Would you rather marry Musk, Zuckerberg, or Bezos— and other burning listener questions answered

Run a business and not thinking about podcasting? Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than add supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. Learn how podcasting can help your business. Call 844-844-IHEART. Hi, it's Joe Interstein, host of the Spirit Daughter Podcast, where we talk about astrology, natal charts, and how to step into your most vibrant life. And today I'm Talking with my dear friend, Krista Williams. It can change you in the best way possible. Dance with the change. Dance with the breakdowns. The embodiment of Pisces intuition with Capricorn power moves. So I'm like delusionally proud of my chart. Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton Eckerd. In 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it, all I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn. A one-night stand would end in a courtroom. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every Monday from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. There are no girls on the internet as a production of iHeartRadio and Unbossed Creative. I'm Bridget Todd, and this is There are No Girls on the Internet. Hey, y'all. So we are doing a mailbag episode as promised. But when Joey and Mike and myself sat down to record, we realized that a lot of the conversations we were having were sort of focused on one area, and that is our careers, our backgrounds, how the podcast comes together. So this is sort of a mailbag theme episode that speaks to those issues. We'll have more mailbag episodes to come. Thanks so much for listening. Mike, Joey, happy almost new year. Thank you for being here. Thanks for having me. Hey, Bridget. Yeah, happy new year or happy almost new year. I think at this point when this episode comes out, it'll be the new year officially, but we are currently in 2025, all ready to leave 2025. Oh my God. Tell me about it. We could do that thing where we pretend that we're recording it the day of yeah like oh how's your first few days of 2026 going can you believe that topical thing happened we're all still reeling from topical thing i can't believe he did that i know that was crazy uh yeah yeah yeah i was gonna visit that place but i guess that's out now there's actually a nuclear bomb currently headed towards our house as we're recording this crazy what happened i don't know in the news cycle that we have now like we're all joking but genuinely when i wake up in the morning i don't even know what i'm gonna see i had i really i have stopped i used to think things used to be a lot more predictable these days i'm like i don't even know when the morning starts i don't even know what is gonna happen so honestly truly it could be and this we're joking but it could be anything Yeah. And we're just so desensitized to things like I was remembering how like a couple of years ago, the government said that there are aliens. We're all like, yeah, well, you know, we have like bigger problems. Like we have we have a lot going on in our own lives right now. Yeah. You forgot about it. I forgot about it. There is actually a documentary out right now called The Age of Disclosure, which I started watching, but I have not finished, that claims to be, you know, essentially an inconvenient truth, but about aliens. And it's like how the military knows about this and all the information that we have and da-da-da-da. It's so funny to me that it's come and gone, barely a blip. Barely a blip. An inconvenient truth about aliens is such a funny sentence. even back to i'll be real like i i keep my my end of the year traditions is all i go through and make my list of like things that i did like big moments and i keep going back and being like charlie kirk was shot this year not that long ago like two months ago and i'm like i feel like that happened like five years ago at this point um wild how that was such a huge cultural moment for like 72 hours and now other than erica kirk being a mainstay with pyrotechnics on stages all of that it it almost never comes up it's like that came and went exactly yeah i i i wonder if that's like as true for them as it is for us though like my understanding is that a lot of maga people got really mad at Trump when he attacked Rob Reiner the day after he was murdered and like specifically referenced the killing of Charlie Kirk. And so, yeah, I don't know, like my big enduring takeaway from that whole episode is how like radically different the media bubbles we live in are. And And, you know, like I've certainly moved on, but I think they're still like deep in. Well, in case anybody tries to cancel me, I'm still mourning Charlie Kirk every day. I light a candle in his honor. I go to Starbucks and I say, give me the Kirk because I'm a true patriot. So if you're looking for somebody to cancel, it's producer Mike because he's over already. He's sufficiently mourned. So what does that tell you? I do think that you're onto something about the media bubbles because we were talking about how before Trump made his comments about Rob Reiner, I saw popular right wing figures saying, do you see how no one is besmirching Rob Reiner in death? And then 10 minutes later, Trump had that horrible tweet. And part of me, you know, when people were surprised by Trump comments about that, part of me was like, do you know this man? Like, there's the only information that you're getting about Trump. Like, what kind of media bubble are you in that the idea that Trump would be disrespectful of his enemy, even when his enemy was brutally murdered? Like the next day, in what world are you living in in terms of your media bubble or algorithm where that will be surprising information or not completely expected information? I had the exact same response. And I think they probably just don't see that stuff. Well, it's actually, I thought, a good segue into our mailbag episode. You know, we, I was thinking about this before we got on the mic and we've never done a mailbag episode before. So bear with us if it seems like we're not so professional at this because this is our first time doing this format. And I was thinking, why did I want to do this? Why was this something that I had in my mind? Because we've been doing this podcast. We launched the show in summer of 2020, I think May of 2020. So we're coming up on, we've been doing it over five years. We're coming up on six years. And since that time, I feel that we've learned. So I've learned so much. I feel like we've heard so much from our listeners, the audience. I've, you know, when we first started this, it was just me and our producer, Tari Harrison. And then Mike was more behind the scenes. And then we gained Joey. I feel like we really become a team. So like in addition to all the different shows and stories and rabbit holes and tangents of the Internet that we get to explore, I feel like we've all kind of learned and grown a little bit together in this work. I don't know. Maybe this just sounds a little sappy because it's the end of the year and I'm having a margarita. But what do you all think? Yeah, maybe the real podcast for the friends we made along the way. Maybe. Maybe. Yeah, I'm with you. I feel like I've learned a ton doing doing this podcast, getting to work on it. You know, got to know more about you, Bridget. Got to know Joey and Tari. Learned a lot about podcasting, sort of the business side, the production side. and so much about our digital landscape and the information social ecosystem that we all live in that is just so critical to like all areas of our lives. Yeah, it's been, it's really been a fun, interesting learning experience. Yeah, agreed. I mean, again, I'm kind of like, the latest addition to this show which is also funny because at this point I've I think it's been three years that I've been working on this yeah that's crazy I was like because I'm coming off four years okay um and I yeah I've been working on the show for three years now um but kind of same like I I my journey has been like I came on originally as an editor kind of totally by chance because it was around Tari and I connected she was looking for more help for the shows right when I came on as a full-time producer at iHeart got to know the show through editing and through you know hearing these stories each week and then about I think two years ago now Bridget had actually reached out to me about an episode that I did for Stuff Mom Never Told You which is a show that I will guest host every once in a while and it was sort of like but even before that I feel like this show to me like I kind of came into it and was like I yes like I love writing about feminist issues I was always somebody who was very into the internet and very online but I never really thought of it as like that's tech that's writing about tech and I I don't know I guess this is now me also being a little little corny and half a glass of white wine in but uh you know I I really do feel like this show has sort of helped me like own in what I like to report on and what I like to talk about like again I always I love the internet I grew up with the internet I feel Bridget we we really bonded over like having very similar experiences with that I also was always like I'm not a tech person I'm not a like traditional science person in the slightest the only class I've ever failed in my life was physics so I like I always was sort of like I'm not as I the tech side that's too like that's that's too whatever for me I'm more of like the social issues but it was I feel like through through like this show has kind of given me the confidence to be like yeah no I'm a tech reporter I work on tech issues like even yeah yeah like this is an area that I am interested in this is something that like I've kind of decided I want to continue like doing research and stuff like that and so yeah anyway so thank you Bridget so for for for starting this whole show and starting you know my gosh I mean I feel like Joey oh my gosh you're I really feel like you were the the missing ingredient of the show like you I feel like your perspective I think really informs the work that we do every day you are also in pockets of the internet that I'm not personally in. So like you have a lot of insights. I brought the Gen Z voice. I brought the Gen Z voice already. We joke about this, how the three of us, I'm a millennial. Joey is Gen Z. Mike, what do you, what do you claim? I don't, I don't want to put words in your mouth. Well, I'm like right on the cusp of Gen X and millennial. I identify as Oregon Trail Generation. Okay, wait, I kind of feel that though, because I'm a little bit more on the Gen Z side, but I am like early Gen Z. So I always thought I was a millennial growing up. You're, you're, we'll claim you. You're one of ours. Thank you. Yeah. I grew up with VHS tapes. There you go. I had a flip phone until I was 15. So. Classic millennial shit. If you ever wore a blazer or anything else business casual that would have been appropriate in a job interview to a nightclub. Welcome to the club. I don't know about nightclub because I was, again, like 14, 15 when that was the trend. But I did wear it to, like, homecoming, you know? Yes. Some sort of a non-professional setting. If a blazer made an