Richard Marx

Wait, tell me this story. Okay, so I stop there I was I was a massive Commodore's fan in Lionel and Lionel was just leaving the Commodore's at this time, right? I was a senior in high school my best friend in high school was a year older than me So he was in college in Atlanta at Emory. He was had a roommate and they were they would be playing tapes and Right, that's what you did. You crank up the cassette on the boombox. Yeah Well, my best friend he had my demo tape and he was they were playing in it in their apartment like they were playing REO Speedwagon. Yeah, I know like it was just in the mix and his Roommate said this who's he's your friend from high school. He's really good He goes something's got to happen with this guy, right? He goes, you know, I grew up with a guy who works with the Commodore's I'm gonna send him Richard's tape. I get this call from my buddy going. It's my friend's friend who grew up with the guy Right, and I'm like, yeah, right. I don't know six weeks later My parents phone rings and it's fucking Lionel Richie. No way I thought I was being pranked You look very healthy, I don't look a day over 61 you don't look I'm 62 you look 40 you look a year older than me. I'm 46 you look incredible. Is there like a wellness routine? I'll tell you the number one thing for me was when I turned 60 I cut out sugar sugar. I dropped sugar I kicked it to the curb because I used to love I was a big fan of baked goods Mm-hmm, and it wasn't even a weight thing. It was just a I went and got one of those pre-new voscan You know the pre-new voscan I got one too and when I did it I was 60 just turning 61 and my doctor when he read the report he called me goes dude I don't think I've ever said this to anybody your age. He said you have no traceable inflammation in your body Because I cut out sugar a year before mmm. I drink I love martinis. That's the only sugar I get really fruit and vodka Well fruit's a good good sugar. Yeah, I'm learning about all that now cuz I'm trying to get my health in order Was it bad? No, but it wasn't as is it cuz you're nearing 50? Yeah, I'm heading that and you know like I turned 46 and it like was like oh, I'm now four years from 50 not Five years. Yeah, so now I'm like almost 50 So then I think about that even though it really almost 50 years and you're in your mid 40s But to me like to me 50 is the new 40 60s the new 50 like I feel like when I was a kid in the 90s 50 sounded old and now it doesn't sound old It's like we're in our prime almost it feels like we're in fact I know guys that are 70 that are killing it. Yeah, I know a couple guys in their 80s, right? Actually, I agree the other day. I know this guy. He was I was hitting golf balls and I know and Roughly know this guy, but he's 80 and he's a incredible golfer and he's like in incredible shape Yeah, and he's just living. Yeah, and when I was a kid that sound 80 sounded really old It's not actually now when you see people who take hands. Well, it depends on the person if you take care of yourself I know some people 45 that are old. Yeah, and I know it's in their 80s So youthful Rod Stewart's a great example like and he's a really good example of what I've been focusing on lately Which is after a lifetime of keeping fit and wanting a certain aesthetic and wanting a certain look Which you know you drift in and out of it I've never been so dedicated that I look as cut as I want to all the time right me too But when you turn 60 the last two years, I'm focused on what they call functional training Which is I'm planning for when I'm 80 when I'm 80. I want to be able to put my bag in the overhead Mm-hmm when I'm 80 I want to be able to carry a bag of groceries up a flight of stairs or get up off the floor with using one hand Do you know what I mean? It's those things instead of like how much can I deadlift? Yeah? Yeah? Yeah? It's like can I do the things I do now? effortlessly 20 years from now. Yeah, cuz think if we get to 80 and we have Another 20 let's think about this like by that time. Here's what I think I think in the next five to ten years There's gonna be a bunch of breakthroughs sure and there's going to be an expansion on how What we think is possible for how long we can live don't you think that AI will create a longer lifespan within the next five years? Yes, yeah, I do and we'll benefit from it We're already seeing it because you're now being introduced to like treatments on things and there's people I'm seeing it in my own life with people that I know that I've had illness that are getting treated for things 20 years ago That would have been like pretty life-changing. Yeah, that are now not life-changing So when I think about the same thing, right? When we get to 80 if we have vitality for another 20 years By taking care of ourselves lifting weights doing things where we can actually go up the stairs We can you know be active. Yeah? I think there's like it's a richer life You know what I mean like to be able to have that functional. Have you always been this way? What or was there like oh? I think that's a very Oh, you mean mindful conscious No, I was like relationship. Come on. I was when we were in our 20s and 30s. We were invincible. Yeah I was just as ignorant. Yeah, I'm sure you were yeah everybody we I mean I was mindful of Appearance, right because I was on stage right where I was on record covers So it's just vanity if it's you a huge part of what keeps me motivated is still vanity I think that's really cool to say it's true because I feel the same way if I'm being really honest Like I grew up in a place and a time like my dad was not a vain person He was like an old-school hard-working my dad wasn't either rough guy who didn't care about what he wore Didn't care about he had some swag and style like naturally but to be vain was a very like And I don't know how else to say it but like where when we were coming up It was a very kind of feminine quality like I was kind of felt it was tall I was told that was a very like yeah, he was a man and it was don't care around men And yeah, and then I chose a very vain career Yeah, I started going and prancing around on stage and dressing up in outfits and doing my hair and looking how I look and But then that's how I saw it actually because of what I came from and so there was always like a It took me years to reconcile like that actually no like this is a craft Mm-hmm. It's worth the effort when you are in an audience as audience members because yeah Yeah, you know a lot of people forget that we also go to shows. Yeah We're fans of people yeah when you go see someone who you love or have loved for a long time And maybe you haven't seen them in a while and they look like shit doesn't it bum you out it bums you out I don't want to be like that. I don't want to I don't want to be that I don't want my own Wow, you really let himself go. Yeah, so it's I mean I and I'm I say I can't stress this enough I have no issue with people having plastic surgery. I haven't yeah, but I I haven't either I ain't gonna say never Right, right. Why would we say guys? I know who are older than me Who look amazing have had something done, right? And I don't have any judgment about it because they look fucking amazing So I don't know at a certain point. I might go you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna you know, I have zero Judgment yeah anyone doing anything. I'm fully covered in tattoos, which you could say is aesthetic. It's like a it's a procedure You know, it is actually a procedure. Yeah, and we're one of my sons is pretty heavily tattered not quite that much but And that's part of his The way it likes it's it's It's expression and it also is like being comfortable in your own skin for whatever reason this made me feel more But more me yeah, and so that's why I have always like I don't have any problem with In plastic surgery of like I think it's interesting how we live in a world that'll beat a woman down on how she looks and then beat her Beat her up for changing how she looks or you're damned if you do or they beat her up for being completely natural exactly You know yeah, like Paulina, Porticova Thank you. That's how you pronounce her last name Paulina. Everybody knows her as that my wife showed me some Posts of hers and she just looks beautiful, but I mean she looks her age Yeah, you know or she looks younger than her age But she doesn't she's not she doesn't do anything and my wife said look how great she looks and I said yeah She looks great and she goes now read the comments. Yeah, that's well the first thing Oh god, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a really unfair and it's much more. It's a hundred percent skewed against women It's way harder. It's brew men get away with it. We get away with everything I just think about that way because I have a daughter and I'm like, I don't care what you do It's just like be happy. Yeah and love yourself right whatever that takes whatever that takes and your version of that The world is mean Don't take it personal. You know, it's gonna be easier said than done. Yeah, that's that's the hardest thing very hard It's really hard. I mean I have you ever thought about when we were coming up and I'm you know 10 15 years At least 15 years before you guys but can you imagine if social media existed when we were young and coming up? I don't know how Badly it would have fucked with my head, but it would have been bad. It would have been really bad That's the thing we have to give our kids a lot of credit because I think we had Uh 20 years to adjust. Yeah, so we we kind of grew up in it and you know, we were in our careers working While it was developing how old were you guys when you put out like the first? Put your other record. It was 2020. No, I mean it was 2000. So It was 25 to your kids six years ago. Yeah, so I was 20. Yeah, I was 23. So yeah, exactly. So which is still like Like now when I look back on it 20, I was I was still so immature because of I think One the house I grew up in was very religious so we weren't allowed to experience anything And then when we left home we left in a very kind of We ran away kind of because you escaped escaped. Yes and Then we went into the world which we weren't allowed to learn about or know about And we discovered everything kind of the hard way because we had no information. Yeah, and then I think about we were probably like 16 until we were 27 It probably took me that long to like Would you say it's a personal question? Yeah, I love personal questions. Would you say that Your religious upbringing which I'm assuming