The War and Treaty

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed human. This episode is also available as video on YouTube. You can visit Nora Jones channel and be sure to subscribe while you're there. Hey, I'm Nora Jones and today I'm playing along with the war in treaty. I'm just playing along with you. I'm just playing along with you. Hey, I'm Nora and with me is always a Sarah Oda. Hello. Welcome to our show. Yes. Our guests today are Grammy nominated singer, songwriters Michael and Tanya Trotter of the war and treaty. They are husband and wife duo. They're blending soul, gospel, country music with their incredible voices. This was such a fun episode. I've known them through different shows over the years and I didn't really know their story. It is. It's fascinating. Very fascinating. Yeah, they have an incredible story. Yeah, it was really beautiful. You're going to hear about how they got their start, how they started making music together, some like very inspiring stories along the way. And as always, really powerful music, especially with the three of you. It was really fun. Yeah, they're good people. Enjoy. Yay. One, two, three. Oh, yeah. It's so good. I went with you, son. You did. Yeah, you did. As long as we go together. Yeah, as long as we fall down together, it's a good thing. That's something that is so nice about singing with someone all the time and having that partnership where you just go wherever each other goes. Oh, yeah. Right. It's like every night we don't do the same set list. Yeah. So Michael just pulls out. Do you write a set list? He does, but we've been doing the same set. His energy is off of the crowd. Yeah. So you know how it changes. We've been doing the same set list. Yeah, this it's been we've been together now. We just haven't been doing eight years. The entire set list. Yeah, because we get caught up. So we have this one song called Love Like Whiskey. And at the end, it gets like this church is like a like. Yeah. It's like real church. Yeah. It's like. Walk through the fire. Walk through the fire. And the crowd is singing and we go out to the crowd. Yeah. Wow. And we it takes a while to get back. So yeah, it kills a lot of set. Yeah. Oh, it just takes a long time. And I love it though. To get out. Yeah. Oh, yes. Yeah. I love it because it's like by the time we get back, I'm like, oh my gosh. We got like 15 minutes left. Yes. It is great connection to. Yeah. That energy is so good to. I mean, the crowd, they know it even if they don't know it. Know that you're into it. Well, we teach them first. I'm like, so this is your part. I have all guys go walk through the fire. Yeah. And then time have all these walk through the fire. And then we're like, y'all sing and it's like that's amazing. Yeah, it was insane last night in New York, like everybody. I mean, just being together and just like hearing all those voices singing like that. I was special. Yeah, it really is because it's it's that one moment you can actually connect, you know, with the fans instead of them just watching you the whole time. They're now a part of it, you know. Yeah. I mean, it's always better when that happens. Even if they're not singing, you know, yeah. If you can feel their energy. Yeah. Yeah. So here's another who will make it for you. I'm not going to ask any questions. No, I've been waiting on this moment. So you know who discovered us technically? No, I don't. Don was really? Oh, that's so special. How did that come about? Well, I actually OK. So Michael, of course, he served he served in the military. OK. And when we met, I didn't know that. But once we found out in three years into the marriage, I was like, he's really, really good. He's an incredible songwriter. And at the time, he didn't want to sell his songs because of what he did. Not let him share his story in the military for the soldiers. And so we were like decided to start working together together at this time. And there was a song called Hi Ho. We did and it was just Michael and Piano, myself and the cello player. And I was like, we're going to record this record. And we went to a bunch of different places trying to get the right footstamps. I was not a musician, but I'm really ain't all about my footstamps. Right. It's hard to capture. We need to get the right board, you know, the right hardwood floor. So we went all the different places trying to record. And so we finally got a decent recording. And I was like, I know he doesn't want this music to come out. But I'm going to send it to you. You wanted to do it, but you didn't really want to release it into the world. Release it into the world. It was like, I don't do music for that. And I was like in my mind, I'm like, the heck you don't know. It wasn't. No, it wasn't. No, I'll let him explain. There's a story. There's a story to it. And I'm going to the Dahlwassler. OK. And so I sent it to Andalisi, who's a radio announcer at WDT and she's our friend and well now in Detroit. And she didn't know us from anywhere, but I tweeted it to her. OK. And I was like, oh, publicly. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, what made you tweet her? I don't know. I mean, it was like Twitter. I don't know anything about social media. There's not like a lot of people saying to follow Twitter. So I sent it to her. I was like, please take a listen to the one treaty. And she did. And so she ended up playing it on the radio. Oh, wow. Yeah. She ended up playing it on the radio. And and Dahlwass just happened to be her friend. OK. And that's how he heard the music. And she showed it to him. And she showed it to him. That's amazing. He was like, I want them for my concert of colors. Yeah. Find them now. So he brought you into a show. Yeah. Yeah. And then I was going to produce our first album. He literally, I mean, like this was the wildest moment. We we went to make dinner with him. And he wanted me to bring all my songs. And he was dinner. It was crazy because he was like after we're going to go into the radio station, he's like, everybody's gone. So everyone listened to those songs. And we're going to narrow them down. Yeah. So I brought like 50 songs. 50. Yeah. And he listened to every single song with notes. He was right. He was like, I play next. That sounds like Don. Yeah. I mean, like it was so cool, but he got super busy. So he passed us off to this. His buddy in Nashville called Buddy Miller. Oh, I know of him. Yeah. He's amazing. Oh, yeah. His spirit is I know, buddy. But his and buddy produced it. But Don is like, like the OG for us. Yeah. That's so great. He's such a special human. Oh, yes. Yeah. And he's done so much. Yeah. But like just he'll give you time, even if you just want to ask him a question. Yeah. You know, like, yeah, he's so great. It's he's he's that's really special. I didn't know that. Yeah. It's one of the last of his kind. Yeah. It's he's so incredible. Yeah. It's incredible. Well, I didn't I didn't. You know, I've been singing all my life. OK, I come from a very singing family like my mom and all her sisters sing. My granny was playing and singing. And my uncle, Zellber was playing and singing and stuff. And but I wasn't taking it serious. I actually wanted to be a rapper. Oh, really? Yeah. Where where did you grow up? In Cleveland, Ohio. OK. Yeah. So by then I made some some mistakes and I needed a bailout plan. And so I joined the army. Wow. Mm hmm. A little did I know I was joining during wartime. Yes. I mean, we're not in the hood. You know, paying attention to the news like this war out here. And so first duty station, I'm I'm going to Iraq. What year is this? It's 2004. OK. And we're on like the helicopter. This is how really you got. I see us. Let me start in Kuwait. You go to Kuwait first and in process before you go to Iraq, which is stupid because then you in process in Iraq as well. Army is weird, but. It's about a 26 hour drive. Oh, my God. From Kuwait to Iraq. Pretty much because the the Humvees can go on about 45 miles per hour. And it's a sand desert, you know, but. I'm sitting Kuwait. And the first thing I hear is something like. Just like that, you know, this. And I'm just thinking of someone's hitting the floor and then you hear boom, like someone's just slamming a door. And then you hear a siren. And I'm like, what is going on? They're like, that's the Iraq Iraqis. They're firing. Oh, my God. It's trying to get close. I'm like, they're firing. What? This is on your