Healing Power of Music: Marc Ribler on Resilience and Personal Stories"

Music saved me. I'm your host Lynn Hoffman. Now if you enjoy this podcast, thank you so much. I host another one called Comedy Saved Me. And also I wanna tell you about Buzz Knight who hosts an awesome in-depth music history podcast called Taken a Walk. And the newest podcast to the Buzz Knight Media family, Taken a Walk Nashville with Sarah Harrelson at the helm, who by the way is killing it on the podcast charts and getting rave reviews. You might wanna check her out too while you're at it. Today's guest is a powerhouse of passion and purpose. Singer, songwriter, guitarist, producer and musical director for Little Stephen Van Zandt and The Disciples of Soul. From gigging in New York clubs as a teenager to writing billboard hits like Anything at All, to building the beloved Mark Ribbler and Friends Showcase at the McLoone's in Asbury Park, Mark Ribbler lives and breathes music. He's written and produced songs for artists around the world. He's scored films and jingles and commercials. And he always shows up with relentless energy, often 18 hours a day. This guy is an unstoppable force because music has always been his lifeline. Now, Mark sees music, he's told me this personally, as the ultimate way to process life's joys and struggles, fight for what's right and keep the dream alive. So whether music saved him or he's been saving it for the rest of us, this is gonna be a very special edition of Music Saved Me. My dear friend and incredibly talented musician, Mark Ribbler joins me on Music Saved Me right after this. Don't go anywhere, you don't wanna miss it. This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human. No gloss, no filter, just stories, spoken without fear. A person who is not generous cannot be an artist. The world will be at peace only when it is ruled by poets and philosophers. Listen to my weekly podcast, the Pooja Bhat Show on the I Heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Come for the honesty, stay for the fire. Music Saved Me. Mark Ribbler, welcome to Music Saved Me. It is so great to have you on the show. Finally, it took me like what, four years to get you here. Please check out our other shows. It's so great to see you. I'm doing well, busy, which is good. You know, keeps me out of trouble. And your studio looks beautiful, almost as beautiful as you. Oh, Mark. And your introduction is very sweet and overwhelming. So thank you for that. Well, that's what I aim to do. But it's only the truth, honestly. It really is. You're an incredible person. You're an incredible human being. You've had quite an incredible life. And music's been a very big part of it. Before we even get started when we were texting so I could get you on the show, I was watching the Dick Cavett, where Mark is actually walking into Dick Cavett's house to do a music video called Dick Cavett, which is hilarious. You can catch it on YouTube. There's a lot of famous people that join him. I wanna know, how did you talk Dick Cavett into this? And also you texted me and said that you were also on the set of a film set last week. So what are you up to? Well, at the moment, filming a very, it's a very moving documentary about soldiers that have been musicians their whole life, but have also served in the military. Most of the people I'm working with have seen action from Vietnam to the Gulf War. So it's a group of soldiers and basically telling their stories about how they used music to deal with life after the military, PTSD. And it's so moving. The stories of these people, from people that were in this one gentleman, Chuck Thomas was in Desert Storm and they bombed the village that he was in. And it was friendly fire and there were chemicals involved and he's been dealing with, for 35 years, he's been dealing the repercussions of this bombing and the government will pay for his treatment, but they won't tell him what it was that caused his illness. So, I mean, the guy's struggling with this his whole life. Really, another woman, young girl actually, who, she was in the service, dealing with depression after leaving the service, was talked about ending her life. And now, in the midst of this documentary, I'm like the music director drill sergeant for all these soldiers. So I'm kind of getting the band in shape and we're gonna do a performance. So it's an ongoing filming project, probably for another two weeks and then we do a show in Tarrytown, New York at the Irvington Theater on April 9th with the soldiers, with the military band playing rock and roll. Just to see this girl, like I asked her to sing one of the songs that she wasn't supposed to sing. And she's gone from this person that was in a very kind of sad and low place and she's flowering like before our eyes. And we attribute it to the healing power of music. It's very powerful. It really is. It's quite a blessing to be around. It's like, hey, we do what we do and we're instruments of God or of the universe, whatever it is. But when you touch people's lives, you realize that there's importance to our actions. I'm really happy to be in this situation right now. Yeah, and it's a perfect timing for this podcast because this is what we're all about, about exactly what you're talking about. What's this documentary