Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to progressive and save hundreds. Because progressive offers discounts for paying in full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help when you need it so your dollar goes a long way. Visit progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance. For casualty insurance company and affiliates, potential savings will vary, not available in all states or situations. Here I am, sitting on a stoop. Stoop kids afraid to leave or stoop. Everyone today, you are invited on a field trip. If there is anyone historic location that Nick Keptiche has seen more than any other, it is probably this one. Except he had never been there before. Now if you've ever spoken to Nick about the Revolutionary War era or about movies or about William Daniels or really for any length of time or if you've listened to more than just a few episodes of Civics 101, you have probably heard him mention this one film. If I had a switch, Hannah, that could turn off my love for the musical 1776, I'd flip it, but I don't have that switch. Do I? No, no, no. Anyways. Nick and I were in Philadelphia for a conference and we had spent days and days talking about American democracy, about the origin story of this nation. So Nick and I get to the last afternoon of that conference and I said, hey, what if we visited the very place where everything ended and everything began? And what if you explained that story via your favorite movie of all time, Nick? It was not a hard sell. So here we are, Independence Hall, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, where many of the delegates of the Second Continental Congress signed the Declaration of Independence on August 2, 1776. You are also invited into the mind of Nick Capodice, how this movie and this story took hold of him and what it means to him right now. This is Civics 101. I'm Hannah McCarthy and Nick Capodice is beside himself. This is the most excited I've been at. I've never been here before. You've never been? Never been here. Never been. I've been to a museum of medical oddities but I didn't go here. And it feels like, have you been here before? Never. Oh my God. Okay. What movie did you watch more than any other in your whole life? Princess Bride. Okay, that's a good one. I had that too. So when I was about 10 years old, I was living in New Hampshire. My dad ever since some rough behavior about me not getting to watch the Monkeys episode I wanted to watch. They used to love this TV show. Wait, M-O-N-K-E-E-S? That's right, the TV show, the Monkeys. So anyway, my dad was like, no more TV, that's it. And from that point until I left home, we didn't watch TV. We didn't get any channels. We did have a VCR. What do you mean? What did you do? What did you do when you weren't allowed to watch an episode of the Monkeys? I flipped out when I was told I couldn't watch the Monkeys. And that was the end of it. It was in stages. First it was we can only watch the Cosby show and Family Ties. So then what would happen is, then those got banned and then it was everything spanned. But I went to this friend's house, Christine, dear friend of our family. And she had a tape that said 1776. And I was like, oh, what's this? She said it's a musical about the Declaration of Independence. When a king becomes a tyrant, he thereby breaks the contract binding his subjects to him. Now so. And I borrowed that tape from her every night for like a year. And then for Christmas, she gave me my own tape of it. And there were some years I just watched it every day. I loved it. It's a musical. I thought it was funny. I thought it was great. And I loved the acting. I loved the music. And I have watched it more than any other film in my life. And this is where it was filmed, Independence Hall. But it's also where the Declaration of Independence was signed. Famously. The site of the filming of 1776 and some other thing that happened. So the opening scene of the movie is John Adams is in that tower right there, that bell tower that we can see sort of staring for Lorneley and McNair, Congressional custodian is calling up. He's like, Mr. Adams, you've got to get down. We've got to vote in this Congress. And you know, we have a very important issue. And he's like, I can just imagine. You know, what burning issue are we voting on today? And the big issue, it's not independence, is on whether or not the militia is required to wear matching uniforms. And he storms downstairs. Burst into the Independence Hall and start seeing how useless things are in Philadelphia. This nation will never succeed. I have come to the conclusion. It's never going to happen. And then he says the one thing we have to do is vote yes for independence, to dissolve our allegiance to the British Crown. And the whole movie is about that struggle to get the Declaration of Independence ratified. Written and ratified. This famous song is called Sit Down, John. Vote yes. Down, John. Vote for independence. William Daniels, who a lot of folks might know, is what's the teacher's name in Boy Meets World? Mr. Feeny. Mr. B, why