Fate vs. Free Will in The Prophecy

Welcome to the Swiftie and the Scholar, the podcast where we examine the lyrics, lore, and literary legacy of Taylor Swift. I am Angela McDowell, the Swiftie. And I am Dr. Jerry Coates, the Scholar. How you doing? You know, I've been looking forward to this. Good. Yeah, because we recorded August, Betty, and Cardigan in a marathon session. Certainly did. And it's been a couple weeks now. Yeah, and you had to drive home after that. Yeah, that was exact. No, Chase was here. Oh, that's right. Chase was here. I got to ride home. Okay, good. Yeah, I just got to sit. Because I have to admit to you, I went in there and laid down on the couch and I said, I got to watch something to get my mind off that and I fell right asleep. I was also exhausted. Everybody was like, Uncle Jerry seemed hungry because you were like, let's go have dinner like three times. No, it was fun though. It was good. It was fun. It was just a real time. I liked those three pieces together. I think it was a great idea of trying to examine the Rashomon effect. And I don't know, it's fun. Yeah, but we have something completely different. Totally different today. Today we're going to get witchy with it. Okay. Today we are doing the prophecy. This is actually this song that our patrons chose. Prophecy. Yes. Okay, good. They, um, that's from a movie in case you didn't know. I didn't. Okay. I thought you were just having a moment. No, no, it's actually from a movie. The prophecy, speaking of movies, always just makes me think of Harry Potter. Oh, is that right? The prophecy like in the ball, you know, that they go and like they have to. Right. It's right. Let's see. Yeah, I've got one. Yeah, I have a prophecy in this. Yeah, exactly. And all I have to do is like smash it or something and it will speak to me. Except it's like real rock. So I don't know. Not easy to smash probably. No, probably not. Okay. The prophecy. The prophecy. Um, this is chosen by our patrons. We did like a march. This is going to be a weird one today, I think. I'm ready. Yeah, just set it there. Perfect. Okay. Good. Um, Patreon chose this. We did like a March Madness tournament of a bunch of songs. I think we had 32 songs and we went round by round and the prophecy is what ended up being the one that they want to hear your thoughts on the most. Okay. Um, which I'm excited. I love this song. I probably about a year ago, it like hit for me probably around the same time that Peter and the Bolter also hit for me. This is from the second half of the tortured poets department. So that, um, the anthology, the second, the surprise double album that we didn't know was coming. Um, I didn't know. Yeah. Yeah. Actually, it's almost, um, today, today that we're recording this is the two year anniversary of tortured poets department. Happy anniversary. Um, yes, I must have gotten sleep. That's the last I would have. And I have not. Yeah. Okay. I think I see the grim. Um, okay. This is, um, the prophecy is written by Taylor, written and produced by Taylor and Aaron Dessner. We're losing our prophecy. Yeah. I get it out of your way. Not in my way. Okay. Um, and that's kind of it. Um, this one is very fun and witchy. And I do kind of think that this song is exactly the culmination of all of Taylor's work up until that point. Okay. Like it really kind of, I think rounds it all out and says like, this is what I've been writing about and hoping for my whole life and why am I not getting it? That's what I was going to say. Okay. Take it away. Well, let's see. First of all, yes, there are tarot cards here. Yes. Um, and of course, so why would I know anything at all about tarot cards? Cause you know something about everything. I know everything about something. Okay. So here is the, um, the dark secret about my fetish for tarot cards. Um, I do collect them. Yeah. I have more than 60 decks up there on a bookshelf all stacked up and, and stuck back. And so of course it begs the question. Why? Why? Yes. Um, actually I read the poetry of William Butler Yates. Okay. And, um, and I love William Butler Yates as a grad student and I read a biography of him. It's still back on my shelf. And, uh, one of the things that, uh, that you discover about William Butler Yates is that he was a matter master of a Rosenkristian fellowship. He was interested in the occult. Many of his poems refer to tarot cards and so I became interested in tarot cards. So that was like a, you said in grad school. Oh yeah. In grad school, this was a long time ago. Okay. So like for my whole life. Yeah. Don't hold. Thank you. Yes. You weren't quite born yet. Yes. Thank you for reminding everyone that Uncle Jerry is old. Um, yeah, it was in the 80s. I'm from the 80s too. Yeah. Okay. Thank you Blondie. So yes, uh, I got interested in tarot cards. I joined a Rosenkristian fellowship via the mail. It was in California. So I, I don't know, I became interested in them. And so I started collecting them. I have all kinds of tarot cards and I took down some samples to just show off. Look, I mean, I, I don't, I, I branched out. I not only collect, uh, tarot cards, but I collect all, this is the Oracle Belline. Oh yeah. Yeah. She was, um, a prognosticator in the 1960s and she took an older deck and kind of made a, uh, 53 card set of kind of, um, prophecy cards, if you will. Um, this is, oh yeah, this is, yeah, I'm sorry. This is the, uh, you can see the, um, taped up. Yeah. Um, so I used to do tarot card readings. I used to go to fairs and things like that. And I would, yeah. And I would do, um, tarot card readings. Um, these are cool. Yeah. This is my favorite deck. So this is the Alistair Crowley Tooth deck. Um, so it's got these really, really nice illustrations. Oh, you can actually see that. Yeah. Yeah. Um, it's got really nice illustrations. Um, that I love. Yeah. Those are fancy. Yeah. These are really fun. So I used to use this deck. I mean, I literally have had this deck for 40 years. Um, I haven't, I have a brand new one. That's the same. Yes. It's exactly the same. It's never been unwrapped. It's back up there. And so I just keep it in its pristine shape. Um, I have, I have a copy of the oldest, um, tarot cards. So this is the, this conty Svorsadek. So those, this conty Svorsadek were, uh, and, uh, a couple. Yeah. These are cool. This is a, um, this is a reproduction. Obviously the real ones are actually in three different collections around Europe. And like you can go see them or have them. Yeah. They're on display. There is not, there's no single, uh, copy remaining of these cards because they were handmade and hand painted. So you can, you know, you kind of see they're really, really beautiful. Yeah. Um, and so this is a, um, facsimile reproduction. So this is the size of the original cards. Um, and it was made for these. Uh, Italian families, probably in the mid 1400s. Whoa. Yeah. Kind of fun. And, um, so, oh, this is the one I have, but the regular size, the rider weight. Yeah. This is the rider weight. Yeah. I have that one, but, and I needed, I was like, I need to get those before I leave. And then I forgotten. And I was like, it's going to be fine. Uncle Jerry, that's a lot. So I had this little tiny one and it's a mini deck so you can carry it with you anywhere you go. So yeah, this is the rider. So cute. I know, aren't they? I had to get it. Um, as a matter of fact, I had to get it. I know this, this is when you know you're dealing with a collector because I have one that I actually carry and use and then I have another one up there. It's unwrapped. It's like keeping your favorite toy in the box. Yeah. Yeah. And so yeah, I have a rider weight. Just in case. Just in case. All unwrapped. Um, but this is the, this is the most recent one I bought. Uh, I know. But anytime you, anytime it's got a magnetic closure. So this is actually a rider weight, but it's done in this beautiful black and gold foil. Oh my goodness. Can you see that? Yeah. You can see how shiny they are. So fancy. So this is the upper side and then these are the cards themselves. Yeah. So cool. People are going to be so impressed that you have a so shiny thing. It's another thing. I know it. It really is. Um, I mean, it's kind of crazy. I got way into it. And mostly through poetry. I mean, you know, it was Yates's poetry that made me think, okay, so how and why are these important to Yates? What do they mean? So I started studying. I got the pictorial guide to the poet, to the tarot by, this is by a weight. So a weight was the rider weight deck. Right. A weight was a British occultist and it's also someone who Yates studied and met. So yeah. So you know, that's the weight. I mean, this is the Joseph Campbell book on tarot. And yeah, I know I've got lots of these. Wait, does