going to be called? Do you have a working title or where people can keep them a look for it? It's called The Sounds of Valor. It's being produced by a gentleman named Mike Campbell and Jordan Campbell, no relation is the director and a friend of mine who's been a cameraman and creative director back in the day. He did all the Tiger Woods commercials. So these are like his family from years ago that now are making these amazing documentary films. And my friend's name is Tom Parr. So Tom kind of introduced me to these people a couple of months ago and now we're halfway through making this film and it's been really positive. Yeah, but it's very fulfilling and how interesting because I met you because you joined my merry band of documentary makers as well, which we'll talk about in a minute. But I wanna start, because you had mentioned just now how it's fulfilling for you, but I wanna go back to the beginning of when you, Mark Ribbler, were introduced to music and when you were growing up, when did you first decide this is something I really dig? Well, I remember as far back as going to public school in Brooklyn, the alarm clock, the old school alarm clock with the dial on it was dialed into WABC New York and every morning, whatever it was, like in the movie Groundhog Day, it seemed like every morning, the song Mel Yellow by Donovan would be the wake up at 6.30 a.m. or whatever time it was that we got off for school. So, I mean, I feel very blessed, like we were born in a renaissance, which didn't happen for 200 years. The last renaissance was Beethoven and Mozart and Bach. This renaissance was the Beatles, Bob Dylan, Jimi Hendrix. I mean, the depth and just the depth of the creativity and music that these people were making in the mid-60s, really the mid-60s through the mid-70s when I was absorbing all this incredible-ness. So, we're just, even today, like I feel anything new that I really like is a throwback to what I grew up with. It's influenced by those bands and I think another reason the tribute thing is so populous is because people are craving, they're craving great live music and there's great singer-songwriters today. There's many and we're exposed to so many more because of social media. We grew up at the pinnacle of creativity. Even I just remember listening through radio, I felt connected. It made me feel like, oh, this is what it means to be alive. And a few years later, probably when I was 11, my cousin had a guitar and I was visiting him. We'd moved from Brooklyn to New Jersey, which was an incredible culture shock. Growing up in the projects in Brooklyn, my friends were black and Jewish and Italian and Puerto Rican and Irish. And we moved to the Burbs in Jackson, New Jersey and it was just quite different. I never experienced seeing bigotry or, so it was a major transition. So whenever I would go back to Brooklyn, it was like a homecoming. Anyway, my cousin had this guitar and it was like a holy grail shining in the corner of the room and that was the day that my life's purpose began. When I was 11. You were drawn to it, it called to you. When did you realize that music was magical? I mean, being drawn to it's one thing, but when did you realize it actually had power that was beyond just the notes? Well, it probably goes back to listening, listening to the radio when I was a kid, I would be transported by, say a little prayer for you, Deon Warwick or a Bob Dylan song stuck inside a mobile with the Memphis blues again. You listen to the song and it transports you to another realm. It's like watching a movie, listen to a Bob Dylan song. The lyrics are so incredibly vivid. But once I became a musician at 11, I think I was probably the first time I was completely transported to another dimension playing music was when I was 13, the band I had at the time, we played a CYO dance and something transcendent happened in the room. It was like, aside from anything else, I mean, when I started playing music, I didn't even think of girls. So, I mean, a lot of my friends, yeah, I started playing guitar because I could meet girls. It's like that was the furthest thing from my mind. But I bet that changed quick when they started giving you the googly eyes from the front row. Exactly, the girls were googling it out and way before Google. And it was probably more like Barney Google eyes actually. And they, I remember we took a break and the girls were chasing us in the hallway, but the thing that happened in the performance was something took over our beings. And it's really hard to explain, but we entered another dimension of consciousness. And I mean, just the level, it was a high, it was an incredible high, and no one was doing drugs then, we were very young. Yeah. So that was the first time I realized that music is incredibly powerful. And I couldn't even intellectualize what was happening even to this day, other than I plugged into some other dimension, I plugged into the sun that day. Yeah, oh, that's a cool way of putting it. You're such a good, of course, you're a word master, you write songs. Now, can we transport a little bit into time now from that first experience to how you ended up the musical director for Little Stephen and the Disciples of Soul, because I've never really heard the story of how you two got together. So