An Interview with Christopher Mannino

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My name is Eric, and if this is your first time listening to us, we are normally an episode by episode Bluie podcast, where we watch an episode of Bluie and then talk about it and the lessons we learned. In this special bonus episode, I sat down and talked with Christopher Manino, the author of Making It Up, a revolutionary way to bond with kids through play. We had a really fun time talking about his book and the ideas behind it and how it relates to Bluie. And I think that you guys are really going to enjoy it. Christopher, thank you so much for being here today. We're glad to have you. Thanks so much for having me. Tell us a little bit about your book. So Making It Up. This is a book and a course. They're both out there now. And the reason I'm on this podcast right now is because they are a direct response to Bluie. About three years ago, there was a woman who made all of the Bluie fan groups go mad. I was in more than one of them. And this woman, a stay-at-home mom, went onto a magazine and was basically saying that she hated Bluie because all of a sudden, her kids had unrealistic expectations about parenting. That was kind of the title of her article, that the healers made parenting unrealistic. And so I was kind of joking about this with my wife. We were just laughing. And my wife just looks at me very, you know, my wife was very, very kind of straightforward at times, wonderful person. But my wife, Rachel, she looks at me and she's like, well, you're a writer and you know what's going on. You know that there's a lot of improv here. Joe Brum and the team are creating these based on all these theater skills that are what you parent like. But most people don't realize you're a writer, write a book. That's literally what she said to me. And so that's how the book starts. It starts as a response to this angry woman is like, this is impossible. And my wife is like, well, no, it's not. And the truth is, is very bluey adjacent. It's perfect for those fans. And the other thing that really kind of inspired my method, I realized as I was digging into the editing and the writing of it, is I realized a lot of my parenting sort of took shape in the pandemic actually, because all of a sudden kids were at home, you know, you can't do anything. The world is closed. We all remember that. Yes. Fun times with fun end quotes. And my background was in theater too. This is me. I was a theater teacher as a theater coach. And so I was doing all this theater stuff with my kids. I was using all these theater techniques on myself. And it was like, wow, this kind of method was born that, yeah, fast forward to today. And that's where making it up really evolves. That's interesting that you say that, because I remember very specifically when that rant hit the internet and in the bluey fandom, the ripples through it. And I questioned myself, I said, I feel like I parent quite a bit like Bandit. One of the things we joke about on dinner with the healers is that he and I could be brothers, because we're very similar with slowing things down and really listening to what the kids have to say, and that sort of thing. And I was shocked at this person's revelation about it. But interestingly, when I talked to my dad, he was watching it with his wife's grandkids. And he's like, that show bluey, boy, those kids think they can get away with anything now. And I said, well, I guess maybe that's like a certain slice of life that maybe does view it like that. So that was interesting to me. But COVID is something that really forced a lot of changes in people and a lot of introspection. So it's interesting how that came about for you. Tell us about your theater background. Sure, I mean, my degree is in theater education. I'm for about 20 years I was involved directly in theater. I'm actually just getting back into it. I just had a callback audition this week. It's my first audition on this side of the stage in a long time since having kids. But I've been the director of the playwright and the theater teacher, mostly the teacher. I taught young kids. I am for a couple of years. Then I taught young kids in the summers. I kept going. This is mostly in the Washington, DC area. And then I was running a wonderful high school theater program, sort of my dream job. I have six classes of theater. I'm over four levels. We did a lot of shows. We had a separate improv tree, really a dream program. The downside was when we had my son on nine years ago, he was in daycare and I was working 12 hours a day, five, sometimes six days a week. I was always the first one to school, the last one to leave. And I was making half of what my wife was making. So we had a long talk and I became a stay at home dad after that. And it was one of the best decisions I ever made. So my background was in teaching and in theater and that all pivoted with my son. And then you talk about the, where does this method come from? Like I didn't really realize it until the pandemic, a few years later, but suddenly I'm drawing on that theater experience. I'm drawing on like, how