NADS & SCOTTO’s Unfiltered Journey Through Five Decades of Car Culture

Welcome back to yet another episode of Very Vehicular and as always I am your host Brian Scottow. Last week you got John Nadeiri on firing order and we're bringing him back. That's right more NADs and a lot of you have mentioned you enjoy the freeform format of this show. Let's just say this one is really really free so strap in hold on this one goes everywhere. All anyone wants to talk about nowadays is how great 90s car culture was but what everyone forgets is how bad our slammed cars rode on crappy lowering springs. At the time that's all my wallet could muster but when I finally did step up and get some proper coilovers I went for KWs and never looked back. I've been running their stuff for over two decades now and everything from my 911 to my RS2 I even have a custom set in my Land Rover Discovery and yes that bloody thing does finally run. Anyway because of my long history with them I am very excited to announce KW as the newest partner in this whole podcast syndicate thing I'm building. Anyway check them out www.kwsuspensions.com. Legal disclaimer it might actually be illegal to wear heat waves polarized ultra black lenses while driving but if you spend a lot of time in violently bright conditions like snow or in the desert then these lenses are going to be perfect for you. Traditionally sunglasses have an 11% VLT rating but these are cranked all the way down to 6% as limo tint for your eyes. They also provide a great level of ocular privacy but when you're looking at something you shouldn't be. I'll be wearing them tonight while I'm sat next to my wife scrolling marketplace. Avoid being blinded at heatwavevisual.com NAD you ready for this? What am I ready for? I don't even know what this is. I'm unsure in this in the Scopo I'm workshopping that name because I can never keep up with you for naming convention chef's kiss but in the Scopo universe I'm unsure if I'm here for a very vehicular or a firing order. There's not a third person here. I don't know if this is a new show. I don't know if you're going to do something new today. I'm afraid of that right now. We could just build this plane while we're flying. We're never going to land the plane between the two of us. No plane landing here at all. Ladies and gentlemen welcome to another Scottle production. Yeah so no this is this is very vehicular this is just you and me we already did firing order I really enjoyed having you on the show. I feel like you might become like a reoccurring guest because that's the whole idea of this show. I would kind of love to be a reoccurring guest. Yeah yeah yeah yeah. I got off on it. I'm thinking the next one though we bring in like a shot collar just to slow down some of the stories. What was the joke about Mr. Honda that we would always get into at Hoonigan. We'd start talking about something. Yeah let me tell you about a man named Suitsh Rohanda this versus that that became like an entire running game. And for me it was rail car because I would always do the like first before we leave let's talk about rail car. It's the realization no one else has that joke except for the two of us because we are the most long winded old bags in the business. So speaking of which you've been doing this for a while bro you were the first person on the show who's older than me. Yeah I know don't tell me. I looked up you're so old that I looked up to you before I was in the business. It's pretty cool. Keep reading the magazine kid. What do you want to do with that. He's 99 cents off the dollar 99 subscription. Go run with it. Yeah I don't know man. It's what are you up to lately. About four beers a day which by the way I was under the impression that this was a brew with format so I'm a little like I'm a little left. Yeah you know what it is is if it was only like a half an hour show I'd let you drink but we got to go for three hours and I've seen you drink three hours. Yeah we just like you know three hours deep. Yeah you then did you definitely be naked at the end or somehow wearing everyone else's clothes which by the way this may or may not be water. Yeah man so what do you want. What's been new. I literally have not other than doing firing order with you but we have not actually had a chance to speak before today in years. Yeah I know I know like I ran into a couple events but like it's weird how you work with people you see them every day to the point that you're sick of them and then you just don't see some of us more sick than others. Yeah like that is weird to me right. We were so close you know we were just talking about that you know and it's like you kind of hated me after hitting you know that's fine. I mean yeah it was like you know it was like you couldn't keep the band together you know and I'm like so but I'm I do like I appreciate you reaching out and I don't know if it's an olive branch I don't think it's that was that like contentious but it was that point where it's like we work together now we don't work together and there's a little sourness you know and it's like whatever you know. John and I had a similar conversation which was like he left when we should have all left but we didn't realize it and he left and I think all of us were like kind of bummed he left and like and it was a weird not that anyone was you know mad at him for leaving but it was like wait you're leaving now like and it was weird he left in this weird time and all of a sudden we woke up one day and like John just wasn't there and you know Chase just wasn't there anymore and it was like this weird like I don't know. The domino effect essentially. Yeah but the one obviously you went on you did a bunch of other stuff the coolest thing you did out of all of it is you finally built a really cool Civic. I did and it's crazy. It's outside. Yeah it is outside and yet again much like the Civic that I built at Hoonigan I had nothing to do with it I had very little to do with it I built this one. Which seems to work really well for you. You know I just do the crying Jordan at the end of the thing and I'm like I'm so grateful for all of this but who in this earth has had like two really cool cars built for them. This new one is cooler than the one we built for you. This one is more my vision this is like completely my vision to be honest I mean you know to fill everyone in after Hoonigan I don't know how but I lucked into a Discovery show on Motor Trend TV Fryburger and Alex Taylor and Lucky Costa and that whole group and everything that you know Hoonigan alternate universe Bizarro Hoonigan world I guess you call it. I think we're Bizarro them but we're Bizarro Motor Trend whatever you want to call it but I came back there and I'm like I was there when we used to put ink on paper and put it in a newsstand and asked people to give us money for it and then I came back for you know something when I got the show my youngest is a huge fan of Ken's and yours and all of us and the Hoonigan era and she goes you're back at Super Street are you doing YouTube and I'm like no it's not YouTube and she goes what is it I'm like well it's the Motor Trend channel on the Discovery Network what is that you know and I'm like does television yeah she goes tell me tell me dad what is television does mommy get that I'm like no I don't think she subscribes no so I'm like it was a weird step for me and I said is there a way we could do do this on YouTube and they go no you don't understand where the money is literally coming from you know we're trying to fund Shark Week you know episodes you know and I'm like okay so I got with it and I tried to figure it out and they go well you know I go for this first episode we're going to swap a case series into this fit and they go oh maybe not that much you know what can you do with like putting wheels and tires and suspension and maybe like what are those tribal graphics you know and I'm like oh my god this is you know so I struck a compromise with them and I said listen we what if we did a couple mild builds and a couple wild builds and they said okay so I came up with a whole thing because you have to have like you have to have the setup the process and the payoff you know for any you know they not everyone's going to watch serialized content like YouTube you know and I'm like okay so I kind of said what if we do like a mild build that we finished but then we have a wild build that's going on the background they said yeah and then so I'm doing it and I'm working away and I'm figuring out how to do everything and they go you know you could you could do one of these cars you know like I can't I can't afford a TV show car I'm like there's no world in which I'm going to go no you don't get it you can buy the car we'll modify it and then it's yours you just don't sell it during the season I'm like what and I'm like okay and they go what would you do and I'm like a yellow Honda hatchback that's that was the one that made the magazine what it was and they said okay you know I go Phoenix yellow or Sunburst yellow I go probably EG or EK leaning towards EK and they said okay they go it's before we even started filming they go why don't you paper the build out I said okay so I go on like Google Sheets and I start like I'm Buddy the Elf in the elevator and I go to the spoon catalog and I'm like brrink you know and just like checked you know everything for the EK please you know and I just ran it all through not even thinking going on my merry way and I like had a summation function I'm not really you know and I said I should kind of maybe check where it's at you know just the spoon bill you know so that's spoon bill and I look at it and I'm like it was $65,000 in spoon parts alone and I'm like oh my god well maybe I could switch like the spoons to like an i-box setup and then maybe the wheels I could switch to like an NGA or something I'm like trying to figure it out but now they're all my children so I'm like well I can't I can't give up that because that goes with this and the wiper blade is going with the little windshield banner you know I'm like trying to figure it out and I'm like they're like hey we need that list and I'm like okay okay and I'm like you know what I need to do I need to go through it build the ultimate car and then scale back for TV production when I get done with the sum of parts not even labor not even paint or anything it came out to be like $88,000 in parts alone for this car for all here we are building hundred thousand those civics it's a 1997 civic hatchback mind you so I'm like okay that's a little much finally the proof goes hey man I need that list and I'm like well I'm fired before I even got the job can't figure out how to scale it down just send it and I'm like I need to talk to you about the list and he goes he goes don't worry about it we'll figure it out so I send it to him don't hear anything back and I'm like I'm fired before the show even started I get a call like two weeks later he's like hey we need to talk about your list and I'm like here comes and I'm like I'm wide open you know let's this is a given take this process you know so I mean I didn't know you know I'm like you know I've you're already you're already caveatting yeah 100% I've been I've been divorced twice so I know I know how to this gameplay you know so I said okay yeah we could talk about it he goes no no no I owe you an apology we couldn't get all the parts so we're literally having spoon overnight parts from Japan I I shit you know I got that quote out of him he's like and and that producer probably never saw he was too young to understand the joke he goes they're air-fraiding everything from Japan because they can't put it on a container because it'll take too long and I just wanted to let you know I'm sorry how much muscle control did it take to prevent the just massive smiling giggle that comes in those moments the hyperventilation the anxiety in the pinch me moment you don't want to show your poker face you're like oh yeah okay and we're on a we're on a teleconference and I'm like okay yeah I guess I could deal with that and you know and then now I'm flipping the script you know I'm like I'll be cool I can make it work I guess I'll have to make it work but and it was one of those again another fast and furious moment where the the truck is like driving down the way it was coming into the shop so and I'm like had this clipboard and I'm like okay that's the hood that's the head like and then got connected with a guy with a b16 b swap and then he had the ctr front end everything sort of came together and then they're going to you want to respray it and then the last minute I go from yellow to white because I just always wanted the white ctr you know I'm like if it's for me the tv show is going to last for whatever but I'm this is my forever car and we did the respray and championship I wanted championship white and this is crazy because I'm super honda nerd and I wanted championship white and I co-hosted the show with a mere benz 2 he's a famous time attack driver he's got a key swapped NSX RS future all this stuff and he goes champ white is not really white bro you know I'm like what do you mean he goes it's kind of a cream and I'm like I never knew that I was like champ white is the whitest white you know like excuse me not to be canceled you know not white is right I'm not going there but I'm just saying like it's the it's that cream and he shows me he goes this is champ white versus what you're talking about is like what you want now is a lot of people are trying to get the civics in what's called tefeta white which was an oeg okay e k color and I was like oh and he goes look at tefeta is white on that he goes if you want to go even whiter than that there's something called grand pre white which came on the NSXR and a certain generation s 2000 which is like motorsport white it's like body and white it's it's it's og if you remember like the 72 honda f1 car the white with the that's not the champ white that we know today yeah that's the pure japanese race car motorsport white and I'm like oh I want grand pre white so it's grand pre white it's funny though because like as I've gotten older I've actually really begun to appreciate the off whites like when I was younger I hated off white I do for example my vanagon's like a creamy white and I never really like that I always like pure white like my 9 11 is I think actually grand pre white with like that color kind of white but with I love that now with a pearlescent on top yeah so it gave it that like weird flip and made it look a little creamy but it was still like a pure white but now like I was the other day I was with with will roge and he had like his white sprinter van parked next to my vanagon and like I don't know there's something about the the creaminess is kind of nice now I think I'm just showing I'm getting older like the more the closer you get to enjoying the color beige or aka old man tan it's just showing you're showing you're now you know I mean you know this is the the parlance of our time it's no longer a basic b it's your beige you know it's like that's the color you identify the other thing that I the blows my mind is like pts Porsche colors like root beer brown was the jam like in the 70s and 80s and then it just it was gross to the 80s and 90s and now it's like brown with a caramel interior is like oh that's the color on the 992 3rs I think in the Porsche market right now you've got this world where it's like the weirder the color spec the more valuable it's like hey we gotta it's a booger green on a pumpkin orange interior and people are like oh my god I need that and you're like no one did like it's super rare you want to know why because nobody no one expected one dude who was color but colorblind bought that car thinking it was something else or I love people are like this is this is actually aubergine 17 you know and it's like come on man you know it's like you're getting down you're getting way out of hand it's the same thing the the JDM guys with midnight purple there's like three different shades of midnight purple yeah I'm like midnight purple is a great color it is a really good color it is a great color complete lane change you I know you used to do a bunch of work for hot rod and really through mothers and you used to travel on power oh yeah you do power tour this year I am not they're not doing power tour anymore that bumps me out mothers just not oh okay because you know they're doing route 66 I know I know and I did I did it for so many years with mothers even when I was at Hoon again yeah everybody was so good enough because mothers is my family from another mother and uh the funny thing for me about like power tour and all of that is I think because of your time at super street because of your affliction to Hondas like people really see you as very one dimensional like you are the Honda guy but actually like you have this massive like involvement and knowledge and like just general crime you're like me like you just like general I I'm a fan of the automotive culture I am like I am a career rock on tour like you and uh I'm you're probably the only other person who's pretentious enough to use that word I know but I love it yeah I appreciate it and um I just I've always loved cars and I started I'll tell you my origin story started with the Torrell p6 the the six-wheeler and um how old were you oh my god I was probably like eight or ten my dad just had a poster and he put it on my wall and I was just like what is it and it on the streets of Long Beach of all places and I was like that's that thing is really cool and then never really got into F1 but from there I saw a big photo of all things and I'm like what is this thing and it's bob Chandler it's a super infamous photo sitting on crushing two trucks and he's leaning out almost like Zach you know Zach Merton style like leaning out elbow off the door sunglasses cowboy hat and he's just on the 48th and like it's just I'm like I want the monster truck you know and my dad and I built you know he's had a little bit of money so he said what do you want to build and I'm like I want to build like an F-150 you know I want to build the truck like you know like like bigfoot so we built like off-road truck did you grow up here in LA I grew up in the San Fernando Valley yeah I was born in born in Santa Barbara went to Santa Monica for a minute but San Fernando Valley it was like so so that led to you know me racing BMX in the 80s it was like that was the time everybody raced BMX and um so it was the little league of its day and uh so I was there in the early days of BMX racing and everybody got saying early days like what frame were you riding uh my first frame was a rally rampart okay and then from there I got a pre super goose uh mongoose nice with motomax and astribula cranks so you're talking like 83 pretty good yeah this was uh more like 79 to 80 oh wow okay so even earlier that yeah I forget our I forget our age difference I know I'm an old man I'm 57 man so wow you look good for 57 thank you in the last pot I said you looked old but now that I realize how old you are damn they like I'll take that you got like a moment I'm getting my uh I'm getting my AARP invites on email it's like not good step off I'm not ready for that yet I'm not ready I didn't realize you were that I so you're like a decade older than yeah so I went to I graduated high school in 86 so for me like coming up in the valley I graduated in 97 yeah see so like coming up in the valley I was on the tail end of it but van eyes boulevard cruising on van eyes boulevard was the thing and fry burger was there I didn't know him at the time but I I literally would ride my BMX bike I lived right down the road from from van eyes there was a super shops right there and I would ride my bike there and there was you know fry burgers crew how do we bring back that culture like cruising was so fun like as a kid in New York City we had Francis Lewis but Francis Lewis was like part cruising part real rate like actual racing like yeah rolling nine second cars off of you know off trailers and racing front of Francis prep but we also had this spot in Astoria right on the water that had like speed bumps like you couldn't speed it was just cruising like it was just go out hang with your friends roll back and forth make the u-turn go back run again dpa was the same way there were spots up in the Bronx like it was such a great part of car culture like just go out hang out with people get to see people's cars get to hear them maybe a little light to light action but like instead we have takeover culture which is like I don't even like we we bring it up on almost every episode but we never really talk about it because I feel like and I wanted to want to feed it but like it just seems so removed from