"Exit Interview (The Cathartic Episode)" (w/ Matt & Bowen)

This is an I Heart Podcast. Guaranteed Human. Look, man. Oh, oh, I see him. Oh, my. Oh, look over there. Is that culture? Yes. Wow. Last culturedistas. Ding dong! Last culturedistas calling. Much has changed. Look at our environment. Look at the environment. Y'all, I think we are going to cozy up here, down here on the, I'm going to call it the Malala room. Yeah. Okay. So we, we, remember the time when Malala kicked us out of our normal studio. That was the best thing to ever happen. Give Malala more prizes and accolades for this impact she's had. She continues Malala. Come on the show. Honestly, at the point. No, she's coming. Yeah. We're going to do a kickball episode. I do think now we have to have her. Oh, my God. A kickball episode. We should have a sports something where, or just like live from the court. What do I call a kickball? She would call it a kickball diamond. Diamond. Kickball diamond. Yeah. This is really where we, we falter in terms of expertise. We host a damn sports podcast somehow. Imagine that. Imagine that. By the way, I'm having a great time. If you don't know, now you know, two guys five rings, which we can confirm for the millions time is the name of the podcast and no one stopped us and they can't now. And they can't now has premiered. I love that on today's show this week. You had Miss Jenna Bush Hager kind of giggling to herself because I was like, of course she knows. Oh, she knew. And she's knocking back the captain Morgan in college watching that video. Let me remember the Billy Idol song Rebel Yale. You think that that a plastic. That was that was a baby H. Jenna Bush Hager. I fucking love her. I am a test author. I love her. I'm having the best time. Literally, I really, I was, I was saying I don't really have much to promote, but then I was like, Oh, wait, yes, I do. I do our full bone two guys five rings. Oh, yes, yes. So I was like, Oh, yeah, of course, I'll go back and I'm the last friend. That's, that's as a lot. And so I made a whole joke about how that man I was second place. But by the way, I just do want to say I knew the entire time I wasn't getting that job. I did not want that job just to talk about employment status. My employment status at NBC. Or a rock and a glimmer. And then we'll get to him. No, but I was like, we're both still employed. Everyone was like, ah, like were you disappointed? I was like, a no, I don't, I wouldn't want that schedule. B Chanel Jones should have the job. The legend. I, I will say I knew the whole time I wasn't actually getting it. Right. And but I did like that everyone thought I was a contender. I liked being in that conversation. It was fun. You liked being in the mix, as they say. Yeah. And just how perfect is it that you got to work in morning television? Ultimately, at the end of this week, I'll have hosted it 20 times. Wow. Yeah. They got to get you a smoking jacket for that. And truly, I guess that I would have four SNL jackets at this point. Yes. 100%. And just to speak on SNL. What is that? I don't have you already forgotten. No, of course not. I am. So if you've been living under it, they are not even a rock, a boulder. A big rock. You may not know that Boen Yang, my sister here, my co-host, my bestie has decided to suddenly depart. Shockingly suddenly depart. After seven and a half years, the shocking departure. So sudden. So. Now, this is the thing. This is honestly what's behind it. It's like, it's time. Like, you would do seven seasons and then you would scoot. And then like, COVID and the current media landscape, the current entertainment ecosystem is like so turbulent that like people have completely valid reasons for staying longer or in a lot of cases don't have the like privilege of staying on as long as they would like to. I have this very beautiful thing where I get to say that I stayed on exactly as long as I wanted to. Maybe I'm sure and I've said this before. I was maybe unsure about going back in the summer and I'm so glad I did. When did you make the Icafillic? Oh my god. Barbara. I ask a lot of questions that I know the answer is true. But I mean, I've been really waiting to do this episode with you and I've also been waiting to do an episode with just you. And I know a lot of people out there have been wanting us to as well. And it's not because we don't want to guys. It's whenever we're not together, just us. It's just because logistically, we could not do it. And we feel like we if we're going to do a culture catch up episode, it should be a culture catch up episode. And so that's what it is. And the podcast is many different things and we'll continue to be many different things and we hope it surprises you week to week. But I've been waiting for this because I'm excited to hear how you're feeling. How are you feeling? I feel so good. I also want to point out the tea is like you're saying like you know, you already know the answers to these questions you're about to ask. But also I don't think you and I have really talked about this. Not really. I wasn't able to be there, which hurt my heart, but I was there the last time I thought it was the last day. Exactly. Exactly. And I was there in spirit sobbing, laying on my back in my Orlando hotel because I couldn't believe just how perfectly it was ending. Like that is, it's like landing the Mars rover on like a square foot of terrain. It was like. There were no guarantees about how any of it was going to shake out. Like I went in. Lots of unruly like, you know, factors. Totally. Like working there is just making peace with the fact that like things are completely out of your control. Down to like the audience response to a joke. Yeah. You know, like that is, I think that and like I think having that and like going into it like down to like 12.55 a.m. Not being sure if that sketch was going to go to air. I was like, there's a million reasons why I could get caught. Nothing is guaranteed. Like that is sort of in a nutshell. Like it kind of is perfectly like illustrative of what that job is and it like was resonant all the way through to the end. And I feel really this word is meaningless. I think maybe now, but like so grateful. I don't think that word is meaningless at all because I think that there probably were so many times during that experience where you didn't know if you were going to be able to end the experience of working there with gratitude. So many different people have many different kinds of experiences leaving that job. Yeah. Like you come in and there is like a shared experience of being at SNL, but then ultimately it comes down to like, there's like a collectivism there, but there's an individualism in terms of like everyone is on their own journey there. Yeah. And there's a different like length of their tenure, completely different struggles. It is like what the experience of living is, which is like it is suffering to the point of having to like arrive at a nihilism and then you create your own meeting from there. That is what that job is. Of course the poll code is going to be like, bo and you and call us SNL suffering. Like, but I actually think this year I give so much less of a thought about what the poll code is. That's totally. And we were texting last night. We, I'm just so excited about the future of the podcast now. I really am. Yeah. Not that I don't think that this is going to change it necessarily in terms of you not being there. Yeah. I just mean like, I don't know. I think after everything like after this whole year, like looking back and looking forward it's like, this is the thing that's so been so consistent for us. Yes. And it's the thing that I want to honor and bring honesty to and like, yes, authenticity to and my number one main focus. And I think that because of the past seven and a half years, like your energy being, you know, primarily focused there. Now what's so exciting to me for you is even what you said the other day about how you were like, you know, what's crazy? I don't have to tell someone I'm unavailable just because they want to do something in the fall. Like, I don't have to say, oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I make a mistake that my spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends spends That is true. That's true. But no, you're right. And I also want to acknowledge and honor the fact that like this is, this is like a joint tandem experience for us. Because like the show gave us a lot. The show meaning SNL. SNL. We like went through it together in like, I think in a very like evident way, we were, it was like, one of us was on the show, but I think we were both like living with it. Yeah. And like, obviously, I did not experience work in there, but like I, I always felt like it was a part of my life because of its omnipresence. Yeah. Yeah. And not just yours, but also so many people. And so I think that what I've always been looking forward to for you is just more autonomy. Yes. And but just to speak again about the experience of loving that interviewer energy being directed at me. This is so exciting. Bowen Yang is the guest on this week's podcast. But in terms of like, you said you're feeling really good and that you're grateful that it all ends it up the way it ends it up. How do you think you'll feel when the first episode of the new season comes up? Well, we're going to be in Japan busy by busy by happens. Happens to us. Happens to us. Not. I think both. Yeah. So basically what's happening for me for both of us is that we're kind of like fire hosing new sensory experiences towards us. Like we're going to be like eating food, yeah, going like listening to sounds, touching things. Like what touching things what? And just just we're just I don't think we were going to go to a petting zoo and I had my head around that. It sometimes hard for me to think about touching animals. You know this. We're going to the Nintendo museum. Oh, that's you. We're going to the Ghibli museum hot ticket. We are we're going to be touching things. So I think it's just funny because I feel like I I I summed I'm like trying to redirect it back to the show. Yes, yes, it's okay. Yeah, but no, but like I guess it's exciting that you feel excited about other things because I didn't know how you were going to feel after it ended. I'm sure because it does warp you a little bit like I can give that take now that you're not there. Absolutely. There were times where I would come to the show and you would be there and I was like what happened to you? I know. You know what I mean? The energy could alternately be so high and unbelievable and the best energy you could ever experience or through the floor to the point where I'm like, why are we even doing this? I well, you know what Matt Whitaker, so our friend Matt Whitaker said to me, he was like by the end, it seemed like even if you had like a light show or like a bad week, like you just on Saturdays, like it didn't stick to you. Like you kind of showed up, you were like, okay, here's the rundown. Let's go out to music. Like when this sketch goes up, like I had like, and this is and this is an indicator for me that like, oh wow, like this is this is so beautifully sort of wrote to me that like that comfort is like not necessarily the point of being here. Like there is such a beautiful crucible of that show. And now that like I'm done with it, now that I'm through the gauntlet of it, I'm like, that is one of the most meaningful experiences I will ever have. I can't believe I got the thing that happened during the last sketch, the one time sketch was I look out and I was like, I don't know, I don't know, like emotionally this is going to be like necessarily the resonant thing because what happens according to some alarms that I've talked to, including Eddie Bryant, she was like, oh, like I cried more on Wednesday at the re-through than I did on Saturday. And I was like, oh, interesting. Like that. Like I was sobbing at the re-through. At the re-through in front of everyone. Matt. And like, why do you think? Here's why. In the sketch, I say, you know, it's like a metatextual thing. It's like, oh, it's my last shift at the Delta Lounge. But in the sketch, I say, I've loved everyone here. I've loved every single person who works here. Like I immediately broke down because I was, I was, I was kind of saying because I was telling the truth. Sure. No, thank you. I'm being a bitch. Of course. Of course. And there's like, even the struggles with people there, which anyone would have with any colleague they have, but of course they're in the most heightened experience atmosphere. Like those are going to be hot and cold relationships to say the least, but those are so valuable. One hundred percent, I've learned how to work under what seems like an immense amount of pressure. Which it kind of isn't, it isn't. But it's like, I've learned so many things that have applied to so many other things. I always said like the credits don't transfer. I would always like go into like, press stuff for the show and be like, oh, you know, it's so fun. Like I love that job. But it's, but you know, the process is so singular there. You have an idea on Tuesday and it could be on TV by Saturday. It doesn't work like that anywhere else. It's a dream factory. I don't have to memorize lines. I just read off the cue card. I pitched the rafters. I say the credits don't transfer. Like this isn't how it works anywhere else in show business. But yet, culture words is a perfect example. I was like, oh, I think this benefited both of us that like I had an understanding of like what to do, how to do it, how to work with someone like Liz Patrick. Yeah. Who's the director of us and who directed the culture words? The director of the culture words. Like that was kind of like the veneer cracking on like that idea for me. Anyway, I cried on Wednesday at the read