The idea of bringing back the woolly mammoth had been around for a long time. You jump in take the mantle of CEO I don't know if you were expecting to do that. I was gonna fund it as a side project for at first But then I thought it was just really interesting So Colossal is a parent company is spinning out a dozen Companies each of which have massive potential our first biological products company spun out Which was breaking which is our plastic degradation company and so the same system that can bring you a mammoth can also make microbes You know break the chemical bonds of plastic I think every company is it should be an AI company or is an AI company without AI We would not be able to do anything that we're doing what Ben is building inside of Colossal being able to Design using AI and then build living products. Our vision is Now that's a moonshot ladies and gentlemen How do you like having you on as your warm-up act? Yeah, that's the greatest thing ever. Yeah, yeah, that's pretty awesome So he loves boy mammoths and he does he does and he wants Jurassic Park. Yeah He's not alone I'm not saying that's for me. I'm just saying that he's I understand not alone. I understand that number one request we get Yes, and then Megalodons is too which is also really weird. Well Megalodons are just cool. I mean they littered their teeth all over the ocean floor They're still scary. You're scary I'm scared enough the ocean without it. So as we're going along here, please use your Slido app to add questions. So I want First of all, I've known you now since pretty much the beginning of Colossal. Yeah, you were like first-tex Yeah, first-second-tex. Yeah, and then First-tex yeah first-second-tex. Yeah, and I am such a fan of you as a CEO first and foremost And then second the company the idea of bringing back the woolly mammoth had been around for a long time It had been played around in nonprofits and so forth I'm gonna summarize this man meets George Church one of the greatest, you know synthetic biologists CRISPR gene editor entrepreneur professor at Harvard Medical School and And and you ask him what's your favorite pet project? Yeah, I asked if he had one project if he could work on one project for the rest of time with unlimited capital What would it be he didn't and he didn't hesitate like it wasn't like let me think about it Let me get back to you and it was just instantly like I'd worked to bring back mammoths I'd rewild them back into the Ecosystems and I'd build technologies that could be applied to saving species and also human health care like he just didn't hesitate So you jump in You take the mantle of CEO, I don't know if you were expecting to do that I was gonna fund it as a side project for at first, but then I thought it was just really interesting You build a company which goes from zero to ten billion dollar valuation in four years It's massively undervalued. I I totally agree with you. Yeah Love you And it's just it's it's you as the CEO who has done this you built an extraordinary team How big is this? Thank you so much pal. How big is the team now? We have 260 scientists 200 here in the US and 60 in Australia and a significant number of AI programmers Yeah, exactly you become an AI company. Yeah. Yeah, we I think every company is it should be an AI company or is an AI company? So we feel like the synthetic biology part of our work is really interesting So we don't we don't always like lead with AI but AI without AI we would not be able to do anything that we're doing I want you to think about this what Ben is building inside of colossal is a platform and an engine for creating living products Being able to design using AI and then build living products Let's talk about the work you're doing in the extinction Yeah, so we thought that if we're gonna go build this into in pipeline for synthetic biology And we would have to develop technologies across computational biology cellular engineering genetic engineering cloning somatic cellular transfer and others eventually artificial wombs And we thought that if we're going to do that and build this into in platform What's the best way to do it and we thought well if you start with the extinction right because we are facing a massive extinction crisis right now And if we do that we were gonna have to solve some of the hardest problems in biology genotype to phenotype relationships And sexual shape reconstructions comparative genomics So there's so many things that we have to solve and in in that that allows us to build a system model That could be applied to all types of solutions for biological products You know our first biological products company spun out which was breaking which is our plastic degradation company And so the same system that can bring you a mammoth can also make microbes that can you know break the chemical bonds of plastic So so colossal is a parent company is spinning out a dozen Companies each of which have massive potential. I'll we'll talk about a couple of them here a couple of them are a super top secret We can't discuss but they're as big or bigger So breaking is one so you guys all know the micro plastic issue right that we have like five grams of Plastic in our brain the size of a plastic teaspoon or credit card and most of that 90% is absorbed through your gut Some of it comes through your skin and and in such But what breaking has done is What yeah, we there's actually we originally thought the original thought was that they discovered an enzyme from a micro But after a further analysis we took this discovery at the V since to put it in colossal Started to really understand it and actually it's a concert of microbes working together Which we were able which was actually even better for us because we were able to essentially understand the enzymes are being made We're also understanding the ability to edit each one of the microbes to make different variants of the enzymes To hit different types of plastics and you know the the plastic crisis that were in terrible Not only for human health care, but the oceans