can I not feel so isolated? And as a dad especially, I'm not sure where you are, but where I was in Maryland, man, every library group, every playground, there was one dad and it was me. And all the other kids are there with their moms. And it feels a little weird. And I had trouble, I wanted to talk to them, but I don't want them to be scared of me because I'm a male. It's all those dynamics rolled up into one. And then the pandemic comes crashing down. And it's like, oh, God, what do we do? And so for me, what I ended up digging into was in theater, method acting, what most people are familiar with that, is all about using memories to create emotion. You did this on stage. This is how any screen or stage actor does it. And I realized I was actually doing that just to make it through the day, just to go to these play dates, just to connect with my kids. And so when I came to editing the book and stuff, I was like, wait a sec, I got to talk about that too. Because Blue is great and it's all improv and fun. That was sort of the first half of the book. But there's also this other half where it's like, I want to talk about using memory. So I call that the anchor technique. And that's what that is. It's using kind of method acting style memories, these recent memories to get you through tough moments. Actually, I'm gonna give you an example because that ties perfectly into example. Right before this interview, my son had a tantrum. And I don't even remember what it was about. It was about nothing. It's like most tantrums are, right? And if you, you know, rewind a few years, I would get to the point where things like that would fluster me or the library times, and I'm the one dad would fluster me. And now it's like, I don't even, now I'm the bandit or chili now. And how did they get to that level? How did they get to that level where they're dancing in the street and they're not even faced? And for me, what works is this anchor technique. I instantly think of something recent, less than a month ago, that brought me intense joy. And it doesn't have to be kidrally. It can be, but it doesn't have to be. And so like for me, we just had, I live in Malta now, we just had Carnival, which is this five day party before Lent. And it's huge. And my wife and I were at a masquerade. I mean, I have never been at anything like this. If you've ever seen Bridgerton, we were in Bridgerton for a night in masks, doing the dancing. I mean, they're playing the Bridgerton music and everything with live, with a live quartet. And so the second he goes in that tantrum, I'm like, I'm just gonna think about that masquerade. I'm happy again. I feel like I'm not even phased. And I think that really helps. I think that really helps bring you up to that healer level parenting that that mom can say is impossible. And it's not, it's very doable. It's so interesting that you talk about being the only dad. I, during COVID especially, I have a job where I had the unique opportunity where I could be at home with the kids. And my wife, Amanda, had a job where it was considered an essential. And so she was at work all the time. And I spent a ton of time with my kids and I enjoyed it. I loved it. And a lot of times, like after that, I would be the only dad at things. For example, a field trip at the kids' school. I could take off work and go. And so it would be a bunch of moms and me. And even if there were other dads, the other dads a lot of times would group together and talk about work. And I would spend time with the moms talking about the kids and what they're up to. And that is such a unique perspective. I'm glad you brought that up because it really does present a challenge. And once you realize that it's completely normal, it's our own trepidation that makes it seem not normal. Oh, it's all of them are at. And then the idea that being free to be yourself is such an important thing. And I talk to my kids about that a lot. I remember being young and I was the kid who was too cool to do things. And I look at Amanda, my wife, and she is like this free spirit. She'll dance in the grocery store and embarrass the kids and stuff. And I told Stella and Henry, the way your mom is is an enviable thing. And you should feel comfortable doing that and being that way. Because you're not gonna look back later and regret being free. You're going to look back later and regret putting these confines on yourself. I completely agree. There's literally an example in the book. One of the first examples, I wanna say chapter one or two. And this is a real thing that happened. My daughter, I was shopping with her at Trader Joe's. This is in Delaware. And she was three at the time. And you can picture that three-nager phase where she was like on the cusp of a meltdown. I'm sure you, anyone, everyone has been there. They're like, oh, yep. And I mean, she was there. And you could see all the warnings on it. The steam blown out of her ears basically. Like she was right there and we're in the middle of the grocery store. And I just went full bandit. I mean, this is one of the things I loved about Bluie right away is it's so dad centered too. And the dad's