Misfortunes To Purpose: The Carnivore Leader with CZ Lopez

All right, this episode, I'm actually talking to a really good friend of mine, Ray CZ Lopez. I met him through Robert Irvine and the Robert Irvine Foundation a couple of years ago, and we've been instant friends. He's like an accountability partner. So this episode, we talk about some personal things, man. Like first off, this book, if you're watching, Carnivore Leadership, subtitled, Taking Charge Instead of Taking Shit. Just that alone, you know, you're going to listen to this episode. So we go into his because. We talk about failure and the lessons learned there because most people get that wrong. And then at the end, we talk about the most favorite thing he loves about Robert Irvine, one of our best friends together. So ladies and gentlemen, without further ado, this is my good friend, the carnivore leader himself, Ray CZ Lopez. Buckle up. You're listening to Mick Unplugged, hosted by the one and only Mick Hunt. This is where purpose meets power and stories spark transformation. Mick takes you beyond the motivation and into meaning, helping you discover your because and becoming unstoppable. I'm Rudy Rush, and trust me, you're in the right place. Let's get unplugged. CZ, how you doing today, brother? Hey, doing good, Mick. Thank you. Thank you so much for that introduction, man. I really appreciate it. nah man like I I truly love everything about you you know we met um through Robert Irvine the Robert Irvine Foundation and it was like moment one right like we're sharing an adult beverage right and just talking about life and I was like who is this guy and then I get to learn your story. I hear so much about you. And like, you've been, you've been like a mentor and accountability partner, a friend, man. So I just owe you so much. So thank you so much for being here, brother. I mean, some people just, just come into your life to where you make that immediate connection, you know, and a lot of it is because of the drive and purpose that you have in your life. And that's a, that's a common theme that I have seen with the people that we surround ourselves with Robert Irvine and the foundation. But yeah, likewise, man, you know, it didn't take long to figure out. It's like, you know, this, this dude is part of the pack, man. And let's go ahead and keep on pressing forward. Absolutely. Absolutely. And CZ, you know, on this show, I always ask my guests, like, what's your because? What's that thing that keeps you motivated, that keeps you held accountable, like that thing that's deeper than your why. And I know from time to time, your because changes. So in the season that you're in right now, what's your because? Why do you keep doing the things that you do, brother? My because is simply because we're temporary. You know, our existence is numbered. We don't know how long we have on this earth to make a difference. So we have to make every second count. You have to make every relationship, every interaction count to ensure that we set up the next generation for success. That's always been my because. And it keeps me driving forward, man. I love it. I love it. And, you know, I'm going to get into the book in a second because as I've read it and for all of you that are watching or that are listening, the book is right here. If you're watching, I'm pointing to it. But Carnivore Leadership, go get it now. It's going to change your life. there's a lot of lessons. But before we get into that, man, let's talk about your career. Let's talk about what shaped you to where you are today. So for those that don't know you, right, highly decorated. I've never met a person that's in our circle, that's in our pack, that doesn't just oogle over CZ, right? Like, talk to us about your journey a little bit. And I think it was a series of misfortunes that actually led to the path that we ended up taking. And when I say we, I have to go ahead and give credit to Janet quite a bit on that. But was going to college, going nowhere really fast, decided to enlist in the United States Air Force. Started being stagnant by virtue of the job that I took at the time. And I mentioned job, not duty, because I don't think I really aligned with my initial duty, which was transportation. It wasn't really challenging me, but it wasn't until I became a special operator, specifically an Air Force pararescue man, that I found my purpose in life. From that moment on, every day, every day seemed like it was never work. I was looking forward, regardless of whether the situation was going to be unpleasant or something meaningful. It was the same drive and motivation to show up. And that was because something needed to happen at the time. So I ended up doing the special operations bid for about two decades. And then I got another call to be a senior listed leader, meaning to step away from special operations and become a figurehead for larger organizations. I was not too crazy about that prospect, mainly because I love my tribe. I love being a PJ. I love saving lives. And I love the team that we had around us, operators, support, civilians. It didn't matter. They were just phenomenal people. But the need for leadership in those other echelons, specifically the higher echelons, was something that appealed to me. And I thought that I had