what I want to do with cars like and which is crazy because I know some people are like you created the environment for that no but that's the thing that people don't realize we were tilting at windmills granted but that's what you were trying to stop because you famously told me when we were all kind of conceiving the burn yard like there's containers and it's like a takeover but it's not a takeover it's like filming a show but it's a little bit bigger and there's a little thing and as we were like you know storyboarding it out well burn yard was just taking taking transmission putting on the road for a lot and then exactly exactly and then but we we had the residency at Irwindale that sort of felt like maybe we are doing good but maybe we found the flames a little bit too I don't know I'm not entirely sure it's like it's weird if you try to like keep it off the streets sort of thing you kind of give them a blueprint on how to do it you know the thing side shows have been around since the 80s they started up in Oakland like the bay started it but what the sideshow was and what the takeover has become is like two very separate things because the sideshow wasn't about people getting hit by cars like that wasn't part of the culture and like the kind of crazy chaotic fireworks like just literally just throw everything you can at this thing to just be an absolute nuisance to everybody was like not really what the sideshow was like I went to I went to side shows when I was at rides magazine I went we went and like you know hung out in the bay and went to a sideshow and it was like a bunch of old it was like mostly like older guys and when I say older I mean like 25 and older but like in hip hop that was like an older group and it was guys in older Camaros and Foxbody Mustangs like just throwing like donuts with and shitties and like having a good time and you know and like the OGS are there like you know sipping on like an oldie and like you know smoking like you know like a blunt and like that was and it was like kind of mellow and it was like industrial areas and it was really quiet and like really wasn't like what it is now and and I don't want to talk about takeovers because it's like I don't want to give them the air but what I do want to talk about is like cruising with such a cool culture and I think it's one of the things that makes power tour feel rad because power tour feels basically like a really long cruise 100 where you get to meet people you get to talk to people and I guess instead like we swap that out like I guess the closest thing we have is cars and coffee but it's definitely like a different environment like I think cruising you could bring a shipbox to go cruise and still have fun like I think about the movie Dazed and Confused and like there's an element of that that like was real in what we actually it was like it was like a post-modern American graffiti sort of vibe and I'm really dating myself with that rough I think it's okay so I had this conversation with John Chase in the last one and I actually had a really long conversation with um Ashley last night about it which is like I really think we're like at this tipping point of going back to being more analog and having more analog and having more analog experiences oh 100 because like this digital thing's just not working I wouldn't say it's not working but we became so reliant on the digital world when you talk about this is such a cliched thing to say but it's so telling about our society is do it all for the ground right and when I say do it all for the gram I mean build your car for the ground like you know I'm just going to say it rep wheels and these terrible wraps because they look good and your little two by two square that you're being like a Honda Ridgeline with like an indie car in the back you know things like that build it for the grams build it for the grams exactly so like all of that I feel like is what the the culture is being reduced to and I think it's starting to like kind of boomerang come back from that where people in the pandemic you know as much as it hurt it also helped accelerate this this yearning for community and I think this wants to come back you know and even like when you talk about cars and coffee it is our our thing these days that was started by a bunch of old men you know I was I was there for the first card I know the cars and coffee origin story and used to go to Mazda one I went before the Mazda one yeah crystal Cove and crystal Cove you know was started by a bunch of extremely and I know some of them extremely wealthy reclusive men with like you know 20 million dollar cars that would just like probably on their second wife not going to assume but she wants to get her beauty sleep and I'm not saying that it's men versus women please don't cancel me but the men would get together how much of your life is spent just please not to cancel it it's like I'm going to get that tattooed on my forehead at this point but I'm like I I'm really worried about not being woke at this point I'm like I don't know please I want to respect your pronouns but I also kind of want to objectify you young lady so please like I'm very confused about my place in this society right now if you're anything like me whether or not you have a real shop space or a lift at your disposal you still end up working on the floor so when I saw Viper's new mini creeper I knew it best suited my idiotic and often anti-ergonomic way of working on cars it can be configured both low or slammed and while Viper likely designed this for detailers it's great for those of us who will assemble a brake caliper on a cold hard floor instead of at the convenient height of a workbench check out this great mini creeper and many more shop items at ViperIndustrial.com that's Viper with a why don't lie be honest we've all done it and WearerTools isn't here to shameless for it instead they made the perfect ratchet hammer what's that it's called the Coloss it's a half inch drive ratchet nestled inside of a hefty drop forged hammer and if the other genius of this is lost on you maybe we can't be friends the additional extension is great for braking free stubborn bolts or braking anything that requires double-handed persuasion I love this tool I keep it in my go bag whether the job calls for six degrees of surgically precise engagement angle or just medieval brutality the Coloss can't be beat find this hilariously useful instrument as well as many others at wearertools.com so for me um uh that world was them going to get away from wife and kids and there's just five or six but collectively it's a hundred million dollars in cars that are parked at crystal cove and it's over and when I say a hundred million over like six cars you know and so these guys would meet but then the internet got a hold of it and was like well what are you doing and they go well we just get together and we get a coffee and then crystal cove exploded and then Mazda took it over from there and that's what started that so at at its crux that's old guys getting up at six o'clock in the morning which you know what I'm here for that right now I'm like I'm loving that if I'm not up staying up all night drinking I'm gonna be embedded at 830 and get up it I'll be wiping my car down at four like ready to go to the car with a coffee but I think that there's the element of cruising that never even came to the Honda world we went straight from like static displays to street racing and it's like really yeah like waterfest when you talk about waterfest well waterfest for us was just the show but like but no but waterfest after the show wasn't it like h2o was yeah h2o was where you cruise around and I'm like man at no be to an extent at no be each night when we get to the stops for the thing people would like gather in the parking lot but it was still more of a cars and coffee thing like Honda heads were more like not not there's there was like and you know RJ and Craig Lieberman came from this this group called art motion it's like a famous club and I haven't heard that right so but it was like an art in motion sort of vibe where the cars are moving and you get to see them in their natural habitat sort of thing but now it's did you ever go to h2o I never did so it's the last h2o I went to was in 2004 it started to really get wild after that um but it was an amazing show because it's like beach front property right in Ocean City you basically have two streets two main streets so they have like this artery you could run one way flip around run back the other and then there was like the other street that you can back on and the show became like this actual show didn't matter like what mattered was the crews and all the gathering so like it started with like you know the you know like the bag society guys will have airbags on their Volkswagen's would meet and then like the mark one guys would have like the mini meat and then there was just this like you know it was like oh what are we doing today and it's like oh well two o'clock these guys are doing this and we got to go wash cars at the car wash but like the whole time you'd run into people you'd be cruising like there was a little bit of street racing but like you know and I I'm very careful to not you know be like oh it to dismiss it as like oh well it was true racing we didn't matter but like nobody was doing like 150 miles an hour down the road it was like people were pulling first and second yeah right like yeah okay still illegal but like it's kind of harmless in a way look I say I know people get hurt but whatever but it was fun and everyone stayed in town on that strip so like at night everybody's out in the hotels and the burnouts were crazy and all that which is fun but um that was like this really cool like cruising meets a show environment but even just the good old-fashioned like it's Friday night and I want to go somewhere to go do car stuff like when I grew up in New York I could either drive to Astoria which was like a 15 minute drive from my house I could go out to Francis Lewis Boulevard which was like 30 minutes or I could go to DPA which was 50 minutes but was worth the adventure because like it was where like all the old hot rod guys go you definitely want to see some cool stuff made a ton of friends there maybe it's just because I'm older now but like if I don't wake up at 6 30 in the morning I don't get to go do car stuff like so much has moved to cars and coffee this is also the family element too it's like you got to get this stuff done before everybody else wakes up I know you know I'm like I'm so old now that I'm an empty nester and my kids actually sleep in later than me when they're with me so for me I'm like I could sneak out do some car stuff my youngest my oldest loves the car stuff so for better or for worse we go up to Good Vibes for on ACH and we were talking about how that's getting a little bit it's like a takeover canyon run it's a weird way to describe it but you know it's like no one respects the mustard rich guys who feel invincible because they have cars that wave beyond their capabilities yeah so but you know we get up early and we go before my youngest wakes up and then we go out and we take her to lunch or brunch or whatever and then we go do our thing so I guess that's kind of what it's come to but for me you know it was never that it was either static parking like meet up at a you know there's a the Krispy Kreme meet back in the day which doesn't even back in the dance after my day but before that it was street races you'd go to the street races and you would go like everybody to kind of hang out or work on their cars or whatever and then you'd plan to meet and you usually there were set up spots but sometimes there was and it was crazy to me we were talking about if we could go back in time to the other pod to the to the to the to the firing order um I could remember days and I used to run with a crew called red line and there was cyber and all these all these weird little street races we all had the coolest yeah right so eight ball was the thing I loved eight ball they had like they had a little eight ball sticker on the car I'm like god I want my car club was called auto creek I remember which just which just loosely translates to car war which I love which is the kid just sounds so tough like I love along to the car war club well that's when you think about like battle version and time attack and things like that it's like battle version was always yeah like things like that make me you know I like that but anyways um we would go to the street races and sometimes I remember there was a guy white boy paul had a mark two supra with a mark three engine it was a it was an a 60 with a with a with a 7m gte turbo single turbo this thing was a beast you know for for the day you know it was one of the faster cars in redline and some company showed up it was my first introduction to this company it was a white mark three supra which was brand new at the time the 86 and a half then this with 7m motor and somehow paul had already swapped the engine into it from a wrecked one but they pulled up in a white one with a with a camonari kit back of the day and epsilon southern ways mesh wheels white wheels on a white body kit and it said trust and big along the side the engineers from trust came to the street races and this is early this is early this is in the this is like pre super this is this is this is 80s this is when super street still had chevys on the cover no that that was that was that was super chevy was actually different super street was a was a was a nod to that world but for the hummus wasn't there a super street didn't come along until 96 wasn't there a time though in the early super street though where there was still like non-japan like didn't didn't want to like be like am i misremember there was a move to put where they put like a gene adage neon or the turbo magazine oh that's what i'm thinking turbo magazine did the did like who was it about turbo magazine gene deputy and uh kenny dwiler kenny dwiler did the uh the buix and then gene deputy did the did the five ohs herbo was that place where you could see both like you could you would see like a fuck body Mustang with like an svo in it but then turbo was about like high horsepower i completely forgot about turbo magazine and he just said it that was i felt like if you looked at the mags it was like super street was like the culture mag sport compact car was like dave colman's engineering nerd which by the way i want to get dave on the show oh my god i actually hit him are you following his stuff yeah he's building the launch here right now it's fucking amazing but um i actually follow him on facebook because it feels more period correct for him but um i actually dm'd him the other day and was like hey you want to come on and i was actually going to surprise him as a guest with you on the show oh and not even tell you oh my god and then just do the like super street versus sport compact car i'll i'll do that firing order but i'll get wrecked by him are you kidding me the man is a walking encyclopedia of engineering knowledge he probably couldn't he probably couldn't he probably couldn't name five wheels that matter no but he could tell you how much they wet 100% watching him do the lantia is so uh it's so i think you were talking about in one of your pods or it might have been a youtube i can't remember i can't keep up with all the content you're making these days is um about how just the essence of watching something take shape we've lost that and i'll go back like ron karr gave me like he introduced me to thursday boots like the way they restore the boots and i think goes watch this youtube channel and it was back when we're all at hoon again and i was obsessed with any kind of content and i looked at it and it was so like pleasing to watch them a 26 minute video of them restoring a re-doing the soul of the soul of an old that looks like it had no life left 100% they're like we're gonna bring this back to life and like i love i love like the people who say this is every nut and bolt of this restoration that i'm doing and and dav's going into that level of nerdism with that the launch it that's probably gonna still leak oil and run miserably an airy thing i mean he's literally posting stuff that no one other than other launchy owners should care about but somehow i care about it and what's crazy it's like you you're you're just living viscerally through and right now we have moved this conversation to a point where if you are not over 40 you probably don't know this at all but like dav colman like you either preyed at the altar of like the super street boys the max power boys or you were a like a disciple of sport compact car which means you never slammed your car because then you had a bad roll center and you learned the word roll center from him i mean so much of that i knew about engineering and suspension because i enjoyed both magazines super street was obviously bigger for well there was different times but there was a period in the boom sport compact car was the biggest magazine and and rich chang took it super street to number two and i was fortunate to be there when fast the furious took off and we hockey yeah then it then it exploded so that way but there was definitely that that like you you you either like if you liked one magazine over another it told me everything about how your car was gonna be set up 100% like if you were like i subscribed to sport compact car i'm like i knew exactly what you were into 100 where if you're like i subscribe to super street i'm like you have undergolf like this is a little inside baseball but we talk about like press drives and you go like the journalists we're all hacks and then i just can drive so we show up and we're we're going to the event and they have scott pruett there or some famous racer that's sponsored by lexus is going to help show you the line around the track and scott will run around he'll set a time he's like hey there's no reason for you to drive like this but we just want to show you you ride shotgun everybody goes okay you lead follow whatever it is so then you get by in the car like josh jaco one of the editors of sport compact car used to go faster than the pros sometimes and i would be like they'd have a competition and josh would always win i'd just be sitting there probably hung over because i went out with the marketing people the night before stayed out way too he was proper quick i went to an event at laguna seca i think it was actually isf launch and he brought like this sport compact car project evo with him to oh yeah and was like like just like meticulously doing like a string alignment in the air pressure and then checking everything like what is this dude doing and then just went out there and ran a ripper of a lap and i realized i was like yeah that guy knows how to drive yeah 100 all of them they had more degreed engineers on sport compact car than they did at rodentrack motor trend automobile all these the sport compact guys would always just destroy the rodentrack guys 100 i mean i don't think people talk about this much but like most journalists are slow or terrible there's a lot of journalists who appear on podcasts who talk about driving fast who i have been at events with and they're not fast i'm not saying i'm fast i'm saying i'm faster than them but i'm not fast and then occasionally you'll go to an event with a chris harris you're like that man is fast exactly you're like that guy actually knows how to drive it's funny because now i went to an event and like a press event and it's like press events are so different today because you have this whole influencer group that's there right which is crazy to me because now this is the this is the do-it-all for the gram right world where it's more about like sharing the experience and almost like coming up with a script that chat gpt wrote for you that's like i'm going to tell you all about smoking a gata or something and then not even really ever experiencing i'm not saying you need to go to a shop but it's like you need to have a passion you you don't just need to be about it for the content you you know and and if you are that's fine too but when these people start going to press launches and driving cars because they do have a level of influence the automakers are looking definitely have more influence than magazines then 100 but is that a good is that giving the automaker the best review i think it depends on who it is because i think on some sides you have people like you know people we know like vinyan ron are both good oh they're both good wheelmen i mean ron literally has a pikes peak you know like record for being a good wheelman so and i think that that's one of those things that from the outside looking in you're like