not an idiot. This is not Peppa Pig's dad. This is not Homer Simpson. God, how many cartoon dads have been like the buffoon? Right. He's goofy, but he's also a great dad. And so I went full bandit and I, you know, if I brought out my freeze ray and I was using it and I handed it to her and then I was doing all these things. And then she had to melt me in the, right there in the supermarket. And one of the reasons that that memory stood out and it made it into the book is at the end of us playing around and she was laughing and then we had fun. And she started helping me shop. This random stranger came up to me, a mother, and it's like, you are such a good dad. I was like, thanks. But, you know, it felt kind of nice. And it was like, okay, you know, just getting out of your comfort zone, just as he said, dancing in front of people, being able to take those risks because I think ultimately, you know, you matter and the kid matters, you know, that bond, that connection matters. Ultimately, does anybody else really matter in that situation? Do those other shoppers, you know, does it really matter if you look like a fool? I don't really. Trouble sleeping from sounds of the ocean, the sounds of rain and storms, and everything in between. We've got you covered. 10 hour sleep sounds with no interruptions in between. Listen to Sleep Sounds by TM Soft on your favorite podcasting app today, or visit sleepsounds.fm and listen for free anywhere. That's a great way to look at it because a lot of times we as humans in society are convinced that everybody around us is analyzing our every move. Oh my gosh, they're all looking at me. And when you think about the realities of that, everybody's thinking that, so they're not looking at anybody else because they're so inward focused and not in a narcissistic way, but that's just the tendency because people are so self-conscious about things. But those are the kind of activities that kids will remember forever. And my stepmom told me that my dad had told her once after visiting us that I wish I had been a dad like Eric is. And that blew my mind because he grew up in an era where he did better than his dad did, but he was a lot more stoic and way less demonstrative with his emotions and that sort of thing. And to know that he said that about my parenting style, it blessed my soul. And it made me so happy to know that because that is something I have consciously made an effort to do, is be there for my kids in a way that relates to them. I can't talk to them like they're adults, they're not adults. They will understand certain things and remember certain things. And I know from my perspective, there are things that my kids will probably remember forever because I decided to step out of that comfort zone. Honestly, that's the method in a nutshell. That's what I'm going for is you talk about it. I'm gonna borrow the phrase from inside out, but you're creating these core memories. And a lot of those memories with your kids, when I was first staying at home as a stay-at-home dad, I started looking up resources eventually. And I came across a guy who's now my friend, I'm Shannon Carpenter, just an internet friend we've never met, but he had a book out for stay-at-home dads. And I had never come across one of those. And he was encouraging these dad ventures. And I still do it five years after reading that book. This is because I just took my last one last week. I make sure I get one-on-one time where we will take some sort of trip, something fun, just one-on-one with each kid. And you talk about the core memories though, that you're building. And it doesn't have to be an adventure, a dad adventure. One of the examples I gave ironically, and that was honestly really fundamental to the method, to the book, and to me as a parent is the first day of homeschooling, the first day during lockdown to go back to COVID. And I remember that day so well for all the good and the bad. I'm sure a lot of people have similar memories. And that day I went like nuts, like we did. My daughter was born, but she was breastfeeding infant. So I didn't really have much time with her. My son and I were like, I was like, well, we're gonna do this, we're gonna do this, we're gonna do this, I mean, we had it. And so the next day I could barely move because I was so exhausted. I blew it that way. But one of the things we did is we went and explored the solar system. I mean, we literally built an entire rocket, got in it and went to like all the different planets. And this is what improv is all about. That's, this is what you're seeing in Bluie is you're seeing improvisation. You're seeing Bluie or Bingo come up with an idea and we call these bricks in theater. An idea, any type of unit of information is a brick. This is a rocket is a brick. So think about Bluie, we're in a bus, that's a brick. I'm Janet, that's a brick. You're the driver, that's where every single one of those is a brick and you go build a wall. That's how you think of it in improv. Is you say yes to their brick and you put a brick on top of it. This is what I was doing with my son. We built a rock dip. He's like, oh, a million