through because I was telling the truth. And because there are no other occasions for someone to say that at that place. Right. Because we have to just like be like funny and ironic. And there's a refraction of like what's being said and how it should be received. And like I will absolutely cop to the fact that that Delta one sketch was like completely self indulgent because like what I'm going to do. Like that's fine. Tell us straight, like give us straight joke bag. Well, for a second, I thought that you're because it did weirdly feel like you for the 80 trend forecasters, uh, weekend update piece, um, to be the last thing because that was 80s last thing. Yeah. And I think that that also speak the fact that that was 80s last thing and she was on the show for 10 years. And she wasn't necessarily, she was not given that type of platform like you were given. And we should say very, very, very few people have been given that. Yes. I think it's like actually quite rare. And so I guess my question is as it's going and you know what that's what that's felt like at the read through and everything like that. And it's getting to be like, it's, you know, it's 12 51 52. Did you think there was a possibility that it would not happen because in a way you, you had that moment. Yes. Like you, you've been in the costume before when things are cut literally. I've been in the costume and things are cut. It is completely devastating because you are just like emotionally on edge. You're gearing up for something literally you're in the gear for something and then like it gets taken away from you. I want to say that like because of the Wednesday thing and just like going into that we get all, I was already like blessed by the fact that it was aria's the host share is the musical. Yeah. While my whole thing was how are you supposed to stay after that? And you could never have gone back up to that. I thought after the 50th it could never. I was like, I didn't understand why you were coming back this season. Like just to be candid because I was like, it's after the 50th, you know what I mean? Like it felt like other people were going to leave. And then you went back and now it's like, I'm so grateful you went back. I'm so grateful I went back. And like as the night's going on, like I was completely sent about it. Either way was okay. Either way was okay. Because 80 was there. There was just, I'm sorry, there was like an outpouring. Yeah. People that I hadn't heard from and people that like I'm sorry. It just felt like a really beautiful thing where it was sang earlier. Like as I get on the floor, like I look out, it was like basically like everyone who worked there. I just want the floor showing up. And I just looked out and I thought I'm so lucky that I ever got to work here. And I'm so lucky that I get to make this like little statement that's like barely veiled where I'm like, I love you all. Like it was, I'm so lucky. Yeah. And it's not really like a place where I'm like you said like where emotions get laid bare like that. I feel like people may remember highlights of the show where it feels like that might be the case. But you working their day in and day out year after year, you know, yeah, it's not some place where it's like you're necessarily like free to be like, hey, this is how I'm feeling and I'm expressing it exactly responsibly. Totally. And so that was a question I had for you is, how do you think you've emotionally grown as a result of being on that show and the experiences that you've had doing it? I feel like I've been accelerated in terms of what you know how like a president's the ages you like, yes, 12 years or whatever in one term. Like I feel like completely, I don't know, either I'm like ripened or I'm like rotten. Yeah. You're against the full spectrum of things because you're right. Like working there is completely disregulating emotionally. Like either you are soaring or you are like completely in the dumps. And that's just how like it's like them's the brakes kid. It's like that it's like a show busy blow hard. Not saying this is anyone in particular, but it's just like you are constantly reminded by someone or something or some event where you're like, God, this is just, this is just how it is. This is how it is. And every week you get like a condensed version of like a developmental process on a project let's say. Yeah. And Jesse David Fox writes about this like all three words in SNL Saturday Night Live are about time. And it is just time sort of like encroaching on you emotionally, physically, process wise, creatively. Like it is all those things bearing down on you. And then if you have the time to figure out how to like deal with all of that, then you will be so well equipped for everything else. Yeah. And that doesn't matter if you're on the cast, if you're a writer, if you're in the wardrobe department, if you're in any other place at that show, like it is wow. Every department there is a convocation of the most amazing people with this workman link attitude about showing up and doing the job and not having an ego about it. And then of course there are moments where you have an ego about it. It is like a collective thing. And like I guess there was like some perception that like I felt like exceptional in any way. I really didn't. Anytime I got like some shine on me, my genuine instinct was always to make it about everyone who works there. I mean, I do notice that about you. Like and that's why I was so happy that that moment happened at the end of the show because like I said, I was like, oh wow, it would be very like him for this thing with 80 to be enough for him. Absolutely. Absolutely. But I was really happy that you got more than that because I do think, I mean, you've done it several times today. You've made your experience and you've mentioned you trying to bring me into it. I ain't got nothing to do with this. Yes, you do. You have you experienced like all of this stuff in a way. And one thing I want to say is that not everyone leaves that show and is like ready to positively impact the workforce creatively. I can tell you that. And so the fact that you are leaving intact emotionally, creatively and like in terms of your humanity is like, you know, it's a feat. There was no there was no other way. I'm going to say like it's that Seth Meyers thing where he's like, yeah, or no Mike Schumaker told Seth, you're going to be talking about this for the rest of your life. Like congrats like when you got the job. It's like congratulations. You're going to be talking about this for the rest of your life. That is true. Um, for me, I will try to keep it at like a reasonable volume. I am like, oh God. Sorry, these these thoughts are just coming at me. No, of course. Polar Amy before she left the after party when she hosted the second episode this season puts a hand in my shoulder looks into my eyes and goes, we're all waiting for you on the other side. And I was like, yeah, that's so much. It's like this is crazy. And then that was a good reminder of like, oh my God, I work here and like this is like and there's another side and there's another side and like I just feel like I've died. And like there's like one of my heroes is like looking down at me and like telling me like, and even like 80s been like, there's a really nice life waiting for you after this. You'll miss it every day. Kristen wig. This she texts you. Of course she'll be here in a couple weeks. She'll be here in a couple weeks. But of course she texted me and then I texted her back. I was like, Kristen, like I will never forget like the first time you hosted when I was here. Like the thing you told me was, enjoy it because it's the funest job in the world. I remember when she said that to you. Never forgot. We were talking when we were shooting, Pantan Royale, we were talking about this. And I remember like saying her like because she too also got like a send off like that. And I remember I not to share too much about what we talked about, but I was kind of, I was kind of in my mind. I was like, your best friend and also as someone who watches the show and enjoys the show and the legacy of the show and felt you deserved it. I was like, how do we make it so that he gets like a good, nice moment? And like I think I think that ultimately in terms of the totality of what it could have been, it probably was like beyond your wildest dreams. Yeah. I guess my question is with that, like does Ariana become de facto your favorite host of all time? Yeah. There's no other answer. Sure. And she shares my story. Kiki Palmer. Sorry. You reigned for a while. Sorry Regina King. I love how unselfish the whole thing was. You know what I mean? Like because it takes so much confidence and like so much star quality to come in there like her, her fourth time hosting and knowing, you felt on her in her, in her energy, the being there with you that a her number one goal was servicing that sketch which meant honoring like what was happening for you in it. And she was so there right next to you. But be the like positivity she had that she's going to come back and do that show many, many other times because not every host would be like, yeah, let me give up the whole last sketch of this six minutes of the time for this cast member. But it was her and she did that. And that's not only because she's a good friend, it's because she's a really professional host who doesn't have like an ego about her time, man, which I think is like pretty cool and worth calling out. And the fact that she did not have to walk her ass out there. No. We interrupt your regular programming for a very special announcement Saturday nights are made for Mayhem with celebrity sabotage. Watch me Joe Donnie, me GK Barry, me Sam Thompson and Judy love. It's course some chaos. Do not move a muscle. This is no mad. I got a commercial name. That's a fucking damn. Celebrity sabotage. That's Saturday 21st of March on ITV1 and ITVX. Oh, and the share thing. Okay, I'll get to the share thing. I want to say in terms of the sketch itself, like my only wish is that like we could gotten like a bunch of other cast in there, ideally the entire cast in there because it is just like me just like, I don't know, not imparting anything, but it's just like, I just, I want to be there with like the other people. It did just come down to logistics. Like we did. We had like Mikey and Sarah there in the back just like cleaning up the mess. Oh, and so like the Agnog Machine was supposed to like be on the fritz and like spray everywhere. It was supposed to spray Keeney. It was supposed to spray Jane. It was supposed to spray the people who was spraying. It just kind of got too much. It got to be too much and Lauren came up to me in the last before the show after dressing. He was just like, I think it's better. It's just you guys and you just play into the emotion of it. And he was right. And then Celeste and I were like, Lauren Michaels knows how to produce. So Celeste came back to write that. Celeste came back to write that. We wrote some other stuff too. We wrote a share family reunion, which I'm so sad. Oh, this is a thing. We'll get to share later. This is a thing. You were still getting shit cut at the end. Of course. It's totally totally fine. They were not like, well, you can have this, but you can't have everything. I never look and I'm always like, yeah, yeah, yeah, cut my stuff. Like Keeney still has his stuff cut. Yeah. You don't, I don't necessarily. You don't get a platinum card at the show. No, and my other thing was like, there was like a soft thing maybe where like I would get like, there was a designated like, I was talking to dysmiops about this and James Austin Johnson about this. Like, it did feel like I would get like, there would be like a designated bow and spot in the list of picks on Wednesday. And like, that's also my cue to leave. I do not want the footprint to be edging out other people. Literally, I'm honest to God. That's really noble. That was it. It's just everyone has that. I was just like, no, no, no, no, that can't be it. You know when it's time to go. Right. I'm like, this is the sales whiff that you tailor swift that legend. But anyway, the eras toward documentary, can you imagine? Yes, I can. I can. Wait, wait, wait, wait, so many other things. Wait. Oh, yes. I wish there were other cast in that piece. We did just have to like, if there had to be one. No, stop. Keenan. Oh my God. Keenan. I was so happy they did that. Come on. So I mean, yeah, everybody. And like, I don't know, man, that is a really, I can't believe I got to work there. And I said in the sketch, that is the thing that I will like keep saying, like I can't pull. It feels like it happened to someone else. I'm so glad it happened to me. I am going to pull you into this experience because I got to tell Jenna Rosatana, the stage manager there, one of the many wonderful stage managers there. She's an icon. She's an icon, but I, she kind of cried the hardest out of anybody besides Ari. I was like, Jenna, you, well, first of all, she said something that like destroyed me, which was, and this is not me like bragging. She just goes, I never, she goes, she goes to me. She's seen a lot of behavior on that floor. She's like, I've never seen you raise your voice or be unkind to anyone in the seven years that you were here, which like it means a lot to me. It means a lot to me. Well, that's why everyone hit the floor when you, when you were leaving. But I told her I was like, Jenna, from the very first time I met you, you were just so kind to me because I came down to the hallway outside of the studio just like, right by cue cards because you could kind of hear what's going on on stage. I was like, came down to the floor to listen to your screen test because I was, I just wanted to, I just wanted to like be close and just like, I don't know, send energy