appearance in a non-professional setting, I say, spiritually, you are a millennial. I do feel like, listeners, chime in if you want this episode. Because I do. I have been, like, sort of soft pitching to a person. I think we should do an episode about the whole, like, millennial nostalgia that's going on. on like my TikTok feed now, which is mostly Gen Z people, people being like, I should have been in Williamsburg, like working for BuzzFeed in 2012 and watching girls and like all of the, I think it's fascinating because I'm like, I think we all just are feeling nostalgic about when we were teenagers. Yeah. But yeah, it does make me wonder what are going to be like the Gen Z things. oh I'm so curious I I was the old I mean that you just described me I I brief I didn't live in Williamsburg but I did live in uh Bushwick which I remember my my broker was like it's East Williamsburg I said okay lady they're still doing that they're still doing that yeah I worked at American Apparel which if you know what that means you know that you know that you know what I'm talking about like I was we need to talk about this oh my god American Apparel in downtown Silver Spring, Maryland. Like I, yes, all of that nostalgia, that was my life. Okay, so I want to start with this first email from Lauren. Thank you so much for writing in, Lauren. Lauren writes, Hi, TangoD team. I've been listening to the podcast since the beginning and following Bridget's work for a while. I'm a big fan. Thank you so much, Lauren. This question is for Bridget and everyone who works on the show. I have heard you talk a bit about how much you love podcasting, and I'm really interested in your process. What does it look like when you sit down to put an episode together? How do you conduct your research? I think as audience members, we don't always consider how much work goes into an episode and what we're hearing is the final product of a huge amount of work. So I'm really interested in the behind the scenes of it all. Thank you for all that you do. Your show has been my go-to podcast for when I'm ready to get chores done as so much of the content makes me want to rage clean in a good way. Yes. I always find your takes thoughtful, nuanced, and timely and it challenges me to think critically about tech and the media I consume every day. I feel like this did one of you write this email to pretend to be because this is the this is the email that every podcaster wishes they would get so thank you Lauren this email is what I what if if I was having a bad day I would want one of you to write an email like this and pretend to be a listener thank yes thank you Lauren I was Bridget if it were me there would also be a note at the end that's like also Joey's really cool and they should be uh everywhere I don't know why they're not the biggest celebrity right now um but yeah uh thank you laura this is a great email yeah mike next time you uh write an email to make joey and i feel better add that to the ps just kidding just kidding yeah i i so the thing i like about this email one is that i also put on media to rage clean so we have that in common i like this email because it honors that putting the podcast together is actually kind of a lot of work. It's work that I love and it's work that I am grateful and lucky to be doing. And it's work that you will never hear me complaining about on the mic. Not to say that it's not, you know, I definitely have times where I'm like, this is so much work. But it's not energy that I bring to the show ever because truly, you know, it's a voluntary project and I'm so lucky that we get to do it together and all of that. And then also I would say the work that goes into putting together a show So I do, even though it can be a lot to manage, I do find it interesting. I do, I do, I am like a dog with a bone where if I just get an idea about something, researching it is sort of part of the fun of it. So I would say how episodes come together is generally I start with some conversation that is happening where like, it's in the zeitgeist, right? If you don't need to, you're not, it's not a hidden pocket of the internet. It's a conversation everybody is having. And then I'll try to say, well, what are the parts of this conversation or the threads or the nuance that is getting missed? And typically, more times than not, there is some aspect that reflects the marginalized experience. And whether that's the experience of women, of black folks, people of color, trans folks, queer folks, people with disabilities, indigenous folks, you know, working folks. Right. A lot of our a lot of our media, tech media especially, really centers the idea of like CEOs and founders and Sam Altman and Mark Zuckerberg. And we kind of forget about the everyday person who is using technology, who is a working person, not somebody who is wealthy. Right. And so I try to find the missed ways that identity is actually fueling something. And for me, a lot of times that jumps out. But sometimes I have to like take a little bit of time to think about it because, you know, this is going to be a weird comparison. But if you've ever seen that movie, My Big Fat Greek Wedding, where the Greek dad is like, I can make it. Tell me any word and I can tell you how it's actually a Greek word. I feel that way about tech and Internet stories. tell me any tech or internet story that can tell you how it's actually the story of like a marginalized person or a marginalized experience or something like that um then i'm laughing at that but like that really is by the way most stories though you can find that element because it is that's the thing about working into issues of like inequality of like gender race or whatever is there's all that's always going to be rooted in whatever at the end of the day so yeah i this is similar to how I uh that's on a tangent but I was my friends will make fun of me because they're like every single time they'll like go watch a movie together you will like at the end be like and here's why it actually was a gay allegory and I'm like because because everything is a gay allegory I yeah I love that that's the best part of media jobs side note I did just get into a very long back and forth on reddit about the movie and book American Psycho and the gay oh my god Gay allegory. Do people not know that's a gay allegory? Y'all, gay allegory. I watched that movie this year for the first time. Finally, after I finally actually sat down and watched it. I immediately was like, oh my God, yeah, that's like. This was written by a gay man. I can tell. Yes. Yeah. So once I have kind of gotten whatever the identity thing that I want to sort of like blow up and make the whole story, I kind of have my marching orders from that point. is the research. And if I had to say there was one thing that people probably don't see on the show is how much research goes into not just every episode, everything that I say, I am the kind of person that I can probably count on one hand the amount of times that I've said something on the show where I was not absolutely certain because I have read no less than three articles about that thing. Sometimes I'm put on the spot and I'll have to say, well, in my opinion, da-da-da-da. But for the most part, every line that I have said is something I have read and can confirm and have based on something. And so I'm generally reading multiple like long form articles or having interviews and conversations, some of which don't even make it on the show to help flesh out, you know, the story that I'm trying to tell. in the episodes that you all hear that have like a like a an interview i'm listening to basically i'm like finding the right person to speak to an issue i'm pre-interviewing them i'm i'm outlining like where i want the conversation to go but also sort of trying to strategically leave room for the twists and turns and where they're going to take me i've had many an interview where from the beginning of that interview to the end i was i could not tell you where we were going to go so leaving room for that. The editing process, I don't even know if this is interesting to people to hear this, how the sausage is made, but, you know, I listen through every interview multiple times, just the raw audio, and you kind of get an ear for it, right? You get an ear for the beats of the story. You get an ear for the things that are like, okay, well, this can be cut. You get an ear for how to prune this into a story that, you know, isn't just a good interview, but has a beginning, middle and end. Mike will tell you that when we first started the podcast, I would probably spend just in terms of making edits to audio. I probably would spend what would you what would you say? Oh, I mean, I'd be hard pressed to say what is like editing versus like researching. But you you would spend like tens of hours on every episode, which was just like not sustainable right and yeah you know it's it's funny i started this segment saying about you know i got to gotten to learn so much over these years working on the show and that's certainly true uh some additional things that i didn't mention that i've learned are like uh getting the skills of conducting an interview, the skills of editing footage to tell a story, and then the additional skill of doing all of that under a super tight deadline of, you know, gotta get two episodes out per week, gotta get it done. You know, I came from an academic-ish setting where research projects would unfold over months or sometimes years right there would just be like seemingly endless research and then writing a document would uh be a task that involved multiple people over again many weeks or months of revisions um and then ending up with a like a research article which is just a very different thing than the storytelling that you're able to do and uh and it's just been really cool uh and and fun interesting to get exposure to those skills. And Bridget, you're like very good at it. Let's take a quick break. Run a business and not thinking about podcasting? Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ad-supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. So whatever your customers listen to, they'll hear your message. Plus, only iHeart can extend your message to audiences across broadcast radio. Think podcasting can help your business? Think iHeart. Streaming, radio, and podcasting. Call 844-844-iHeart to get started. That's 844-844-iHeart. Hi, this is Jo Winterstein, host of the Spirit Daughter Podcast, where we talk about astrology, natal charts, and how to step into your most vibrant life. And I just sat down with a mini driver. The Irish traveler said when I was 16, you're going to have a terrible time with men. Actor, storyteller, and unapologetic Aquarian visionary. Aquarius is all about freedom loving and different perspectives. And I find a lot of people with strong placements in Aquarius are misunderstood. A sun and Venus in Aquarius in her seventh house spark her unconventional approach to partnership. He really has taught me to embrace people sleeping in different rooms, on different houses, in different places, but just an embracing of the is-ness of it all. If you're navigating your own transformation or just want a chart-side view into how a leading artist integrates astrology, creativity, and real life, this episode is a must-listen. Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcast. I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan. He became the first Bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it all, I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand and ended in a courtroom, with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. Please search for it. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. This season, an epic battle of he said, she said, and the search for accountability in a sea of lies. I have done nothing except get pregnant by the f bachelor Listen to Love Trapped on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car? When you look at your car, you're going to become overwhelmed with such good feelings. Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you? I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused. Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. NLP, aka Neuro Linguistic Programming, is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics, and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain. It's about engineering consciousness. Mind Games is the story of NLP. its crazy cast of disciples, and the fake doctor who invented it at a New Age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all? NLP might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 1969. Malcolm and Martin are gone. America is in crisis. And at Morehouse College, the students make their move. These students, including a young Samuel L. Jackson, locked up the members of the Board of Trustees, including Martin Luther King Sr. It's the true story of protest and rebellion in Black American history that you'll never forget. I'm Hans Charles. I'm Menelik Lumumba. Listen to The A-Building on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back. So when we first got greenlit for the show, I would spend a few days from soup to nuts at the beginning. Each episode was a few days of like deep work. And I was so, you remember, I was so hung up on the editing, right? I was like, the reason I want to do this show is because I think that marginalized people deserve beautifully edited, beautifully stories-shaped, like stories of our digital resilience and our digital selves and lives. And, you know, when I would pitch it, I would talk about how, you know, if you listen to a podcast like This American Life, or for me, it was a Starly Kinds mystery show, you get these beautifully layered, beautifully thoughtfully edited stories. And I was like, that's what I, that's what we deserve. When people talk about internet stories for marginalized people, so often they're just so hastily thrown together. And I was like, I want to document our loving attributes to ourselves online. Well, it turns out that's a lot of freaking work. And it was like, I don't know that the story, I feel like the stories are good. And all of the editing that I was bringing was important to me, but it was sort of just icing. And so now where I, and also when you are doing work like that, you don't get to respond to what's, what's current, right? Because if all, if all, if all your work is made in advance in the can, when something really happens and you're like, I want to speak to that. You don't really have a way to do that. So I found myself kind of getting into a trap where we were putting out content that I was like very proud of, but it wasn't speaking to the moment. Then we started doing the news roundup. We got to hear from Mike and Joey and other folks who are on my radar and the tech landscape. And I feel like that really changed the game as well because one, it created a space where I could speak a little bit more off the cuff. You know, when I'm interviewing somebody, their interview, it's very important to me that their interview is like take center stage and is the main thing that you're that you're hearing. And so you don't hear a lot of me. And people would say, I like the show, but I don't really feel like I hear Bridget or know who she is. And the News Roundup, I think it kind of lowers the stakes a little bit and also gives a chance to, you know, wrap up like what are the things that happened this week? And weirdly, I feel like the news roundup has become more of the podcast than the interview episodes in some ways. We have been getting more listens on the news roundups than we have just from the numbers on Ami. Yeah. Yeah. I will say, though, that when I see people on like Blue Sky or something just randomly reference an episode, they're usually referencing one of the interview episodes. Oh. Yeah. Well, listeners, tell us what you like. It would actually be useful to know what like how people are engaging with this. So, yeah, let us know how that lands for you. And Lauren, thank you so much for this email. I hope this answered your question. I also hope that was interesting. Wait, do you want the post-production version now? I'm sorry. What am I doing? I'm sorry. Post-production. Listeners, this is what always happens is that I'll get an email. This is a perfect tangent because what happens is Bridget does all that. And then Thursday night, somewhere between 10 p.m. and 3 a.m., I will get an email from Bridget. I can't stop. This is so real. This is absolutely fucking real. I can't fault you because, again, we've talked about this where I'm like, Bridget, I get it. I'm also somebody that I'm either awake at 3 a.m. or I fell asleep at 9 p.m. and I'm whatever. So listeners, if you're wondering why Friday episodes now, since they've switched to news roundups, suddenly come up, come out like really late at night, it's because. And this is it. And I'm not Bridget. I'm not saying this is a fault. It is a hard. It is like, you know, that's the thing with if you want to be like with love, if you but that's it is the thing of you. If you want stuff that is like responding to the immediate stories, sometimes there's little bit of like there's gonna be some turnaround time um but yeah um I guess like real quick for me to kind of what you were saying before Bridget like people come up to me all the time they're like I love podcasts like what is your daily job like what does it look like and I'm like so you don't know the amount of work that has to go into even just a talk show where it's because because this the way that the I took over editing the Friday episodes when I originally came out of the show which originally were similar to the Tuesday episodes where it was an interview and a story and then at some point we switched over to the news roundup uh uh format but for even something like the news roundup where it's just two people talking back and forth like I get the files I did earlier say that I failed the one physics class ever to take but technically my I am an engineer uh so I there is an audio engineering aspect I have to like put all of these files into uh we use a platform called isotope mainly and then there's we i we use the adobe uh platforms here at iheart mate not everybody does but i do and most of us do um so there's like certain kind of programs i run it through and i have to add certain filters depending on how the audio sounds that day this is the very this is where i get to be like guys technically i'm an engineer um and then eventually the file is done i will then put it in adobe audition which is the if you are familiar with audio at all or familiar with the adobe suite that's an editing software uh going back to how you're talking about like wanting this to sound more polished and the editing side of things i'm the one whenever there's like a mistake that happens and Bridget's like never mind I couldn't get what the behind the scenes behind the scenes Bridget will like literally do like a beep sound like she'll be like beep and then I'll have to edit out I'm saying this like oh my god I have to do it meanwhile I'm like this is my job that I worked very hard to get and like enjoy doing both like same I'm like I'm like I'm not like I'm like I can't really complain I do love what I do um but Bridget yeah Bridget will be like if there's a segment that she's like never mind i want to say it free say that she'll be like beep and then yeah there we go uh you do it better than i whatever because i'm the one editing myself but i have to be on air so i always will just be like that's not what i wanted to say and that's my indication of myself that i'm like i know i wanted to ask what is it what is it like so joey is in a at a weird rare position where they are both a speaker like they're a host like they are speaking on the show but also the one who is editing so editing themselves I what is that like well so I guess editing your own voice is hard guys it is a it is a weird like ego death experience that I never really thought was going to be anyways sometimes I'll like finish the recording go and like scream for a couple minutes and then like come back here and upload it and start editing and then immediately will be like nobody talked to me for two hours I just edited my own voice for like five hours straight I want to just pretend I don't know I will say I I've been a performer my whole life I've been like like I talked about this before I was a theater kid back in the day I was like I was an actor for a little bit I've done all these different like broadcast things where I'm like I'm used to hearing my own voice I kind of had to get over that it also sucks like I'm not gonna lie like it is I feel like I'm constantly and I'm just like why the why did I say that I don't know why uh but yeah I try my best but the nice thing about editing your own voice though is then you get to kind of be your own like self-editor where if I like there definitely have been episodes where like I've gone on a whole tangent and then listen back and been like that was stupid I'm taking that all out my favorite thing is when Mike and I do an episode we send it to Joey and Joey is like hey let's let's let's just take this out okay it's funny because we've never actually got to talk about this face to face but sometimes it does reach point because again like usually when I'm in an editing session it's like four hours straight five hours straight to be just listening to this and sometimes I do feel kind of bad because Bridget and Michael get an email from me that's like hi I know what you were trying to say here but that's not what it came up as it sounded really bad I just cut it out no I appreciate it you have saved us probably from you you you've saved us from we don't even know the stuff that you've saved us but i think i i'll email you guys too when i'm finished with mine and i'm like i did my best to make myself not sound stupid but also if you listen to this and you're like joey why the fuck did you say that which is which has happened a couple times and you know what i'm grateful frigid hasn't said that said that to me in the email that's me uh paraphrasing but it's been much nicer. It's been more of a like, I know what you're trying to say, but I don't know if that's it. But I'm like, you need somebody to listen back and tell you like, hey, the thing you're I get what you're trying to say, but that's not coming across. Let's just let's just cut this out. Yeah, I once when I was first working as a podcaster. So we had done