and many parts the environment and others that it's now affecting But what's interesting is that most Plastic treatment and degradation companies are just making smaller plastics They're just making smaller micro plastics and that's not solving the problem in any capacity right and so for us You know if we just made a company that made smaller plastics We didn't think that's the right thing and if we just found it Decided a company that could where the chemical process to pre-treat the plastic is worse than the plastic That was also a bad thing and so what's interesting about this discovery is it actually breaks the chemical bonds of the plastic And so we were able to use directed evolution and supercharge it using our pipeline And some of our editing tools so that not only does it have a larger breath of plastics that can break down But it also breaks them down at a much faster rate per surface area And we are starting to look at the human body and and so I find this fascinating Imagine a supplement you could take that actually breaks down the bonds of the micro plastics in your gut Before it gets absorbed. Yeah, because the plastic problem is a global problem Yeah, and it's and it's not just a problem in the environment and it's in our food supply It's in our reproductive tissues across the blood brain barrier in some cases So it is a pretty big existential problem that we have to solve And so you're not going to have like, you know one solution to rule them all You've got to have a myriad of different solutions and that's really the goal of Breaking is is is how do we break down and get rid of plastics? You know in the world So uh, when you're how many how many species are you working on bringing back? So so publicly we've announced the woolly mammoth the tasmean tiger the dodo and the moa and then we've we've made the dire wolves We will have more dire wolves coming which we have announced by the way I'm just gonna let's get the images in the back over here. Here's the woolly mouth and mice. How cute they are Yeah, they are they are they are objectively the cutest mice on the planet Yeah, the woolly mammoth Yep those are good and yeah and the The dire wolf. Yeah, so that's a rhymingless in in the front and remus in the back and that and that's george r martin Which is great. So we did that was actually one of the fun Like there's a lot of cool stuff that we get to work on But one of the cool things is that like, you know, I think kids of all ages like whether you're like, you know Three or you're you're older, uh, george r martin um, we did a zoom with him and and I and I We got introduced to him and obviously if you don't know george r martin He he created wrote a song of ice and fire and he did um, uh, which became game of thrones which popularized Uh dire wolves most people thought dire wolves were just mythical creatures Including some members of the the game of thrones cast which I won't I won't call them out But uh, but they did and what's interesting though is, um, you know, when we you know, I got introduced to george And we put him on zoom and I just I just let me just show you something I showed him to him and he just teared up He's like this is like he knew exactly what it was right? He knew he knew it wasn't a mythical creature So it was a it was a pretty cool thing to show that we could take a 73 000 year old skull um and make puppies Uh, and we did it in 18 months, which is pretty remarkable. It's extraordinary So the de extinction business people don't you know, I didn't think of it as a massive revenue opportunity when I began What's the business case in this and how big I mean e y did an estimate of the size of the market for you can you they they they said through educational content and changing uh stem related content in in education as well as looking at um, uh, the kind of ancillary effects and they look at like where people are or if you could take Dollars and these would be net new dollars. They wouldn't be taking away from things But you take net new dollars that are comparable to things that are extinct but layer on education the world spends about 12 and a half percent uh 12 and a half percent of global consumers buy something that's extinct every year like and so It turns out to be like 1.7 trillion dollars. So, um, which is which is really interesting so part of our model and part of our thought process is on the the de extinction work is not only to subsidize the platform But to help countries, uh, do it which is pretty interesting and we're helping them preserve their species Which actually is a quite lucrative business model as well as helping from an educational perspective and um, you know It's so far the feedback's been phenomenal. So just to just to land that plane You just came back a month ago from dubai And announced a few major deals there. Yeah Can you say what those were? Yes, we announced the world's first bio vault There's not the equivalent of the bio vault in uh for animals. Is there are for plants, right? You've got a lot of fragmentation. You've got incredible people and nonprofits and zoos and others working on bio banking Meaning they're saving individual little pieces of cells and whatnot But you know when I naively started this business, I came from software. So I thought oh, we'll just plug into the gcp of Species which doesn't exist Um, so we had to go we had to go build reference genomes for every single species that we work on and then we said This should be more of a global project Individual countries should have stakeholdership from it. So we partnered with the UAE is our first partner there's incredibly diverse Fana in in in the region that that that is much of which is is is going extinct So we need to protect it and then we also need to sequence it and build digital backups And also ensure that that's shared with the global scientific community and that should be subsidized by governments, right? And they should take I think we did a lot of over about a year We did a good job educating them on the importance of biodiversity