or something. And then she was there and she was like, are you lost? And I was like, no, no, I just, my best friend in the whole world is on stage right now. And I just want to, I just want to see how he's doing. And then she, she completely breaks down. She's like, that's your best friend up there. Well, then stay as long as you want. And just she, I see her as like a bridge. I don't know like, I always think of you when I'm with her. And I always think about how kind she was to me and how she loves you. I know I wish I could see her. She loves you. We will go. She wants to get done in March. It's a piano. Oh, let's fucking go. Oh, make lasagna for us. Oh my God. That's just fucking awesome. She's amazing. Jenna Ross, it's Hannah. Watching kids don't get ripped and watching the sopranos. She's the fucking bad. I just, oh God. I'm sorry. I'm an ass. I mean, no, I mean, like it is, it is such a crazy thing in totality. Like there have been so many moments where I'm watching it and I'm like, I can't believe this is happening. I can't believe this is happening. And then at some point that transition to like me like completely just like Marin dating and this experience and then like it of watching you do this show and then it ended in that moment. And I was like, I was like, I was like alone watching it, which felt so crazy. Of course. And like, of course, all of our friends are texting me from the, the, your dressing room and like they're all there. And I could like smell it and feel it. I could feel how hot it was in the room. Like, and I was just like, God, like it really is. But it didn't feel, it felt conclusive. It did not feel final. Oh, interesting. You know what I mean? Like it felt like it was like a wonderful way for this to conclude this chapter, but it didn't feel like, you like, you'll be back on that show hosting. Like, you know what I mean? And I think it's so great that you get to have this great relationship with the show and everyone that works there. And yeah, I mean, just for it to end that wonderfully, I think gives all. The validity to what Janet is saying, it would not have been that way. Had you not done it like a pro, like a kind person and like a talent, like the talent that you are. So I take my hat and all my clothes off to you. Oh, I'm naked. If you can't see, I'm completely nude. I've been completely nude doing this interview, this exit interview, title of app with Bowen. Is there anything else you want to say about it before we talk about heated rivalry or whatever the fuck? Yes. I need to just point out the share element of it, which was we weren't sure if she was going to do it down to like Saturday. Yeah. Because it was like, we wrote a bunch of different versions of it. And she, you know, she just wanted spare dialogue because it's like, she will tell you, she's a dyslexic icon. Yes. Oh my God. We have it. We also haven't talked about her memoir, which whatever. Well, we will definitely Jay Block doing the, it trades out between share and Stephanie Jay Block doing the reading together because she's like, you're going to notice that someone besides me is on the, is on the audio book and it's the wonderful Stephanie Jay Block who played me in the share show and whatever. By the way, okay, we were just, what a gig to score for Stephanie Jay Block. Yeah. Yeah. Such a gig. We were to share a family reunion. It did not go, but I, but Celeste and I had the perfect experience of running around on Wednesday to all the cast offices because they're like, I don't have a share. I'm like, ah, straight people don't have a share. Gay guys do. Yeah. Every gay guy has a share. Every gay guy has the same share. Oh, you know, like they kind of understood what that was. Snap out of it. I had to tell them, I had to tell them that snap out of it, but it's like, I did a teach Ashley Padilla. You had to tell people about snap out of it. It was beautiful. Oh, no, I didn't have to tell them that snap out of it. People just don't know the culture anymore. People just don't know the culture. And this is not a nod. This is not just to, to like, um, evaluate anything about shares legacy or cultural impact. It's just that like, it's a gay guy thing to like have share in their bones. Anyway, um, we weren't sure if she was going to do it. Then Saturday she, uh, confirms, we're so excited. And then she, uh, you know, she was always going to be the boss. But then like, we wrote, we wrote her like a, like, some zingy, like, roasty lines. Like the original line was something along the lines of like, I was like, do you have any feedback for me? And she would say something like, you know, even for me, you were a little bit too gay or something like that. But then she was like, I want to, I don't, she was like, I want to be kind. She was like, can I just say like you were perfect? Mm hmm. And I'll, she was like, I just want to kiss some, yeah, or something. And then like, and then we had to go and like, pitch to her that she would maybe sing if we would love for if she sang with us at the end. And because that was a question mark two and then we go down, I, I go to her dressing room. Oh, man. And I was like, so it's, please come up from Christmas by the Eagles and Charles Brown and you've covered it. And I loved her cover of it on the album. And she was like, okay, but what part do you want me to sing? And I was like, it's just going to be the end. So do you want to run it? And I was like, oh my God. I was like, there'll be no more sorrow, not to grieve and pain. And then as far away from me as this microphone is, she's like, she's like, it is close to me. And then with the full force of share, my God. She goes, no, be happy. That's a, that's a, that, it wasn't like that. She did not crap, but she just gave me full, full force share directed at. And I was like, it felt like a card crashed into me. I was, yeah, I'm, I can't believe, I can't believe every second of that. She did that. Yeah. Anyway, that's all I have to say. Let's talk to you, did rivalry. He is ended the conversation. Everybody, even though this was my interview. Oh, well, anything else you want to ask? You've been so thorough. Really? I do know all of it. Like I said, you get shocked me with anything. Yeah. I don't know. Is there anything else? I mean, not really, I guess. What's next for you? Oh, what is next for you? Wait. What's next? You should we say anything? Wonderful things. Well, I love this like press run of like Bowen's first major project post SNL is two guys five. Oh, I love it. Not that I'm not honored to have that technically be the first project post SNL. It's like, well, that's not. Yeah, the Olympics podcast we're doing. I mean, we are going to Milan. We actually, we have a very fun next few months. Yes. So it's funny because like we do have to, we have to execute this movie. Yes. We have to write our book. Yes. We got to get the new culture awards together. That's going to be very fun. We have to, we have some other things that have not hit the trades. But there's, there's a long list of things. And so that's another thing is I was like, to be honest with you, it like really wasn't tenable for you to keep working on the show because we're going to be in debt soon to these people. Yes. Which is so exciting, I think. It's like, there is, it's not even like what's the next act? It's like, there is a next act just wait. Like it's like, you don't have to decide or anything. If you added things to our and your plate, that would be great. But you don't even need to bitch. And so, and I just want to make sure that you know that the pace at which you've been going in the workload that you've had has been abnormal. And so it's going to feel a little bit like less. And I just, I feel like as someone who, it's really interesting because like I have had this whole other like career outside of like what you've had. Like I feel like you got to develop for such a, for seven and a half years at this show and like everything. And my resume is like a little bit different. Like for me, it's like a ton of other things. And I got, I've had a lot of different experiences. And you are so perfect at all of them. But well, I do think that sometimes it was a little bit like because it's like when you are right next to someone else, like all you have to do is like compare yourself to that. It's like, you know what I mean? It's like with like sisters or like twins. It's like if something happens to one, the other one almost feels like why isn't it happening to me? So I do feel like sometimes I would like overcorrect and like really, really, really push myself to make sure that like I would develop in an equal way alongside of you. And like in so many ways, I feel like, and it doesn't really matter what I feel like because as a result of existing and working and caring, you do develop. But just outside of all that, like one thing that I've had to learn and I think now you'll be forced to learn is balanced. Yes. And I think that I hope that it cites you and doesn't start to make you anxious and nervous because that's a certain point. I just, I'm telling you like you can always tell me if it does and you can always vocalize to like on camera. I'll say this like you're a therapist and stuff like that. Like you know what I mean? Like be checking in about what it's going to feel like to suddenly not have an abnormal schedule. Truly, you know, I'm on it. Yeah. I think it's going to be okay. I will make room for like moments where it feels really bizarre or maybe even bad. You should be bored. I can't. Oh, don't even worry. Well, the thing is it's so funny because like literally we're not like you, so you're we're going to Tokyo. We're going to Japan. We're going to Milan. We're going to Milan. We're full on continuing this podcast. Like full steam. We got a new contract and everything bitch. We got a new set. And can I just say I want a new picture? We're going to get a new picture. We tried this one. I like it. But let's let's let's we we need to see our faces. You this was so I can't the one of us naked and like this and you were like that was so iconic that I feel like you go back to it. I don't think we go back to it. I think I think we have a picture that works. Okay. I think maybe we do an animation on it. Oh, but anyway, so this is just for us. But what I was saying was like, um, you're going to you're going to go to tell everyone where you're going after Milan. I am going to Santiago and then through Drake's Drake's passage and Arctica with my parents because that is I think it's I'm going to say it's my mom's dream and dark to get a trip with my parents is so crazy. I'm going to see the penguins. We're going to get our sea legs. I think I'm going to Vom on this boat. Are you guys sick? The rough the water. The roughest waters. It's the roughest waters. Um, but oh my god, I'm going to see we have to like order like special parkas for this. Like my mom when when she came when they came for Thanksgiving, they stayed with me and my mom was just like whatever, like helping me clean the apartment, but it's just like on loop. The entire time or just on an auto mixed playlist, just content about this boat and Antarctica people and. Steerage just like vomiting. Like it this is she needs this to happen. And I need it to have I think this is what I'm saying. I'm like firehousing myself with new experience. So how many continents will that mean you've visited? Five. Um, the only one that I'll have not visited by the end will be Africa. You've been to South America. I will have Santiago. Oh, right. So yes, of course, that'll that'll that'll take that's Chile. Yeah. That'll check to anyway. I've randomly been to South America. I've randomly been to Bogota right. By the way, my God speaking of South America. So all this Venezuela stuff. Stuff. My you know my aunt used to live in Venezuela. No shut up. Ant Chrissy. What? Yeah. So what does she think about all this? She's like, so I asked her. I was like, I was like, so what are your friends? They're thinking. She was like, honestly, like, they're, they're free. They're relieved. But she also is like, we'll see what happens in the next few weeks. Like, because certainly chaos is going to break out. Like, well, this is, this is all worked out so great in the past when we've been a part of regime. Exactly. I mean, but, but the thing is like, and I've seen some, some friends of mine who are ven as well and are like sort of saying like, you know, if you don't understand this, like don't say anything, it's not as simple as like, like, when I do all of it. My one friend shared like, you know, if you're drowning and someone throws you a life raft, you don't question where it came from. It just, you just take it and then as well as has been drowning. So that was like a take I hadn't considered because, you know, the vast response to it is like, this is illegal. What he's done. This is, you know, this is exactly like Iraq, you know, this is et cetera. And I think all those things are true. But it's been an interesting perspective to literally ask my, I mean, so my aunt was married to a guy from Venezuela back when they were a wealthy country. I didn't realize Chrissy was down there. So she was hurt my, my former uncle Maurice, like they were married and they got divorced because he was an asshole, but they were wealthy. And then Venezuela was at one time like prosperous. So she still got friends back from that era and they are not feeling like that anymore. Like it's gone off a cliff like under like the regime of the past like 30 years. But it's been an interesting thing like just to look a little bit beyond the initial reactions to what's going on. It is yet another complicated international moment. But yeah, it's just been really interesting. And I realized I had like a, like a literal resource to people there. Yeah. Yeah. You and Chanel should trade spots