an episode early, early on. It might have been my second or third time even like doing a podcast where I was on the mic and she was like I don't think we should run this because Bridget you sounds like a fucking like what did she say she was like you sound like Valerie Solanis like you're gonna go start taking the oh my god murdering men and I listened back and I was like I sound insane is this what I said like you you could not I you could have told me that And they had done an AI vocal clone of my voice because I was on such a rant. But in the booth, it felt natural and it felt normal. But listening back, you know, when your cortisol has gone down and you're no longer in the moment of like ranting and ranting, I was like, I sound insane. Is this what I sound like? She really did me the biggest solid by saying, don't worry, this is going in the vault. More after a quick break. streaming, radio, and podcasting. Let us show you at iHeartAdvertising.com. That's iHeartAdvertising.com. Hi, this is Jo Winterstein, host of the Spirit Daughter Podcast, where we talk about astrology, natal charts, and how to step into your most vibrant life. And I just sat down with a mini driver. The Irish traveler said when I was 16, you're going to have a terrible time with men. actor, storyteller, and unapologetic Aquarian visionary. Aquarius is all about freedom loving and different perspectives. And I find a lot of people with strong placements in Aquarius, like are misunderstood. A sun and Venus in Aquarius in her seventh house spark her unconventional approach to partnership. He really has taught me to embrace people sleeping in different rooms on different houses in different places, but just an embracing of the is-ness of it all. If you're navigating your own transformation or just want a chart-side view into how a leading artist integrates astrology, creativity, and real life, this episode is a must-listen. Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan. He became the first bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it, all I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand and ended in a courtroom with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. Please search for it. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. This season, an epic battle of he said, she said, and the search for accountability in a sea of lies. I have done nothing except get pregnant by the f***ing bachelor! Listen to Love Trapped on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car? When you look at your car, you're going to become overwhelmed with such good feelings. Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you? I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused. Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. NLP, a.k.a. Neuro Linguistic Programming, is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics, and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain. It's about engineering consciousness. Mind Games is the story of NLP. It's crazy cast of disciples and the fake doctor who invented it at a New Age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all? NLP might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 1969, Malcolm and Martin are gone. America is in crisis. And at Morehouse College, the students make their move. These students, including a young Samuel L. Jackson, locked up the members of the Board of Trustees, including Martin Luther King Sr. It's the true story of protest and rebellion in Black American history that you'll never forget. I'm Hans Charles. I'm Menelik Lumumba. Listen to The A-Building on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's get right back into it. seeing as though we all have kind of come from different professional backgrounds to do this work i was surprised that we got so many emails from listeners who were interested in sort of our career trajectories and the idea of like making career changes and how we came to podcasting in the first place we got an email from chase that says i hope you guys are doing well and taking time for yourselves during this crazy time my name is chase i'm 24 i've been listening to your podcast for a few months now. I enjoy it. And I love hearing your takes on all things tech, media, and society. You both are so insightful. And I appreciate your work so much, especially during this time of misinformation and the lack of integrity in mainstream journalism. So I said that all to say, thanks for the work that you do. It's really important. Okay. My question is for Bridget. As someone who has gone down a non-traditional career path, how did you grapple with this? What was your North Star kept you motivated? And how did you turn your passion into a career? For context, as I said, I'm 24. I'm in the thick of trying to figure out what to do with my life while staying too true to myself and my passions. Thanks, Chase. I love this email. Thank you so much, Chase. And it's written to me, but I know that we've all had, I don't know, interesting career paths. My career path has been very cattywampus. My late father, God rest his soul, used to say that when I was in college, because I majored, I double majored in English literature and women's studies, and he would tell people, This is my daughter. She is majoring in future unemployment. Lovingly, that was his joke. He used to beg me to say like, oh, please take a minor in business administration or chemistry or something. So I went to undergrad at East Carolina University. I kind of had a couple of different majors, dance performance, which, again, my dad was not thrilled about because I loved dance and I loved kind of the intersection of theater and dance. And I anything involving physicality was my thing. And so I did like modeling and portrait modeling and dance. And I thought I was going to have a career that I don't know how you how you didn't say it. I thought I would. I thought I would be happiest having some kind of a physical career where my physical self and my physical body and presentation was part of how I how I made my money. Right. um a performance career a performance career i feel like that's yeah yeah that's the word i'm looking for you too joey i also yeah i was gonna say i was talking to you like bridget what are you we've never talked about this before i didn't know you were a dancer too um so i also kind of came i just ironically also from a performance background but i left a little bit earlier i didn't end up studying it in college it's funny because i've talked to so many people that come from a like like a like a modern dance or theater or performance background who now do tech and media work there's like an intersection there producer mike and i were just in barcelona interviewing uh someone who is like a digital rights activist now and part of her work brings in her background studying performance and and what she calls like the theater of the absurd the theater of protest And her work is all about using data to make up kind of a public spectacle of embarrassment for people in power. And that is so grounded in her work as a theater professional. And so I do think there's some sort of intersection point between these two things. Yeah. And so I, you know, in college, I was a little miss on campus. Right. I this this is I've said this before. I don't know if I said it on the podcast, but I wrote I had my own column in the paper. I had a zine. I was a DJ on the radio on our college radio station, WZMV. I was DJ Coldflaw, which is a name. It's a goofy name. I got it from the graphic novel Ghost World by Daniel Close. the main character of that graphic novel was a girl called Enid Coleslaw, who I felt was my like spiritual twin. And so that's why I was DJ Coleslaw. And there was one day a month on campus where my column came out in the paper. You could hear me on the college radio station. You know, you could get the zine. Basically, my opinions were coming at you from land, sky and air, There was no escaping my voice if you were on campus. And yeah, I guess that really was my North Star, you know, just being somebody who had something to say. I mean, it sounds so cheesy, but I feel like every aspect of my career and my passions of my life have come back to the importance of self-expression, the importance of the truth. I... I don't want to get too personal, but I grew up in a household where it was sometimes difficult to express yourself. And it was sometimes difficult to say the truth and really say it with conviction and say what you meant. There was a there was a sometimes there was a cost or a penalty attached to saying something and saying it true, like saying something that carried emotional truth. And so I think that today when you say the truth, the truth always finds an audience, even when we're living in a media climate where lies abound, right? Like when you live in a media climate where lies are everywhere and lies are cheap and lies are fast and lies are easy to produce and lies are incentivized, truth is what cuts through. And so I think that's really been the North Star of my career. I had a disastrous stint in graduate school. I went to University of Maryland. And I was accepted into their MA PhD program. And y'all, I was the dumbest person in my fucking PhD program. I was like, I just could not get it together. I would have nights where I would say like, oh, what am I doing here? I would be up at night being like, oh, this is not. But also, it was very important to my parents and my family in general that I get an advanced degree. I am the least educated person in my family. And yeah, I mean, I say this. Yeah, I am the least educated person in my family. And it's just funny because I, in a million years, never thought that the career that I am in would be where I was. And I got to say, I am so grateful every day that I had the guts to leave my graduate program because if I was still in that, there's a verse, I know people who are still in that grad program. And I dropped out like 15 years ago, right? Like it is for people who have PhDs, Mike is one of them. Genuinely, I do not know how you did it. The fortitude that it takes, I do not have. yeah so I guess I guess I said it to say that I am someone who has started over a lot in my career we got another email about you know what it's like to start over for a long part of my career I thought I wanted to be in academia that didn't work out and I realized what I enjoyed about academia was being in front of a classroom and working with young people and students like that was really where I found an energy that I had that I had been looking for but you know in academia the teaching is supposed to be like supplementary academic research that you're producing. That's meant to be the main thing. And I was like, oh, I'm really more into the teaching. So then I taught for several years. Then from there, I worked more in like political activism and organizing. I got a job at MSNBC, started doing journalism. I really have taken kind of a strange circuitous route. I'm rambling. And I was going here because I wanted to set up to dovetail to Mike, because you are somebody who actually did finish your PhD. You never make me call you Dr. Amato, even though you could. You should. I think it's your right. I think it's your right to say you're