why you need to protect diversity Why it's so so important for for for national Pride as well as as well as the impacts from the data from from from these animals And so so if you don't like you should do it because if you like ecosystems if you don't like ecosystems You should do it because you like animals if you don't like animals You should do it because the applications could be helpful to humans and if you don't like humans and You're probably not the right fit for us talk to but but but but fundamentally We got them to say agree to to put hundreds of millions of dollars into The world's first bio vaults and instead of also doing it in you know some secret Backroom, you know cave or underground thing and there's still redundancy models around that But do it like in a high-trafficked area Now if you're going to spend x dollars spend x plus y and wrap educational content around it You know make it available for kids and whatnot which they did which they agreed to which is great And then and then from that we're building a living lab. And so it's a nine figure initiative for us it's a nine figure initiative for the country and You know, I think you know, it also builds capabilities in country for countries to also Protect their biodiversity in a complete new way while also sharing globally The data yeah, so the way I think about this is countries are your customer for Saving their endangered species For and eventually it'll be productionized. I like it once we are successful with artificial wombs Yeah, you're you're just passively. So the other thing that they're doing besides breaking is they're giving birth Excuse the pun to an artificial womb company So that these mammals and these birds can actually give birth ex utero Right. So imagine a future In which and speak about you have three of these projects going on. Yeah, so we have we have three They don't work yet We have three we have three mini moonshots within our big moonshot, right? of artificial wombs for different animal clades and you know, our vision is using Biobanking using synthetic biology using automation and robotic process automation with assistance from AI and computer vision In artificial wombs we could productionize species development. And so when you have small and we have Genetic bottleneck around a certain species or you have long gestations like with the northern everyone knows about the northern white rhino, right? A lot of people at least know about it. There's two females left. They're functionally extinct There's low pot. There's low diversity in them. There's a bottleneck because they're related And there are 18 embryos are related. But if you can engineer genetic diversity from that Both synthetically and from from lost specimens and then productionize it through artificial wombs The 25 million dollars that people are spending a year keeping two animals alive You know, you could use a piece of that to productionize it and then the rest of that could go to you know, water education other things for the country, right? and so so I really do think that productionizing endangered species and Also helping species adapt at the same curve of which we are changing environments Is also something that's going to be needed in the future because evolution is not fast unless it's directed Um, you also purchased the world's top two clothing companies. Yes. I love that. Yeah You forget that it just happened to buy that so so Most people think of cloning and they're like, I think I've read something about a celebrity cloning their dog, right? And and we did clone tom brady's dogs. So I think we're part of that Tom tom brady's an investor So we did so I did we do we do kind of like push that narrative to people because it's true Um, so I guess we're part of the problem of when people think about it But what's interesting is that only like 18 species have ever been cloned and 15 of those have been cloned By the company viagin that that we the main one that we bought we bought another one and most cloning efficiencies And I think this is really important most cloning efficiencies is only about 2 and in viagins was at 78 percent pretty consistently Which is amazing, right? And so the only endangered species that have ever been cloned on the planet were cloned by viagin, right? and so things like the black-footed ferret and others that uh, you know are are going extinct Viagin took old cells and we're able to Reanimate them and then clone them and so I think that you know for we people still love their dogs Oh and nothing negative about dog cloning. I people I get asked if I would clone my dogs. They're much so I'd probably save more but I don't know. Maybe I'd clone them because I love them but um, but but so we're not taking away the cloning business for consumers So people love that business. It's a profitable business. We're still supporting that business But then separately we're now taking those technologies into country and helping Uh, uh, not just production eyes with artificial wings but production eyes cloning of a critically endangered species We have some big announcements this year with the with a With a local government on it. Hmm. Okay So I want you to think about uh, the pipeline the platform that colossal is is being able to use ai And synthetic biology to say we want this phenotype these genes these gene copies You know, I was in a conversation with one of your scientists saying yes, we're going to a tusk conference Right, I was like what and being able to understand okay. We want we want the snout to be longer We want the teeth to be longer and being able to use ai to Change which genes which enhancer sequences? and and be able to like Design the living animal that you want Which is why I said, you know, someone asked you could you create Pikachu and you said, yeah, we could probably create Yeah, I did get asked I I got asked that is like the first question on at south by southwest a few years and then the rest of the entire panel was about Pokemon Which which I was really hopeful to talk about like our vaccine