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Bia Heights Public School District in Minneapolis. She runs the schools that have had probably the most interactions with ICE. Hundreds of kids who are now learning remotely, dozens of kids who have been detained. Most famously, Liam Ramos, the five-year-old who was detained, sent to Texas, and then sent back. He's currently back. We talked a lot about what it's like to be running a school system that is under siege and all the ways in which she has had to adjust her own life and her own profession, doing things that she never thought she would have to do, and how her teachers and the people who work for her have had to take on this incredibly difficult role, comforting families, looking after kids, consoling siblings who have seen their parents taken away. I hope you enjoy the conversation, but more importantly, I hope you take something from it, which is that in tough times like this, community can rally and school systems can be a beacon of hope and they can push back against pretty aggressive forces from even our own government. It was a sobering talk, but it was kind of uplifting in a way. I hope you enjoy it. I hope you subscribe to The Bulwark so that we can continue to do important conversations just like this. Hi, everybody. so we're going to do something a little serious here we're going to do an interview the person we're interviewing is a genuine hero she did not offer me weed it would be a problem if she did we're going to talk with Zena Stenvik she's the superintendent of Columbia Heights School District Hi. You can stand up for her, Elia. Stand up! Hi. These are my friends, my neighbors, my community. Minnesotans really care about kids. I brought you something. It's not weed. I'm... no. You were right. That wouldn't work. Wouldn't go over well with the Columbia Heights School District. So there's something that our students are working on, a project that they're working on. And they're calling it a safe passage home because, as you know, we've had seven children detained. And in honor of little Liam and his bunny hat, they're making origami bunnies. And they're doing an art installation at our high school. They've made hundreds and hundreds of bunnies. So I made you a bunny. Thank you. And our young and vibrant communications coordinator created a design. And then one of our alumni has a printing press. So this says, Solidarity lives in Columbia Heights. Thank you. That's very kind of you. I didn't expect gifts. And paid for out of my own pocket, not taxpayer dollars. I'll get that question. A nasty email tomorrow. I feel like we should find a way for everyone to make some of these origami bunnies, but they look a little complicated for me. I don't think I can do that. There's a YouTube video. That's all I want. Okay, yeah, I was going to say, we could probably get online. So I'm cognizant of the duality of this event, which is we're all gathered here because we want to both celebrate the resistance of the community while simultaneously acknowledging that you have been through an incredible trauma. So it's not going to be a light conversation. I want it to be a newsy conversation. But hopefully at the end we can, I don't know, figure out a way to feel good about the path forward. I'm not going to say you have to do that, but hopefully we can get there. So I just want to start, and I'm just going to do this kind of chronologically because I don't think, personally, I don't know the totality of the story. And maybe there are people who are out here who don't quite understand the extent of what you're dealing with right now. But let's start back to the election of Donald Trump in 2024. How do you guys feel about that? But what were your genuine expectations, even before he took office, when he was elected, and what were your expectations specific to how it would impact your job in your school district? Well, immediately I understood that the new U.S. Secretary of Education was affiliated with a world wrestling... That's true. It used to be WWF when I was little, now it's WWE. I don't know what it stands for. So that definitely sparked some uncertainty, should we say? Sure. You know so right after the inauguration so I know you at election time but right after the inauguration on I believe February 10th we started partnering with the Wilson Law Group which provided bilingual presentations to our families and our staff called Know Your Rights Right So over a year ago we were having families fill out DOPA forms delegation of parental authority So in the case that they had to give their child away because they would be detained. It was just, it's not something that we've ever been, you know, trained to do. We are dedicated our whole lives to the well-being and caring for children. So we began with that. and we became trained in when the horrible day, because at that time the sanctuary of schools and hospitals and churches had been taken away. So therefore we became trained on the day that maybe an ICE agent would show up with a document signed, judicially signed warrant. We were trained on how to respond and what to do with that. But mind you, almost all of the, like our front door people, like our clerical people at the front door, almost all of them are either Hispanic or immigrant or a person of color. And so we had to make a contingency plan for, you know, we knew how scary that would be