first drive in. Yeah. That's a bomb. And the sound of a bomb. I tell people, I can hear it internally first. That's how loud it sounds like. You can feel it and hear it in here. You know, and so when I got into Iraq, it was just a sad site. It was, you know, and what made it so sad is because you could see how beautiful it once was. The architecture, I mean, the homes and everything and the people. And. But then you get into the war and start realizing you're definitely at war. You start seeing guys drop one by one. And so. This captain recognized my fear. It was like, he's going to be the one to get someone killed or get killed himself. We got to find something to calm him down. And in my file, my profile, it says I love music. And in the palace we took over in Baghdad, Saddam had a P upright black piano. It kind of looks like that over there. And his initials carved in it. Because Saddam supposedly to play. Yeah, piano's all over. I didn't know it. Different palaces in Iraq. I've never heard that. So they take me down into the basement of this palace. Nor when I tell you, it was like we had to crawl over mortar and brick and stuff. I mean, this is a bomb dot palace. I mean, I could look straight up and see the sky. Just to get to where this piano is. And my captain's like, when you find, when you can't find your way home, come down here and find your way home. Like that's a great sentiment. I don't play. What's his name? His name is Robert Robert Sheets. And I'm like, I don't play. He's like, well, this is a good time to learn. And that's how I. So I taught myself. That was like the first song when you started playing. Yeah, I taught myself to do that. But it wasn't, you know, I didn't really understand. The piano, I could hear Harman's, you know, I knew this was something. And, you know, and but Rob gets killed. Wow. And I am. It's still hard, you know, like he was such a beautiful show. And I write like my first real song and I asked my sergeant major if I could sing it for the funeral we want to have in the war out there. And, you know, if you ever have been to a military funeral, it's very different. It's like we're all outside, especially in the war, because you're all outside information. You're standing there. And what happens is the first sergeant gives a roll call. And so it was like, you know, private private time in Trotter. She's like here. It's like private Nor Jones here. And it was like private Michael Trotter here for a sergeant. And say Captain Robert Sheets. Captain Robert J. Sheets. And then he'll say a one more time, real loud, Captain Robert Sheets. And a turn of the commander say Captain Sheets is no longer with us. And that silence that you hear is so like loud. And so in military, you don't you can't show emotion and you have to, you know, you're in formation. You got to be on guard because you're still in the war and this is outside. The time for me to perform that song is right in that moment. And the soldiers, you know, soldiers don't cry. I'm just in it. And so I start performing the song and the soldiers just break. Like some of the toughest guys like. And the way I write, I put like little funny things and like his he was like, he was so clean, but his feet stink. You know, I would put it in the song and so it's so chuckle. We like, you know, and when I was done, they play the taps. And then when it was all over, the soldier would just get taller. I tried. I know you can sing and play that. And so my Colonel Peter Jones was now general. He was like, try to write that song. I was like, yes, sir. He said, how long and take you? I was about five or 10 minutes. He was like, great. Turn in your weapon. That's your new job. You're going to go around with me to as many memorials as we can. You're going to learn about the fallen. You're going to turn around, write the song in the morning and then turn around. And after them perform it. That was my job from 2005 to 2007. In the military. I went from being an infantry kid, providing supplies on the supply route, guarding and protecting, fighting for the country to being a military songwriter and writing strictly about the day the fallen and trying to write hope so that the guys, it could raise them around. That's what he kept saying. He was like, it's boosting the morale. Not only was that happening, but when we would come off duty and patrol, we all be sitting outside, you know, behind the wall. And they were like, Trotter, like freestyle is on force. It's a great cool, so grab his guitar and I just start singing so I'll tell him my head. And then one day we learned, we realized that the Iraqi nationals, like the people were sitting outside of the wall eating lunch, just listening to me sing. But the reason I didn't want to get into the music business is because it wasn't my dream in the first place. It was one of my guys named Jose Perez. Perez was one of my boys. We write songs together and he he he was killed on like the last day of our duty in Iraq, and I had a lot of moral injury. I just I didn't feel worthy. I was like, it was his thing. I don't want to. And I felt guilty a little bit. And so that's when when time met me, I just was really struggling with the idea of surviving and then possibly having a shot to make it. You know, yeah, that's not why you were doing it. Yeah. So I had it. It was complicated. Yeah, I had a lot of trouble with that. Well, I understand why now. Yeah. Yeah. That is that is quite a story. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's that's what happened to me. Wow. Well, thanks for your service. And and also I'm sorry for your loss. Yeah. But some good things come out like that's where Hey, Pretty Moon comes. Yeah, because doing duty and, you know, Iraq, it doesn't have much. But the because there are no trees and I think you can see the stars and the moon is always huge and beautiful. And so that's how we wrote Hey, Pretty Moon. Did you write it there? I started it there. Started it. Yeah, I just was like, Hey, Pretty Moon, talking to the moon, you know, I just thought the moon was really interesting. I mean, like because storms and stuff during the daytime, the sun hides. But in the nighttime, like no matter what storm happens, the moon is always out. You know, like no cloud can cover the moon. It shines right through the sky. Yeah. So yeah. Well, what a gift music is, right? Mm hmm. It's the ultimate gift, isn't it? It really is. Yeah. It's a song giving. Another example of it. Yeah. A very shining one. Yeah. Well, it's beautiful. Yeah. You want to play? Yeah. Hey, Pretty Moon. Let's do it. Yeah. That's a great song. Or I start crying here. But no. Maybe we'll be able to sing you a star cry. Hey, Pretty Moon. Bright and fair. How do you hang in the air up there? Looks like you're hanging. Oh. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. Free. free from the prank the silver circle gliding around In the dark, look at the bees you fly Looks like you hate me Free from all castles Oh yeah Oh, where do you shine? While the darkness tower burns under your loneliness Oh yeah Oh, teach me how to shine the way You do no matter how green the sky is Hey pretty moon, bright and fair How do you hold your hand in the air of hell? Looks like you hate me From all castles Oh yeah You find a way to stay a path You find a way to stay a path While all the stars fall by your side Even the sun, yeah, sometimes I feel the sun You always keep your clothes Hey pretty moon, bright and fair How do you hold your hand in the air of hell? Looks like you hate me Free from all castles Oh yeah Looks like you hate me Free from all castles Oh yeah I want to take you with us, no I have to go with us Oh my god, it's so pretty, you don't need me but It's fun to play with you So good, I got that ending Kyle Cause we doing so differently live We do Gosh, you know where you sound so amazing on the world Oh thanks I totally want to take her with us What do you guys play live? Do you have a keyboard live? Yeah, yeah, yeah, the Yamaha Montage Do you change the sounds or you just stay on piano? I stay on piano because I have another guy who is up on stage He's playing like Oregon, he's doing all these things Oh that's fun His name is Slim, he's pretty, Terrence Holmes He's home slim, he does all that fun But then there's a moment where it's just me and Tanya together You know, that kind of thing He's amazing, he's got a great bunch of guys How big is the band? It