something to offer. I thought that I could do it different than the average. And I thought that I will go ahead and give it the same level effort and rigor that I gave special operations. That eventually led to being selected as the highest enlisted ranking member in the entire Department of Defense, Department of War today, the senior enlisted advisor to the chairman. But it was that that series of misfortunes. And we can talk a little bit bad, a little bit more about what that bad means that eventually put you in a position to where you can make the most difference. So let's talk about the bad then. Let's talk about the misfortunes. Like for those that are watching or listening, like break that down a little bit. Yeah. So it begins, obviously, with not having a purpose in Bridgeport, Connecticut and going to Second Heart University. It was a very tough spot to be because as a 19 year old, you're trying to figure out what the hell your life is going to look like. And college to me wasn't going to do that at the time. So I just went ahead and went blind into military service. You know, I knew that, hey, you know, there's a purpose in there. You know, you're serving your nation and you're going to get the things that you require the most in your life at this moment, which is independence, discipline, and that purpose, right? Being part of a bigger team, not just an individual. So when I got into service and I was given the duty of a transportation specialist, I was sent to a rockliner station on Creek, Greece. And I got into trouble right away just because of my wild ass ways. I got an Article 15 that is a nonjudicial punishment for adverse behavior, and I got demoted. I almost got kicked out of service there at that moment. And that was the first wake-up call to realize that nothing is owed to you. You have to earn your keep every day. You have to follow the rules, and you have to make sure that you exemplify those rules if you want to be a cut above the rest. And I fell grossly short at that moment. So that was wake up call number one. Wake up call number two, in order to fix that one, I needed to find a purpose. And that's when I decided to join the ranks of pararescue. And I didn't make it through the first try. I was 147 pound kid. My legs were not really all that strong. And man, I just couldn't keep up with the finning at times, swimming with those big rocket fins. And I got a setback. I was given an opportunity to come back at a later date. And it was at that moment that I had my second wake up call. It's like, all right, so you really have to work harder than the average in order to make it. Because there were some guys that were just breezing through the program. And I was having a tough time. So what did I do? I went ahead and parked my car. I started riding my bicycle everywhere to go ahead and get that leg strength that I needed And I started swimming at least five days a week just to go ahead and make up for my shortcomings By the time I got back to the training pipeline the instructors were like, holy crap, what the hell did you do, man? You must really want this. And that was success story number two out of adversity. Then throughout my tenure as a senior enlisted leader and as a pararescue man, there have been many other failures that ended up becoming synonymous with lessons. I never looked at a failure from then on as something that was going to hold me back. I looked at failures as something that was going to make me stronger, that was going to give me further drive, more motivation, a chip on my shoulder to just go ahead and keep on pressing forward. And that became probably like the greatest lesson learned to where in several bouts of adversity, I find opportunity to go ahead and prove myself that I was better than who I was the day before. I agree. And you and I, we've had this conversation, right? Adversity reveals character and failure shows that drive that you have, right? And I totally believe that a lot of folks don't want to accept the lessons that you learn, not just about yourself, right? But just the lessons within the lessons sometimes. You know, I think social media today, and we could talk about just media in general, they always highlight the wins. And so I think from a societal standpoint, we just assume that like everybody who wins was born a winner and they never go through anything. But you were proof that like in order to get there, in order to climb the mountain, right? You got to get pushed back a little bit, right? Like no one just easily goes up the mountain. No one easily does that track. Like you learn things. Talk to us about one of the biggest lessons that you've learned and how that's parlayed into leadership for you. I believe that one of the biggest lessons that I have learned is the value of humility. And I will explain what I mean by that. When you become a special operator, you get put in a certain pedestal, right? So you have a certain standing. You have a specific uniform that is unmistakable. People expect certain things about you because you have gone through one of the most rigorous training pipelines and crucibles that the Department of War has to offer. And you have that aura about you that this is the person when the chips fall that is going to make things happen. Sometimes those things can