Betting on Yourself: How Adversity Builds Determination and Discipline | The Turning Point

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That was the number one comedy to get all the time. Yeah. That's not country. That's not country. And I'm like, OK, cool. Now to really go and hold true to your comment, you can buy my merch. Yeah, buy our merch. You country people don't have like, you don't like it. What's up, guys? We are back and we're in a different space today. We're at Nashville Creative Spaces, Rory Vaidan Studio here in Nashville, Tennessee. And I have with me today, Koei Red. You guys are in for an amazing treat. She is the epitome of determination, discipline and resilience. Country artist from California in my neck of the woods. Welcome to the show, Koei. Thank you so much for having me. I can't believe we're finally here. It's been like a year or two since we've been connected. And so crazy. It's so crazy. It's so funny when you meet people through social media and then you meet them in person. You're like, I feel like I've known you forever and it's my first time meeting you. And it's actually cool in the energy matches, right? It's like you can be one way online and then meet somebody and like they're completely different. Exactly. And that's also that's always like so hard because in my line of work, I meet a lot of great people like yourself and, you know, I got to do a show with my favorite Tony Goldwyn's my favorite actor. And it's like when you meet people like that, you just hope they measure. Exactly. You know, and it's always nice when they do. So you did it. You match like it's all good. It's all good. I feel like it's probably harder for you to especially having a podcast. And if you interview somebody and they're like very lively on social media and then you meet them and they're just like, I've done some show. Dude, I've done some shows where it's like, you know, it always happens virtually. If you do a virtual show, it's like you're staring at the camera on your or the screen. You're like, yeah. It gets awkward. Yeah, well, it can. But then you can see the time you're like, all right, cool. I can see the time. Yeah. You know, and some but it just, you know, you're not going to always mesh with everybody. But as long as the audience gets what they need out of it, I'm good. Exactly. I am so good. So and just like with you, with your music, it's like you want to impact your audience. Yeah, you know, always, always. That's always the goal for sure. Vacaville, California. Good old EV. Let's go. Dude, it's so crazy. Like I told you, I used to play baseball in Vacaville right by the Budweiser factory every weekend from the time I was 13 and 14. And my allergies were so bad there. Oh, so bad. My eyes would itch and they they go. I couldn't see, but I was I was playing ball girl. All those rolling all those rolling hills, you know, all of those, all those, all those trees. And I mean, it's beautiful. I'm just I was I'm not going to lie when when, you know, you were like, oh, my gosh, such a fail. Like, where are you from? When you knew where Vacaville was, I was like, oh, OK, yes. Because typically, especially out here in Nashville, and I'm like, I'm from Vacaville. And they're like, what? But Vaca, Vaca, Vacaville. And I'm like, yeah, I'm like, it's like in between San Francisco, Sacramento, it's like right outside of Napa. Like I have to preface. It's very small, but like it's part of my childhood, too. I mean, because I was there a lot, you know? And we it's so it's just it's such a small world. And that's why I do love social media. I use it the right way. As you do as well, I use it to build relationships. I use it to, you know, build my show and, you know, everything else is off limits for me. You know, but I want to get into your story because it's it's amazing what you did. And, you know, for the audience's sake, like, you know, you're this artist now and it but it didn't start that way. You were behind the scenes. Oh, yeah. At twelve years old, you were writing hooks for rappers just to earn studio time. Walk us through that there because that that is amazing. Pretty interesting. Yeah. I think I knew from like a really young age that I loved music. I loved writing of storytelling. I love all of that. And I come from, you know, my dad was a garbage man. My mom was a stay at home mom. We didn't come from money. I didn't come from connections or knew anybody in the music industry. So it's kind of like a get in where you fit in. My parents were always super supportive, but it was also like my dad came from the baseball world, too. And, you know, you got to, you know, if you really love something and and want something, you have to do it, too. It can't just be everyone pushing, you know what I mean? You can't just throw money behind your kid, you know, like, oh, because then it becomes, you know, inauthentic. It becomes something forced and not something that genuinely like, oh, I want to fight for this, like I want this. Yeah, I just I loved writing and I started kind of doing like skeleton tracks to where I would like take songs and then I would kind of write my own melodies and my own lyrics to them. And it was kind of getting where you fit in. And there was a couple kids around the corner and one of they were a little bit older than me, actually. And he worked out Burger King. I'll never forget this. So funny. He worked out Burger King. He was like 16. My mom grew up with his dad and but they knew that I could like write and sing. And I was just always doing music stuff. And I was doing small shows and shows and stuff. And they were making music on like, you know, garage band and all that stuff. And I'll never forget we had like a Jordan shoebox and he had like a headset from Burger King because he didn't have a microphone and we stuck it through the shoebox and wrapped it with toilet paper. OK, kind of like make a makeshift studio. And we would just go on like YouTube and like just rip instrumentals. And I would just write hooks and things over it. And it ended up somebody's cousin did rap in the Bay Area. And they were like, oh, she's like 12 years old writing these songs. And so then it was like, oh, yeah, we like what you're doing. OK, come here. OK, we have this show. Do you want to open for this guy? Yeah, sure. OK, come to this, you know, studio in the Bay Area or whatever. And what's even crazier is my parents were like so supportive. Like I'd be like rolling up to like straight trap studios in like the middle of Oakland and my mom was just like, all right, like lock the doors. But let's go. Like let's get out. Like, that's so cool. This like they were always supportive and just. But in a way of if you want it, you have to you have to work for it. But the thing was, was music was music. And I just wanted to create so badly that I didn't really care. And the hip hop community was so especially in the Bay Area at that time was just so welcoming and like just didn't didn't matter. My age didn't matter what I looked like. Didn't matter that I was like nothing like everybody was just like, oh, like she's she's got the hook. She's no the bars. Like let's do it. And it's the Bay Area, man. Progress from there. And ultimately, I mean, if you were a music producer