Dr. Amato. Let's go. When he's like emailing a company with a complaint or like he wants something free, you're not above doing it. That's the main time I pull it out when I'm like complaining about something and want them to know like, no, I'm someone whose complaints are backed up by evidence. I guess quick addition to that because uh Chase when uh Mike and Bridget sent out this email with the the prompts that we were talking about I flagged this one where I was like I like in your email you said I'm 24 I'm 26 so I'm two years older than you and I I was like I'll give my opinion as somebody who like I gotta get it I don't know I guess I guess I I resonate a lot of what you were saying I really resonate with where I think like it is a time in your life where and I'm saying this year where I'm still figuring out what the hell I'm doing and what I want to do with my life. Personally, though, I will say like my route to getting into podcasting was because I also this is something where it's not a traditional career path Everybody I work with has a different path They got into it For me I studied journalism in college I for a while really wanted to go into the film industry uh and then sort of got to college and was like never mind I more of a writer I want to do all of this studied journalism got really involved with the Bridget you kind of you mentioned this when you're talking I got involved with my college's radio program uh so I was not as like the big name on campus, Bridget Todd. But, you know, but I was super involved with the radio studio. I kind of found my niche of like media that I was into. I was doing a lot with that. I had some audio editing experience because of that. I got kind of lucky in a weird way where I graduated in the middle of the pandemic. But also it was right when podcasting was taking off. Again, that's why I say I'm like, it was lucky in a way, lucky in a way. Because if you know anything about if anybody listening was a was a junior senior at the time when COVID started, it was a weird time. I had an internship that I was about a month into that got cut short that I immediately freaked out and was like, my career is over. I'm never going to whatever. But but it also it was like it was a time when they were looking for people that had audio experience. It was a new industry. And I just happened to have that experience. But yeah, I the thing that I really emphasize, I think, for a lot of people is like I I'll be real. Like when I was in I never was a big like podcast listener before I started this career path. Yeah, because I and part of it was just that I was like I knew I was into media. I knew I was into like storytelling, talking about things. I was into the like pop culture. I again for a while really wanted to go to film. I had that like that background, too. I had done a couple internships that were in like the documentary sort of field. And it worked out really well where it was like this, these things that I like doing. And there's an industry that I'm able to do all of them. Podcasting was the thing when I graduated. That was the big thing. There's going to be something else currently or in a couple of years. That's such a good way to put it because the stuff that I, the skills that I got, this sort of like fell ass backward into that I use every day now and have been really helpful in my career. there are things I would have never, you know, thought would pick up. Like I got into podcasting because I was the opposite of you. I was just a voracious listener of podcasts early on. And I was, I was, I was there for that early wave of podcasting, the sort of wild, wild west before that second boom of when you were graduating into audio production. Like I was just there as a, as a listener of podcasts and the field at that point, this was like 2008, 2009, it wasn't that big of a space. And so just by being somebody who likes podcasts a lot and knew all the shows and had listened to them all, I was able to show up in that space professionally. I never thought that would be something that would be an avenue for me. So I say that to say it really reflects your career path of just sort of happenstance, luck, being at the right place at the right time, and then also really following what it is that feels like an alignment. I could never have on paper planned for the career that I have now. I think all of the twists and turns and, you know, weird stopovers and pit stops are part of it in a kind of way. That's sort of part of the journey. That sounds so cheesy, but it's true. No, it's real though. I mean, I like the first, because again, I came into this show as a producer and I came into iHeart as a producer, but like the first episode that I wrote and co-hosted was like about like a comic book character for Stuff Mom Never Told You where they had like mentioned that they wanted to do an episode and I was like I emailed Samantha and Annie the host who like they're amazing love them and I was like you mentioned this character you mentioned one doing an episode about this I I really love this character I would love to be involved with it somehow and like they were like if you want to write it go ahead and i was sort of like oh wow okay so yeah it is like a weird like you kind of just got to wait for the opportunity which and again i'm i'm saying this too this is it's a double-edged sword of also i will recognize like i said earlier i'm 26 i feel like i've been really lucky we're like i success is like is it's i feel so like wow i'm one of those like barstool podcasts or something being like oh my god the key to success is but but for real but really like the key to success is like the key to never mind forget i know i know but you know what i'm trying to say you know what i'm trying to say i think the way to do well is it's the it's the combination of like having those skills ready where again i was like i have this background in radio i've worked on audio i have a portfolio i can send people and like when i got the interview for this job i was like here i have all these things i can send you that was really a leg up but also being like and once you were ready for me to be like can you write an episode about this I was like, yeah, let's go. I love this thing. Let's do it. And it's kind of been like a snowball since then. I think luck is a huge part of pretty much every successful career and hopefully some good luck, but like a lot of bad luck, too. But, you know, what's the old saying that like luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity? That's what I was thinking of. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's really true. You know, I'm also somebody who's had a non-traditional career. It's hard to put a lot of labels on exactly what my career is, but non-traditional perhaps fits better than anything. and yeah there was a lot of what I would want to call luck but was more just sort of like unexpected opportunities that for whatever reason I had a mix of qualifications for and or a willingness to take a risk and an ability to take a risk you know and I think for anybody who's contemplating a non-traditional career path, and you probably know who you are, right? Like if you hear that phrase and you're like, yeah, that's me, then yeah, you're probably one of us. You know, you just have to know for yourself, like how risky are you willing to be? I think that's a big question that needs to be answered. Yeah, if anybody, I don't know if this is, interesting for anybody that's not trying to get into media, but like, I was just having a conversation with a family member over the weekend about this, about the sort of balancing act that goes into, at least for my work, it goes into like making the financials work and then the math, math and how you have your one client that pays for your ability to take this other client or your ability to do this other passion project that doesn't really pay, but maybe it will. Like, it really is a little bit of a spinning plates dance. I will say we got an email from Steph from Winnipeg who said that she heard that I used to be in education, which is true. What a different world than podcasting. I'm in my mid-30s and I've considered a 180 career change myself, but it's very scary. Does Bridget have any advice on how to do it without ruining your life? I hate the idea of starting over, but this is not it. For reference, I'm currently in accounting and administration looking at agrisciences, lots of farming around here. And first of all, I just, I love this email. I am all about a second, third, fourth act. I feel like I've had many of them in my career. But Mike, I do feel like this email speaks to what you were sort of answering, right? Like, you know, when I first met you, you were just a lowly data, just a lowly PhD We have her who was, I don't know, just doing some like piddly little thing, running a data team of one of the country's largest public health nonprofits. And I plucked you from that world of garbage and obscurity. And I said, come to podcasting. This is our this is our Hallmark episode. Yes. For the Christmas season, the holiday season, whatever. Yeah. I taught Mike the true meaning of Christmas. It's risking it all to become a podcaster. Yeah, it's. Yeah, so I have I also love this question. I love to hear about people like Steph who are even just contemplating big changes because I think they can be like really scary and rightfully so. But I think also like spending another 20, 30 years toiling at a profession that like you don't enjoy and like maybe makes you miserable is its own kind of risky. And yeah, I'm somebody who I have made three distinct, extremely hard pivots in my career. so when I first went to grad school I was accepted into a PhD program at the psych department at UW-Madison which is like a very prestigious program and I went there to study psycholinguistics in a lab that did like linguistics and neuroscience it was really cool heady stuff how does the brain learn language and store information about words and meanings and how do we put them together to communicate what does that tell us about the way we understand the world. Really heady, interesting things. I'd done it somewhat in undergrad, took some time off between to work in a lab and then got accepted this prestigious program. And after about 10 years of this, I just realized that it was not for me. It's like super interesting research. I'm really glad that there are brilliant people continuing to study that and like push the frontiers of human understanding. It's why we have LLMs now is because of people doing research in that area about like brain connectivity. But it just wasn't for me. You know, I didn't know this when I was younger. But over the course of about 10 years of study, I realized that I really wanted to be doing something more directly applied. It's like solving like more immediate problems in people's life. Again, I really value basic science, but it just, that wasn't it for me. And so I pivoted, put together a whole new program with the help of some really, uh, compassionate, uh, kind, smart mentors worked in natural resource management for several years. Uh, and that was really cool and interesting. And then from there got into tobacco control, which I think I've talked about on the show a fair