all NBA player and that that's just the question is can that ramp up period happen fast enough for him to get back to being an all star all NBA caliber player by the time the playoffs come around. But I will say when the Celtics have struggled in the past, it's been when they've tended to hold the ball more rely on their three point shooting and sometimes the threes go in and they look great. And sometimes threes don't go in and they look bad. And with Tatum back, the one thing that does happen is they lean a little bit more into that and a little bit less into the helter-skelter fly around, you know, hustle play stuff that they've been doing around Jaylen Brown this season. But news flash to people who think that's a bad thing. That also gives the Celtics, as Ben said, an actual championship ceiling, which is why this has been something we've talked about all season. It's why it matters. It's why it's great. Jaylen is back and we'll see what the next few weeks look like. Very important Cavs corner update before we go. No, good. Jared Allen, Kenny Atkinson says Jared Allen, who missed his ninth straight game on Tuesday night, is ramping up key piece of information on the Eastern Conference playoff race. Just said it a few minutes ago. So let it be known. Jared Allen is coming back. It's going to be a very interesting close to the season in the east where you've got the Knicks, the Celtics, and the Cavs all pretty bunched together in those two, three, four spots. And you've got the Pistons with Cade Cunningham out the collapse lung sitting in first and holding on eight and two when Cade didn't play. That's not a knock-in. They're going to get the one seed. Between the Celtics losing that game to the Wolves on Sunday night and then the Pistons coming back and beating the Lakers the next night without uh without Cade, I would say with five five losses up with a handful of games to go. Plus the tie break. I'm pretty sure. Yeah, they're going to be they're going to be the one seed. But I mean even if they went under 500 and the Celtics won out, I'm not sure that it would I mean if they went like five and six, I'm not sure they would. Well the Cavs have the magic in the heat right now while we're doing this pod Tuesday night to play the magic. Then they play the heat Wednesday night, second night of a back to back. Here is state of Florida on a 10 game losing streak, by the way. Go on. It's right. As of now. The Cavs schedule in uh in April is the following. At Warriors, home for Pacers, at Grizzlies, a home and home with the Hawks and home for the Wizards. So you got four automatic tankers in there and those two games against the Hawks are going to be fascinating because I think there's a chance. The Warriors aren't tankers, they're distinct. Go on. Well, the Warriors are the Warriors are very banged up with injuries. Obviously Moses Moody had a really unfortunate injury towards Patella on Monday. Steph probably could still be out then. The point is those two games against the Hawks are going to be super interesting, I think, the last week of the season because that could be an opportunity for the Cavs to potentially manipulate their way into whatever seed they want from two to four. And it also could be the difference between the Hawks being in the play-in or being fifth or sixth because that whole group of teams from five to ten is three or four games apart in total. Yes. So those games on Wednesday and Friday, that final week of the season, are going to be once to watch. Anyway, Jared Allen might be coming back soon. All right. Thank you so much to McMahon and Bon Temps. Thank you to Jackson and the rest of our producers. Thank you for listening and watching The Hoop Collective. We'll talk to you later this week. Adios, amigos.
