AI Makes You A Learning Machine Or A Lazy Machine

Using only 20% of your business data is like dating someone who only texts emojis. First of all, that's annoying, and second, you're missing a lot of context. But that's how most businesses operate today, using only 20% of their data. Unless you have HubSpot, where all the emails, call logs, and chat messages turn into insights to grow your business. Because all that data makes all the difference. I would know because I use HubSpot at my company. Learn more@HubSpot.com I realized recently that AI either makes you more of a learning machine or more of a lazy machine. So the people that use AI, for example, I'm gonna. I'm gonna guess for Neil. Neil probably asks a lot of tax questions to his AI. Okay, so more or less as a tax strategist, right? You're learning more. There's. I'm sure there's a lot that you've learned about things that you just didn't know before, right? But my point is, you've. You're asking a lot more questions that you usually would have asked before. You're not just kind of, you know, expect like, taking it and say, okay, a. A.I. do the work for me. So when I say A.I. makes you a learning machine, you ask more questions and you actually expand your mind more. That's for smart people, okay? Now, unfortunately, many people, Many people like you want to be. You want to be lazy and smart. You don't want to just be lazy, okay? So because smart and lazy people try to figure out ways around things, right? They figure out creative ways. But if you're just someone that just throws it over defense, and you're just like, ChatGPT is going to solve the problems. ChatGPT will write my prompts for me. ChatGPT is going to write all the content for me. Then you will get slopped, right? So that's the first point I wanted to make. But the second point to what you're saying is I've had my AI agents, they've started to invade my slack channels, right? And so they're working in my, My, my sales room. They're working in my recruiting room. They're working in the SEO room too, and it's working with the team. Now here's the thing. I see it. Their team's asking for data pools, and it's giving the team strategies outside the box strategies, and it's rating our strategies, and it's also offering to do the work too. Now, here's the other thing that you just mentioned that gave me an Idea. So we, Neil and I just made an idea baby. Let us let the everyone know that we just made a baby. So the idea baby that we made here, Neil, is if you have it, coaching your team. Okay. Like imagine your kids are going to be working with personalized AI tutors, right? Everyone on your team now has a personalized coach. Okay. That has all the data that understands what that team's supposed to hit. And it's going to help coach the team, but it's also good at what? It's also going to performance manage the team too. Okay?

0:00

Yes.

2:21

Whether you like it or not, that's what's going to happen. And it's going to show like a leaderboard that way. And I think that's a good and a bad thing. Right? I think we're always just, we're always just trying to do better for our companies and I think this is great. Like I didn't have that idea for the coaching piece, but I think I'm gonna inject that a little bit into my little bots that have invaded slack, which I. It's been tremendous. My team's like, oh my God. I'm like, you say you like it. How useful has it been? Oh my God. 10 out of 10. 10 out of 10. I'm like, okay, all right, we'll do more.

2:21

Yeah, dude. I was telling Ethan about this concept because he has his AI lab where he helps people set up.

2:46

Is it really a lab?

2:53

Uh huh.

2:54

Okay.

2:54

And he helps people set up, you know, all this stuff internally, whether it's openclaw or whatever you want.

2:55

Does he charge six grand for open claw setups?

3:00

I think it's, I think it was either 5 or $10,000. I think that's fair for businesses. And including the PC or something like

3:04

that, that's a really good deal.

3:12

That's why I think it's closer to

3:14

10 grand if you include the Mac Mini. He's probably make. That's like the Mac Mini will cost like a thousand bucks or so. And then the rest, you know, he figures out, yeah, yeah, I think it's

3:15

ten grand or somewhere around there.

3:23

I think that's a good deal.

3:25

So you know, I was telling him, I was like, dude, I'm like the opportunity. And I don't know if he's, if he's doing this or not, but I think the opportunity in AI right now, if you're trying to set up a big business outside of creating LLM, which is very difficult and expensive and creating those lovables is very hard to do. You know, for every lovable that we see at 400 million in ARR, there's I don't even know how many that are struggling. Right. There's too many to count. Is do consulting where you help train people's AI to produce better outputs when their employees use them. So instead of training the employees, train the AI to adapt to the humans and do this at mass scale for everything from marketing to engineering etc. It's pretty much another version of Bain or McKinsey or Accenture. But specifically focus on just training AI to deal with people wherever they are versus just trying to train the people because I think it's just gonna be

3:27

too hard to train the people. Exactly. So that's, that's why I think the sooner you get it working for yourself, as in the organization like your leaders, one, whoever's running AI, then you get these bots to invade your Slack channel or your, your team's channel. Everyone's gonna learn because your team's gonna feed it. Context is also gonna feed con. Like it's just gonna be like this self reinforcing loop. And that's what we've been doing and we've getting, I will say we're getting more and more people reaching out to us saying hey we, we're hearing what you're talking about. Like we want these enterprise agents set up. Like we want these revenue agents, we want these recruiting agents, we want all these things so of pulling us in that direction. So we'll see where it goes. But I do think it's like what Heaton's doing for the setup is huge. I think you and I like what we're talking about right now. Even what's happening on Twitter is probably like the top 1% of the 1%. The vast majority of the world doesn't know about this stuff. And that's where I think the opportunity is. Like if you're listening to this and you're like 18 years old right now, I would just do this. Yeah, yeah.