get to your head, specifically when you start ascending through the ranks and people are shyer and shyer about telling you no. you're doing something wrong. Everybody tends to agree with you. You start getting a lot of yes men around you. And that is very dangerous because if you start believing that hype, you're eventually going to become what many call a victim of your own success. And that is not a victim of your own success because you continue to do good. It is just that you're a victim of success to where your credibility is going to diminish over time because you become an egomaniac and you decide to go ahead and start disregarding the input and the candid feedback and the criticism of people that matter. So humility is something that always reels you back. And I think that one of the best equalizers that I had in my life when it comes to humility was the presence of Janet. Janet being around me, she was basically the one with that pin to deflate my head when it was clearly starting to go ahead and get blown up and ballooned up. And eventually I started checking myself when it came to it. You know, if something didn't feel right, when I asked input about something, I will ask many questions and I will encourage people, hey, just the emperor's got no clothes. Just give it to me as it is. Just candid and honest feedback. That is the only way that we're going to progress. And if you lack humility, you are never going to get there because eventually you're going to believe to hide. You're going to become another egomaniac and you start disregarding people that are actually trying to help you be better than who you were yesterday. Amazing. Amazing, bro. So let's talk about you and your leadership journey. And this is going to start to parlay into the book, right? Again, one of the most dynamic leaders that I know is CZ Lopez. And I'd love for you to just talk to us about when you realize that you were a leader and a leader of people. Because you've been in some very high state situations, right? Your teams have been in situations that the average everyday human doesn't go through. And it's kind of shaped you in the leadership world. So talk to us about when CZ identified, damn it, I'm a leader. I think the first taste of that, and I believe I wrote a letter to my sister, she may still have it, that when I was in basic military training, I could barely speak English. Right. And I still keep in touch with my drill instructor, by the way, Hank Herrick. And one of the squad leaders, a squad was basically a row of beds. So all of the beds are properly lined up. And at the head of that row is the leader for that squad. One of my squad leaders got set back, basically got fell out of our BMT class, basic military training. So the opportunity came for the next squad leader. And it was Hank Herrick that made the decision. It's like, hey, Colon Lopez, you're going to be the next squad leader. Now, why did he choose me? and we had these conversations, he and I, years down the road, he was paying close attention to the way that I carried myself. Now, I wasn't perfect, but I had potential. And there's the difference between perfection and potential because I think potential will always win. At that moment that he made the decision, I struggled a bit with it. Like, okay, fine. So the majority of these guys are making fun of me because I can barely speak English. I got to make up with something to be able to make sure that we are successful. And actions. That's when I started relying more on actions versus words. So I started making sure that they had all the information they needed. I started to make sure that we were in time, that we were passing the inspections, those that were struggling with certain things. I started putting the time to help them out. And it was in that process that I wrote that letter to my sister. And I told her, it's like, hey, you know, wow, I think I'm finding a place to exist here, especially this thing about being in charge of things, having a responsibility for other than self that I'm really, really gravitating towards. And I believe that that was the first time that I figured out that maybe this leadership thing is something that is in you, that you can grow over time. And by the way, I don't believe that leaders are born or any of that crap. I believe that if you put yourself in certain situations, you either rise above or fall under. And it's all about your courage to keep on pressing forward that eventually makes you the leader that you become. And that never changed throughout the years. When I became a pararescue man, it was the same thing. You know, I always decided to take charge. I never took like the subtitle of the book, taking charge instead of taking shit. That's where that comes from. Because I learned early on that when you start taking charge of things, you have control of the actions that actually equate to the outcome. And if those actions and that control is positive and empowering of others, you get to do magnificent things. And that was a constant drum meet all the way throughout my career to where I realized, all right, own it, be responsible, be accountable and empower people to achieve the goal. There you go. Oh, and by the way, the failure, and this is a cliche, but the failure is always yours because you