4.17. Live from London with Cynthia Erivo!

What's up everybody? Welcome to another episode of Nobody Asked Us with Dez and Caro. Welcome to London presented by Brooks running in a lovely, lovely space here. Kara Goucher, how are you? I'm gonna let hardcore fans, do you notice where I sat? Thank you. Because I got scolded last Saturday in Boston for sitting in Dez's spot. We have a side. Yeah. We've been at this long enough we have a side. Yes. I'm on the left, Kara's on the right. That's what's happening apparently. How is everybody in London? Are we excited for who's running? Raise your hand if you're running. Love that. Love that you're sitting down right now. How many first timers? Nice. Look at those hands if you see them afterwards. Go chat with them, give them some advice, give them some tips. We're all friendly here. Very friendly. Very friendly. So I don't know, Dez, how is the time zone? So as you guys know, Dez was in the desert, then she was in Boston. Now she's in London. Do you know what day it is? Absolutely not. Absolutely not. But I do know I'm excited. This is amazing energy. What a crazy space. Yeah, this is a crazy space. What about, have you looked at the races? You want to just jump right into that? I know you're here to see a special guest or that's a big part of it, but we always preview the races. So we're gonna quick preview the races. Are people excited about the elite races? Yeah. So do you want to go women or men first? Let's go with the men. Okay. So we have two two big heavy hitters, right? Big heavy hitters. We have Jacob Piplimo who won London last year. No, he won Chicago. 202-23. Weeks off after Boston. Yeah, what? Why bother? Call that a why bother race. And Saway. Yeah. Who's the reigning champion here? 202-05. So he's getting closer. But that's gonna be Epic Up Front fireworks. And there's some debuts. Kajalaccha's in there. Kajalaccha who, if you listen to my track commentating, he's always in the mix. He's a 5k, 10k guy. He's been a world champ. He was a former world record holder in the indoor mile. So London is known for being fast and I'm actually kind of excited since Boston was so fast. If it's a little pressure on everybody to live up to that title. Yeah, it'll be interesting to see if the pace is set differently because of Boston. Like, oh, this is the new standard. This is what we're doing now. How fast can we go? I haven't looked too much at conditions, but you just assume London's gonna be perfect. Yeah, I know. It's been so nice since we've been here and people are like, it's not really this thing. It's too sunny. It's too warm. It's too warm. Yeah. Okay, well, how about this women's race? This one I'm excited about. I mean, the men's is gonna be fireworks. It creates crazy fast. But the women's side has some heavy hitters. I can't wait to see O'Berry on the flat fast course. Me too. So if you know Helen O'Berry, she's a world champion in the track. Many Olympic medals. She moved up to the marathon with a lot of success. She's won New York. She's won Boston twice. And yet she's never run a flat fast marathon. So we're all interested in what can she do when she just gets to rip. And she's gonna have plenty of folks pushing her. She has Jip Cosgay in here who's just been solid the last several years. She's experienced. She knows how to run fast. She knows how to run technical courses, the whole thing. And for former World Record holder, this is the whole thing, a Sefa who will line up as well. Olympic silver medalist. Yeah. So some heavy hitters there. Any prediction? Do you have a time prediction? I think it's, should I do this? You should do it. Do it. Okay. I think it's gonna take 214. I think it's fair. I mean, it's funny to have that come out of my mouth. Right. It's like a funny number. But I just think like everyone's been leveling up. Boston puts pressure on everybody to step up. I don't know. Yeah. I mean, I think that she has that in her for sure. O'Berry. So I think it'll be competitive. And I hope just that the race element takes over late and that pushes to something incredible. Yep. All right. That's gonna be super exciting. We're all looking forward to that. We'll recap that. We have this thing called the Freshy Fresh. You won't want to miss after the race. That'll drop and we'll get into all the nitty gritty of the pro field. But today is about something very different. We have two very exciting guests. Do you want to do the honors? Sure. Well, we have Team USA member, World Championship team member, amazing ass marathoner to 22 marathoner Erica Kemp and wait, hold your balls that thought we have a little someone who might be a little bit famous. You might have seen her before. She's a producer and actress, a daughter, a sister, a runner, Cynthia Revo. Let's hear it for both of these women. Welcome, ladies. It's so exciting to share this space with you. Yeah, just welcome to the stage. This is great. So we're some a place you're familiar with this stage. Yes, we had the pleasure of watching Dracula last night. Okay. Unreal. Just unreal. Amazing. By the end, my jaw was on the floor. Just crazy good. How you how you feeling today? How do you recover from something like that? What's that routine look like immediately after the routine afterwards is not perfect because there's a strange sort of high that you get from it and an exhaustion at the same time. So I tend to try and get out of the building very, very fast to get home so that I can start winding down to get to bed. It's a lot. It's a lot. I have to say we were so so