living in Northern California, you probably were able to afford to make a steady living there off money. And I didn't have money to make music. So it was like, get in where you fit in, you know, it's such a cool story because, you know, I look at adults now, they say they want something, but they but they want the map. They want everything figured out for them instead of just taking action and moving. And that's the one thing that I really love at 12 years old. You understood the secret to success. It's like, if I want this, not only do I have to take action, but I got to work diligently in order to, like you said, get in where I fit in right now because you don't know where it's going to lead. Now you're sitting here in Nashville. Exactly. Like it's it's wild to me. And I feel like it was always part of the journey to like where I am now is what I've always wanted to do. And it's funny because I've always considered myself a songwriter first because storytelling is my favorite thing in the world. I love it. So in any facet of that and and so combining kind of the genres and the fusions that I do now is just kind of a product of where I come from, who I am. And, you know, people might not get it, but people that do come from where I come from or know who I am or know how I got my start or, you know, know all the background, know my background. They are like, yeah. So I'm getting goosebumps right now because it's like I'm I'm listening to what you're saying and I'm looking at your hat. That's not country music. And so for the audience, you know, her hat is so sick. It's one of her merchandise. And it says that's not country music because a lot of people put country music in a box and you've exploded that freaking thing. Oh, yeah. And the thing is, is, you know, I actually the reason why I wanted to make my merch of that's not country music, because that was the number one comment I used to get all the time. Yeah, that's not country. That's not country. And I'm like, OK, cool. Yeah. Like now you have a hat. So now to really go and hold true to your comment, you can buy my merch. Yeah, buy her merch, you know, for your red dot com, right? Exactly. Yeah, buy the merch. But, you know, it's but the thing is, is like I got it very early on, as you know. Like I I'm like, you definitely did. I remember I remember when you wrote me and I was like, hey, you know, you're like, and you said something along the lines of you're like, oh, you kind of remind me of like a entry pop, like a Leah kind of. And I was like, yes. And I'm so that's another thing is I love 90s fashion. That's like my thing. You know what I mean? As like a mid 90s baby, you know, like grew up in that era. So like I just I love all that. I love throwbacks. I love, you know what I mean, that type of era. And I think I kind of missed the curve of being able to really like be able to participate in that era. But it was a dope era, dude. Loving that era is a dope era. Yeah. Essentially. Yeah. I just I love like the baggy stuff and like the Calvin's. That's, you know, what a lot of people want. It's funny now. And I love it so much because people get like weirded out. Oh, I see people wearing, you know, like, oh, there are the Calvin thing, just like you do. And I'm like, that's freaking awesome. Yeah, like I love it. Like, yeah, like 90s fashion. Like, please make a comeback. I love it. Yeah, I know. It's funny because I picked up the Elia vibe right away. She was she was my favorite. And I remember when she passed, I was in college and I just remember just reading it in our school paper in Louisiana. And I literally got up and walked out of class. Like it's so so like when I saw you and I saw just the bars and just the way and then the way you dress. Like you had the Calvin clients up. I'm like, wow. Yeah. Like what she's bringing it back. Like she's bringing that shit back. I gotta be I gotta be along for this ride. So let me ask you a question. So with with the writing of the bars and everything like that, where you came from, that's obviously influenced how you write and produce music. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so funny because even out here, like I'm just even the more pop or the more country stuff that I do, I'm just very wordy. And that comes from the fact of writing hip hop for years. Yeah. I mean, it's it's kind of embedded into my writing style and just who I am. And it's also what I love. So I was like to say, yeah, like that genre like chose me. I don't feel like I chose it. I don't think people realize like because they look at me, you know, and like vanilla dude. No. No. Vendil dude. Dude. I mean, like growing up in the San Francisco Bay, like it was all hip hop. It was, you know, I grew up in the ghetto. Like I was running away from the Bloods after, you know, when I'm walking home at eighth grade, I'm like, what? Sorry, probably sixth, seventh grade. But it's like that area can give you such a cultural vibe that nobody can understand. This message is sponsored by Raycon. Look, y'all, I don't ask for much in life, but if I'm grinding in the gym, I need two things. A killer playlist and headphones that can actually keep up. Weak sound quality is a non-negotiable deal breaker for this guy. That's why I switched to Raycon's essential open earbuds. Crystal clear sound, open ear. So I'm not completely zoned out and they just fit. No fussing, no falling out, zero excuses. Whether you're hitting the gym, running errands, or just touching some darn grass. These belong in your ears. And guess what? You can get 15% off right now. And Raycon has over 3 million customers. And the sound quality is just as good as the way more expensive brands. And guess what? If you don't like them, they have a 30 day guarantee. The essential open earbuds are the perfect addition to your everyday routine. Go to buyraycon.com slash determined open to get 15% off. Thanks Raycon for sponsoring. When life gets hectic, energy ups and downs are all you need. If you're seeking energy reassurance, Eonnext can help. From regularly updating our tariffs to get you our best value, to smart tech that helps you take control of your energy future, we're here for whatever's next. Just one of the reasons why we're rated excellent on TrustPilot by our customers. Find out more about how we can help at eonnext.com. Eligibility and T's and C's apply. TrustPilot February 2026. It's crazy. There's so many innovators that come from the Bay Area too. And it's funny because Vacaville's like the outskirts, you know what I mean? Silver Bay. But it's still, yeah, it's still, you know what I mean, considered that. And there's just so much culture and there's so much like just artistic vision out there. I mean, you can even see it with artists that have come out, directors. I mean, you have Ryan Coogler, just in centers. You have Kehlani that just won a Grammy. You have E40 who is literally considered, you know, one of the goats. Kind of an innovator of hip hop because he did it in his own wet Mac Dray, who's still. Did you ever hear RBL Posse? RBL Posse. That does sound, wait, give me something. Balance of this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay. There it is. There it is. Sometimes I'm like, I've grown up around so much Bay Area music that sometimes