are responsible, but never fail to recognize at certain stages of the project or the mission, the people that made it happen. And it's never about you. It is just about the people that ended up getting the task completed I love it brother I love it And I think that the perfect segue into the book now right So carnivore leadership let talk about one what does that title and mantra mean to CZ? So for those who are listening and watching, why the name of the title? Talk to us about that principle. This was late 1990s, early 2000s. This is before 9-11 hit. And I was assigned to a SEAL team in Virginia Beach, one of the most elite units in the nation. And I had this great leader, our boat crew leader. So the team was broken down, not into troops, but into boat crews. And I was part of boat crew three, led by one master chief, Jim Henske. And Henske always used to classify people into two buckets, the meat eaters or the grass eaters. Naturally, the meat eaters were the go-getters, the ones that will make things happen. The grass eaters were the lazy, complacent oxygen thieves that never got anything done, that needed consistent guidance and basically hand-holding to get anything out of them. And that stuck with me because I started paying close attention. I've always been a student of human dynamics. I always like to be aware of my surroundings. And I started paying attention. Then I started saying, oh, definitely a meat eater. Oh, bonafide grass eater. So I decided to go ahead and start sharing with other people outside of the command, basically the joint special operations command. And I used that mantra, you know, to help shape culture, right? All right. This is the price of admission to be an honorable, an honorable member of this particular club. And if you fall short, you're going to be in this particular bucket. And that is not shaming. That is just making you aware that you're not doing enough. So do not expect the same rewards that this group is going to get, all right, unless you decide to start getting with the program and be more proactive. And that's what the mantra is really all about. It's about being proactive, you know, owning, having the courage to move forward, even at the price of failure, in order to learn. And when I got assigned as my first duty as a senior enlisted leader outside of pararescue at the first special operations wing, that's when I decided to write the 20 silver bullets. And that was to motivate the masses. I mean, you're talking the cooks, the administrative people, the financial people, the maintainer of aircraft, you know, the people that dealt with multiple area affairs. I mean, you name it. It didn't matter whether they held a gun in combat or a pencil. I saw the need to make sure that we created a culture of warfighting because at the end of the day, the mission of the wing was to answer the call when the chips fell. And that became pretty evident upon the first two weeks of assignment at the first special operations wing. when we got the call from President Obama to go ahead and rescue a hostage, Jessica Buchanan, who also, like you, ended up putting a quick blurb on the book, on the preface of the book. And we got the call to go out and rescue her. And we ended up rounding up about 130 people from the first special operations wing on a Saturday, deployed to Somalia, got the hostages and brought them back. At that moment, I told him, I was like, hey, look, so this 20 silver bullet things that I gave you is not lip service. That is an expectation of who you need to be, specifically to be successful in this environment. If you're not ready, you will fail. And I'm here to prevent every single one of you from failing. But I can only do so much. It is your personal responsibility to play by the rules, to abide by the standards and to do whatever the nation needs you to do. And it was from that paper that eventually, 20 years later, we end up with the book that we have today. That's freaking amazing. And this book, man, like it, it challenges you to think. It challenges some of the principles that you may have. Right. But but what I love about it is it's storytelling. And you know this, right? Like I read the book in a day and I just sat there and I was just like, man, like I'm learning lessons. I'm getting it through storytelling. And I don't care who you are, what industry you work in, how many people report to you. Like the book is also very practical, right? Like there are moments that you can just pick up in the book and go. So I'd love to get your thought process on just how you engineered that in the book, because your story and I didn't I mean, yeah, when we talk and we have an adult beverage, you have some amazing stories, right? Like, I'm not even going to hold that you are one of the best storytellers that I know. But to put that in words and keep people captivated is a different thing, man. So talk to us about just how you structured and engineered the book itself. I have to give credit to Janet once again, because the original concept, clearly, you know, I kept these notebooks, these small sky notebooks, and I will I was always taking notes. And those notes were nothing more than the bookkeeping of my character. Right. The salary of that bookkeeping was nothing more than the honor to serve. And the