Under The Cover Of Night: The Nightingale Podcast

Vianne & Isabelle

8 min
May 2, 2021almost 5 years ago
Listen to Episode
Summary

Vianne and Isabelle answer viewer questions about their experiences during World War II, discussing their motivations for joining the resistance, pivotal moments of defiance against Nazi occupation, personal relationships, and the emotional toll of wartime decisions. The casual Q&A format reveals intimate details about their wartime choices and post-war reconciliation.

Insights
  • Personal agency and self-preservation can coexist with resistance—Isabelle's decision to fight came from recognizing her unique position as an underestimated woman, not purely altruism
  • Moral courage often emerges from accumulated exhaustion rather than grand ideological commitment—Vianne's defiance began with a single act of hiding refugees, not a pre-planned strategy
  • Post-war silence and burden-bearing were deliberate choices to protect loved ones' futures and self-perception, suggesting complex ethical frameworks around truth-telling in trauma recovery
  • Regret in wartime centers on incomplete information and unintended consequences—Vianne's greatest regret stems from not fully understanding the implications of her actions before acting
Trends
Oral history and personal testimony as primary sources for understanding WWII resistance movementsReframing women's wartime roles beyond traditional narratives of victimhood or heroismIntergenerational trauma and the deliberate withholding of information as a form of parental protectionPodcast format enabling intimate, conversational historical narratives with contemporary accessibility
Topics
French Resistance during Nazi occupationWomen's roles in WWII resistance movementsMoral decision-making under totalitarian regimesPost-war reconciliation and family secretsPsychological impact of wartime traumaEthical dilemmas in resistance activitiesPersonal agency versus collective survivalBurden of knowledge and silence in familiesHiding refugees and civilians from persecutionTorture and interrogation under Nazi occupation
People
Antoine
Vianne's husband; she withheld information about Julian's paternity to preserve their post-war marriage and fresh start
Sophie
Vianne's daughter; Vianne struggled to inform her of Sarah's death during wartime
Julian
Vianne's son; she concealed his paternity as Von Richter's child to protect him from self-resentment
Daniel
Vianne's child; mentioned as equally loved despite different parentage circumstances
Rachel
Jewish refugee hidden by Vianne in her barn cellar, representing her first act of Nazi defiance
Ari
Jewish refugee hidden alongside Rachel in Vianne's barn cellar
Captain Beck
Nazi officer to whom Vianne provided a list of names, resulting in deaths she deeply regrets
Von Richter
Nazi officer and biological father of Vianne's son Julian, conceived under coercive circumstances
Sarah
Vianne's friend who died as a consequence of the names Vianne provided to Captain Beck
Quotes
"I just wanted to fight for France because no one else was sticking up for France. And who would think a woman would be out there fighting for France?"
Isabelle
"I was just tired of having to be strong for everyone, so I decided I'd be strong for myself."
Vianne
"I couldn't break his heart because all of our hearts had already been broken by the war. And I didn't tell Julian because I would never want him to think that he was a creation of hate."
Vianne
"I should have prompted him more about what it was before I gave those names because in the end it cost my friend her life and I'm sure countless others."
Vianne
Full Transcript
in love we find out who we want to be and where we find out who we are welcome back to under the cover of night with vianne and isabel today we're gonna be we're probably gonna edit that what are we doing what are we doing okay wait what do you mean we're reading questions that our viewers sent in. Today we're reading questions that our viewers sent in. Personal questions. So Isabel do you want to start? Guess I'll start. Okay. Okay. First question came in says why did you want to join the resistance? It's a hard one. I just wanted to fight for France because no one else was sticking up for France. And who would think a woman would be out there fighting for France? You know, they're going to expect men. So I was kind of undercover. So proud of you. I know. Now you hated me. I still kind of hate you, but it's okay. Okay, I'll go. So my first question is, what is your favorite memory from before the war? I wanted to eat this cupcake. Why do you have to eat it right now? Yeah, because it's good. Okay, what is your favorite