I'm like, I just want like into like, you know, like I'll got to respect the OGs too. You have to. And like, like RBL, I mean, I still listen to it in the gym, you know, because that's my childhood. It brings me back. But like, just again, my point for everybody listening and watching is, you know, in order to understand an artist, you have to understand where they come from. And then you'll fully understand and appreciate it. You know, I look at what you're creating and I'm very proud of you by the way. Thank you. Very proud of you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Absolutely. Is you have made it your mission not to fit in, but to stay authentic. How has that blessed you but also caused you stress? Because I think there's two different paradigms here, right? Oh, yeah. You know, like we talked about rejection earlier off camera. Yeah. Right. Yeah. That rejection really is protection sometimes. And even though you might not see it at that time, usually later you'll have that, aha, kind of moment. Thank God. Oh my gosh. Okay. Like I understand it now. And you kind of need those. You need those kind of divine interventions to kind of like, you know, to get frustrated, to just be human. Yeah. Because then that will also frustrate you, but it'll put you in a position to like, listen, you're either going to go one or two ways. You're going to go 10 times harder or you're going to give up. Yeah. And giving up for me is not an option. I don't think my family would ever let me give up at this point, even if I wanted to. And that's actually happened before, you know, so. That right there. Okay. Because this is something that drives me crazy. There's so many people out there that say, I've never wanted to give up. I know I'm it. You're a liar. Yeah. Or delusional or like maybe you need medicine because I mean, I think I've wanted to quit 10 times last week. Yeah. But it's not an option. It is a current state of emotion. Oh yeah. And so dig into that because the audience listening and watching, some of them right now, are in the middle of wanting to give up their dream. Oh yeah. No. And the thing is, is like, don't do it. Don't do it. Thing is, is once you give it up, then it's like, then what? Then. Cool. You lost. Exactly. And I truly believe in the in this, in the phrase or the saying. You only fail when you give up. That's the only time you'll ever fail. And when you have that mindset and that mentality, you'll realize that even the slow progressions, like with me, I was sitting at, I had over a million followers on TikTok and all this stuff and I was putting out music and I'm serving in restaurants on weekends and funding all my own stuff and doing all this. And with that being said, my Spotify numbers were only, you know, 50,000 monthly listeners and I sat there for a really long time and my goal was just, I just want to break 100,000 monthly listeners and I gave everything that I could. You know, I moved out here. I won a car on the prices right and sold it to take that money to. You were on the prices, right? Yes. Get the hell out of here dude. Yeah, that's another like fun, funny fact about me. Yeah. Man. I won. I actually, I won the showcase showdown and that 2019 Jetta. It was the only thing I've ever owned and I, yeah, and I remember it was, it was in 2019 and it was around the time where, you know, TikTok and stuff, everything started happening in 2020 and, but it was always part of the plan of me being here and doing the music that I'm doing now. It was always, I wanted to kind of infuse the two worlds that I grew up in, you know what I mean and what I listened to and what my mom loved and you know what I mean, that was kind of embedded in me to really just, this was all part of the plan. Yeah. And so it's funny. Yeah. I, I sold that 2019 Jetta. So the only thing I've ever owned just to come out here to the move to Nashville and fund basically that move because you got to go all in on yourself. If you don't go all in on yourself, then nobody else will. This is so good. You know, this is so good. Like the only, like you said, I want the audience to hang on to this because like the only thing you ever owned when you own something for the first time, it's like, I'm, I'm never letting this shit go because I don't know if I'm going to get something else ever and I want something of my own, but you saw it as leverage. Yeah. You saw it as a tool to get you where you wanted to go ultimately. And I think that's such a special quality of you about you. Oh, thank you. Absolutely. It's just, you know, that, that moment is the reason why you've gone from 50,000. To almost 200,000 now. To almost 200,000 monthly. You know, I'm a little offended that church is not at least at 1.5. Can you guys start streaming church, please? What the hell is wrong with you? That is my, I love that song. It's so deep. That was my first release. Church was? I thought wildcard was. No. No church was. First release. So good. And that, that song came from such an authentic and organic place because I was at that, I was at that pivot point of wanting to quit, wanting to give up, but it also, like I, back to what I was saying before, if I give up, okay. So I spent my entire life almost signed to this invisible contract, knowing that this was what I meant to do, not trusting my journey and just give it up. Like no way. Yeah. So instead my roommate or my old roommate at the time was going through a hard time and he was also my producer and he was sleeping on my couch, was going through break up, having a really, really hard time and it was on my couch and he started singing like this little like hook, like melody. I was like that. And at that time I was in a really, really rough spot and I kind of didn't know what I, what my next move was. Like I wanted, I was coming out here, but I wasn't getting, I mean, I would show up and have 10 sessions and every single one of them would cancel. It was just, it was really, really rough. Like, and it put you in that, in that position of like, oh, maybe this is a sign. Maybe, you know what I mean? And it's like, no, I'm going to make something happen. And I remember of course, was singing that melody and had that guitar riff and I was like, sit and we sat on my couch that night and we cut the entire song within like 30 minutes. Are you kidding me? Yeah. And I just like almost like freestyle doubt, like the verses and stuff. And I just knew that I need to define like, and that's what the song was about. And it's not necessarily, and people always like take it as like, oh, like actually going to a physical church. It's like, no, church isn't here. Like church is in here. Like your relationship with God, like I'm, you know, a follower of Jesus Christ and God and like, the same space we can say that here. Yeah. But like whatever you believe in, you know, like it's in here. You know what I mean? And that's church. And that's, you know what I mean is, is admitting to yourself sometimes like, man, I'm down, but you know what? Like I have so much faith and like, I'm going to, I'm going to crawl out of this. There's two, there's two, I don't know what you call them because I'm not a musician, but there's, I'm going to call them lines or verses or whatever that I resonate with so much. And