struck by athleticism in that performance. I mean, just physically, we saw you at the beginning and Erica was like, that's why you have to be but like the posture and how much you used your arms and you did fall to the ground at one point. Erica was so worried about your knees, but it was such an athletic performance and it was just so captivating. How do you train for that? How do you train to be on like that and you know, the performance built the whole time and intensity? How do you do that? She knows. She's been helping me train for it. She doesn't realize us. What's been happening? Basically, all of this training, all of the running that I've been doing actually helps with stamina and with physical health and strangely with mental health for the run of the show because it is so physical because it's about, it started when we started doing it at two hours and eight minutes and as the pace had gone on and as I got used to it, it sort of decreased to like an hour 40-45 and so in order to get to that place of muscularity of ease, I've had to make sure that I'm comfortable on my feet, moving around, breathing, all of that has come into play. So I think actually the training for the math has been really helpful with that. Erica, you're the coach in this situation. Thank you. What type of training are we doing? Are you surprised by this ability? I mean, we know since that you've run a really incredible time in London a few years back, it sounds like we'll get into goals later, but it sounds like you're ready for a good one. Erica, what's the training been like? Have you been surprised by how much you can push or are you holding back? What's that balance? I feel like every week was so exciting because when we had our first chat about goals, there was kind of this bigger range and my initial thought was why do we have such a big range and then we got more into talking and then she just seemed like she was in such a good place. So those first two, the long runs are always super important as far as like what kind of training, like Cynthia has an incredible long run like crusher. Like some people are just really good at them and they get a lot of that out of them and she's been incredible week after week. So that was definitely like a priority every week. And the first two we did, we threw some race pace in there. Yeah. And oh my goodness. I was like, one, she doesn't need me, but like two, she was so fast and came off of them so well. I was like, now I understand why the goal is what it is. And I feel like once we decided to kind of lean into that like speedier goal, it's just been so fun every week because I think the well is a lot deeper than we initially thought. I think the running and the performing go hand in hand. And I think one of the funniest messages I ever got was a couple of weeks ago, we were just, she was coming off all these big workouts so well. I've never heard a professional marathoner say this, but she's like, it's so strange. I can just always finish my runs faster. And I was like, you're a marathoner. Like quite literally every runner's dream, but I think the endurance and the stamina has just been so impressive. It's been really fun to dabble in some speed. Okay, we want to dive into running so deeply, but I think everyone wants to know Erica, when you got the call from Brooks and they said, do you want to coach Cynthia Arrivo? What happened in your brain? It was the first time I got a FaceTime from the Brooks team because everything's usually an email or like a more professional call. And I'm glad this one was like less formal because I said some very unprofessional words. I was so excited. So that call was not recorded, but I was so stoked. I mean, she's incredible. London is super exciting, but also finding out that she is just so fast was also super fun because it was just, I could relate to it a lot more. And then I think one of the cooler things was in my initial like email about how this would look and like what we're trying to do. They sent the passage from her book from the first chapter about running marathons. And I was like, she gets it. Like Cynthia is a runner who gets it. This is going to be really fun. Cynthia, I read your memoir simply more. Everybody read it in it. You talk about how you got into running by seeing this sign for a 5K. And then it led to this relationship with marathons. So talk to us a little bit about why did that sign make you want to run it? And then what has running become for you? I saw that sign. I don't know. You know, when you get signs from the universe, it was a literal sign. Yes. But it also felt like it because it dropped in somehow and it caught my eye. And I thought, I wonder, I wonder if I can do that because I had never concentrated on running before. And I was a fitness fanatic and I was going to the gym and I was working out and doing dance and all those things. And I don't know. I was just like, oh, I wonder, I wonder if my body is made for something like that. I wonder if I can do that if I'm physically able to commit myself to being able to run that amount of distance. Looking at that distance now sounds like it's like the fun day is what I did today. And I was like, I'm so sorry I only run a 5K today. But like when I saw it the first time, I'd never run that distance. And I thought I want to change myself to do that. And knowing that it was for some, it was for cancer research. And I thought, I want to do something. And I signed up to it and it sort of began this sort of love story between me and running. And what I found is that I started using the runs to order my thoughts, to meditate, to think, to process things. And the more I did, the more I got into my career, the more I needed running. Because it was the place I could go to sort of be on my own, to find a little bit of space, to find a little bit of relaxation. People always ask, what do you do when you want to relax? And I'm like, well, I can't treadmell and I run. That's what I do. And it means that for an hour in the morning or an hour to three hours, whatever, it's mine. I don't have to do anything other than be where I am with my own thoughts, with me, finding out how I feel, how my body feels, how my mind feels, and relearning myself every day, you know? And that's kind of how I got here. Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting. You just hear the passion in your voice and the love for it and the joy for it. I think it's just, it's a nice thing. It's a refreshing thing as a professional athlete to hear, because sometimes it's the burden for us. Erica, for you, did you find that as a challenge? I feel like I hear that and I'm like, oh, you need to hold her back. You need to hold her back. What was that like balancing that, like the love of it, the passion of it, the need for it, but also you have to get to the line healthy. Like how was that as a challenge? Yeah, I mean, it was so exciting finding out that Cynthia is low key very fast and has this like intense passion. And very quickly, she informed me that she would be following the plan to a tee. And I was like, that's putting a lot of like power in my hands as far as like, what are we going to do? That's going to take her to the next level, but not push her over the edge. And I think she's such an introspective athlete and has such a good sense of self that I felt comfortable giving her some stuff that I'm like, okay, we haven't done this before. You haven't run these paces for this distance, but I believe you can do it. And if it ever feels too much, you have permission to pull it back. And just like, there's a lot of trust there that I trusted her to know where that line was and just be guided by how she felt. And it's gone pretty well. I was a nutcase. I was insane. She's being very kind. I was a crazy person. I said to her, you tell me what to do. What are we doing that in the most capricorn way you could possibly expect? I just sent her a text. What do you want to do this week? What are we doing next week? What are the things that we're doing tomorrow? How are we doing that? I'm going to send it. And I would send her pictures of my pace and of each of the miles. I was a crazy person. I've been a crazy person. She's put up with me. I thank you for putting up with me. And that's how I've gotten here because she's been patient and I've been eager. Can I ask, have you found a limit? I feel like you've been pushing and she's been finding the line. Have you found a point where you said, Erica? No, absolutely not. Or do you think that yours is still untapped? I feel like there's more. I feel like there's more. What's the good pace for one of our miles? What's the quickest pace we've run a mile? I mean, once I opened it up at some of the end of the workouts and it's like, you know what? Have some fun with the last couple miles. Run as fast as you want. Now I'm starting to see 650, 640. And I was like, I don't know where this ends. But that's also a very exciting thing to take into race day. It's a good thing not to know where that limit is. Yeah. Sounds like you have more races in your future. I think so. I want to. Want to do Paris next? Oh, yeah. I mean, yeah, we're just getting started. There's definitely plenty left in the tank. She's stuck with me. Sorry. Cynthia, I think people might be surprised to know you do your training on a treadmill. I do. So talk to us about that. Why do you do it on the treadmill and how do you not get bored? I don't know. It's something just happened this year. Well, a couple of huge things happened this year, which made it a little difficult to run in public. So I figured I would just be sensible and run on a treadmill. And also, I wanted to, the temptation when I'm running on the street is to stop at the roads and to, and I wanted to see what it would be like if I could just keep going without stopping because of the traffic lights or because of other people in the way. And I wanted to see how it would feel to keep going over long distances. And I remember the last time I was training for a marathon, I would stop at the traffic lights and it would give me like a little bit of a break, which was fine. But I think the challenge this year for me was I wanted to feel what it was like to just keep going. And the treadmill presents that. And I figured that mental fortitude would happen if I'm on a treadmill and there's nowhere to go. And you're just looking at the screen or you're looking ahead. And sometimes I would do it with music. Sometimes I would do it without music. Sometimes I would watch something. Sometimes I would not watch anything. And I would just have to figure out how to keep my mind focused on the run, focused on the distance, focused on the breath, focused on the breathing so that when I get on the street, hopefully all of the things around me will be a really beautiful gift that keep me going. So there's just like a, I actually benefit from a thing that I haven't been able to experience whilst running on a treadmill. You talked a little bit about the mental health aspect of it. And I hear that a lot in what you're saying