I got- I'm guessing New Jersey had something to do with it. New Jersey, at the time New Jersey, New York had everything to do with it. Stevie was living in New York and his studio was in New York, but certainly once we got acquainted, we realized that how deep both of our Jersey roots ran. But I got called, my friend Rich MacCurio was playing drums on the Darleen Love, introducing Darleen Love record that Stevie was producing. In the midst of the project, I don't know where the guitar players couldn't make a session and Richie told Stephen, you should call my friend Mark, and I think you guys would hit it off. It was the last song on the record, a song written by Bruce called Night Closing In. We did the basic tracks with the band, with drums, bass, keyboards, guitar. Spent a couple hours with Steven, kind of experiencing his wizardry as an arranger, because he's, aside from probably arranging, is probably his favorite thing in the world to do. And so we spent a couple hours arranging the song, then he told the rhythm section to leave, but he asked me to stay, and we spent hours overdubbing guitars. He was trying to recreate a Phil Spector arrangement on this Darleen Love track. And so Phil would have four acoustic guitar players playing the same part. Everyone would be recording at the same time. In modern recording, you have the option of not having to hire four guitar players. You can have one guitar player do it four times, the same part. So we would do four acoustic guitars, four electric guitars, four electric 12 string guitars. So we kept throwing things at me, and some of it was challenging, but I think in the course of the day, we realized that we have this common thread in our spirit. It's like we both want this to be great, and we're both willing to work hard for it, and we just connected. We started talking about New Jersey, realizing all the common ground, Kevin Kavanaugh, who he hired for Southside Johnny to be the keyboardist, was a close friend of his, very close friend of mine, realizing all the common ground, and we just made a connection that day, and I didn't hear from him for a couple months, and then my dear friend Ken Dashow, who's from Q104.3 in New York, I'm sure you know Ken very well. I love Kenny. Is it okay to call him Kenny, I wonder? I love Ken. Yeah, you can call him Kenny. He's the best. Yeah, he's so casual. And so, and our other dear friend, Mark Rivera, we were doing Ken's show, Breakfast with the Beatles, which he does every Sunday morning. This was one of the Beatles' birthdays. I think it was George's birthday, and Stevie was the guest. It was me, Mark, and Stevie. So we did this sort of unplugged some Beatles songs, if I needed someone. God, you remember. Yeah, yeah, it was a profound day. It's like, oh, Steven's here. It's like, and he wasn't sure of some chords. So I told him the chords of a couple of the songs, and it just reaffirmed our connection. Yeah. Then six months later, his assistant, Paul Osmoskis, Paul was coming out to my shows and stuff, and we became friends. Paul calls me out of the blue. He says, Steven told me to call you, because he wants you to put a band together for Darlene Love for her upcoming CD release, album release. They did one at the Paramount in Asbury Park, one at the Whiskey of Go-Go, and he wants me to be like her music director. And this is based on us meeting twice. Yeah, but you had the nerve, oh, not the nerve, but you had the chutzpah, I should say, to teach him the chords he didn't know live on the radio in New York. Right. So that takes a little something. You weren't scared to do it, and he probably respected that. That's right. I think Steven, as his Silvio character, that's part of Steven's personality. It's like, Steven's not a mafiosa, but it's like he wants it straight. He senses your pheromones changing if you're in fear. Yes. So yeah, so we connected right away. He realized we had this simpatico musicality and a spirit, so that's a good point, though. I think Steven realized that I wasn't afraid of him, because Steven, he can make you nervous if you don't know him. He makes people shake. Really? Yeah, yeah, he's a strong personality, and some people, they just want things to be light and fluffy, and that's not Steven. Although he can be very loving, and he's one of the most generous people I've ever met, but he's intense. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but you handle it well. Yeah, fortunately, my mom taught me well. Yeah, so we did the album releases, and then he says, you know, I want you to go on the road with Darlene. I want you to protect my arrangements, make sure that you have a great band for every show. And then we did, me, Steven and Darlene, we did the Cobraire show, the Cobraire show, and Elvis Costello was the guest that night. So her first single release was, oh, what's the name of the song? I can't remember the song, but Elvis wrote the song. Wow. And so Steven, I get to the Ed Sullivan Theater, and Steven calls me, he says, go down to Elvis's dressing room and teach him his song. Come on! Yeah. You have to go down and knock on the door? Yeah, exactly, yeah, without fear, you know? And by the way, Elvis Costello's one of my favorite singer-songwriters of all time. Oh, so no pressure there on top of everything