here they are screaming out, but nothing's leaving your teeth. And, um, overlooking the flowers just to dwell on the weeds. Yeah. Those two make me feel some type of emotion because at some point we've all felt like we are screaming, we are trying to say something, but nothing's coming out. Yeah. No one is hearing it. And then in life, there's so much adversity, so much adversity with anything. I don't care if you're a teacher, hotel, you know, you work in hospitality, musician, podcast hosts, like the amount of adversity that you're going to face on a daily basis is astronomical. And so when I looked at the, when I heard the line, overlook the flowers just to dwell on the weeds, I'm like, dude, I'm doing that shit right now. Yeah. Look how beautiful this is. I don't have to go and check in with a boss anymore. Oh, for sure. I don't have to do anything. I get to talk to great people every single day. I'm living a freaking dream. Does it look like what I want it to yet? Nope. No, but look at how far I've come. Yeah. But like, I'm in Nashville right now, dude. Yeah. You know, like what in the world happened, but like, and this is something that I want you to answer too, because I'm having to reflect on this a lot lately. I keep, I keep looking at, you know, the, my brand, you know, the business. It's like, I got to get to that next level and I got to get there quick because I get somewhere and I'm like, okay, this is neat, but what's next? Yeah. And what we forget is to reflect back. Oh, for sure. And understand how far we've come. Yeah. How do you deal with that? I'd say, you know, I've had like some divine intervention. So when I would say about this time last year, exactly, I was probably the most miserable version of myself. I was very comparative. I was very frustrated. The why me, like why, why am I like, I'm doing this and I'm, you know, all of these things. And I just wasn't happy. And what I realized was that I was not trusting my journey. I wasn't trusting myself. It's hard because it's unseen. And then it's crazy because I have to remind myself like, it's about trusting the journey. It's about trusting yourself. Like nothing, the universe isn't going to reward you when you're over here worrying about this, that, this, that and the other. It's going to reward you when it's like, oh, she's ready. And I've always said, you know, there's no such thing as luck. It's always when preparation meets opportunity. And the universe has been, and I haven't had a big moment. I haven't been put on by a big artist. I haven't had a big record deal. I haven't had like a big moment or an opportunity, but I know it's coming. And I know that when it does happen, I'm going to be so ready for it and so prepared because I've gone through all of these steps. So it's always reassuring that and telling myself that, that, you know, going back to that, and I kind of had this moment spiritually with myself and I, it dawned on me of, yeah, why haven't I been like, look at, like, I've been, like, I'm doing this, like I'm going on tour, like, I have all of these great things. I have fans, I have people that relate to my music and that's all I've ever wanted. Like, focus on that. Focus on the good. Dude, you got three in this room. And the little one right there that just adores you. With the cutest cowgirl hat on now. She is cute. But it's one of those things. Yeah. Like, you have to trust your journey. And, and I am a very spiritual person in that, in that aspect. I don't relate all of my spirituality to like the book, like I've said, I've always said it's, it's in here, like your relationship with God, everything's in here. Yeah. Um, and so, yeah, I just relate back to that if there's such a plan in store that's bigger than I ever imagined. We don't know it. And I'm trusting the journey and I know I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be. And I know that when those opportunities come. You're going to be ready. You're already ready. Just the world hasn't caught up yet. And that's just kind of one of the things. Thank you. No, absolutely. It's just, it's just what it is. And it's funny because, you know, my good friend, Dan Tuffarello, he was my boss at Paychex and we ended up becoming like brothers. And he is now on my team. He left corporate America. He went and taught for years like, I'm not doing lesson plans. I'm out. And he said to me, he goes, I promise you guys, the audience, I'm going somewhere with this. He goes, I'm done. Let me know if you know anybody. I'm like, well, do you want to come work for me? Like, he's like, yeah. Absolutely. And so like I brought him along and this is what he says to me yesterday, you know, because I told her, you know, I told him that, you know, my wife was coming and, you know, and everything. And in Mia and I go, he goes, look, dude, I want you to understand something. And he texted me this after we had the conversation. He goes, dads don't get a whole lot of credit. Like they don't hear how great of a job they're doing from their friends, etc. He goes, but the fact that you're able, that you were able to build something that your family can be along with and enjoy, he goes, dude, you're winning. And I looked at that. I'm like, what? Like it's so true. It's like, because this all pertains to the journey. Exactly. Like this isn't normal. Yeah. There's somebody right now that is a podcaster to go and like, I want that. And I'm looking up here and go, I want that. Exactly. There's always this, the grass is always greener on the other side kind of thing. But you're, but you're so right in that aspect of like the opportunities that come from, come from what we do, whether it be music, whether it be entertainment, whether it be whatever, are things that will last a lifetime. Like, I mean, just like a small thing. So I grew up riding dirt bikes. That's like a passion that me and my dad. Not, not surprised. Yeah. Not surprised. But it's one of those amazing things where when I first came out to Nashville, or like official, like I would say it was like, I was like two years in, two years ago, Supercross was happening in Nashville. And I was working with WME and they were like, hey, we have these tickets, like these, you know, really cool tickets. Do you want to go to Supercross and whatever? And I was like, yeah. So of course, me and my dad used to go to Supercross every year. Like we still to this day, that's like kind of our bonding thing. That's so cool. We'll call and talk about like the races and heats and like who's went, like big fans. And it's just a bonding thing that we do every week. Like it's, if it's baseball, it's either baseball or Supercross. Okay. So baseball, what's his background in baseball? Because you mentioned that earlier. It was pitcher. Where? So he was drafted in his high school parking lot when he was 16. He was a stud. And yeah. And then he tore his rotator cuff. Went to college and was trying to kind of get back into it. I'll be honest, not to circle back, but he's one of the reasons why, no matter what's happened or any setbacks that I've had in music, why I'm hungrier than I've, than ever, why I'm always come back because, you know, he put into perspective one, one night when I called him and said that I was, you know, I'm done. I can't do