oh those buffoons over at hoonigan they just do donuts but it's like those guys like really can stitch together a good lap oh yeah um but and then you have like cletus who like is this is are you paying attention what's happening with cletus and nascar right now yeah yeah he's actually like but but like have you watched the hatred that's coming out oh yeah 100 because they look at him as pure influencer yeah and it's like he's not pure influencer does he have the c time is everybody else no but like i think the cletus going there is one of the greatest things that has happened to nascar i haven't seen this much excitement in nascar since ross chestin basically just did the video game ride the wall and pass like half those like and they also got mad about that and i started to think like nascar i think you're your own problem like the expression you're stepping on your own dick like if you don't realize that these things that make you unhappy are actually the things other people want to see maybe you don't understand like where the current space is and where the audience is but like the cletus thing i think is interesting because there's this weird world where i think the old school journalists look at influences and don't take them seriously and feel like they're not they're not real yes but there's two categories of influencers you know when you look at someone like a cletus or chisaris versus someone who makes tutsu sounds you know well of course and that's the thing and when you go to some of these like and there's no hate against that honestly please don't cancel me again so you know it's like um but you know every you know everyone has to get back to hating people you know i'm being i i god i would love to hate people again there i have so many strong opinions that i bite my tongue on that you know i'm waiting for the statute of limitations to go out we're talking about particular movie franchises and you know and my thoughts about all of them and i this like you just it's hard to like hate on some of these trends you know yeah i got a lot of things i got a lot of hate for movies that i'm that i'm open with although i did say to you before i did enjoy the f1 movie which is one of the most hated movies in the automotive industry i don't understand why too i don't understand why because people wanted it to be like an like a race they wanted to like play out like a real race and it's like nobody wants to watch that no god no you know i think they i think they did a great job like balancing between the suspension disbelief that you need to have yeah a little bit of a story 60 year old f1 driver i get it you know all that i'll watch bread pitonin exactly exactly come on you know it works but rewind back to where we were before um which was i i want to i want to i wanted to go back and touch on the analog thing but we'll get back to that but i think back to like the um the super street and sport compact car thing because like that's kind of like where we were at and that's like your era um i'm still creating content you know by the way so i don't like to define i hesitate to define myself to an era that's interesting because like i question that about like i think i'm sitting pretty comfortably in that like i've already peaked god no i mean like i'm like i realized like i had like a peak moment which was like probably like 2017 2018 was like peak like hoonigan was ripping like literally was on a i was on a roll where like i could do no wrong like jim kana was crushing like life was pretty good like i got pretty skinny for my wedding like i was just like firing on a bunch of cylinders a few of my cars ran like you know it was pretty cool um define a few what actually actually right now more of my cars run than have ever have i have like 12 cars running at the moment but yeah it was just like at the time it just it just like it was and then like you know it's like i don't know i'm just kind of pacing now like there may be another peak that comes that's to me i i never i'm not flashback friday through Thursdays four touchdowns in a single game that's not you know you're not uh what's his face i'm not bundying it yeah polk high you know again gen X gen X yeah exactly but for me um i always want to be looking at what's next i always want to be looking at what i could do next you know for me i did the i did jeez i left print publishing at i was at peterson i got the dream job and i left it to go do overboost.com you know and then i got brought back sucked back into it which i'm eternally grateful for yeah to do super street and i left that to do youtube content in 2007 before anybody knew what youtube was so my too soon junior moment yeah you've been too soon 100 percent i put you know knob ton of gucci's i talked about that in the other pod drift car on the cover i did vip i did the very first jim kana event in the united states before can even you know ken showed up that's what that's what brought i introduced i introduced ken block to jim kana well i introduced him to the event and then you introduced him to jim kana we're both involved or you brought you were the one who brought him there so but i think because either you or who was the other person can talk to him talk he sent me an email he was the one who was doing jim kana usa and he sent me an email about having zero to sixty come and i was like and i and at the time we didn't have any budget or anything to go drive there but i knew that ken was local so i sent ken a note and i said hey can you get one of the vermont rally cars to go do this and he and he hit a vermont sports car and they were like oh we don't really have anything that'd be good for it so then ken just built that car yeah he built the car for that event and then the event was supposed to do a second event it didn't and now ken had just dropped like 40 50 grand into building this sti and was like all right i guess i'm gonna like just go shoot my own film and then we birthed the jim kana series do you know that he also talked to me about filming that oh i'm sure yeah i mean he was he he said when i left super street and i started doing rice boy he said yeah you're doing youtube content he goes does anybody does anybody he asked me three questions does anybody do video parts right i'm like what's a video part and he's like like a scape video i'm like is that what you call those you know it's like you know it's like oh i get it when dirta comes down the 20-stair gap and that's yeah that's a video part oh i get it so everybody has a part in this you know it's like oh okay this is the sunday morning video or whatever this is thrashers you know i went oh okay you know i'm like no no no one does that you know and he goes oh that's strange and he's all what about like lifestyle brands in the space i'm like what do you mean what's a lifestyle brand what do you mean lifestyle brand he goes like a brand that is like like dc shoes and i'm like oh for cars and i'm like no god no and he goes well what apparel do you wear i'm like well if you like hot rods you wear a moon eyes shirt or a hooker headers shirt and if you like jdm you're wearing an hks shirt you're wearing a brand shirt you're wearing a brand shirt and that's how you identify you and i talk about tribes a lot we always talk about you know when you come into a school and you don't know anybody you wear the thrash shirt because you want to find your tribe you know it's like you put it's like it was the hoonigan thing was like 100 percent that was what we built you raise that flag and you hope that someone sees it's like first day in the prison yard you know you take your shirt off and you show your ink you know do you remember the thing what you wore to your first day in college god no i wasn't degenerate i was just yeah i i totally remember you you were you were you were you wore something i was at university of vermont i was really big into snowboarding which a lot of them were but and i was really into like punk rock at the time and i want to say i wore like i knew i wore a punk shirt and a snowboard hat i think it was like an op i v t shirt and like like a ride snowboards hat or something like that and it was literally just like putting out the like hey does anyone yeah within half an hour met my roommate dan kennedy who like you know still friends with till today because he was like hey you like op i v i like op i v too and when we started hoonigan that was like one of the things we discussed was like you need to build like this the goal here is to build a brand that when someone goes to their first day of something and they want to find you know community that like it's literally wearing a flag and you have no idea how many times people have said to me like oh man i was at this bar do is wearing a hoonigan shirt i walked over and was like hey let me buy you a drink you like hoonigan like now we're best friends you know like it's like there was like such a that's like such a weird thing but it just works you know so but it's true because when ken was asking that question back in the day they really weren't like automotive the lifestyle brands were someone who were just wearing like a steppen repeat of a of a tri-five chevy that was like a tommy bahama not it was like terrible you know no one really like a brand or you would you would wear a snowboarding shirt or a skateboarding shirt to say i like cars because i'm driving a car but i also like this this is how i identify and to me that was so shocking to me and then he goes what do you want to do with your with i went down to the to the office and ocean side and everything and he goes what do you want to do with this brand you know he goes i'm all about it he was one of my first sponsors they were one of my first advertisers dc she sent us a bunch of swag and we did them a bunch of commercials for them that were more car based they were working with vaughn getting at this time this was that this was when this was rice boy tv at rice boy tv so met with ken he said i'm very interested in doing youtube because we do video parts but it was all like vhs or a dvd that you get in a magazine he goes but now this youtube world it i love it and i want to do something with cars yeah and he goes what do you got and i'm like here's what i got friend of mine he has something that it's like a helicopter but it's not a helicopter it's like a remote control helicopter it's not a remote control helicopter it's called a drone it's a drone and craig Lieberman of all people and he flies it behind the cars and he could almost kind of keep up with a car what i'm saying is not one car not two cars not three cars but all of the falcon drift team because vaughn's on dc you put the rest of them at dc shoes too you have the whole team tony angelo forceburg turk all of them ryan ampton and i go then you run a train not that kind of train then you run a train around the bank and you shoot it in every different angle and you make the most epic drift video ever that it's just it's one lap but it is shot a hundred different ways and then you stitch that all together and you create the perfect little music video for that and he goes that's not bad that's pretty cool he goes what if you did it with a rally car and he went rally car no one's gonna watch that and that was like that was close like k-wik hand so that's how we came again and then and then he called me and was like what do you think about rally cars i'm like i love rally cars and then the martellies and you guys do the jim kana practice and then i was like oh that's what he meant i'm like that's a really good idea you know and i'm like that was it you know he did the other one i'll save as my miss you moment is uh you and i talking way back my first stint was doing the jim kana video and doing the jim kana event and then scott famously told me he goes i go why do you want me and he goes because you did you're doing time attack and you're producing events and you have this like you know this world you know and i said i could put it together but live tv the chances for this not going well we built the rules package and we slammed it all together in like 50 days and then um by the way you are playing this down this was jim kana grade as a event at x games which okay do you want me to play it out like a no but i mean it was a major no but do you want to play it up i'll play it up right now for you i'll tell you this even like bob bernquist didn't get to bring the mega ramp bob bernquist is x games legend he had to do his own event and espn would look at that event street league skateboarding dirty they go they do in their own event and they're like that event's doing really well do you want to bring it to the x game stage ken is the only athlete in the history of the x games to not even have an event that espn went carp launch ken what do you want to do and he's like i'd like to do a and he's like i'd like to do a jim kana event a what kind of event and he goes yeah it's we had only done that one event at urwind yeah we did the test event at the forum we did the test event at the forum and then we did the event here and then that was it and then we did the main event and we didn't even have any cars and they were doing global rally cross global rally cross it's proven itself so they're like okay make use these cars you know in the end it had the same if not more viewership than global rally cross it it's so hard but i will tell you like meanwhile i'm i get divested from you because you and i very symbiotic relationship we work well together i'm with ken and matt chile bless his heart but matt's like ken's body man and he's just like where are we at with this nads where are we at with this nads i'm i'll shut up you little parrot let me talk to ken you know love you matt but you know and be careful matt's at haggardy now you might need to work there one day so um i'm like i'm trying to figure this out but you guys gave me 55 days and i'm like scott what's going on here you're like nads consider this like we're putting a suicide vest on you and if you could run in and somehow get the vest undone and drop the bomb and get out you have a job afterwards you know so that was my audition essentially to to work with you guys and i was like this is brutal so i didn't have enough budget uh dan i can't remember his last name but dan from espn was my contact my connect and this guy was like one of the producers that he knew and everything's fine everything's fine with miwa everything's burning down around it he goes you got this you got this i didn't have enough budget ken was under the impression that espn would pay for everything espn was under the budget that ken under the impression that ken would bring a turnkey production and i'm stuck in the middle having to tell ken espn he goes you tell them they better pay you know a quarter million because i want to do an entire like i want to do a revamp and i remember this conversation and it was it was literally this is my fast and furious moment much like the car we took the elevator to the top of the mega ramp and ken ron scottow and matt were up in the up with me and it was literally like ken holding the back of my shirt do you see the problem ted do you see the problem ted we ain't got no engines ted he's like hanging me over the side of the thing going do you see this course this doesn't look like the course that i envisioned it is literally the day before the event so we had to like go get uh well you guys had to build the course in like a 24-hour period because they were the rallycross course they had to take down and they were using part of the mega and they were using part of it for the mega wrap so the mega wrap came down and we only had 24 hours but i'm like this is not going to work we didn't even have k-rails in it you know and if you know japanese jim kana it's ridiculous there's like two cones yeah it's really and someone does every single car does like the same 40 maneuvers around the two i'm like how do you even american drivers don't a british auto park is like 100 percent i'm like is that a parking box i don't even see the box and they like slide and then they get out of it and then they're like doing everything with just literally some dude in the catering room yeah exactly it's just like crushing oh it also rest in peace oxfiefer brought the catering remember that catering that he brought he's just like such i just loved him to death he's one of my boys so i bring him up alx five or famous drifter one of the one of the first one of the first yeah he was kid from hawaii that just did very well on fd in the early days but he was a pirate he didn't play by the rules he was so like i may have different memories of other people than him because i i watched i saw a bunch of people posting about like we miss him but he was like such a you know he was like so fierce about this or that he was ready to throw balls but super nice to me like he's the first person i ever met in drifting i met him because i flew out in 2004 for jg tc d1 at fontana oh my god you were there yeah that was a that was a moment i was i started at rides it was like my first month or two and they were like well is there anything that you know you think is coming up that's cool and i'm like you know what the hip hop magazine rides needs to cover japanese story card i promise you there's gonna be a brand called bathing ape that comes out 15 years from now i was immediately abusing my privilege immediately like i wasn't like my health care hadn't kicked in i was already abusing my privilege and flew out and we went to jg tc me and tony harmer and uh yeah i met him there and it was like drifting was still kind of new right oh 100 but it was it was new but everyone was talking formula drift had only been around for four years like maxim was like talking about it like everybody was already on it and um we went there and i met him i think i want to say i did a ride along with him in the one of the rsr cars but um he drove the s2 yeah and uh he was just awesome he's such a great guy and then he came to the jim connor great event in the cater room and the cater room just wrecked shop everyone and he came up to me and i was like hey thanks for coming today and he was i was like oh yeah no doubt whatever man it's like super fun i was like yeah because you just created a new rule no cater rooms but i think he would wreck shop even if he drove it he was an amazing driver but he loved that but the fact that he had the cater every other driver was like uh really you know but it was he was such a such a great personality he just passed just the other way i was so sad to hear that um it was yeah it's just such a he was such one of those dudes i hadn't seen him in years so yeah yeah i hadn't either his health took a turn yeah so anyways don't want to bring that don't want to be a part of it it's it's part of like i want to give him his flowers i mean dude was a rip and was one of those early dudes that influenced so many people so many people you think were early like he was earlier like he was he was he was definitely there so one of the oj's but yeah so anyway but he's also the reason that we don't allow cater rooms jim connor great because they're they're rivers so yeah ken was like ken's whole reason for not he's like that's too fast and it doesn't look cool well yeah he's like that just doesn't look cool i was like yeah i get it i get it but you know i i um i have like a lot of regrets i don't know if i'd say regrets but like i just wish some things worked out differently at hoonigan thing we were drinking from a fire hose the whole time 100 so much opportunity and i constantly tell people because i'm like oh yeah like we had this idea i'm like oh why didn't it happen it's like because we had 15 other ideas the exact same time all the time so it's like yeah the idea was there but like there was another idea and even if that idea wasn't as good as the other idea we had either someone was willing to pay for it or it just started to move forward and like you knew i wasn't doing it again once something started to move forward it was like okay i guess we're all doing this like train one hundred percent and the one of the bigger regrets that i had was that we didn't spend more time trying to make jim kana grid work because i feel like it filled this interesting gap between drifting uh and rally which is like drifting is is a really fun sport it's obviously created this massive culture that like has really shifted i think the way that you know a lot of people look at cars and and how to go and have fun in cars it brought sort of the skateboarding um mentality of like this is just cool and fun but i think jim kana grid took the dynamic style of that put it against the clock and made it more like rally in its style of like it's still time you got to be fast right but there is a