because of the way you phrased it was pretty Not severe but strict. Yes. It was severe intentional. Yeah, it was traumatic Would you say that that helped you in life going out or hindered you? Oh, that's a really good question. And as you know, I think probably it's complicated. Yeah I think if you had to skew one way or the other I would say it hurt me more in the functionality of like knowing how the world works. It's a causality to life that is like Anyone listening because I listen a lot of the people that listen to this show are figuring out just kind of They want to optimize. They want to grow. They want to figure out how to succeed in life overall And I think it's like this like Positive thing we do we sit around and talk about how we did what we do people are listening. They admire you You're a legend, right? So they go Well, that's cool. And then they get to hear the person and the philosophy behind How they approach life and their stance and their worldview And I think that helps inform them whether they realize it or not and like having a bit more of a self-love positive optimistic look overall of like how how can I go forward and go up? And then how does the world work? And that's the thing with religion What happens is there's this really good set of principles values these good ideas, you know, um that are I do still hold Really dear, but there's this magic element of like if I pray hard enough, it'll happen So that's one part of wanting anything is thinking about it wishing for it praying for it The other side of it is actually going forward and and taking action towards Any goal a lot of people forget that step. Yeah You know, it's it's the same thing with manifestation, which is a huge Part of my life. Yeah, and it's something that I've Been doing my whole life that I did unconsciously and then I in the last I'd say 10 years I started to really zero in on that and that's just for lack of a better word It's intention There's this amazing book that's sort of my bible called as a man thinketh That I love that. Yeah, James Allen. Yep when I read that book Everything started to make sense to me in my life And that all the amazing things that happened to me, especially interactions with other human beings I Hold into my path and the things that were bad that happened to me are negative for the most part. I somehow Thought it's like I think it was Henry Ford Whose quote was whether you think you can or you think you can't you're correct? Well, okay, so what I've been doing the last 10 years since I really came into that Is with the people closest to me particularly my sons. I have three sons Wow Is I constantly remind them that it's all about how you think and what you think your thoughts dictate your path Absolutely, and there's no two ways about it. Some people are just such Instinctive wild animals. They are not even conscious. They just believe they think and they believe and they go forward And then there's no question. You know those it's something like an athlete who just goes towards the goal And it's just their natural inclination now some people like artists. I'd say a lot of us are heady Neurotic kind of body we think a lot because what are we doing? We're imagining the things and then we make them and so we can fall into negative thought loops In those processes that get in the way of that But not to interrupt you but you referenced athletes in my opinion. This is a great example Michael Jordan clearly early on in his life Decided he was going to be the greatest he decided he was going to out Work everyone out perform. He was going to be the best It's not enough to just think that if you go back and trace his history Who was in the gym the longest yep who practiced the most who did all the extra work? So that he could fulfill that prophecy. So it's it's a it's a two two part two part You can't just think it you have to act on it. You have to make the moves or else you're just you know that and that's where prayer as on its own for me falls Flat where it's like I don't I think if it works for you and it makes you feel good I'm all for it for me personally. That's just not and it's somebody who did pray, you know I'd say the first 35 years of my life. I had a connection and I felt something that I One day It vanished. Hmm and it was replaced by what I believe now what works for me now. Hmm But it may be a was an evolution. Yeah, I think if you think the same things and Go about things the same way your whole life. You miss the point. You miss the point like changes inevitable, but also changes good I love have my mind changed. Don't you I love to be enlightened on something by someone I like to be wrong something. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I like especially when it benefits me Because being wrong doesn't mean that it's bad. Yeah, just means you were incorrect everybody's Capable of that and regularly when I'm proved wrong about something or if I go wow man, I got that so ass backwards Thank goodness. I know that now because that's going to help me going forward. That's a good thing Yeah, I feel the same exact way. That's interesting because um I remember my mom used to say stand for nothing and fall for anything, right? And and and that was she was saying that about about religion. That's a good idea That's a misguided kind of if you apply it to the wrong place, right? Everyone needs a value system Yes, but you're values can be different than mine. Yeah, like if you value this and I value that I do think that like whatever your values are You should take the time to establish them in your in your in yourself if you're too Constricted which I can be sometimes actually I am very sensitive To hurting people's feelings. Hmm. I really feel here an empath. I do I don't I don't want anyone to feel bad about how they feel Even if I don't agree with it. I really don't like I know that sounds crazy and I I think it's admirable um the personality of this show is like a positive regard Yeah At all costs kind of which sounds really but have you ever at least in this format sat across from somebody who you know You are diametrically opposed to on almost every level. So that's interesting. No Which would be interesting. I don't know if I do it though because right why there's a few people I feel that way There's only a few people in the world that I feel And I almost feel like if I met them they might change my mind I might I might understand a little bit. Well, that would be good Maybe but there are also people who you know And I know who I just know enough about their views on certain things that I go I don't want to sit at a table with you. No, you can you can feel that way I pass all that but that's you get to an age. Don't you that's the that's The exact kind of energy I want nowhere near me But don't you feel like you get to an age where you can just pass and you don't even think about it? You're like, yeah, I'm not going to my favorite word is no. Yeah, you're like, uh, well actually my favorite two words are no Thank you. No, thanks. Yeah, you're like, yeah, I'm not going to that that just sounds it sounds like I'll feel terrible Well, the best criteria the way to do it and it took me 60 years to figure this out Is when somebody asks you if you want to do something pretend you have to do it that day Think about what your brain tells you and if your brain is like, oh fuck Then say no. Yeah, it's simple and it's I've been practicing practicing this now for A year and a half more than ever in my life where Day in and day out I get an email or I get a text or I get a phone and I go no, thank you Thank you so much, but I'm going to pass or as my wife my wife's sarcastic reply is oh my god I totally would but I don't want to and that's the other thing. I wish I could There are certain things we have to do right? Yeah, we have to do but as you if you get to a certain point in your life If you're lucky enough to get to a point where you don't have to rely on doing things you don't want to do Then don't do them. Don't do them And it's it feels cold to say this but sometimes The things that you don't want to do you you do because you don't want Somebody to feel bad or you know that they would really like you to do this or be there or whatever then you'd have to do For me, I do sort of a I take stock of that dynamic and go I'm not gonna go. I'm not Putting myself through that for that. I'm just not and I and it's not like I'm not going. It's not that it's like Thank you so much, but I pass or I have this other thing or whatever and dude saying no Is so fun. Yeah, I love saying no it feels good And that's why the and then the yeses become really special and the no can like feel for example I was about to say well you come and do this You have no idea how many knows And I'm sure I'm sure most people that sit in the chair opposite you They don't they don't do a bunch of stuff And it's like but you look, you know, you do your due diligence. So you dive in and you You go, oh, yeah, that looks it looks like time will spend and I was right so far Well, I would say that first of all I can see why you're so close to your sons Whether just such smart asses. There's so much fun to talk to. Yeah the sarc. It's just a sarcasm extravaganza But also you're easy sarcasm palooza, but don't you think that your um success And your experience right because I know that when I say your success, right? When I say a legendary career legendary songs things like that Those are moments divided by all these other moments of rejection and failure and work and hardship and haters Right and going through the whole spectrum and the pendulum of a career, which is highs and lows And only someone who's been I'd say in a career Long enough, let's say five seven ten fifteen years you start to put years behind you and you start to realize like Oh a career I can only call it a career because it's behind me and I put these years together and I stayed in it I didn't quit. I didn't kill myself. Right and so you have an accomplished career That you can hold I think because of the time and the experience you have but then when I sit with you I can still Sit with a person who it doesn't feel like brought that whole career in the room with them and there's space for two people to talk and Hear each other. I just think it's interesting when I'm that's a lovely compliment man So thank you very sweet of you to say the one thing I'll say is when we first saw each other out there And I did not think you would remember me said security. Who is this guy? Yeah, like what was this guy doing here? I