this anymore. I'm just tired dad. I just, and he was like, I love you. I'll support you through whatever, but I can't let you quit. And I was like, why? And he was like, because do you, can you, do you have two legs? Can you write a song? Can you sing? And I'm like, yeah. And he was like, well, guess what? I had a dream and I worked really hard for baseball. I loved baseball. It was my first passion. And he was like, and it was out of my control to still continue that dream. I got hurt. I couldn't do anything. You don't have that excuse. Think about kids that are sitting in hospital beds right now that don't have the even luxury to even go after something that they want. And you're sitting here complaining, saying you're tired. Like think about how, you know what I mean? And he was like granted and it always makes me emotional when he said this, he was like, granted, my dreams changed and it was to be. And it was to be your dad. And he was like, but my dream is also to see you live your dream. Come on. And I was like, someone says that to you. What the hell? Okay. All right. Well, I guess I can't quit now. But not in the overalls again. Like, well, let's go. I will run in it. You know, like, what do you eat? No, but it's one of those things, you know, and it's all about perspective. It's all about perspective. When you look at, you know what I mean? Things like that, you're like, wow, you're so right. Like I feel, I feel like such an asshole. Like, oh my God. Yes. But you need that. You need those divine interventions. You do. And one of the things that I will say about your dad, I also had that injury. I went to LSU. I played in the college world series and I didn't have that choice because I got hurt my first year there. And then for two straight years, I was working so hard to get back on the field. When I came back, I wasn't the same. Like I couldn't throw like I used to. I, you know, it just got in my head. So to your dad's point, like that's one of the things too that keeps me from quitting what I'm doing now other than the fact that I'm obsessed with it. I honestly think I love this more than I love playing baseball. Oh yeah. In some weird way. The thing that nobody knows about me, and I'm going to say it right now for the first time on air is what I love more than podcasting is being on stage. What I love more than that is being a husband and a father. I love that. So I understand your dad's paradigm where he's coming from. And my biggest fear is when I look at my three beautiful children is I don't want to ever see him quit anything. If you make a commitment and you're doing something, you're going to finish the season, the year out, whatever it is, and then we can pivot. If that's not your thing, cool, you tried it. But if it's your passion and it's your purpose, you're not allowed to quit. You can't, you know, and that's what I want the audience to really pay attention on is because what you said about your dad and how he walked you through that. So if you're a parent, you have a child looking to quit something, replay that. Yeah. Run it back. Run it back, dude. Because. Run it back. And run it back in your own mind, right? I don't care if it's a fitness journey. I don't care fixing a marriage or being promoted in your career. You cannot see the future. You don't know what's coming. Like two weeks ago, I didn't know I was going to be sitting in Nashville. This message is sponsored by Raycon. Look, y'all, I don't ask for much in life, but if I'm grinding in the gym, I need two things. A killer playlist and headphones that can actually keep up. Weak sound quality is a non-negotiable deal breaker for this guy. That's why I switched to Raycon's essential open earbuds. Crystal clear sound, open ear, so I'm not completely zoned out and they just fit. No fussing, no falling out, zero excuses. Whether you're hitting the gym, running errands, or just touching some darn grass. These belong in your ears. And guess what? You can get 15% off right now. And Raycon has over 3 million customers and the sound quality is just as good as the way more expensive brands. And guess what? If you don't like them, they have a 30-day guarantee. The essential open earbuds are the perfect addition to your everyday routine. Go to buyraycon.com slash determined open to get 15% off. Thanks, Raycon, for sponsoring. When life gets hectic, energy ups and downs are all you need. If you're seeking energy reassurance, Eonnex can help. From smart tech that helps you take control of your energy future to always staying below the price cap with NexPledge. We're here for whatever's next. Just one of the reasons why we're rated excellent on TrustPilot by our customers. Find out more at eonnex.com. NexPledge variable rates are always below the option price cap. 25 pounds exit fee per fuel applies. Eligibility and season fees apply. TrustPilot February 2026. Here we are. I didn't know. I had no idea. Yeah. Opportunity where Janna Cramer came up and actress and I'm like, okay, cool. I'm like, wait, Koei's there. Wait, wait a second. Fillmore's there. And so. All the opportunities aligned. All the opportunities aligned. Went to a friend and I said, hey, best studio in Nashville. He goes, Nashville creative spaces, brand builders, Rory Vain. I'm like, dude, set that up. And then we got Rory coming on tomorrow too, which I haven't met, but I've known of them ever since I've been in the space. Yeah. And it's so funny. I'm telling him yesterday. I mean, tomorrow, but I'll say here on the air, so many of my close friends are because of Rory Vaden. And Rory Vaden doesn't even know it. Really? He doesn't know it. That's actually amazing. Matthew. You can meet tomorrow. Yeah. We're gonna, we're gonna hang out. We're gonna do a show. Oh, that's gonna be neat. So like one of my good friends, Matthew Hedden, like heard a podcast with someone that I'm no longer connected with. I'll leave his name out. And he's like, well, hey, if Rory Vaden's on this pod with him, then maybe I should join his community. And I was in that community and we both left, but that's how me and him met. And we've been close friends forever, like three years now. Love that. I mean, so it's like, there's, there's this big spider web. Anyway, I'm getting on a tangent, but, but like two weeks ago, I didn't know. Like, it's my point, right? You don't know what the next second is going to bring. So if you quit, like what, what the hell? I think the thing is that's always brought me back to is just, I love for it. Like, like kind of like you said, like there's nothing more that you love. And that, that was my whole thing too. It's like, I can't picture myself doing anything else in the world. So even if I'm 80 years old, still, still doing it, like I'm still gonna do it. Because I, because I love it. Yeah. Even like, regardless of my success level, when I peak, whatever, like when you love something and the intention behind it is just genuine, like you just love it. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like I don't, you know, I've never been signed to a record label. I've never been signed to anything. I don't get it. I'm sorry. What are you guys doing? Like I said, rejection is protected. Because like I said, when that does happen and when the right people come around, they're going to get it. And then it's going to be off to the races. Like I love the fact that, and I used to hate it. I used to be so envious, like, why can't it just be easy? But nothing worth it is ever easy. You know what I mean? Nothing worth it. The long jab. Think about some of the most successful people in the industry, regardless of, you know, like I said, entertainment, music, sports, whatever. Think about like Tom Brady. Dude. You know what I mean? Like the rise out of the ash and to end up being one of one of the greatest football players of all time. Oh yeah. It's definitely the best quarterback. You know what I mean? Yeah. Um, Hall of Famer. Oh. And he's last, you know, last, last drafting class, right? Like nobody expected him and he came out of Michigan and he wasn't like crazy in Michigan. But like, No, he wasn't. Then he came out and just he understood he, he put, he put everything into it. I want to tell you something because I saw this clip of Tom Brady being interviewed on stage and you've probably seen it. Everybody's seen it, but if you guys haven't listened up or in watch. So he went up to his coaches at Michigan and said, Hey, look, I'm only getting three reps of practice, three snaps of practice. How am I going to develop and get better with only three snaps? You know what the response from his coach was? Hmm. Those three snaps you take, make them the best three that you've ever done. Well, clearly you did. So like the, the, the thing is with that, right? It's like, it doesn't matter how much playing time you're getting or how many interviews you do or how many stages you're singing on that moment, make it the best that you can do. And now he is the best quarterback of all time, which kind of offends me because I was a Joe Montana guy. So that sucks. But I did meet Tom Brady. Oh really? I met Tom Brady. So he's from San Mateo. Yeah. Okay. So he's a Bay Area boy. Yeah. Yeah. He's a, he's a Bay guy. So right before the draft, I went to college at San Mateo in junior college before I transferred LSU. We walk out and he's playing catch with his dad on the football field. I said, Hey man, what's going on? You ready? He's like, Yeah, we'll see what happens. I was like, Hey man, nice to meet you. Good luck. So crazy. The rest is history because he trusted his process. He had his journey. He knew he didn't give up. He knew that he was going to go on to be greater than what he probably could have imagined, what anybody could have imagined at the time. And that's what I'm saying is that perspective of like, just, just run with it. Like don't think why me think why not me. Why not? Or what is this teaching me? What am I supposed to learn from this? Right? There's got to be a reason it's like, I haven't peaked yet. You haven't peaked yet. There's a reason because we need to learn a lesson and we need to enjoy this. And like, for, for me, when I look at everything, I go, would I have wanted it quicker? You damn right. I have a family to take care of. I would love endless amounts of money so I could travel with them. You know, when I'm not recording, you know, I'd love to just hop on a plane, you know, and shoot off the Yellowstone for the weekend on a surprise. It's just not time yet. But the one thing I'll say is through all the adversity and the pain that I've gone through and that you're going through when we get there, we are going to appreciate it so much more than the flash in the pan overnight success. Like let it take another five years. I'm only 47, only 47. Jesus Christ. Listen, 26. Run with 26. You're good. That's fine. That's fine. Hey, look, I feel young, you know, but I think the journey and all the pain, because we talk about this a lot on the shows, determination and discipline. That's what we go through here. Yeah. It's like leaning into those moments. A lot of people like to run from them. I, and my wife knows this, I feel that pain so deeply. And I put my face in it because then I know what I'm feeling. And then when I get out of it, I'm like, I can appreciate the next moment. Yeah. Do you also find yourself like really accepting the pain and not running from it? Yeah. No, definitely. I think it's one of those things too, especially recently, like I said, this time last year, I was, you know, in kind of like a rougher spot. And it's one of those interesting things. You said something really interesting in the fact of you said, do I wish it would have happened sooner? Yes. Sure. I, looking at myself now, thinking back to a year ago when I wanted that, that success, I wanted that overnight success, I look back now, I'm like, shit, I was not, I wasn't ready. Like right now, like who I am now, I'm writing the bet and hasn't come out yet, but I've been writing the best music I've ever written in my life. And I needed to go through that. Oh, I'm standing by it. Like the record, the records that I have been doing, I would say this past year are the best records I've ever made and they haven't come out yet. And you know why is because I embraced my authenticity. I realized that I chased so hard that, and I put so much pain on myself and so much pressure on myself to kind of be something that I wasn't in a way. You did? In a way. I mean, moving out here, you know, I really wanted to be kind of accepted into the country world. And I really wanted, you know what I mean, to make friends and rub elbows with all of these up and coming people that clearly didn't want anything to do with me because they're like, who are you? What's this hip hop shit? And you know, kind of in a way or like, or like a almost like a dance, monkey dance kind of thing. Like I get called in the sessions and I'd be super excited to write because what people don't realize is like, I had come from also, I took songwriting courses when I was 10 years old, when I was 15. And I paid for those myself through Skype every day. I would meet with this songwriter from Berkeley College of Music and he would basically go over the curriculum that he went through for songwriting and taught me the basic formula of pop, pop writing. So people sometimes don't realize that I do have that background as well. And they'd call me to sessions and be like, okay, I want you to put a verse on this. And I'm like, okay, well, that's not writing a song together. That's like you wanting to cloud with me. Yeah, that's like a feature. That's like a fee. That's not me coming in and writing a song with you, you know, but like, it's one of those things, yeah, where I definitely had to face that a lot. But like I said, it was now I'm like so confident in what I'm doing and who I am. And I don't care what people think. You know, you shouldn't, you know, like, because I think everything about your music is what I love. Because I love pop. I love hip hop and I do love country. Yeah, it's like, wait a second, I can go to one place in here at all. Exactly. Like, like, and you, you country people don't act like you don't like hip hop. I think it's funny too. And I keep that all the time. I'm like country and hip hop are the cousins in the genre. Sure. They're a lifestyle genre and they're also storytelling genre. And that's what I fell in love with with hip hop originally was storytelling. I mean, like, I loved TLC and out. Oh, dude, TLC, man. We've