style as well kind of like mix those two and i thought that there was this really good opportunity especially when drifting was kind of going through like a lull to like come in there and be like hey you can take your drift car and come and compete in this against the clock and it would be it would speak to different drivers in different ways like daio shihara would have destroyed jim kana grid because his brain was wired for it and he did he did he did well he he won he won in a two-wheel drive class like you know that falcon the discount tires were his uh 13 um like he was one of those drivers i was like this i think really speaks really well to him and look you know he's someone who retired from drifting and went road racing right like he eventually wanted to go after the clock and it never happened because frank just point blank ken was like i don't want to race in parking lots because ken knew that in order for him to go do it like in order for me on a bigger level in order for it to be busy like for it to happen he would have to be involved and he had so little time that he was like if i have a choice of what i want to do on the weekend go race on the stages or go race in a parking lot like i'm going to choose racing stages you know in the forest 100 and i get it i get it but for me i was looking at it's like this is this really cool thing that we could build and you had already um i think you had already had you left tunigin before ken passed or after i left before he passed right before he passed like literally like a few months before we uh we desperately tried to make jim kana grid remember yeah um because in my mind i saw this is like this is like the real legacy for him would be like let's build the series let's create this sport because if 20 years from now i'm driving down the road and i drive past the parking lot and kids are doing jim kana instead of autocross like that would be a major change right like that would have been this thing because i always thought that the sport of jim kana grid like had so much opportunity because like autocross is only fun for the driver 100 jim kana is actually fun to watch yeah right like but if you make it fun there was two things there's two things that we said about that we started live in front of 30 million people yeah on e s p n we started with the super ball and you had always said we need the little league to fill that in because you can't just go to the world series you know you got to you got to build feeders to get up to there but when we did it ken wanted to put a good show on and that was the one thing he did yeah and ken was great at his amazing driver amazing showman and he was an amazing marketer and we all learned so much from him right and i would watch ken go around the course and like sideways at the espn and like come in there was that tether ball hit and he would hit it perfectly with the side of his the side plate of his rear wing and he would just send the ball spinning tenor fowl's i knew consummate racer consummate racer would tell me he goes how hard do we have to hit the ball and i'm like what do you mean he goes where do we need to hit it and i'm like we didn't justify that and i said you know and then we started to quickly come up with a rule knowing what he was going to do yeah saying you can't hit it with a windshield and and i think that was one of the original rules you had to be sideways yeah i think it was like behind and tenor was a was a two-time champion drifter he knew how to put a car anywhere put a car and he had his his volks why could be no he was highly competitive so as as ken came in like this and would smack the the tanner would go and it would like barely like the ball but he got but he got the checkbox and then the flag would go up and sing the driver achieve and ken came to me and goes well he can't do that and i'm like i don't know what to say boss i'm like technically he can but i'm like what do you want to say you know again ten we got no engines here you know he's like grabbing me by the scruff of my neck and i'm like but that's the problem is anything you create in racing people are going to try to figure out the day they figure out how to put two cars against each other so they're gonna have a cheat yeah it's true so um but no i that's like something and and i tried to do that you know the guys at Hoonigan you know have brought back the jim khanokirch here they're trying but it needs jim khanokirch is a really great support show to something else you're 100 it needs to be part it needs to be one of the rings of the circus yeah it's like you could go to another event and we through the years we talked monster jam about doing it as part of the pre-show we talked about doing it we talked to indy car yeah we were gonna go we even were looking at uh espn x games in gallas i flew out to dao and looked at kota and tried to figure it out well the reason we didn't go there is there just wasn't a there's no pavement at the time i'm like i'm like who'd have thunk they'd build a track where it was literally dirt parking lots and i'm like how is this possible sorry man i feel like this is a damnit probably got wind power too um but um yeah and i still like i hope there's like another chapter in my life where like i get to take another swing at trying to make grade into a sport that's more accessible to other people but i don't know that i'll have to call you because you wrote the rule book so yeah i mean that's like i i i get into it with the guys from good life because i wrote the time attack rule book and adam jabay is always going i hate the rule book you wrote i'm like that's that's those are the rules that's one of the things we talk about time attack like yeah and we talk about khan and there's like a spirit of competition there that the japanese have that the australians and the americans just don't get because australians americans figure out a cheat japanese are sort of like hey we have a kind of a you know gentlemen's spirit of the agreement is like this should be like a tuner car right where the ossees are like you know andrew brilliant comes in and like designs every kind of like under tunnel arrow and hammerhead looking thing that looks more like a spaceship than a car where it's like okay and even the japanese hold on a second did americans ruin motorsport is that the take you know we'll find a way you know our our need to just like dominate everything you know i mean yeah well sorry f1 um on the time attack one uh have you watched the grid life i know this is like a few years old now but it still feels like a new concept but like the toge style time attack they do where where it's like the two cars the two car and it's like the time between them i think that would work if the cars were a more evenly matched and b it took place on a legit little toge because that's the whole appeal of it the tightness of it yeah when you're on a track where you could go you know three wide and you know it's like two two cars by themselves i don't you know it doesn't it doesn't quite translate if you did that at like you know the balcony you know or i mean um horse thief mile horse thief at willow you know um that might be something that would be more the the audience would respond to it a little bit more also the way that they produce their content i think you and i could probably show them a couple things about like the way that they need to actually fill it they just got this massive roll up a racer called tarot get in there figure it out chris is i'm actually chris is going to come on the show in like a week or two nice i i love chris you know there was a talk back in the day when i guess we could say it now statue of limitations yeah yeah i was just thinking about selling it to to honey well we we tried to buy him and i was actually the one that talked him out of it i could tell you now he was like we literally just met and we instantly like honda honda nerd head meld you know engage and we're like oh my god you like this i like that too oh my god we all like the same things you know we just went off have you driven a fit you drove a fit you have an active you got a hot acting oh my god can i drive the hot acting you know and then like so chris and i became fast friends since then and um he's like well what do you think man because he was you know apparently he knew i was was this this is when we brought him out to okay so this was when wheel pros wanted to buy them we had already we were positioning it as this was going to be a piece of the puzzle that we were and i'm like hey if you want to take this as a golden parachute and get out of town but you're not going to like what wheel pros and who to get by the way the golden parachute turned out to be rustling and golden it all f**king flaked off crashed right to the floor broke my hip so for for me i'm like i straight up told him i said don't this is not your cell you know yeah i i i hope it makes sense on paper motorsport marketing media all together you know racer and and uh and gridlife and and uh id agency and i'm tight with victor and i know the people at racer you know i'm like yeah let's see what they do you know i i'm happy to hear that chris seems happy but um for me i think gridlife to me and god i hate to use this phrase but it is that intersection of cars and culture that trueners anytime you have an event promoter someone at coachella will sign scion back when they were doing music festival stuff and they'll go let's do a car show so when coachella tries to do a car show it fails miserably much like if the people at i don't know import explore what i'm i don't mean to call out a particular show but let's just say a car show tries to do a music component it fails miserably chris and the crew get that like perfect yes because he comes from the music world but he's a car fanatic he gets it on both fronts like they would always ask me every year they're like what do you think of the lineup and i'm like i don't know a single artist so i guess that's a good thing yeah you don't want me to know you know you're like his depeche mode playing exactly i would see that show yeah i would see so for me i'm like i like what they did you could walk the paddock and i've been to a lot of grid life events you could walk the paddock in the morning and see the you know shitty skid kids and that that crew and then somewhere around three o'clock by the way i love shitty skid kids that's just shitty skid kids is a brand i would make that sticker and sell it 100 shitty skid kids i want to be those kids and if i can't my civic my kids like you got a sticker bomb one of the windows and i'm like i should i should i'm counter cultural and i'm like well where do i put the first sticker and then no you're like my ocd is not going to like this sticker but i don't know what if the glass breaks and then i i lost that sticker i'm never getting that sticker back you know and i'm like maybe if i tape them on or like oh this is so true i have a shoebox full of stickers 100 percent i can't commit i won't use because i only have like one or two cannot cannot commit cannot there's nothing valuable enough for me to put one 100 percent same thing why are we like i don't know but i want to be that i want like but you you can do it i've seen you with like napalm nova and some of your car you're like disposable cars you go to it gets that grit about it like zack somehow makes that that k5 look all at once like oh this is just a barn fine but yet it's got a 572 big block in it and it's like it's clean but not clean but yet you know and it's well used you know vin and i are on that other end of the spectrum where but vin actually drives his cars though he drives them through the rain where i'm like mickey's worst in all of us while we were waiting to do firing order mickey was like picking dust off of his car i'm like you drove it here like of course there's dust on it i was like this is so different between the two of us meanwhile my 9 11 has like six months of dirt on it and i'll drive it like that two cars in coffee and vinny'll be like dude you didn't even wash it like what the fuck i'm like there's a group that's on the come up right now doghouse garage and uh i actually don't know yeah they're they're just crushed they have good name yeah doghouse garage so they had an event in orange county at an act you're a dealership park your car inside the dealership and they invited me to put my car inside the dealership my kids were in town my oldest is like oh my god this is this is really cool and i'm like okay the morning of the meat dumping rain and i'm like kiddo i'm sorry i can't take the car she's like what do you mean i'm like i can't i can't i can't take the car and she's like just drive it just drive it i'm like no no no it's gonna stay in the shop under the car cover and it's it's good the way it is and we'll just it's it's just dumping this is such a southern california oh 100 because in new york you're like yeah i know it's raining the show is still going we're still gonna go and she you know they uh when i got there people with like cars that were 10 10 show cars mine's a driver you know it's not even that nice all drove their cars no wipers in the rain like slammed on r-comp tires and everything r-comp found and i'm like and my kid's like see that guy drove his car oh look at that girl drove her car oh look it so you didn't drive i didn't drive my car i took my daily and we parked outside and he's like did you bring your car i didn't bring it into the show but i'm just like parted and i'm like it's raining you know and then they're like oh and then all them were like yeah we're gonna pay for it later and they're all instagram stories and then washing their cars and give them more things yeah because yeah it's like i'm like i will not like i i let her drive i used to you know whatever mexico whatever you want to say i used to run moho and that's how old i am in this little mini truck and we go up and down moho and i showed her like the little i forget that you had mini truck roots i had mini truck roots was mini trucks before like was that the first thing for you that was my first thing because i raced bmx i could all like bob harrow and all the all rl osborne all the people from bmx action magazine had lifted hawaiian style trucks toyota sr5s or they had slammed mini trucks and they throw the bike in the back and they did you have a toyota mixtures i had a toyota all toyotas i had two lifted two leveled if you know the parlance of our vehicle i would build if i could build a i always like the uh mitzvah bishi mighty max oh my god i don't know why it's just so cool and you know what you do back when they had the stickers g63 and you at when we had the stickers on the mitzvah bishi on the back you change it to might you be high you never saw that in the old video no but sounds exactly yeah 100 percent just like taking the toyota toyota one just say yoda or yo and then um there used to be and please again don't cancel me but no fat checks my truck will scrape you know it's like all that every every era whatever folks wagon all that but i had a uh my my my end all be all was a was a 1980 long bed sr5 and i pulled the motor and i went to a place called california mini truck it had a it had a 22 r 20 r actually 20 r carbureted 20 r and i got a 18 rg out of a silica that i didn't know was an 18 rg at the time so i actually went down in displacement but it was a built motor and it had dual mccuny side drafts on it and dug thoroughly and i had them swap it into the car and it it ripped but the problem was there's nothing in the back so the rears would just spin i had black anky 92 stormtrooper look i feel like mini trucks are starting to come back oh mini trucks are having resurgence you know you sure george is oh yeah i'm super sick but like jordan you saw my jordan no no no george from do you know her oh george erin yeah i don't know her but i know of her she came into hoonigan like at the end and and like so and it i don't even i forget how we even connected but i she was like doing something i was like her shit's kind of cool and i was like hey you should stop by hoonigan one day and then she stopped by and then just like ended up and ended up yeah i was like i love her so she does yeah she does good but um who's who's the kid now god i'm blanking on his name but he had the blue 520 with the wilcox wheels on it and it had the shell top on it he was at hoonigan oh yeah yeah i forget yeah i just want i just want a dancing bed car oh my god so but to me back when i was coming dancing beds were terrible and now the fog of memory we're going oh yeah we're dancing did you have you watched the guy who has a dancing bed but he uses it for real like construction shit oh yeah he like he goes to the dump he goes to the dump and he's like backing it up and like everyone else everyone else is like backing up they're like f250 and he pulls in slammed and then all the sudden he's like flipping shaking it out um it is like i like there's things you see and you're like this is what the internet was built for like this is what i wanted to see this is what i wanted to be delivered i didn't want to be delivered all the atrocities of war i wanted to be delivered a dancing bed ending out construction debris like to the actual to the absolute chagrin of other construction workers who are near him like what is this man doing oh hey what's up here we are with another story time interruption brought to you by my good friends at fcp euro look if you've spent any time in the euro scene you have heard the term oem plus okay for those of you don't know oem plus is modifying your car with just oem parts usually taken from either a higher spec car or a newer car to most people it is the morally superior way to modify a car and still consider yourself a purist anyway back to what we were saying the other day driving the s8 it was brought to my attention that it needed new brakes and i thought oh i probably need to fix these but why fix these when you can upgrade these i found a bunch of big brake kits i could go buy but then i realized that there was a really good oem plus option which was upgrading to the next generation d3 either a8 or s8 brakes i started looking on marketplace that's usually where i go and it occurred to me you know what fcp euro probably has most of what i need and they did head over to fcp euro dot com filled the cart and surprisingly it was not that much more than buying the parts used that's right i was able to get brand new parts to do this great oem plus upgrade all from fcp euro brand new if you too want a mod your car and you like the oem plus route remember you can go to scp euro and find a lot of those oem plus upgrades right there if you know what you're looking for scp euro dot com for those of us who have an affliction for the european cars fucking crazy so okay conversation switch um you have been in the business for a long time right how many decades now as an enthusiast as an enthusiast since 1984 as a as a as a career 1998 1998 1998 so you've been here for a long time do you think we are at a peak moment in car culture right now in terms of the mainstream being aware and being involved in car culture well you know when we talk about this is what the internet is for there's so many different things to occupy everyone's attention span so before we talk about magazines that's your single source of truth now there's so many youtube channels out i all my friends make youtube content i can't possibly watch on my life is spent sitting on the toilet watching at 1.75 speed you know it's like that's like that's when i can see i'm like okay cool yeah i get the idea you know you know such and such did this this week and that's it you know by the way i hate how i sound at 1.75 because i will i review these at 1.75 and i realize a lot of my audience listens to that which made me also realize that if i was if i met some of these people in real life they wouldn't understand why i sound this way wait do we need to talk faster or slower right now i think we have to talk really slow so that way sipping on at 1.75 yeah it's a normal we sound like christopher walken yeah we've yeah so we just drink some lean on the shelf it slows the whole thing down anyway so but i do feel like because there's so much content to consume it's harder for people to keep up but i'll also say but you're talking on the content side yes talking about is like so i'll give you a peek that we both live through um two peaks fast and furious one was like this peak in import tuning right all 100 you know maxim magazine gq everybody's talking about it right um i think it was a short-lived peak but there was definitely it was a bubble hip hop car culture it was a massive peak talking about like dub and dub rides pit my ride like that whole era mtv