amount. That's you met me, Bridget, when I was leading the data team for Truth Initiative, the country's largest nonprofit dedicated to eliminating the harm of tobacco to Americans. It was really cool. I was working on digital interventions to help people quit smoking. So like apps and online programs to help people quit smoking and vaping and whatever other tobacco products they wanted to do. It was like a public health service. We were helping millions of people. It was also a research platform i got to work with like really smart cool people uh it was a good job paid well good benefits um and so pretty much everyone in my life was pretty shocked when i uh pivoted yet again to come work on this show and you you're underselling it because you were like a slick professional guy like you were I just want people to understand the ways in which you really had a really prestige not that not that what we do is not prestigious but you had a very specific kind of prestigious career that I could tell and I don't think I'm telling tales out of school to say was not aligned with what you wanted to be doing day to day it wasn't that it was unaligned but I just, you know, increasingly was a found my mind attracted to other problems. So like, you know, if I'm really motivated by public health impact, right? Like I'm somebody who's benefited from a lot of privilege in my life. And it's important to me that what I do with my time here on this earth is like contributing to helping other people and trying to reduce the prevalence of smoking or actually reducing the prevalence of smoking is like one of the biggest things that you can do, right? Like it's, it's so harmful in our society in ways that I think a lot of people just like really don't appreciate the magnitude of death and disease that smoking causes and cost to the healthcare industry. But it just, yeah, I guess my, you know, this was happening at like the end of the 2010s, the first Trump era. And I've just always really been interested in the internet from the earliest days. I think that's something we all have in common here. And, you know, Bridget, as you were pulling this show together, trying to, in my opinion, really confront and address some of the root causes of problems with the Internet, right? Where it has the Internet has so much potential to connect people, to democratize information, to raise awareness about important problems, to help people organize, to advocate for solutions. and increasingly I felt like it was being co-opted to do other things um often in direct opposition to those like nobler ideals and so you know at the beginning of this episode uh one of the things Joey mentioned was feeling uh more emboldened and empowered encouraged to uh take up space in conversations about technology and so when I talk with people about why I'm doing this show, that is precisely the reason I think the internet affects all of us in like profound ways from how we pay for stuff at the store to how we connect with our family members to how we elect candidates to how we decide to get vaccinated. Like all of it is filtered through the internet. And I really truly believe that we need to make the Internet better and address some of these problems before we're really going to be able to make progress on a lot of the other ills that are plaguing us. And so, yeah, it was a super hard pivot, not encouraged, you know, definitely took a big financial hit on doing it. Uh, and the identity loss is real, but, uh, I, I would do it again because it's, it feels really good to, you know, wake up every day and feel, um, really connected to the output of what we're doing. not that I didn't before, but just, uh, also ownership of it. I think that makes a big difference to me. You know, like everybody is different in what they value. And, uh, for me have, I think having, uh, control over what I do with my time is a big one. And working on this podcast has, uh, you know, allowed me to have more of that as well. Okay, so speaking of career stuff, career paths, we got an email from Sam P, who recently moved to Michigan, who writes, I would love to hear more about Bridget's career paths. What did she study in school? How did she break into podcasts? How did she get a host gig? this is actually one of my favorite stories to talk about because how I got my how I became a host on podcast is just one through being a voracious listener of podcasts and then two I early in the early early early days of podcasting this was in circa 2009 2010 before we had any idea of like what this medium was going to be this was pre-serial right so this was way before anybody was really making real money on this. People didn't. We were still counting metrics by hand and shit. Like, very early days. I saw... Just to put a pin in that, you know, folks like Bridget, who've been in this industry for a long time, will demarcate distinct eras. Like, the pre-serial era and the post-serial era. That is right. So, thank you for saying that. I know what you mean. I know what you mean. So, serial is when podcasting, for people who, like, do this professionally, that is, like, the... before Christ and after Christ. Not to say that, you know, Serial and the This American Life team is Christ, but are they? But like, yeah, that was when they became much more professionalized. Ad sales became a thing. Before that, it wasn't really that kind of scene. So I have been in the space since before Serial was a thing, which is a long time. That's like a, like, I've been making podcasts professionally in some capacity for over 10 years. And I remember seeing an advertisement for a podcast that was called The Flaming Sword of Justice. I know, weird name, but it was hosted by my good friend and former boss, Ben Wickler, who is now the chair of the Wisconsin Democratic Party. You've probably seen him on TV like he in Madison, Wisconsin. He's a big deal. But he was working on this podcast project. It was him and the late Aaron Swartz. If you know him, he was this very prolific figure in the fight for digital rights, fight for an open Internet. Our buddies at Cool Zone did an entire deep dive episode into him. He is a fascinating person, a personal hero. Definitely, definitely think folks should look into his story because it is one that is really tragic, but also one that is like full of hope for a better Internet landscape. And Aaron felt strongly that all of the highs and lows and wins and losses of the fight for social justice and social change and the fight for an open Internet, we should tell those stories the way that we tell other kinds of stories that have romance and David versus Goliath and good conquering over evil. And that if we told these stories in that kind of way that we can make people understand what was at stake and then want to take some sort of action. So I saw this call for applicants for this podcast that him and Ben Wickler had put together. And I was like, this is perfect for me. This is so many things that I like. Only problem was I had not I had never edited audio before. Right. So I put together a resume full of lies, just like straight up fabrications about my skills. literally I think I might have googled podcast resume and then I just copied and pasted whatever it said and put it on my resume and I was like whatever what are they what are they gonna do like I hope this is on this is a hail mary anyway and I remember at the time I was living in DC and the job was in Brooklyn and so I was like I'm already like a super super long shot anyway anyway anyway I got the job so then I was like fuck now I have to learn how to use all these tools I lied about on my resume. Luckily, YouTube existed. And this was so early days that nobody really knew about podcasting. Nobody had a college degree in podcasting. So truly, you could have said anything and this learns it on the fly. And that was my first job in podcasting. At that point, I was a producer. So I was really behind the mic helping Ben, who was the host, sound his best. And he was such a... If you've ever seen Ben Weckler speak, if you happen to live in Wisconsin or catch him on TV. He did not need a lot of help from me as a producer, but he was fantastic and a great person to learn from. I learned a lot about how to tell good stories from him and then how to tell stories with the gravitas that they deserve. And so from there, I remember every now and then I would be on mic. But at that point, I really thought, like, I am a behind-the-scenes girly. Like, I am, you know, my job is to make the show sound good, make the trains run on time, make sure the interview is good and make sure all of that. And, you know, I guess even thinking about it now, I think Ben was someone who saw something in me and was like, you'd actually be good on Mike. And it wasn't something that I, even though I had done like college radio and stuff, I didn't really trust my voice yet. And truly just getting the shot to make terrible content on microphone and then hearing it and cringing, really getting the space to learn and try, I think was opened up a whole lot of doors to me. And the podcast here on iHeart, well, it used to be Stuff Media, Stuff Mom Ever Told You, their hosts were leaving. And then a friend of mine, Emily Aries, was like, I'm coming on as the new host. I think you'd be great as a co-host. I was in Australia. And so I had to do that interview at like 4 a.m. on a Saturday for the time change. And it was just a lot. But I ended up getting the job as the co-host for Stuff Mom Never Told You. And early days were the hardest. Like I go back and listen to some of those episodes and I don't know what the hell I was talking about. But really, you just had to learn. You just had to like flex the muscle. And like the more exposure therapy to your own voice, the more you become kind of more confident about how you speak. And really just the more that you know and feel strongly about what you have to say. It's like really, that's, if anybody out there listening is thinking about becoming a podcaster or wants a job in podcasting or media, I would say like 80% of it is having a point of view and being able to express it clearly and having confidence in what you say. I'm a thousand percent sure that not everybody listening agrees to every take that I have. I hear about it sometimes and people don't and I am grateful for that. So I can confirm that to be true. But I think if you can present your point of view and say, here's how I feel, what do you think? People really respond to that. And so, yeah, I came to being a host in sort of a roundabout way, but it's not it's not anything I'm not doing anything that is particularly special or challenging. I firmly believe that podcasting is one of the more forgiving mediums because. It's long form, so people really have to engage with what you have to say. And even the podcast that I listen to every week and I'm obsessed with, I don't always agree with what they say. But there's something about hearing somebody express themselves and explain themselves in their own words and make a case for how they feel. If they tweet, if they condense that into a tweet, it's so easy. Or a short form post, it's so easy to be like, I don't agree. And like, now we're in a flame war. Podcasting, people really, it's just a different, the people who listen to podcasts, people who make them, It's a different kind of space. People are very forgiving. People want to hear challenging attitudes and opinions. And I don't know, I'm lucky that this is the medium that I'm in. We did a whole meeting with Cool Zone in the wake of Charlie Kirk's death where one of the things that came up was how, you know, there is something about it where, you know, we're not like, I don't want to say the wrong thing and like diminish the work of any other creator, but like, we're not like drama YouTubers or anything, right? I think that podcasting, the reason why I'm a podcaster and I feel very lucky to be in this space is that people listen to what you have to say and it's like a long form medium. And if somebody really wants to, you know, be combative about your opinion, they have to listen to like an hour of you speak plus ads. And I think it's so different from other communities online, like the YouTube community, which I really admire and I love and I'm not putting anybody down who is part of it. But I know it's not for me because YouTube has this culture of, you know, I'm going to respond to what this other creator said and then me responding to that creator. And then it's like there's so many levels where you don't even remember the take that somebody is responding to anymore. That is so not my ministry. And I think that being in podcasting as a medium, I think it like is a little bit protective of some of the kind of back and forth that happens in other media. More after a quick break. Run a business and not thinking about podcasting? Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ad-supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. So whatever your customers listen to, they'll hear your message. Plus, only iHeart can extend your message to audiences across broadcast radio. Think podcasting can help your business? Think iHeart. Streaming, radio, and podcasting. Let us show you at iHeartAdvertising.com. That's iHeartAdvertising.com. Hi this is Jo Winterstein host of the Spirit Daughter Podcast where we talk about astrology natal charts and how to step into your most vibrant life And I just sat down with a mini driver The Irish traveler said when I was 16 you going to have a terrible time with men Actor, storyteller, and unapologetic Aquarian visionary. Aquarius is all about freedom loving and different perspectives. And I find a lot of people with strong placements in Aquarius are misunderstood. A sun and Venus in Aquarius in her seventh house spark her unconventional approach to partnership. He really has taught me to embrace people sleeping in different rooms, on different houses, in different places, but just an embracing of the is-ness of it all. If you're navigating your own transformation or just want a chart-side view into how a leading artist integrates astrology, creativity, and real life, this episode is a must-listen. Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcast. I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan. He became the first Bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it all, I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand and ended in a courtroom, with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. Please search for it. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. This season, an epic battle of he said, she said, and the search for accountability in a sea of lies. I have done nothing except get pregnant by the f***ing bachelor! Listen to Love Trapped on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car? When you look at your car, you're going to become overwhelmed. with such good feelings. Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you? I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused. Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. NLP, aka Neuro Linguistic Programming, is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics, and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain. It's about engineering consciousness. Mind Games is the story of NLP. its crazy cast of disciples, and the fake doctor who invented it at a New Age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all? NLP might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 1969, Malcolm and Martin are gone. America is in crisis. And at Morehouse College, the students make their move. These students, including a young Samuel L. Jackson, locked up the members of the Board of Trustees, including Martin Luther King Sr. It's the true story of protest and rebellion in Black American history that you'll never forget. I'm Hans Charles. I'm Menelik Lumumba. Listen to The A-Building on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's get right back into it. All right, so this is our final question. Scarlet wrote in with a really great set of four different questions that we are going to do as a bit of a lightning round. So I'll read the first question, and then we'll each go around and say our answers, and we have, let's say, like 60 seconds to justify your answer. uh how's that sound that sound good that sounds good that sounds good that sounds good to me yeah okay so scarlet writes uh i've been listening to your show for about two years now you're one of my favorite parasocial podcast friends uh i enjoy and appreciate the thoughtful analysis empathy and curiosity you bring to tech news cutting through the bs cult of capitalism thank you scarlet uh okay so here's the questions joey you're up first what is your favorite movie with techie themes and why first thing that comes to mind uh i have mentioned on the show before i am a big fan of the movie ex machina uh a i love oscar isaac i'll watch anything that he's in but uh b i think the way that the movie talks about technological advancements and like the capitalism behind tech you know that whole sort of thing but also like how that pertains to like sex and sexuality and like exploitation of women and women's bodies um that really spoke to me when i saw that movie and that was like one of the first movies that i saw that really dived into that topic so yeah big fan of that movie love that movie one more really quick that i want to shout out it's kind of an anti-favorite oh well no it's more like a movie that used to be one of my favorites and now it's disappointed me and that is um the iron man franchise particularly the first iron man movie um i was talking about on the show before i've talked about this on the show before i've also mentioned many times I'm a big Marvel fan I still to this day I'm a big Marvel fan I used to love that movie when I was a kid and I honestly anytime I try to watch it now it just feels so depressing because it is such a like product of its time it is such a like most superhero movies are very pro-military industrial complex like to an extent this is like the poster child of that it is such a portrait of just the Afghanistan war, Iraq war era, war on terror, all of that. And watching it now, it's a movie about a tech billionaire being really cool. And I don't know, some of that stuff didn't really age super well in our current world that we're living in, is all I'm saying. But yeah, that's my second answer to that question. Can't leave it at one, sorry. I have to say, I've never seen an Iron Man movie. we've talked about this I feel like we should do a watch party at some point I want to hear your thoughts there's a lot of weird like post 9-11 racism and shit it's interesting it's interesting to see how it aged you know it is it's wild to think that that movie is over 20 years old it is over 20 years old no it is not no it is not is that true It is not. I'm 26. It came out in 2008. Hang on. Wait. Okay. Okay. But it can buy cigarettes. Okay. Moving along with the lightning round. Bridget, what is your favorite movie with techie themes and why? Eternal Sunshine of a Spotless Mind. You might not be thinking of it as a tech movie, but it's a tech movie kind of the same way that the movie Her is a tech movie. I like movies that don't necessarily feel like tech movies, but are about new technologies and the way that they would actually, you know, shape our lives. I think that oftentimes when we're talking about tech, it feels very sci-fi. I like that the movie shows all of the emotional hangups and relational hangups that that kind of the availability of that kind of technology might actually show. And I like it because, again, oftentimes when we're talking about tech, I feel like we poo-poo the sort of everyday ways that technology keeps you from getting over your ex or helps you get over your ex. I like the applicable real world application of tech in that in that universe. It's funny you say Eternal Sunshine because like so I do really like that movie. But the first time I watched it, I was like actively a grad student in a neuroscience lab. And I was like, it doesn't work like that. Oh, no shit. It doesn't work that way. Wow. I still haven't seen it. So maybe we'll do an episode. Joey, okay. You have to see it. But I, yeah. My favorite Tekken movie. I'm going to go with Terminator 2. Ooh, that's a good one. I don't know how y'all just like left that sitting out there. I actually still have yet to see Terminator 2. Oh, wow. You should watch it. I did watch the first one recently. I mean, it's like genre defining. and it's just like a really good movie it's really fun action-packed uh and also i think it's some of those like themes that joy was talking about with iron man of uh like military industrial complex uh some of the like more nightmare scary scenarios of ai uh you know it feels surprisingly relevant and also it deals with time travel which is just a personal favorite topic of mine like pretty much any movie that involves time travel i'm gonna watch and enjoy also the entire like all of humanity is saved by that kid who played budnick on salute your shorts the like redhead kid by knowing instinctively to lie to the cops where it's like have you seen this kid no i don't know him you know like thank god for lying to the police all right so the final question in the lightning round uh scarlet put us up to this so we have to do it uh it's a popular game that people probably know because we are broadcasting we're gonna call it fuck marry exile so we list three people uh one of them you have to fuck the other one you have to marry and then The other one just gets exiled somewhere, maybe to Mars. I don't know. But you know the implication of what's happening. You know the implication. So, Dennis, I mean, Joey. Musk, Zuckerberg. Okay, okay. No, I'm just kidding. I can't even come up with you with another character in that because Dennis is the worst, objectively. I think I'm more of a Charlie. I'm a Charlie. I am in no way comparing you to Dennis. thank you that's a question for another day which character I'm Frank yes can confirm Bridget is Frank alright so Joey you are up Musk Zuckerberg Bezos fuck Mary Exile Exile Musk fuck that I'm sorry he I they're all objectively bad but here's the thing there's something about Elon Musk that I know that if I had to be in a room with him for more than like 10 seconds like hands would be thrown this is not illegal I'm not legally saying this is what I would do however hands would be thrown and things would be happening