talked about this before, haven't we? Yeah. Yeah. TLC, left eye is like what inspired me to want to write. You can ask my mom growing up when I was a little girl. I used to love, love, there was three music videos that I loved that would come on and they're so random and so weird, but I loved Waterfalls by TLC. That's a great song. Oh my gosh. I actually, I have a country cover of it coming out. Stop. Yeah. And it's actually phenomenal. And when you hear it, it, it makes, you're like, this 100% come in. Oh yeah. It's phenomenal. Of course I hit the left eyebrow. Of course she did. But Thriller by Michael Jackson. And of course, Man, I feel like a woman. Yeah. That's right. Those were like, and any man of mine I used to love. That's a great one. I really liked that song. Yeah. Like, or I'm thinking of the, yeah, I think, yeah, that was the music video of her like with like the cropped gene and the genes. And she's like, I'm thinking, is it, who's better? Have you, no, no, no, that it is any man of mine. Yeah. When she's like on the tractor, live out. Oh my gosh. Yeah. And I thought she was so beautiful. I was like, you know, like when you're little and you just like, yeah, watch, you know, things like that. But yeah, no, I loved all, they're just, they're all kind of related, genre wise. You know, it's, it's awesome because it allows you to create this art that's so different. Yeah. And sometimes, you know, people are like, I'm not ready for different, but when they are, they are. And it's, it's astronomical. And I'll tell you what, you know, you, I want to go back because you, you talked about at one point, you know, they didn't get it. I remember having this conversation with my wife very early on, I'm like, nobody gets to the determined society. And I said, you know, in fact, I don't even know if I get it. I don't know what it means. I don't know what it is. It didn't make sense. Now it makes perfect sense because of consistency, right? And overcoming certain things. And, you know, I, I made a move in my own life to get very healthy because about, you know, November of 24, I was probably the most depressed that I've been in a very long time. And I remember laying down on the couch and not being able to get up and do anything unless I was recording. I was just, I wouldn't work out when do anything, but then I changed that, you know, and I got lean and I got in great and better shape and now I'm in better shape. And we keep moving on that, but I became the brand. I became the determined society. Instead of just talking about determination, discipline, I'm now the billboard for it. And then that's when the show went, and so, you know, I just think that's such an important point because, you know, people will get it. Oh, for sure. People will get it. Now it makes perfect sense. The determined society. Oh, you live a determined lifestyle and you have people on that talk about determination and discipline. That makes sense. It's like, duh. And then you'll have people that are inspired by what you're doing. And I think that's also like just a magical thing is seeing people that love what you do, that get what you do, and then you inspire them to do their art form or what they're doing in a different way. The most rewarding part about this isn't the amount of listeners a month, the streams, the ad revenue. It's when I get messages like I did from this dude in New Zealand. I got it two days ago. He had just found out about an affair that his wife had four years ago and he's struggling in his marriage, trying to figure out what he's going to do to stay and, you know, if he's going to stay. And is it okay to stay or do I need to leave? How do I become a, how do I be a great father only seeing my kids half the time? That's some heavy stuff. But he was searching through Spotify and found my show. And he started binging it like a couple of weeks ago. And he wrote me a message and I responded. You know, and I followed him back and I'm pouring into him. That to me is the most rewarding about this whole thing. I read somewhere that an army vet, and I don't know if you know this, but an army vet said your music helped them open up about his emotions. Yeah. Yeah. I actually, so crazy story. And I remember I cried when I got, so I've had, I've had a couple vets reach out to me. One, unfortunately, Mark, he passed away and I sent him a Koei red hat and I sent him a video. Damn. And he was, um, he had Parkinson's and he was a, I think he was a Vietnam vet. He was older and my manager reached out to me and was like, Koei, I'll talk about, I know exactly what you're talking about, but I'll talk about that one. Sure. No, of course. No. Um, and Nico, my manager reached out to me, was like, Koei, you'll never guess what just happened. I'm like, what? He's like, one of my homies, like in North Carolina, he's a caretaker for this vet. Um, this, like Vietnam vet named Mark and, you know, he's Parkinson's, he can't really like talk or like, you know what I mean? He's kind of, It was advanced. He was kind of towards the end and, um, and he's in his wheelchair and he was like, I've seen you post this girl stuff that you work with and he's like, okay. He was like, and Mark is over there just jamming on his phone and it was your artist, Koei. And he was like, listen, I can't remember what song it was or what it was, but he sent Nico a video of him and he was like rocking back and forth like with like, in like a thing and he was like, oh, Mark, you like it? You like Koei red? And he was like, yeah. And he was like, and he like, was like, just jamming. And so I sent him a video message. Uh, and Nico's like, listen, like totally up to you, but like, I just had to send this to you and I was like, let's run it. Like let's send him a hat. Like, let's, like, I'll send him a video, like a personal video, like, Hey, what's up? So like, Mark, oh my gosh, like, I love you. Like, thank you for your service. Like, I can't wait to meet you when I come to North Carolina, you know, all this stuff. He ended up passing away, unfortunately, but I was like, I'll have a ticket waiting for you. Damn. And then his, the caretaker sent a video of him watching my video and he's like, he's watched it like 20 times. Like he just is like, so, and he was like getting excited and like, just it's things like that that just put, like I said, make, make everything, all the, all the pain, all the, the hardships, all of the doubt, everything that you go through. Like I'm exactly where I need to be. I'm doing exactly what I've always wanted to do. That's it. But I did, I did get a, I got a direct message from this, from this guy one time and he was like, Hey, he's like, I feel comfortable sending you this because I don't think you'll ever read it. He's like, because you have a lot of followers, you know, like, but I do, I try and reach, I try to read everything as much as possible. I mean, I'm only human and I, you know, have, have things going on and I can't get back to everybody, but I really try to because I'm so appreciative. Like, there's thousands of great artists in the world. You can listen to anybody. Like you want to listen to me. Like I want to give you a hug. Like I wish I could hug everybody, you know, and just like thank them because I, like I