varies, like, you know, we have two guitars, two keys, which includes me, so me and Slim One bass and fiddle and two horns That's huge Fiddle and banjo That's a huge band Yeah, that's a lot of people That's how big it can get Yeah, but we travel with, now we're traveling with five And I get really bad anxiety You do? Yeah, so like every show it's the biggest Every time Yes, like I have it now, but luckily I'm sitting down But every show it's like, Michael's like, calm down, just relax You guys have such an interesting dynamic I mean, every show I gotta know more here It's crazy, like every award show, you just don't even understand the hysteria that goes on backstage It's either I'm leaving stuff at the hotel, that's anxiety It does something for me to see everybody else go into anxiety So something will happen and I just like to see everybody else wrestle, like me Yeah And when Michael's sitting there You stir the pot Stir the pot, right? And so Michael is there, he has PTSD, so, oh god, what are the lyrics? The curtain's about to open, you're forgetting lyrics to the song, you've been practicing for weeks And Michael's like, please, you're giving me anxiety So you're giving me anxiety? Oh my goodness And she's strong, like my hands have yet to recover From the forms they have on TV Yeah, CMA's, I know, it was so bad My hands were sweating so bad You were holding this hand? Yes, I was sweating so bad On the CMA's? Oh, was it the ACMs? ACMs, yeah There's so many, I don't know It was that one, and we were standing and I was like, I was like, hey, ouch That's all I said to her, she was like, I should just tell her Yeah, and then if you watch us like on one of our shows, we rehearsed that I'm going to take the high note But my anxiety was like, no, you're not No, no, we rehearsed it, I would take it You would take the high note, right, but you wanted me to take the high note, you can do it Absolutely Because this particular moment, he wanted me to do it And I was all like, yes, I can do it Until I got on stage It's the same performance I realized that I could, no, because I had on the red dress on that one The other one I had on the gold dress No, we were sitting in the chairs Because we were standing, when you held my hand and I was like ouch And we were standing in the center of the stage And I had on that black suit with the flames That's one Yeah The other one was The point is, this happens a lot It happens a lot, oh yeah Really? And yet you're the one who wanted to get into this business I always have had anxiety So I think a lot of it, when I was younger It would like choke me where I couldn't sing While I was like, I'm a horse, it's not your horse It's all psychological, you know So I had to work through Yeah, like you literally can psychologically put yourself into a point where you know you can hit these notes But you're so psychologically, like, you know, restrained that you can't do it This is interesting because I think of you guys as just being out there all the time You're on the road all the time, I see you everywhere And oh yeah, this is so easy, everything Isn't that wild? Every performance, it's an anxiety thing Wow So where did you grow up? In Washington, D.C. And did you grow up singing? Mm-hmm I grew up, I was very shy though You know, my music teachers say that I started singing when I saw my brother Like, really tear up a Baptist church one Sunday morning I was like, how is he doing this? I'm like, I'm like, I could do that I was like, not realizing that I couldn't I'm like, whatever he's doing to make these people feel like that, I want to do it Because I was more so like a feeler when I was little So I would see people sad and want to, you know, make them happy or animals And bring them home all the time, I was that kid And so I saw him one Sunday morning just like, rip up a church And I went home and I was like, Mom, this is what I want to do for the rest of my life That's amazing, how old were you? That was a lot I was like seven and a half, eight years old Aw And my brother was like, that's not what you want to do for the rest of your life He was like, if you want to do this for the rest of your life Then you're going to have to learn how to sing like this So he bought me a Whitney Houston record And learned how to sing like this And it was Dream Girls with Jennifer Holiday Okay And so those were the voices that he was like, if you can halfway get there Then maybe you can do this as a career I'm like, this is like a lot That's a lot I'm like, I'm like A good starting boy A great, I would say I mean that's what we have for a year So I started, like, you know, we had the little vinyl, the big vinyl You call it Stereo's back in the day, oh vintage one I'll put the records on vinyl and go downstairs and yell at the top of my lungs And then my mom was like, that's not singing She was a classical singer Oh really? Oh, okay, so that's a whole other thing That's a whole, and I ended up going to college on a classical music scholarship I was like, I'm going to be a singing opera? Wow Yeah Now I want to hear it What? That's what I ended up doing That's amazing Wow, so that's where the power also must come from Yeah, and then Michael taught me how to growl and do all the stuff that the teachers say damage your voice Yeah, they would not be happy about that Oh no, they were, I couldn't sing gospel music for like a year when I was at school They were like, it's killing your vocal cords Yeah, that's so crazy Did you grow up in the church singing? Yeah And then I went on to do R&B music and then I, you know, stopped doing music for a while You did? Yeah After the whole Areef meeting and that record Released a record The 1994? Mm-hmm Yeah, I did Sister Act II before then Yeah, so I wanted to ask about that How old were you in that? I was, I had just turned 17 And you were into acting? Not really No I kind of fell into it I didn't realize that I was one of those kids You know, I was an actor at home Because I was very shy So I would take my mother's gowns and wear them to school and get sent home to school I was that kid But I was still shy Yeah This was like my little world where I hid and no one else, I didn't want anybody else to be a part of it So they had this audition for this movie and it wasn't called, I don't know what it was called at the time They were going to call it something else And I came to New York and audition and ended up slipping up, ending up in the top three That's amazing It wasn't called Sister Act II? No, it was called something else Really? Yeah And they didn't even write me in You never told me Like Lawrence Hill's part, it wasn't Lawrence Hill's part The part that I was in, we ended up writing that as I got the part at Whippy Goldberg's house So none of it was planned, you know This is all, I'm slipping into this That's amazing Yeah, so it was great, you know That's so cool And that's how I kind of got into acting and, you know, liked it but didn't so much because it takes a little bit longer than It's hard Music, you know, you're on set It's not as much You can't be as creative Yes Spontaneously Very descriptive It's not as satisfying in the moment Exactly And so that's not something I pursued long term and then, so I completely kind of just walked away from it Wow And I was doing R&B and then I had done, you know, gospel in my church But I just knew I wanted to do other stuff because I went to school for classical music But at that time, there was no, like, genre, there was no genre for what I wanted to do Now we have what we call Americana Yeah You felt that kind of vibe then Very early on Because I loved all kinds of music My mom was from Panama Oh, yeah So I was growing up listening to Calypso music in the house That was so cool Morengue, you know, what dancing and, you know, doing all that kind of stuff jazz So I'm like, why is everything so separate? I want to be able to listen to somebody that does all this at the same time And so I stopped for a long time after I released that record And years later, met Michael What did you do when you stopped? I was a worship leader Oh, cool I did worship music I wrote books I did, you know, a lot of community service Kind of stage plays Is that so great Behind the scenes kind of stuff So I was doing more writing That's so great But, you know, that was an introvert part of me And I learned through that time that a lot of me is an introvert And a mom And a mom