Sara Haines On Speaking Up for Epstein Victims, Honoring Catherine O’Hara, & How Parenting Is Humbling

When you want your family's staycation to feel like and you're confirmed connecting rooms to feel like and you're a hotel bed to feel like Oh and room service to feel like Choose Hilton because at Hilton, hospitality feels like Good morning. Enjoy your breakfast It matters where you stay. Booknowedhilton.com Hilton for the stay Did you understand that's Octopus Bet thing I sent you? I didn't understand it but I'm beginning to think our phones have been infiltrated. Well I'm betting it for sure. I'm going to place a bet for you if you want also. It's basically an Octopus Bet is a rare Super Bowl or Super Bowl prop. So basically the bet is that somebody will score a touchdown and then that same player, instead of kicking an extra point, they'll go for two. Oh. So I'm going to score the go for two point attempt scoring eight points, eight being octopus. Octopus. So I feel like with all the octopus in the air we have to bet the octopus. I'm really happy with the creativity. Yeah, I think so too. That they went for on that. So you and I should bet the octopus. I think we should. Yeah, there's a great chance. I think there's a decent chance. I think so. Given everything that's been happening, I feel like we're betting the octopus. Yeah, say for it. Octopus. Octopus. All right. Welcome. It is Wednesday, February 4th. I'm here with Sarah Haynes. Hello, Sarah. Hello, Brian. You are decked out for the Super Bowl here. This is a. Yes. You always get the cutest clothes for the Super Bowl. Yes, we do. And you were in Seahawks now. Was this a choice you made? So in my mind, I know statistically the Seahawks are, you know, most likely favorite win, but I tend to like an underdog and I feel like the New England Patriots are just that team. They're like the one everyone. They always go the Super Bowl. Well, here's the thing. Yes. So are they really an underdog given that they always win and they always go to the Super Bowl? They've had a couple of years off. I got a, I got a really, I apparently upset a lot of listeners by my, I made some comments on the show about not liking the Patriots. I think I'm out of said. I hate the Patriots. Many. Well, I don't have that many strong feelings. So don't get mad at me. I just are producing a summer's mother felt very upset about this. Thanks for listening by the way. Super aggressive there are wouldn't go that far. I kind of hate them, but I also like a change in colors in the wardrobe. Yeah, no, okay. Well, so do you like, I mean style wise, you like to see a lot of Seattle could use a win, I think. Yeah, and are honestly Ashley who does our style with Fran are clothes, her husband's from there. And this is a pivotal moment in their household and knowing how big that is when a family follows the team. We could say I'm also doing this for Ashley. All right. So there we go. You're doing it for Ashley. I'm doing it for Ashley. Will you watch the Super Bowl? Well, I will be at a Super Bowl party. You will. Okay. Yes. I go, this is our third year going to the same party and we have the best time we see all our friends. I make an effort to watch commercials and have time and check in on the score. It's not it. I don't hate football, but it is to me, a Super Bowl is so overwhelming, especially at a party. Yeah. That the game is more just to keep one eye on it, type of thing. So I'm not like dialed in. I have a lot of bets. So I'll have like spread. Octopus. Octopus bet will be there for sure. Everyone at home who's listening, who's willing, you know, follow the octopus. Follow the octopus. But I think it'll be I think it'll be fun. I go to a buddy's house every year for the Super Bowl. My daughter has a performance on Super Bowl Sunday, which is. So what are you going to do? I'm trying to figure out how I can both go to the performance and then then make it to the Super Bowl. It's a three o'clock performance. Oh, you should be fine. Yeah, it's like 45 minutes away from my house, but it's fine. It's going to be great. Details. She's going little women and she was phenomenal. I've seen her already. It's pretty perform and it's unbelievable. I'm very proud of her. But anyway, so that's my Super Bowl Sunday, but I'm excited. I'm excited. So you are cheering for the Seahawks as well. I haven't placed all of my bets yet. I've placed five or so. I'm going to ask you where your money is because you have a thing. My money will be where my heart is. Okay. Oh, you follow your heart. I tried to. I tried it. But the I listen, I'm a I'm a Giants fan. The Giants are the only team to beat Tom Brady twice in the Super Bowl. They were amazing. And you know, I have some anti Patriots feelings from those days. So I'll probably be rooting for the Seahawks. Okay. Okay. All right. So consider that a bet. Okay. Thank you. And you know, you as a close friend of Michael Strahan, I feel like she. You have to like by loyalty be a Giants fan. I also have new friends that are really intertwined with the Jets. Oh, I'm sorry. You're talking about that. Yeah. Oh, sorry for that. We have a no. We believe a team needs fans when they're not doing well more than when they're doing well. It's easy to be a fan when they're winning. It's much harder and much more a litmus test for loyalty when they're not winning. I don't disagree, but as a mother who cares about their children, do not raise Jets fans. It's no. I