on the today. You should be behind the desk. I should go to the right. I should become a right real journalist. You should. Yeah. I mean, not now. I almost did. You know, I went, you know that I was initially a, yes, you were a journalist. Journalism major. I thought I wanted to be Ryan Seacrest. You, not even though he's not really a journalist. Yes, sure he is. I don't know. Is Ryan Seacrest a journalist? So I initially I was like, I want to go to school for broadcast journalism. Yes. So I can hopefully one day get like a radio show and then maybe host something like American Idol. But the whole time look underneath that. I wanted to be an actor. Yes. Loki, like a singer. And so like that was always buried underneath what I could package me wanting to be in the entertainment industry with which was at first broadcast journalism because that didn't seem to gay. Of course. And then comedy because that really didn't seem gay. That seemed like edgy and fun and something that like I could tell straight man and straight people in my life that I was doing and it was cool. It's like a way to be on stage. That's not gay. Right. But I eventually like realized I am gay. But isn't that the tension with this. Sooty has this, right? Like you just want to tell like any any guy who like doesn't see it as theater or you're like it's theater. Yeah. It's like you during something gay dude. You're doing something. You're up on stage being like, Hey, I'm in a full face of makeup like and I'm mic'd. Now gay is to get my someone has to run a cord down your shirt. It's so much and then they have to like look and they have to like meticulously work on your collar is like gay. Yeah. Well, even just like stool in a water bottle. Yeah. That's still technically considered like set a stool is one of the gays chairs. It's real culture number 11. A school is one of the gays chairs. One of the gays chairs. I'm gonna go on a sat on one or kneel down one for her second album and gay culture was never the same and gay culture was never what's your favorite Ariana album. Oh, that's so hard. Production on it. Why is it sweetener? Just kidding. No, I'm not from it. It's actually positions. You love positions. I'm a I'm a dangerous woman. Stand forever. Freak. Freak forever. Love dangerous woman. She coming back on the show. Can we you test texture? Yeah, well, it's actually she. Well, I was going to say she obviously. If she doesn't do the culture words this year, it's because there are she's got a million other things going on. She obviously wants to do it. Oh my God. By the way, you know what? Just came out and we didn't even realize that sag and domination. Oh, that's right. Shall we read them live? Let's read them. Okay, wait, this is exciting. Before we do this, did you watch the critics choice and everything? I did not watch the critics choice. It's looking like Miss Madigan has taken that Academy Award, babe. Jacob. Surprise. Yeah. Huge surprise. Huge surprise. Okay. What is this? This says, oh, to be revealed on Wednesday. I can't. Sorry guys. No problem. So they'll be out today. We're losing into this in the morning. But yeah, yeah, yeah. I did not watch critics choice. I watched it. What are your thoughts? So the winners were Chalamet. I think it's his year. Chalamet, Jesse. Jesse Buckley. I haven't seen Hamnet because I want to like, so this is the thing. You want to watch it? You should watch it on the plane to Tokyo. Maybe I will. Yeah. I just, I need to be in the clear. I'm a little bit emotionally raw right now. Yes, yes. And I need to be in the clear with something like that. Totally. You know what I'm realizing? It's like, it has to be the right time for me with some of these movies. I understand. Hamnet, I was going to go see it like a screening and I was like, I just don't think it's like the right time. I'm going to be destroyed. So I didn't get to see it. And also I can't find four hours to devote to Avatar. I can't, I can't, I at the present time can't do it. I understand. Because it's just three hours. I had tickets. Right. We were going to go with the band. Yes. And on the road and I was like, hmm, with our precious time here, between rehearsing and traveling and doing shows like, two, watch a three hour, 17 minute movie that's going to have over half an hour of previews, nothing you have to get there, whatever. That's like an almost four and a half hour commitment. And I don't know what it is. I always enjoy the Avatar movies. You know, my baby is strong. My baby is strong. I hear the whales have a great dialogue in this one. And that's going to help me get there. It is. I also heard this Una Chaplin. Una Chaplin. What was the character she plays? Pro Yang or Pro Vong? Who's seen the movie? You have. Varong. Varong. Does she give? I hear she gives. I hear, I hear, I hear Varong is the star. All right. Well, I'm going to go. It's just that there hasn't been ample time. I've been, I've weirdly like not stopped being busy. That's so weird of you. Yes. Of course. The tour, just to speak on the tour, the tour was like the best version of the tour ever. And I'm really, I didn't even give you the space in the flowers. Congratulations. It's like not my name. Christmas and December. Yes, it is. Man, it's your name. That's your name. No, it's both of our days. I have had a, you keep evolving the show. You keep evolving the show several months. Yes, you have. The tour was the same in Grace that it always is for me. It like has, it was the best version of it ever. You sounded amazing. And this is my first year where I wasn't able to see it live, which I'm very sad about. It's all good because I literally spoke to our agent last night. So candidly like six weeks ago, I was like, maybe this is it. I was like, maybe this is the last year because I was just a lot. You know what? Like I'll just like on up to this. Like I've been feeling, I've been feeling a more self-conscious and a little bit more vulnerable to people's opinion. And I think that like one of the things that happened when I was doing the tour is I was just like, just there with me and the band, which is like, we're such like a literal like unit on the road. We have so much fun. This was the most fun year yet. And everyone that had come to pace and see that show and like, I felt such like a duty to make it the best one yet. And I think that was what was giving me such anxiety was I felt like this weird combination of like self-consciousness about whether I was going to be able to deliver a product to that I that is good enough like for me to show everyone and get people out buying tickets and still come into the show. But also that was like in the face of me being really like like I hate to say it, but like caring what people thought and we're saying and like just super aware that like I think that what you experienced like four years ago or maybe four or five years ago with becoming like a lot more recognizable I experienced in the past like year. Yeah. And I also when I always try to like shy away from saying something like that because again I compare myself to someone like you who's like much much more recognizable and much much has much much more notoriety because of the platform that you're on. But I also like it wasn't serving me to deny that my reality was changing because it did. And like a lot of the things that people will say online when they're really mean is like he is no talent like he's just writing on Bowen's co-tales the most untrue thing. And the thing is like with the show and like when I the concert with my like my Christmas show. Yeah. And with like you know being involved in things with people even just doing things like today show like being on Pomeroyale like I was in that movie Good Fortune like you know what I mean like I've had a busy year and doing the cultural awards like was so edifying and came I just ended the year being like all that is such bullshit like this is what I'm supposed to be doing and I will always do. I never in the beginning when I was developing myself and my talent in my career ever had any doubts about that. And then suddenly like I don't know if it's because the cultural awards like truly took me for a ride and I had to reexamine a lot about my anxiety and stuff like that. And whether or not I enjoyed a lot of the elements that come along with putting yourself out there and being in the entertainment industry. I can fully confidently say at the end of this year that as long as I keep the focus on what matters which is the work and how I'm making people feel and how I'm feel doing something I have no doubt in my mind that I love this and that I will always do it. But I was having a hard time. I understand. And I also just want to say you were meant for this. You are the funniest most talented person I know. That's subjective and you are a bio writer who contrast work ethic with that contract. And so he has to say this. Yes, that was actually made sure that was in the contract. I was happy to sign now say my mile time. Mile time is 436. Very good. But anyway, recurring joke on two guys five rings. I literally what I mean to say is I literally have the conversation with our touring agent Joe last night that we're going to do it again. Yes. So I'm going to do it again and I'm always going to do it probably in some as long as Henry Capernaisky doesn't bail on me. And he already texted me like literally the day or two after the tour ended. And he was like, I already have so many ideas for next year. I'm so excited. I love that. And that was so different than what the energy was like three or four years ago where you would end things. He fully told me like I don't want to do it again. I feel like we need to leave a good thing. And then I was like, just give me one more year. I was like, you know, I'll I will train my voice with a with a coach so that you don't have to do it or get me ready as much like I'll come to rehearsals really prepared. Oh man. I will work on, you know, it was hard when it was just he and I of course, you know what I mean? It was he was he was my ex boyfriend, right? It was just he and I traveling around the country and I was like, not the train singer I am now, you know what I mean? And so sometimes tech was hard or whatever, but I worked on it really hard. And I've I've worked on myself really hard. And I'm finally doing things like without saying too much like recently that really put me first and have a belief in myself worth. And I'm so serious this year. I'm not I'm not engaging with the online. No, no, no, I'll say something like that. It does not serve me. I'll say something about that. It doesn't serve you. No, of course. But the the thing about you being just you and Henry, like this is something that even I forgot, but that is like the gumption and the resourcefulness and like the like self-leaning thing that you've had to like depend on for all these years. Like Matt, you've like think of like how that's developed over like the past five years. Like that is so. Well, it really makes me feel like anything is like possible with people in your life. Because like he and I are truly like soul connected in terms of like what we create what we do. And sometimes when I'm doing the show, especially towards the end of the tour, like I'll look back at him and I'll be like, I can't believe that's still that person. I know. You know what I mean? Like I cannot believe that that person is still around. Especially after like, you know, how stupid you are when you're like 26, 27 years old and how you treat people that are close to you and how how like you really have to like stick with people, especially like through your late 20s, early 30s and then not everyone is supposed to stick around. No, but I'm like so happy that he has and it connects me to Ethan, his partner now who's like makes my tour better. He's the tour manager, et cetera. I've had like no emotional release since then. So it's like because I stayed really busy and just like a lot's been going on. But yeah, like I just I'm super grateful. I'm super grateful that everything shook out that with obviously with that project. But with him, I mean, that's really the most important thing. Like at the end of the show, like the band takes a bow and then I make sure that just Henry and I take a bow. Like he truly like, you know, you guys, people that know the Lord know the Lord. The Lord is truly profound. It's like you guys really boosted each other up from like what didn't seem like any sort of like, I don't know, like low point, but it's like we were all like we didn't really know like how and that's a beautiful thing. We didn't really know how much we were like struggling and it wasn't even I don't want to frame it as a struggle either. We were just like really working really hard like we did not. Yeah, we did not come from this. With like, I don't know like with too many like blessings besides like the obvious ones. Yeah. And like this is not to make this about me, but this is like our dichotomy you and I is always and I feel completely great about this. Like I feel like I see like my track on like in the last seven years is like me being a part of something that like affords me a lot of things and you being almost exclusively a self starter. Like you get to look at this tour as like your creation, your and Henry's beautiful thing that you've built together and I get to be like, oh, I've, I had a great time. I had a great time on this thing that like on this very well oiled machine. Well we started this girl. That's true. And I think we take this for granted a lot of for sure. I think we take this for granted a lot. And I feel like, you know, this is like the, this is the first episode of the 10th year of the podcast. And that's like crazy. Crazy. And I think the reason we don't think of it sometimes as like even though we do a lot of work for it. Because I don't realize how