You know, all those things that normalized it for me You know, not realizing that I don't think I had the role models to show me how you can kind of balance it both Well, it's impossible Yeah, I was like, that's so bad And it's possible, but mostly impossible And that's what I had to learn, you know It's like, you can't balance this Well, no, you can balance it all It's just something will always suffer and it's usually you Yes, that is exactly the truth That's a great way to put it That is so true Something will suffer Something will suffer, you know And so, you know, a lot did And a lot of my mental health suffered So I took that time off to kind of just fix the cracks within myself And when I met Michael, it was the cracks were not all fixed I'm still wacky sometimes, but, you know, but I ain't saying that I don't know what you're talking about I'm the perfect wife, thank you, honey I don't know what you're talking about at all Well, it sure seems like you guys have this great partnership that has become so special And, you know, when did you, how did you meet? At a love fest That sounds so weird It does We met at a love festival Please say more Yeah, it was, again, I was doing community stuff And so this was a community event where we were giving packs and stuff out And Michael was on the gospel kind of Christian hip hop scene Okay In Maryland Okay And he was, I mean, amazing So he came and performed The lady I was working with had him as one of the artists And I didn't know at this time that he was going to be there performing And he got on that stage and I was like, who is this guy? Like everything that I loved about music, you know, that thing you have to have to like want to go in the studio and do music again He had that thing and I was like It lit a spark Yes And I was like, this is the feeling I had when I was eight years old and saw my brother like on stage performing I'm like, this guy, he has it And so I darted across the field to meet him and hide his shoes I was not shy I'm shy in some areas, Nora I'm not saying the word Not in the area Oh, no, you're wrong with this story Yeah, so we met and he was with a friend and we exchanged I mean, nice, I see, he's with his girlfriend But anyway We exchanged phone numbers She was not my girlfriend Yesterday you said she was I didn't, I never said she was In an interview you said she was your girlfriend I didn't say she was my girlfriend You fester No, she was not my girlfriend Maybe he met a friend girl No, thank you, no, no She was a girl who was a friend Yeah And they're going to leave it at that Yeah, we're leaving it alone But anyway, we exchanged phone numbers My girl Michael and I I was like, you wrote all these songs? And he was like, yeah I'm like, my brother and I are working on a project Because my brother is a singer too And I was just doing music for him And Michael started writing songs Like in three days he wrote like 12 songs for this project Oh, wow And I was like, this is weird Because not just songs, they were like You know, you write songs, you come back to them They were like complete compositions You know, I'm like, I just gave this guy 24 hours How'd he do that? I don't know if you have help He's inspired by you Oh, yes Wait, had you heard her sing yet? Oh, Nora, listen Because did you sing at the thing? I was a fan from Susie's Drag 2 So I was nine when that movie came out Oh, got you And I told, when she came on the screen I told my parents, I said, oh, that's my wife And my mom and dad laughed And they looked at me and I wasn't laughing I was like You just felt a connection Oh, she was so beautiful to me I was like, whoa, at nine That's amazing And so when we finally met I woke my parents up like at like 3 a.m. And my dad was like, what do you want? I was like, dad, let me in the house And I tell you something He's like, boy, it's 3 a.m. My mother's in the back room Who is it? Is it Mikey? Let him in My mama's boy And so I'm like, dad, mom, guess what? And my dad's like, boy, this better be good I gotta go to work in the morning I was like, I found her I found time in your blood That is crazy And my mother, I mean, neither one of them believed me But they remembered that moment Oh, yeah, oh, yeah, oh, yeah Like, they just didn't It's still a pinch me moment for a lot of my family members Like, you know, and Tanya is just the She's really an angel, honestly I mean, like, I don't Good guys, good husbands Say that about their wives Just to get a point But I really do believe You know, she got some weird spiritual stuff going on too Like, she's deep But I just believe that Tanya is just An angel Well, thank you I do believe it That's so sweet Do you see why I'm doing it? She's a healer She's truly a healer Like, her presence, her energy, her touch I mean, like, I didn't know what I needed At the time, 2010 But once I met her I definitely sure as hell knew From that point on what I was gonna want forever And need forever And that was it Yeah, we found each other at a great, perfect time The right time You had stuff to do before then Oh, yeah The universe had to know that And, you know, yeah, we had a son And I had an older son But I couldn't have kids, like 14 years after My oldest, the doctor's like, you can't have kids And I met him And boom You wanted to And, well, my body was like, yes, we're doing this You couldn't do it before And I was gonna argue Yeah And I have two daughters From my previous marriage So how many kids total? Four Wow My two baby girls I mean, like, they're not baby girls He wants them to be babies, so bad They always will be my baby girls I mean, my baby daughter who's here She's walking around with her little boyfriend right now Just driving me nuts You love him In there? Yeah And he works for us So it was weird Cause he's like our sound engineer That's so great I really love him But I hate his guts too Every time he touches my daughter I'm like, ah, it's like her cringes Oh, like, it doesn't matter how cool he is It's still your baby girl I'm going in and out I have to hold his hand every time he sees him touching I'm like, she's an adult He's like, bye, Mike I'm like, bye, boy They were sleeping And before we got here, they were sleeping on the couch We were, you know, at the other vent And they were just sleeping away, just so cute And he looks over and he says, it's time for them to get up And go in the other room I'm like, they're sleeping Why are you getting them out of here? My dressing room There you go Why are you waking them up? They're asleep They can go in the other room I'm like, this is my baby That's too funny Oh, he couldn't handle it Oh, that's great Isn't it cute? That is sweet So your youngest is 13? Yeah Okay He's the boss That boy Yeah, he's almost Michael's height We named him Legend Amazing Help Yeah See him when I was out there listening to help Don't name your son Legend He doesn't think we're real about our music Because it's not hip hop or anything like that He's like, you don't want to make no real money Mom and dad, you guys are playing around Oh my God That's a good boy What do you know? And then if he asks for something Your boys are probably not, they're not teenagers They're not there yet Well, when he wants something, he's gotten to this point now Where he understands that he can Google stuff Oh, yeah So he Googles, you know, nothing is real in Wikipedia Nothing's real in internet How much he thinks we make Oh, and then he tells you He snapshots it and he sends to me Don't tell my kids to do that Mom, what do you mean you can't get me a roadblock? That's not real He's like, Mom, what do you mean you can't afford $200 worth of roadblocks? Oh, yeah I'm like, it's not, you don't have a job You You don't have to work for this Oh my God But you know something weird about him? He, his favorite style, like, it's so interesting Because we have another side of us That's more like what jazz, like classic jazz And both him and the youngest daughter They're like, if it ain't that, we don't want to hear it I mean, it's so weird They just don't, yeah He wants to whore, he wants to stream He's like Frank Sinatra or Nat King Cole He's like, come on You can sing too, he just won't Well, someday, you can't force them right No, you know Yeah, I have the kids all been on the road at various times And just kind of He was gonna roll forever Because we homeschooled him When he was little So you could go on the road? Yeah, so he was 