didn't think you would remember meeting me So I took the liberty of saying nice to meet you Oh And I was like dude we met in you're like we met in Amsterdam or germany Where we were and it was at the very beginning of my career. It was it was uh, didn't we we on some radio? We were on a show together tv show or something. Yeah, and you were one of the first like legends I'd met someone with like these this big career big songs legendary guy And so it was like a big deal for us. We were like you guys were so cool We were so I remember feeling like I I think we wanted to go hang out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We were all like some Radio tour press tour, you know how those things go so I always remember it and I remember too And I did not think you would remember it and that's like an interesting thing And why why would I think but in my mind I'm like, yeah, he's a legend He wouldn't remember but um and that was the first thing he said to me He's like, no, we met back and I was like, I did not think you'd remember that. Yeah Well, plus, you know the things that we have in common are kind of crazy too. Not crazy, but they're good coincidences Yeah, you know the the two degrees of Lionel. Yep, you know that right, you know that backstory Yep, and that we're both I'm a coach on the voice Australia. Yep, and you were yeah, I mean That's kind of that's interesting. Interesting that we have that in common. I'm sure there's plenty of other things I forgot incredibly handsome. We're both good-looking We both care about our health. Yeah, um, we both love being dads. We both love being even though it's a selfish act We're we're very I feel like we're very uh, we're feminists. Yeah, totally big feminists Well, the the most influential people in my life have been women mine too Every every guardian angel I've had uh has been good women particularly the woman I'm married to now same like she is she is um my Daisy is um, I I mean I could do two hours on What she represents to me other than my wife my lover my confidant my best friend How long have you guys been married? We just celebrated 10 years um 10 days ago. That's great. So 2015. And this is my second time around her second time around I think the fact that we met later Was a big contributor, you know, there's trade-offs There are things that we realize like we don't we won't have as much time as we would have if we'd met back then But we might not have survived. There are things that we you know, we didn't have kids We didn't have that thing But it's the glass is so half more than half full on this one But more to the point she my mother there were women who were just the best teachers for me and and the people I admired and I admire my wife's tenacity vision Curiosity her she's the most curious person I've ever met. That's so sexy. Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, my wife is Uh, I would say the same thing everyone knows her as one thing Which is it's always weird to talk about her because I feel like people have There was a a top line or a narrative that she couldn't really control That people could run away with back in the day when that was like really like there was no instagram We could go on and go that's not true. I did the whatever and she's always been so dignified to not Try and Sell anything to anyone. Isn't it great that we speak about our wives like this? Yeah, but that's how you should right? We also both seriously outkicked our coverage I punched about my weight because I don't know if I had as much integrity when I met her as I do now because of her Oh, what a great thing. Do you know what I mean? Are you watching this Nicole? Cause I hope so Somebody's getting lucky later. Yeah defy lucky um Um, I think I like to think I did or I had the potential Well, you obviously had the potential or an aspect of it or an amount of it But the same with me. I've become a much better person better person. That's what happens They give you that cliche, you know, you make me a better man. Yeah, it is your better half All that's it and she doesn't feel the need to prove it So that's the thing is I kind of need to sell things But I'll be on here talking about it or I'll be there like I kind of go a little over the top sometimes and like Telling everyone how great she is and because that that's my wife and and I'm proud of her and I believe in her and sometimes I feel like It's been an unfair narrative and back in the 2000s. They were awful to women Yeah, there was all this like if you if you wikipedia her and you read You're reading the narrative that they wrote back then that no one ever went and said hey, that was wrong And actually she could have fucking sued you and in today's world. She if she sued you she'd probably win Right, but back then Errin got away with more And you could say whatever you want and there's no rules and everyone was running wild because it was the time when It all took form to now. It's evolved to where it is now Where it's more like this independent People can get two sides of a story all these things But what I what I she doesn't care about any of it But maybe her reluctance Even back then to fight it Or to be Counter punching is what contributed to the elegance that you're talking about now, which is a elegance is a great word She's very elegant Yeah, I feel the same way about daisy and in turn it makes me more elegant, which I don't know if I am But in relationship to her I am. Yeah, it's kind of just natural just happens when I think about my wife I think about how I shudder to think if I hadn't met her Yeah, me too everything that we've done together, which is just build a life. It's not Just the kids or the businesses or anything we're doing. It's everything. It's just us showing up every day trying our best And working together Yeah, and figuring things out. I have I never thought about this until the second I think that in terms of Our wives making us better men in terms of character alone, right? There's a similar Thing I was a really good kid growing up. I really caused my parents Very little trouble. So was I like really and I had I was free to express myself. Where'd you grow up? Chicago? Oh, wow, there's a lot of trouble you could find in Chicago. There's a lot. Yeah My dad was a great Musician composer jingle writer. My mom was a singer. She sang on the commercials So there was it was a musical family, but my parents were pretty progressive and Very about like I from the time I was a kid I remember hearing my parents talk about civil rights and women's rights and gay rights and all that like this inclusive humane And so I was always allowed to express myself Up to a point and then I had to be respectful that I didn't I didn't have free reign or any of that, you know, but My parents The way they raised me and because of the kind of people I knew they were I think what helped define my character was that I never wanted to disappoint them in me I never wanted them to go. Oh Like they could be pissed off at me, but don't be disappointed in me And that's how I feel about my wife. That's how I feel about my wife and my kids. I don't and my kids too. Yeah, I just would I clock myself sometimes going Oh This would disappoint the people I love the most and I and I because I respect their opinions So much that I would never do something Instinctively, I just won't do something that I know that they would frown upon That's something like To me that's something like god. That's something like right. That's a version of that. Yeah, I agree It's a it's a standard that you hold yourself to Because there's a higher purpose. It's not about money. It's not about Yeah, it's like about something else and it's a feeling you couldn't bear to live with And I think at the same time the only way I got there was because she was gracious And forgiving and when we were younger I was still Growing learning figuring it out It takes a long time and a lot of experience of being around people who are entertained for a living To get comfortable with separating the fame person from the real person right and then actually interacting with them with no Judgment of that. It's one thing I love about my wife. She can separate. She doesn't care What company someone owns or what movie they were in or what it doesn't matter what kind of success they had It does not factor in right. She's like that guy's cool or right that person should be I guess like my perspective over the years has been and I'll tell you why it's a great story actually 1986 I'm making my first album. Wow in LA and You know been influenced over the years by a lot of people But when I finally got a record deal and I was making my first album It happened to be the year that Peter Gabriel put out so well of Peter Gabriel and so Along with earth wind and fires. I am or my two favorite albums of all time And I was so obsessed with the Peter Gabriel and I was a huge Peter Gabriel fan before that but then when so came out I remember Standing in line at a record store on melrose that's long gone And waiting in line the day the album came out because you were afraid that it was going to get sold out Right and I bought the cd And I took it home and I couldn't wait and I had headphones and the first track came on red rain And at the end of red rain, I was sobbing I was crying my eyes out because it was so I thought it was just the most magnificent thing I'd ever heard in my life And I was so happy That he delivered, you know, yeah, yeah I remember in his voice. So I was obsessed with Peter Gabriel four months later. I'm in the studio off and on I'm having lunch at a restaurant And Peter Gabriel walked in with a group of like five people and they said and I and my first thought was I'm in the same room as Peter Gabriel And I was with my ex-wife and she said you got to go say hi and I was like, are you crazy? Say what what? There's no way. She said no, no, no, you're gonna really regret it. You should you got to say you got to talk to him I was like, what am I gonna say to like and I was like, no, no, no And she just kept peer-pressuring me and I don't know how I I got up and I I was shaking and I and I didn't want to interrupt So I just sort of lurked there for a second and then I saw a lull in the conversation and I stepped forward and he turned and looked at me and I said Mr. Gabriel, I'm so I don't want to interrupt. I'm so sorry. I just and I didn't know what I was gonna say and I said I just I needed to thank you for making music and he got up from the table And he too. He was what a lovely thing to say man. What's your name? Oh, you