there. What, how do you decide on the focus each day? Like how do you step on the treadmill and decide what you want to get out of it and where to let your mind go or where to let it be? What's the decision making in that? I think I don't really decide where I want to go. I think once I know the distance I'm running and I know how I'm going to do it. Thank you, Erica. Then I just, I let that sort of do the talking and whatever comes up will come up. If it's something that's happened in the day, then it will be something that's happened in the day that I have to work through. Sometimes it's me going through lines. I've been going over the lines on the show. I have quite a few. I have quite a few. And you know, sometimes it's that, sometimes it's, oh, I have a thought that I want to work through or there's a song that I am thinking of and that I just, whatever comes up will come up in the, in the run. I never sort of decide what I'm going to experience. I just sort of let it be, you know? Yeah. Erica, I want to know what you've learned from coaching Cynthia. What have you learned? I mean, you're a professional athlete. It's your job. You're used to taking instruction, but what have you learned from helping her try to achieve her goals? Yeah, I think one of the first things is I thanked my coach after a few weeks. I was like, I thank you for everything you do. I really appreciate you. No, it just like I am like so fortunate to have had some great coaches and I understand like how powerful that can be to just have someone in your corner. Like even when everything's going really well, it still does something powerful to have someone tell you you're doing a good job and to like keep pushing you forward every day. It's just like, you know, an extra motivation, an extra reassurance that like you're on the right path. And I think one of at least my most memorable moments, like I would say 95% of training was perfect or like better than I could have dreamed, but I am really glad we had a moment that wasn't perfect. Like that one long run. It was not great. Didn't go according to plan, but in every other long run had been picture perfect, feeling incredible, getting faster, gels are great, everything's great. And just how you worked through that, how you dealt with those miles that didn't feel good, how you got back on the treadmill after like Erica, I'm not going to get to 20. There's no way I'm going to do this. I can't make it. It's just horrible. Everything hurts. I've got a stitch in my side. I think I'm going to stop at 15. I think I'm going to be done like literally giving her a moment by moment account of what was happening. Which is like a very real moment. Like that is one something that happens to everyone. It could happen on race day where like you're 15 miles in and you're like, I'm having the worst day of my life. I feel terrible and being honest about it and then like navigating that and the way you collected yourself after accepting that it was like a terrible day, but then finished it out and how you felt mentally the next day after having gone through that, I think was really good to see one like as your coach, but also like in general watching someone else experience that you're like, okay, like it's not all hope is not lost. It's okay to like have a dark moment and like be honest about it. But then I feel like since then it's been fantastic. Yeah. I think because the absolute worst could have happened, everything went wrong with that. Everything. Because I was also trying out what I wanted to run in when when I do this and I was like, well, this is wrong. This fest doesn't work. This is too heavy. It's feeling really terrible. Okay. It's moving around a lot. Can't move. Okay. This is too hard. Can't feel anything. I've got a stitch in my side. Oh, great. Good. Look. Okay. My thigh is hurt. Okay. My foot's hurting now. Good. This is perfect. This is so great. Oh, it's only 10 miles in. I have 20 miles to do. This is perfect. Perfect. My text Erica halfway through this run. I think it was at like mile eight or nine. Yeah. It's like, I really don't think I'm going to get this done. I think I'm going to try and stop at 15 and I'm going to I'm going to get off because I don't think I'm going to make it. It's also like 6am my time on the East Coast. Just like rage texting. I can't do this. This is not going to happen. I'm not going to make it. I'm not going to make it. I feel really awful at here. I'm going to stop. Okay. You know, I'm going to what I'm going to walk at mile 10 and then maybe I'll try and do 11 and see how I feel. I don't think I'm going to make it to 15, but I'm going to try for 15. This is literally, this is literally what's going on. I'm texting all of this and then I get to my 11. Okay. Well, I managed to walk the 11 and I'm moving it mile 12. So I think I can make it through mile 12. I'll get up to 15. I've made it to mile 15. It's not so bad. I think I can make it. I think I can do it. No, I tried to run at mile 15 and it just got really bad again and then the stitches come back. It's mile 16. I don't think I'm going to make it to 17. I'm going to just try 17 then. Maybe I'll get to 17. I'll get to 17 and then got to 17 and I'll, I think I'm just going to walk 18. I'll walk 18 because I think it can make it. If I've made it 18, so I might as well just make it to 20. I think I can make it to 20. I made it to 20. I did it. Okay. I did it. It's fine. Sold. Absolutely. Stars. They're just like us. But I think the wonderful thing, thank you for your patience on that