that say, sorry, I've never looked at this section of your, of your book shelf here. Does that say A to Z? A horoscope maker? A delineator. Yeah. Yeah. I can talk about that. So this is the, this is the cabala and this is a book about the cabala. One of the layouts you use when you do tarot card layouts is the cabalistic tree of life layout. So I usually use the tree of life or I use the Celtic cross, which is a really nice card layout. And I can also do the four card daily. So if you want your daily run after this. Yeah, let's do it. Yeah, after it, not during it. I just got into tarot and astrology in the pandemic. Cause there was nothing else. I mean, I was like kind of into it before, but then I like bought a bunch of books and started like, If you want to save a few quid, British gas have a way you get half price lecky and it's called peak save on every Sunday. It's the smart thing to do if you're regular folk or furry and blue 11 till four. Let the good times begin. You could charge up the car or take the dryer for a spin. Half price electricity, what joy that brings with British gas peak save, we're taking care of things. T's and C's apply eligible tariffs and smart meter required. I did not know that. Trying to study stuff. Yeah. Okay. So this is a fun story. You were there for a second for this story, but you left. Now I'm wishing you kind of would have stayed at my, um, bachelorette party slash wedding shower was hosted by your daughter. And I wanted to do a Taylor Swift theme, but I also want to make it kind of witchy and taro we and so I did what was we, the theme was the Aura's tour. Oh, the Aura's tour. And so everything was Taylor theme, but then we had an aura photographer and a tarot card reader. Okay. And so we all got readings. We all got our aura photographed and then like everything else was like Taylor themed, like there were Taylor decorations or Taylor puns for all the food. Wow. Okay. It was very fun. I mean, I'm not sure if I'm doing my personal account. There's like a couple of reels about it in the high, a story highlight that y'all can go look at, but have you ever had your aura charged or a massage? No. Okay. Well, I have. Well, actually I was going up to, uh, to Denton to, uh, when I was learning tarot back in the eighties. Um, and I really kind of, I was doing it mostly by my own reading and by, um, by taking the correspondence course through the California Rose Christians. And, um, I thought, you know, I'd really like to check this to say how thought authentic it is. I couldn't call William Butler Yates because he was dead and I couldn't, couldn't summon him. Not yet. No. So, um, I happened to be at, at an occult bookstore in Dallas when I was buying another, um, tarot card deck and there was an advertisement for a witch who gave lessons in Denton. And so I went up, I made an appointment with her and went up and took some lessons from her. She was very good. Um, I mean, she was very patient with me because she knew that although I don't subscribe to what they purport to be able to do, nevertheless, I wanted to know how they work so that I could understand the literature better. And she was very nice. And she, on my second lesson, she asked if, uh, it was okay to bring a friend in. She was an aura, uh, master. And I said, that's great. And she brought a friend and she gave aura charging. She essentially stands over you and rolls her hands around, never touches you, but massages and charges your aura. What, did you feel different after that? Yeah. I said, I couldn't tell if it was better either aura, um, before or after. And as I recall, she didn't like the, the, the humor. I would assume not. No. Yeah. This is all fascinating. Do you think? Yes. Yeah. Are you guys really going to find this interesting? Yes, they will. Okay. It's in the prophecy. I'm telling you. Yeah. Absolutely. Um, shall we talk about the poem? Yeah. One more story. Okay. Um, I just went on a trip with my friends to Asheville and we are all friends because of Taylor, like online friends is a long story. Um, we, when we get together, we like to do PowerPoint parties. As you know, I love to make a PowerPoint. That's what helped me. Um, and we decided this time to do your perfect Taylor album and we, the only role was 15 songs and you could, it could be whatever you want it to be. So it could be like, you know, a, a, a sonically cohesive, it could tell an album, it could tell a story, it could be your favorite songs that you just think are all go together, like anything. And I actually did two because I did one and then I was like, well, I have another idea. And mine was, my second one was, um, the album was called invisible string, which is another Taylor song. And the prophecy was the first song on that perfect album. And I did it all about, um, all of her, it was all the songs that were, she talks about like fate and stars and astrology and, you know, the universe, like being in charge of our, our fate and stuff. And so that was like my second perfect Taylor album. That's fun. So you guys did like PowerPoints to prove your point and who won? There was no winner. Oh, we, we're all the winners. Okay. So, um, yeah, that was just like this, this is kind of coming out of perfect time that Patriot wanted to do this one because it's all fresh in my head from making that PowerPoint. I mean, I have to admit, I was kind of excited for this because I, um, I mean, I like Tarot Cards and when I saw it in her work, I thought, oh, that's pretty funny. Yeah. Um, and I hadn't really, I hadn't thought about Tarot and literature for a little while. Oh yeah. So it really took you back. Yeah, it really did. It took me back. I was really interested. Yeah. I will, I'll tell you one more story and that is I, when I, when I got this book, I want that book so bad. I'm gonna buy that right now. I'm gonna buy the horoscope by Llewellyn George and it tells you, it tells you how to create a natal horoscope and, um, yeah. And what, what it all means. And, um, and so I studied and studied and it took me months to learn how to do it. And by the time I thought that I was really getting proficient, someone made a computer program where you can just put in your, uh, date of birth and location and it pops out the whole chart and I was pretty upset. Yeah, that is upsetting. I mean, I learned a lot by learning how to do it. Yeah. That's, I think that's probably a crucial step because I haven't learned how to do that. I just go to those online things and say, make me a chart. There you go. You know, Chaucer actually wrote a, um, he wrote a book. It's not a, it's not a big book. He wrote a short work, I guess I should say, uh, called a treatise on the Astrolabe, um, you know, and he sent it to a son and he asked his son to retrain, to translate it back to him. And so it's kind of fun to see if he, to see, understanding. Yeah. And proficient in languages and understood how to use an Astrolabe. So if you've ever seen the movie, the name of the Rose, he's, um, the Sean Connery character has one. He has an Astrolabe that when one of the monks comes to his room, he quickly covers up because they were, um, methods of divination, which was kind of against the law. Um, or it was seen to be handling your own future when you should be relying on God. So right. Right. Which, which is why these tarot cards got a bad name. I think, um, you know, the, I mean, some people believe they're, they're like anti-Christian. Well, you know, um, yeah. They feel very, um, yeah. But, uh, but it's not, it's, um, most of the imagery is religious imagery. It's very, yeah. Right. And, and a great deal of it is in fact Christian imagery. And some of it's not, some of it belongs to other religious traditions. Um, but it is, it is a religious imagery, which, you know, in itself was interesting to me because, uh, you know, my dissertation in history is on history of religion. So kind of fun. Kind of ties it all together. Right. But yeah, I was really disappointed when I learned how to do the, uh, the horoscope. And all of a sudden there's a computer program that just pops it out. I'm like, yeah. Cheaters. I know, cheaters. Hey, the prophecy. Right. The prophecy. Um, uh, so obviously I read the title and, and it's something prophetic. And I did wonder what we might see in it in the way of, uh, divination. Um, and, and I wasn't disappointed. Yeah. It's all there. Um, I, uh, although with the first line, I didn't think it was going to go that direction. You know, it starts off hand, hand on the throttle. And I thought, okay, so what kind of, what kind of hand on the throttle? Um, you know, usually they talk about a foot to the, a pedal to the metal, right? Or your foot's on that throttle. But, um, and I thought, well, a train has a, um, a throttle that you have to hold by hand. Yeah. You have a two-man switch, uh, where you have to keep, keep a lever pulled down and you have to hold it. Um, so if you ever let go of it, the train will immediately power down. Oh, okay. That makes sense. Right. Um, the same thing's true of steam boats. They also have a throttle. Um, so I was kind of, kind of interested in, I wonder what she's envisioning for what she's on. Um, but hand on the throttle had an antique sound to it. Okay. Yeah. So I was kind of anticipating perhaps an antique story. Um, and then it also puts her in the driver's seat, right? If she's in the throttle. So she's in charge. She's in charge. Um, she's always surging forward. And then I started thinking about the word throttle. I mean, I wondered, did she choose it because it has an antique sound? Is it because it shows her in the driver's seat? And then I thought about to throttle someone means to choke them. So I wondered, wait a minute, is this one of her? I'd like to choke the guy. And stories. Yeah. Because to throttle someone is to put your hands about them and to choke them. Oh, and then the, yeah, the next two lines, cause it's like, well, that was, that's over. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Yes. And it's thought I had caught lightning in a bottle. Okay. That's an idiom to catch a sudden dramatic success. And here's lightning again. We've seen that in her other songs. I sound so knowledgeable about Taylor Swift. Now that I have 35 songs, that's what that is that like 15% of her total output. Maybe. Yeah. Well. But she's thought she had caught, but no, it's gone again. And it is a general reference pronoun. Okay. There is no noun and a seed. And so I think that she does this purposefully. She understands a bit of grammar. So I think that she wants us as the reader or as a song listener, but certainly for me as a reader, I still haven't heard the song. I am really curious. I love this song. Okay. I really am interested. I want to know if it has a spooky sound or if it's a little angry or just what. Yeah. Yeah. She wants, she wants me as the reader to ask, well, what is it? And what's gone again? Right. What's gone again? And since it's again, I think it's probably a relationship, another lost relationship. So yeah, I'm putting the three lines together and I'm thinking, oh, I wonder if she intentionally has ambiguity. Take your first drink of the day. I wonder if she hasn't, you know, that is one of her poetic techniques as intentional ambiguity. Yes. I'm wondering if she's being ambiguous with the word throttle to mean to, yeah, to surge forward or to choke somebody. Yeah. Right. And I think she might mean both in this context. Never considered it. Yeah. That's fun. I like it. I mean, I like what she does with ambiguity because she's very purposeful with it. So it's gone again. And then I'm thinking, oh, darn, is this going to be another one of those? I'm so sad I lost my love poems, but it's not. It's better than that. And it was written. Okay. It sounds very biblical. Both Jesus and Paul in the New Testament say it is written and then they quote some passage or other. Right. This is just how things are going to be. Right. Yeah. So it's a lot of the expression written in the stars, which is also sort of Shakespearean. There's a form of it in one of his plays. So written in the stars could be prophetic. Right. And so now I'm thinking, oh, prophecy, it's faith. And so I'm thinking, oh, this is getting interesting. So it's illusion, right? It's kind of a reference to biblical literature, but also maybe prophetic literature. It was written. Okay. So what's written? I got cursed like Eve got bitten or was it punishment? So I love the illusion. It's both an illusion and a simile. Right. So I'm like Eve and it's a reference to Eve from the Old Testament. She got bitten by a snake and was that punishment? I don't know. By the way, there is a whole theological discussion about that. You know, a fourth century writer. Sorry. It's time for your Bible lesson, kids. Wait, hold on. It's time for your Bible lesson, kids. And can you tell what just changed? Yeah. Find what changed behind us. It's like one of those old magazine things where you have to find the difference. Yeah, find the difference between this goose and that goose. She's the goose. So no. That's silly, dude. Okay. So there's a fourth century writer, Augustine of Hippo or Augustine of Hippo. And he writes that, you know, that this is original sin. Well, the phrase original sin never appears in the Bible. This is this theological idea, but it has seized hold of the way most people interpret the Bible that Adam and Eve's fall is somehow an original sin. There's a lot of other literature. A lot of theologians also say a lot of Jewish theologians as well. An 11th century theologian says that he thinks it's in fact intentional that God wants us out of the Garden of Eden because he wants us to have free will. So you know, she eats of the, prior to eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, she has no knowledge of good and evil. So how does she know what's good and what's bad? And how does she know she's doing right if you don't know? God said it was wrong, but the snake said it was okay. Who's, who are you going to believe? God put the snake in the, in the garden. All of this is problematic. Yeah, I mean, it is. So it is the, there are a number of theological questions. So I like the fact that Taylor Swift says, I got cursed like Eve got bitten or was it punishment? So was it, was it a gift to go out and seek your free will or was it punishment that you get ejected from a so-called perfect relationship? I don't know. You know, she's got to discover that. Interesting. Right. So, yeah, I mean, I like the illusion to Eve because I think she's doing something fairly complicated with it. Yeah, it seems like it. Right. So, I mean, the question about Eve is, is she ejected from the garden as a matter of punishment? So she has to endure pain and childbirth and eventual death. Or is this a, is this a kind of gift of free will where humanity gets to discover our own needs, wants, desires? You know, and all of that is the question she's asking of the prophet, you know, who can, who can tell me this prophecy? You know, am I being punished because I keep losing relationships or is this because there's a better relationship out there and I'm supposed to seek it as a matter of my free will? I'll get goosebumps. Yeah, I mean, I don't know. So I liked it and maybe I'm making too much of the whole Eve illusion, but. No, that's amazing. Yeah, but I liked it. I thought that that was really fun. So she says pad around when I get home. You know, her word choice, her diction is really fun. So you got to stop and say pad walking quietly. And you think of the pads of your feet, the soles of your feet. So is she walking without shoes on? Is she barefooted? Is she pacing? It feels like there's a sense of comfort and at-homeness with the word pad. Pad around when I get home. Interesting. Yeah. I guess a lesser woman would have lost hope. A greater woman wouldn't beg. But I looked to the sky and said, we got to stop. So the lesser woman lost hope, the greater woman wouldn't beg are both idiomatic, right? They're kind of idiom. It's also a technique called antithesis. So you've got these anathetical rhetoric, so lesser versus greater, lost hope versus begging. It's also juxtaposition or foil writing. Okay. You've got two different women and you're supposed to reflect back and forth on them. And they're in kind of a binary opposition. Yeah. Right? Yeah. I always, so this little segment right here, like pad around when I get home, I've never thought of it as like home is kind of a comfort, like that's your home. That's where you feel the most yourself maybe. But I always just picture her like she's just at home pacing around and then saying a lesser woman would have lost hope and a greater woman wouldn't beg. That always to me is like she's talking about herself as she's just like a normal girl in the middle, a normal woman in the middle. She's just an average woman. Right. Yeah. She's obviously not, but at the same time, she's just a human woman. You know, when you're at home and you got your shoes off. Yeah. Yes. You're just a girl. Right. Yeah. You know, there's a great saying by Robert Heinlein. He wrote in one of his novels, he's a science fiction writer. He said, everyone looks equally stupid on a commode. So. It really caught me off guard, but that's very true though. It's just like we're all just humans. When you're at home and you got your, when you got your socks off and your feet up or you're just messing around the house, you're