musician. I was like, yeah, I'm making my first time on and he and he was so lovely And when I walked away the way I felt Is how I want people to feel when they walk away from me. That's a great mantra for everything Do unto others you and I know The road is can be a blast but the road is really hard It is and especially sometimes you don't know what's going on in somebody's day or life Right, there have been many times when I'm going I've gone through been at like my lowest low And I'll be in a restaurant or I'll be in an elevator Or and somebody comes if they come up to me because of that Peter Gabriel interaction this thing clicks in me it clicks in you and I Immediately shift into I the minute I connect eyes with them. I think I want them to walk away feeling the way I felt that day Well, it's interesting because if Peter Gabriel heard this I would say It's something that we all have to remember is that we're helping shape Grow and form the the way that impacted me if I impacted somebody in their life But you have yeah, well we have with our music for sure or with a performance or but to personally Interact with a stranger who you'll probably never see again Yeah, but if there's something in that Encounter even if it's as simple as they walk away and they go I'm so glad I went up to him Well, that's all you want someone to say is man. I'm so glad I met that guy. Yeah across everyone your friends Your family which was like I met the hymn. He's a total dick I would say I got plenty of those I would say that I have the same Generally the same philosophy. I think that uh, if you walked up and met me. I'm a pretty nice guy I think I'm probably more a pretty nice guy who goes what the fuck are you looking at? Well, I think I think and early on I felt threatened You know, yeah, um, also when we're young there's no handbook for this no There's no tutorial no on how to deal with fame which happens overnight And I had a love selfish theme. Okay. Well, there you go. So you were you were it was all kinds of other stuff You were projecting other shit. Yeah. Yeah, but I was always pretty nice I wanted people to like me and I think at this stage of my life. I kind of meet people where they're at Yeah, so if someone only see if someone sees me and they're like, you're the guy from good charlotte And I love your music. I meet him there and I'm happy. Yeah. Oh, don't get me wrong. I can be a total dick Yeah, given the right circumstances. Yeah, I'm no wallflower. Right if you fuck with me It's gonna be bad for you. Well, you're smart. Well, but my point is in that very specific way when there is no, um There's nothing prior. It's just an initial encounter with someone who comes up to me because they like what I do or even just because they Recognize me, you know, they might even be fans, but they're like, oh, I think that's Richard Marx I'm gonna go say hi in those circumstances. I have a sort of mantra. I feel the same way but um, and I do think that Having that philosophy about strangers Does feed into the fact that I think that Like I'm sure you our default position is nice our default position is polite respectful polite I think manners good manners. Yeah, you know, like please and thank you Yeah, and just like my sons to this day in their 30s They'll especially if it's an older person, they say ma'am and sir. Yes, sir. Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am. Um, sir That's all that to my kids as long as they've ever heard me All of they'll be things that they they say my dad always said that type shit Yeah, one of them will be that manners are the thing that got me everywhere in life. Good manners. Yeah Just having good manners. Yeah, and those kind of please. Thank you those old-fashioned statements Do you ever hear George Carlin's about his grandfather? No George Carlin said, you know, my grandfather used to say something to me He used to say I'm gonna go upstairs and fuck your grandmother See got a good laughter That's funny. Not me. George Carlin said that boy. That's your Ground to a halt this conversation. Well, there's a lot of weight in that statement. Um What would you say is when you say the low point What would you say the lowest point of your career was or it has been my career? Yeah, like or your Let's say career in life If they're intertwined because they feel like if i'm not doing well in life In my personal life in my life where If things aren't going well with Something like really consequential like a relation in my relationship or if it was my kids or if it was my health Or if it was something like that, I could not enjoy my career It wouldn't matter what i'm doing. Well, I think those are two very different things Let me answer the the professional question first the two lowest points that come to mind does anything stand out Yeah, what I was I guess 20 19 I'd been out here. Thanks to lionel Lionel was the reason I moved out to la lionel richie heard my demo tape of my first four songs when I was a senior in high school It's a miraculous crazy story of how he even got the cassette tape Wait, tell me this story. Okay, so I stop there I was uh, I was a massive commodore's fan in lionel and lionel was just leaving the commodore's At this time, right? I was a senior in high school My best friend in high school was a year older than me. So he was in college in atlanta emory He was had a roommate and they were they would be playing tapes and Right, that's what you did. You'd crank up the cassette on the boombox. Yeah Well, my best friend he had my demo tape And he was they were playing in it in their apartment like they were playing r.e.s speed wagon Yeah, you know, like it was just in the mix And his roommate said this who's he's your friend from high school. He's really good He goes something's gotta happen with this guy, right? He goes, you know I grew up with a guy who works with the commodore's. I'm gonna send him Richard's tape. So I get this call from my buddy going It's my friend's friend who grew up with the guy, right? And I'm like, yeah, right I don't know six weeks later. My parents phone rings and it's fucking lionel richie. No way And first I thought I thought I was being pranked But then he when he started talking I was such a fan I knew his speaking voice from watching him in interviews and stuff and I was like, oh my god, it's really It's really him. His voice is unmistakable. Yeah, and he said doctor You know, right Doctor, you know, I get a lot of tapes and man, I just wanted to tell you I think you're really talented and what's your plan? What do you talk to me for like 20 minutes? Wow And at the end of that conversation He said, look, I can't help you. I don't you know, I'm just I'm about to make my first solo record But I don't think you can make it from Chicago. You got to come to LA And if you do look me up and he gave me his number and I graduated a few months later You were in high school. I was in high school. Holy shit, dude And I I had applied to northwestern to to this music program at northwestern and I bailed And with my parents blessing as soon as I graduated at 18, I packed my bags and I got an apartment in LA My dad flew me out to kind of help me get set up. Yeah I called Lionel. He said I'm in the studio. It was then a and m now. It's hensen He said come on dad. You should come down in the studio tomorrow. My dad and I come in Of course, he's as gracious as he can be Lionel We're sitting on the couch in the control room and they're working on Background vocals for the song you are and it's Lionel. That's crazy, dude That's how I changed my life and these other two background singers who he worked with all the time I still remember James James Cochran and Debbie Thomas And I'm sitting there and I could see that they had been working on this song's background vocals for two days in a row And my dad and I looked at each other coming from the jingle business. My dad was like this shit had to be done in 10 minutes But we're watching and it's a blend issue and Lionel's out there singing and he's frustrated and they're not getting the And all of a sudden I can see he's frustrated and Lionel looks through the glass And he goes like this. He points to me. He goes Come out here and I literally did one of these like Like look behind me kind of thing And I go out and he goes You've been listening to what we're doing. I said, yeah, and he goes here. Here's the headphones. You sing my part And Debbie you sing and he and he went in the control room And they countered it off and we you are the sun you are the rain We did the first pass and Lionel hit the talk back and he goes that's the sound And I did all the choruses and then he said we got another song put that other song up Richard Sing and then he said to me that day and this is the most important thing. He said come back next week I I can use you next week because we're cutting another track. I think you'd be great on this So I ended up singing on like four songs on that first solo record But what he said to me joe was did they keep your vocals? Oh, yeah, are you fucking kidding me on that record? Are you on you are dude? Wait, just wait. I knew we were soulmates. No, no just wait All night long all night. That's me. Yo all night. I did not know this I didn't know this too. I thought that I just thought that Lionel discovered your music Dude, he gave me my first job. Holy shit But that's first what he said to me that day and this is so powerful You'll really understand this as that we were leaving the studio and I'm so grateful that my dad was sitting there when that happened He was so he was beaming. Yeah, Lionel said to me. I don't know how much Work I have for you on this, you know, I'm gonna I'll probably bring you in on a couple of things You know to sing some background vocals, but he said just know that if I'm in this room Meaning the studio you're welcome to be in this room And I said, what do you mean? He said like if you want to be here you can be here and I And I was there every day. Of course you were that was college That's college if he was doing a horn part a horn section overdub. I was there. That's right He was cutting basic tracks. I was there. I went to fucking hit record production school Yep with Lionel Richie and James and James Carmichael his his co-producer. Yep. I watched them record truly Wow, I watched them record my love And Kenny Rogers coming in and singing just thinking about you baby That's crazy. So then through Lionel I now know Kenny Rogers and Lionel recommended me to Kenny So Kenny hires me to sing background vocals on a record and I was