cribs with the dub presents the garage like that lasted for four or five years i was living in it it felt like this massive peak like people knew what spinners were spree well i mean it it had transcended car culture became pop culture 100 and then we fell from there and i felt like the dark ages of like 2008 until maybe like 20 i don't know maybe even like 2020 like maybe 2021 was like an enthusiast era where like if you weren't an enthusiast you probably weren't paying much attention the rider dies or sticking around yeah like if this wasn't your thing you were there was no one was casually involved in the space right and then like you know you've got like the the 9 11 explosion luke's the cult sort of brings in this like you know more high end community you've got sort of this like new explosion of super cars like then and then all of a sudden f1 explodes because of netflix's drive to survive and like now you got all these like motor like i go to like you know neighborhood events and like my neighbors who were not in the cars are talking about f1 and i'm like i don't follow f1 anymore like i have no idea what you're talking about because like it is just not where i'm at but they are all like super saturated in it like a whole new sport but now you've got you know j json jason i talked about this it's like diamond supply co makes ferrari t-shirts like we tried so hard to get into zoomies and they told us we didn't hold with the gritty t-re and t-re collapse it's like it's like now this culture is like now something that everybody is doing and it feels like it's this peak but i've mentioned it to other people and it and also some of our own comments on this pod is that people don't feel that way because they feel like as an actual enthusiast it feels like it's at a low like the the laws are making it harder to own cars like there's just like there's you know that the actual that while the superficial side of the space feels um maybe sat highly saturated rappers are putting you know cool cars like e30 m3s and their videos right um but you have this other side of it where like everything else feels harder maybe more expensive like unrelatable like we're losing racetracks so like in one way the culture feels like to the outside like this is the biggest it's ever been but then at the same time we're losing like all this access to get to go do the hobby right yeah yeah i see but i ask you because you've been around and you've watched a couple of the hills and valleys right for me i think the first real peak i got to experience i i saw fast and furious but i wasn't really in the business yet but from the industry side like right now there's a ton of money coming into automotive that is like non-indemic 100 and then that money leaves yep it comes in waves yeah and then it's up but like do you feel do you feel the peak right now or is it well i judge it by you know like i live and die by the automotive aftermarket and the motorsports side of it and the show side to an extent and you know that that aftermarket culture that aftermarket culture thrives on you know essentially oam offerings so when i came up in the in the first wave of that 98s and everything that's when the Honda Civic Honda Civics were being produced at that time yeah the old guys this is the point other people have brought up the old guys liked the old Camaros and the old 70s muscle cars that were no longer in production right they were dying off the cars were getting harder to find the prices were going up now we're seeing that happen with our cars when Huff does the collab with TRD they don't put a GR Corolla on it because the GR Corolla as much as i love that car and want to get one um it's not as sexy as Ivan Stewart's old school you know class seven right truck you know and so that's the car they put on it and people are like i like cars but they don't even realize that the car that they like is an is an 80s era off-road you know Baja 1000 crusher that that has no real identity in today's world so if you look at the cars that we're producing today it's not good but then you also but yeah that's a really good point you know so there's not a lot so a few years from now you know you have to wait for those cars to go into the aftermarket the past 10 15 years have not been good but people argued that when the R35 came out remember when the R35 came out 2010 everybody's like well there goes tuning and now you have people 2500 horsepower you know vr 38 and you know it's like it's impossible to tune because the transmission has its own ecu and now they've like they're just tuning the f out of them you know so i look at that as the same way as like the being said i still find the R35 GTR to be a very uninspiring oh 100 my hot take to is the mark four super is a very uninspiring car wrapped around wrapped around in amazing engine the mark for supra is japan's answer to the Mustang that no one asked for 100 percent you know and a movie made it take off and made everybody but it doesn't really handle that no it's a terrible pig of a car the you know 36 it's good for what people use it for which is like texas 2k 100 percent it's a really fast and it's that engine that just that goes and goes and goes exactly exactly exactly but you know i will argue that the nsx and the fdrx 7 aged much more much more gracefully than the super yeah you look at those two cars and you just rx 7's you know just beautiful designs where the super is like okay i thought it was cool i remember when it came out i was there i think i think all the other i think the gtr's have used well i mean i think 32 when you talk about 32 33 34 to me yes 35 the mecca not really you know really feeling it you know the early ones are great too um but that's us we're getting stuck in an era so you just said something though that i actually like i never thought about this concern before um i do not like new cars right to me to me like i ek is greater than uh fl 5 and fk8 you know yeah like there's something and i don't know if that's because i'm old right and i'm listening to the same music that we listen to in high school no we're doing right now i do too i do too i listen to music i listen to i still listen to old music but i do enjoy new music what about old music do you guys know anyway good instagram page if you don't follow it oh i love that guy is that the white boy with the glasses just listen to this just listen to this are you stupid are you mental right just wait wait wait so good so good so good show him he's great yeah old old music fridays um but something you just said actually frightened me in a way i never really thought about before like right now i think the thing that is propping up car culture are cars that are 10 to 20 to 30 years old like that's what the culture is built on you're right when we were into hondas and you know vokes wagons we were we were modifying cars that were still in the dealership honda and a mark for right like you're literally either one you're either one generation out of the dealership or you're currently in the dealership nine six four porches e46 m3s you know it's like that's like you know we just stuck in our generation but younger kids are also pining for the same era cars which then asks the question of in 30 years from now what is the group of cars you're building brz toyota supra the new supra the mark five it's tough for those cars to age because like a muscle car that can kind of withstand the test of time whereas like a plastic car of the of our i always fear like what is our patina gonna look like years from now i'll tell you when you can't crack dashes yeah crack dash that's our future you know what uh my my least favorite thing about the cars from our generation is soft touch oh yeah all the soft touches just this is like goo that's just like you can't get off your fingers it's all peeling the way the alcantara just sort of wears away to a smoothness you know it's like yeah but no but like are we in a weird place where maybe that maybe this dies out because there isn't a huge handful of cars right now that become affordable for kids in 15 years to tune and the all the 90s cars and the 2000 cars that we grew up on become unattainable because we make them all expensive because because we get older we have more disposable income at least i'm hoping that happened it happened to the boomers i'm waiting for that moment i have a horribly apocalyptic hot take on all oh yeah let's let's okay okay here we go this is my old man rat um i got into this with i was on the uh the inevitable at low and they asked me to do that podcast and i'm like i do not like electric cars anymore i told them that like i like i i was an early adopter who has turned against them so it's not like i'm the never like no no i'm the never i'm like i'm like i've ridden in a tesla at hoonigan i've maybe been in a tesla uber you know but i'm not your guy but i was hosting the show at the time and they wanted to boost the show and they wanted to get the boost from the show and i'm like they brought me on and and i talked about by the way it's a great name oh the inevitable 100 inevitable is a fantastic name for anyone like a man for you to give credit to that name that's high praise that's high praise coming from you it's really yeah they did a great job with that ed ed does it does very well with that sort of stuff ed and johnny the two of them together and they make great co-hosts it was it was a fun experience but we started talking about you know l1 to l5 you know autonomy and right now we're about like l1 l2 you know which is like just for everyone l5 is like full autonomous right l1 is like okay lane assist is like lane assist and everything so we're getting into like the l2 era and starting to push into l3 and then we have the wamos out there that are not quite l5 they're more like l4 because there's someone monitoring that but this is the world that we're in right now is the same world of the industrial revolution when the automobile came around work the move from horse to buggy to car is happening again for us and it's the only problem is the loose nut behind the wheel because if you want to have full autonomous all the crashes right now that have happened from most of the autonomous vehicles back in the day this stat was more true but as they're driving more they're finding more issues but most of the problems are problems with human error humans are driving and they run a light and the autonomous vehicle runs into it but for the most part they're getting there's a there's the one of the the waymo that gets confused when the guy's like down on the ground and the police around him in LAPD there's a few of those right but for the most part the problem is the loose nut behind the wheel it's the human intervention if you want to have eventually when you get into full autonomous l5 is what you're getting to that's not just interconnected vehicles that are talking to each other but interconnected roads that are talking to every vehicle so that way you're going to have vehicles in the fast lane doing 200 miles an hour and all those vehicles are doing 200 miles an hour bumper to bumper not connected bumper to bumper and then when one vehicle wants to merge the other vehicles no right because it can speak to each other they can speak to each other get on no human could keep up with that it's the same thing with the the the paddle gear shift you know if you're talking about dual clutch it shifts faster than any human could shift I happen to prefer rolling my own gears I just like it even though it's slower I get it but I just feel more connected to the driving experience I don't need to be that fast I don't need to shift fast like Lewis the Hamilton I don't need to do that so for me I don't see that happening the other thing I don't see is that people aren't going to be able to coexist with those cars so eventually humans are going to be taken out of the equation so before the horse used to be a beast of burden right and that's it you you everyone had a horse you know then the horse became the playground of the wealthy the car is going to be the playground of the wealthy thermal club where there's a driving thing your daughter's this line before your daughter's not going to want a pony she's going to want a miata and the miata is going to be there and daddy what do we put in it we put gasoline into this vehicle and it's only available here and it's very expensive and then you could drive your car around she goes oh my god I have to drive it myself that's so that's so quaint you know and then you learn how to drive and that the vehicles are going to be the playground for the rich and if you want a car you don't get to drive one but if you want to go pick up something at Home Depot you could summon you know a a vehicle that could carry what you need or just gets delivered yeah exactly exactly exactly and you never need to leave your house and then we're in that point you just plug into the back of your neck and you're in the matrix or or you're in the I'm a I'm a my kids are of the Pixar age the Wally you know you're in the Wally world where we just end up going to buy right and spending everything there and you know it's it's super dark no but but I've got a Lieberman who knows so much about this contested me to the end he's like absolutely not there's no way you could still you could still ride a horse on the street you'll still be able to people will still be able to drive but the problem with it though and you said this and I've heard this line before and the line goes at one point everyone rode horses and only the wealthy had cars and now only the wealthy can afford a horse and it's like that's just a reality that comes because when something is no longer the norm it it fits outside of standard practices and then it makes it more expensive because if there aren't gas stations anymore if there aren't roads you can legally drive your horse on or your car well then you have to go to Thermal Club I don't know man I don't know if I'm I don't know if this is because of my age or because technology just moved too quickly but in the past year or two I have taken a massive like step back from wanting more tech in my life because I was a huge supporter of like new tech I like tech right I mean there's some tech that thinks it's really good the cameras that are recording us right now are these like logitech cameras that are all connected together and they all work off the iPad and it's like they all just stream together it's so simple and if the way we used to do it at Hoonigan was like four different cameras and like each of them sync the time codes and it's like it's like that's great that's an advantage but there's other things I'm just like I drive new cars today and I just I want to turn everything off like I don't need it there's a few new technologies I actually wanted to do this is a firing order but I think it just ends up being like old men yelling at clouds but was like what new tech is absolutely useless versus like what new tech is actually great like there's certain things I like I like so I'll talk to good tech I'll go positive first I like my high beams getting turned off when another car is coming at me on a two lane road I find it to actually be really convenient it makes it nice I get to keep my hands on the wheel especially if I'm riding like spirited road I don't have to reach for the stock right boom it's on and off on and off backup cameras I think backup cameras are good I don't really use them because I don't own any cars with them same same I I never own the car in concept in concept they're great when I drive cars with backup when I'm when I'm like oh my god this is amazing like right there I forget to use them when I get like a press car like I'll still you're over the shoulder run over the shoulder looking in the side mirrors like I'm driving a fucking like a box truck but other technology like I like Hill assist I like Hill assist I think Hill assist is the weird cheat I don't like auto blip I don't like anything that adjusts the performance but I don't care how good of a manual transmission driver you are if you're sitting at La Cienega in sunset I knew you were gonna say that I knew you're gonna sucks to this day I get like sweaty when I realize all my cars the the hand it's not that good you know it's not that good I'm like I don't have much hill holding power with this one and I'm like at that one I'm like I always try to time it I'm always like yeah okay and the guy in front of you starts and stops yeah like burning your clutch like I don't need that in my life I no longer need to prove myself there but there's so much other stuff like the lane assist like just weird things that the car does that without me asking it to do all of that stuff like I just have no interest in the blind spot indicator is like that's a little extra to me yeah there's the other thing is like if you look back at tech that that didn't work do you remember like the s chassis and the I want to say it was the third gen Integra that had the automatic seat belt oh yeah we had that in the Volkswagen yeah it's just the worst you know and I get like those were trying to keep you safer and I guess all of these are I mean I guess in the end like the idea of like the lane guide and stuff and all of that is so that you don't pay you don't swerve off the road while you're on your cell phone but if we remove the I mean there's yeah yeah we're talking about tech I was thinking about that I actually rode in one of the signal auto drift cars in in Osaka like literal bayside drifting that you see what on the streets with and they were doing I don't know 80 mile an hour entries back then and one of the drivers I jumped in the car and I got in they went okay and he goes strong go you strong go and I said what it's late at night I've been drinking a little bit and I'm like what's happening he goes I gotta give this guy a hand job he goes he goes handle on the a pillar and then they close the door and then the little seat belt refractor goes and there's no seat belt no harness no anything oh goodness and so I'm like you want me to brace myself on the a pillar with and I'm like you know what no one else would get in the car everyone else is like nope and I'm like I'll get in the car no there was no there was no cell phone camera or anything I'm just like I'm doing it for the the the the story so I'm like okay let's get in the car and I went and full like 80 mile an hour entry of course it was a right-handed tree so I am right there like hi container you know like strong go holding on holding on and everything and another one I'll give you is I won't do that anymore I'm too old now to get into other people's cars I still jump in like the biggest idiot ever you know but another one I'll give you about technology that just maybe think of it with the seat belt thing was I used to park cars the Beverly Hills Hotel and my dad actually invented valet parking but that's another story for another we we your dad invented valet parking which is another story I've crashed the playboy mansion as a parking attendant I worked at the Beverly Hills Hotel as a parking attendant and I've had some pretty cool jobs and drove some pretty cool so before your dad there was no such thing as there was no such thing as valet parking Herb Citroen and John the Dairy started a company called valet parking with a v it was meant to look like a tuxedo of a like a man servant a valet or a butler that would actually bring your car why would I want you to bring my car the parking lot is right there it's right there no this is a service you're spending a lot to go to this restaurant we give you a good complimentary service and everything and they first started at a lorries prime rib in Beverly Hills California in like the mid 60s that is a fun fact I did not know anyways I I've worked at a lot of these valet jobs and I was working at the Beverly Hills Hotel and when someone tips you back in the day the parking was was two dollars to park at the Beverly Hills Hotel people give you a five it lets you keep three you get a tip and everything everybody's happy um Jean Claude van Dam comes out and he was peak van dam at the time this is like god I want to say uh late 90s late 90s you know like yeah there was a whole thing and and uh no I mean early 90s early to mid 90s and he he comes out he had a BMW 7 series brand new and he said how much and I said uh two dollars you know and he said oh okay and he gives me a five and I said you kind of wait you know and then he's like change and I'm like are you mother you John Claude van Dam and so I take like three sweaty wadded ones and I hand it to him I don't like you don't give him this change in any like sort of measurable way and when someone tips you you hold the hand on the door and you hold the other hand