just walking back and forth, asking yourself what is going on? When is this going to happen? Yeah. You're just being very human. Yeah. Okay. So you go back up to Eve and I think that ties up with Eve because, you know, like I said, the question about Eve is, is she being punished and ejected and does she have to submit to pain and death? Or is this a kind of gift? I mean, I can't put it into humanity to be free, to be given that choice in life. Yeah. To go live your life, how you choose to live your life. Right. And so a lesser woman would look on that as having lost hope. Oh no, I'm going to live in pain and die, you know. But a greater woman wouldn't beg for it back. I don't want back in the Garden of Eden. I mean, I'll say it again. I don't and own it. I don't want back in the Garden of Eden. I want to be free to make my own choices so that at the end of life, if there is a summation that we can sum that up and say, well, he was either a jerk and talk about people in commodes or he was not a bad guy. Right. Yeah. I mean, he tried to do right by his family and by people at work and by friends. And yeah, I mean, so I'm not going to beg to be back in the Garden of Eden. I'm going to be OK. Interesting. Yeah. I like that, that antithetical rhetoric that's going on here, both with Eve and with the lesser and greater woman. OK. I have to, this is just occurring to me now that Cassandra is the song after this on the album. She goes to the prophecy and then Cassandra. Oh, who is prophetic? Yeah. So that's fun. But also in Cassandra, she's also talking about, you know, patching up the she's at home and she's patching up the cracks on the walls. And I've never connected that like where both of these are her like at home. Oh, that's great. Like at home in a in a in a bad moment. Right. Yeah. Well, I mean, that's the deal is you take your your good moments, your bad moments home with you every night. Yeah. You just do. And you kick your shoes off and you pad around and and you try to assess, you know, where where is this all going? Right. Exactly. Or sometimes you look up and you say, please. I mean, my the first time I read this, I have to admit I laughed out loud when I hit the word, please. I know it's so fun. But I looked to the sky and said a greater woman bag. But I look to the sky and said, yeah. And I'm anxious to hear the song, you know, again, for those of you who are first time listeners and still with us after the commemoration. I have not. I've never heard these songs. So, you know, not having heard the song before, I'm interested to know how much of a pause there is between I looked to the sky and said, you know, is she talking to God, talking to the stars, talking to the prophetic, you know, beings and elements. And the only thing she says is, please. A single plaintive word. I've been on my knees. OK, so we have to talk poetry just a little bit. OK, OK. You know, we she really does have nice rhyme going. If you go back up to the first verse, throttle and bottle. Written and bitten. You know, she she doesn't do it in every line, but she doesn't often enough that she's sort of playing with rhyme. There's no consistent rhythmic pattern. But most of the lines are at least six syllables, and then you get to the single line in the chorus, please. Really kind of makes it like it stand out. It's emphatic. Yeah. Yeah. And that's something that all good poets do is when they do alter the rhythmic pattern, they alter it in a way that is that's trying to get a message to the reader. Right. And the message is she really needs help. Please. I've been on my knees. OK. This could be ambiguous. OK. Wait, let me let me try to get there. OK, so I'm always thinking I've been on my knees because I'm begging. Yeah. But also. I've been on my knees. Oh, like you're like you're like you're down like you're down on the ground. Like you're down and out. Yes, like you've been knocked to your knees. OK, OK. You know, I get knocked down and I get up. But I get up again. You're never going to keep me down. Chubba Wamba or whatever it is. Chubba Wamba. Chubba Wamba. Tubthumping, I don't know. What a classic. It is greatness. I bought that whole album. Remember when you guys have to do that? Yeah. Buy a whole album for that one song. I did. I bought the whole CD for that one song. And it's like, oh, I just wanted that one, really. Yeah. Yeah. Yes, I thought it was there's a level of ambiguity going on here. I've been on my knees. She's on her knees praying. She's on her knees because she's been knocked down by life. You know, she's on her knees because she's like down and out. So, yeah, I liked the expression. So she she uses it both figuratively and literally. OK, yeah. So literally, she's on her knees praying, but figuratively her she's been emotionally knocked down. Yeah, so. She she wants, she says, change the prophecy. Do it. Just just change it. Change it. And of course, that begs the question, is this possible? You know, I don't know if it's a prophecy. It just is written. It is written. Yeah, she says that up in a previous line. But we don't want that to be true. But she doesn't want it. No. She says, don't want money. Of course, I'm going to have to pause and say people with money. There can very easily say, I never wanted money, you know, while they're counting. Right. And, you know, but nevertheless, I understand she would be willing to give up. Yeah, like I'll give it up for. For just someone who wants my company. You know, and when I saw wants my company, but wait, does she own the record company? She is the record company. Does the word company is it ambiguous? Oh, God. I'm going to go. I'm going to choose no up for the sake of my brain on this one. You know, it didn't work for me. I don't think that she wants someone to buy her record catalog over again. Yeah, I think that she means literally her companion. Somebody that wants to hang out. Right. Yeah, which she's been writing about forever. There's a song on red called Stay, Stay, Stay. And she's like I've and it's about it's like not about a relationship. It's about like an imagined relationship where she's like, this is what I want. And she says I was thinking it might be nice. I can't think about exactly goes, but she says to hang out for the rest of our lives, basically, you know, just going to hang out. And then also this this section, which I know we haven't done this and we need to. But Elizabeth Taylor, she says in that song, which we know is the first song that she wrote for the life of a showgirl. Elizabeth Taylor was the first one that was written. So this was like very early on in the her relationship with Travis. When that song was written, the only one that has a little bit of like anxiety about like, will this work out? And she says I would trade the Cartier for someone to trust. But then she follows it with just kidding. Because like, actually, yeah, I can have it all and I do want to have it all, you know, but like if I needed to, like maybe I would give it all up, you know. Right. Yeah, I guess. Would she? Yeah, I mean, who knows. Yeah. What if what if she just gave half of it? Let's say let's say a billion. Yeah, but I don't want to make fun of her for having money, you know. I understand the emotional anxiety that she's dealing with here in the song. So yeah, in the text of the poem, I'm willing to be a forgiving reader and say she just wants someone to be with. And she says, let it once be me. And of course, let it be is a Beatles song. I think there is a song I didn't look it up. Let it once be. But I have to look that up and see. And, you know, who do I have to speak to? You know, now it should be with whom do I have to speak? But you realize the use of the word whom has almost entirely fallen out of the English language, especially in in American in standard ed at American English, we're supposed to use whom. But when we speak, almost no one says rarely. Right. So who do I have to speak to? About if they can redo the prophecy. She wants a retake. Yeah. Yeah, let's go back. Yeah. And she's like, who's in charge here? Who do I have to speak to? Is it God? Is it these planets? Is it the faiths? Is it the stars? Something someone has got to be able to fix this. Yeah. Yeah. Then she turns to tarot cards. Yes. I don't know if this is, you know, when I first read cards on the table, immediately, obviously, it's a cliche, a famous cliche in idiom that says, let's open up, let's be transparent. Right. Yeah. My cards are on the table. Right. My cards are on the table. Here's what I've got. What have you got? But but I do have to say since the title of the work was prophecy, even on my first reading, what popped into my head was tarot cards. That was for me, too. It instantly I was