didn't I watch TV, Hannah? Okay, well, Boy Meets World is how I learned the monkeys existed. So everything comes full circle. There's an episode where the monkeys show up. Oh my God. Well, they needed to work after their show was canceled. Yeah, William Daniels plays the irascible stubborn John Adams, who is obnoxious and disliked. And the whole movie is them lurching towards this bizarre concept of independence. Independence, see. Well, someone shut that man up. Never. The villain in the movie. So the protagonist, the hero is John Adams, missing his beloved wife Abigail, who he writes letters to and says how much he loves her. And where's Abigail? She's in Quincy, Massachusetts. I swear it. Abigail is at the farm in Braintree, everybody. Braintree, Massachusetts, where Hannah McCarthy grew up. And now Quincy is the city of presidents. I didn't know that Quincy was the home of the Adamses because in the movie, she says the farm here in Braintree is failing. The chickens and the geese have all died. So John Adams wants independence. Congress says no. Or the Congress is useless. They can't even, there's a big debate about whether they should have the windows open or closed because it's so hot in Philadelphia in that summer. And they can't agree on to open the, because if they open the windows, the flies will all come in. And if they close it, it'll be hot, but it'll keep the flies out. And the point is how inefficacious a Congress is. The line is, John Adams storms in and says, I've come to the conclusion that one useless man is called a disgrace. That two are called a law firm and that three or more become a Congress. And by God, I have had this Congress. For 10 years, King George and his parliament have gulled, collied, and did of these colonies that they're illegal taxes. Stamp acts, Townsend acts, Sugar acts, TX. I'm almost done. And when we've dared stand up like men, they've stopped our trade, seized our ships, blockaded our ports, burnt our towns, and spilt our blood. And still this Congress refuses to grant any of my proposals on independence, even so much as the courtesy of open debate. The president of the second continental Congress was John Hancock. You know him, right? Got a big ol' name. So Fat George in London can read it without his glasses. John Hancock was like in the real world, he was a tea smuggler. His whole family was a bunch of tea smugglers from Boston. But anyway, John Hancock was the president of the Continental Congress. Adams and his crew is trying to get independency passed and they can't do it. And the villain of the movie is John Dickinson from Pennsylvania, who's a loyalist. He was like, have you no love for the country that bore you, for like mother England? Is that all the pride and affection you can muster for the nation that bore you? For the noblest, most civilized nation on the face of this planet? There's only 13 colonies. They only need seven votes to declare independency. And they can't do it because John Adams is obnoxious and disliked. John Dickinson is leading the opposition, saying, no, we shouldn't declare independency. There's only 11 represented colonies at the Congress. Why is that? Georgia hasn't shown up and New Jersey hasn't shown up when this movie opens. So they just need what? What's the majority of 11? Six? Yeah, six votes, but they can't do it. And then Georgia shows up and Georgia is not sure where it wants to stand. Who is that? Dr. Lyman Hall of Georgia. Dr. Lyman Hall of Georgia, he shows up and he doesn't know where to go. He doesn't know where to stand. And Ben Franklin shows up from Pennsylvania. Now then attend as friend of friend our declaration committee. For us I see immortality in Philadelphia city. There's three delegates from Pennsylvania in the movie. John Dickinson, who's anti-independence. Ben Franklin, who has very four independence. Ben Franklin is the second biggest character in the musical, played by Howard De Silva. He's like the best. He's a very good Franklin. I told my dad when I grew up, my dream was to be an actor who played Franklin. It's not too late, Nick. But he was like, what about John Adams? And I was like, nope. And he kept noting that all the roles I wanted to play were rather plump old men. He's like, don't you want to be like Jesus in Jesus Christ, you're a percentile? I was like, no, I'll be Herod. That's who I want to be. But they come upon a plan, which is let someone else in Congress propose, because no one likes John Adams. Richard Henry Lee of Virginia. Richard Henry Lee makes the proposal, and then it's shall we vote yay or nay on the proposal for independence? And at this time, New York never votes yes or no. They abstain courteously. New York abstains courteously, Mr. Morris. Why does New York constantly abstain? So you've got a tied vote, six for independence, six against independence. John Hancock, he's from Massachusetts. He's pro-independence. If they vote, they can get it to pass. As a maneuver, this is actually the part of the movie that I really care about. John Dickinson of Pennsylvania says, any vote for independence