12, actually This is the first year that he's in the school It's his first year He's doing so good, I'm so proud of him He set us down and was like, I don't want to do this anymore I don't want to be around a bunch of old people Well, that's a good age to make a switch But how cool that he'll be happy he did it Yeah, he's very happy I just didn't like his reasoning I don't think we're that old I mean, later, he'll be happy that you did that Yes That you homeschooled him and took him out And then we were together He's thriving, he doesn't have any social issues I mean, he's just really cool That's what he needed That's great All of our kids are great They make it easy, you know, because it could be hard, you know No, I don't know at all I don't know what you're talking about It could be very hard What do you mean? What are you talking about? You just pray that you get the kids It's like, I understand you're working I understand it's okay And we've just been fortunate enough to Our kids aren't making us pay The only one that was not always like that is legend Yeah, well, I mean When he was a baby boy, like, I'm talking about like two or three And we were taking places, he'd heckled us In a real way I mean, listen He heckled you? That shows We were on the circuit of really trying Our hearts be discovered and Our first show in Nashville was at this brewery called Tennessee Brewers And it was just Ty and I Like, no guitar, no not just keys and Ty and I No babysitter And no babysitter, we could not find anyone So we had to bring this three-year-old boy into this brewery And they let us do it Because I was like, he's gonna sit right here Where we could see him Like on the side of the stage No, he just sat in front of me He's in front of us at a table That's amazing And I put his toys, we set him up I was like, nice, son I thought I did the right thing I was like, you have to be a good boy, okay We'll get your milkshake after He was like, yeah And I thought, the yeah meant, okay, I got it Yeah No We started singing, it was a three-hour set One of those Nora, we get through the first song by the skin of our teeth Oh my gosh Because he's like, boo This sucks, you're terrible Oh god, my ears are bleeding Now And he's like, look at me, I'm Legend TV He's standing up running across the tables And then he takes the salt and pepper shakers He's like, come on And he loves the show It's like a scene in a movie And the people are like Laughing while meantime He's like trying to ignore them It's like part of the action Yeah We said we'll be right back We and Tanya both took him to the bathroom Oh my god Sit down You little demon I was like, stop it What is wrong with you? I said, what is in you? Because I won't do it again, dad Yeah He was like, oh dad, I'm so sorry I'm sorry, I'm sorry, daddy I won't do it again, be a good boy I was okay, we should go back out And we started the next song He's like, oh boy, when is this over? Oh my god This is terrible Your impression of a Ms. Like Elmo Oh, that's totally not That's him I love it I'm gonna show you the video When we're done with this Oh my god And I look over at the guy who had us I said, we're done He was like, honey, did two songs I said, we're done Don't worry about that I said, we're done We got our control all the way back Where we came from And he was quiet the whole time He knew Yeah, he knew Oh my gosh And we were in, that was like the toughest time Of our lives That's a hard time to be touring with a kid Yeah, and we were homeless too Like we were, yeah We lived prior to hitting the road Like 20 different places And we ended up stumbling into Maryland At a service and a guy was like I see you guys have this At this time he was like four maybe Legend was four And this is prior That's Chattanooga Chattanooga Chattanooga, you can see I know what you're talking about Chattanooga And we just roughed it out You know, we used to have to take them everywhere Yeah You know, have care.com was our friend Yeah, yeah, yeah, I remember that Yeah, we would get people to come to venues Come to the venues And watch your kid in the dressing room It was like Every babysitter we would get Yeah, it was crazy We would quit Really? Legend, terror He was not bad He was He's just difficult Very experienced in being difficult Yeah, he knew how to get rid of them Oh, he did on purpose Oh, yeah Oh my God Well, that's a whole intense thing That's a whole, well, gosh, right What not to do With your kid on the road The life of a tourer So you were just on the road constantly Yeah So you didn't have a home And you just lived on the road We've lived out in the R&B We lived out of our vans Yeah We've, we've, we had Because when I met Tonya I was already a homeless veteran I had a hard time Really? Yeah, after my first divorce Like my divorce with my, my, my Children's mom I, I couldn't get it together I was stuck And Just, I didn't have the help But also I, the military didn't know That I was a homeless fat You know, and which just happens in this country a lot Like the army or marine or navy, whatever They don't necessarily Once you become a veteran You're no longer their responsibility It's the VA's responsibility But the VA You have to go to it In order for the VA to know What your situation is Not everybody knows how to ask for help And most of those guys are like me They come out of war They don't really trust it They're afraid to go back And I was going through a lot of that And I couldn't get a job Our country was going through a period where The incentive was to hire an ex-con First And so I'd be in interviews with an ex-con And I'm like You're going to get this job over here Because the incentive is to do that You know, and um But uh One day just to turn I mean, Don was actually to turn for us And you know how you meet artists I mean, you have probably come across Lots of artists and you look at that person And you're like, this person really deserves Somebody to just Terry with them a little longer You know, hang in there So that they can be discovered And for me that was Michael Like I'd never met anybody that Deserved it more, you know From his experience, his writing, his heart And then you know, on top of me being in love with him I was just like, he's such a giving person You know, and how he loved people And how he served people Not just in the army, but his family Um, we would go to churches and different things like that How people responded to him And so for me it was like People were like, well you could have went out And got a job and did different things It was more so of just trying to make sure That his dream happened You know, and I was, I mean, once we started Staying together, then it became Yeah, I didn't know what my dream was I mean like, when I met Tanya And I was writing songs And hopes that Well, maybe this can do something You know, I've been hearing about songwriting But I was more so focused on Trying to figure out where I was going to take my daughters When I picked them up You were dealing Yeah, I'm in it But you know, at the same time Tanya was in her own recovery journey You know, and so We cleaved to one another But I told her, I'll never forget because I knew she was I was like, hey I sense She's starting to have feelings for me Because our conversations are getting longer You know, all the things So it started with just the songs Yeah, and the And I told her, I was like, hey I'm not a catch I was like, don't fall for me I'm not a catch I was like, I You were being protective Definitely of her because I was like You know what, I'm not going to be another Story for another female You know, I had a lot of Letdowns, you know And then with my My daughter's mom's We were Children When we got together So, you know, I didn't really count that You know, and so And I just knew that I didn't want to be the cause Of another heartbreak Whatever, so I said, hey, I'm not a catch I'm not established I don't have any money I don't have a car I don't have a job I don't have a house I was like, I am what they call That song, Scrub Yeah, that's me I was like, I said, but I know I'm supposed to be something in life I just don't know what it is But I do know how to love I said, that's the one thing I know how to do And I said, but I don't know how to get to whatever it is And we were sitting at her In her friend's house Where Tanya was staying Tanya was staying with her friend We were sitting at her friend's house She