day. But actually, being able to talk it out was like me having a private and public conversation with someone just working with my brain about what it was going to do and how it was going to work through what it felt like to go through something like that and know that on the day, if something terrible happens, I'll still be able to make it through. I'll still be able to get to the end of it, which actually is kind of like a life lesson, I guess. Like it doesn't, it matter how bad it gets, I'll still be able to make it to the end of the finish line, you know. And I, as much as we're joking, but I felt awful and nothing was going right and everything, I would try and fix it and it just wouldn't, I couldn't get it right. It wasn't working. But I just was like, just keep going one step at a time, one mile at a time. It's fine. Maybe if you get to that, you can't do it. But the more I thought to myself, okay, I can do it. And the more I had support, because she was, it's 6 a.m. and she was still texting back. She was texting me back. She was still there. So to have her on my side, to have Erica on my side was really, truly, I can't tell you how invaluable it was because I, it meant that there's someone just cheering you on and it helped me sort of compartmentalize all the things that I was thinking of all at once and still keep moving. It meant that even though I was complaining, I was still moving, you know. And that's the key really, to just keep going. You'll get there, you know. Thank you. That's such a breakthrough, those moments, I think. And do you have any experiences in your career, in theater, in acting that you brought into that? Or do you think that that moment, again, you said it reflects some life really, really well. Do you think you'll take moments from that and apply them to other parts of your career or your life? Like what's the parallels there? Yeah, I mean, on what I was doing, what I'm doing now, there was a moment at the very beginning where I was like, there's no way I'm not going to do this. You're going to have to replace me. You're going to have to find someone else to do this. It's not happening. It's not. And that was, I think it's just reminding yourself that those times are going to come up. And it's okay to think to yourself, nah, this is a nip. But to know deep down that even though you're feeling that in the moment, that there is a little glint in the back of your mind that says you might be feeling that right now. But if you just push through just a little bit, you'll get to the other side of it. And I think that this is always the lesson that I keep going back to anyway, which is probably why I keep running, because it always teaches me that. And it's probably the thing that makes me have an experience like I had on the show and go, it's fine. You'll be okay. It'll be horrific for maybe two days and you'll be okay after that. Just keep going. I love how you said that you got through that run and it taught you that if it happens on race day, you've been there, right? So I'm a big journal and I think we all are big people who like to journal and I like to pick the best thing that happened of the day and how I survived it. So for instance, I called a confidence journal. So if I was due, I'd be like, worse long on run of my life, but like I got it done. You know, like I tricked myself as you were like tricking yourself in to keep going. Talk to us about journaling and the power of paper to pen for you. It has been the most helpful thing. And when I'm, especially now as well, because I'm doing both the marathon at the same time and this show that it feels like I'm doing two marathons at the same time. And so in order to like work through what I'm feeling, putting it down means that it's out loud. So it's not just in my head anymore. So there's a beauty in putting things down and reading them and seeing them away from my mind and in front of me so that now I can go, oh, that doesn't, that doesn't read as bad as it felt in my head. You know what I mean? And or that does, that's something I want to work through. Oh, I don't really have words for that. Let me find the words to put it down. Let me find the words to talk about it. It helps me get through through a lot of the things that I have to work through in my brain and it makes it easier to discuss, to talk about, to share if I'm, I'm joining and I'm doing it avidly right now. And I, there are times when I, I mean, right, like once a week. And then there are times when I'm writing every day and all the way through the day. And I have a thought and I put it down immediately. And so I carry my journal with me. Or there are times when it's actually just a bedtime activity. I want to write down what I felt throughout the day at the end of the day. And right now I'm, in a moment where I'm just writing all the time. And I'll sit in my dressing room before I go on stage and I'll write down what I'm thinking and feeling, especially because this show is so wordy that you kind of need just those words in your head so that anything else needs to be out on paper. So I kind of empty my brain of anything else so it can keep going with what's going on there on stage. I love that. I mean, I think it's just an incredible strategy. For athletes and on race day, that's a tool that I use is writing a physical race plan because it's out there. It's real. It gives you a list of things to do. And it's a checklist because what happens when you're on the course is you bargain with yourself. This little guy's like, slow down, it's fine. And