engines are busted. I was like, that's why we're landing here on Venus. We're looking for engines going, we're doing the whole thing. But I gotta tell you something, Eric. We still sing the song. We wrote a song because I really was overdoing it as a teacher and we still sing the song though. It's been years, he's only nine now. And it's like around the sun we have fun. It's the stupidest little song about the order of the planets. But it's such a core memory that it's like, you know, this war, people remember this just at our basement with pillows on the first day of lockdown. Like, I don't know, that's what it's about in my head. Creating those core memories, creating those bonds. That's so cool. My kids, we get a lot of that the same way because my wife would be the same way with the kids. And there's a song that she made up whenever they would brush their teeth. And they still remember it, even though they're much older now and they're like, oh, how embarrassing. But they remember it because it meant something to them. And what a cool approach. That's so neat. I'm so glad that you shared that with me. I'm curious, how did you discover Bluie? Oh, man, I am not sure. I think I saw it recommended on a dad's group. I'm pretty sure, yeah, I'm pretty sure some people were talking about it. I wanna say on Facebook, I was in a number of dad's groups because I was feeling isolated. I was already a stay-at-home dad. And it can feel isolating. I eventually met one other stay-at-home dad. He was like a, in a gay couple. So he stayed at home while his husband worked. I had never met, until him, and he ended up being a neighbor, I had never met another stay-at-home dad in person. I wanted to do everything around there. So I went on the internet and I was like, come on, there must be other dads at home. It can't just be me. And yeah, definitely a lot of the dads were talking about this show. It's like, you gotta check this out. And so I remember checking it out and one of the first episodes I saw was Magic Xylophone. And I was instantly like, wait a second, because Magic Xylophone is free. This is what we call it in improv. And it is the introductory lesson. So I used to teach improv, as I said, theater teacher, improv coach. And when you teach improv, that's the first unit is that episode. And this is one of the first shows I'm seeing up blue. I'm like, wait a sec, they're just doing freeze and he's turned into show. And then the more I watched, the more I realized that, and this is true, 98% of bluey. That is actually true, is improvisation. That's how it works. Almost every episode, Joe is gonna take a different scenario and he's gonna have them improvise together. One of my favorite episodes when it came out, that really blew my mind was Octopus, because that was the first time you take it away from the healers. And I had been like, gosh, this feels like improv, this feels like improv. And then I really felt like Joe was acknowledging it to the audience because there's this moment when Chloe and her dad, this is the one where Chloe wants to parent like Bluey's dad and stuff, and she wants her dad to and he's struggling. And so they discover, what's the, is they're saying no. They need to say yes, which is the foundation of improv. They need to build off each other. It's like, I felt like that was, for those of us who know theater, that was the let's break the fourth wall and acknowledge what's happening behind the scenes episode. I don't know if that was its intent or not, but that's how it, that's how it's a mate. But yeah, once I discovered it, I was hooked and it's a great show, and I've loved it ever since. It is amazing. I was shocked at how much I connected to it. I am a big Star Wars fan, and a lot of my Star Wars friends are from Australia. And because culturally Australians, they travel. And so whenever we would have the big Star Wars conventions, that's how I met them. And they kept telling me, you've got to check out this show, Bluey. You would love it, I'm telling you. And that was right when it was coming on Disney Plus. And I was floored. I was hooked immediately because I identified with Bandit so much. And just watching the style of play, watching the respect he showed the kids and their thought process while still pointing them in the right direction, not being afraid to have fun, all of that stuff. It really spoke to me on a big level. And it's interesting that you talk about that episode, Octopus, because it felt very familiar to me. I do a lot of things that are theater adjacent. And I have a friend who's big in improv, and he talks about, it's always yes and, yes and. And I'm like, man, that feels exactly like what he talks about. So that's how cool is that. Starting the podcast was just like a random thing. One of those, you know what we should do at moments. And it just grew from there. Who is the target audience for your book? I would say, I mean, for sure, kids, Bluey's age and Bluey fans are big target audience, but it's parents of kids about three to seven are the super target. But it definitely applies to kids older. There's a whole section in there, up through