like, oh, she's because she talks about cards a lot, like playing cards. And I feel like that was a lot of people's first reaction. But and maybe it is ambiguous in that line. But I feel like she's specifically just talking about tarot cards. Right. I do, too. And I read a tarot card reading. Yeah, I probably should have prepared this. Have you seen the fool? Mm hmm. Not in that deck, though. But if you look at the fool, you know, she says after the cards on the table, mine play out like fools in a fable. So here's the fool or you could probably find a nice picture of the fool. The fool. Yeah, you can see that. OK. So yeah, the fool is he has a son over his shoulder. He looks like he's doing pretty well. A rose in his hand, a stave with a satchel or or sometimes it's a gourd, a double represented gourd. In this particular one, it's a satchel. And he's walking straight off a cliff, looking straight up at the sky. And his dog is kind of leaping. And the question is, is the dog jumping off the cliff to or is the dog trying to get him to stop trying to get him to stop? Yeah. And it's usually interpreted as the dog is trying to get him to stop. There is a Hebrew idiom from non canonical Hebrew literature that says a fool walks with his dog behind him. Right. The the idea is that, you know, the dog, if you're in an ancient society or if you're a shepherd, you know, the dog should be going out in front of you so it can see if there are any dangerous animals or any enemies or there's a cliff or something like that. But this guy walks with the dog behind him because, well, guess what? He's a fool. And she says the fools in a fable. And that made me wonder what what fable is she talking about? You know, she's not just talking about the card, but is she talking about? I wrote down Gimple, the fool, which is an Isaac, but she was seeing her short story about a character who's kind of a fool. His wife cheats on him, poor guy. And so there are a number of fools. In Chaucer, the millers tale of poor millers, pretty foolish. So there are a number of fools in different fables. None of them ever come to any good. Right. Being the fool has your wife cheat on you, has your daughter become a cheat, have you losing all your money, losing all your livestock. All the stories of fools always play out poorly for the fool. And she says, mine plays out like fools in a fable. So we should probably stop and admire the use of alliteration. Yes. Right. The F's and fools and fable. You know, Alessa Ryder would have said fools in a story. Right. Right. Oh, it was sinking in, sinking in. Oh, slow is the quicksand, poison blood from the wound of the pricked hand. You know, usually I don't like two word rhymes, but quicksand and pricked. Yeah, it's kind of fun. It's kind of fun. I like that. Yeah. So I do have to say I like this whole passage because you've got the quicksand, which is a metaphor, right? For life is sucking her under to her death. It's, you know, loneliness. She's sinking the gradual process of realization that none of this is working out that the stars and cards are aligned against me. That's fun. Like sinking in on the line above as she's saying, like I'm understanding that I'm always going to be the fool. Right. But then when you put it with the line underneath it, so it was sinking in. And then she's like, I'm sinking in quicksand. Yes. Yes. And also fun that slow is the quick. And so the use of sinking is not only idiomatic, but it's also ambiguous. Yeah. Take a drink. Because sinking, she has a sinking feeling. So emotionally sinking, but but also literally sinking in the sand. So yeah. And then you've got poison blood from the wound of the pricked hand. Obviously, a sleeping beauty reference. To bring it in your fairy tales. She is. This is I looked it up just so those of you who have your morphology of the fairy tale handy. OK, yes. Yeah. This is number four ten on the Arne Thompson scale. OK. So you know, I remember us talking about that. Yeah. And Steve Thompson, Arne and Thompson are the two that create this whole list of different fairy tales and they catalog them. So this is number four ten. There are a number of stories where the young girl usually prepubescent girl is told by way of a prophecy. Hence the use here that she's going to be pricked. And in some of them, she's going to get a piece of flax stuck in her finger or under her fingernail. OK. So flax is actually would be something that a common person would make. You know, flax is a stalky plant. OK. So you take the flax and you you cut the stalks and then you lay it in a river or you soak them and you take them out and you crack it. And the hard shell comes off. You have all these nice pieces of stringy flax and then you can weave it together. OK, gotcha. And but it has these little slivers in that process. And so if you can get them stuck in your hand, it's really painful. Or it's a spinning wheel, you know, in the classic Disney story, it's a spinning wheel. And that that prophecy for since for Sleeping Beauty is that she has to she goes to sleep. Yes. And the only thing that can wake her up is true love. Yeah. So you have the evil witch, the evil prophetess, who says that she's going to get pricked and she'll die. And then you have the good fairies who say, well, we can't do away with the whole prophecy, but we can change it slightly. Right. And the change is she'll only go to sleep until she is awakened when true love's first kiss. OK. Yeah. Right. So in that case, the prophecy does change, which is I wondered why if she's using it here because Cinderella in the Disney sense is a story of a changed prophecy. OK. So so is that like a like a tiny bit of hope in there that maybe it can change? A little bit of hope. Yes. Pull that sliver out and she's going to awaken and to her true love. Interesting. Yes. The last line of the verse. Oh, still I dream of him, the prince who will come and awaken her. Yeah, because she's a sleeping beauty. Right. So she's dreaming. OK. OK. Interestingly enough, in the Arne Thompson number four ten index, where they mention both the flak stories and the needle stories, put the kids to bed now. The when the prince comes, he pulls the flaks out from underneath her fingernail, or he awakens her with a kiss only after he has sex with her. And so she is impregnated while she's asleep. That feels like rape to me. It's not great. No, no. But you understand that these stories come out of other cultures where yeah, the masculine hegemony is pretty firmly established. Right. So again, as a feminist reader, I read that part of it and go, yeah, that's great. Yeah, someone needs to be prosecuted right now. I mean, she's asleep and you have sex with her straight to jail. Yes. So but yeah, she's looking for that man who will be her response to sleeping beauty. Maybe not necessarily the whole thing. The Disney version. She wants the Disney version, I think, is pretty clear. Then we go to the chorus and she's back on her knees. Please, she plaintively cries. I've been on my knees. I've I've been down here, right? She's been so again, we had that and the ambiguity of meaning. She's been knocked down time again. She's prayed time and again. So I think that both are in charge. Yeah. Change the prophecy. Don't want money. Just someone who wants my company. Let it once be me. I like the infusion of the word once. I didn't mention before. You know, just one time. That's I want. All that's all I'm asking for. That's right. And I want the one time guy. You know, I don't want the guy for six months or six years. I want the one time guy. So love the word once it has a multitative meanings. I didn't use word ambiguity. Who do I have to speak to about if they can redo the prophecy? And that, by the way, is in German. Who do I speak to about if they can redo the prophecy? OK, then we have the bridge. Yes. And I love this. I do, too. Her bridges are are usually the poetic gems in the middle of the song. Absolutely. And, you know, I have said before that there are times when I think I could do without the final chorus or the outro. Yeah. And I think that some of you who listen, you know, your ears hurt when I say that because you love the songs and you need the whole song. When I say that, I mean, as a poem, as a poem, I'm not sure you need the redundancy, the repetition. I think it work. It must work in a song, but. But in a poem, I might edit it. Yeah, just on the on the page, it's like just on the page. Just repeating this. But in a song, you can like sing it differently. You can take it to a different, you know, key. Change key. Yeah. You know, the sounds can be different behind it. So that's like a different thing than. Yeah. I think I like her. Her bridges tend to be so strong that they