this little guy's like, no, keep going. And that's what happens. So writing it down as a physical tool and you look back at it later and it keeps you accountable. Have you guys talked race strategy? Do we have a strategy? Do you want to just, you know, hash it out a little bit at all? What are we doing? What's today Friday? It's Tuesday. No, no, no. Is it too soon? Pre-race chat is the night before the race. Because it's like what you take with you before you go to bed. Because once you wake up Sunday morning, that is like race time. I mean, I have thoughts, but we will save them. I love that you're making her wait. You're like, no, you wait. We're doing that tomorrow. It's called pre-race for a reason. We haven't even done our pre-race shake out yet. Okay. No, we haven't. Let's do this tomorrow. Yeah, yeah. Okay. You can't skip ahead. They'll let us know. Wait for the good part. Okay. Erica, working with Cynthia, she's so accomplished. We all know who she is. We've seen her in Wicked. We've seen her last night was like mind blowing to see you live. It was mind blowing. Like we all know she's amazing. But what are things about her that you've learned that make her unique and special and strong? Yeah, I have told this to like a couple of my friends. I was like, Cynthia would be such a good teammate. Like on your college cross-country team, like she is who you would want on your team. Because she's intense in the right way. Because like intensity can go either way, it can be a positive or a negative. But she's so diligent in everything she does. She's so thorough. But she also has such a passion for it that it's like very contagious. And I feel like that it honestly worked out with like the time difference because I would wake up to a little bit of a novel, but there was so much enthusiasm behind it that it was like, all right, time to go for my run. Like it was so exciting. And it's exciting to see someone go after their goals like that. Like that kind of stuff is very contagious. And I think seeing like we know your talent on the stage, but it's also really cool to also have a talent for running because that's something, you know, London Marathon weekend, a lot of people in this city this weekend can really appreciate that. Yeah, I think it's just such a unique combination of this joy and even just the way you speak is very like fluid and almost soft. But there's nothing soft about the way you approach the things you do. It's very intense. You're going to accomplish your goal. And I think that dynamic is beautiful. Thank you. Well, I'm going to ask the same question to Cynthia. You've gotten paired up with a professional marathoner. She's done amazing things on the world stage. Yes. Was that intimidating at all? Was there any tension there? What has it been like working with her? I mean, it seems like great camaraderie and you have someone incredible in your corner. But was it was it intimidating at all? I mean, she's fucking awesome. First of all, I read the time. I was like, what the fuck? I mean, there's that obviously. But I was I read her. But I got like a list of like, who do you want? I was like, that lady. Her. I want her to train me please. Thank you very much. But because I knew that I had to, if I was going to pull someone in who had been who was that accomplished and had achieved something like that, I would have to come with it. You know, I mean, I'd have to actually do it well. And I, as a Capricorn, you, it's work, you do the work. And you want to you want to get it right. And I knew that I would be challenged. I knew that that Erica would ask things of me that I probably wouldn't ask of myself because I didn't know to and didn't know how to. And I wanted the right guidance. And she's been really encouraging and deeply passionate and also really good at going, only run the eight. Just run eight. I know you want to run the seven 15 run the eight. Which is hard for me to hear and hard for me to do. But it was really wonderful to have someone that would help me hold back sometimes when I needed to and push because she would push me. And I'm good at pushing myself, but she's better at pushing me for sure. And I feel like, no, I know that over this time, my running has become exponentially better than I could ever have imagined it becoming because I'm training with Erica, not because I'm good at what I do, but because I've had someone by my side who's been helping me learn how to be better as a runner. And that's been really, really exciting to see where I started and where I am now is really kooky and really fun. And it's not because I did it by myself. It's because Eric taught me how to. And I feel really pleased about it. She's just really, really spectacular. And on the outside, really sweet, but actually, I know she's talking about me about intensity, but I would look at some of the training plans and be like, cool. Seven, twenty, four, eight miles. I don't know. Okay. If you think I can do it, I'll try. And did you do it? I did, but still. But you know, it's just that I think to have someone who believes in you, and I have a belief in myself, but to have someone who believes more than that is really, really cool, who can see the well more than you can see it is really, really awesome. And that's a special talent to have. And Eric has that. Yeah. Oh, this is like so cute. Sisterhood at its best. Yeah, this is great. Okay. So we want to get into a little bit about gear and we got to see you backstage get some shoes, which sorry, but we're crazy dog people. So can you just