currency was credibility. and every single failure was a withdrawal on that investment. But unless you kept the books, you couldn't realize when you were falling short the most, what you were doing at the time and how to prevent it. So I started keeping copious notes. About 13 notebooks later, I decided to extract some of those lessons learned and I started shaping them into mission accomplishment and readiness. And that was a way to sequentially highlight the company you kept, the actions that are expected to you. How good are you at rule following standards? How well do you treat other people? How serious do you take your purpose and duty? How in tune are you with yourself to be humble? So I sequentially started putting all those things together and I started writing. When I gave it to Janet the first time, she bled all over that paper. She's like, good Lance, Ray. You're just freaking chasing your tail about talking too much about stuff. Just make it short, sweet, and to the point. People don't have the time to read all this blabber. They probably don't care about it. So how about you make it two to three sentences per silver bullet and then put it out there? I listen like every good husband. I listened to her advice. And that's the paper that you saw, the 20 silver bullets. Now, it was supposed to be local for the first special operations wing. But what I got to see year after year was that more and more people will mention the paper. He's like, oh, I got your 20 silver bullets. I just used it for this professional development session. I just used it as a lecture over here at this professional military education keynote that I did. And it was both officer and enlisted and some civilians even. So this went on for 15 years plus. And eventually when I was getting ready to retire, I was approached by a publisher that said, hey, I read your paper and I think you have something here. Have you ever thought about writing a book? And I said, Nope. Never thought about it. You know, that was then. This is now. It's like, hear me out. So what if you were to make each silver bullet its own chapter and then put a personal vignette beyond the five second soundbite that you have in the current paper to enlighten the audience on why that quote is important to you? And I think your experience is going to be critical to the success of the book. So that triggers something in my head. I talked to Janet about it and we went back to the drawing board. And the way that I wrote it was one chapter per day. I will take a silver bullet per day, whether I was on a flight, going to some engagement, whether I had some time in the morning before working out or at night. If I was feeling creative, I decided to just go ahead and shut everything off. And then you decide to concentrate on that one chapter. Much like the first paper, I gave it to Janet to go ahead and take a look at the first few rounds. And she bled all over it again She gave me some guidance So I went ahead and took that guidance from her and then went back to the drawing board And in a matter of about 45 days I had the entire book written And the reason it went so fast, I didn't use a ghostwriter. I wanted it to be my voice, my writing for my first real book. Because I had a children's book with Mike Cirelli, Scarlett's Big Shot. but uh by the time the book was written i gave it back to her and she read it much like you in a day it was a flight from dallas fort worth to raleigh durham and in a span of two and a half hours she read it and it was her feedback that actually gave me confidence that this was going to be of value and she said well done i learned things about you that i haven't known in over two decades I laughed I almost cried this is it you hit the sweet spot on this one yeah at that moment I went ahead and gave it to uh Amplify Publishing Group uh with the help of uh Naren Ayal and his great team and we just went through the mechanics put it together the layout you know all of the things every single detail that I consulted with them about I wanted it to be meaningful like I originally didn't want my photo on the front cover. I wanted it to be just a silver bullet because that was the book. And they advised some people like Janet, Mike Cirelli, Navy SEAL teammate, Wayne Fisk, and a couple of others, including Robert. They're like, if it's going to be a book about you, buddy, I think you need your face in the front. And I was just like, you know, that's the humility on me. It's like the book is really a generational commitment to set up the next generation for success. It's not about me. It's like, no, but you're writing it. So if you want something to be recognizable, you need to be on it. That beret needs to be in there because that's really who made you who you were, the career field of pararescue. So we decided to go with that photo. And then, you know, of course, it's like, do you smile? Are you angry? And that was a very just different kind of photo. And I just put it out for feedback from people. And we decided to just go ahead and stick with that. But everything from the small silver bullet thing, I wanted everything to have meaning just because that's exactly the way that I approached the book and the paper from the beginning. This is a great looking man right here. So if you're listening to