almost feel like a final moment of the poem. So then like, why are we going back? Well, that was a great final word. Yes. Well, because the song. Yeah. So I treat it like a poem. She says, I sound like an infant. OK, so it's a simile. So how does an infant sound? Someone who whines and cries. Yeah, I'm just like having a meltdown. Well, and illegibly, right? Because I don't understand an infant mulling and puking, I'm quoting Shakespeare now. I was like, oh, no. Oh, yeah. You know, the line from Shakespeare, people, look at a mulling and puking like an infant, feeling like the very last drops of an ink pen. OK, so she's got the whole pen thing. Is this a little question mark? Is this a quill pen? Yeah, I mean, this does feel very quill pen. But that just to me, like that line is, I've got no more words to write down. Like I've written all the songs. Yes, I've been through all of these feelings before. Yeah, and I have nothing left to say, like except for change the prophecy. Where is it? Yes, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think I agree with you completely. Yeah, she's just it's like I'm tired of writing about this. I would like to write a different song or write a different poem. Yeah, I've had the very last drops. And I also thought of Last Drops of Blood, you know, because she is literally I think she feels like she's bleeding out her life. Both of these are similes like an infant like the last drops. The last drops of an ink pen, by the way, also very old fashioned, very antique feeling. And I think that it goes with the sort of antique ambiance of the poem. Yeah, agreed. Yeah. So we're dealing with prophecies and old fairy tales and tarot cards. And so I like it that she uses this antique simile. OK, you just saying that you it was sounded like blood to you, like she's bleeding out on the page in four torture poets. For a lot of her albums, she has actual poems that she puts inside the, you know, in the vinyl covers and stuff. And TTPT torture poets had two. One by Stevie Nicks and then one by her. That is like the summation of what the story of this album and which people really want you to dissect that one. They want us to like cover that like it's a song and have you look at the poetry. Yeah. But at the end of that, the very last line of that poem in tortured poets says, my veins of pitch black ink. Oh, that's fun. So you literally just called that. Hey, buddy. You're not a fool in a fable. I'm not the fool. Although I have occasionally drawn the card. The next line, a greater woman stays cool. So we're back to the greater, lesser woman thing. The greater woman stays cool, but I howl like a wolf at the moon. So like a wolf at the moon is a simile howling wolves. We got werewolves. I still see no vampires. No, no, just witches this time. Just witches. So would you to me. Well, well, so there's a tarot card. The moon. Yeah. Yeah. And now I need to go back through and find it. There's the moon. Love it. Yeah, we can see it. Yeah. By the way, you may notice in the moon, we have a wolf howling at the moon. Ah, so she says, I howl like a wolf at the moon. The moon can be a symbol of error or danger, but also the image of the moon, the goddess of the moon looking down between the two towers has a very placid expression. There's a lobster, a clawed creature coming up at us out of the water, almost unseen in the card of the moon. Like there's some danger lurking. Yeah, it can be an ominous card. So she says, I howl like a wolf at the moon. That's also very rhythmical. I howl like a wolf at the moon. So we have dactyls, the dactylic meter. Maybe that's why I like that's one of my favorite lines to sing. Oh, really? And maybe that's why, because it's like kind of the only one that like has that. Yeah, it's dactylic. So you have two unstressed soles and one stress soles, but I howl like a wolf at the moon. But but but but but but but but but but but but. That's actually how she sings it. Oh, is it? Like it's got that rhythm in the song. Yeah. Yeah. Alfred Lord Tennyson, when he writes the charge of the light brigade, uses that same rhythmic pattern because it's horses running. OK, so they're just going. Half a league, half a league, half a league on all in the Valley of Death Road, the six hundred so they're charging forward with their horses. Makes sense. So she seems to be running headlong into her disastrous life. Yeah. Yeah. And and I look unstable. Well, I wonder why, because she is stair howling like a wolf at the moon, which can be a portent of some kind of error or coming danger. It's just screaming like an infant. She's screaming like an infant. You have babbling. Yeah. So she's gathered with a coven round a sorceress's table. And again, we had this really wonderful rhythmic power gathered with a coven round a sorceress's table. So I have these alternating trokies and and dactyls that are really fun. And you have the witchiness of the coven and the sorceress. By the way, how many witches in a coven? Is this a joke or a real real real question? I don't know. Usually 13. Really? I wouldn't lie about that. That's Taylor's number. Oh, what? Is that her number? She loves that's right. You've told me this isn't the 13 song. Is it? I don't think so. That would be too freaky. I do have to tell a story that came out after we got this album. OK. Because I was always picturing that, you know, like we're just there's a bunch of women like with tarot cards and we're all trying to figure out where we're going next. And then we learned a story. Do you know who the model Gigi Hadid is? You know, I have actually heard the name, but I don't know. I don't know the face. There's no reason that you should. But her and Taylor are really good friends. They have been for a long time. She has a sister. She has two sisters. I don't know how many sisters she has. One of them is also famous and this other lady is. Is her name FF? No. OK. I just thought it's Gigi. I actually don't remember what her name is, but she Taylor invited them to one of the shows on the Eris tour and they rode with her on her plane and this woman, Gigi Hadid's sister, I should look up what her name is. So I don't just keep calling her that. Gigi Hadid's sister. Marielle is her name. Marielle. Marielle did a tarot card reading for Taylor. And this was, I think, when they had just she had just started talking to Travis and they she did a tarot card reading and was basically like this says you should go for it with this guy. Oh, well. And so then Taylor gave it a shot and went for it. And so I'm wondering if this whole song is was was inspired by like that moment of a tarot card reading from this woman who just was like, hey, go for it. And then she wrote this like beautiful. You know, you're engaging in biographical criticism. I know, but I just had to pull it in this time. It's OK. I'm the one who's supposed to try to because I am happily and vacuously unaware. Yeah, I just think that's that's so fun. Like to because we got the song first and that's what I was picturing in my head. Like, she wrote that perfectly. And then we a couple months later got that story. She this. Marielle went on a podcast and like told that story. And I assume with Taylor's blessing, because I think that's how everything works with Taylor is that like she's like, sure, go for it or don't you ever, you know? Yeah, I just think that's so fun that there could have been like an actual moment that inspired this whole song that was based around the tarot card reading. So she got the like the 10 of heart, the 10 of cups and not the 10 of spades. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. Ten of cups would be fulfillment in a romantic relationship. Ten of spades would be death. So. So yeah. Well, that's a fun story, though. Yeah, it does give the reason to the you know, to the song. Yeah, like just the inspiration behind it, like how she came up with. And you realize Marielle is little Mary. And when she's talking about Eve, the antithesis of Eve is Mary. Oh, goodness. Oh, dear. Oh, gosh. For those for those who haven't noticed a nice statue of the Virgin Mary lately, the Virgin Mary is usually depicted standing on a snake. So she is crushing the head of the snake that threw Eve out of the garden. So Eve, Eve is the reason why we have free will, but Mary is the reason why we have Christ, the redeemer. Salvation. Right. Yeah. So there you go. That's interesting. Aren't you glad I'm here? Yes. Yes. That's probably has nothing to do with the song. So they're around the sorceress's table. Yes. And a greater woman has faith. As opposed to the lesser woman who has no hope. By the way, I guess just because I I live that way, I thought of. And I marked it up in the up in the very first reference. I thought of Shakespeare's Macbeth, lesser than Macbeth and greater. Oh, I know. OK. I know. Oh, you know, but probably not for this song, but it just kept creeping into my head when she kept doing the greater and lesser one. Going back to it. Yeah. Right. I love the next line, but even statues crumble if they're made to wait. And I mean, it's a metaphor. It's a truism, you know, metaphorically, she's the statue or any of our hopes or statues. You know, what's a statue made out of stone, marble, something or perhaps even metal, but and you think of them as being permanent, but they're not. Even statues crumble if they're made to wait. You know, Percy Shelley, middle name, Bish. Percy Shelley wrote. He's the son of a bitch. Yeah. Thank you. I remember. Percy Shelley wrote a poem, Ozymandias. And that's the title of a Breaking Bad episode. Well, is it really? Yeah, I always remember that word. And I knew it came from something literature, but I didn't know what. Yeah, it's a poem about a, you know, a great eastern king who has this huge city built in his name and he has this giant statue erected and on the pedestal of statue, you know, it says, look on these works, she might and despair and nothing remains except for the fallen head of the statue and the pedestal. Right. So that the the inscription is ironic. Look on these works. She might and despair is ironic because there's nothing left. No works. Right. There are no works. The works of of humanity will ultimately dissipate to nothing. It will just go to sand. And so I love her use of this. I wonder if she's thinking of Ozymandias when she says even statues crumble if they're made to wait. Yeah, you know, for me, I really think this was my favorite line, but even statues crumble if they're made to wait. I like it because it's rhythmical, because it's metaphorical, because it's trip reminds me of Ozymandias, which is probably Shelley's most famous poem, Ode to the West Wind and Ozymandias. Probably is two most famous. I just liked it a lot. I always, you know, there are so many of these songs, poems, where I find a line. I think that's just a gem. Yeah, you know, that's a gem. Yeah. I'm so afraid I I sealed my fate. No sign of soulmates. And I like the word sign because people are always looking, you know, covens or prognosticators with tarot cards are always looking for a sign. A portent and auger, you know, something to show me the way. And she says there's no sign. There's no augury. There's no portent of a soulmate. I'm just a paperweight in shadows of gray. So gray and beige. Grays, gray. Yes. That was my second favorite line. Yeah, I do love this, too. Like because grayish became a thing. I want to say, like probably about 10 years ago, I think like your daughter's house might be painted in grayish. Yes. Like it was like a popular house color at that time, like a wall color, you know. Iris is kind of like that and we want to repaint. Yeah. Yeah. So it's just, I don't know, that's just kind of, you know, she has these like quill pin songs where she's talking about, you know, all of these super old references and then she pulls in grayish. It's always just kind of fun, like, because that's that's very of now, you know. OK, so we're closing in. We're closing off the the the the bridge, spending my last coin so someone will tell me it'll be OK. She's looking for a prophecy that's positive. And and beg the question, who is she seeking? Who's she looking for? Is she looking for a prophet, a priestess, a witch? Is she talking to therapists, you know, a friend or all of it? All of those because she's going to spend all of her money or just anyone to tell her. Yeah, that's I mean, it was funny because I started thinking, gosh, I wonder if she is treading beyond if she's padding beyond just the idea of a witch and a tarot card. You know, is she talking about her friends really? You know, I need help with you giving me advice and holding me up, keeping my statue from from deteriorating. Or is she talking with a therapist or with a psychic or just to. Yeah. And then like you got to go back through the bridge and look at the rhythm, the rhyming unity. You've got unstable table, faith, weight, faith, soul mates, Graze, OK. You it is nice. Yeah, you hear the rhyming power of the A that runs through every one of those. You know, not always in the same way and not always with the same consulate. So sometimes they feel like less like true rhyme and more like assonance, but but that A always runs through all those last lines. And, you know, you you combine that with some of the lines that are incredibly rhythmical, but I howl like a wolf at the moon or gathered with a coven round a sorceress's table or but even statues crumble if they're made to wait. You know, I just love the bridge. To me, this could almost be a standalone poem. Agreed. Yeah, it tells the whole story right there. Yeah. Yeah. Then we go to the chorus. The chorus is again this plaintive crying to heaven, the stars. Please, I've been on my knees. Change the prophecy. Don't want money. Just someone who wants my company. Let it once be me. Who do I have to speak to about? And now she completes the line about if they can redo the prophecy. Who do I have to speak to to change the prophecy? I don't want to redo. I want another direction completely change. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. And then we have the outro as we're rolling out. We go back to the original hand on the throttle. Thought I caught lightning in a bottle. Oh, but it's gone again. Pat around when I get home, I guess. A lesser woman would have lost hope. A greater woman wouldn't beg. But I looked to the sky and said, please. So she tax please back up. Yeah, I love the way this ends. The way it sounds when she's ending it is very fun. Yeah. So I do kind of like, you know, again, if I was if I was editing, I think I would edit edit down the chorus a little bit and keep the outro just as is because I like tacking the word please on the end. Yeah, me too. Yeah. And I like what I like. This is a very tailored thing to do. I don't know if we've seen it a ton yet. I think we've seen it a couple of times where she the outro matches. Verse one, like how the song started, she brings it kind of back. Yeah, I keep saying outro. It's outro. I mean, I think it's whatever you want to. I think you must be right. I thought we were all just having fun with the outro. Outro. All right. You want to hear it or you want to talk themes? Let's hear it. And then I'll talk things. If you are on Patreon, go listen to the song with us. And if not, we will be right back. That was fun. The song is good. Yeah, I just love that one. I don't know this. The sounds. There's this like a lot happening in the background. Yeah, strings in there, I think. And it's fun. You know, I like the I mentioned the consistent rhyme or assonance, if you will, of table faith, weight, faith, soul mates. Grays, OK. Just the same thing with knees, prophecy, money, company, me, prophecy, prophecy. Yeah. You know, but as she stresses it because she says prophecy. Yeah, please. Please. Prophecy. Knee. Is. Yeah. You know, the and I like several things that we talked about during the song, like the howling wolf howl. Yeah. I like the way she said, how do I? Who do I have to speak to? She says that in a slightly different tone. It's like she's standing at a complaint window. That's what I was. That's what I was just thinking, like she's like being a Karen a little bit. Like, who do I need to speak to? You know, it's like to make this right. Do I have to talk with the manager? Yeah, I liked it. I mean, yeah, it's like it's like she's I don't know. She's at Dillard's or she's she's the department store is saying what I got this. I got this dysfunctional love life. Yeah, yeah, I want to I want a new one and it's got to be right. Yeah, I have the same thought just now listening. Also, the we didn't talk really about paperweight. Oh, yeah. But I do kind of feel like paperweight maybe goes with what we were talking about, but feeling like the very last drops of an ink pen, like talking about like, I don't I can't write anymore. Like these are all of my stories. Like I have all of these stories here and I'm just here holding them down. Like these are the things that I've written about wanting this. And all I am is like sitting on these without anybody here. Right, I'm just sitting on them. Just I'm just here. Well, and I think it also matches with one of the previous lines. When she talks about sinking, right? Oh, I was sinking, sinking in slow in the quick. Yeah, right. So paperweight would be waiting down to sinking. Yeah, I've got all this crap and I'm sitting on it. And where is my love life? Yeah, that's that success that I really want. Yeah. Themes. Yes. Fate versus agency, right? You know, so how much how much does the greater woman take charge of her own life and get out there one more time? Once more, once more. She uses that, you know, and hoping for the one last time. The one. Yeah, just once. The cost of success. Because she does refer to her, her money, her company. You know, she does talk about how she has success in just every other realm of her life, except this one. And that's the one that matters. Yeah, I think that's I think that's the theme that hits the hardest for me is where she's like, I have all of these things. I have this career. I've made it to the top of my game. The preordination of destiny in romantic loss and love. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you know, so do you just feel like it's just been ordained somewhere that you're going to have this crappy relationship in that crappy one and that crappy one, and you're going to see the perfect person walk right by and by, you know. Which it does feel like that. It feels like meeting the person that you're supposed to be with feels like that should be impossible, you know. Yeah. And so it does feel like it's all it is written. You know, it feels like this is how it's supposed to be. And maybe we didn't write a person for you, you know, we didn't write. Yeah, there's not one in the cards for you. There's just not. Yeah. The pen ran out of ink before he got his name down. So sorry. And one more one more theme that I think is more implied, but I think that this is an intensely personal one for her. So maybe I am engaging in biographical criticism. Fear of being left behind. You know, I think that it's it's 2024 and she's writing the tortured poet society. It's not the happy poets running through Daffodil society. Yeah. And I mean, that's kind of that that let it once be me feels like that, because it's like I've seen my friends meet these people. I've seen my family meet these people and they've gone on and have these happy, successful marriages and relationships and whatever it is that they have. But just this one time, I need that to be. Yes, I'd like it to be me. Yeah. Right. Yeah, I do think that there is a sense of fear or fate of being left behind, just, you know, losing out. What what was the the theme you said about fame, the price of fame? Yeah, what's the price? The cost of success? Of success. Yeah, I feel like she's a several songs that kind of tie that into this one. Like she has a song called Peace where it's basically like if you're in a relationship with me, like am I enough to combat the the unpeaceful nature of what our life is going to be? Like you can't go out with me and not be hounded. You can't, you know, it's not a normal life. And like an anti hero when she's talking about being a monster on the hill, like I just don't have a normal life. I'm not a normal human. So can somebody because of my fame? So is somebody going to step into that with me? So so lastly, well, OK, almost lastly, lastly, in terms of thematic material, I really wondered and I don't want to talk about her necessarily, but I want to talk about her work. OK. I wondered in the poems when I began to reassess them as you just did, right, when I began going back through anti hero or that kind of thing. I began to wonder if the if the poem demonstrates a. A fear or a concern or maybe even a dark conviction that success in one area may somehow mean lack of success in another. Well, yeah, because we're kind of taught that, you know, you women can't have it all. Right. Well, there's an expression you can't have at all. Right. You're not allowed to be the world's biggest pop star and have a great romantic life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, you can't choose one or the other. Yeah, you've got to make sacrifices, you know, and I, you know, I dislike the inevitability of it, but I think that that's what the work kind of demonstrates is I it's asking that question. I wonder if success in this area means that the payment is, you know, the Eve's payment. Yeah, the punishment. The punishment is that I won't have success in this other area. And she's beginning to weigh maybe the poet's voice is beginning to weigh, you know, which one was more important after all? You know, was it the notoriety and the money and the company and the, you know, and the songs or and the artistic gratification? Right. Right. Or was it just somebody to pad around with? Yeah. Yeah. I said, I had one more. Yes. Your literary device for the day. OK, yes. I have not mentioned this before, but since I since I did say that I liked the outro here and I liked, you know, the the moderated the inclusion of the word please. I guess I should mention Inclusio. OK, that sounds like a Harry Potter style. Inclusio. Yes. Taylor, you must include. When when you when you have the same line or image or idea at the beginning of work and at the end of the work, it's called an Inclusio. Oh, right. So hand on the throttle. Thought I'd caught lightning in a bottle. Hand on the throttle. Thought I'd caught lightning in the bottle from verse one to the outro. Yeah, it's an inclusion. Who knew that was a term for that? There you go. Inclusio. So she does. She likes to do it in her other works as well. We've talked about that before, but I thought that I mentioned it here, especially because the Inclusio is the same, except she does change it with the word please. Yeah, so it's kind of fun. Yeah. OK, you ready to grade? Yeah. OK. OK, 99. Oh, OK. Lyrical strength. Are we giving that a 99? Yeah, I lyrical strength. So I really like to the rhythmical elements and I love the way she uses rhyme and assonance together at the ends of lines. I like the way she sings it. I'd like to hear her read it as well. Yeah, I like the way she used prophecy, please. It makes you listen. Uh huh. You know, so it's like she's really begging. Right. Yeah. So 99. I really, really liked that. Awesome. OK, narrative and structure. Yeah, I thought that it was really good. I liked the little pop up tarot cards. I liked finally getting right down in the weeds and saying, I'm going to a coven. You know, I'm not even going to leave you guessing as to whether I'm referring to tarot cards. Yes, I'm talking to the witches. The witches are here. We're doing this together. Right. So 97, I think that was strong. OK. Production and atmosphere. Oh, you know, the song was good. I liked the little pensive at the beginning. That was good. So 96. OK. Lore and literary references. Oh, so I like a lot of this. There's a lot of a lot of that going on. Yeah, I think that she's clearly it was written. She's referring to the Bible, especially to the New Testament, you know, where they referred the Old Testament. So and I especially like it that it was written is frequently used by Jesus and Paul. And they're always referring to the Old Testament, which is where we find the story of Eve, which is the next line. Right. So she's not just throwing this crap out there. She's literally coordinating it rhythmically, you know, and she gets to Eve and asks about punishment. And then she goes to the lesser and greater woman. How do I respond to that? If I were Eve, if I were blighted with this, or is it a blight? Or how does it work? Yeah. Yeah. So I'm doing a lot of talking here. You're allowed. Yeah, you're thinking I'm going to give this like a hundred. I just don't know. I'm just ready to see where you're going to go. Yeah. I'm on my tippy toes. I really am leaning towards a hundred. This is really I like it. Ninety nine point six. Oh, my goodness. And emotional impact. Oh, I mean, you ever felt like the prophecy needed to be changed? Yeah, occasionally. Yeah, I didn't know whom I should turn to. But but yes, I have. So but I'm going to say a 94. I didn't weep about it. I'm OK. That's a 97. Yeah, this is a good song. I say that I feel like every week. But I especially like this one because you have elements in it that I'm familiar with in poetry. So I like the use of references to the Bible. I like the references to the tarot cards and mixing up methods of prognostication. Fine. Great. All right. Thank you, patrons, for picking this one. Yes, that was fun. Yeah, that's right. Thank you, patrons. Yeah, they knew you were going to like it. Yeah, I did. OK, is that all? Anything else? I think I think that's all. OK, make sure you're following us everywhere. Subscribe on all of the things wherever you get your podcasts. You can follow us on social to make sure you know what's coming next. At Swiftie and Scholar Pod, you can find Uncle Jerry, a Dr. Uncle Jerry or Dr. Uncle Jerry. And you can find me at Angela Wyatt McDowell on Instagram. OK, OK, we will see you next week. Bye. Bye.