actually am so proud of Alex. So when he first met this family that I'm talking about, he's a chief's fan because my were my nephew and niece who I adore were raised in Kansas. So they're a die hard original chief's fans, pre-tailor swift. They are chief's fans. They literally like have season tickets. They go. We've been a chief's family. He says to the family, you know, kids speak honestly. They're like, do you like football? We knew they were a Jets family and he goes, yeah, I root for the chiefs. So we go to a game and he's like, mom, is it rude to root for the chiefs? They said, when you're in the general manager's box, you don't root for anyone but that team. And so he took that so seriously, he became a fan and we have a lot of talks about they need you to scream louder when they're not doing well. I respect that. I do. That being said, being a Jets fan is heartbreak. You don't understand. You'll see. Until it isn't. It's been a long, long time. All right. All right. Super Bowl three was the last time it paid off. All right. Switching gears to something more serious and something we've been talking about a lot and something I think will continue to talk about a lot no matter how many distractions are provided in front of us. The Epstein files continue to be a hot topic with us and you've been very passionate about supporting these victims. Today, you really had a message for the president that it's not about you. He is questioned about it all the time and let's not kid ourselves. People who don't like the president are hoping to tie him to these files. But there is something more broader here that is important. Tell us about that. Well, if you truly care about all these victims and not just the victims of Epstein, but honestly, since the beginning of time, people have been silenced by powerful people that have money. I hate to pin it all on men, but it usually is men. So powerful men have ruled the world for a long time and rarely been held accountable in these sorts of circles. Epstein is not only these victims to me, it's all victims of these sorts of things. And these are the most vulnerable young people and being preyed upon. Being preyed upon. And like you look at how changed an abused person is and you can't make them whole again. They will thrive. They will survive. But the least you can do is hear them out and hold people accountable. To me, I'm not looking. I have no skin in the game on who's in these files or how far into the files they are. Meaning you have to approach all of this information with nuance. There are going to be people that are associated purely because this was a wealthy finance year. You have to have your head on straight and not be biased about what that is. And that means when the Clintons are called and they decide to go in that we all support that because if you have nothing to hide, talk about it. Right. Shed light on this situation because I do believe Epstein was not only a voracious sexual predator of young people, he was also a power broker of blackmailing. So I do believe some of the tendencies of headlines to say, oh, maybe this person did this. I always go in with a grain of salt that he was also manipulative. Put it all in the daylight because it's in the dark that the victim suffer the most. And this is the least you can give these people when abuse has already been done is some form of justice. And I hate all the talk being revolving around the men because the men aren't the issue here the victims are one of the frustrating things is when you read these, some of these emails are the only thing redacted is the person that sent them and they're horrible to read and they're disgusting to read. And you see the redacted name as the the the sender and you just who are they protecting there? I don't understand that. Well, I don't believe there's this trove of predators necessarily. I believe Jeffrey Epstein is the key one. There's going to be offenders in his circle. But the part that gets me the most is the complicit world in which he was allowed to survive because people needed his money. They needed his money. They needed his clout. They needed his parties. And you can be a judge for yourself because these aren't articles being written about things. They are emails being released. Everyone has to judge for themselves with the contact. With the email says yes. 100%. And you want to read more or not less because I I'm not someone that's jumping to. Oh my God, your name's in there. I believe so many people we know will be in there. It's to what level and what are they saying? What are they saying? About them. Because remember this man, there was an article killed in 2002 about two teenage sisters with their mom on record about Jeffrey Epstein by 2008. He has been prosecuted. He is a sexual predator. Now we're talking about people that are like, oh, I haven't run in his circle since 2016. I'm sorry, but how many sexual predators do you run around with and consort with and do all these things? People need to explain themselves. Well, and I have to say that President Trump has long denied any wrongdoing in the connection to Epstein and said that the latest release absolves him. 