booked for two days And at the end of the first session I overheard Kenny mentioned to the producer that they still were looking for a song He described it and went home to my apartment And I wrote a song and I came in the next day and I did Exactly the thing that would usually get you fired as the background singer, which is I've got a song Yeah, and Kenny Rogers instead of kicking me out Took me to a piano and made me play it number one country song crazy I wrote I wrote three songs on that Kenny Rogers record all tracing back to who? Lionel Richie so cut to I met Nicole by the way when she was that tall. Yeah, you know the first time Six seven years ago. I had this incredible invitation Barbara Streisand asked me to come and And play with her at Hyde Park legendary. She was on the main stage. I was on the b-stage Still I got to play for 20,000 people or something like that. She played she played for 75,000 people or something And all big yeah big shows and Lionel was in London playing the next night And I didn't know that so I go and I do my show and then I hung out You know with Barbara and watched her do her thing because we've worked together and friends And I didn't even look at my phone all night, you know, I get back to the hotel and there's a text from Lionel And he says my brother I was sitting on my patio of my hotel room And I was listening to 20,000 people singing your songs back to you and I was just so proud of you And I was like dude, it's all because of you and you know, so my relationship with him He's one of those like he there's no way to for me to really truly accurately describe The impact that he had on my life. Yeah That's oh my god I just realized you asked me about like the worst low points and then we I went off selling pretty high points to me Yeah, I was a high point Well around that time after I had had some hits as a songwriter and I'm I've got the support of somebody like Lionel Every record company rejected me rejected me your songs for you I'm talking about endless summer nights a number two single. I'm talking about shit or none better on top five single Wow people every record company was like nope doesn't look right no hits No don't like his voice That happened for so long for like a year year and a half that I really thought it's not meant to be I'll I'll be a songwriter. I hopefully David Foster told me I shouldn't sing I was working with David a bunch and we joke about it to this day But he said man, I you should totally be a writer and producer, but you're not an artist. You shouldn't sing. Yeah That's buddy. So that was a low point Cut to 12 or 13 years later. I've had 10 years in a row of platinum hit after hit and and then I put out an album in the late 90s That instead of going double platinum and went double plywood Right just didn't connect didn't work happens and I Was devastated. Hmm. I was like, oh because I knew I couldn't Well, not couldn't I knew that I didn't have it in me at that point to reinvent And I didn't want to go chasing something that wasn't me Looking back it was a big mistake at that point to because I produced all my own records That would have been a great time to reach out to somebody else and say help me Let's try something but it felt desperate it felt and so I went I'm just going to write and produce for other people for a while, which is kind of like what happened after that but I will tell you that that period between Deciding that and then having the luck and the success of writing for in sync and Josh Groban and barbers try and all those other Keith Urban The little period between deciding that the public doesn't like me anymore Or I don't I'm not having hits anymore. That was hard. That was really low a really low point. I thought that I Was smart enough and intellectually honest enough that I expected the this to happen at some point Like I thought, you know, nobody has hits forever, but when it happened I was like early 30s because I started so young. Yeah, and I me too it really it felt like such a rejection I had the same moment in my 30s, but I think that's a natural too because you're also coming of age Yeah, and I think there's a dissolution of where you like Realize like one you realize age. Yeah, two you realize that nothing stays the same So things only evolve And so I also look back and I I took it so personally But then I realized soon after that it was a part of the Evolution of music which is that this happened in the late 90s And guess what the same thing happened to brian adams and the same thing happened to billy joe Everyone happened to all everyone white male pop singers and line all No one wants to talk about it because it's well particularly white male pop singers, right? We're like the most uncool thing and that was it and our in our Domination of the charts ended. It wasn't just me. It felt like it was just me and I looked around and I was like, oh, okay Yeah, and also you got to also zoom out and go the size of the songs you wrote and the songs you put out And the records you put out were so big You have to kind of remember that like if your Music defined a decade Right a defined a time, right? And it's part of this landscape of this incredible music And then whatever era comes in the 90s or whatever and suddenly the world has shifted in some way and If you're not careful you can feel left behind right and you're not actually Yeah, but it's impossible to know that when it's happening when it's happening just feels like it just feels like your membership is cancelled But what it is is like then you go and you start producing and you write for in sync and you write for this person You write for that person and then the world there's like this a new generation of people Are getting to know you in a different way Yeah, and then you come back to your music and you start to realize like oh, I'm weaving this like very interesting career I'd love to be able to take credit for it. Like I thought that but you're an instinct. Hey, you're an animal You're just going and now I'm gonna go that way. I just I just knew that even though I wasn't Welcome on the charts as an artist anymore I could I'll go back to what I was doing before And luckily there were so many artists that were like, I'll take your song Or you know, I want you to produce me even even Michael Bolton bless him Who we I guess we felt maybe competitive with each other a little bit really there Yeah, I sang on one of those early records and we were always We were nice to each other, but we I think we were both competitive. Well, you know, it's like you were the band Yeah, we're competing for chart positions. Of course. We did right. Yeah. Yeah, I lost to grammy that he won Yeah, you're gonna mean that kind of thing and he reached out to me and said co-compepsy Will you come yeah, but will you come to my house and write some songs with me and produce some songs on my record? That's like Sure. Yeah. Well, not only do we write a couple of songs. I'm so proud of they weren't hits But they were like it was such a great experience and we were friends forever I got my heart's broken for him right now, but like we've been great pals ever since Yeah, he's one of my favorite people I went through the same kind of journey of like from 2000 to 2011 It was non-stop right and then 2012 13 Okay, so from 2000 the 2011 2012 was the final kind of extinction of physical product in that time when CDs went away, right? And then mp3s were there, but there was no platforms So it was all music was free for like five to seven years right six eight years nine years There was no way to there was no way to know what's record was doing good when you put a record out It was like everyone's stealing music and there was no way of tracking like what's big as far as like what people are Yeah, and Not that the billboard charts were ever really truly authentic true. You're right about that, but Spotify didn't really Materialize until 2015 2016 was when it really started going like oh they have this many followers and there's charts and all that and streaming really took form in the mid teens so from 110 Imagine if a stream counted as a actual radio play back in our day. I mean we would be trillionaires Yeah, just like the Spotify owners. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so in between that though that awkward the six seven eight nine years of development of between physical going away and streaming becoming music was dead and everyone said it was over and everyone said that this industry is done And it's not a worthwhile thing and artists only make money on tour now. It's true that touring is our likely one of our biggest revenue streams But at the end of the day a career is now looking more like there's multiple revenue streams We're in a modern time where artists make more than they ever have I think So it's interesting. I look at it a lot like sports like basketball players baseball players in the 90s versus today Right It doesn't even touch night and day So but in that time and you were there too. So we were both there when they said it's all done. It's dead It was a scary time because I actually believed them I I didn't know that the world keeps turning and that things evolve and that the next thing will come and everything will be fine just Now And that was in my 30s. I was in my early 30s when we were going through that I thought I was done and I was really depressed And but it was really great because I had Nicole So I thought I was done and that was my worth. That was it The success of that band was the best I had and that would define me and that's only how they know me And I was going to be a failure and a joke and I was really afraid of failure I was really afraid of of also embarrassing, you know at that point Yeah, there was that when you've had it's embarrassing you had hit after hit after hit and then it's like not what do you mean? You only sold a couple thousand tickets. You're like it's still pretty good Yeah, but we we kind of live in a world where if you're not at the top Your number one is the only spot and the other hundred people who have success don't count the only Perspectives in that scenario that are more warped than ours is the public's and it's mean And it's and they love to see you that it feels like this. It feels like they love to see you fail They love to see you Make a mistake or they love to see you you'd not do well because it's funny, right? Because ha ha look at that guy. He was so big but that's what happened, right? It's like the people who say Um, where are they now? Yeah, and I was well. Well, where