tell everybody else about your dogs? So so my my shoes have two little charms, well, they have four little charms, but there are two charms on there that have that are heart shaped, but they have my two dogs in them. What Caleb and Gigi Caleb is in just about eight pound multi poo. And Gigi is a Yorkie poo who is like four pounds, who thinks she's like 20 pounds is ridiculous. And they're my little buddies. They're so sweet and ridiculous. And they have great personalities and they keep me going and I love them and I could try and get them with me everywhere I am. So now I can take them with me when I'm running. Which is really cool. Yeah. I love that. And we gave you strategy. We don't want to go too much into it, but Gigi is who you channel at mile 20. Yes. Be fierce. You're the lion. Yes. Love that. And then Caleb is patient. He's the patient. He keeps the pace. Love that. Caleb is very unbothered by everything. He does not want to be bothered if he's my favorite thing when I travel with him on a plane is he is who everyone should be when they're on a plane. He's in his eye taken with me on on in his crate and he goes to sleep almost immediately. It's like he knows what the plane sounds and feels like. I usually put a blanket over him. And if I lift the blanket up, if you imagine, I'm Caleb, you lift that blanket up. He goes and doesn't look at you after that. That look is why are you disturbing me? Leave me alone. And you won't hear a peep from him until you land. Gigi is like, excuse me. Excuse me. I would like to sit with you. Excuse me. Excuse me. Hello. Excuse me. And she wakes up in the morning before everybody else. And because she's four pounds and kind of knows how small she is, but doesn't because she also thinks she's huge, will get on the bed and on your chest, but like sits there like it's a seat and then just pause at your face. Wake up. Wake up. Wake up. Wake up. And you go, okay. She goes, that's the difference between the two of them. And there's, but they're both very sweet, but they're so different in personality. So Gigi's who I'll channel at the very end, they're one more mile, one more mile, one more mile. We'll keep going. We'll keep going. And G and Caleb was the beginning. It's fine. I'll just keep going. It's fine. That's what it is. I love that. Yeah. So we know the vest isn't going to happen. It will. I need to find the right one. And I found the right one. I tested the fit. Do you have the fit? I do have the fit. I also ran it by Erica. Okay. Again, crazy. I ran it by her. I was like, I'm really hot. I'm sweating a lot. And these tights of, I think, I'm, I think I'm not going to make it in these. She said, well, maybe try the tights. Maybe try the shorts. You said the two and a half inch at first. The five inch. I knew that was a no go. The five. The five. And then the five inch. I was like, it's too short. I think I'm going to, it's going to annoy me. She said seven inch. Try the seven inch. And I've been running in the seven inch since it works. We found a winner. We found the winner. And I'm trying to, I was deciding whether to run with compression socks or not. I did it that the last time. I don't know if I, I don't think I should do it this time. So I think I'm going to go in the, the ghost socks here because they work very well. And they keep my feet cushioned. I have hearing max fours because I like how light they are. And they've got a lovely spring on them. And then this long sleeve, the dash, which is so comfortable. But I have to be careful. So I'm going to use, what is that? The chafe because I chafe under my arms. Who knew? Who knew? And then I found a good vest that I could put on that, that because the zips pull tight to the body. So that the weight's not dragging behind me. Yeah. But that's what practice is for. I feel like that was something that I'm glad that we did and something I've learned over my career is like, we always say like, nothing new on race day, but that means you actually have to try things out in the weeks leading up to the race. So once we got like inside of a month, it's like, okay, now we need to make some choices. Now we need to try some things. And we saw some things that like didn't work. And it's like, aren't we glad we tried that? But we're a few days out. And I think we're all set. Yep. You're going to wear the Hyperion maxes. Yes. Tell us. I love that shoe, by the way. It's such a fun shoe. Yeah. So I'm sure you tried all the shoes. What about that shoe connected you to it? It's the weight, the light, and they're springy. And I feel my feet feel solid. You know what I mean? It's a strange, I don't feel the shoe as much as I do on other shoes. They give you back what you give them, which is why I like them a lot. I just feel my feet feel good in them, you know? Yeah. I feel you. Yeah. I can run for miles, miles, and then it feels good. Yeah. Did you guys do nutrition? Do you have a nutrition strategy? Yes. Yes. Okay. We feel good there? I feel good. I think so. Yeah. Cynthia's always been incredible about hydration. So we were really pressing, like getting used to the gels and whatnot, like before and during. She did get me, like maybe a month into working together. I was talking about gels and she asked me what I do for my training and I went through the gels I take and she was like, don't you take any water? And I was like, oh, actually that's like where I fall short as an athlete. She said, you're not drinking any water. How do you do that? I mean, it doesn't feel good and you do tend to cramp sometimes. I just