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That's abcsecretsavings.com slash BTT to get yours today for just $29. ABCsecretsavings.com slash BTT. From 30 for 30 podcasts. Ryan Pata, Senior Defensive Lime and From Miami. Gunned down. The key to this case, it's Brian. Oh, it's a wrap man. A hour before he died, he was on a phone arguing what's about this might be a hit. You want the truth? They just want a conviction. Press your wrist. We had a killer mockstus. Murderer at the U. Listen now. 9-1-1, where is the emergency? It's the middle of the night in a small town on the Jersey Shore. Someone reports an abandoned car on a bridge. A search gets underway for the missing driver, 19-year-old Sarah Stern. Is it a missing person? Is it a suicide? At this point nobody knows. Old friendships, buried cash, and a sinister plot that was once pitched as a movie plays out in real life. I'm Juju Chang from 2020 and ABC Audio. Listen now to Bridge of Lies, wherever you get your podcasts. All right, I know you are heartbroken to hear about this. I was too. Catherine O'Hara passed away. This is someone who you've met several times and you were a tremendous fan of. I was a tremendous fan. I've never got a chance to meet her. I'm sorry, I never will. She was supposed to be here with the studio cast last year and had a cancellation. Tell me a little bit about why she was so important to you and what it was like to spend time with her. Well, first of all, we always hear about celebrities passing and it always hits you because it's that changing of chapters. People are aging, they're dying and they offer so many people. But so many people offered amazing music, movie, you name it. This one hit me in a unique spot because Catherine O'Hara, like, brought so many characters to the world. Recently, an iconic Moira from Shits Creek. But beyond that, I always watched the best in show. All those because she loved comedy so much that oftentimes she wasn't just in a big blockbuster like Home Alone where her most famous line is, Cafe. It was her real craft. She was an improvisational actress on a level that we honestly have a handful of people. I made a genius. I'm really a genius. And in the times I met her, I'm one of those people that I don't need to meet people because like oftentimes their art is the best parts of them. She was someone that was so normal and it sounds weird saying that. But I remember I was pregnant, I was doing a panel and I was asking questions about her because she was sharing how she met her husband on Beetlejuice. She was in the crew and her boys and she had questions for me. I was this just moderating. I was a big fan. I tried to walk the line of letting her know I thought she was just pure greatness. But also just because I'm in the back room with her doesn't mean she were going to be best friends. You didn't go full Mariska Hargote. No, I did not cry. But I have cried since she passed. I think she was just one of those people that was truly a lover of her art but she said her best role was being a mom. That's how she wanted to be remembered. And when you look at it, there are no words to capture that she, I've always said and I've suffered at times with depression and anxiety. Comedy is life's medicine. You can afford it. It's not, you know, it is safe to take anywhere. It has saved me in my darkest moments. And Catherine O'Harris, one of those people that has treated me to use the medical metaphor over and over and over and over again. And she will. Live that legacy. I will teach my children about her. She is a gem of a human and that is the only thing that competes with her skills. And it's funny. I mean, generationally important to my kids and me and everything else. And my parents loved her. Like it's really something. So coincidentally this weekend or the weekend when she passed was this last weekend. The kids wanted to see their, they had a friend over who was talking about beetle juice. Yeah. And I hadn't seen it in a while. I thought, oh, that's a good one. So we turned it on. I didn't have the heart to tell them she'd just passed because they jumped right away. And they're like, that's the mom from home. Home alone. Yeah. And like Max and I made eye contact. And I thought, I just don't want to have this conversation right now. So I let it go. But there, I'm going to unveil the portfolio as if she's a family member because I, I do believe the way she graced this earth and this lifetime for so many is just really. Did they like beetles? They did. My daughters love it. And also the musical, of course, because they're musical. Alex, Caleb's nightmares came though because he started to say he didn't even know the word ghost before beetle juice. I don't think. Yeah. I was going to say it's not entirely without being scary. No, so he started to say there's a cloud and there's a ghost. And I thought ding, ding, ding, that's my fault. But I refused to admit it because for those who are joining us in progress, there's been some nightmares at home. Oh, sorry. Yeah. Caleb sleeping with me face to face every night because my hair scares him. But when I didn't want to tell Max, I thought it was beetle juice because I've been holding him accountable for Lord of the Rings. Oh. And golem, which haunted our first child. Sure. And then E.T., I blame you for. Right. And then this one is mine, but I'm just not drawing attention because I didn't think Max put it together yet. So Lord of the Rings just got re-released in theaters. So I was going to make my kids go. Oh my god. We actually are an obsessive Lord of the Rings family. Thank God for Max because as Alec was scared by it and learned to embrace it, I embraced it. Really? Because I love Andy Circus. Oh, I know that. I