else. So wait, how did you respond to him? Were you nervous or did you, no problem, I got it. No problem, yeah, it's like, you know, we're soldiers, you know, we're in the trenches. What are you thinking as you're walking to the dressing room door to Elvis Costello? Man, I mean, so many things are surreal, being a musician, you know, I've done this my whole life, but when you meet your people that have influenced you, or you're, I don't wanna say idols, you know, heroes, as you know, it's like a surreal experience, you know? It's like, I used to sit on my bedroom floor, cross-legged, with an album cover, separating stems and seeds and rolling joints on Paul McCartney's face, or Elvis Costello's, you know. And there he is. So I went down, you know, he was very gracious, I said, Stevie asked me to show you, you know, the updated version of your song. So I start showing him the chords, he goes, I wrote this? So Stephen completely, so he says, when I wrote this song, it was like a cowboy song, it was like a cowboy country song, and now it's this Phil Spector, man, I can't remember the title of this particular song, it'll come to me by the end of the interview. Or tonight you'll call me later. What, I remember, it's three in the morning. Exactly, exactly. Wow. So I said, well, this is what it is now. Elvis said, well, they have a guitar for me, right? I go, yeah, they have a guitar for you. He says, I may or may not plug the guitar in. Cause it was like, you know, it's like, how am I gonna remember this song that doesn't resemble the song I wrote? He loved it. Right, right. We went to the listening party, he loved the song and the arrangement, but he didn't consider how drastically the harmonization and the arrangement had changed. And how many minutes before you had to take the stage live? Probably, I think we had, we were just about to do sound check. So it was probably an hour and a half before taping. Wow. You know? Wow. And then Stevie arrived, John Batiste was the music director then, and we played the song with the band, and Darlene was wonderful as always. And it was great playing with, you know, Stevie on one side, Elvis Costello on the other side, three of us playing guitars. And you melded all of that because of who you are. You're just that glue that keeps everyone together. I get that from you immediately. And I know why Stephen entrusted you right away because it pours off of you. If anyone's ever met Mark before, they would agree with me, who I'm talking about. And even Mark Rivera too, just incredible thanks to him. That's how I know you. That's right. Yeah. So writing music is incredibly personal. What's your formula? And, you know, because you've put out a few albums since I've met you actually. Yeah, yeah. Fortunately, Stevie's signed me, Stevie's Vangana's label is Wicked Cool Records. And he signed me in the heart of the pandemic. And I mean, me and my girlfriend Camille were basically, it was the apocalypse as far as we were concerned. We're curbside pickup of food. We probably went through a case of, we were drinking wine every night. It was like, this is, what are we gonna do? Right? Yeah, yeah. I mean, everyone, it's like, this is like, thank God for streaming, for Netflix and good Spanish wine or Italian wine, you know? So anyway, in the midst of that, Steven called and just to see how things were, you know, maybe a month into the pandemic. And he said, what do you do, man? I go, well, I decided I gotta finish my record that I started when we went on the road three years ago. I put it aside, you know, to tour with you for three years. And now I'm finishing it. He said, oh, you're making a record. He's suspended to me, you know? So I sent it to him and he calls me back. He says, I got some good news and some bad news. I said, well, okay, what do you got? The good news is, I think there's a lot of great songs here. The bad news is, I don't think it's quite finished and I wanna finish producing the record with you. I said, well, Steven, that's, you know, the bad news is actually great news because, you know, he's one of my favorite arranger-producer. So we spent the next two months of the pandemic virtually, like I would record everything in my studio, send him rough mixes or the new parts that we came up with and getting him to sign off and we'd go back and forth. And it sort of, it kind of saved my existence during the pandemic. It gave me purpose, you know? Cause otherwise, you know, our wine bill was, you know, was going up, up, up. It was good. Somebody had to pay for all that wine. That's amazing though. Cause I remember getting in the car turning on serious to little Steven's underground garage channel. And hearing you and hearing your music. And it was amazing. And I think we had met just shortly before that. So I didn't realize that all went down right before I met you. That's right. Everything went down just before I met you. And we even got the pandemic behind. I think we met right as the pandemic was sort of subsiding a bit. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But it was probably, I think it was like April of 22 if I'm, that we met. Wow, please. Are you kidding me? Thanks to, thanks for, we have four years ago. That was a fast four year. Yeah, right? That's incredible. Well, you've just brought nothing but light into my life since I've met you. So I'm so grateful that, that you're spending some time with us and on the show today. Can I ask you a little bit of a personal question because you have such an incredible life outside of music. I mean, just your dad and your story of your family, where you came from. Could you share a little bit about that? And also I know you had some health issues that almost sidelined you permanently. And I wondered how music got you through that. And if there was any kind of suggestions for anyone going through a time that they could use. Yeah. Well, I'll tell you about my life, my health crisis. Yeah. And my parents were certainly, my parents were, I was very blessed with parents. They were both always incredibly supportive that I wanted to be a musician. Although my mom would, you know, she would have preferred if I went to college, I became a professional. Doctor or a lawyer, come on. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. I had the same. Right? So she was, at first she was maybe disappointed that her vision for my future wasn't met, but she realized how passionate I was. And then she got on board, you know? Yeah. So they were always supportive. In fact, even later in life, I had this residency at this club in Esveri Park, which you mentioned, MacLoon's separate club. And we played every Tuesday night, we'd play original music, and we'd play a tribute theme, like whether it be, you know, The Beatles, Jimi Hendrix, Allman Brothers, whatever, every week. My parents, and then they were in there in the late 70s, early 80s, every Tuesday, they had their table, they sat in the audience. My mom was like, you know, the mayor, she would hold court, everyone knew and loved my mom, my dad. But just to be able to play music every week and have them present was the greatest gift, you know? And my mom passed away almost seven years ago, but I feel like having that experience, and then I was on the road with Steven when she passed, but we got to spend the last three weeks of her life together, thanks to Steven, you know, deciding to hub from home and in the Northeast, you know? So anyway, I've been very blessed with parents, you know, my dad's still 93. Yeah, dad. I'm a dad still here, yeah, God bless him, you know. Just moved him into Florida, I love it. Yeah, he's living with my sister, takes great care of him in Florida, yeah, so. So the health thing, you know, being in the music business, you know, my entire life, it's incredibly stressful, you're constantly being rejected, you're constantly being, you know, you take a beating, you take an emotional beating, and you have to be willing to go through hell and back to survive in the music business. And it's not always that, and then you'll get, you get little gems that kind of lead you on to like hang in there, you know? Yes. But I never had a plan B, so I was going through whatever I had to go through. But, you know, showcasing for record labels, having songs go up the chart, and then they die because grunge music comes in, you know? You have like, I had songs flying up a chart with bands like Alias, you know, they used to be Sheriff, this guy Mitch Malloy, and then grunge comes out, and anything that was pop-oriented was over, you know? So I used to write a lot of pop rock songs with a lot of these hair bands and, you know, pop bands. So all these things, you know, occur, and you know, you're taking on all this stress, and everything's fine, you're surviving, and then all of a sudden, one day, I was living in Lower Manhattan, and I was playing guitar, I was actually busking at the South Street Seaport. You were, that's so cool! Yeah, yeah, it was a trip, you know? So playing for this incredible spectrum of all of humanity every day, and I made a living out it, like, I had a couple years with, you know, the music business, after grunge, you know, there was some years of like, we had to do other things to make a living, aside from writing and producing, you know? Yeah. And one day, I was playing, and I just kind of had some stomach pains, and that turned into, it sort of was exacerbating, and then I developed, I was developing ulcerative colitis. And I didn't know that at the time, but I went to a gastroenterologist, he diagnosed me as ulcerative colitis, you need to be on these drugs for the rest of your life. And I was like, I was a vegan then, I was jogging seven miles a day, I was sort of alternative leaning with all anything medical, you know? So it was like, I'm not gonna take these drugs the rest of my life, I'm gonna find some alternative way of healing. I went to a natural food person, this guy, David Jubb, who was from Tasmania, and he had a very rigid raw foods diet that I tried in all these detoxification, flushes, liver flushes, and gallbladder flushes, and my condition just kept getting worse. So finally, in the midst of this, this producer, David Z, who he produced Kenny Wayne Shepherd, and he produced Funky Town back in the day, he was also, he was Prince's engineer through all the years of hits. He loved my music, and he wanted to do, he said, would you come to Nashville, and I'd like to produce your record, you know? So I go to Nashville, I bring all my guitars, all my amps, drive down, we make this record, and he