4:23

On a side note, speaking of AI, did I ever share with you the results that we ended up finding because of our size and scale? And we're not the biggest agency, but we have enough data on certain industries where we know if you're recommended number one by chat, GPT versus number two versus number three, you should do that.

5:14

And then talk about the ads too.

5:33

No, that's already out there. We put that out there.

5:34

Oh you did. I, I, I, you didn't say it here. No.

5:35

Yeah, yeah. I don't I don't know if I said it here, I'm trying to end up finding the chart, but it was interesting cause I was just like, huh. Everyone knows that being position one on Google, it's worth so much more than being position 2. But AI is way more of a winner take all than traditional search. So if you count the most revenue you can make is position number one. Let's call that a hundred percent. If you're position number two, you do roughly 32%. Number one.

5:39

I was just gonna say that.

6:05

And guess what position number three is compared to position number one.

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5%.

6:09

Close. 8%.

6:10

Yeah.

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And position number four.

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1.5%.

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Very close. 1%.

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Yeah.

6:16

So pretty much if they're giving, if Chad GBT or Gemini perplexity is giving you a list, it's number one takes almost all the revenue, the number two and then it just pretty much the

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old way of SEO back in the day when there weren't any ads or anything, like number one got the lion's share and then like they started pushing it down more and more as the click through rate started going down more and more. So we'll see what happens. But that's, that's good to know.

6:27

Dude, I don't have a. I don't have it posted. I'll end up showing you on this. Um, check this out. How chat GPT ads. Cause we were talking about this over text.

6:38

So what Neil has pulled up, so it says how ChatGPT ads perform against meta and Google Ads. So it shows ChatGPT versus Meta plus 256%. Okay.

6:50

This is for lead quality I believe, right?

7:01

Yeah, I can't see.

7:03

But let me see, let's see. Yeah, lead quality.

7:04

Okay, so 256% up on ChatGPT versus Meta, but ChatGPT versus Google, 50% down.

7:07

Yeah. Okay, down. Yeah, exactly 49%. Close enough.

7:14

What's the bottom one?

7:17

The bottom one is cost per acquisition. So CPA.

7:18

Yeah. So CPA ChatGPT versus Meta, 46% cheaper. And then ChatGPT versus Google, 38% cheaper. So it's clearly a winner versus Meta. And then you know you're still gonna

7:21

get, well, even Google if you want.

7:33

Because that's a CPA basis. Yes.

7:35

Yeah. Because as a marketer we only care about CPA. Right. Lead quality from Google is much higher than ChatGPT. But you also have to look at cost. Google Ads are some of the most expensive because lead quality doesn't assume cost. You can end up spending 3, 4 times for a click because Someone may end up typing in like I'm looking for global digital marketing agency or I'm looking for the best ABM account, ABM software solution that works really well with LinkedIn. And then carrot could end up showing up.

7:36

Right.

8:11

You can end up bidding on that, but it's going to be a very expensive cost per click. Lead quality. I totally agree. Google is, is extremely high on lead quality. But the ads are just so much cheaper right now on Chat GPT. It's the wild wild west.

8:12

This just goes to show you again, every time with marketing, whenever a new ad channel comes out, you want to hit it really hard before the costs start to go up.

8:26

Yes. And a lot of people are struggling to get into Chad GPT ads, but they no longer need a struggle because Chad GPT just announced a partnership with Pret.

8:33

Yep.

8:43

So now people should be able to get access to ChatGPT. Yes. I was shocked that they partnered with Criteo.

8:44

Nobody talks about Critio anymore.

8:51

Yeah, because they're known for like more of like a spammy ish affiliate ish type.

8:53

Must be a relationship. Somebody had an OpenAI with them.

8:58

Yeah, I would assume that trade desk would have got it.

9:02

Who knows? Yeah, a lot of this stuff is relationship based. It totally is. So. Okay, but let me ask you this kind of separately because we're talking about just marking in general right now. Have you added, do you have APIs for both Ubersuggest and answer to public?

9:04

I don't know.