said, I had to work really hard. Like I, I haven't had a lot of people believe in me, especially coming up. Like a lot of people, I was like, laughed at, I was mocked. I was, you know what I mean? I know how that feels. And bullied for, you know, so having like, oh my, like, you have no idea what this, what this means to me. But I got this message and he was like, Hey, you know, you'll probably never read this. I feel comfortable saying this, but I, you know, did three tours and I rack. I have a beautiful wife. I have two beautiful little girls, but sometimes it just, I don't feel strong. I don't feel like I'm strong enough for them. And I listened to your song, cry like a man. And for the three minutes and two seconds made me feel like I was seen for the first time. And he was like, and I just want to let you know, thank you so much for writing that. And you have no idea how much that song meant to me in these type of moments. And I was just like, I don't remember crying. And I was like, Amber called my mom, because I was called my mom for like something. I'm like, what do I do? And I was like, shit, do I write him back? Like, do I let him? And like, is he going to be like, Oh my gosh, he opened it. She saw it. Now I'm mortified. I'm like, mortified. Like, Oh my gosh. I'm just like, yeah, just writing back and saying, like, you know, thank you. And I'm like, yeah, but I don't want to, you know, it's kind of like manly, you know, it's like buff dude, tattoos, like Jim, you know what I mean? And I was like, oh, like, I don't want to, you know, but I also was just like, Oh my gosh, like, I'm so touched. Like, I love that you love that song. You're exactly who I wrote it for. I'm so happy that my music found you. And I think, yeah, that's, you know, with church, with cry like a man, I even wildcard, like, I get that all the time. And I can't tell you how much connecting with people through writing. It makes me feel so seen. Because like I said, I've always considered myself a writer first. So getting that people, even you saying some of the specific lyrics to me, I'm like, I get it. You got, you got those. Yeah, I get it. I do get it. I think it's, it's shaped the way you've written your music because it's deep. Yeah, it's not empty. And the world needs deep right now. Yeah, the world needs deep. But I have one more question for you before we shut it down. I could go like, I know, seven hours with you. I feel like I spiral too. Sorry, like, no, you're, no, you're great. This has been a very fun conversation with a lot of value that is literally the root of this show. And I'm just grateful that for your friendship, first and foremost, and then secondly, that we got to connect and do this together. I'm so grateful too. I was, I was just telling somebody, I'm a little bit shy in the sense of I don't put a lot of myself personally out on the internet. I get a little bit nervous. The internet's a scary play. Two, two, you're telling me. I get picked apart already for music that I'm like, uh, like, you know, it's hard to, hey guys, how's it go? Like, you know, to do the camera. Yeah, that's hard. It gets a little nerve wracking. I'm like, am I even, I'm boring as shit. Like I just sit down with my, with my Pomeranians. Like, you know, um, so, so I can't tell you how much it means that you invited me to come on today. Well, absolutely. We'll do it again, you know, and we'll do it when you're on a big tour. Yes. That'll be really cool. Right. But don't worry. We don't get much hate here. Like on the show, you're, you're not going to get destroyed. Trust me. But one more question. Again, when I started the show, you know, one day I, I said this statement, I just want to wake up in a society where people are determined to chase their dreams no matter how they feel emotionally at that time. Yeah. That's my definition. That's my definition of determination. What's yours? Of determination of, hmm, that's a good question. My determination or my definition of determination. Trusting the journey and just doing it. Just doing it. You can sit around and sit and think about it forever, but until you just go out there and do it, and it's going to be scary. It's going to be scary. You're going to put yourself out there for whatever it is you want to do, whatever it is you're pursuing. It's going to be scary. You're going to feel silly. You're going to feel, oh my gosh, you know, if you're putting yourself out there with music for the first time, whatever, let's just say that, or a podcast, you're probably going to get three views. You're probably going to get five views. Yeah. Keep doing it. Yeah. Keep going. Keep doing it. And it's, and it's, it's the ego a little bit. It hits your pride. You're like, yeah, but I'm so good. Why, why is it, you know what I mean? Trust. Yeah. Trust the journey. Trust yourself. You got to earn it. Yeah, exactly. You got to earn it. You have to earn it. Because when you do earn it, when it's not handed to you, when you do earn it, it makes you a better person. It genuinely does. Truly does. I mean, think about, you know, people that have, like, like we were talking about people that, you know, didn't have it easy or wasn't handed or it wasn't like this God gift and just, they just happened for them. They really had to work for it. Most of the time, those people are also the most humble, appreciative people. That's true. In their, in their, in their craft, whatever they're doing. That's so true. Because they, they, they knew what it was like. They knew what it was like to be in those positions. Yeah. It's true. And they, they did it. They're the real people and they're down to their earth and they're, they're cool and killer like yourself. Thank you, Koei. I'm so happy we did this. I'm so happy. That was an amazing determination definition, by the way. Oh, thank you. I feel like I spiraled a little bit. Sorry. So, no, it's okay to pause. I'm like, it's okay to pause and think. That's called authenticity. Yeah. See, we don't cut things out like that. I want the listeners to hear that. Oh, I love that. Yeah. We don't, we don't, like, we don't cut nothing. No, no, no, no, nothing fabricated here, my friend. All right, guys, thank you so much for listening. Please do me a favor, go to at Koei Red on Instagram, go to her website, search her on Spotify, and listen to her music. My personal favorite is church, but there's so many great ones. And like she said, she's writing some more stuff and recording some more stuff. So check her out because I'm going to tell you one thing, one thing, one day she'll be the biggest country female artist on this planet and you want to be along for the ride to watch your growth. So go get it done. And until next time, stay determined. When life gets hectic, energy ups and downs are all you need. If you're seeking energy reassurance, Eonnex can help. From smart tech that helps you take control of your energy future to always staying below the price cap with Next Pledge. We're here for whatever's next. Just one of the reasons why we're rated excellent on TrustPilot by our customers. Find out more at eonnex.com. Next Pledge variable rates are always below the option price cap. 25 pounds exit fee per fuel applies. Eligibility and season fees apply. TrustPilot February 2026.