had this bar downstairs And I'm turning on her that And then she goes, well Okay, I'm going to tell you what I see And she just pats my knee like that And I'm like, what do you see? She's like, I see a king You just need the right kind of queen in your life And I just started like I was like I'm not very shy I was growing way out of my shyness But then I was way out And it took us actually three years To actually sing together So we got married And didn't sing together for three years Most people would think Oh, they just got married for the music So he wrote songs for you and your brother But you guys did No, we didn't start singing together And her and her brother never matriculated But what happened within those three years Was Tanya pretty much started Studying me You know, I would get jobs And I'd be able to keep them After a while, the only job I could get Was playing for church And that was like horrible I mean, that paid me like $125 a Sunday And you can't That's just once a week Yeah, and then I had kids, you know But it was the 4th of July in Detroit To where Detroit got some things out there That kind of sounded like the 4th of July And I was like, duck! And I'm calling commands And I'm diving under stuff And that's when she's like, whoa What's going on here? And so I'm like, well, I'm good, I'm good And then the next 4th of July, it happens again Sometimes like, we have to talk You know, the kids are crying And everyone's scared And doesn't really know what it is And I'm like, I'm a war veteran You didn't know this No, you never shared this You never shared this with her No, I didn't I didn't share this with anyone Because when I came home So I served under President Bush Yeah When I came home It was 2007 Baltimore It was not I quickly understood that my country Was against my uniform This is so deep Yeah, so I was like, oh In order for me to survive my country now In the war my country is in I was a soldier Wow Because then questions began Then you got to tell And so I just thought And it wasn't serving me I couldn't get a job selling them Because they were rather hiring Excon because the Excon is more afraid To mess up or flip out Than a war veteran Because he can blame it on the war Okay, I'm getting this It's really incredible But Tanya found Within the 3 years Tanya, after I told her You'd been married about 3 years Yeah, we're married for 3 years by the time After I tell her, she then Goes into like the study on the VA And the process And so she contacts our senator And tells our senator about me And what's going on And our senator was like, well we're looking to it And when they looked into my military file And they contacted the VA And the VA was like, oh he's Well he's actually highly decorated It's not like he was a problem or anything like that And so this is so crazy We got a letter from the senator Like hey, they're working on his claim But until then, here's a check for $5,000 Just to hold over Because they're working some things up When they got done The military had opened me back pay For injuries They medically hired me from the military And gave me pension But you hadn't been collecting All the time So now everything changed And so what happens is Now the military is paying me monthly Even now, my stipend and everything It helped us get on our feet And chase that dream And still have a place to come home to I mean like, things just This is so wild And that's her This is incredible I mean your story is incredible Both of you and then together And then Yeah Music and love saved Yeah Well, my goodness In husband I'm gonna cheat on this one You gonna cheat? No Uh-huh Baby Why you have to go and fall for me? Then you'll fall for me till you're high High I was up to no good Yeah Baby Why you have to go and fall for me? I'm not the one No I'm just Mr. Fun Yeah In the night All alone And you won't Someone to hold I'm gonna run it I'm gonna run it In the night You're all alone And you won't Someone to hold I'm gonna run it Yeah You're all alone Baby Nice story Why you have to go and play with me? Did you, did you, did you Didn't you know I was there for you Oh baby Baby Why you have to go and play with me? Oh yeah You're not the one Oh no You're Mr. Fun Oh yeah In the night All alone And you won't Someone to hold I'm gonna run it I'm gonna run it baby In the night All alone And you won't Someone to hold I'm gonna run it I'm gonna run it Yeah, when the night turns into day You're always there for me to stay When the night's taking you home, mama All right, there's your All alone In the night All alone And you won't Someone to hold I'm gonna run it baby Yeah In the night All alone And you won't Someone to hold I'm gonna run it baby Yeah Yeah Yeah Oh god, that was good You guys have power Oh god How do you? Oh man The queen I'm like, you're the nicest queen I try to get in there I love it, I love it I love it when it's bigger than just candy That was so cool Yeah, I love it We have to do one like For real We have to do one We're gonna try Yeah, baby Yeah, it would be so fun Yeah I had so many thoughts, you know So I didn't have confidence on the piano You sure do now Well, I have, listen In the fandom, I mean not the fandom In 2014 Yeah I used to set Tony up We used to go to singing churches And I let the church musicians play for him Yeah She was like, Michael You need to play as I was in the spire I was like, mm-mm I would get up there and It's nothing like playing with the piano player That outplays you Or also nosy you I mean, I would get with these piano players And they would outplay the song Oh, gotcha, they would be too much Yeah, yeah, yeah And I'm like That's what you're talking about Yeah, and I'm not like a, you know I don't do all the riffs and trills and stuff Well, they're not listening Yeah, they're listening to themselves Yeah So, listen to like Michael's playing in a piano And you're playing You are sensitive to the voice And the song and the intimacy of the song So we would go to these churches And I'm like They are wearing me out on this piano I'm like, I can't keep up, you know And you can't sing over it No, you can't, you know You kill yourself trying to do And Michael just has this touch I mean, the same touch Well, I didn't believe it Because, you know, growing up in the church The flashier you were It's like the more the spirit moves So it tricks you Yeah It's not real Because you can get out in the real world And you're like You know, everybody's like Where's the song? You know, so Yeah But There's a balance Yes, it is So before we moved to Michigan We were living in Towson, Maryland And, you know We're through a period where It's still like that Like, the guitar is like a thing thing Like, everyone wanted to play the guitar No one really was doing keys like that And so I was like I can't play the guitar I'm a keys guy, so But someone freed me I watched a concert Of Nora Jones That's true No Yes, and it was just you in a piano And I was like, tell ya Look at Nora on the piano And I was like And I swear to God Because it was like I watched this over and over And over again Because I was like How does she like Okay, wait a minute And you would play and sing And you're playing complimented Your vocal So perfectly, you know And the only person like I mean Nina Simone Does it wonderfully You know, Ray Charles But nobody in our day and age For me was doing it And then I saw that concert And then it caused me to go in deep dive And I saw you with another configuration Where I want to say it was The Blade Brother Oh, Brian Blade Yeah Brian Blade And it was an upright bassist And I was like, oh my God Like listen to this sound, you know And then I saw you In all these different configurations And so it gave me the confidence I needed to be able to Just trust me and trust You know, where I want to jump out at You know, cause you can sing like You know, like it Amazing grace how sweet The sound And sing the rich like me I once was lost But now I'm found Was blind but now I see My dreams was blind But now I see Yeah I created that off of you No Yeah She knows it's like Yeah, the pacing Like you are this generation's One of the best vocal pacers I've ever heard in my 18s You guys are so sweet And you make the music wait for you I mean, I think a lot of artists Are afraid of the silence Spaces The spaces and places, you know And what you do is you allow The music to get into you And then you're like, here I come