for those people. So obviously they would go somewhere else and a principal would come to the front. But did you think this was, you know, this is preparation, but it surely wouldn't happen? Or was this something like this could very well happen? What has happened to us is so unbelievable that no, I mean, we could have never fathomed what has happened. So what was the first inclination that this unimaginable reality was actually taking place? So we started the year off really great. And we are hopeful this year, you know, things had, it kind of finally felt normal after COVID and after the murder of George Floyd. and in October, at the end of October, we were having a staff training day, so no students on campus, and I said, why don't we do a food drive, because SNAP benefits were going away, and you know, all of our schools have resources, food and clothing and whatnot, and so we were like, let's bolster up our food pantries, because we knew there would be, so that was in October. then we went into winter break in December and before school we came back January 5th January 3rd which was a Saturday I got a cold call from a principal and if a principal calls you cold on a Saturday you know it's a problem ice is on campus ice is on campus teachers are emailing me our community members are texting me and I'm like okay I was at a family funeral and then another principal called me the high school principal after that I said you know and And it was so strange because at that time, our athletic, so schools are really busy even on the weekends. We have athletics and theater and all kinds of things. So our athletic director was on campus. And I had been messaging with our school board chair, Mary Granlin. Maybe you've seen her, any of her interviews. Someone's seen her. She's badass. She's a badass. Thanks. So I was calling her and I thought, here's what's strange. I didn't want our activities and athletics director to go and confront the ice vehicles parked in our parking lot. Because at that time, do you know how many ice agents he's chased out of our parking lots at this point? Lots. Okay. But not at that time. No, this was our first time, right? And so I was like, oh, you know, I'll have the school board chair go. And that was the first day that she got doxxed. And they took her photo of her license plate and they walked up to her car and they said her full name. Hello, Mary Rose Granlin who lives at blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Wow. So that was January 3rd. January 6th, our little 10-year-old Elizabeth was taken, apprehended and detained with her mother while they were driving to school. Jesus. Okay. Tell us about the day that Liam Ramos was detained. So that was the day that I broke, basically. And, well, that was one of the two days. because for weeks we had been asked getting media requests and I was like we're not talking to the press like let's just keep our head down keep quiet but it was the next day after Liam was abducted that we held a press conference so that day that morning I got a call from the high school so my office is connected to the high school so sorry for the high school principal but um so i mean i'm pretty sure they're probably grateful now but yeah at the time yeah we get along great i'm just teasing um so that morning i get a call from the high school principal and i i run over there and so on on their way to high on their way driving to high school three 17 year old boys were driving to school and they got stopped and surrounded by masked, armed, unidentified. They don't just have one actual officer come. There's no actual law enforcement practices that are happening here. It's lawless. So they're surrounding, which is really terrifying. And these are kids. They're children. And so I saw the video and the photo of two large masked men flanking and holding onto either arm of one of my students. And they're pleading with them. They're pleading with them. They took one of the boys and detained him. And then the other one, they said to him, I guess it's your lucky day. So I'm thinking, you're instilling survivor's guilt. I mean, there was just so much trauma and so many layers. So I spent the morning with the two boys. I mean, they raced to the front of the high school, parked all crooked, and ran in. And after about an hour and a half or so into conversations and just trying to console them, I mean, they were frantically trying to call the students family, you know, different friends and contact people because he was a minor all by himself and they detained him. All of our other children who have been detained were with a parent. Anyway, at one point they're like, I think I left my backpack, my wallet, everything's in the car. So I went out and parked the car, cleaned it out, got everything. So it was quite a morning. Right. So that was a Tuesday. So I knew I had a board meeting that day. so that was going to be the first day in a while that I wasn't driving the school van so I would drive a group of students who are in our walk zone which is a very dangerous place for us because at this time you know at arrival time and dismissal time there were three four ICE vehicles kind of up and down behind our high school circling around Valley View Elementary School in our middle school and so I knew I couldn't drive the van that day because sometimes you know you're dropping kids off and sometimes I would get back at 