really loved the series. I now see the brilliance of it. Mm-hmm. That's really great. All right. So for people who don't know, if you don't mind talking about it, tell us a little bit about what's going on with the nightmares and how this is because you've been going through it. You know, so it's just a reminder that you, like parenting, is just a humbling experience because Max and I have always said we're not going to let kids sleep with us. Even though my parents, if you got to the bed first with my parents, you could get in. Right. But another child was in there. The rule was you had to go back to bed. With, again, mental health and everything, sleep is pivotal and Max is not a good sleeper. So we never let them in the bed other than snuggling and then they're out. Alec came to us and he's had a lot of problem sleeping at night, lots of scary moments. So we had eventually adopted you can sleep in your sleeping bag next to us. So he's been in our room for well over a month. Caleb, post-beautlejuice, started coming in and talking about ghosts and what he was seeing. And I'd go into the room. We swapped nights. We were going in sleeping with him in a bunk bed and then it wasn't close enough. Then I couldn't roll over. My hair was scaring him. So now we've decided that Max has to go to the back room. Caleb can sleep with me, but only if it's just the two of us. Alec's still on the floor and Sanders, like I'm not going to be in here by myself. Right. So now she's in a sleeping bag. So we just have this family tent one bedroom studio life right now. So have you given any thought to just doing the whole fervor thing and just letting him be miserable and scared? Sir, this is the hard part. So I was very firm in the beginning and we would walk back and walk back. Yeah, I don't tend that's easy. It's very long. But it was beyond the hard, because there is a handbook, there's a moment where you're like, wait, my child's petrified and that's tracks for Alec. Caleb is not, he's going to be my horror film person. He doesn't get scared. So you almost have to look at it case by case. The fear and the almost trauma in his night terrors. I'm like, how do you, it makes me guilty now that I yelled it, not yelled at him at the beginning. I was mad. I was like, we can't do this. Like why are we doing this? And then I embraced it because I was like that soft mom part of me was like, what am I doing? No matter what you choose, you feel like a total failure. No, it's really hard. I mean, I went through a version of this with my daughter and she was younger, I think. But we just, we let her cry it out, even at an older age when she was, but she did get through it. So Alec has this recurring, not nightmare, but conscious thought he's very aware of our mortality, Max and I. So he starts talking a lot about when we die on just the two of us. Just going to do that for sure. That's like the whole thing. Don't bring it up because in case, yeah, Max hears about that. But he was worried about it. And someone explained to me, when a child is really obsessed about you dying, it's actually like a separation anxiety. Yeah. And again, this all tracks, you know, you say the kids develop a way of probably a pro. And this way for a long time. Kayla being this terrified is actually makes me feel like soft is the better approach right now. But then like the woman that takes care of them when I'm not there made a comment the other day. She was like, we can't give into this. And she didn't mean it that way. But you walk away thinking, I can't make a right decision to save my life. No, I know. Like, do you let them in? Do you not? Are you awful if they're scared and they go away? My husband can't sleep in the room. Like, I don't know what to do. So we're kind of, I'm paying for that in spades right now. Yes. I say you're soft and you break up. And I'm really a bad cop. Yeah. It's just that one little part. One thing that my, I tell you I told you, it's my younger daughter loves to listen to audiobooks at night. Yeah. And that might help. I don't know if that. But some of the patients at night, little sleep cats. But something that like when they wake up kind of takes them away from their being scared and or even mates, their subconscious a little bit go on a story. Well, so she's listening to the Harry Potter books and they're like 700, they're like 700 pages long. So she falls asleep in chapter three. It goes on till they're still going when she wakes up and it's chapter 25. And hopefully it's not the forbidden far. There's something about rainbows and bunnies. There might be. I mean, there might be something or sports. Sure. You know, as bad as it. It's a T scared them too. I'm sorry. Because they were scared of E T and E T's the good one. Yeah, no, but they're scary parts of E T. I know. It's the scientists get scared of the scientists. It's not E T. I know. I'm sorry. We used to sleep with E T. Yes. I can't. All right. I'm sorry. Ouch. Listen, speaking of Lord of the Rings, you know that Martin Freeman who played Bilbo and Andy Circus who played Gollum were both in Black Panther. I didn't know that. They were the Tolkien White guys. That's a nerd joke. He's here with you, guys. Try the Ville. Okay. There's like four people that would get that joke. No, that's hilarious. Tolkien White, guys. Oh, my God. Thank you. All right. We had a baby shower yesterday for a mess up. And your advice to her was to not look at other parents. I