whatever Elon Musk exiled Bezos I would marry him because you know what i saw what his ex-wife got in the in the divorce i feel like he i can figure out a prenup that would work uh it pays exactly zuckerberg i guess he's the fuck because you know what i if it's if it's jesse eisenberg as zuckerberg that's perfect you can just close your eyes and pretend exactly thank you for your candor thank you who do you got mike i'm i i know yeah i mean i think i'm actually gonna go with the same set as joey uh musk has to get out of there just exile him he wants to go to mars anyway let him uh bezos would probably marry just because he seems like the least psychopathic of them all maybe that makes him the most psychopathic i don't know but like i feel you could have an enjoyable evening with bezos in a way that would just not be possible with the others and then that leaves me banging zuckerberg which like i'm definitely not excited about uh but it does like work out a lot i guess so i'm i'm stuck too i love that exiling musk that's an easy one for all of us we're like get him out of here none of us want to have any sexual relations with elon musk at all there was a i think a poll on x the other night that like you're you're sitting next to elon musk and you can say three words what are your top three words and the top choice was kill yourself now oh i saw that i saw that which is like pretty mean and like he should not kill himself but like god damn never tell anybody to kill himself but also if you're in full anyone, Nicole. I mean, I will say, there's not even part, like, I was like, well, is it, is there a, because, like, you don't have to like somebody or, like, enjoy somebody's company to be interested in what sex with them would be like, and I keep asking myself, is there any reality? Unfortunately for me, maybe that's just me. Maybe that's just me. You don't have any interest in somebody that want to have sex with them. Bridget Todd. Yeah, go on, Frank. Maybe I'm alone in this. And if I am, I'll own it. But I keep wondering, so, like, can I see that ever being the case with Musk? I can't even picture. I can't even, like, no part of me is even curious, even, like, a grotesque curiosity. Nothing. I can't even imagine, like, doing drugs with him would be fun. No. I can't. Grimes, girl, are you okay? Please. So, Musk, we have to get out of there. it's between marrying Bezos or Zuckerberg or fucking them. Let me think. Bezos, I think, treats his wife pretty well. I think he sent her in a space. He bought her Vogue, allegedly. He's buying her the Met Ball. I've seen the emails he wrote to her that are like, a live girl. A live girl. I can't see being married to him. So I guess, but I don't want to have sex with Mark Zuckerberg. He's also like sloppy seconds for me and Joey at this point too. I know. Coming in for the scraps. Okay. Classic prank. Classic prank. Yeah. You know what? Fuck it. I'll go Zuckerberg. I'll go Zuckerberg. I'll be third in line for Zup. Picture Jesse Eisenberg. I'm so sorry, listeners. Listeners, if you are throwing up from this segment, you can thank Scarlett. tell us which it's always funny Philadelphia character yes leave it in the comments and also which one is all of us yeah let us know in the Spotify comments your fuck Mary exile and which always sunny character you are I am Frank Joey is Charlie let's go oh who am I I think you might be Mac Mac that feels like a particularly poor fit i do enjoy karate yeah is there a better sitcom we could be like new girl or something oh i don't watch that oh oh my god we're old and terrible we talk about community community yeah i'm i'm i'm somewhere between abed and troy yeah i'm somewhere between abed and troy same uh-huh yeah if you're listening to this show you are probably you're like i identify somewhere as like either a troy or an op-ed in the middle you know i completely agree not a lot of shirley's tuning into their who's to say who's to say not a lot of all right so now that we are closing out bridget and mike i have a question what is your and this is a little bit broad but if you could have a tech prediction for 2026 something's gonna happen what would it be and it could be anything if you're like i think they're gonna make a movie that's all ai and also leonardo dicaprio that's i don't know yeah i think that the vibes on TikTok are going to get weird and not so good when the deal goes through for American ownership. I also think all the little things that we all get fed up on that we talk about on the show all the time, things like dynamic and predictive pricing, things like, oh, when you have a flight and they screw you over at the airport, they no longer have to give you money. I think the consumer is rising up. I think that the consumer has had enough. The consumer, we are fed up. I think we are, I think anybody can plainly see that we are all being screwed over. And I think that this is something that has vast, like transpartisan support. I think that no matter where you are ideologically, nobody likes getting screwed over. And I think that the amount of ways that we are all getting screwed over is growing every goddamn day. And so I think that we are going to start seeing it become a more popular thing that people, consumers are rising up against really just the use of technology to siphon every dime we have to make some rich guy richer that's my hope but i also think that might be happening in 2026 love it uh i am gonna predict that we in 2026 we will see the ai hype bubble start to burst and i think it's gonna burst in like unusual ways like i don't think all of a sudden one day nvidia stock is going to drop to zero and like nobody's gonna ever use ai again like obviously i don't think it's gonna be like that but i think we're already seeing people uh the voices of people pushing back against ai gaining traction and consensus forming that actually audiences and workers do not want AI slop shoved to them from like every screen that is possible. And in fact, there are a lot of things that people are trying to force AI into our lives to do that it's just like really categorically bad at doing um and so i'm i guess optimistic that in 2026 uh we will see that like absurd hype really start to to tamp down and course correct in some kind of way i hope so i mean that kind of speaks to my prediction and i I think shit has to course correct. Everybody hates where we're going. Yeah. Seriously. I was going to say, I mean, mine was going to be, which adding onto that, I think the AI entertainment industry emphasis specifically. My hope, again, my hope, who's to say what will actually happen, is that that's going to just fall apart. because I feel like that's something recently that I see that I'm like it makes me so sad to see like this is something that is such a like beautiful expression of like creative output and then and like yet we are turning into computers or whatever it's there's creatives that I really love who I've really respected for years and now we're like actually AI is great and I'm like this is really disappointing to see uh so I don't know that's yeah no I agree with all of you um I hope, my prediction is just that you know, it's interesting. I feel like this whole decade has kind of been a whole like, people, like, young people are rejecting all of these new technological advances. They're in more, like, analog methods. And I think there is going to be a continuation of that. Like, I do really think there is going to be a continuation of that. I have a, like, disposable camera that I've been using that I was like out with friends last night that I was taking pictures with for Thanksgiving this past month I had it out with some cousins and they were like oh my god like wait I heard that was like a thing with this like like the young people are taking photos with the analog cameras again I'm like yeah because like literally I don't have any physical photos to like me and my friends and that was something recently that like had motivated me to be like I want to bring this camera out i want to get these photos uh but yeah i i think there is we're at a weird point we're at a weird point and and all this where it's like i really do hope there are certain things where it's like yes technology is a tool it helps us deal with all these things that we do need to deal with but also when it comes to art when it comes to to music photography visual art we're gonna have a sort of resurges of people wanting to do these like analog hands-on things. So we'll see. We'll see. What beautiful visions for the future of our shared tech landscape. Mike, Joey, thank you for this. We took some, this was a wild one. Let us know what you all thought about this. We have more emails to come. So yeah, thanks to you two for taking this sort of walk down memory lane with us. And thanks, everyone, for listening. Happy New Year. I'll talk to you soon. Happy New Year, everybody. Happy New Year. If you're looking for ways to support the show, check out our merch store at tangoti.com slash store. Got a story about an interesting thing in tech or just want to say hi? You can reach us at hello at tangoti.com. You can also find transcripts for today's episode at tangoti.com. There Are No Girls on the Internet was created by me, Bridget Todd. It's a production of iHeartRadio and Unbossed Creative Edited by Joey Patt Jonathan Strickland is our executive producer Tari Harrison is our producer and sound engineer Michael Amato is our contributing producer I'm your host, Bridget Todd If you want to help us grow, rate and review us on Apple Podcasts For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, check out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts Hi, it's Jill Winterstein, host of the Spirit Daughter Podcast, where we talk about astrology, natal charts, and how to step into your most vibrant life. And today I'm talking with my dear friend, Krista Williams. It can change you in the best way possible. Dance with the change, dance with the breakdowns. The embodiment of Pisces intuition with Capricorn power moves. So I'm like delusionally proud of my chart. Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton Eckerd. In 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it all, I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn. A one-night stand would end in a courtroom. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Adventures of Curiosity Cove podcast, When peanut butter disappears from school, Ella, Scout, and Layla launch a full detective mission. Their search leads them back in time to meet a brilliant inventor whose curiosity changed the world. And this Black History Month adventure, asking questions, thinking creatively, can lead to amazing discoveries. Listen to Adventures of Curiosity Cove every Monday from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car? When you look at your car, you're going to become overwhelmed with such good feelings. Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you? I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused. Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. Mind Games, a new podcast exploring NLP, a.k.a. neurolinguistic programming. Is it a self-help miracle, a shady hypnosis scam, or both? Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.