9:18

I. So I think APIs as marking is going to become like very big because you have the agents crawling the web. Right. So I think your, your, your technical documentation is going to be important and then your APIs. Because the way like I'm starting to work more now is within the LLMs. I'm just asking to do stuff. So yesterday I was messing around with one of our agents and we use this thing to send cold emails. Call instantly. I'm like, I don't want to make five. First I don't want to write five different campaigns. Okay, that's number one. And then second, I don't want to load all the copy into these individual campaigns. And I'm just like, hey, can you like create five campaigns for me and create like an expert panel of like legendary copywriters and email copywriters and then recursively score them until they're like, you know, 90 plus out of 100 and it does five versions for me. I'm like, these look pretty good. And I'm like, well, I don't want to load them. I'm like, anything you asked me to do, I just don't want to do it. Right. So I'm like, can you just, like, do it for me? And, like, it's like, it loads everything. And I check it. I'm like, oh, my God, it loads up. Right? So I'm like, with the software you have. With the software I have, we need to have APIs for it so then the agents can discover it first. Because I don't think other people are doing it that quickly right now. And then you have to have good documentation. And Mintlify has really good SEO. Like, not SEO, but software documentation.

9:19

What is it called again?

10:27

Mintlify. Mid M I D M I N T lify.

10:28

Oh, mint. Like that. Like that. Like mint.

10:33

Like mint ice cream or. Yeah, that.

10:35

Mint toothpaste.

10:37

So Mintlify, they're. They've been growing faster, and all they focus on was documentation. And I think they're gonna grow even faster now because all these agents, that's all they read is documentation. Yeah. They don't care about, like, you know, show me, like, a, you know, bikini sports or something like that, you know?

10:38

Yeah. And before you got into that topic, you mentioned relationships and how people close business through relationships. Do you want to take a guess on what portion or. Actually, I'll ask you first. What portion of your agency revenue comes from relationships?

10:52

Well, what do you define as a relationship? Like, they know you from your content. Like, you know the person. Okay.

11:06

So not that they know of your brand or they know of the Single Grain brand. They may also know that. But you also know that individual or employee on your organization knows the other person who's interested in working with you.

11:11

I say 20%.

11:23

Oh, wow.

11:25

Yeah.

11:26

That's a good chunk.

11:26

Yeah. But we're also smaller, so correct on

11:27

our S and B division. I don't know what the numbers are, but maybe somewhere similar. I'm guessing. I don't. I honestly don't know. I do know the majority does not come from relationships in our S and B division that I'm 100% on for enterprise over the last three months of our sales. I don't have marches numbers yet, but, like, 2% relationships. Yeah, that's almost all relationships. Yeah.

11:30

Okay, so that's. You like. But you know these people, is what you're saying.

11:52

Are you. Are you specifically taking. Are you talking about me and my relationships or relationships within my organization?

11:58

Okay. No, I was talking about you specifically.

12:04

I don't know my percentage. I know the Percentage of all of us combined.

12:08

Yeah, all of us. Like that makes sense. That makes. Yeah.

12:11

So when I look at like my managing director of Australia and his relationships, or Javi, who leads Latam for us, or Mike G, our CEO, majority, when I say majority, I'm talking about 90 plus percent is starting to become relationships. Now, some may be classified as like, oh, you got a RFP from this company. Oh, we got a RFP from that company because I have a relationship with someone who works on there or my team has a relationship with someone who works there. Yeah, we may end up winning that rfp. And if we did, you could be like, oh, you got it because of rfp. Well, if we didn't have the relationship, we probably would have never been included

12:14

in the rfp, you know, I think so. Relationships aren't going away anytime soon. But when you look at a lot of maybe these agencies or service companies that have become really bloated over time, they still have the relationships. So, like the way is, can you acquire the relationships and AI what you can. And it's not like it's a new thesis or anything, but it's like. But it's clear to me that a lot of these are moving like dinosaurs. But the relationships are still incredibly valuable. But once they start to get hit more and more, they can't take anymore. They're going to have to tap out and sell.

12:45

So I think what people forget about relationships when you're doing deals. Relationships create trust. And what we found is when people, when you do good work and people move from one company to another and they know you, they, yes, there's change when they're going to a new organization, but they also like a feeling of comfort. And they know that if they hit you up and they work with you again, they can rely on you. They already know what to expect and you should be performing. And I think that trust part is something that people overlook a lot in marketing in which they're just like, yeah, we want to put the mesh out there. What can I end up doing to maximize my conversion rate? But they forget to really emphasize on building trust. And Google's talked about this for ages with the double E, A T. Right. The last one being trust and eat. If, if you end up building that trust, I just think it works so well for you in the long run.

13:14

That's why during nice events are good for building relationships at scale sometimes.

14:10

Yeah. And let's, let's go back to dinners. Do you still do your dinners here?

14:15

Every two months or so. Three Months. I was doing it every month for a little bit. But I'm so heads down with this. You know, my eyes, like, my eyes hurt like hell every night when I go to bed. Because I like to. I'm on this until I burn my eyes out. Yeah.

14:19

Have you tried drops or.

14:31

I do drops, but you have the Lasik issue. I have.