has to be unanimous. All 13 colonies have to say we want to be independent. And then it gets to the president, yes or no. And the president says, it has to be unanimous. And why? Why should the vote for independence be unanimous? Because they envision a future in which these individual colonies will be of one nation. Yeah. And even more painful, Hancock says, when John Adams is like, what are you doing? You sunk us. He says, can't you see that any colony that doesn't want to be independent will be forced to fight on the side of England? We'll be setting ourselves brother against brother that our new nation carries on itself the mark of cane. So then they're like, well, if it's got to be unanimous, it's never going to happen. So then John Adams comes up with a stall, total stall. How can we declare independence without having some sort of written declaration? Our purpose is goals, ditto, ditto, et cetera, et cetera. He's totally stalling. And he says, well, we need to get the approval of France or Spain. And such a document would remain consistent with European delicacy. So they agreed to write a declaration. Now, who's going to write it? So the committee of, let's see, Livingston, Roger Sherman, Ben Franklin, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson. So the committee of five. Jefferson writes it, and then the declaration is brought here to be debated. And then the big swing in the musical is that there is a grievance in the declaration, which was cut out. Does anybody who's listened to any of our episodes in the declaration knows? It was cut out and it was about opposing the slave trade that King George has done that. The South says, if you don't get rid of that grievance, we're not going to sign your little piece of paper and independence is gone forever. We have no choice, John. The slavery clause has got to go. Franklin, what are you saying? So John Adams is convinced to tell Jefferson to scratch it out. And then there's one more little hurdle. Everybody's finally convinced to become independent, except Pennsylvania, run by John Dickinson. And also keep in mind this whole time, Britain is smashing the hell out of us in battles, just destroying General Washington. Every other scene, George Washington's messenger comes in and brings a missive of terrible news. I beseech the Congress to dispatch the War Committee to this place in the hope of restoring some of the order and discipline we need to survive. You're obedient. G Washington. But here's another favorite part of mine, is when Adams is just complaining about the South, who's in Dickinson and all these people. And Ben Franklin says, these men, no matter what we think of them, are not ribbon clerks to be ordered about. They're elected representatives to Congress. They are like the cream of their colonies. And whether you like it or not, they are to be part of this new nation you hope to create. So learn how to live with them or pack up and go home. We're going to take a quick break. When we come back, that was then. This is now. So what do we do? Many years ago, never mind how many, but I was in high school. My very wise friend informed me that I should stop acquiring so much flimsy, fall apart in the wash, fast fashion. This was, by the way, before the term fast fashion had properly entered the lexicon, so he probably just said junk, and that I should instead invest in high quality clothes that I could wear year after year. Now, there are two reasons that I did not do this at the time. One, I believe I was like 16 years old. Two, when I heard invest and high quality in the same sentence, I really heard too expensive for the likes of you. Now here I am some years later, and there's finally a path to exactly the kind of quality over quantity my buddy Pete was talking about, and that is Quince. Quince makes wardrobe staples that last. We are talking 100% European linen, 100% silk, organic cotton, Mongolian cashmere, high quality fabrics, well made clothes, the stuff that you can reach for year after year. As I speak, I am wearing my Quince organic cotton boyfriend sweater, something that I reach for week after week, and it has been years. High school Hannah could not even imagine something holding up for this long, let alone keeping its shape, warmth, softness, and color like this puppy has. And because Quince works directly with safe ethical factories and cuts out the middleman, I did not end up paying fancy retail or brand markup prices for this. So Pete was right, I don't need a ton of clothes, I just need the clothes that I love that last year after year. And you can have the very same right now. Go to quince.com slash civics for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash civics. you will. Now available in Canada too. Don't keep settling for clothes that don't last. Go to quince.com slash civics for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash civics. So food delivery services have been around for a while and I've tried a lot of them and I loved some and I hated others. I will say that GreenChef is the trusted authority on clean eating. They