5 30 so other staff members were driving the school van to make sure kids could get home safely and we have many volunteers teachers walking kids home our retired middle school principal comes back every day to drive kids and lots of volunteers So I'm driving behind the high school because I knew there was a lot of ice activity in the neighborhood and I get a phone call from our school board chair, frantic, and you know and she's really whatever. So I get a call from her, please come to the corner of x and y and it was just two blocks right there. So I pop over there and it's, it was a sight to see, right? So there, we have a very organized community. And I think anyone here in Minneapolis knows about the communication on the community groups, right? And it's rapid. so I pull up find a place to park jump out and I was like where's the child where's the child I'm here and she comes up to me with tears in her eyes saying they took the child and I she kept repeating it and I was like no there's no way like that was in my mind like that's not possible so I go so we didn't at that point we also weren't wearing high heels or anything like we were wearing our combat boots and our jeans every day no earrings you know seriously weren't we you all were there so I like run up into the snow into the yard where a person was standing and I was talking to them I'm soy hablante español bueno bueno so I was talking to this person And they were like, yeah, I live here at the same home as Liam. And I was pleading with the officers. I live here. I live here. I can take him. I'll take him. And then my school board chair got there. I'm the school. The school's here. I can take him. And they wouldn't take him. So when I got there, I talked to this neighbor. And then I look into the driveway. And there's Liam's dad's car still running. I mean, I was that close. I mean, what could I have done? I don't know. there were eight masked armed agents, but I would have tried my damnedest. So, so then it all kind of gets blurry, right? I sent the address into, for our students' information system to see, like, what kids live here, and that had been my common practice. Many evenings, I would get texted, like, this house just got raided. Are there any kids there? Should we go in and find the other if there's any kids left behind right and so I'd be calling homes in the evening like looking for a four-year-old child that potentially well this is true this actually happened like is this four-year-old child with you or did they get left behind alone in the home because we'll come get them right well we talked a little bit backstage about how um there was a Washington Post piece about the district and one of the really crushing elements and anecdotes in it was having to talk to Liam's brother about what had happened. And you sent someone there and he just broke down. And obviously, you can understand that. Can you speak to how the psychic shock has impacted not just the brother, but everyone in the school? yeah i would say everyone probably everyone in the twin cities but everyone in our school district has been impacted i don't care if it's a white u.s born kid they've been impacted i've had children say to me am i going to get taken will my parents be home when i get home from school today just the fear is pervasive so that i'll never forget the day we were inside Liam's home trying to console his mother. We're looking through all of her immigration paperwork. She has all the legal documentation, a thick file. Their court date wasn't supposed to be until the end of February. And meanwhile, Liam's brother is being consoled by our school board chair and his principal. So there was just, you know, the mother, she was there, she wanted to open that door. But we all know now in the Twin Cities, you don't open your door. They will bash it in and they will take all of you. And she knew she had another child coming home in a few minutes. Jesus. The impacts are obviously psychological, but it's also educational. I read that in the Columbia Academy, 210 of the 700 students are now studying at home. That's not a great way to get an education, as we know from COVID. Your school district encompasses about 3,400 students, so I have to imagine that same ratio is probably true across the district? 800. 800. Online. Can you speak to the other types of adjustments? And by adjustments, I mean the, you know, going, doing virtual learning, but also what you're talking about here, parents coming out and having to create physical barriers and things like that. What are some of the adjustments that have happened in the past couple of weeks because of this? Yeah. So again, we have a highly organized community and we all of the clergy meet together the city council the Kiwanis lions you know it's a small town right next to the big city basically and so every weekend there were community leader meetings so we were checking in with the mayor the city council school perspective and and organizing that way and at one you know sometime in January we had 220 people show up to a church for a training. And at that point, I said to them, you are allowed on our school district property. You're welcome to stand on the corners. We've got grandpas out there wearing their Minnesota nice watch t-shirts. We also, you know, the school is a hub for the entire community, right? And we care about the entire community. So we also had