were you ever? Yeah, you know what I mean like My favorite is has been The people who use that term Crack me up because when you try to explain to them, let me tell you I don't think you understand what that means It means has been successful Has been all over the world touring has been all the things you have not been And there's nothing more gratifying than hearing The thing you didn't know. Yeah, right like okay. Think about this let's say you're somewhere in this point that you're talking about that I'm talking about and you wrote a hit song for in sync, right? and Now it's not going to be general knowledge until it becomes general knowledge So someone will be like oh that guy and he goes. Yeah, did you he wrote that fucking song? It's number one Or it's this or it's that I started to embrace that I started to embrace the things I could accomplish in silence And the things I could accomplish um that no one knew about yeah I hope for you because it's true for me. It's taken a long time. I'm much older than you There is this beautiful freedom when you if you can come to the point where you combine that with Yeah, I don't care whether they know or not. That's right. And when you can walk in a room and you can be Like all I've almost become I really love the idea of feeling like people don't know what I'm up to and that I'm doing things I really love and it gives me a lot of freedom and and privacy And look how quietly I sang you are and all night long and you didn't even know It's true. Look at that. Look at that success. It was so quiet And and let me finish that story with this When I was a kid I'd had left when I was younger, but I was he was around until I was uh, uh, probably Uh, when I was like 10 11 12 was when it started all falling apart And when I was little he would play you are he loved that song He got that record. He loved lino And that song really like had a huge effect on my Perception of like a good song. It's a great song. And so it's always kind of been burned in my Songwriting DNA of how you write a song. I'm sure you've told I told lino It's interesting when I first started when me and nicole first got together lino was a very warm Loving from the from the jump as opposed to the asshole that he is now You would almost expect you have to warm the father-in-law Gets to know you and then likes you he kind of just he just but that's him artists see other artists I think that's why he saw you. Yeah, we find other artists. We know we we know real We know when someone's a real songwriter. Yeah, we go all that guy's for real Or a real guitar player or a real you just know like you're like, oh that he's a real one like he's the real deal Yeah, it's not faking that right. I can't fake that no pose him And maybe it was a little bit of that but also I had good manners and I think he's like old school like that And so from the jump he was always like a really loving unsupported father-in-law And through like also just like a crazy time in those early 2000s and I remember telling him in passing I don't know my dad used to play you are all the time and that song has a huge It's burned in my and he didn't immediately say, you know, richard marches singing on that. No But he loves you he loves you and I'm sure he'll hear this and he'll and he'll be tickled And I love him and at our wedding I had no idea right. We get married at his house There's a small wedding Small enough to be small but big enough to be big It was like 150 people 100 people something that there's a great wedding though Is that his house in the reception? He jumps up and plays you are of course he did and I this was I told him two years I I got choked up. Yeah, he it was a really it was really important This is why I'll tell you my dad and me had just reconciled a couple year a year or two before I got married and it was a huge deal that he was coming to my wedding Because I didn't think he was going to be at any of my life moments because we hadn't talked in Decades wow and then we reconciled and we had this really beautiful kind of like is he still with us? No, no it's gone That's all right, and it was a really big deal for me because I reconciled with him After I met Lionel and Lionel was kind of one of those were voices of Wisdom he's a very wise guy. It's just like what do you what do you what are you so mad at? Or what you know, you'll regret one day if you don't make peace with that whatever that means. Yeah So he's not telling he's a person who doesn't want it. He doesn't tell you what to do But he will tell you like he's always kind of had a wise way of taking the the weight out of some things And going like man just you're gonna regret that Right or say like he tried his best And he was a very he's very gracious and also when he meets people Very my dad was a fan of his so imagine this I reconciled with my dad He comes to my wedding Lionel plays you are which is like both me and my dad are just like yeah That's a moment. You'll never forget. Yeah, my dad comes to Thanksgiving that same year before Before we got married. That's when they met so the wedding was in December The Thanksgiving was where we were getting the family together and I was like really nervous like my family. Oh my god This is a great side ways any second it's a it's a rough bunch. They're a great bunch of people But I'm like so I just was I was I told Lionel's like listen me and my dad we've had a complicated relationship It's we're still but we were in this like Honeymoon yeah of reconnection and it lasted all the way till he died So we had 10 years of like a honeymoon. So I could say in 10 years with my dad I got more out of that than maybe some people get in a lifetime Right and um, I've tried to replicate that 10 years with my son and be as close as I felt like we got Anyways, I told Lionel's like hey my dad my dad comes to Thanksgiving with a black guy. He's wearing Ray Vans He's hilarious. I was like dad. Why are you wearing Ray Vans? It's two o'clock and we're inside And he's like, oh, I gotta do a little fight and uh, I was like, oh my god, and then Lionel comes and he just Loved on my dad was so they loved each other They actually he they saw each other My dad was a very old school guy and Lionel appreciated that and he loved him Yeah, and he's like I see a lot of you After the fact he said I was like hey Lionel. Thanks man. That was that was means a lot to me He's like your dad's great I see a lot of you and him and you and then he plays that song at the wedding anyways all all to say There's a part of him as big as he you know, he's he's he's always going he's always on tour He's always he's iconic. He's got all the things he is But there's a part of him where he goes he what did he see did he hear did he and he did oh, yeah He caught that yeah, he heard that yeah, he heard me say that that song was important. Yeah He saw the the interaction with me and my dad at Thanksgiving He told the band at the wedding to have that song ready No one I didn't talk to the band. It was it was a great band. We got this amazing band that played all this classic See him here's what we're gonna do. He did he did he caught that so when you think this big iconic guy Who's his whole life has been poured into this legacy and you go did he notice that did he see that and then you see that Mom and you're like, yeah, he did Well as big as he became okay the same year that he did endless love And wrote lady for Kenny Rogers And was leaving the comedors to start his solo album He called the number written on the backup of cassette tape cold called my parents house Think about that because you heard a tape and he just wanted to tell this whoever this kid was hey, man You should I really think you're good. You should do this. Who does that? Who takes the time to do that and it wasn't like hey, man Lana Richie heard you tape but he was like we talked for 20 25 like the first time I Saw him after this recording session He was playing one of the last gigs with the comedors. They were rapping out like a farewell thing And he invited me and my parents to the gig I forget where the gig was Well, we had to we got a hotel room or motel room nearby Because it was far from where we were And I was with my parents and he came to to the motel room I on this is such a vivid memory. He's sitting On his sitting on the floor It was this tiny little hotel room because he wanted my parents to feel comfortable about them leaving their one and only child In LA yeah to pursue this he wanted them to this is after a gig He spent an hour In this hotel room with my parents and me just talking to them and going, you know, I'm I can't protect Richard from everything but there are ways I can protect him and he's always got he can always come to me And like just to make put their minds at ease and I look back at that Especially at that time of his career and I think Who the fuck does that? Lionel does that. Yeah, Lionel. He's he acts on feeling Remarkable. Yeah, remarkable human being. Yeah, he is I never I never see him I ask him I ask him out sometimes and he'll be like, oh, yeah, we can Yeah, he's not he's no one ever sees him. He's he's working. He's always doing he's working. He's going always He's always playing shows. He's always he'll text me. He'll go American Idol Richard. I would love to I'm in Hawaii I'm like or he's on vacation. Yeah for the weekend between the Taurus I've only witnessed a few people I would say a handful of people that Can't go anywhere without being inundated And the amount of energy he spends because he's so he is like that same as you he's gracious And he's nice to everyone and he's I think that's a real little old school thing He's like there is something under the understanding of like the people he navigates it really well He does But I don't know that it leaves a lot of time At the end of that day right when he comes home from that world. He's he's doing he's saying no Yeah, he's saying no when he needs to and that's smart and the people who love him. I think he know to me anymore Well, I think the people that that that understand that Like understand to like god, I think everyone goes that must be so fun. I'm like that looks awful It's not that I'm not saying that the people are awful or anything about it It's just the amount of energy you have to spend Out there in the world meeting and greeting everyone all the time when I see that happening because I see it with people Yeah, with huge amounts of success and I always kind of go like I feel like I had the perfect amount of success Yeah at this age when it was young it wasn't enough