says, I'm gonna go shop your record now. And then, I don't know what happened, but he got called for another project, and he couldn't mix the record, that's what it was. So we got some mixes done, he sent it to a couple labels, and it was rejected. But in the course of traveling and putting all this emotion and energy into like, I'm getting my record deal, I'm finally gonna have, you know, I'm gonna have my record deal, I'm gonna have a record out, you know, I'm gonna have hit records, nothing happened, you know, and it exacerbated my ulcerative colitis. So literally, I was, I needed, I went into the hospital, this is October of 1999, and I spent four months in the hospital, and I had a surgery that saved my life, but I wasn't gonna have surgery. And I was, you know, I was on chemotherapy, because it's an autoimmune disease to slow your immune system down. I was addicted to pain meds, because the pain from ulcerative colitis, if anyone that's experienced it, it's incredibly intense. So anyway, when all was said and done, this surgeon came into the room one day and said, I think you need this surgery, and of course your condition's gonna keep getting worse. At this point, I was about 120 pounds. I'm six foot, I was very thin, you know. I had this surgery and this guy saved my life. The thing that kept me alive was, I couldn't, I didn't have the strength to play my guitar, but my guitar was in the corner of the room, and it was a beacon of light and hope for me. And I, like that's the thing I had to get back to. Yeah, so. It got you where you were, but pulled you back. Exactly, the same thing. The business of it, not the actual music. That's right, the business of, the business of music almost took me out, and the thought of continuing to make music and the healing power of music is what saved my life, literally. We'll be right back with more of the Music Saved Me podcast. No gloss, no filter, just stories, spoken without fear. Addiction is a disease, and it should be looked upon as any other disease. How did you cope with a reckless father like me? Join me, Pooja Bhatt, as I sit down every week with directors, actors, musicians, technicians, and beyond. You don't need to work with the biggest people and the biggest sound to have great music. I have gone through the sub-CD Hachakar, the Rish, the pinnacle, stung by the snake and I've fallen down again. Yeah, I am not writing actively anymore, and when I see my old work, it kind of saddens me. I'm only as good as the last shot that I gave. Mom's gone, but don't shut the theater. The show must go on. Listen to my weekly podcast, the Pooja Bhatt show, and the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Come for the honesty, stay for the fire. Welcome back to the Music Saved Me podcast. What would you give to an aspiring artist who has gone through trials and tribulations like you to maybe sidestep and ulcer? Yeah. Well, I wish, maybe when I was younger, I had some interest in yoga, things like that. Anything, any kind of stress management, it's like as musicians, as emotional people, we take everything, we take it to heart. We're empathetic by nature. So if you can come up with a healthy way to manage stress, whether it's yoga, meditation, exercise, eating healthy, as difficult as it is to be on the road and eat healthy, but just make the effort, because all these things will reduce stress. And if you, I mean, my Achilles heel was my colon. And I put all my stress in there and I got very sick. It's really about stress management, I think. Yeah, I agree. And keep going because you've made an entire career. You also were in other parts, which I found really fascinating. It's kind of part of my world where I started in commercials and things of that nature. Tell me about that experience a little bit. Maybe commercials people might remember, jingles. Yeah, well, the first jingle that I ever won was an STD HIV commercial by Trojan Condoms. Oh, fun. So we would joke, of course, but it wasn't Trojan Man. It wasn't Trojan Man. It was actually a very heartfelt song about respect and being responsible. So they sent the Ed agency sent me a 30 second video with some temp music that was in it, but it was a couple of holding hands on a couch. And then the caption says, 40% of people with HIV don't tell their partners. What? It blew my mind. I was so moved by whether it's like, are these, are these accurate? Real statistics, yeah, yeah, yeah. Real statistics, but I would think it just made me, it put me in this emotional place about it. It's like, hey, people get sick, people can be promiscuous and things happen. So if you know something about yourself, you need to be responsible. You can't just pretend that this doesn't exist. So I watched this picture and then I wrote this song that was called This Life. So I would approach Jigels as a songwriter. So I was basically thinking of it as a song that would be great for a score in this movie about this couple that needs to be responsible. And so I wrote this song, This Life, and we send it to the Ed agency and they love it, except they spent two months trying to change it. Like spinning my wheels for two months, can we start on a minor chord? Can we put it back to the major key? Can we make it a ballad? And they know nothing about music compositions. Yeah, they're