neighbors standing in front of our Mexican grocery store, sometimes for 16 hours. But these folks have been there, even in those bitter cold weeks, early mornings. And then we learned quickly that you can't just stand right in front of the school. So we have people posted like three blocks up because that's where they are. I mean, I was driving the school van one time and I had a handful of kids in the back. And when you stop at every person, like, are you good? Are you good? So teachers walking the kids, are you good? just checking in And our middle school Spanish teacher was walking two kids home and said are you good and she said yeah this one girl you know this student doesn have a jacket maybe she want to go in the van and then ice pulls up and I was like get in the van and so they all everyone just sort of jumped in and we you know took off I mean you can cheer that but it's so fucked up it is what one thing that i've said to all of the students i've talked to and all of our staff and i'll say it to you tonight we can never normalize this behavior amen to that i mean as good as as good as we got at and are still at delivering groceries and packing meal boxes and even online learning which is we didn't want to go online learning We've been there before. Not fun. But as good as we've gotten at it, it's systematized, unfortunately. It cannot be normalized. This can never be normal. I kind of do want to get political. Sorry. I want to read you the remarks that a crowd favorite, Vice President J.D. Vance. Oh, sorry. Not J.D. fans? You know you're in Minneapolis, right? I want to read you the remarks that he made defending the detention of Liam. And I just let me read them because I want her to respond to them. He said, are they supposed to let a five-year-old child freeze to death? If the argument is that you can't arrest people who have violated law because they have children, then every single parent is going to be completely given immunity from ever being the subject of law enforcement. so so first of all you know I don't I don't think anyone is opposed to apprehending violent criminals like pedophiles for example be my guest I see what you did there. So, violent criminals being my guest, Liam himself, Liam's father, Liam's mother, and all of the cases that I've worked on, they have no criminal record. So they are snatching and kidnapping and disappearing people who are here legally. They have, again, thick immigration paperwork. I've seen it with my own eyes. So they are here by legal means. I mean, people need to do a quick Google search about all of the different ways that humans can be legal in our country. Here in Minneapolis, we are well known for our refugee resettlement organizations, and we have a long history of welcoming immigrants. My grandparents came over on a boat in 1911 through Ellis Island and moved up to the Iron Range. And, you know, yeah. All right. a point of personal privilege and then my last question for you. First of all, I'm sorry. I'm sorry you have to go through this. This is not the job you signed up for, but I'm also grateful. I'm grateful that people like you are in here in this moment doing God's work. You're learning a skill set you never needed to learn, but I'm so happy that you've learned it and you're protecting the most innocent people that we have in this country from horrible, horrible circumstances. So thank you. Now, my last question is, and I'm hopeful that we can, again, it's a shit situation, so maybe we can't get to an optimistic outlook, but let me ask it this way, I suppose. Let's say you're in the same job you are 10 years from now, And you're, okay, well, let's hope. Let's hope this show didn't screw anything up. And let's say you're educating or you're, you know, putting together a curriculum for kids. And part of the curriculum is about what's happening right now in this moment in your community. What is the lesson that you hope those kids take from what we're going through? so first of all um thank you and it's all about the children right so i didn't want to speak up but when it was important to to weigh whether it was going to be helpful or harmful and we decided at that point it was helpful so we decided to speak publicly um we're going to teach the children the actual truth, not the whitewashed truth. All of these fine folks have, you know, just hours and hours of video footage, actual real footage, which is so crucial and is really literally making history. So we'll, developmentally and age appropriately, could show some of that. But yeah, I mean, it's all about teaching the kids the truth. And the lessons that we've learned is like know your neighbor, go to a city council meeting, come to a school board meeting, speak up. And, you know, if you're given a platform like I've been given, like if you use it for good. So I appreciate all of the people who have elevated the voice of children who can't speak up for themselves because that's always been our laser focus, right, is what's best for kids. family in our community. And I think in times of crisis, Minneapolis and Minnesota has really turned out and shown up for one another in community. We love our immigrant communities. They bring... There's strength and diversity, right? So, yeah. Ladies and gentlemen, please stand up and applaud Zina Stendik. Thank you. That's shopify.nl. It's time to see what you can accomplish with Shopify by your side.