development for elephants and others But it was mostly about Pokemon. Oh god But what I find fascinating is if you can engineer life that way The missions that the companies that are being built and spun out include Company that can create disease resistant plants or without resistant plants plants and animals or something that we're disease resistant animal we're spending a lot of time on it because you know Leading extinction rates are not just human cause but some of them are Supercharged by humans for their their existing in nature like diseases and we get this you know A project that i'm very passionate about that we're working on is kittred and most people have never heard of kittred It's the leading extinction driver right now on the planet in frogs and and and amphibians and they're not fluffy so they don't get as much attention but And but but it's terrible for ecosystems, but it's something that we can solve with genetic engineering, right? And so for us, uh, you know, and not only can we solve the current problem But we can also create kittred frogs and salamanders and others and and and Infibians that are kittred resistance which have huge applications same thing. You know, we're not currently working on corals after dinosaurs It's like dinosaurs corals and then I guess pokemon And those dinosaurs corals dragons pokemon everyone's really excited about dragons and um, and so We aren't working on dragons and we're not working on pokemon. Yeah, or corals yet. Yeah, um, and so, you know, we get a lot of requests Um, uh, but but the coral side is really fascinating and it applies directly to this idea of animals and plants So we we have an entire group now that's focusing on how do you apply some of the like what are some of the biggest issues From livestock to, you know, critically endangered species. What are commonalities around these vaccines? What are commonalities around what can be developed to to? infer resistance, right and you know part of it's also amazing because you know, most people think about colossal They only think about the mammoth. They only think about the extinction They don't think about the platform like you've talked about which i'm really appreciative that someone's talking about the larger synthetic Platform and bio system that we're building but then also people don't really think about kind of like what the ripples effects on society are and and you know, we don't want to live in a non-biodiverse Ecosystem in an environment and we don't want to live in a world where we are changing it faster than nature can Uh catch up and you know, I think that synthetic biology, especially paired with AI will be You know, and I'm sure others in other industries will disagree with this But I believe it will be the most transformative technology we as humanity ever has. Yeah, it's You know, you think of AI as a multi multi trillion dollar hundred trillion dollar Market that's why I think we're massively undervalued. Yeah, and synthetic biology Enabled by powered by AI is as big a diverse market. I mean, how big is the market for uh, you know, engineering disease resistant plants Uh and drought resistant plants and animals. Yeah, I mean it's it's hundreds of billions today And that's and it's just not well tracked, right? but if you look at everything that can be applied and what the what the current rate is you have a terrible like a swine flu or a a Bird flu or whatnot that wipes out a population You've got so many precautions that also go into these, right? When we roll it when we brought back to dire wolves, we got some feedback that are like Oh people don't like wolves because they're going to go kill the cattle I was like the way we raise cattle the wolves aren't going near it. I'm like, that's gross. Um, and so It just is it just actually is and so It's just gross and so uh, what's interesting though is uh, if I think that we with with certain we do that because of how we've had Inbreeding and hybridization all this over time. I think that if we're smarter about this Um, and we also have the opportunity to educate governments on things like GMOs, right? Because for a while there was this anti-gmo genetically modified Or it is a movement, right? Because people thought oh it's going to change your genome and then you're going to If you eat GMO corn, you're going to like I don't know what they think I mean, I had this conversation with Rob sake uh on on zoom earlier today that you know GMOs have saved so many lives. They've taken nobody It's an educational moment, right? It's like it like you know There was a season when seatbelts were scary for people Right, there was there was literally a time where like cars were like, you know We can't put seatbelts in cars because it's going to make people think cars are bad or or that cars are dangerous Like well cars are dangerous, right? And so it's an opportunity to educate, right? And so we get that and and if you go look at like, you know When we were meeting with the australian government about reintroducing the tazmanian tiger because all the species that were working on want to reintroduce You know their law technically the tazmanian tigers are GMOs and so they are genetically modified organisms, right? Even if they're a hundred percent genetically identical, they're an amalgamation of 53 different tazmanian tigers over the course about 300 years And so what's interesting about that is they're sold GMOs and so for us We had to then educate the australian government like you can't just have an anti GMO narrative as it relates to The tazmanian tiger because then you can't rewild this incredible species back into your country Because you see it as what you were afraid of in the 80s There's another dare I say multi trillion dollar market working on Gene drives. Oh, yeah. Once again gene drives is a 40% technology problem 60 percent marketing problem. Yeah, can you describe? What it is Who's the customer is and how big it is so? The invasive species Problem it's global problem. It's about 5.4 trillion dollars. It's currently