deliver only real farm sourced ingredients. So for my choice I chose the Mediterranean option because I want to live another thousand years and the standout to me was the fish. Oh I've had so much trouble fish in my life. Specifically in this box the salmon with red peppers and olives because I don't live by a fishmonger. There isn't one in my town and salmon salmon my whole life it's been a gamble. This salmon from GreenChef these were vacuum sealed. They were gorgeous cuts of fish. The kind I literally could not get at my local grocery store. And also I haven't made a fish and olive dish in maybe ever. So I learned something and that means it was a good day. So if you're interested in having someone else handle your meal planning and your grocery shopping in an organic affordable varied way give GreenChef a try. Just head to GreenChef.com slash 50 civics that's 50 CIVICS and use code 50 civics to get 50% off your first month and then 20% off for two months with free shipping. Again that is code 50 civics at GreenChef.com slash 50 civics. Hey everyone it's Nick Capodice here. If you have found yourself asking can the president really do that then you gotta check out You Might Be Right. It is the chart topping civics podcast produced by Howard H Baker Junior School of Public Policy and Public Affairs at the University of Tennessee. Named after Howard Baker's guiding principle to quote always remember the other fellow might be right and quote you might be right aims to inspire the next generation of leaders in government public policy and public service by filling a critical gap in today's media environment and offering balanced perspectives without the shouting matches found on cable news. Each episode former Tennessee governors from both sides of the aisle Phil Bresden and Bill Haslam tackle timely policy conversations with luminaries like Al Gore, Judy Woodruff and more. Their new season just launched and they are tackling such big questions as is there too much money in political campaigns and should a president be able to take control of a state's National Guard to restore order even if a governor resists? Hear balanced perspectives without the shouting matches found on cable news. Follow You Might Be Right on Apple podcasts, Spotify or Rary Gittier podcasts and make sure to tell them civics 101 sent you. So it is March of 2026. Yeah. And we're coming up on the 250th birthday of America. And we're actually in Philadelphia because it's the kickoff to Civic Learning Week, right? Yeah. It's the National Forum for Civic Learning Week. And we've heard a lot of people talk about the loss of and need for the ability for people who fundamentally disagree to talk to each other specifically in America's democracy. And what you are describing is an insistence that the democracy would never even come about. Not that they necessarily knew what the government was exactly going to look like. And they certainly made a couple of mistakes along the way. But in order to even get to the point where they could start to think about what the government here would be, people who disagreed had to agree on one thing. Yeah. It's to me, it seems bonkers that it happened because this required unanimity among a group of men who couldn't agree on anything. But they argued about it and they talked about it. And they fought about it. There are all these stories of fights in these halls, walking sticks and stuff, but that they actually got together for this one thing, this really scary thing, this thing that was signing their own death warrant, their own trip to the gallows for treason. We say it over and over, but it's true. Like, the reason we're here is because people are able to talk about something and disagree immensely, but then actually get somewhere. And because despite there being some people who didn't necessarily want to talk or who wanted to leave other people out of the conversation, there were other people who said, no, look, we got to do this together. You have to talk to that guy. You have to. There were voices of reason and of power and influence who used their power and influence toward communication even within fundamental disagreements. There's even a part Dr. Hall of Georgia is wrestling with whether or not to vote for independence. And initially, he's like, I can't decide, the people are against it and I'm for it is what he says. And he's like, tell you can figure out why I'm here and what that means. I'm going to lean a little on their side. And then an ultimate scene of the movie, he comes in the middle of the night and says, I couldn't sleep. I was thinking about something I'd read was that I'm going to get the quote wrong. But like, when a man represents people, he doesn't just give them his industry. He gives them his judgment. And he betrays them if he does something thinking about what they want. It's his job as a representative to be paternalistic. And then he says that was written by Edmund Burke, member of the British Parliament. And he slides the vote over from ne to yay. I grew up star spangled. Mostly because of this