middle school. I'm new parents as well. Honestly, anybody who wants to connect with kids, it does connect to teachers too. And my background obviously is in teaching. So if you're a daycare worker, you're an elementary teacher, something like that. But the primary, the mediest I'm group. And the reason I say three to seven, most of all, and it'll, you'll definitely get stuff out of this with older or your kids. But it's that age. And we all remember around the time they hit three, especially when you're in the Y phase, not only are they constantly said, why, why, why, why, why, not only are they constantly doing that, but they're also becoming what I like to refer to as a brick factory. Because neurologically, their brain is at the point where they're trying to figure out what is the world. Think born yesterday in Bluey. I love that they, they, you know, let's do a role reversal. Let's have him experience everything from the first time. And, you know, just like band, just like, well, what is this? What is this? Why would he basically in the Y phase? Like he's also dropping ideas nonstop. They actually really did that very cleverly. And this is the kind of golden moment for this method. And for what, for what Joe's doing in Bluey, for saying yes and for taking these ideas, for building on them, and for using that as a way to connect with kids. That would be the, definitely the core group. One of the things I find so endearing about Bluey is, especially with Bandit, because I relate to him as a dad, is the way he'll slow down and look at things from a child's perspective. Because if you want to be reminded of how magic the world is, look at it like a child would. And that episode, when he's filled with wonderment at things, because he slowed down and took a minute to put all of the problems aside and really look at things through a brand new lens. And man, that is an exercise that people should get involved in more often. It's not just the looking at it through their eyes, the empathy is huge. But what you said just now, putting everything else aside, and that, what I was mentioning with the anchor I was trying to touch on in the second, that's the whole kind of second pillar of the method, I think that is key is he, every episode, we're chilling. What they are pros at, what they succeed in our models out, is they can take whatever is going on and they put it aside and they are fully in. They are in the playtime. They are in the game, whatever crazy game it is, honestly even Pat, I'm in the middle of doing my one. Okay, that's out the window. I'm fully in, let's go. It's that ability to put it all aside because we all have other stuff, whether our spouses or our jobs or the news or whatever, we all have as adults other stuff. And to be able to take just 10 minutes a day or so and set that all aside, being like, you know, it's still there, it'll be there in 10 minutes. I'm gonna put it aside and for these 10 minutes, I'm just dad or I'm just mom, whatever. And you're just in that moment, that I think is the truest key to it all. And to Bluie too, I think that's why they are such great parents is because they really do, they set it aside and they are all in. That's awesome. And that is one of the things I love so much about the show. In our segment, did we learn anything today? We talk about what was the overarching lesson of this episode and we just started a rewatch because we reached the end of the episodes where we still love Bluie. Let's go back to the top and talk about how we feel about it now. Three or like really almost four years after we first watched the episodes and talked about them and the change in perspective is really cool. But when we get in some of the early episodes, there might not be a very specific lesson. Did we learn anything today? But we were just talking about the episode hotel where Bandit is supposed to be cleaning the bedroom up, Chili gets in the shower and the kids, they wanna play. And I mentioned that specifically. I don't think there's a particular lesson, but one thing that you could take away from it is Bandit knew those chores are gonna be there 15 minutes from now. I can put that aside and do this right now because for parents out there, if you're a new parent or not a parent yet, the amount of time that your kids will want to have all of your attention goes away in what feels like a blink of an eye. They grow up and they move forward as they should. That's how people develop is they find their own sense of self, but do not miss that window of opportunity when your kids desire and crave your time because it will mean the world to them. And that is what you're going to think about later. And honestly, and I'm saying this a little jokingly, once your kids get a little older and a little more angsty, you need those memories to remember why you love them. But yeah, it makes such a difference to just put it aside. And it's a joke, if you remember the movie, What About Bob? Bill Murray was in it and his doctor told him to take a vacation from your problems. They'll still be there when you get back, but just for right now, let's set them aside. And that is