memory from before the war? I'd have to say the picnic the summer before the war started in Laura Valley that I took with Antoine and Sophie. It was the prettiest day that I can remember. The grass was green and there were butterflies everywhere and we set up in this field and it was just beautiful. gag I just kidding shut up Isabelle um my next one is do you love Vianne Yeah. That's all I'm going to say. Sure. Sure, period. That's it. I'm not saying anything else. Oh, I'm glad nobody asked me that. Sorry. That's on me. That's on me. This one's so bad. It's so funny. Okay. My next question is, what made you decide to finally defy the Nazis? I think I was just tired of having to be strong for everyone, so I decided I'd be strong for myself. And I think the first time that I really defied the Nazis was when I hid Rachel and Ari in the cellar in the barn. That was my first realization that I can defy the Nazis and I can get away with it, and this is what I should be doing instead of keeping my head down and staying quiet. So that was the flip for me. Isabel. Oh my gosh. This one's kind of cringey. The other one was kind of cringey. How do you feel about Kayton? Well, how do you feel? He's a hottie with a body. What can I say? Yeah, but, I mean, he was kind of... I don't know. We have to redo this episode. No, we have to cut it. Cut what? Cut it. Cut it, yeah. Shut up. You're silent and dying. You spit cupcake all over my paper. It's really flaky. What's the last thing you said so we can... Just answer your question. Potty with a body, that's the last thing. You got it. That's all I had to say. Okay The next question for me I should have wrote out my answer Shut up for a second Just eat your cupcake Can you edit this episode Can I edit this episode Yeah You have the anchor app But you want to log into it I might just get angry, but sure. Because we're halfway in it now. Yeah. We're like, let's see. five minutes in four minutes in okay go when telling sophie that sarah had died what was going through your mind honestly the thought that kept going through my mind was why do i always have to be the strong one and what kind of benevolent god would do such a thing so i didn't really know how to tell her and i tried to handle it as best i could but in the end it's hard news to hear and She didn't take it well, which it was hard for me to give anyways. Next question I have is, was there ever a moment where you thought this is it? Well, when they finally found me and broke into my cabin that we were all staying in, they beat me until I got knocked out. Then I was tied up and tortured because they found out I was the nightingale. Or they wanted to know who the nightingale was. They didn't know it was me. But they knew I had connections, even though it was me. And I thought that was it. I thought this was it. That's when you were going to die? Yeah. Then Dad took the fall. Rest in peace. No, don't even do that. Okay. I'll rub you. No. I knew you were going to be. We're going to sit. Okay. Okay, next question. Why did you never tell anyone Julian was Vaughn Richter's son? I never told Antoine because we all desperately needed a fresh start after the war and I just couldn ruin the second chance that we were given I couldn't break his heart because all of our hearts had already been broken by the war. And I didn't tell Julian because I would never want him to think that he was a creation of hate. No matter the circumstances, I love Julian just as much as Sophie and Daniel. I would never want him resenting himself because of who his father truly was. It was a burden that I was willing to bear on my own. One of the last questions I'm going to read calms it down from the rest of the questions. What was the worst part about being in a boarding school? Just the manners. I don't like acting like a girly girl. It was annoying when I had to use several forks and several knives. Why can't I just use one fork and one knife? Or not even a knife. I don't know. You're not very good at keeping your mouth shut. I got kicked out of a bunch of clothes. Yeah. Exhibit A. Exhibit A. Eating a cupcake. My last question that was sent in was... My last question that was... Stop! Go ahead. My last question that was sent in was, what was your biggest regret from the war? I would say giving the list of names to Captain Beck. I should have prompted him more about what it was before I gave those names because in the end it cost my friend her life and I'm sure countless others. that's all the questions that i have that's all the questions i have well then i guess this podcast is over yes we're done this was the nightingale podcast with isabel and vianne bye