on the handle and you close it and you say thank you very much have an enjoyable trip thank you for right right they don't tip you you give them the you give them the flick you know so I flick the door and I look over my shoulders I'm flicking the door and he has a pen and he goes to write something down as he's talking to the other people in the car and he drops the pen and it lands on the door cell and he reaches his handout to get the to open the to grab the pen the pen rolls out of the door cell onto the ground the door is in motion now and I'm like no and I'm I'm rushing to get to it but I can't get back to it fast enough and the door hits but doesn't close all the way which is the perfect close if you're trying to snub them not the perfect close when you close John Claude van Dam's hand in the thing but it was the soft touch door so not only does it not close all the way but it like hits and then it goes pulls onto his fingers and he goes open open he's like screaming at me with his accent and I'm like oh my god John Claude van Dam is going to kick my butt right now you know so I open the door and I just look at him and I panic and I take off running and it was a big party there was people everywhere and I don't know what happened but all I imagined was because this is I'm dating myself here I see him on the Arsenio Hall show later that night this didn't happen but I'm imagining him in this full cut I can't do the new movie because some idiot closed my hand in the door but no it's his fault three dollars because I come on man come on I might have been the end of it for him come on JCBD be better no um yeah I always love when you have like weird interactions with celebrities once backed into um Alec Baldwin's uh Cadillac I want to say it was like a the DTS remember the DTS the DTS by the way let's talk about this did Tony Soprano drive a DTS and like I want I feel like that was a very Soprano as Cadillac was making their move from being like we're no longer a big boat company but we're not going to make art and style no we're gonna make we're gonna make a sporty CTS they're like someone was like we still need to make a car for the old people and someone's like the DTS they was like the Malae Zera without being in the Malae Zera you know 100% it was like it was like they looked at the Lincoln Town car and was like I don't think we can improve it but we could certainly make another one and they introduced the DTS which was like a modern version of just an old Cadillac and he had one and we were working as when we were movers we worked in the city and back into him and he's always annoyed I talk about him on the pod but I love I love him so much but um he backs into him and Tim who's in the good one of my best friends who was in the car who's in the truck with us was like oh shit yo you hit that car you should leave like drive away yeah yeah yeah yeah like oh bro you just hit that car you should go yeah yeah because like yo he like I mean he had one the moving band it's like it wasn't a small dent it was like caved in the quarter panel and and we're like trying to like figure out what to do and we're like shitty fucking like you know 20 year old kids and uh then all of a sudden Tim's like oh shit looks like the fucking doorman caught us and the doorman comes running out doorman was not the doorman the doorman was out of the Baldwin so we get out the car and he was super fucking cool oh he was super cool and this was like three weeks after he beat the shit out of a photographer oh and once we once we were like yo is that out like Baldwin and this was only like an aspiring photographer and uh I was like is that out like Baldwin like yeah I think so and I was like bro he or he already doesn't like photographers he's gonna kick your ass and then we literally let him get out of the truck we both lit up newports and sat there smoked a cigarette and watched it inside me here just like well cigarette break here we go and he ended up being super cool and he ended up not even going through insurance like he was like yeah whatever it's fucking cool but like but you know you you run into people like that and like oh this could be an interesting interesting position so what do we learn here John Claude Van Damme asshole like Baldwin not an asshole yeah where were we going before we were talking about peak we got off of that um autonomous yeah we kind of moved on to Thomas which like I hate having that conversation I don't like to have that conversation but I told you I wanted to give you a dark apocalyptic which apparently might not be such a hot take anymore because people are seeing that writing on the wall Johnny Lieber and I got in a huge debate over it where he just he just likes to fight he does he I feel like I'd love to see Johnny on the pod I think I would be really good on firing order because I think that like he would do his research he would come prepared but it needs to be a topic that like really suits him the problem is is um extremely knowledgeable but also just as opinionated yeah I love that about him yeah no no he he would be he would be good for that the um but I just like I don't know you need to teach him how to do YouTube though is driving with Johnny is like Johnny work on the driving the big issue for me though is I really draw a weird line when people are like hyper defending electric cars is like great being a great driving experience and it's like I'm all I because I'm not one of those people like I I'm really concerned about what the fuck we're doing to our like universe same same I climb I grapple with like yeah you know yeah yeah yeah you know I'm test piped you know dirty smog my car and all that right but at the same time I'm like man like how what am I doing for my kids and everything you know it's like that being said all of us collectively acted like the way we do but we setting ourselves the problem is is if you actually look at the percentage of percentage of people automotive emissions versus cars versus what's actually the problem like we need to look at like long haul trucking we fire power plant all of a hundred percent look at shipping and container 100% like that's where the problem is we need to you know I don't know think twice before like you know igniting oil fields on fire like these are things that like are really really bad for the environment right um I'm not going to get into the argument of whether or not electric cars are potentially worse for the environment because I don't have because they get charged by the electricity from a coal fire power plant I will say I haven't done the research so I don't have like enough education we also haven't been doing it long enough to realize the repercussions and ramifications of everything that we're doing so the case study we can't do a b testing on anything yet because we really don't know totally but I will say this they are not a better driving experience no 100% and anyone who says they are I instantly lose like that's it you've lost credibility your credibility 100% like that's just credibility is out 100% and when you say good driving experience they'll say well it's faster than your car that's not that does not qualify it as a good driving experience that just means that the the zero the the instant on torque of an EV motor is applied in that fashion that's it I also just don't find raw power and speed to be what motivates me for a car slow car fun to me I'm like and I know everyone says that now but it's like it just works but to me I'm like it's so much better than like I was I don't know I somehow get involved with these like hypercar owners with some of the work I do with with mothers and I hear people debating over the driving experience of a begoni zonda versus a conic seguro garra and I was like does it matter are you do either of you are either of you and I'm not I don't know what I'm driving have you driven a lot of like hypercars no I haven't had the opportunity I would love to I've you know a couple McLaren's and Ferrari every now and then but you know nothing that spectacular out there you know the probably the craziest car I ever drove was like on the power tour it would be Charlie Lillard who's a famous collector had one of Mark Steele's famous pro touring Camaros which is like a super different space different space but that was like a that's a quarter million dollar car you know and I'm like okay and that was like manual transmission and everything right rock crusher and everything it was yeah I think like every I've driven a couple hypercars I've driven a bunch of supercars and I think that the same experience I always have in them is when I get out of them I always feel like I drove the car at like four tenths and you you also kind of just feel like it also kind of knows you from the driving experience I drove an r35 and 2012 right when they were pretty new and I followed behind a 3rs and unlike a little autocross style like road course type of cone road road esque autocross course and I effortlessly kept up with and I'm not that good of a driver and I but I just felt a little detached from the driving experience you know and I also felt like I didn't nearly explore the levels of what the car was capable of yeah and I'm like okay in order to get there that's you got to get on another level I had an amazing experience in that car not because of the car but I went to a press launch when it when it launched in the US they launched it at Reno Faley racetrack which was like an old motorcycle track up in Tahoe area and went to the press launch they'd already done the Tokyo launch right I forget where it was but they already done a launch in Japan and then this was like the first US launch and this was all like I figure what the hell that was called but like you know the the media like like instant media so it was all like people who had to like report their stories early okay like a deadline yeah it was like deadline media so it was you know it was more of the blogs and that kind of stuff that were showing up for it at least for the wave I was on but I was there for zero to 60 so like I didn't have like a rush to deliver something yeah everybody went and did one lap and then went and wrote their story I'm like okay and then the rest of them didn't even go back out so I went I did like my five laps like they gave you tickets right for like how many laps you could do I did my five laps and then I think it was uh it was Scott or Steve Oldman I forget which Scott Oldman Scott well one of them worked at the magazine one of them worked in the magazine world one of them worked at Nissan I forget one of the old man's they were brothers I think it was Steve Oldman maybe Scott Oldman I don't remember anyway um he came over to me was like hey man like here's a bunch of tickets like can you go and like drive the car more because like everybody else doesn't want to go drive anymore and Steve Millen was there and I did lead follow with Steve Millen for so long that we blew the brakes out on three of the cars and we would just bring the cars in and then hot swap to another car and go back out like literally killing tires on cars just following Steve Millen through this track and it was one of the most like rad experiences because we would do laps and then Steve would like pull in next to me and as we came into cool down and he'd be like here's what you're doing wrong in that corner and it was like it was just such a rad experience but it was also this amazing moment at like looking at what journalism was at the time which is like all of you just got invited to drive one of the most important cars of the decade the car that everyone's putting up against the 911 and you drove it for one lap and then wrote a story about the one lap like you literally did an out lap and that was it I spent the entire day driving that car and I can genuinely say it's not that great like it's it does its job but like it felt it's it's not a 911 it blows my mind how people don't want to drive cars anymore like when we talk about journalists I have another story that's like exactly like that I went uh I want to say it was an Acura RSX press launch and then by the way not to not to cut you off but the RSX was a car that got mentioned I saw it I saw it I've never driven I think I owned one and I think I never driven one is it a car you need to go drive no it's not it's it's okay Mickey even mentioned it in a in a pod that said it's the next collector car that's going to come from Japan the the type R because yeah DC5 type R and I'm like McPherson strut front end it definitely like it needs a lot of help it needs a lot of aftermarket help but anyways that the the new car came out in 04 I think the the the mid-cycle refresh came out in 04 and we went to streets of Willow to drive and I know streets pretty well and we got to drive the car but then also we got to take a lap in Peter Cunningham's real-time racing DC5 race car everybody could take a couple laps you know and I was like what the what so we got to drive the car drove the car everybody did a couple laps and then they all went in for lunch and then I'm like kind of standing there going I go again you know and this this kid uh his name was Jasper he worked he since past but I had such a great interaction with him he's like yeah no one else he goes they paid us to be here all day we got tires we got fuel you know take it out and I'm like okay how many laps he goes I'll flag you when it's time to come in and I'm like what do you mean and he goes just go go have fun and I drove countless laps he flagged me to come in I'm like oh that's it so I brought it and he goes we got to change tires and fuel you could stay in the car if you want to keep going soaked and sweat and I'm like yeah I'll keep going I skipped lunch I drove so many laps in a real-time racing world challenge DC 5 that's accurate you know DC uh RSX type s you know I'm like we're gonna and no none of the other journals were just like yeah well it was cool you know a lot of them couldn't fit in the car they're a little too too overwhelmed I'm like dude I'm like a cat I'm like if I fits I sits you know I'm like I'm gonna like wedge my fat fat ass into it I'm like gonna go okay all the tiny little bridge seats I've squeezed into over the years I'm like I don't fit in any of the problem you know it's like just you know it's like that that kid who puts the helmet on that's too small that's me in all the bridge seats you know and I'm like I'm doing it I do not care you have no idea how many times people handed me keys to cars and like go take it for a spin I'm like I physically do not fit in your car like no no you'll fit and then I try to get in there like oh my god you do not fit you were talking about uh Elise Elise and Xege um we built one for the show and and Amir built it it was a k20 swap turbo k20 monster of uh of Elise and Xege and he did full aero on it and everything but because he's diminutive like a jockey or race car driver he did a fixed mount seat and he tucked it all the way in and I'm like I could do it I could do it I could not do it I could not he was like you could take it for a rep I'll let you take it for a he was like so open to letting me drive it and I just my knees just went right up into the steering wheel and I was just like if I could just if I had like a slider on this Amir I'd be in it right now by the way something I noticed about our conversation because you're like is it a new show this is the show that we're doing today okay I realize what it is we're about two hours in we're about two hours in I'm sorry I figured out what the show is have you ever played that game what I brought to a picnic no and basically it's like I think does everybody put their keys in a bowl because if so I think I played it okay no is that not the game you brought the cucumber okay so it's like the game was like you would say a word you'd be like I brought like a loaf of bread and then you have to use the last letter of the word I said to say the next thing this whole conversation has been you start talking about something and then you say a word and I'm like ooh let's talk about that word it's tangential it is 100% like like none of this this is the most stream of consciousness conversation and because you're like oh that actually happened to me or this other thing Nolan is gonna want me on this show ever again because you just said something you just said something and now I fucking forgot it but I was like was it about driving the press cars the the or squeezing into the bread seats or not fitting into the lotus I love the way we're like you know this is like a chat gpt search history it's like what was I asking about you're hallucinating right now we're full slop hallucination at the moment no there was there was something you had said and I was like oh yeah yeah yeah that's the next conversation piece and I realized that like that's actually a really good format for a show which is like just start telling a story and then something from your story has to connect to the next story out of that and then go to the next story and then go to the next story and then it's like every story is connected but you can like only put it together if like you're a neurodivergent like otherwise it makes zero sense you're like I don't know how these guys started here like first they were talking about this civic and then they were talking about like this and then like I don't know then like then it was like just sexual and you went to us for like three minutes straight like what that what are these guys on about it's a good thing you didn't let me drink beer you know I'll say that much yeah I don't know you're pretty good conversationalist on a beer or two I you know but the thing is is I've watched with you if the beer pacing like is not at the right speed I you have to like you know yeah 100% it's like throttle modulation yeah you know it's like you can't know not too much oversteer understeer yeah yeah it's it's it's definitely one of those I'll give you one about being over served when you talk about like you know me having being good conversationalist when I was a super street HPI RC cars came out and I'm terrible with RC cars and never take the time when the car is coming at me I cannot figure out how to steer it is going the opposite direction I'm like I almost have to like turn my body this way when I'm driving and that's how bad I am this is my hand-eye coordination when it comes to RC cars just terrible so I get invited to the celebrity grand prix it was at the opening of you know some super auto box in Orange County or something and HPI is having a celebrity grand prix with real-life drifters racers media personalities and I'm one of the drivers and I pick of course knob ton of gucci's red d1 grand prix s15 with the super red van wheels and the whole thing and it's all got the livery and everything but they don't give me the car they say you could drive this car you're gonna bang into things and this is your practice car so I have some practice car from HPI I never take the time to even take it out of the box I don't even practice I keep I'm so busy with work you know maxi world you're just like I'm like I gotta get you I'm watching it sit on my desk this box unopened box going two weeks I got two weeks I could do it over the weekend the weekend I'm hanging out drinking doing whatever and everything the night comes I still have not taken the car out of the box and I'm like I am so ruined it this is a big thing in front of a whole bunch of people so I'm nervous and they go well you got to be here at like seven o'clock so it's like a Friday night we all leave work early all the super street guys come with me and they're like I'm like this is terrible I don't know what to do and they go you need a drink you need a drink you need to like just take a drink and like that'll help you like calm your nerves at least because you're I'm losing it now like the anxiety is kicking in so I'm like okay me being me and the super street guys being this way that I get wasted like completely just gone I stagger up to the thing when it comes time and I'm like I feel pretty good now I'm feeling loose you know and I'm like I got this I get in the car get to line up for the race and the race starts we're all in the podium and everything the suspended and you know we take off and I'm like in second place you know and I'm like oh my god you know and I'm like barely hanging on and I'm like please and I'm like death gripping the controller right now and I'm like please please please you know and then now I'm like oh there's an opportunity and I pass for first and I'm in first place and I'm winning the RC and I mean meanwhile there's like Alex Pfeiffer may have been there there's like the tanner fowl of the day or all all these drivers and everything and I'm like dude