much work I'm doing for it. Like you know what I mean? Like sometimes I'm like, whoa, like I just spent hours like working on the podcast. And I think because it's rude and something that is so easy, which is like talking to you and like our friendship. But I am sensitive about this. Yes. Like I'm really sensitive about this podcast. And well, I guess what I want people to know is like, like we are working so hard and we're still even before we started rolling. We sat here for like 10 minutes being like what like really thinking about the color of the chairs for the set. You know what I mean? Like really caring about and think who we put on this podcast and what we share and how we get out of them and how we deliver to you. I mean, I will, I will be transparent and say that man, I've had turned down many people. Not people. I'm saying a lot of money. Yes. For deals where like it would compromise the way that this gets delivered. I'm just going to we're just going to are we are we are I feel like I feel fine. I feel good about saying like because it is true. And this is I guess again, what I want to say is that like we have earned the right to do this the way we want to do it. I'm so fucking lounging that being said that being said. Let's talk about some culture. Last last last thing. Last thing I'll say about like the like about like what's being said and like being sensitive to that. The reason why I was also very emotional the last show and just seeing like that sort of thing being like directed my way that kind of that outpouring as I said earlier of love. Yeah. It's because it completely undid this other narrative that was running parallel in my mind. Yeah. The very vocal loud one. Whereas I think the love one is like was there all along. I just wasn't too attuned to it. But the vocal loud other track that was going on was like. Yeah. Listen, like everyone who works at that show engages on different levels with like the comments. Right. It gets to us because it's weekend and week out and you really don't ever get a break to be like, oh, let me not engage. No, and they're so consistent. And even the alums are like, I don't know how you guys do it now. Yeah. They would be like one review. Right. New York magazine on Sunday and then that would be it. And everyone going on about their lives. Do you remember years ago Tina Fey, like one in Emmy and she used, I remember at the time watching it and her speech was mostly used to respond to online commenters. She's a whole chapter in bossy pants about it. Yes. And I realize now that that was not purely ironic. No. No. And that's okay. It's okay because this doesn't make any fucking sense the way that anyone that we have that we are openly available to read anyone else's thoughts about what we do. And yeah. And so this is what I'll say about like the commenters for me, which is like, I feel like I was really bowed down the entire time I was there about like the idea that like there was no range or anything I did. That's just such a lazy. Big critique. Well, it's just there's it's not lazy. It's just it makes sense in terms of like they're being like. They're being like an indigestion as it were with like receiving me where I'm like, I knew I was never going to play the dad. I was never going to play, you know, the generic thing in sketches where it's a sketch show, each thing is like four minutes long. It is shortened collapsed by sort of necessity. And so therefore it plays on archetypes. These archetypes are also in a relationship with like generic things. And there is a genericism in whiteness and in like being like a canvas to like build upon. And like I had like I came in sort of like pre stretched pre died, whatever. You know, like people had their overdeterminations on like what I was, which was like, Oh, that's just the gauge and guy in SNL. And so anytime I would try to like work outside of that, it got completely ignored or it's still got collapsed too. Oh, he's an age he's he's being engaged in so many things that were first of all, it is a I don't think people necessarily know they're being homophobic when they say they're 100%. But it is because I'm sorry, but if you don't have range, I think range is a myth. And it's all about like palatability, whether there's a surp, whether you're getting taxed on it or you are subsidized. You know what I mean? Do they knock Pete Davidson for range or does he get to get away with it because it's cool and like within a male gaze? I could. I could. Is that wrong or right? I could teach like a media studies like seminar about this, I think. I bet you should. You both, you both of us could. I'll be the TA because that because you know what they do. Nothing. They have no range. So this is the thing. I just bring this up because that is one little thing that I wanted to like that I'm getting so much clarity on. It's the reason I'm a wife, been so emotional about the posts, like the post script of this. You talking about all the work you put into the tour into your projects into this show. That is all running count. That is that is the panacea to all of that noise. It's not real. And it's not real and it's so easily debunked. Well, that's what drives me crazy is I know I could live and kill these people in a second. Of course. And George, George Severus was saying this on straighter lab, it's like there's like a phenomenon going on now where like there's like a it's kind of like pleuribus. It's like there's like the remaining people. There's like a survivor ship thing happening where it's like the remaining people in the comments are either like clearly bots or clearly mentally ill or truly children or 12. And it says they're all 12. There's one person online who constantly comes for me. And I realized recently that they're 13 right. I it became very clear to me that they look kid. And I was just like, Oh God, how much brain space have I been angry at this 13? I know. And you know, they're failing pre algebra. It's sad. It's like, Oh, the fact that you're obsessed with me means that you are not doing well. You're not selling girl scout cookies this year. I mean, and that my thing is just like and and I don't it's I'm not we're not dunking on that person. No, no, no, it's reality. You're just 13 on the internet. So you have every right to do that. I am an idiot for investing in it. And like it's an opinion, but I was using the fucking reddit as a report card. No, no, no, you can't do that. First of all, that's right. A report card kid. I'm invisible to that reddit. Meanwhile, they're all I don't get it. Like we need Matt's takes on heater bribery. Oh, I'm I'm in the recently look at it. I did. I'm like, I'm on this show too. By the way, whenever they just mentioned me, it's because they love the attached. I think that I am I feel more accessible to them because I'm not actually a list famous. I also think I think they think they know what you think about heated rivalry. Let's get into it. Sure. He's just thinking about heated rivalry. A show can be so amazing and incredible even if there's virtually zero conflict in it. I fucking love it. I'm obsessed with the show. I'm obsessed with it. Did you ever come to the show? I never touched my dick once. I think I paused, walked around like how to snack it then I jerked off. I wasn't like, oh, let me, you know what? Before I watched it, I jerked off to it because I was like, I'm not going to watch that. Might as well just use it what it's for porn because I had been told so many times this is porn. Right. And then I was like, wow, this is a cultural phenomenon I must pay attention to. You cannot, because suddenly it was all over my algorithm. Someone that hadn't even watched it. I was like, okay, the world is deciding it's this. It was as big as white lotus. I would say so. So finally, I watch it. Here's my two takes. It's not porn. Right. I did not think that I thought it was explicit. I did not think it was grotesque. It did not feel too much. I wasn't, maybe I just watched too much porn. I wasn't like, um, clutching my parole, watching it. I was like, oh, this looks like hot sex to me. Hot movie sex to me. I was like, oh, look at the framing on that. There's a lot of negative space above their asses. That you don't see that that. Can I say something? This is, it is all love to Jordan Firstman. I think he's probably sorry. He said this about like, gay guys don't have sex like that. Like I don't need to see someone pull out their dick and a little bit of poop on it. Like I'm sorry. That's what gay sex is like. That's what gay sex is like. I don't need that in heated rivalry. The romance show. This is, this is the, I know. This is the, this is also like dovetails on my, on my first comment about heated rivalry which is like no conflict. It's because it is a fantasy. It's because it's, this is the, this is like the romance genre. It's like every word, every detail is engineered to make you obsessed with it. Yep. And it worked. And, and, and welcome to the Fujoshi community. Like I've known about this world since I was 12 on fictionpress.com where the people who were writing the best, Yahweh, Gay, Shit were women. Listen, I think, I think, if you're still out there, she was the queen of Yahweh fiction. Yeah. I was like, Oh, it's, oh, the straight cis women love the gay stuff and are the best at writing it for some reason. Do you want to know what Rachel Reed? At first of all, she has imagination and writing about it. And then like a gay, a gay man did create the show. Like, and so he is in charge of like the way it disseminates from the page of the novel to the screen. And he did an amazing job. And I do think he's being erased a little bit in this commentary about like, oh, no, no, no, no. It's straight guys playing those roles. My second point is you do not know that they're not gay totally. And I don't care. Oh, but also I don't care. I don't think, well, at this point, it's like the target keeps moving for this discourse because like, oh, say it. So dimwak, so dimwaw fucking like docks, shit about. They're on the way down. I'm like, they're on the way down. First of all, they fucking, dimwaw and page six are just spewing lies that like my PR team has been like, that's not true. I did not get a lot of money thrown at me. No, he did not. Which is all good. I still did it. Still loved it. Yeah. I don't have some like development deal coming. Trying to make this whole thing out of how there was so much drama about me leaving the show about how Lauren was pissed. It's all good. I clearly otherwise that none of that would have happened. That would not have made it to television. And then I'm like, when were you talking to me? Whatever. It's fucking idiots, including just whatever. It's not. He just said, dimwaw, because years ago they did like a celebrity who's nice, who's naughty list. And they said, I was naughty. I'm nice to literally every single person I meet. Every single person. I literally, I don't know where they got that. It's it's it's chimsy, it's Perez. It's like it's all the fucking morales. Oh, I'm ashamed anyway. Anyway, let's move on. Anyway, okay, but uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, yeah. Oh, uh, yeah. It keeps me moving. But don't you, and are do you say that because it's like, it's like the, the, the, the fervor about the show is like, I obviously think it means that like, it means a really good thing in that we can actually have, because we're always saying the reason why they won't do stuff with like gay stories is because we feel there's anic factor around gay sex, right? Like, it feels like outside of the straight male gaze in a way that's like too uncomfortable. There's object theory. Right. And now it's like, oh, you guys like it. Yeah. I mean, huge, like literally huge. So I think that's, that's good. But like, I think the fact that we don't exactly necessarily have a finger on their sexuality allows that to be true because I think if that's true, explicit gay guys, like you had scenes that were just as hot as that in a show that was quote unquote better than that with fellow travelers and no one said a word. We didn't even, like, and those were two out gay guys. Of course. Yeah, I mean, there's certainly something there. I mean, there's a dialectic in this for sure where it's like people are like, it should only, it should only be in the bedroom. Well, that's like a fucking Republican talking point. Right. It's like, okay, let's like, we got to figure out like there, it lives in the middle of like they should share everything about their sexuality and their sexual lives in real life. And they should share nothing. It's like, whatever. It's like, they performed it so well. They was great. You have a Connor story. Mark my words. He will win an Oscar one day. He is really talented. And I love Hudson's performance. He's the one who makes me really horny. Oh, it's the Nipple. It honestly is. He's got a very unique Nipple. Very red. That reminds me of Chad Michael Murray years ago. Oh, did he have pepperoni? They were like appetizer plates. Yummy. They were huge red and more. They literally were, I remember there was it, there was, his, he was always like, he was so hot. Chad Michael. He actually was, he was one of those guys when I was like coming of age and like getting into my sexuality. That would make me angry. Another one, Justin Timberlake red nipples. They were red. Redder pink. Can we look it up? Matt. Matt is a hotter. Like can someone just Google Justin Timberlake nipples? They just sold their New York City apartment for 40 million. That seems like too much. Feels like trouble. I'm trying to. Oh, what are we? Demois. Yeah, I guess so. Well, they're on the way out. Should we just be do Mo now? Demois over. Demois over. Oh, we would love to be do Mo. We're not some like anonymous gossip girl you want to be like, I can't stand. But anyway, yeah, no, there's