14:32

Right.

14:35

Where, like, your. Your lipids don't. The oils don't come back as quickly, so your eyes dry out quickly. So I do use drops. But then, because I'm just. I can't. Every time my eyes come back, I just. I get on it again. I burn it out. But my point is, yes, I've been doing the dinners, but less. And then the thing is, all those dinners have been AI dinners. And then all those founders are also doing the same thing. They're burning their eyes out every day. So. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

14:35

I have the same issue. I didn't know you had laser eye surgery.

14:56

Yeah.

14:59

But, yeah, you have the same issue. Yeah, my eyes are dry. I don't really feel it like you feel it. I'm also not on a screen as much. I'm more on a phone call. So I'm not looking at myself. Talking. Yeah, I'm talking. But every time I go to optometrist, they always tell me like, oh, you need to do this. Try putting this, like, Vaseline type thing in your eye. I'm like, why eyes are dry?

14:59

It didn't help. I did it for six months. It didn't help. So I went to a doctor right next to the doctor I have in Beverly Hills. But so the big thing I found. This is a little tangent, but, like, if you look at your phone too much and it's a dark room, that it, like, it screws it up way faster. So don't do that.

15:19

Huh?

15:35

Yeah. Like, I workshopped it with ChatGPT. I was like, why is that? It's like, explain all the science. I'm like, okay, makes sense.

15:36

So, dude, the time I look at my phone, more than anything when it's dark is on an airplane.

15:41

Yeah. Which is really bad.

15:45

Yeah. To watch, like, movies. And then I fall asleep.

15:46

What do you watch on your phone? Your phone.

15:49

On your phone? Dude, I copied your phone. You know how you used to have the MacBook, not MacBook. IPhone. Air. I ended up buying your exact same phone.

15:50

Oh, nice.

15:58

Right? Because when you're on airplane.

15:58

When you watch movies on this. On the airplane, on the iPad. I got rid of the iPad. Why?

16:01

It was just harder to deal with

16:06

it's so good for movies. Yeah.

16:07

My problem with the iPad I've been using, you kind of nailed it. Earlier you mentioned I'd probably use AI a lot for tax related questions. I use AI a lot for structuring related questions and spreadsheets. So still finance, it's not always tax, but even structuring indirectly, it is related to taxes. Finances. This related to taxes one way or another. I've always found that. And because the AI is just so much easier for me to crank out reports and slice and dice the data, it's just harder to get the data in a format I want on an iPad and it's just easier for me to do. Crap.

16:09

Yeah.

16:48

With a computer.

16:49

So you're using Claude code within the cloud app, I'm assuming. Yes. Right. Okay. That's how you're using it. Okay. Yeah. There's so many things we can talk about there, but we also export a

16:50

lot of data to Excel.

16:59

Yeah.

17:01

And then when you export to Excel, because I'm really good at using Excel, it's just easier for me to use Excel on my laptop than the iPad. Because the iPad versions of a lot of these softwares. Yes, it's pretty much the same, but it's not identically the same. And it's just, for some reason, I just do better using it on my laptop.

17:01

Imagine if you have a, if you had a secure version of a claw. So like Nvidia is coming out with Nemo Claw, which is like their version of Open Claw, but it's secure. Right. So imagine they come out with that and it's sitting on your phone, it's ingesting all of the text that you're getting on the updates and all that. And because you, you work with it as your co pilot and the charts you make, it understands your behavior over time and it builds on that and it just starts to make the charts for you over time and it makes better charts for you too.

17:21

We've tried using AI for the charts so much. We try every single month. Because if we did that, it's okay, just keep trying. Yeah, we would save on the design budget. You want to know the biggest problem? When we actually put the inputs into AI for the charts. This is going to sound like the stupidest problem. I wouldn't say it's not a hundred percent of the time, but like. And it's not even 50% of the time. Maybe like 15 to 20% of the time. It messes up the design.

17:43

Yeah.

18:11

So it doesn't keep the exact style guide. No matter what you tell it. And then I would say 25 to 30% of the time it messes up the data.

18:11

Yeah, that makes sense.

18:24

So then. And then to fix it because we look at the cost, right, to fix it and find the errors. Because a lot of the people, the designers don't find errors. That's more costly to us, the reputational hit, than just having it done right, so.

18:25

Oh, you can't show that to clients, obviously.

18:40

No, no, we can't. But what we find is people will say they check it and they don't check it. So then when we do it manually, there's less errors and the cost isn't that high. Like my design cost for the charts is call it around $3,000 a month. At $3,000 a month, yeah, I don't care. And I don't want the reputational hit of just AI messing up. But one day it will get it right 100% of the time. Will it be six months or a year? The technology is there. They just got to fine tune this stuff.

18:42

Anyway, that's it for today, guys. Please don't forget to rate review, subscribe and we'll see you later.

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