movie. I love America. I really, I love the people and all of these teachers we just talked to love the idea of America love the foundations of the declaration. I love that all men are created equal, even though they weren't. I am not loving it so much right now. I think what I'm feeling right now is because I'm looking I'm sitting outside of this hall and I'm not feeling a swell in my stomach and a knot in my heart. Right now it feels like I maybe don't love America. But I know that's not true. I love so much of it. And I love these ideals, which maybe weren't held to for what, a hundred to 1960s basically. But I'm, I'm feeling very hurt. I'm feeling hurt by America. And I'm like, spurning it. It's like someone who hurt me. And I'm like, well, if you're going to be that way, you don't get my love. That makes me really sad. Do you feel like ever like, is it worth, is it worth fighting for? I know that it is. And so I guess my father had never heard white flag by Dido before. I had never heard white flag. That's true. That's true. And the other day he said he heard this song with these lyrics. I will go down with this ship. I won't put my hands up and surrender. There will be no white flag above my door. I'm in love and always will be. And I was like, dad, that is a Dido. You've never heard that before? And that's how I feel. You know, I think that you don't turn your back on it. You just keep going, keep saying out loud, what is at the core of all of this? And if everyone stops believing in it, I'll be the madman in town. But I'm willing to be. You're going to be the madman in the town who's saying, I hold these truths to be self-evident. Don't forget. Don't forget this is the Constitution. These are how things actually operate. And people will just say to you, yeah, but that's not how it really works, right? I actually, when I look at this building and I am reminded of the people who wrote the words upon which American democracy was based, I feel a call to action. I feel voices from 250 years ago, or even more so, I feel like I can feel their eyes on me. Look what we gave you, doofus. You know, the longest constitutional, the longest running constitutional republic in the world. Look what we gave you, ding dong. Figure it out, dummy. But as soon as you started singing Daito Hanna, really though, I kind of regretted what I said earlier. Like, of course it's worth fighting for. As I write these words, the enemy is plainly in sight beyond the river. How it will end only providence can direct. But dear God, but brave men, I shall lose before this business ends. Your obedient, G Washington. You might have heard that we are approaching America's 250th birthday, which will be celebrated on July 4th, 2026. Now, Civics 101 stands will of course know that the Second Continental Congress unanimously voted for independence from Great Britain on July 2nd. Edited the declaration for two days, approved the edits, sent it to John Dunlap to print it. On July 8th, Colonel John Nixon of Pennsylvania read it out loud in Independent Square. A bunch of delegates signed it on August 8th, and the last signature happened sometime in early 1777. And you'll probably know that John Adams, that July 2nd, would long be celebrated. Quote, I am apt to believe that it will be celebrated by succeeding generations as the great anniversary festival. Well, sorry John. It's the 4th. Maybe one day we'll put you on standard issue currency. Anyway, in anticipation of making it through a full 250 years, Civics 101 will spend the next months sharing stories that explore where we came from, how we got here, what that means, and why it matters. Stay tuned for our series celebrating America's 250th birthday. We do love it. It is worth fighting for. This episode was produced by me, Hannah McCarthy with Nick Capitice. Marina Henke is our producer, Rebecca Levoix is our executive producer. Music in this episode comes from Epidemic Sound and the streets of Philadelphia. You can find many, many stories and lessons about this nation of ours at our website, Civics101podcast.org. Civics101 is a production of NHPR, New Hampshire Public Radio. Not all darkness is dangerous. Sometimes it's the doorway to becoming whole. On the brand new podcast, The Shadow Sessions, hosted by me, Hibbabalfaqei, a psychologist and trauma expert, we shed light on the hidden corners of the human experience. Through raw, unfiltered conversations from the edge of healing, The Shadow Sessions invites you to do the deeper work that leads to real change. Follow The Shadow Sessions wherever you're listening now. Sometimes it feels like red and blue states are just as divergent as post-World War II East and West Germany. So what can the US learn from German political history in order to create a more perfect union? Find out on the new season of The Future of Our Former Democracy, the Signal Award-winning podcast from more equitable democracy and large media, hosted by me, Colin Cole and Heather Villanueva. It's time to rethink democracy, so follow The Future of Our Former Democracy wherever you get your podcasts.