kind of roll the dice and like I usually win, but you know, it's a good reminder. It's always good to, you know, be reminded that everything is important. And it was just funny that like our strengths were different and we could compliment each other in that way. I was like, thank you for the reminder. Do as I say, not as I do. Yes. She was like, I'm so sorry if you really want to run this PB, you have to eat something. You have to have something. You have to nutrition. Nutrition is important. I was like, oh, funny that. It's a good idea. I'm not really fast about it. I don't really, I wouldn't at the beginning. I really wasn't having any nutrition whatsoever. I was just like running with electrolytes and that was it. And she was like, we're not going to do the thing that you want if we don't have any nutrition. So here's the choices. Let's try. And we found it finally. Yeah, I tried a couple and some were not right, but then we found that's why we packed it. Yeah. And we found it. Cynthia, I know so many people who look up to you, especially young girls. And I'm just wondering you're in the theater world, you're a producer, actor, amazing singer, but running is a little bit different. We're in our own little community and you're in it and it's so exciting. So what would you say to some of these people that look up to you that have never considered running? What would you tell them about running? Oh, that it's, I think it's, people don't realize how freeing it can be. I was asked a question about traveling and running at the same time. And there's this wonderful thing that running does for you in that you get to see places in a way that you haven't seen it before. And it gives you the opportunity to actually look around you and open your eyes to things you might miss if you're in a car or in your or on the underground, but you get to see it at your own pace, you know, and you get time to yourself, you get to learn about how you function as a human as a person outside of everything else. I think that's a really beautiful thing. I think people sometimes get a little bit afraid of what it feels like to run because I think there's this sort of strange idea that you must be able to run miles and miles from the beginning, but actually you just start and then one day you'll find yourself running miles, but maybe today it's just a minute. And that's one more. One more. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we're almost up on time. We could chat with you forever, but you're obviously a very busy person. So I guess I'll let you two close it down with what does success look like on Sunday? What's a win for Cynthia Erivo at the TCS marathon, TCS London marathon this Sunday? And you can both answer. Oh, do you want to give this? Oh boy. I think a win in our first chat when I asked you what was so special about the last time you ran London and what we were trying to get out of this run at London, I was like, was it the PB? Was there a special feeling? And I feel like that's what we really landed on. Like how incredible and proud and strong you felt when you came through halfway and saw that time on the clock and you're like, I'm doing something fantastic today. But like that feeling, I think we're in a great place. And I think if we can capture that on race day, and you can come through half, but also flying through that finish line feeling that like tall and strong and proud that we've been thinking about all season, I think that'll be a win. Okay, I like that. I'm going to take that and put it in my pocket because I would like that for myself very much. So yeah, I think I think the Capricorn and me is like a win is if we get there and less than 335 if I get 320, that's the win. That is the practical side of me. And the other side is actually getting to this weekend and getting to the start line tomorrow is a huge win. Because it's been a really long, wild process because I've been doing this at the same time as doing this show. And part of me, if you don't ask me last year if this was a good idea, I may have been like, I'm not sure. I don't know how this is going to work. But the fact that we've gotten here and come rain or shine, I am getting to the finish line. That for me, feels like the win. That will be the win tomorrow. Getting to that finish line. Well, how lucky are we to have Cynthia in the running community? It's pretty awesome. It's so special for all of us to see this side of you and to feel connection to you through running. It's so amazing. So we want to thank you and Erica for giving us your time today to come talk to Des and I. We want to thank all of you for supporting Erica and Cynthia and the pod. And we wish you all the best of luck on Sunday. And thank you all so much. Thank you. Thank you. Is anyone running the marathon on Sunday? Who's running the marathon? Please take care of yourselves. Be good to yourselves these next few days. When you finish that marathon, eat whatever the hell you want. Treat yourself really well. Get that massage that you've been booking that you didn't get yesterday that you should have gotten this week and you didn't do it for yourself. Put the compression socks on because you know you need to. You know you need to. You know you need to. There's some of you who will think that you can just flex and do nothing for yourselves. Take the hot bath. Make sure that everyone treats you like the king, queen, they, queen, princess, royal that you are. Please be good to yourselves and have a great time on Sunday. I will be rooting for you as well.