measured. I think it's much larger than that Because I don't think it's it's hard to truly quantify But as the world gets smaller from a commerce perspective invasive species are just More prevalent, right and that that's everything from what we're seeing You know in australia with the cane toad cats even carps in australia like invasive carpet. That sounds weird I don't know who put them there, but they shouldn't be there And then And people will talk about mosquitoes, but but what we're seeing right now in the us and a big problem coming to us Texas is just declared it as a national emergency is the screw worm. It's it's coming up through Honduras and mexico. It's now in southern texas It it's going to decimate our cattle and in bison industry And so you're how do you combat that right and so the best way to combat that was you kind of have a couple choices you can Create vaccines and and try to do different things to to the animals themselves But then that goes directly into usda and you've got to work through that and there's the anti some anti gmo movement Still that persists from an education perspective But then separately an idea that you could create genetically modified screw worms And release them so that as the next generation Are produced they're all male And so you over time know how much they love each other. They're not going to make more They don't have the same technologies that human humanity has And disposal and opposable thumbs. So they so they they're going to go they die out They're going to die out right and so you so there's people this is terrible But this is true in new zealand in australia in parts of africa People are killing animals because they're invasive species. They're killing cats. They're killing possums They're killing these these because they're decimating their local population of small marsupials in australia or like birds in in new zealand And you know, that's a that's an animal welfare nightmare That's a that's a you know social nightmare like who wants to be you know, because people care more about cats than screw worms um, and so if you uh, but if you Engineer the right gene drives into them and create the right bio control around them You can have animals and including insects live out their normal lives and then over time You have a decrease decrease in that population Humanely and so, you know people release gene drives in africa around uh mosquitoes and everyone freaked out And then they stopped it because they thought you know, no, it's bad. Um, but mosquitoes are a part of the food web I don't think it was necessarily a bad idea to stop it because they were part of the food web But we know invasive species are not a part of the food web because because this is a word invasive and so um, so yeah, so so uh, it's a huge problem We're working with our government and we're working with uh international governments on it But that's the that's the magic of of ai combined with uh synthetic biology two years ago if you said would you You know, should you be working on bio control and bio containment and gene drives? I would have said, oh, well, I didn't really work with I didn't really get into it because I would have I would have I thought I didn't really work when it was distributed around mosquitoes, but you know now it's a five trillion dollar Problem, right? And there's not we we have an interesting model to it and some proprietary technologies that makes it You know safer than what has ever been dispersed in the wild and also we have the ability to roll it back Which is which is helpful. How big is that marketplace? How big how big is the spend? on going after invasive species us is over 500 billion year so in in in the in the economic impact the spin and just just domestically But I don't know off the top of my head What the spend against it is because the way that it's mostly Combated even it is with everything from poisons like literally poisons like they literally poison the environment Is a way to get rid of the invasive species like you know, it's it's it's like archaic ways of treating cancer Right and versus what we know is here and what is coming Um, it's the same thing is what people are doing with the environment. So poison is one and then uh for Larger animals, they're killing them poisoning them trapping them and it's it's pretty nonhumane Yeah, I just want you to understand how huge this opportunity is uh, you know dozens of Deg deserts of Species to be attacked and cost doesn't and none of the people are focusing. I mean the good news is compute power AI anthropomorphic robots and others people are really focusing on which is great I still think like if you go ask like 90 percent of people that are Fluent in synthetic biology and think about genome engineering. I'd say 99 percent of them will focus only on human healthcare, which is great Right, but I'd say that's 99 percent But the same technologies apply to other use cases. I think are even larger economically Um, but also have a bigger opportunity to help us You're focused on creating healthier embryos reinventing IVF uh advanced gene editing technologies. I mean these are all Sort of spinouts that are coming out from this engine that you've created Yeah, yeah, so so our artificial wombs don't work yet. Um, just fold this closer And we have three projects around that But what we found is that like, you know as you break some of these Problems down from a first principles perspective and you look at kind of like how would you rethink it? How would you start and what's interesting is like we are keeping like, you know, I I've got kids now and uh, they're great and uh um, and we went through the IVF process and you know, it's a it's weird and Crazy and it's archaic and it's emotional And then like this thing that's so precious you like look at it from like this archaic like Grading scale, right? Like this morphological grading scale and it's like that's that's how we're choosing these things. It's crazy, right? I think it's great. I think it's very archaic versus where technology