there's something about like I'm doing this you know and one of the marketing people comes over from HPI and they said John are you okay you know and I'm like yeah yeah I'm fine don't what are you doing don't talk to me now I'm doing great you know and then they're like are you sure you know and I'm like yeah and they're like that's not your car I had drove my car into the wall meanwhile the steering's just going and I'm like gas break gas I'm tracking someone else's car around the track thinking it's you thinking it's me thinking you're killing it and I just punched it into the first turn and I'm like literally like watching the wrong car okay I handed the controller and I'm like I'm so sorry and then so that's a problem that's when it goes from good conversationalists to you know a little a little out of control once right before you hit me with what actually happened I already knew yeah I know exactly man exactly that sobering reality of like I am outclassed for this right now I just recently went to Cletus's I was there filming something with Leah Block I saw that yeah and uh Cletus was has a RC full-size crown Vic and I made it two-thirds of a lap and I saw that too I didn't know it was an RC car I didn't know it was a I didn't know it was like okay and like I thought I'm like why would you do that I'm like were you in the car I'm like you just sort of turned up into the wall I'm like from the perspective when you're like when you're watching do you do you have a POV camera no you're just watching the car yeah that's weird to me but also it doesn't center so you have to see you're constantly chasing like it doesn't auto-set the wheels you have to steer it back into position oh my god which was weird it's also got a massive delay right oh god so you get into it and then and then you wait and then by the time you're trying to correct it's like oh no now it's still starting yeah yeah and then on top of all of that in my head I thought I was doing like 20 miles an hour because like you're like watching this car from a quarter mile away from it and then when they brought it in and I realized how tall it was I was like I was doing like 70 like like you didn't realize like like I really got stacked like because in my head I'm like why isn't it turning back and I'm like oh because I'm doing 70 miles an hour and I'm like trying to just steer the other way and I just pushed right into the wall like weird so yeah and it was funny because I was like that because it started with Cleetha saying are you good at RC cars I was like I'm okay which was definitely the wrong answer you never said that definitely set me up for that I was RC cars is what kind of really got me into real cars oh man back in the day the Tia cars they were so like not it was like a rat think aesthetic that was like they were like hyper realistic but with that little bit of that that anime twist that cartoonish twist you know I um I got into RC cars um I'm trying to kill that fly the whole day um I got into RC cars because I was uh eight years old I went to the park and they were these like older like older guys they probably were like teenagers but they were playing with a clawed buster oh yeah I know exactly what you're talking about and a black foot and I like fell in love and like my parents didn't have like that much money and I remember like long story short they'd asked my grandfather to buy one for me my grandfather ended up passing away like between that period and my birth he actually died the day before my birthday and my parents were like decided to splurge and like spend money and they bought me a kiyosho um turbo ultimate oh my god and it was just the coolest thing and it like it taught me about how suspension works and like you know had oil fill shocks you learn like the damping and like all of that was just so much fun and I should have realized then that I definitely enjoy like building unbuilding and rebuilding cars more than driving because I would like build it bring it out crash it and then just like that was it like I wouldn't drive it again like it would like sit for like a month and then I'd finally like I'd be like I like I can't just rebuild it I need to like put a new this in it do a new that like I would like modify the hell out of it and like I enjoyed driving it but it was definitely but RC cars was like my entrance into real cars because I was not one of those like I didn't read car magazines until I had a car like I was one of those people like you know like some like there were kids I went to high school with who were like reading hot rod when they were in freshman year of high school yeah yeah I'm like I was into BMX bikes like like I liked my hobby to be immediate like I wasn't like something I was like you were you were spying to like for me I always think like my my grandfather was into cars which is why I I loved cars but it was RC cars that like made me want to like build them design them work on them like I built my own shock towers when I was into it like just ordered a sheet of like carbon fiber from like McMaster car and then like cut it out with a bandsaw and like you know just came in this flat sheet of whatever like I was like that that like early on was the thing that uh that got me in because it was funny because when you said before you're like these are like the you're like bigfoot and um what was the other one that was used to big foot got into cars what was the other thing uh the tarot p6 yeah yeah yeah it's like for me I don't know if like I have that like I had like specific moments like I would say uh the Lamborghini Countach just as a car was super cool but Miami Vice is probably what made me like cars like I thought Miami vice the white Tester Rosa and by the way they're they just announced that they're gonna be doing a new there's a reboot they're rebooted the film and um the director who did f1 oh okay okay he's doing it and I was like man that would be a cool that'd be a cool film to work yeah that like that like that would be that would be super cool like that I wanted nothing more than to be Don Johnson when I grew up when I was a kid like I thought he was the coolest thing ever I you were a little bit older I would I would wear the Don Johnson close to the high school parties you know everybody and the girls were the Madonna glove and the guys were the the teal shirt and the white I was terrible with like white linen because I'm always like I had a lowered mini truck and it was always like something was wrong with it I'm like trying to get in and out of it without I had white Corbos seats on it which I thought were like just pretty pimp pimp right until like just every little bit of dirt and everything I was just like could not keep them clean I don't know how people keep white seats clean I drove a Audi RS4 with white interior home and I had like you know like salvage denim that was blue and by the time I drove from LA back to New York and by the time I got back to New York the seats were just dyed blue yeah same like for me like people said oh why didn't you get the Civic Type R seats because the Civic Type R seats are the Riccaros they are 3s but they're red they're bright like Honda red and I'm like dude I just gonna just wreck those seats so the Integra Type R from the same generation had black seats with red stitching and I'm like that's you know yeah give me the black seats please now all right so Nat's the million dollar question what's next what are you doing what's going on you know what I'm doing I'm you know I'm embracing my old school roots and I'm writing a book about golden arrow wheels my love letter to old school wheels and nice all the way back to the 60s and like all the way you mentioned the OZ Futuras on like you're talking about something with James Pumphrey yeah that's one of those top those are those are one of those that's everybody has those wheels it for what I'd say all wheels like not Japanese it's it's Japanese it's a Japanese market and it starts in the 60s and goes all the way to about the 2010s when the wheels literally fall off the first you'll make like official wheel maker in Japan is it what we tell it goes back to what and I mean and you're 100 right that's we talked about that in another conversation that's a that's a that's a mini light rip off you know it's like they were they were the first you know but and then Panasport copied the watts there were a copy of that and then Conan Rewinds and everyone's done and then you've got western the westerns and everything yeah but but what I feel like that no one really ever talks about is we are unique in our space if you talk about a low rider it's Dayton 100 spoke triple crosses if you talk about a hot rod it's Hallibrand sprints if you talk about a muscle car Camaro it's torque thrusts you know every spec like Porsche has their fuchs alloys right every space has the perfect wheel even if you are an outlier even if like Vin wants to put T's on a Ferrari which you could tee the world which I get that but the T 37 is not the first wheel that you think of when you want to put on our Ferrari but then will then is a little different because he's got a few different sets of wheels for that because he comes from our space we are the only ones that don't treat wheels with that main character energy we treat it like an ensemble cast like Hoonigan we treat it like there are multiple options to play with and we treat them like we're the sneaker heads of the car culture no one else does that the low rider space they don't go yeah I got these wheels but I also like these ones I mean right now you're running I have two differences wheels because yeah on your car and everybody I have 12 sets of wheels for my rabbit I've only read one on them now but like they're I they're you know for a rainy day I might want to know I know I got RS this because you have to have an RS it's the it's the driveway picture of the one car with all the wheels and tires laid out and no one no other space does that the muscle car because maybe they'll do like forge lines instead of the OG torque thrust which I think Euro kids are the same though Euro kids are the same but I'm saying like the sport compact world okay got it is just a little bit different and even like you know Vin's more of a Euro kid he's a JDM guy too but you know he's got multiple sets of wheels for all his cars you know you've got multiple sets of wheels you know most of the people I know multiple sets of wheels there's never that one perfect wheel and I know people who get a set of wheels for their car and go yeah I got these but I also want those or I can't decide so I'm just gonna get them both I think wheels are so important that I've bought wheels that have then made me buy cars to match you buy a set you you come up on a deal and you're like oh my god these are you know these are five by one four teens and they're they're in this they're in this pcd and they're in this 158 and a plus 38 I gotta get an ek you know I gotta I gotta get an ek for these wheels I can't not get the ek because you know yeah I will 100% justify like oh this is a really good wheel at a good price and this will go perfect with that yeah so now I have to buy and build an entire car just to support these but yet that it won't stop at that one set of wheels just like the just like sneakerhead culture you know it's like it's this we are the only only group in this in this segment that treats wheels like this that's gonna be a really good book you thinking like coffee table I'm thinking coffee table type and then I'm gonna do like a little bit of like there's a little bit of like there's gonna be also what I what I want to call the outer rim getting my naming convention is like what what was bit why would why were moon eyes so big why were halibrand sprints so big why were torque thrust so big what what does the deal with like Dayton Dayton wheels on low riders and I write the whole section that a kf is just japan's interpretation of a torque thrust oh my god there I I you know and I it's one of my least favorite wheels but like the scene loves it the scene loves those because when when when you know the japanese there was a subsect of japanese drifters that wanted big fat steelies and just like just to show it off you know it's like drifting meets VIP sort of thing yeah and I also don't drifting I think also drifting meets hip hop culture like that feels so pulled out of like the back of rides magazine it does but it also like it's also right at home at final bout yeah no it works so yeah so it's like okay so when I saw him on Hertz car I was like okay now the us is getting a hold of these you know well it's like it's weird for me because I like performance based wheels like I think my first wheel of choice is always a wheel that feels like it belongs on a race car do you know what I'm saying like that's what I like I like it I like te's but then I also like a future which doesn't feel like it belongs on a race car no there's a there's that weird like three-piece wheel german element which bbs rs is like the iconic wheel but the rs is were once race wheels they were that's what now they feel weird as race wheels yeah and now people don't step-lipped your rs's please god those are just wait what step-lipped rs's you don't like that oh god it's so bad I think it's okay to a certain size it looks I think it's okay to a certain size it looks so bad to me yeah no I mean in my opinion I think the best size rs is a 15 it works well as a 15 or 16 but John Ruskov started the little wheel I got the sticker on my rabbit I'm like I am 100 card carrying member he's like top of the list of people that I want to reach out to and talk to but it's the same thing that goes like I'll make the comparison of sneaker culture when you design a sneaker you design it around a size nine right like a size nine is what's called sample size so like that is the perfect like proportions for a sneaker okay I wear a size 14 it doesn't always translate the same way and I think the same thing happens with wheels like wheels start to get too big and it's like certain wheels just don't translate well it's all it's also the wheel diameter to the sidewall ratio too it's like another thing you know like to me I think the 17 is like the perfect size wheel overall I think like once you start getting into 20s wheels unless it's like a monoblock like they just start to like the proportion of like the size of the lip versus the wheel it all just seems like I think it also depends on the car because today's cars are getting so big you can't run you know 15s but like when you see someone put a set of night like bbs is stepped up to a 19 like a set of rs is up to 19 looks insane like I can't defend that like that's like too much when you got like this like it's this much of a void of like polished aluminum that's going out so that to the lip to me it feels like that's that is not true to the original so I mentioned this on on the firing order but I do want to do and I think you brought the book up then it's like I really want to do a firing order on wheels but that it's really difficult because it's it's really too broad I mean like right now top five top five wheels of all time can you name them god you're like TE 37s bbs rs's that's two I 100 what's the other three I would say the southern ways epsilon mesh which is like a like a I get it but to me one of my and I have my other dream wheels and I hate that my dream wheels are black because I hate black no but but to me I agree with you but there's something special about a spoon wheel and flat black a friend of mine christian wong from battlecraft he's one of the huge inspirations to the build and actually helped build the build so I had a lot of my like iconic friends yeah uh ryan rye wire bossery helped wire the car and did that right wire does the best he does the best amir bent to and like christian and this this group that got involved with it but christian has the wheel the the sw 388 the s-tubs are based on the desmond rega master evos right so the rigas white with the black and red around the outer that has that touring car jtcc like oh god that look is so good you know we were talking about on the other pod too it's like the way people tried to go touring car wheels to represent but they didn't recognize that you got a re cut like the fenders to get that to tuck like that and that's the way those btcc cars were made and that's the way all the japanese touring cars were made but i will give it's also the reason why the royals look so good like people don't understand like people's cut so deep into the radius into it and then they go with the fender lineup it it raises the fender line so it's essentially like a modern era body drop i guess you'd say but i would also say like there's people out there like eric cutail gets it you know if you know who he is he's a gltc racer and he did his civic and he's now he's doing it a cord touring car that he just looks so care and he works so hard to make the car not only look good but perform well i think mike burrows from stance works is also another one that like really works on like roll center and like how will this car perform but i want it to look really really good you know and then there's also like if you look at like mad mike i remember like i know that there's there's a there's a set of twins the turbo twins they call them twins turbo they did nine or horsepower supers before they're talking like back in the day yeah yeah yeah they worked with vini 10 and yeah i know vini 10 yeah so they came up through vini 10 but they helped him with his car rod chong was at you know need for speed and speed hunters and he helped sponsor mike to first come here for fd and the twins were new to drifting and mike was like these are what i want these big fat 20 inch johnny's on my fd you know and he's drifting and they're like these wheels don't work man you know they're not right for this car and he goes i don't care figure out a way to make him work he's like the look has to be has to be right and to me i'm like maybe that kind of goes like i like a mike burrows a little bit better than a mad mike you know that's like more like it has to absolutely perform but also look sick as fuck you know so yeah you talk about wheel sizes and everything if we get into like you know the the wheels so you know my my my spoons are also you know a set of those but i think you also get into like and this is where it's such a difficult conversation and i don't know what's the application what car you make it like i love i love superadvan sa3r's because those were the wheels that were on you know knob ton of gucci's s15 but would those wheels look good on something else i also like when people take them out of the box vini vini put t 30 vini put t 37s on his mark 2 golf and the Volkswagen community just vomits every time they see it and it's like you know it's not like a concave te it just doesn't really work on that car no i get it it looks cool in like a motorsport fashion but there are a hundred other wheels i would put on that car first but i would still argue that the t 37 is one of the top five type five wheels in the motorsports arena i will too but also i'm like at the same time i think meisters actually look better which is a weird thing to say like the te is just like but then what's crazy i like workmeisters but the ssr sp1 professors not quite as good because the way the spokes meet the barrel it's there's the weird little things that you could get so right and so wrong i had i'm not ashamed to admit it hre 504s would hre purchased the name from hayashi racing enterprises and became right it was the hre that we knew today it was the precursor to that and they had the fake plastic cap and the wheel cover and they were want to be bbs rs's and i thought they were so cool until i saw a set of bbs rs's and then i was like yeah i done i done fucked up you know i i i'm i'm i'm faking the fuck which the other thing that i want to get into in the book and i'm i'm digging into it now it's the world of reps you know it's like back in the day it was like you you had to be authentic with everything be it body kits or wheels or turbos or and nowadays it's something like i can go to alibaba and get the same wheel or a company will make a wheel that is inspired by a iconic you know design and yet they're blatantly ripping it off you know i'm not going to name names but you know name yeah i mean it's funny though because it's out of you got me blacklisted from hop sames that's a super deep cut if you i know you have to be the only one that knows it wow okay they asked me to name names name the names we use that cut in the last uh in the last episode oh really yeah because we kept saying like like i don't know why but with john chase he just kept saying like i don't want to name names don't