something about Hudson that just like, it was like immediately or totally not so sweet. We wrote so we wrote two versions of Bowen is straight for the last two shows. One with Josh O'Connor where we do a challenge is my motel Lillia. I can't believe this. I didn't do this. We got. I read the script. It was a dumb decision. We got to have him say it was like, you know, we got him to say and he was laughing through the scene. Those are pink. Those are not red. Oh, this of no strings attached. I know every screen grab. Justin Timberlake nipple without the Janet Jackson thing keeps popping up. I think Hudson's are more red. I think CMM's Chad Michael Murray's are. I can picture him having red nipple. Hudson's are red. Oh, I can't believe we're talking about his. It's not those things that it's friends with benefits. Famously the other one that year. By the way, you've Googled this and it's from Instagram and it's just a fan pages screenshot of this and the caption is this. Justin Timberlake shirtless is one of the best parts of the movie friends with benefits. So sexy heart. Thank you, man. Thank you so much. What was I going to say to the heater rivalry of it all just like what I was going to say was I don't care that if they're gay or not, they performed it with honesty and they were really committed and they have unbelievable chemistry. I don't care that they don't come out and say what their sexuality is because what's important is the representation that is on the screen. Right. It gets becoming a little bit narcissistic for actors to be like, no, it needs to be me. That does it. It needs to be me. That does it. It needs to be honest. It gets to a point sometimes with sexuality where I'm like, guys, we're putting the cart for the course a little bit here. Like we have to make them first if they don't exist. I'm serious. Well, my thing is, and I might, this will probably get some sort of, please write in. Please talk me down from this. Y'all, listeners, readers, Katie's, both of the spineless calls. I feel like performing sexuality or queerness is like because queerness is like an internal experience. It's different than like, oh, well, this person ethnically should be played by this ethnic person. That, I totally, right, makes sense to me. I think there's more room to like, I don't know, be like not necessarily exactly. It's like, well, what's, you know, I don't know if Connor is by. You know, it's like, would it be better if Connor was gay or if Connor was by? You know what I mean? I think where we start splitting hairs. And so then, so my, my thing is always, it's an interior experience. There for it's okay, but also, you know, this other thing of like, we're not supporting gay creators. Well, I don't know, like we're a perfect example. So it's like, anytime we get a press release announcement for something we're working on people fucking meltdown about it. The ones on gay Twitter who just can't stand that we have. It's anything. It's fine. It's like, it is what it is, but like, don't pretend that you're rooting for gay guys all the time. Like, don't pretend you're rooting for gay guys when like, you bone yang takes a fucking shit and it's he can do anything right. Right. Exactly. Like, that's my, that's my like, stitch together take. My other thing about heated rivalry, which I, I go back and forth on, whether I love or if I'm like, huh, is like, this story takes place over like seven years. All the needle drops are songs from 2007. Oh, it's like, give me your eyes. I need a sun dry. It's like, why that's playing in a scene that's happening in like 2017? No problem. A little bit of a vibe of hunting wives where you can tell of it. So it's, it's a little, by the way, I think both produce by three yards. Love it. It's just a little cheaply done. No. Wait. What? Oh, yeah, you're right. Even Francois or Noah's like, this, all this Miley Cyrus stuff, it's like, we don't have a Miley budget for like, her to write a song for us. Right. It's like, oh, they will now. They will now. But I guess what I'm saying is there's something charming about it? Yes. Something charming about like how we had no budget for the culture. Yeah. I mean, there's something charming about like, you know, watching this get thrown together, but the thing that really, and that's why the thing that really makes it work is their chemistry and their performances. And I'm loving them on the press store. Neat. They're nailing it. It looks fun to me. I'm like, Steve, it should, that's I guess what sells something is when someone is out there having fun. You know what? Like, people have a lot to say about Timothy Shalameh. I think he needs to put his foot on the gas on this, on the, whatever he's in. You know what they get? No, I mean, I'm just on top of the sphere. More. Oh, you're crazy. You know, he was nervous. He took a beta blocker. Oh, yeah. That's, that's an ancient boy. Beta blockers are life saving tools. Absolutely. This is, this is one of the greatest inventions in modern, modern, and modern, and modern and modern, and modern and modern. And a lot of, that's tough. They should, they could have named that better. That's because that's giving me, that's getting my heart rate up. Did you ever watch, I guess, I don't know, what else does he have, but he did rivalry. It rocks. It rocks. I loved. I, I was late to it because I was like, there's no way. And then I felt the way everyone else felt. I talked to someone and you know what they said? What? They said, he did rivalry gave me everything I was expecting from wife of a show girl. Oh. And I was like, why not me? I was like, I don't know this necessarily tracks. But then he was like, let me explain. And by the way, I like live of a show girl. And if you think I'm lying, cop to me on the streets, cop to me on the streets and tell me that you think I'm lying and I'll show you my recently played. Wow. I covered Elizabeth Taylor on the road and you said that I'm in my life of a show girl era. You are in your life of a show girl, or era, I can't say what? That's interesting. I'm getting a football player. No, I'm just kidding. I can't say whatever I'm in. But anyway, um, this person telling you that, oh, they were like, it's a pop album. They're like, it has all those little bursts. And it's like fun. And it feels like, like, like, it's going to, like, it just feels like, um, non-caloric, not in the way that you're going to be okay. But then by the end, you're like, wow, surprised. I feel full. You know what I mean? Surprise. Oh, I felt very full because I was like, yeah, because like for the first, the first three episodes was like, okay, this is, yeah, I'm along for the ride, but I'm not sure what to track. I'm so five. I was like, this is cinema. Oh, no, episode, at the end of episode five, I was like, well, I'm coming to the cottage. I was like, and I was like, wait, and then you know it's one of the highest rated episodes on IMDB, like, ever. Perfect. It's up there with like white caps from the other sopranos. I love that. I didn't rush the town. I love that. I love that. You have made a fool of me for years with these horns. I'm Carmella. You're a car, Matt. You are Carmella. Oh my God. You're a little bit more melfy. Are you laughing because you know it's true? She's, she's an icon. A full blown. It's the glasses. It's the glasses. It's the Bronco of it all. Right, right, right. Um, um, um, wait, the cottage. You, this is, this is the thing. My fantasy is on a lake house in Ontario. I know you've been saying that. I can't believe, I can't believe it. You can still do it. I can still do it. He feels like he can't do it anymore. He's like, uh, now that the cottage is in culture, I can't have the cottage. Now that, not that an Asian guy has a cottage in Ontario, I can't do it. Um, no, I understand what they're saying now about it being life of a show girl because it is, um, it is giving you a sense of safety. Yeah. Because this is the thing about like the no conflict thing. I'm not being snorkey by the way. I'm just saying like I love the fact that it's like, ah, here's a problem. My dad's home with a boy back two things later. He's dead. Ah, here's a problem. Spoiler alert. Sorry. Parents aren't, aren't going to be okay with the fact that I'm gay two things later. We love that you're gay. You're perfect. We love that you're gay. We love that you're gay. Why didn't you text me back? No problem. Two things later. You're in love. And honestly, it was like as bad as their communication was. Oh, this is why I wanted to say it surprised me so much and why I loved it because you know what it reminded me of. One of my favorite movies, Love and Basketball. Oh, yes, you've said this. So it reminded me so much of Love and Basketball, which is a classic and it's actually criterion. And if you didn't know now, you know, Gene, a Prince, Byth, Wood, an underrated director, by the way, um, who's gone on to do so many more things since then, she actually did the woman king. So good. And um, but what I loved about it was like the time lapse really helped the romance. The fact that it was like sports, but not really, right. Like they were passionate about something else and also each other. Yes. The fact that it was like, will they won't they over the years? Like you believeably felt like you were growing alongside them, but it moved quickly. You know what I mean? Like I just like, and it was very sexy. Like Alan B. I think it would have felt weird if it was like chased sexuality and the gay show because gay guys just be, we just fuck and their athletes. Yeah. Exactly. They're healthy motherfuckers. And no, that ass was made to thrust. Like it wasn't made to like, you're not going to see just like, it's this is not the age of innocence. No. Like gay guys fuck gay athletes. Fuck period. Hopefully they fuck us in Milan. Oh, have you thought about that? Now other thing. Did you ever watch the end of an era documentary? I because I did it. It's like, oh my god. Six episodes did each one twice on apologetic. On apologetic. No, but I love that we have committed to film the tortured poet's portion of the era story. Here's what I love about the documentary because I do think it wants you to know a few things. It wants to remind you she's brilliant. Yes. And I think it does do that. Like there's scenes of her playing guitar, like rehearsing her. I'm on. And on the piano, like rehearsing her surprise songs and everything and like you do see how it really every element of that like was her vision. She truly is in control of it. So I think like after all of the discourse about her, the documentary wants you to know she is a talent. And can we put that to rest? Yeah, there's the weird thing where one life of a show girl came out and some people took Umbridge with a lot of the lyrics that she's like not a good writer. I think it's truly silly. I'd actually do think that people have Taylor Swift arrangement syndrome. Well, they have a deranged syndrome. And they have like an amnesia back in the day. Like everyone had everything to say because the whole media thing. There's a reason why reputation exists, right? Exactly. And it's because there was a widespread notion that she was like, yeah, terrible. And like, and there was like, you know, whatever, like what I quote, the receipts to prove that. And then she genuinely like fought back from like whatever hell she was in to do this. But she's able to do that because she is that talented. So there's that the documentary also wants you to know that it's not about money. Uh huh. Like there's a part where Andrea Swift is like, you know, it's always just been about her sharing her music and doing that and et cetera. And I think that might be the part that's tough for people to buy. Sure. Especially because of like, you know, just just like people's assessment of her and the story about how much money she's worth and how much money the tour makes and the variance of it all, et cetera. But you, you can leave the documentary thinking like, you know what, this is an extremely generative person. And because she's generating a lot, she sells a lot. And she's also like, meaningfully diverting a lot of those funds to like the people who make that tour happen. Right. And so I think that that's obviously a focus of it as well. Yeah. And so, you know, I think that's really, they want you to know that her values are liberal. There's a lot in the documentary about her dancers. She really puts a lot of the spotlight on her dancers and the highlight on her dancers and how gender is not a thing on stage. Like one of the dancers, one of the male dancers, this dream is to dance ready for it. But ready for it is like an all-girl number. And the arc of the episode is him getting to do it because she allows him to do it and he fucking crushes. And you know, you, you then look at the stage and you think of the show and you're like, oh, wow, I never thought that that person would never hurt that or should be like that. And like that's et cetera. Like it really is like a pretty lovely display of diversity in that respect, in all respects. So I think in terms of all that stuff, like it's super successful. And you get the, I think, very cool stuff, which is watching them record their albums, which I love. I can't see enough of Ariana to do. Yes, yes, yes, or anybody. Taylor's great to watch and I have such an appreciation of her. Watching Ariana is like something different because like I just, I think she's truly a genius in the studio, the way she comes to her own vocals and stuff, I would kill, I would pay to be a fly on the wall, just watch her in the studio for it. I like let you. I, to answer your question, I think Eternal Sunshine is her best produced album. Is it what it was like? It was, it was, it was, it was Max and her and, and, and, Ilya, when are we going to the tour? I guess we're going to New York, Barclays July. Is it Barclays? She's doing Barclays and MSG, I think. Okay, that's chic. Yeah, I, I wonder how that's like, I, but I've seen that happen before, people do Barclays and MSG. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we'll do that. Sun on the dashboard, the kind of day that makes you want to take the long way home. With a range of spacious SUVs like the CRV, you've got the room to handle the daily chaos, which makes those big adventures feel that much closer. Because every journey matters. Book a test drive at Braille Honda today. Honda, the power of dreams. Should we talk about, um, let's see what I'm thinking, Minaj. And I'm going to cop to something. Okay, I'm going to cop to something. So when that happened with turning point, you thought it was AI. No, I knew it was her. Yeah. By the way, anyone being like, Nikki, we lost her. She's been gone. She's been gone. The writing was on the wall for this because the fact is Nikki Minaj was kicked out of mainstream culture because she's married to a sex offender. Unrepetent. She allegedly, allegedly was intimidating his victims from like saying anything, doing anything, whatever, that's alleged. And she was picking fights with everyone in music and it was out of pocket and she was obviously a bully and unwell. So that's why she went to turning point because she needed an audience at all. She probably wants like, you know, something out of the president too at some point, but like she clearly didn't believe one word of what she was saying. That was the most inauthentic thing I've ever fucking seen. Maybe she does now because it's like, it's being invalidated. I don't, I don't, I don't think she's like gone gone. Sure. The whole thing of like, it's okay to be a boy. Whatever. I was like, you're saying this to be mean spirited because you feel like but hurt and disappointed that the people who made your career now take Umbring with the bullshit that you're doing and so you're reeling against them. You don't actually believe that. But anyway, fuck her. But I will say because I knew she was gone forever the day after I took my moment to listen to her music for the last time. And what did you think? It's sad. It's sad. But you know, it's there are there are others. There will be others. I said goodbye. You said goodbye. I end that I streamed in my the drama and I watched Cardi be amazing on drag race. So good. Yeah. I have nothing else to add. I was just like, I was just, it was, it was all over my FYP and I was just like, well, of course. Right. I was like, uh huh. It was ridiculous. Everything about everything going on with the GOP right now is ridiculous. Obviously it's been that way. But I'm loving watching them fall apart. And I do think that's what's happening. What else? Housewives. I use what do you think of the Meredith of it all on Salt Lake? I don't counter out. I definitely don't counter out. But what do something is fishy about it to me? What part like the fact that she's being like pushed out. So sure this is the case. I don't see I don't get what the case is. I well, I think what they're trying to say is that she's got an alcohol or drug problem. Like Mary being like, I see it. Like you know what I mean? Like right. I don't know. I'm like, do you feel as viewers we are seeing what they are claiming they're seeing? Well, I think we are not seeing the flight, the flight footage, which I guess is like, I texted Andy about it. I was like, does it exist? He said, no, we would have shown it. That's so wild. By the way, just to make this explicitly clear, I have never had sex with Andy Cohen. I will never have sex with Andy Cohen. At one point, I kind of wanted to in the very, very, very beginning. But if we were going to have fucked, it would have happened by now probably many times. If you ever see me talking to Andy in a way that would suggest we've had sex, it's because we are flirting because it's funny. He is a friend. He is now our boss. That's what the extent of it. And if you're going to make fucking content about this, like get this person's fucking name right now. Yeah. Just call me Matt Fraser, which obviously, I think it was a mistake, but I sometimes think that straight women just need to stop and remember they are straight women before they talk about the way that gay guys are being. Sure. Just like before you talk about the way gay guys are being understand, like there might be something else there. Like, and of course it is like loose between gay men. We just don't think about this stuff as much as you guys are. But Andy and I are having fun. We do owe him a book. That's why he said that to us. That's why I said we were going to have time to work on it soon, thinly veiled illusion to the fact that we now have a lot more time to work on it. Like there is no drama or tension between Andy Cohen and I. Nothing. I don't know about the Meredith at all. Anyway, we love her. We love the Marxist love. And I just, but I'm just like, I just wish I was seeing. Right. What they're seeing totally. I am, I did start watching the Cult of the Real House. So I have to mirror him. Cosby Doc. What was going on? I am like, this is not made. No, no, no. I was like, whatever case you're trying to make here, it's like, okay, but all those documentaries are such. I know, but it's also like, they use a lot of like our content. Also like a lot of our, a lot of friends who like make house. Our content. They do like take clips of like us like getting Charlie X the X to talk about Mary M Cosby and how much she loves her. Like it's like, oh, well, you didn't clear that with us. Not that they like had to legally, but I'm like, oh, like it just, I don't know. It just kind of seems this is not to like minimize any of the allegations. It's just like, yeah. Persuasive stuff used to mean something. Right. Oh, well, nothing more. Nothing means anything anymore. I open my algorithm now and it's like, it's all AI. I don't want it. And I'm like, how would anyone coming into the world be able to believe anything at this point? And I think the AI conversation is also so boring. Right. Yeah. At this point, what feels like, like I really is like, it's inevitable. It's like, right, but also like, I don't think the appetite for this is linearly going to grow. No, no, no, it's people. I think the vast majority of people have no appetite for it. But this idea, like it's coming and you have to deal with it is making people like sort of resigned to the fact. Surrender to, yeah. And I just don't want people to, like, I guess like you can resign to learning, I guess how to use AI well or correctly. But what I don't like are people resigning themselves to giving up their creativity or their autonomy in terms of like finding information or creating stuff. Like that to me is bad. And I think it's confusing when you're like, it's here, get used to it. What does that, what does get used to it mean? It's just like an, it's like an energy that people have about it. But those are the same people who are like having casual conversations with chat, GPT being like, what's your, how are you? It's like, what are you, what are you doing? You killed some penguins. Just killed some penguins. There's going to be way less penguins for Boeing to see them. And I want to see them. He wants to see them bad. This is the trip of the lifetime. Yes. What I think you might be ready for movie wise, let's go back to that conversation. Yes, we'll have someone washing on a plane in front of me. That you know is my fucking nightmare. No, well then, yeah. I think you, you might be ready for sentimental value. It's not like completely, of course I am. Have you seen it yet? It's not like completely what? It's not like completely devastating the way that Hamlet allegedly is. Oh, yeah. I heard Catherine's great in it. Catherine is so funny in it. Catherine, you can tell that Jochem loves her. I just saw Catherine. I just saw Catherine. I told Kim's wedding and I was like, what a great. She's so funny in the running man. She's been booking. I'm worth, we're thrilled. Oh, fucking love that bitch. I'm trying to think like what else like there has been. Is any music come out? I just, December, January's always a tough time. Yeah. Well, we didn't really ever get a chance to talk about Lilia and we like it as much as everyone else. Of course. And then there was also what else? Well, next week, Robin will be here. And that's going to be very exciting. And that's that. That's that. So I guess it's time for I don't think so, honey. Yes. This is the part where we do I don't think so, honey. It's our 60 second segment where we rant, rail, rave, and turn the party ultimately. And by turn the party, we mean hopefully change hearts and minds about this thing and culture that we just think needs. I think I will. Yeah, I do too. Okay, great. I don't think so anyway. I'm sure you will. This is Matt Rodgers. I don't think so many times starts now. I don't think so, honey. Gavin Newsom, if you're going to run for president, you need vocal surgery. You need to remove the polyps on your vocal cords. Listening to you is a nightmare. And I have a feeling you're going to be talking a lot. I don't necessarily want that. I don't think we will win with him. But just go to LA, ask people how they feel being there. But anyway, I do think that while there's a lot of crises in the world, I did number one, one actionable thing that Gavin Newsom can do right now is text of Anna got three and get whoever, whoever just did her vocal surgery. She just had the polyps surgery. You're going to need to be silent for about six weeks afterwards. But don't worry. You can still tweet. 15 seconds. People dunk on Trump, which is apparently something that people still think is going to like win and not speaking directly actionably to people on their concerns. Like say Bernie Sanders does who is the only durable remaining politician over the last decade that's been like consistent and is still around in a meaningful way. Take notes maybe. But in the meantime, I need to stop hearing your voice as it is. That's one minute. Get vocal surgery and finish the damn 405. No he won't do that. Why not? Nothing will happen in California. I know because he's too busy. He's busy doing other shit. And then I get calls from council people who are running in LA and I tell them exactly what I fucking feel. And they're like, oh, well, it's just hard because this and I'm like, then talk to big boy. Talk to big boy. Talk to big boy and get them to fucking fix California. Because it's never been worse. No, it's so you think you're going to be the governor of California with that hair and that ex-girlfriend of Kimberly Gillfoil and that voice and that podcast with the Steve Badden feature. Just get to give it all to this point. Oh my god. I forgot about that. No, it's a mess. And I think that because he thinks he can like troll Trump or whatever and that people know who he is because he makes a fucking spectacle of himself that he's going to be the one to lead us forward. Let's run Bernie again. Bernie is the only politician who says exactly what he feels. And I do mean the only one Bernie come on last coach. Sure. No, absolutely. He's the only person who is actually no bullshit. This is this is another thing about early days last coach that I regret is being a Hillary you've seen. I can't believe it because I think we were trying really hard to just win. I know, but I feel so silly. Here's what I'll say. The president should I believe the president should have been Elizabeth Warren. You and many many of the smart Brooklyn days are aligned in this. I'm sure we all like share like a certain like ideology about all. But the fact is like the reason we were Hillary stands is because at the time it was like the Bernie had to remember you remember 2016. I remember like it was like it got a little thick there with like the way people were talking on the Bernie side and it was misogynist again. It was tough. And I think at the time there was a very girl bossy like that was in Obama, Kourish like hey, right. Don't talk like that. We're going to crash the glass ceiling girl and I pull my hair back. Check my nails. It was a very that. And so I don't I don't I don't look back in regrets because we were part of the culture we're part of. Should we have listened to the populist message all along? Is that ultimately what would work for them? Yes. It's not going to be Gavin Newsom. And when any time a politician is making it too obviously about themselves, I'm already done. Don't waste your money sending to Jasmine Crockett. Do not do it. I must agree. Don't do it. Don't you're going to waste your money. Take it from someone who sent Sarah Gideon like a ton of money in Maine. Like just don't do it. Don't waste your money. Don't do it. It's hard enough to come by. So I remember 2016, well, I was reminded of it in heated rivalry. That was the year that Boston won. I don't know. Hard to keep track of the sports. And by the way, I am not being like fatalist about the damage. No, no, no, no, no, no, it's just saying it's not Gavin. They're giving us a wide open opportunity here. Let's not flop by putting up what they said, what everyone said they hated in the beginning, which is an establishment like California Democrat. It doesn't work. Who is doing it in the same way that like they've all been doing it where it's always failed where it's like like Colbert was asking him, point blank, like, will you run for president? He's like, that's not my focus right now. And by the way, that is a version of his voice. That's like, sounds like crystal clear. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, get a fucking surgeon. It's just, it's so sick. And how come who is not telling him this? What if you get hired to be part of I should be his ramen manual. I would get him together. You what you guys don't know is I'm ramen manual in like a Conti gay way. Oh, and then you're going to be mayor of Chicago. Is he mayor? I think he was. He was. I don't know. I know he was like Obama's chief of staff, right? And he was like known as being like a real dick, but like he got shit done. Chief of staff is such an interesting position. I love it. I read that Suzy Wiles article. No, all that was to. Okay. I'm I've been in my politics back. I am see this is me like I'm getting off my spaceship and then like I am ready to touch things in the world that I've been away from. Does that make sense? Okay. Yes. Let me just qualify the Jasmine Crockett thing. She's not going to win a Senate seat in Texas, you guys. Like if Beto or Rar couldn't do it, like Jasmine Crockett is not going to do it. She isn't and it's the re it's nothing against her. It's just that she is a politician and that she is like, you know, like very well defined already. And I think it's my opinion that we are going to need someone who is less defined at this moment that then rises up. Like I'm interested in this talent. Rico guy from Texas. Oh, I don't know him. I'm just interested in him. You know what I mean? I'm like, Oh, I haven't seen him before. It would be hard for them to define him as anything other than what he is with just like a rising democratic politician from someplace like Texas who is like, yes, speaking a little bit to the middle, but at least he's someone that like, we can't define already. You know what I mean? Like Gavin Newsom is defined. I believe Jasmine Crockett is defined. Like I'm just trying to win here and I really feel differently than we did in 2016. Like the way to win now is to like go with the energy. I did just get a text from the people who helped me write her into a sketch who Trisha Paitis is mulling around for Congress. I think I'm going to say as a, as I feel like Trisha, you don't have to do it. Just don't worry about it. Who told you this? I'm seeing on Twitter that Trisha Paitis is mulling around for Congress lives in West Lake Village. So would put her in collision course with Julia Brownlee unless she is, oh, I have my block on my Twitter, but she Trisha, you don't have to do that. Don't have to do that. Authentic. We're back to being authentic. We're back to being authentic. Oh, God, yeah. Oh, I love it. They said we were done. They said we were. And now next week Robyn's going to come in and they're going to be like, why are they kissing Robyn's ass? Here's why we're kissing Robyn's ass because she's a pop culture icon. And I can say with, already, we're going to kiss her ass. And it's going to be okay. It's going to be great. It's still going to be a face like cherry. It's going to be a free show with 20 minutes of ads that you can fast forward through. But by the way, we apologize about the ads and we've made changes. And we're figuring that out also. Last call to reach. It's all just them talking to celebrities. We've had like friends on the show, like all the Q4s. This is what everybody comes down. It's like all the criticism. I'm like, but what about this? It's like, it's easily disproven. It's like, we'll have what I don't care guys. Let us do it. Like, let us do the show our way. Okay. And it's, yeah, I mean, let us cook. And also like, it's, it's just that we're like, if we're not doing it exactly like this, it's just because we wanted to make sure that the show was released and we had a great episode. We weren't just going to go off in December. Like my, my least favorite thing is when they dragged us for doing three episodes in one day. They were like, I can't believe they would ever do three episodes in one day. You mean work for eight hours straight? Yeah, I'm sorry. That doesn't. You're crazy. I'm with your ethics. I don't understand why that's an issue. And then they go, well, match should have at least changed the shirt. Fuck all of us. I was like, I put on a different over shirt. You asshole. Leave me alone or else. Or else, this is the last time, this is truly, this is the last time all year we're going to be addressing this. No, because this is, and this has been so cathartic. This actually is called exit interview. Prethesies the cathartic episode because I am never looking at this again. And I swear to God, mark my words. Wait, we should really do this. We should get brick. I have two bricks at my house. And there's also Opal, which I love. What's Opalite? It's an app that blocks things for you. But if you want to, you know, if you want to take a break, you can take a break throughout the day, which I do. Or it'll ask you, if you're sure you want to take a break and then it'll present you if you want, like a math puzzle. Or a puzzle that will give you a quick dopamine hit. And then it's like, see, you got your dopamine hit. Do you still want to take a break? It's cute. It's like, it's really getting in the way of like you like mindlessly scrolling. Yeah. And they actually love to do less of. Oh, absolutely. Wouldn't we all? I think there's like a, I think there's like a thing now where it's like, this is again, like the comment or survivorship thing. It's like anyone who like has some sense of like self-protection is like weaning off of the phone. And they're on meaningful way. I mean, in an era when so much is changing anyway, why not change this one? Totally. I'm like, I just remember the day when I left Facebook just sort of cold turkey. And I quit smoking cold turkey. You did, huh? I, this is my thing. Like, I gotta. Yeah, tell this. I know this is good. I gotta sweet at the Chelsea hotel. Um, that's like a customary thing you do at the end of the season. I've done it once before with Celeste and Sarah, but I got it for myself and like I had friends over and we had fun and then I just had like two days to myself at the Chelsea hotel. It got me the balcony suite, which is like the only sort of balcony that like looks the hotel Chelsea sign. And so then like someone left like a pack of cigarettes and I like smoked, I smoked one on the balcony and then I like looked up like right before I was going to check out. And I was like, this would be a chic place to just quit smoking. After I finished SNL, I met the hotel Chelsea on the balcony. This is the last one. I've since had like cigarettes. I'm just never buying my own again. No, no, no, no, no, quit cold. This is, I've since had several. No, no, no, so it's not cold turkey, but it's like, I'm never going to buy my own cigarettes ever again. That is my thing. And I get to have one like if I've like had a couple drinks. You remember the deal we made years ago. If I would quit smoking if you got, if you were in therapy and now you're at so grossly inequitable that I am ready to be honest. I've just seen unfortunately up close. What happens when you don't. What happens when smoking and vaping gets out of hand. And I would tell everyone that as a person that's had a first hand account, do not fuck with it. And it is, it has nothing to do with anything but the smoking and the vaping that I'm talking about. And I promise you your life will be better without it 100%. Because think about it. Think about vaping. Think about how dumb it is. Not that you vape, but like it's you sucking on a machine. Who here does it? Show yourself. You're all very afraid to come forward. A 14 year old was doing it next to me on the train. I was like, don't do it on the train. He'll be dead, just tell him he'll be dead by 20. Oh God. What? He will. He will. Anyway, I got a minute. If you're vaping, you're going to be dead. I've got, I haven't, I don't think so, honey. Of course you do. Let's, we've been here two hours. Let's, let's, should we split the episode into two? No. No, no. No, it's just on this. All right. This is the biggest Avagonza. This is Bowen Yangs. I always go to the compass when I mean to go to the timer. That's okay. This is Bowen Yangs. I don't think so. Honey is time starts now. I don't think so many fries for the table. This is a myth that it's something that everyone loves. Think about it. Everyone's like, yes, fries for the table. Does it ever get fucking finished? It's a huge waste. You get a little potato confetti sitting in a fucking cone at the end of the night. No one's touching it after five minutes. It's completely gone. You have a full cup of Aeoli there because guess what? Aeoli also fucking sucks. No one in the Western hemisphere cares for it. Aeoli contains multitudes. Thirty seconds. It's ketchup all the way. Don't even bother with the Aeoli with the mayonnaise. We're in America as unpatriotic as I might be right now. I still care about that with our Olympics podcast. Hatchup. Fifty seconds. Over. Mayo. Aeoli. Fries for the table. It's a lie. We all think we're all on board for it and then no one fucking touches it by the end. Five seconds. I don't know. Let's just get real. Let's get real in 2026. Fries for the table. It's just a myth. No one cares. That's one minute. What? I ask me anything. I will. I'm just gathering my thoughts. What are you talking about? It is a fantasy. It is in theory. Some of the best films are. Yes, but in theory, fries for the table makes total sense, right? Oh, everyone's going to nibble on fries. No one's touching it within five minutes. Can I ask you a question? I've been hitting the table. No one is touching the fries after five minutes. Everyone's like, oh yes, for a such a good idea. No one gives a shit after five minutes. Can I ask you a question, but first can I say one thing? Yeah. It's a real culture. Umami, more like Udadi. That's a real culture number three. Umami, more like Udadi. I say that because ketchup is umami. What about this two orders of fries for the table? No. So wait. I'm saying even one order. But can I ask you a question? Do you think that do you think that the reason why one batch of fries doesn't get everyone's too shy? Everyone's like, oh, I'm not going to put my hand in the one batch of fries. Whereas if just if say it's a party of four, right? Instead of one group of fries in them, because here's the thing. I think we can all agree that everyone wants fries. Yes. Okay. Starting there. Order your own fries. No, that's too much. Because this, Matt, I'm telling you. Four orders of fries on the table? I'm telling you, Matt. I've been to SNS through money. I've shut up. I've bought enough. I've paid for enough tables at the SNL after party because that's something we had to do. They still have to do. I've had to pay for so many fries for the tables. I've seen it. I've seen it. This is I'm practically from experience talking about how you get to teach a college seminar on this. I can teach a college seminar on this. A media study seminar on fries for the table being sort of a societal ideal that never really gets fully enjoyed. That's it. I'm just saying, I've seen, I've so many data points about this. Oh, there's another half full thing of fries. That was supposed to be for everybody. I just feel like it would be a shame for there to be no fries. Oh, and I think everyone ordering their own fries is too much. If one person orders their own fries, they're not going to finish all of them and then that invites other people that they would be like, can I have some of your fries, Matt? You'll be like, of course. And then those get finished. I guess I'd rather that already be an assumed fact that, of course, you can have some of these fries because they're everyone's fries. Also, maybe you're just not dining with the right people. Also, you don't talk about the people I dine with. I will talk about the people you dine with. I just dine with you the other night. And how was that experience? Lovely. You had some nasty things to say about A.O. Lee. Yeah, I don't care for it. I only care about mayonnaise if it's used to help toast a grilled cheese. I only mayonnaise. I hadn't thought about that. Basically. That's like Aggie. Okay. I'm about Dijon mustard. I love Dijon mustard. You're going to be wishing there was fries on the table to have with some of those. No, I like Dijon when it's, it's in a sandwich. I like Dijon when it's my last name. Matt Dijon. I love it. Remember when my, remember my first name? Iran Dijon. Iran Dijon. The, the, from the Middle East. Middle East. She was spicy and unstable, just like my borders. This was back in the day when you could be a little, you could be a little problematic because no one was listening. Anna, what, how does that make you feel? She's okay with it. Inshallah. You're okay with it. Don't say inshallah. I'm allowed to say inshallah. Judy Green told me I could and then I said it in front of me. And she wasn't so sure. But inshallah, you'll all let me get away with it at home. The readers, the readers. Well, this was a fantastic episode. I thought so. Thanks for getting me to cry, bitch. I cried too. We both cried. This was an emotional roller coaster. I cathartic, at least the cathartic episode. Action interview, hashed, not hashed, parentheses, the cathartic episode. No real edits. I think just the pickups that I, you know, I will tell you I have one edit after we had. And we had every episode with a song. All the things you said, all the things you said, running through my head, running through my head, running through my head. Text in if you think we should be Ilya and Connor. Shame. Shame. Connor is plays Ilya. Should we be them probably? Yes, we will. But you be the white one. I'll be the white one. And I'll be the bottom. Oh my god. Imagine seven years without ever changing your haircut, like those boys. Anyway, bye. Wow, they never did. They never did. Los Cultures is the production by Will Ferrell's big money players in my heart radio podcasts. Created and hosted by Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang. Executive produced by Anna Hosniay and produced by Becker Ramos. Edited and mixed by Doug Bane. And our music is by Henry Comersky. This is an I Heart Podcast. Guaranteed human.