the same kind of thing. It's so neat to look at it like that. When you were talking about that, I was actually reminded of there's a line in on Daddy Drop Off when they're later and later and later, this is the one where Bandit has to bring them to school and Bingo forgets her jacket and all this other stuff. And they do the wind up Bingo at the end. And Bingo has some, and I'm paraphrasing terribly, but Bingo is like, well, why were we still late? Would we have been less late? And Bandit's like, yeah, we would have been less late. Why did you do this? And he says something like, well, it wouldn't have been as fun if we did something like that. And again, I'm paraphrasing, but it's the same exact idea. It's like, yeah, this matters. Okay, you're a couple minutes late to school today. Don't do that every day necessarily, but take those memories when you can get them. And to go back to your question about the core group, I have to say my kids are now seven and 10. So they're older than this now. I was saying three to seven, but I still play this way with both of my kids, even my older son. And he's at the edge, I mean, we play chess and we do all the fancy old stuff. And he's on Minecraft building, whatever that he does. But, so he's into all of that too, but we still use this imaginative play that we still go hunt dragons. We still go exploring for fairies and magic. We still use that type of play together, and that's still a cornerstone that keeps us close. And I'm really proud of that, honestly. Henry and I have bonded over our mutual love of Star Wars and Lego and those sorts of things. And I've found that I enjoy playing with the toys just as much as he does. So matter of fact, I probably want Star Wars sort of made a resurgence. I probably spent what most would call an irresponsible amount of money on collectibles. But it is, it's one of those things that it's still fun. And when as kids get a little bit older, if they can hang that up for a little bit, none of your friends are around, don't worry, just be yourself. We took the kids to Disneyland a few years ago. And I remember telling them, listen, there's nobody here that knows you. Don't be afraid to be a kid. If you see Mickey Mouse and it makes you just wanna cry, cry, it's normal. Embrace this for what it is. Don't let other people's perception of it get in your way. And I think they really took that to heart. It really does make a huge difference to approach life with a bit of abandon. It's really healthy and it makes life fun. And those are the things that you're going to remember over time. They pick up on our cues too. Like if we're out there having fun, whether it's in Disney or in the supermarket, but if we're singing in the supermarket or we're singing in Main Street USA or wherever, they are picking up on that and they're internalizing that, oh, this is okay. This is healthy. And I think that's good. I think that's a good thing for them to pick up on personally. I agree, I agree. What is your favorite episode of Bluey if you had to pick one? Or can you even pick one? I mean, the sign stands out because it's the long episode and it's special. I don't know if you can even count that because it's so different. And I know I'm gonna love the movie when it comes. But if I had to pick a non-the sign episode, oh man, I have a bunch of favorites. Oh, off the top of my head, I really do love Daddy Drop-Off. I love, I love Buss. Buss is so fun. I like Puppets, the second unicorn episode, unicorn episode, sorry. Yeah, those are some of the ones that come to mind, quickest. I think those are all, oh, and then the one where they narrate, I think it's called Stories. And it keeps changing perspective. That was a really interesting one too. The one with Lin Manuel as the horse at the end. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was a fun one too. Yeah, no, there's a lot of wonderful ones, but those would be a few of my top ones. How about you, what was your favorite thing? It's so tough. I love Bandit and I love Pat when you mentioned Pat. He's one of my favorites. That guy's a legend. His ability to just be like, okay, let's, we'll go along with this, we'll do the thing. And the fact that for the longest time, they call them Lucky's Dad. As a parent, that is exactly what happens. Hey, Henry's Dad, can you come over and blah, blah, blah. But one of the things that really sticks out to me, it's from, I think the first season, is Bumpy and the Wise Old Wolfhound. Bingles in the hospital. And they never say why, but Bingo's in the hospital and they make this little home movie and Muffin is so cute in it. And they show a lot of things that as a podcast we can relate to where they have to keep doing a take over and over and over again. And Bandit says, we can edit that bit out, right? It's, it hits so close to home. But I love that style. And the whole reason they did it at the end was to let Bingo know that everybody gets sick sometimes and not to worry. It was such a cute thing and the amount of effort they went into as a family. It was so excellent to see. Yeah, yeah. I will say in terms of the method, and it really honestly