name names don't name names don't name names so we use the like she names names anyway well it's getting hot in here it sure is we have no air conditioning in the studio yeah we have no air conditioning in the studio and we were on a doubleheader because obviously he was here for firing order as well so we're getting a little exhausted you have any last you have any last things to add no we wrap this out it's been good catching up it's been great catching up it's been good to hang now what i brought to a podcast is a nice format for this yeah that's gonna be something that you know i it'll be tough to replicate with with other people no it takes a certain brain type yeah it takes a certain brain type yeah um yeah no just excited to still be like i appreciate you know you told me a lot of people wanted me to come on so i do really honestly like appreciate that i you know people miss your brain i don't know if they miss your face but they certainly miss your brain i have a face made for a podcast with no video component no i i i something that you brought to hoonigan was that encyclopedic knowledge on things that i think people loved our conversations because we would often fight about a lot of stuff which is weird because i don't think we got into too much of an argument on firing order between so i'm gonna have to have you back on something that i feel like i'm more in a position to fight with you about i was that's what i gotta be honest i was i would never go on the driver's car with with you and ron and then because you guys have driven more cars yeah i mean you have more that that error too is like i have a lot of you are right in there yeah and and you guys had that depth of knowledge that i would be and i'm out of my i'm out of my wheelhouse so to speak um today i was a little it flipped the script on me a little bit because i'm like i'm not in a position to see scott oh it is like weakest you know when we did that firing order so i was like dang i wanted to like when i said when i said tommy car i looked at both of you and i'm like well clearly that was not a good choice yeah we were we were trying to resist you guys are being nice you know if you haven't seen it go watch it and and mickey and i were like yeah that's a that's a choice you know it's adorable when you try brian you know so you know next time maybe try coloring inside the lines but you know what that was pretty too we're gonna put that on the refrigerator you know so fine again grand tourism shaped me so you know so no it's nice to see you still doing the thing and i'm sure and i'm hopeful that our paths will cross again on a personal slash professional level very least go for a drive i mean i would like to do more print stuff it's something again i said it multiple times huge on my list i just think well this is great and i enjoy uh the long form element of podcasts um i really just miss things that don't feel disposable 100 people will watch this and then they will stop watching it right the other day ashley asked me to clean out all my books because i have like a huge stack of books i'm just bringing them to the farm okay because we need room for hudson's toys in like a little section and uh i was just i pulled out all these books and it's like i got to like re-experience all these books over the past you know whatever however many years from like calvin wand's drifting handbook oh my god like love you calvin's antonio's book on drifting oh the book on drifting yeah and then you know and then just like collections of like you know you know 9-11 books and outie books and like you know the practical guide to building a race car and like all those kind of things and it's like there's just something about sitting there undisturbed not distracted flipping through print that i have grown so nostalgic from and i i've had i have been you know i'm not really a big uh person to say like i feel blessed but i i i feel blessed to have done or privileged to have done all the fucking cool things i've done but hands down 060 was the best like hoonigan probably had a much bigger not probably hoonigan had a much bigger impact yeah in the community as a whole than 0 to 60 did um and i built amazing friendships through it it put it gave me access to do all this really cool stuff i had an amazing time with ken uh it was super fun to do all the jim kana films it was super fun to work with all of you guys but there was something about getting this first stack of magazines when they would show up at the office after like you'd gotten you know the the first product you know like the not the blue lines but like the first samples they would send you like the four yeah before they went to like full print and you would like just sit there and i remember they would come in and we would all sit in the office and just everybody would just quietly look through and enjoy it yeah and it's like i upload something now i never watch it again i upload jim kana and i don't watch it again like it's up there and it's just there it's like we're like there was something about that and that just makes me want like i don't think that the the previous magazine format is sustainable anymore but i do think that the book format is sustainable you know you look at i think there's something about triple zero and and rodder's journal and surfer's journal and all that i think that there's something there for that quarterly that really coffee table magazine esk that i think is is very good i will tell you this um when you talk about you used to read me when i was in super street i looked at zero to sixty and to me the highest compliment i pay to people is when i i'm mad at what they did when i could when i look at it i'm like fuck that guy sure why can't super street look like that i challenged my art i every i'd slam that book on the table look at the paper quality look at the quality of the writing look at that hunter s thompson esk zero that is that that's a company i was like here you i'd because he was such my so to me too and i i read how everything we did it oh yeah you know the way that you write with that abandon like that to me it's like our adhd minds you know it's like you're writing on acid and you're just taking us on that journey and to me i was like fuck this is like the type of shit but we you know we were too far you know we were too far gone at super street you know it's like we were down that path and we it was so i tried so hard to like bend it back and i could that's one of my regrets and i still want to revisit print even down to like some punk zine influences and so like big one just i want to do i think one of the things that people aren't even doing youtube right is i want weird random like inserts and i just want you know it's like so so because i don't think anyone's doing a youtube show the way it should be done even when i did the tv show i would do just random i i just said film me eating a peanut butter and jelly sandwich like you know i just and it would just be a cutaway of just like just defeated by this project car you know okay so two things one i think we should try to do a magazine together even if it's just a zine you know i don't love that if there are two people in this business who are set to do this it's the two of us would love we need to bring some quality you know photography in which is pretty easy we know some people um i definitely think that that would be something fun we've talked we teased about it because at hoonigan we talked about doing a mag but i think i think we should try to do that now i'm in the process i'm working on a i'm working on a potential ken block book which is like based around 43 stories um and then i'm also um working on a book actually for bbi right now about development that they're doing on the type 99 evo project yes um and then i've got a couple other things and they're all like sort of in the works but so the first one is i definitely think we should have that conversation we could continue it off off podcast but the other one is the other part that you said so i wrote this concept the other night i'm just going to throw it out there we'll see what people say and i actually think there would be i think you would be great to help me with this project because i want to make a video magazine for youtube i know already that it won't work meaning because of the way the algorithm is built it like doesn't service the thumbnail but like i just don't care maybe i'll just make one we'll see how it does but like in basically like an hour variety show where it is like hey it's i just drove the brz like here's three minutes of it right here's a rambling on this hey i ran into this person i interviewed them about this like hey i went to this event and here's some stuff from this event um someone asked me this random question here's an old story right and and like just a just like this weird variety show that's like all fucking over the place very zine style aesthetic to it and here's why what i miss the most about magazines isn't the individual pieces it's curating the whole and i feel like we really have lost that on youtube meaning like you got to curate a whole issue like you got to say hey in this issue it's a recipe it's a recipe you're building a recipe for a meal we need a little bit of this a little bit of that the front of the book needs to do this we need to do this right now we even talk about it what you serve up to your audience it's basically like it's basically like a chow line and you slap it on and you throw the plate across and that's what you're serving to the audience right now and as much as we joke about how just like absolutely adhd you like add old and out of control all my podcasts are i think that there's an audience that's enjoying it because like you don't know what you're getting no it's a little bit of a journey and we don't know where we're taking it we don't know i don't know i i it's we're two and a half hours in i don't know how we're gonna land this plane but like there's something fun about like curating this journey for someone and i remember like when when i read the first maxim magazine i was i was it was it was same same remove the girls and the boobs yes that's not what made that make no nice to have the humor and the and the diversions and all the pieces and like i just read a six page article about colonoscopies i would never have done that exactly the way maxim could present it everything from the writing to lay out the presentation to the curation of everything that but and the different entry points even though you didn't know what you were gonna get you did know that it's gonna include a little bit of information a little bit of personal growth a little bit of humor a little bit and you had those little segments just like every time you you know like i'm really going back like the variety show you're talking about like a carol brunette or something you know that this skit's gonna do this in living color it's gonna do we just talked about a little bit of this a little bit of that there's gonna be this one that one there's gonna be everyone together the guest star saturday night it may not all be great but some of it's gonna be pretty exactly exactly so you kind of know what you're gonna get but that like we have now moved into single topic everything short form yep right it's like i can only like when did we as humans get to a point where it's like all i can consume is one idea at a time and also that idea has to be greater than the idea and then my creation is this random creation created by robots that's the algorithm of what i see in my feed it's telling you what you want rather than you're expressing creators who don't have a common thread who don't have a aesthetic that like you know speaks through it all and that i i missed a tangible piece of magazines but my god i miss like feeling like a new issue shows up and i get to dive into it like like you know like it was like oh like this like i want to read everything from the editor's letter all the way to and like at zero to sixty we would hide stuff i would at the bottom of the mast head oh yep i would add a little extra stuff because like i wanted this experience where like i know what it felt like to get to the end of a magazine and be like oh should i read all of it like i remember getting on flights and like reading all of vanity fair because there's a fucking excellently read magazine and when i was a kid i thought it was a magazine made for women i didn't realize it was a magazine meant for like made for great reading exactly and it's like it was like this was something that was like and i i so enjoyed that and if you and again i think we tried to curate it across channels but it was harder it was just so much harder because it curated a content calendar yeah that had a mix of everything but at least in terms of episode it everything had a singular arc single it was all single serving i will also like counter your vanity fair reference i'm going to go way back this is this is one for your for your kid back when you read harper's bizarre this is no this is uh richard scary did you ever do you remember richard scary books do you know what i'm talking about but i don't know but it's like a view of the city and it'll show how the sewer works and it's a but you have to like it's almost like a wears waldo type thing but every single time you look at it again you're like i just discovered something new that i didn't that i didn't know about that before and that's i love that when people put stuff i we used to put stuff spying quotes on the on the side i did one that was all in wingdings like wingdings font and it said if you could read this you need to get a life and someone actually read it and figured it out and literally there's no way you could do this you had to like literally go on your you know go into wingdings and go and actually go backwards and go backwards in every letter to figure it out and to figure it out and someone actually figured it out we did it i did a backwards issue for april fools day in 2004 like a jdm issue not even thinking that but the way you read you know you'd read here and then you'd have to jump over there read there i did the entire issue backwards someone no one there was no barely any email someone sent me a letter or i think it was an email it said you i got your new issue but it's but it's like backwards it's hard to describe i'm like what do you mean they don't like they got like printed yeah i'm like what do you mean backwards i'm like are you sure did you check all the issues at the newsstand i'm like please go back and buy another one and he sent me an email a week later it said i bought another one it's like that too i'm like two sales i just made two sales and it did so well we we had to poly bag it because we already had a poly bag plan for that issue and i'm like that's our april fools day issue we i did a backwards i mean that's that's the links that i could go to but i would do like i would really one of the most one of the most brilliant things i saw was when i was at mass appeal magazine you know which was y'all yeah culture mag vice was our competitor and this was before vice became the vice that yeah became this this juggernaut it was actually at the time we were probably bigger than vice and we had beef with them right yeah i can see that our beef was that they were a bunch of canadiens trying to write about new york yep like culture yep and we were a bunch of new yorkers who were writing about new york culture right and um so we used to take jabs at each other right and we would take jabs at each other and uh and they even got to the point where like things almost got like like we would run into people at like at parties it was like not cool right it was like full mag beef and they fucking killed us because they made an entire issue of vice designed like mass appeal they basically just ripped our magazine off like there's like all of our sections they basically just made an issue of mass appeal and called it vice but then just clown it was so good it was so good it was so like the amount of effort that they did to go through that i thought was fucking great and i i just loved it i was like it was so well done so i don't know if you remember but at one point dve did this did like their version of this versus that do you remember that do you remember what we did no we took there we took there they made this first that we were like this is our show yeah like you literally came on our show and then you you're ripping it off but nothing but love today yeah but like they came on our show i remember that and like made like a version but like oh ours is different because it has super cars i'm like you're on our show with your super car but he was like yeah we made our own show so we didn't say anything we just we just took their episode downloaded it and then put all of the this versus that fought work on it and re-uploaded to bonus channel so it was their episode but recut with all of this versus that graphics package that's pretty good which was like our like yeah that's your vice bass here basically made our show a little inspired by them so anyway i think it's time to maybe end this one but this has actually become a bit of a theme nick where at the end we make grand promises to do big business ventures with people whether it's like making movies making magazines so you're making a movie and now you're gonna make a magazine with me yeah magazines pretty it's not easy but it's a little bit easier than making the movie so yeah yeah all right if you're still listening if you're still deep in you want nats and i to make a magazine just let us know below if there's a like if i don't know how many comments do we need is that way they're supposed to comment i don't know i don't know the podcasting world do you comment below it depends on where they're listening smash that like button or do like okay it depends on where they're listening yeah the comments comment in the comment section send us a dm i don't know if there's like more than 10 comments maybe we should make a magazine okay there it is 10 comments that's where it is so nats thank you for coming on i'm definitely gonna have you back on firing order so you know i'd love it yeah let's think of another good talk that's sorry that's not that show sorry what were you gonna say that's a wrap no we don't you could do it you know no one's done it bring us that's a wrap finish it up but step back a little bit so you don't blow people's okay okay that's a wrap thank you everybody what what what what what what we're not accepting any messages this is time goodbye goodbye viper industrial makes the best damn shopstools ever go buy them okay now that we've got that out of the way i want to take a moment to really thank viper they were the first to hop on and support very vehicular when i hit him up the immediate response was yes we want the biggest package you've got that's why they're the title sponsor look they make a really great product and i felt that way before this partnership but they also do a really good job of supporting all of us in the car community think about it they work with adam elze chris forzberg grand anderson travis pastrana from sports car and those are just the ones i can remember right now so viper thank you again as i was saying before go buy a damn stool at viperindustrial.com that's viper with a why of all the sunglass companies out there you might ask why heatwave aside from them being friends of mine they just make great shades awesome styles cool collabs smart tech they even have extra large sizes for big heads like me and for those of you wearing this on the job they make ancy z87 spec safety glasses too but what really attracts me to heatwave is that they are physically a part of our culture you will find them everywhere from king of the hammers to formula drift you'll see everyone wearing heatwaves at your local track day event damn you might even turn laps with the co-founder justin because they're one of us so one more reason to choose heatwave visual to fix your face i'm a tool dork my obsession might even dwarf my addiction to cars i love collecting unique and specialty tools which is how i initially fell in love with wearer first off they just make aesthetically pleasing tools you feel good in your hand they have a great finish their sizes are universally color-coded and they are super strong in two decades i've never broken a tool from wearer i wish i could say the same about my other tools but the thing i like the most about wearer is that they create clever solutions for your wrenching woes because you need over-engineered tools to work on today's over-engineered cars so if you're ready to step up your tool game whether it's the zyclop ratchet or the joker wrenches find them at wearer tools dot com you