for me But now at this age ago that was perfect I get to have a career that I still go on stage and I have a great time and We don't have to do it too much, but we do it enough right it's like perfect Yeah, but I still get to yeah the years where I was on MTV every second and on the radio and on tour and like all that could you go And nowhere yeah, my point is that Experiencing that even on that whatever that level was which was the highest level in my life. Maybe uncomfortable I was gracious, but I didn't I felt in a fishbowl I felt watched And then over time I think now the balance is really nice where you know Dinner last night somebody came over and just and it's so nice to have somebody come over and compliment you But I don't feel like I'm being watched and I don't and I go every day I'm somewhere and nobody gives a shit no or doesn't if they do recognize that they don't say anything Or they don't have any clue and I I think that that fishbowl thing that you're talking about Is exhausting it's exhausting And I think at some point if You can't turn it off. Yeah, you could Almost feel like Well, that's the thing is I think it's not that you can't turn it off. I think at some point you feel like you can't turn it off And that's the thing with with Lionel the only thing I genuinely worry about if I'm being honest is How much energy he spends having to Uh greet the world gotcha because everyone loves him. They love his songs. Every it's it's it's remarkable when you go places with him He's a part of it's like tens of millions of people's lives Yeah, and and and they feel like they know him because it's his persona is so close to really what he is In terms of friendliness and openness There's not like this dark Where he's an asshole or there's none of that so that's tricky for someone like him and it's also tricky For someone whose public perception is important Yeah, I agree. I think he cares about it because I also think he comes from a different time That's the other thing that people don't always factor in with him. He's from Alabama In the fucking 60s. Yeah, and you think about that and no one ever like no one leads with that like This is where he comes from. Yeah, and and now in 2026 in the world and people are still relating to him number one through the songs And obviously he does tv and he does all these things but I I've asked him I'm like, is there anywhere you can go in the world where you're you aren't doing the meet and greet the whole time? And he doesn't even if that's the thing is I'm sitting there complaining for him. Right. He's not complaining He's just like no, that's what he's used to that's what he's used to I spend a lot of time not a lot of time But I spend a considerable amount of time with rod stewart Yeah, we've become friends in the last two and a half years legends amongst legends And I he's a hero of my lifelong hero and I manifested him into my life How'd you meet him? I met him a couple times over the years at american music wards or at this radio event like in passing. Hey, he's always polite We'd chat for a second, but like he didn't know that I was totally fanboying out, right? One time we were standing at the american music wards I was about to present and he was up after me And we were both wearing the same shoes And he went nice kicks mate and I was like, oh my god rod stewart just complimented my shoes and then Just about almost three years ago. I was touring in australia and the last show I'll try to make this brief talking about manifestation on the flight to australia for that tour Sit next to daisy on the plane. She's watching whatever. She's watching. She's downloaded She goes she looks over she goes. What are you watching? I was like an interview with rod stewart from 1988 on mtv I Downloaded all these interviews with rod and performances of rod. I've seen him live. Well, I'll get to this So i'm watching that on the flight over to australia I do an interview somebody in one of the interviews early on in the tour says you've worked with so many artists Who's somebody you always wanted to work with but never did and I said, oh rod stewart? That's always been my dream to work with rod never happened. He certainly didn't need my help But that's one that was my bucket list that I didn't get next day Flying somewhere my drummer says who have you seen in concert more than any other artist? And I went rod stewart He went really I said I've seen rod like 11 times wow Real fan fan huge fan every record you have every every you know the catalog We end the tour in perth Wow, yeah the furthest point the night before the last show is off because we're to travel day My tour manager's birthday. I take him and the band daisy's with me to this beautiful restaurant in this hotel And as we're walking into the restaurant my guitar player looks down and he goes dude Where did you get those shoes and I was wearing these? Two-tone black and white kind of like what Elvis wore in jailhouse rod and I said, you know funny So I tell him about rod and I running into each other Wearing the same shoes We sit down at the table and 30 seconds later rod stewart walks in front of us No, shit and daisy goes Richard. Isn't that rod? And I and I can't believe fucking believe it In perth at the end of this week of me talking about the edge of the earth My brain initially goes You don't know him to go. Hey, right? And then the other part of my room went fuck that I went hey rod And he turns it's dark and the rest when I said it's richard And he goes oh and he comes running around the table gives me the biggest hug Introduces himself to everybody. He met daisy a couple times over the years Had events and stuff like that when when she was on MTV and stuff Actually, he tried to date her years ago. Yeah, it's understandable. Um, and I say tried understandable We stand there talking for a few minutes. He says, um, I'm starting my tour tomorrow You're ending your tour. Let's meet back here tomorrow night. Have a drink And I was like It's gonna be late. I'm thinking he's like older man. Yeah, he's like, no, man. Let's do it. We'll meet back here It's cool. Like after the shows Okay, I'm thinking I'm gonna get a text that he's canceling whatever no I get a text from his assistant Rod's really looking forward to seeing you tonight So we all end up back at this restaurant the next night and rod and I there's My wife was sweet enough to take pictures of this We end up in a corner the two of us talking and talking and talking and talking cut to I'm going on tour with him Like this without the mics not only am I going on tour with him this year? Wow He did a duet with me on my new album. It was his idea He and I become so Such great friends. We text each other all the time, but we spend a lot of time together We go to dinner just the two of us we go. I love tenny. Awesome. His wife. He loves daisy. Penny loves daisy It's we the four of us go out to do like he's become my new How that's awesome and cut to like lionel Especially looking like rod stewart. You can't hide anywhere Even if you didn't know who rod stewart was you'd go who the fuck is that? Yeah, that looks like somebody fucking guy rock star the way he Does it, you know, we went to mr. Chow I don't know six weeks ago just me and him and When we walked in we both, you know, we know the owner or whatever we go Hi, how you doing then we sit in the corner and you know, you can tell people are looking But nobody's like it's totally like fine and then And then the waiter comes over and says this table over there bought your dinner And so ross oh Mike whisk over and like so we go over and we took pictures with them and we're sitting there and we're both of us I'd had a couple, you know, and oh my god. It's it's been the most fun friendship That's fun because and I and we actually went we were invited to his 80th surprise birthday party a year ago this weekend Stacey and I flew to London to be part of the surprise party There's a small group of people but and I toasted him and I said at the table Many nice things but I said and the last thing I'll say is the people who say never meet your heroes never met rod stewart Because he is like everything I wanted him to be he's everything you hoped you would be everything and then and then some like a really good friend and gives me advice and we just love Hanging out together. That's cool because you you're at this stage in your career and in your life You could be jaded and you could be like fuck everybody. I I know too much. I've seen too much I have I don't want to meet any new friends because everybody in this business. This is a fucking Silly business sometimes. Yeah, like we all know it. It's a it's a business where we go out. We work We try our best. We're trying to what I always say is like I'm trying to make an honest living in a very dishonest business sometimes There you go. And I literally just want to work to support my family habit Which is I just want to work make a living and be with my wife and kids and Do my best But when it comes to human interaction, I think that the the best mantra is Some people are really going to disappoint you and definitely some people are going to exceed your expectations and that's a nice thing to know about rod stewart because I've always had a Really nice impression of him met him in passing like not not enough to say I've met him but met him and he was like He's very gracious gracious And he's not arrogant and he doesn't it doesn't feel like you can't be in the room with him You know, it's a very well-welcoming You know, you you're the same way. This is what I say. I would say to you you're a legend Amongst legends you come from this cloth of guys who write songs and make to me It was a time that'll never be again when these songs And these songs wrote other songs these songs are Songs that we grew up and every generation is like there's something to me about the 80s and 90s For music. Yeah, that was a turning point for what was possible And what kinds of songs we could write and what kind and so like I like look at this kind of legendary time with all these all these this catalog of music that I love And it'll never be again. Does it mean that well, there won't be great music, right? But it'll just never be again. It was a time that you yeah, and there's something about Meeting certain guys and you're one of them who there's a humility to But you don't feel like you're not, you know rich enough or good enough or you haven't written enough hit songs to sit Like I certainly my songs have not been as big as your songs That that being said