I'm coming It's a few artists and crowds Yeah, she does She lets it And she just, let me touch you And she'll just, I mean I saw her the first time Maybe, when was that time? April 100 was? That was three, four weeks ago March 19 I will never, ever forget this moment At Ground Operating She's on the stage And it's her and her configuration And she's got her, you know Her fiddle And she's just singing And I knew she was staring at me While she's singing But then this person thinks She's staring at me And the person will go, everything I'm like, how in the world Is this happening? And we all were like And she never went here Where she just stayed right here Our entire band was trying to get here To see you They all think you're singing to them She's not singing to you guys It's not just about the singing though I'm gonna say this This happens to Nat King Cole a lot Everybody talks about his voice But unless you understand this And this Like his vocabulary on the keys Like, satin up and fly right It's packaged deal Yeah, that's what It's beautiful though Like when it's done the right way And, you know, so I just I wanted to tell you that You know, I wanted to say that Ohana, we saw you at Ohana at that time Was that the first time we met? I think so, yeah No, no, no Oh, we met at John Krimes Some writer induction, all a thing We've seen each other a lot Well, now I see you at everything I know Grateful Dead tribute We're both there We're both there, what are we doing here? That tribute was so I mean, like That was fun Oh, man, John Prine I'll never forget that You know, you come in the dress room So that wasn't our first time No, no Well, that's really sweet of you to say I appreciate it I think that being yourself Is the most important thing So you playing for yourself Is only gonna be the thing That you are the most Does that make sense? That makes sense Collaborating is great But like, you guys have a thing So don't leave her hanging next time We'll go to church Oh, I quit so fast I have no idea I mean, you know who's gonna meet me at the church Tell him so I'll never be on dream She's a kid up there Yeah, no Oh, he was so scared And we used to play We had so many keyboard nightmares That I'm surprised that he still plays Well, piano on the road is hard So keyboards, it can be uninspiring too Yeah Well, we had a Casio starting out I used to plug up, I used to put batteries in the Casio Oh my God, you didn't have a plug No, we were too far You just had a tiny little Casio I would take him out on the streets in Richmond And put him on the street like he was busking Aw And he would play his little Casio Our first tour We were playing in this club in Columbus called Georgia And we're doing great It's just me tying a cello player And I'm holding it down, I was worried You were so worried How am I gonna hold, you know, a guitar player Can hold down an entire show with the rhythm and everything Yeah, it's tricky with piano Look at you, you got good at rhythm Oh my goodness You're good at it, y'all Nora, I was drenched The club was so hot We had a 3-P suit in a bar Wait a minute I go, we're playing this song It's like Like one of those boppy Yeah People were clapping Nora, I went to go hit this chord here And every key on the piano played at once Oh no I was like I knew what it was I was like, what is happening She was like calm down Oh no And then the cello player, he's like He eats real classy treats He's like, hey man I ain't gonna want you to mess up, man I was like, it's not me, bro And I was like His sweat drained And it kept doing all these It was so much water and it keep pouring We had to stop Once again, I got to look at the guy I was like That's why it was stuck Because he got too much water on it He's like, hey man, we're done Oh man Yeah, it was terrible He was like, you guys want to be four songs? We're done, bro Yeah, we're two songs in it He kept pouring the cello He was like, I had to say it on music shopping I don't keep a word, I was like Tiss keep a word Yeah Oh, it's the worst So many stories I'm sure It's so crazy This journey has been wild It is wild I loved hearing about it I love it I could listen to your stories forever He didn't live through us He lived through trauma Let's just hang out some more Let's do that I've been pretty lucky I only had one keyboard snafu And it was on live TV But I don't know if anybody noticed it But I was playing It was Willie Nelson and Paul Simon And they were trading songs So it was Maybe the country music awards or something I think I saw this Yeah, and Paul Simon did crazy Yes And then Willie did still crazy after all these years And he asked me to play the world's sir under him And everything's backstage And they hook it up And then it's like a 45-second part And I'm doing it in the pedal sticks And so everything is sustained and runs together And I can't do anything about it That is a whole other... Okay, so let me ask you this As a piano player Because I have to know Because I... I lived and died by the pedal for a long time Because I didn't understand how to connect So it was going like... It was going... Yeah, yeah, yeah But I have to have... And the keyboard... I have to have the sustained pedal plugged in Because it gives... So I tell my guys all the time Hey man, make sure the pedal is in Oh, because it's easy for them to forget And it's just kind of this random piece, right? And there's nothing worse Than you go to play a sustain You let it go and you're like... And I'm looking at it and I'm like Hey man, I told you to plug it in Yeah, yeah, oh, it's not working Yeah, well I think I would have rather that Than it just be working and then you're playing And also that song goes through many different key centers So it's not like just one chord Or the polarity switched on you Yeah Have you ever had that happen? No Where you hold it down and it doesn't sustain And then you lift it up and it sustains Oh, it's reversed That is a real mind... Yeah, it's a circus of the mind And they're like, man, let the note go bro I'm like, stop it That's so funny, it's not you Technology is tricky, electronics But we can make it through Yes, y'all do, I'm gonna do it Well thanks so much for joining me Oh, thank you Love you guys And I'm so special Thanks for sharing all your stories Thank you for listening to us Thank you Oh wacky I've been drinking, I'm so happy And I'm so glad we got a chance to tell you How we feel about you I appreciate it, thank you so much You know, what was it? Tank said something to us one time Tariana, we went out to eat And we were just talking about You know, like we were talking about The inspiration and stuff And Tariana was like, I don't know what happened to us There's a people like what's going on And Tank said, we don't impress each other anymore She was like, nobody's impressed by anyone You know, and Why is that? I don't know The internet? I don't know I tell you what, I am forever impressed by you Thank you for the last 20, what was it? 20? I'm impressed by you as well I really am And I'm so grateful that When you did what you did with the music You stuck to it And you've been consistent with it And given so many people Like you said, just be yourself To tell young people to be themselves Like now, you know Oh yeah, well It's so powerful And for you to be that example Never changing And every time you see All the time Like you are Every time you come out It's more pieces of you That is just like Yeah Like, did you see that? Yeah, just watching you unfold And become this beautiful woman I'm gonna cry No, seriously, you just became like You were a woman at, what were you like, 2021? I was a woman in child I was like, who is this woman? I thought I was so grown up You were But you made so many of us want to grow up Like, listen to these songs And this music It was like, oh, this is how 21 and 22 is supposed to look You were like, I'm a grown woman Well, I had an old lady music taste Well, that's the thing We talk about this all the time We will never, like, I wish I could have been in the club Sitting down, watching Ella Fitzgerald sing Mac the knife or Can you imagine being in the room When Billie Holiday first sang Strangestroot Yeah Like, I'm like, how privileged were they? I mean, YouTube is as close as we can get Because we're not, we aren't creating artists like that anymore You know, I mean, Samara is doing a wonderful job But, you know, like, there's something about