goes with any single Bluey episode and them in general. But one thing that I do, I have one episode that I mention in the book specifically because it's such an easy parallel is the episode work. Because it's one of the only episodes. So you talk about even probably in Yes and Work, which is the one where they end up, he's making drain pipes and end up dancing at the end. They kind of giving Bandit and Chilly jobs. Well, Bandit is getting jobs. Chilly comes in as the dancer at the end. But it's one of the only episodes where you see no a few times. And the way it's handled from a theater point of view is masterful from Bandit. Because Bandit is like, I'm doing this. And Bluey is like, no, you're not, you're doing this. He takes an idea and crushes it. And in the framework of the imagination and the improv, that would be breaking the rules, so to speak. That would be kind of getting off the track of the game. But Bandit just goes right with it. And not only that, so the earliest suggestion that Bluey says no to is, I want to be a dancer. And Bluey says, no, no, you don't. You want to do this, blah, blah, blah. And he says, okay, I'm going to accept your idea, Bluey. I'm going to go with that. And then he brings it back later. That is, and we do this, we call these heralds and long form improvs. That's exactly what you're supposed to do. If there's an error, you tuck it away for later and you bring it back so the break is not destroyed. This is why I'm like, gosh, this is like masterful improv stuff and nobody's not necessarily recognizing this. And this is exactly when I taught high school improv. I ran a troupe. We had this one improv, a steady improvisation that ran on for, I remember it, went on for just over two hours. And the number of things that would come back, the number of things that come back, it reminded me of that moment. I was like, this is beautiful and Bandit is doing that. So from a theater point of view, that episode always stands out for me as God, that is masterful. The way Bandit just handles that. That's really interesting. I'm going to have to go back and watch that today through that lens. Go watch work and see. It's very interesting. One thing that I think makes Bluie so unique is the way the music ties into everything. There's very little- Oh, Job is amazing. He's a genius. I would love to work with him. And people might not realize this, but something as simple as the theme. The theme of the show is it's like freeze where, what's the word I'm looking for? Kind of almost like musical chairs where it stops and everybody has to stand still. And it feels very random. There's a weird pause before the music starts up again. And when to say the names seems very random, but it's perfectly musically timed. And this is a very nerdy thing. But for people who speak in music terms, it's measures of four and then a measure of five. And they say the name one quarter note earlier each time. So it's da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. One and two, three, four, five, dad. And the next time is one, two, three, four, mom. And it moves up. Yeah, it moves up one each time. So it feels very random and very rushed, but it's perfectly aligned to a grid because Job is a genius. Oh, he totally, I fully agree with that. Job's amazing. And I think the music and the incorporation of classical themes throughout is honestly even kind of education too for the little kids watching, but it's just so masterfully done. And it's a beautiful part of the show. I have nothing but admiration for the music. I suspect if I were to work in an environment like that, my process would probably be to watch as close to a finish cut of the show that I could get my hands on with a little bit of musical direction and just play along with it and see what popped out to me and then go back and refine it into certain ideas so that there's this level of improvisation where you're drawing on things that you know to fill in that emotion that you're feeling right then. And the takes on the classical themes that they'll do, like, oh, DeJoy pops up a lot and those sorts of things, but the way they'll reinterpret the instrumentation of it and the vibe of it. And for a man of a certain age, that's the way we learned about a lot of classical music is from classic cartoons. Oh yeah, the number of Bugs Bunny ones. Yeah. That's classic music, yeah. Exactly, exactly. Well, Christopher, thank you so much for spending this time with me today. This has been super, super awesome. I appreciate it so much. Thanks so much for having me, Eric. This has been a joy. I love talking bluey. And it is a great book and method. I encourage people to check it out. You can look up my name, Christopher Menino, M-A-N-N-I-N-O, but it's also wherever books are sold. And then the course is up on my website, which is just my name, ChristopherMenino.com. Awesome, thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you guys so much for listening. And I hope that you pick up Christopher's book, Making It Up, a revolutionary way to bond with kids through play. Thank you for being awesome. And until next time, we are out of here.