songs have not been as big as rods or linals or I notice a through line with you rod linel. I could go on a list of guys who have had to work really hard They've seen music and the world changed Um, um a few times over now where you're like, I've seen the world change a bunch of times It's gonna change again And you start to there's a there's a wisdom and almost like a there's something really classic feeling about it There's a wisdom that where it feels like you're sitting with these guys And they've seen a lot and they know the world's gonna keep turning and keep changing Music's gonna do this that's gonna do that. But never once have I ever felt not respected Like you see me coming behind you 15 years or whatever and you go, oh, he's doing the same thing. I was doing yeah He's There's something honest about what we do. We're just trying to make records Yeah, yeah, and then right and you know, there's something about it that I feel is true Yeah, what about your new music? Well, I hadn't made an album in a while and I decided that the idea of doing a standards record Was never appealing to me because I'm a songwriter first and foremost second of all I didn't I mean I love that music but is that really what I do, you know coming from rock and pop and And then I thought about well rod, you know did did it very successfully 20 years ago 25 years ago Boublé is great and then I was thinking who else is doing that not it's not really It's been done a million times, but it hasn't been done in a while. It also looks really fun. It's really fun And so then I thought well, wait a minute What if I did half an album of my favorite standards? But then I wrote the other half to sound like they fit with those That's a challenge as a songwriter writing a standard and writing those chord progressions and like writing No melodies and chords and even lyrics that I would never write in a pop song That became fun and so then I started when I started writing those songs And then I I met this guy. I did a thing called the piano room and at the bbc It was a great show in london and I worked with this young british arranger Conductor named rob eckland. He does a bunch of stuff for the bbc orchestra and he wrote the arrangements for my Performance there. So I worked with him and he's brilliant. He's absolutely brilliant So I called him and I said would you want to do the charts on this thing? I don't know when i'm going to do this album Whatever he got really excited about it and then the kicker was I decided one day. I'm going to do this whole album live Oh, wow, you recorded it. I did it down the block. I did it at evergreen Here in burbank. Oh, wow Do you live in l.a? Yeah, oh, okay. I live in miami and here. Okay, cool Three afternoons three three hour afternoon sessions in a row 13 songs We did every song two or three times. I sang live with 28 piece big band orchestra and that's the record A great story like monsters ink stays with you forever And disney plus is where you'll find your next great story From the return of the award-winning hit series Rivals welcome to the naughtiest show on television to the unmissable crime drama high potential Gotta dead body gotta go a lifetime of great stories awaits this spring on disney plus 18 plus subscription required T's and C's apply How did you get your vocals to not crap out like at the end of each day? Because i'm awesome. Yeah, because you're fucking g No, i'll tell you why because i tour so much. Yeah, you my voice is in shape always like it's never It was challenging and it's stressful because you're like because every you know the other 28 people are gonna get their parts, right? And I just wanted to make that record that way because that's how sonatra did it That's how dean martin did it. So we would just do it. So that's bad ass two or three. Thank you for understanding Like you can you understand what that means. That's so good. I still don't get it dude. I couldn't do that There's no computers. It's not like it's so gangster 29 people doing a song in live playing live And it's gangster the only overdubs were my guests. So rod steward When I told rod I was doing this He was the one who said we should do a song together mate and I was like I think this is the Guinness talking and the next day he texted me No, he texted me the next day he goes. I was serious. We should do young at heart, which is this old Sonatra song we did a duet of young at heart Kenny G Who's one of my closest friends in the world and the funniest guy you'll ever meet he seems like he's such a blast He's so not what you think I've ever heard he's cool as shit the dirtiest jokes I've ever heard in my life. I heard from Kenny G Kenny G is it it's true I just think he's cool as shit. I don't know him brilliant guy. I just think he's like Insanely talented. Obviously, but he's just such a hand. He's my at least my One of my best friends. That's super cool. So I I wrote this song Imagine you rod steward Kenny G Michael balton We're we're we're the new rap. I'm like fucking crew of like these guys is this like That's cool. We have good times. So Kenny played on the song called big bamboo. He Crushed it and then another great friend of mine Chris Bodie the trumpet player played on a song. So Serious And stuff it's cool. Yeah, dude, how did you write the songs? Did you write them on like a piano or a crucifix guitar and then you had Your guy in london arrange How did you do that for years now joel? I'm not sure why I stopped writing songs at an instrument Okay, because I I realized that as good as I might be as a player this way or that way I'm still limited to write what I'm able to play right but as a singer Sky's the limit. So when I need to write a song I just walk I hike and I go outside I truly I heard your melody and I truly believe this I think that great melodies and lyrics are hiding under rocks and behind trees and in the bushes and I need to be out in nature So like there's a song called all I ever needed on the album. That was the first song I wrote I just took a long hike and I pretended that I was a songwriter in 1948 trying to pitch a song to frank sinatra And I was like I live to be free Need of my mind no one Ever gonna take me like that kind of melody. I would never have written that but I was like super Right and then I wanted my version of sort of like I've always loved sway, you know the song sway the Blue Blades done and Dean martin did When I wanted to have a tango like that kind of vibe I wrote the song called magic hour and daisy my wife wrote the lyrics with me. Oh, wow Sitting on a beach in australia. That's really so all the songs were sort of me just channeling I was ripping stuff off, but just very delicately so it wasn't a ripoff It was just sort of like, you know, we've all done that we go you hear a song you go I want to do my version of that. Yeah, it's like a it's a tribute to the homage. Yeah, it's a tribute to the thing you love That I think is um a really nice Way to express yourself in a different way than maybe what you're Like to me it just sounds like a lot of fun to to like the most fun record It's kind of like almost like a fantasy to be able to go into something that when I think about a standards record When I think about frank sinatra when I think about those are is this like It's so amazing. Well, what am I gonna do? Am I gonna sing one of those and then you go make a record like this and I'm like that Sounds really cool. It was the most fun. I'm and the music is good and I'm super proud of it And then touring it is going to be really fun Yeah, and also like the way you can perform the record when I think about it. I'm like, oh my god Do you realize how many gigs you can do now in places? You couldn't have done a gig where you're like I could do a gig now at a private thing or at a thing there or a thing there Because I have a standard set. Yep that I couldn't have done that gig. I had one gig. I could do this rock gig They needed it and so when I think about that. I'm like that sounds like a really fun project to Dive into and it also takes balls because not right only a few guys who can do it Thank you. So it's cool that you did that. I I thought it was like the fucking coolest choice I was like, that's cool. I'm glad I just went for it because it was such a I'm so Proud of it and the experience of it was it was like the best drug All three days in a row the cover was shot by my son Brandon Which is like extra cool We went to the beach in Malibu and I dressed up and had a martini and just spilled it and he snapped it and Everybody who worked on the record. It was just I had a bunch of those musicians a lot of them older Been on a lot longer even than me String players horn players come up to me and thank me and nobody does this anymore Yeah, nobody makes records like this. We're never together in a room as human beings We all come in like little sections and like we never this never happens. Yeah, think about that. It's a it's a lost art Yeah, it doesn't exist How many records are being made live in a room this year? You could probably count them on one hand if it's if it's even happening And then how many musicians that are working musicians think about this guys who get hired to play Right that love playing music and that's what they've dedicated their life to being an excellent trumpet player an excellent String section and excellent. These are excellent musicians who when you think about the limited Scope of what kind of work they get to do because of just the time we live in where everything's digital and We don't need to have a band. We got a good sound system. I've got a great string sample right here in my keyboard I don't need the orchestra. So really incredibly excellent musicians who you can't replace it You can't replace the bow on the string the sound of that you can't replace the emotion with which someone Plays their instrument. It's emotional when you hear instruments all being played together. It's emotional. Yeah, mr. Marks Mr. Madden, this was you mr. Richie I call myself mr. Fuentes, I would go I would accept it. I would accept it. You're great, man Thanks for coming and um, I really this was cool as shit. I just really enjoyed this. Yeah, glad I did. I see you again Maybe in Australia. Yeah, congrats on the records. Thanks Thanks Thank you for watching artist friendly if you like this episode Please make sure you hit the like button You follow the channel and please share it with your friends. We appreciate the support That is why this show exists because you listen to it. Thank you guys. We'll see you next time