Being able to be in the presence of that And for me, you know, Antanya Your Ohana set You know, I'll never forget that Me and my guys and Antanya, we were just sitting there And, you know, it's outside And I was like, I wonder what set What Nora's gonna do because it's outside And what I said she's gonna do I said she's gonna do Nora It's there scum drunk You know, I'm like, oh, I'm very interested to see this Because it was light out still It was so beautiful But it was so, the mood, you came out And Brian was on there and you had an upright bass I forget what Oh, that was Chris Thomas Okay Yeah And you played and we all were just like Well, this is what I mean by the presence We get to experience one of our legends do or thing You know, and He's our legend I hate that I've never got a chance to see Ray Charles I never got a chance to see Nina Did you get a chance to see her? I never saw Nina and I kicked myself Because when I moved to New York, she played every year Wow At Carnegie Hall Wow And I just, you know, I didn't maybe have the money Or I thought, oh, I'll see you next year And I never did Yeah But I saw Ray play in high school Oh And it was great, but it was very, like, you know Short and medley I mean, it was great But You wanted more I don't know, I think I wanted more Or maybe my mom wanted more And I'm just remembering it that way But she saw him play when she was in high school In a high school gymnasium Oh, wow In the 60s That's amazing That's the right I know, I was like, that's what she's expecting That's what she was What was your first concert ever? My first concert ever was MC Hammer Oh, yeah You got to see the heads Where? In Alaska at a stadium Oh, and she has so many people on that stage Yeah So good It was crazy Wait, honey, yours was... What was your first? Whitney Houston That's amazing That was your first? I thought Sarah was your first No, Sarah Vaughn, I saw... You saw Sarah Vaughn? You saw Sarah Vaughn? Sarah Vaughn when I was 13 Oh, that's amazing Yeah, at Blue's Alley, and my friend took us there And I was all dressed up They had to dress me up to make me look older Oh, so you could take a get in? And I was like, oh, my God That is incredible, is that amazing? It was... Oscar Peterson was on Keys What? Stop it What? No No way You didn't tell me this Well, we went because my friend was a piano player And he was like, obsessive It was like, this guy's playing, you got to see him? This guy Yeah, like, no, I'm like 13 That's incredible And then he was like, do you know who's playing? And I was like, no Because I was listening to jazz stuff at school My teacher was like a band teacher So he was like, the voices you need to listen to a mimic She was incredible And she's fun to mimic too Oh, she really is She really will stretch you up and down and all around Oh, yes, and she was down here Yeah And she'd go up here and then send in the glow Yeah And she's cut older and lower and forward Oh, she's older and just richness She was older She had one of those long kind of kimono Capitan Yeah, she was one of the captain It was like a brown with like the shiny stuff on it Oh, man And you're 13 That is incredible Wait, how old were you when you saw MC Amra? I was probably 11 or 12. Okay. Yeah. I was 10 with my first concert. I saw Whitney at 17. That was my second concert. 17. I hate telling people who my is. It was the best and worst experience of my life. And for the same exact reason. I mean, it was weird because it was the best because it was so amazing. And it was the worst because it was so amazing. But I was blindfolded, Cleveland, Ohio, at the Cleveland Coliseum back in the day. I was 10 years old and my godmother took me into the Coliseum and then unfolded me. It was pitch black and then this music and out of the center of the stage pops out Michael Jackson. Oh my gosh. And she surprised you. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, and it was the worst because Michael stood there for 15 minutes, literally because they had to cart people out from passing out. Are you serious? Yes. That's crazy. It was insane. And this would happen throughout the entire concert. People would, just drop. I mean, like, but he was, I would, you don't want that to be your first. Because it's too high a bar? It's too high a bar. Like everything about him, like standing there for 15 minutes, you don't even realize it's 15 until you look over because there's a ticker. Yeah. And because everything he does was like precise. And then how he emotionally just took everybody. Like he's doing all the jam and he's doing everything and he does stiller. But this was the moment in his career where he was ending all of his shows with, she's out of my life. And he would like cry in the middle of it. You know, we know that one. Wow. I know it. That's my favorite part. She's, what's he got there? I was boo boo crying. It's just the keys. She's out of my life. She's out of my life. Now I'm in the net. And I was like, perfect. Mm-hmm. Perfect. I was like, this is ridiculous. I don't ever know. This should be my first. You're ruining it. He was, he was, it was, I mean, not many people get, I mean, people have seen it, but not many people get a chance to say. Like that was their first time. Yeah, that's the first concert. That was my first concert. That's pretty incredible. Yeah, Michael Jackson. Well, you were young, so. Not many people your age get to see that. No, no, I mean, I walked away with a hat and a glove. I mean, yeah, you got a glove. It was everything. Everybody had a glove, right? Did you have a glove? I got in so much trouble, like the next day I cut all my pants to my white socks to show. You cut them all short. And then all of a sudden, the high waters became a thing. I was like, me get a high water. I stole my mother's communion gloves. Really? No, we're in the school. That's funny. Y'all stole her. I can't find no glove for communion. Oh, I'm so funny. Because school in the market. Can't get it this Sunday. Oh my God. That went on for a while. Yes. Well, I'm so glad to have that in here. Thank you so much. Thank you. Yeah. This is really cool. You guys are special. Well, we'll hang out again. I know it. Yes. Let's go out on a song. That's good. This dude leads me home. Let's do it. I'm going to make out to the sky. As you travel to and fro, sometimes you get lost. Trying to go back to a familiar place where you straightaway from. Leave me on the other side of the railroad. By the mountains and crystal streams, through the vines, flows. In your eyes I find straight and narrow on those country roads. You will always be the one that leads me home. I remember the old times. When you found me, I had lost my mind. I forgot where I was going, but I am where I came from. Leave me on the other side of the railroad. By the mountains and crystal streams, through the vines, flows. In your arms I find straight and narrow on those country roads. You will always be the one that leads me home. Home. My love. Oh. He's so pretty. Beautiful, guys. Look at y'all. Yes! Yes! It happened. Thanks so much. Thank you. Thank you. Aw, thanks for listening. That was so fun. That was amazing. I can't believe that story. Yeah, that was unbelievable. Learning how to play and sing and sit on busted-out palaces. No big deal. Oh my God, that's so intense. That was a very, very touching story. I'm really so glad that I got to be with them. This was nice. If you want to know what songs we played in this episode, the first song was Hustlin' from their album Hearts Town, released in 2020. The second song was Hey Pretty Moon from Hearts Town also. And the third song was Mr. Fun from the album Plus One, released in 2025. The fourth song we did was Leads Me Home, also from Plus One, released in 2025. Special thanks to the Warren Treaty for joining us today, Michael and Tanya. And we'll be back next week with Josh Groban. Norah Jones is Playing Along is a production of iHeart podcasts. Follow Norah Jones is Playing Along and start listening to the free iHeart radio app today. I'm your host, Norah Jones. This episode was recorded by Matt Marinelli, mixed by Jamie Landry. Audio post-production and mastering by Greg Tobler. Artwork by Eliza Frye. Photography by Shervin Lenez. Produced by Norah Jones and Sarah Oda. Hey, that's us. Executive producers Aaron Wong-Coffman and Jordan Runtog, marketing lead Queen Aniki. Thanks again. See you next week. Bye-bye. Smell you later.