thought it was very sweet. And that there's no perfect way to raise kids and that her kids hit the lottery. It was very, very sweet. Why was it important to you to give that message? Because I think as someone who talks about mom life a lot, you'll probably ask that question a lot. What kind of advice would you give? Well, first of all, I can say that this baby won the lottery because I know Alyssa and Justin. Yeah. You know, any time you just have good people and because they struggled, I always give extra credit to people who fight to be parents. I feel like we've been on this journey with her. Honestly. I know. As a show and as the audience and everything else. Yeah. And to watch so, you know, whether it's fertility, whether it's a gay couple, whether when you see people go after having a baby, I have a deep love for that child of how much they were wanted. Like, I can't imagine giving a child more than letting them know that. Beyond that, I think even now I'm sitting here talking about night tears and comparing myself to the right and wrong and the journey's long and you never master it. And in the beginning, that was really hard for me to see because you project your own fears, which was, I'm not capable. I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how to make a decision. I have no instincts. And what I realized was you can't look at anyone else. It's the fastest way to pile on to tear yourself down and parenting is not only a mental journey. It's a physical journey in the beginning. Yeah. You know, and so I think the big thing is there's no preference for that. Yeah. To remind her. Now, it's going to look like that in every picture. And I will tell you the backstory on every picture. So you know that there's literally no one that knows what they're doing. Speaking of advice, Gabrielle Union gave advice to listen to today too. And she said there's no such thing as a work life balance. I think you agree with that, right? Yeah. I mean, that's kind of, well, it's just still the biggest thing is you do have to always have a North Star. One, one always wins out. And at the end of the day, my family will always be the deeper meaningful part of my life. And everything has to curve that way ultimately, but it doesn't balance. Sometimes they'll work balances you. So that's the brilliance. You don't have a balance between the two roles. But for me, I needed the balance of work to make me a better parent. So there is balance involved. It's just not about equality and equal time and all that stuff. Absolutely. Yeah, I thought it was great. And I've had these conversations to listen to because she's going to go on maternity to leave. And she's nervous about, like, well, when should I come back? When should you do? And she's like in her mind, like, I'm going to come back the first second I can and everything else. And I just keep saying, that's great. And we want you back. But maybe just feel it out. And she has to. So I tell her, I say, take one, you don't know because right now you're in that spinning phase of waiting when you don't know anything else. Because you came back very quickly. Well, for the last one, it was kind of a necessary choice. But when I look at, I said to Alyssa, listen to yourself. Because it can be amazing. And I know people that cried when they came back from maternity leave. I remember feeling awful because I didn't cry. I needed to come back. Sure. So I said to her, like, don't try to put this in a compartment. Be present and listen. Because if you're one of those people that is feeding off that time and truly loves it and cherishes it and wants it, then take your time. I was just one of those people that struggled and was looking for order and control. And I couldn't, that's not going to show up when you have an infant. No, you like having a call time and something that pays to be in. I needed a little regularity to allow myself to be present for my babies. Right. So I, you know, I did take three, almost three months, the first two. It was the last one. Caleb, that got a little slided. Mm-hmm. He's doing okay. Except we sleep face to face because he's scared of my hair. I mean, there are mornings. I'm not going to lie. I bet it was the maternity leave. I'm not going to lie. There are mornings in the hot topics meeting where I'm a little scared of your hair. But wait, this is the best part. No, he knows how frustrated I am. So he like, Tyce, he goes, I don't get you all over your hair. Scary. All right. Cute as little voice just in my ear. What does he think it's going to do? Is it like Medusa hair? No, it's that he needs you even closer. He needs your face. So it's not that your hair is feeling the wrong with your hair. It's not the hair. It's that your hair is not going to grab it. It doesn't have the face because he's seeing a face coming out of a cloud. Yeah. So he needs my face. And sometimes he needs. There's that scene. There's that scene in Beetlejuice, not the blame Beetlejuice. But there's that scene where you don't see his face and you see this. Oh, it goes. You want to see her in the air? Yeah. That could be your hair. It's your fault. I'm really worried. I did this. All right. Well, this weekend show them saw and everything will be fine. Yeah. All right. That's all the time we have for today. Very excited to spend time with you as always. Thank you for joining me. Tomorrow, I'll be back with Sunny Hauston. We'll have a brand new view and we'll see you then.