currently is And so so what's interesting is like for us to be successful even long term with our mammalian base Artificial wombs is about nine different. There's four core but nine different core plus central types We have to innovate in a couple of different categories and one of those is just keeping embryos Healthier longer, right? And if you look at like how current modern-day IVF clinics work, they've been doing the same way a long time right and what's interesting about that is that um, if you look at the uh, uh, you look at the data It's just based on this morphological grade and what we found is that Sometimes embryos that are day two that are day three or day five in non model species And in some model species like like mice They they aren't uh, they they they look like they're not they wouldn't be the winner of the race Morphologically at that stage where most humans make their decision But if you go a little bit longer, they actually are the healthiest embryo, which is kind of crazy, right? So we as humans are making this decision on the probably one of the most important things in our lives You go through IVF with this archaic old system based on this one moment in time and Bad imaging to say the least so you do that But but what we found is that you know things will speed up and things will slow down at these different stages So even for us to be successful in artificial womb We had to build a hydrogel and microfluidics device that actually makes the embryos healthier And we've actually been able to take embryos in non model species much further Than anyone else has in the world in both mice and as well as in in non model species And it's a lot easier to do it in humans. We're not we don't do it in humans But that same technology could be applied to uh embryos and we have a slightly different grading scale that that is Proving way more efficient and way more importantly way more accurate in both model and non model species and that Uh that just so just that little innovation. I think could be pretty transformative to IVF you know pal um I I Want to take us to close here, but give me a sense of how fast this field is moving Uh, you know what you know the transformations you've experienced over the year or two And as far as I know there is no other company out there That's even close to what you have built in terms of production pipeline. Yes so Obviously, I'm biased It's closer, but I am too. Yeah, I'm we're both biased But but I will say objectively two years ago three years ago We were doing victory laps when we did a couple edits and I think that's where most people are doing it We're now doing hundreds of edits at a time And when we were doing a couple edits, we were getting like 40 efficiency and we're like that's pretty good Most people didn't 15 we're we're really smart But then now we're doing hundreds of edits at 90 efficiency I think in the coming years that's thousands of edits and those are those are not linear repeats meaning they're all over the genome They're completely Uh And they're very precise to the point that I would feel comfortable that that technology could be applied to human health care We're not going to do it We'd spin it out or license it right because we are pretty myopically focused on biodiversity and de-extinction at the core Um, but uh, no one's near that no one's even near that but even two years ago We thought we were by far the best based on every single standard, which was interesting I will say that um, what we're finding also from DNA synthesis We've now put in at least from what we unless there's secrets something we haven't seen Uh based on research and based on the published and a lot of scientists love to take the victory laps pretty early in in the in the journals um, so based on what we've seen You know, we we've surpassed the largest delivery by 5x already I think that's we'll be at 20x before the end of this year And so the DNA synthesis large hardware delivery and the clustering models that we have are um, you know Very superior, but at the same time I do think that you know, uh, I think the part of the reason for that though Is because we have taken a product and systems model approach to synthetic biology leveraging ai Whereas most people are trying to solve one-off point solutions for human health care So they have different goals so I can understand why they have different ambition levels But for us to to to be able to to understand genotype to phenotype expression and being able to do it all over the genome Um, it's just a different set of challenges But but I think I I do think in the coming years that um, you know Hopefully the models that we are applying and the way we're thinking about it applies broader to synthetic biology and you're Taking these capabilities and spinning out companies Uh, we want we want to stay very focused and so like we're opportunists and we're capitalists But at the same time we think these tech these some of these problems are very hard Um, and we want dedicated teams on them, right? And so the extinction species preservation We think it's a you know $10 trillion opportunity But we think it's also one of the most important things to focus on and we think it's solving the hardest things in biology But if we say oh, we get a great discovery on plastics and we could spend some resources on it Then we we invent that here and then we spin it out and we put incredible women and men to then go work on that Right and and we bring in the right capital and attention to it. It's a part of the ecosystem We build intercompany agreements where we share the editing efficiencies and whatnot that we develop so it can help them So it is a really interesting ecosystem of how we approach this but um, you know, fundamentally You know, I don't ever want to spread ourselves to then I want to focus on the platform Focus on biodiversity and de-extinction, but then these you know, bring in women and men that then can go run those But they're typically seeded by us with the the scientific team internally that built it You