this, definitely go straight to the YouTube and you need to see this. But no, this is an amazing book. man a lot of a lot of uh endorsements on the book a lot of great words you know i love that you signed this copy and not just signed it but you gave me a nice little note that i'll forever appreciate man and again for those that are watching for those that are listening carnivore leadership you know cz kind of gave you the subtitle taking charge instead of taking shit and again it doesn't matter who you lead, where you lead, this book should be your new blueprint. And so CZ, I'm going to do this for the first 20 people that messaged me silver bullet, because there's 20 silver bullets. You're going to get a free copy of this book. How about that? That is, that is awesome, man. I'm paying for it. So you're not giving away free. I'm paying for it. So I'm going to go buy 20 copies. if you message me silver bullets, I'm giving this to you and you're going to see the messaging, how easy this is to read, but more importantly, how it relates to you as leaders. So CZ, man, I'm honored that, that you did this. This book is amazing, brother. Thank you. Thank you. And, and again, you know, I started the book with a, with a Mark Twain quote that experiences the bread, the blood, the heartbeat of the essence of any book and author writes. Then I mentioned that the book wasn't about theory. It was about experiences. And I think that that is really an approach that more people with similar backgrounds as us that have had the honor and opportunity to influence others to be better, we need to do this more often. And I believe that leadership is in decay in America. Everybody's looking for a finger to point. The divisions are so rampant right now to where I do not want to associate with this group because I'm part of this group. And we need to go ahead and put all of that to rest, man. We need to put a wrecking ball to some of those freaking walls that are being built, you know, amongst each other. And I think that one of the best ways that we get after that is just to go ahead and start talking a little bit more, to learn from each other, you know, gauge the differences and see the value of being different. And the more we do that, the better off we're going to be as a society. And this is just my small contribution to that. So thank you for wanting to put that book in the hands of other people. Absolutely. I'm definitely going to do my part. Definitely going to do my part. Before I get into my rapid fire questions to get you out of here, where can people find and follow you, sir. So my website is up and running carnivoreleader.com. The book is available, Amazon, Amplify, Publishing Group, and Barnes & Noble. The links are included on the website and you can follow me on Instagram, Facebook, and LinkedIn. I love it. I'll make sure I have links there for everybody. Definitely, again, make sure you buy in the book, whether it's Amazon, Barnes & Noble, go visit your local bookstore. show your local bookstore love as well too to make sure that you're supporting them um cz you ready for this rapid fire let's go you sure let's do it all right so take leadership out of it what's a weekend passion project that you have weekend passion project physical fitness all right you and robert you guys kill me every time you see me i'm working on getting in shape I'm back in the gym. I'm back in the gym. What's one myth about veteran leadership that people either get wrong or they don't know the truth about? Assuming that the higher a person gets in position, that it equals the effectiveness of their leadership. Some people are merely appointed and there are no leaders at all. I totally agree. Totally agree. What's one of your favorite ways to unplug after a long, busy day? Music. Always has been. Even in combat. Coming back from missions, I will either listen to Bob Marley Legend or Moby 12. Those were my two go-to wind down. I like it. I like it. What's one thing about Robert Irvine that you truly love? His charm. That guy can walk anywhere and light up the room, man. Just being around his presence just energizes you. I really love that little freaking British guy. I love him, too. I love him, too. So as the story of CZ is being written, what's one word that you want to define your legacy? Humility. You got that quick, man. Most people stumble on that one. I love it. I love it. That is definitely you. Well, CZ man, again, you know, I love you like a brother. Can't wait to see you soon. We'll see each other really soon. Can't wait to break bread, man. Just proud of who you are. But more importantly, just that humility. dude I love it because that is you right like you've never met a stranger you make yourself on equal footing with all people and you are just the charm that you talk about Robert has you have that too bro you have that too you got it so thank you for being you for all the viewers and listeners remember your because is your superpower go unleash it that's another powerful conversation on Mick Unplugged. If this episode moved you, and I'm sure it did, follow the show wherever you listen, share it with someone who needs that spark, and leave a review so more people can find their because. I'm Rudy Rush, and until next time, stay driven, stay focused, and stay unplugged.