not musicians, but I found that the people that work at agencies are scared to death of losing their job, of making a wrong decision. And then they'll put the producer and the artist on all these trips because from their fear, they're projecting all this on the project. Anyway, when all was said and done, after it was probably six weeks, felt like a year, we finally came back and they signed off on what the original song was. So all these changes were in vain, but at least it got us to the point where they signed off. The commercial was extremely controversial. There was a lot of like the gay community had issues with it. So it ran for two years, but under with a lot of... Pushback. Yeah. Pushback, you know? The funny thing was after the song was on the TV and radio for like a month, I started getting, I literally got thousands of emails. This is the early day of the internet, you know, social media. It was the days of MySpace, you know? And 2006, I believe it was. And people were going to my website sending me emails, I want this song, please release this song. Where can I get the song? So I discussed with my manager, he says, well, let's make a record, let's make a whole album, you know? So I made a record called This Life. That was a featured song. And we sold a lot of records, but it wasn't through a record label. It was because I had a song in a commercial that people, they responded to it. They loved this song. They wanted the record. So, you know, you make plans like, oh, I need a record deal to sell, you know, you don't need a record deal. You need whatever is gonna happen to you that wherever your success can come from, you don't know. So you just get up every day, you keep doing what you're doing. And one day the light shines down and your dream happens. Well, Mark, the light shines on you 24 seven. In fact, I should put on some sunglasses right now. It's very bright. Nobody, but you are a true testament to someone who believes in what they do and you do it so well and you've been able to sort of cobble together a career throughout your entire life, which, I mean, the chips are down so many times and you just rise like a phoenix every single time. So I really appreciate that. I appreciate you saying that, Lynn. You get enough nuggets or, you know, gems just appear like, you know, when you least expect it. And it's like, and it reminds you why, you know, not that it's about, you know, it's really about the process. If you don't enjoy the process of making music, then you shouldn't be in the business. We have goals, you know, but it's the journey, you know, it's like, that's what you have to be present for and that's what you have to enjoy. And then these gems and these nuggets appear as, you know, to affirm, you know, that you're doing, you know, you're doing what you're supposed to be doing, you get the bills paid, you know. But I feel blessed just, I've been able to follow my dream my entire life and make music. That itself is, you know, that's a blessing. That's such a gift, you know. Speaking of those nuggets, I have to say, you're one of my nuggets because one of my dreams was always to, I wanted to do everything really. And everyone kept telling me, just do one thing really well. I'm like, that's not my brain. So I wanted to do everything and including make a documentary film. So that's what brought you and I together. But really the biggest moment from all of that was, we met and the next thing you know, my husband and I are putting a movie studio in the car, we're driving into the city to meet you at Steven's studio. Just unbeknownst to me on your own, you were so inspired by our project we were working on that you wrote a song and performed it and we were able to film it. And I could see you working with Steven, who was so gracious to come by during the filming and release of the song. It was really a place that I never thought that I would be and it was a surreal day. And I know it's still being massaged, everything. And there's so much patience you have to have in this industry with everything that you do. Things don't always happen right away. They don't. And see the thing that happened when we met, you and I and Jim Tomlinson and Rivera, it's like I was investing in you because I felt like you guys are real. This is like, we believed in you guys and the project. So, and when I don't do it, I don't commit to anything that I can't put my heart and soul in. That's the other thing, like for young musicians, it's like, don't, you know, I have friends that they're scared to say no to every project that comes in, but do things that fulfill you, you know? This music project that I've been working on with Lynn and Jim and Mark the last few years, it's about, you know, the connectivity of the music community, where we come from, you know, how we got here, the history. And so immediately, you know, we had this idea for a song, it must be in the water, you know? And which, you know, I remember watching the Muscle Shoals movie and the Wrecking Crew movie or the one about the Funk Brothers, you know? It's like, a lot of where great music comes from, it's by a body of water, you know? And it's like, Asbury Park, you know, in Detroit, you know, there's the lakes, you know? It's like, so it's like, well, it must be in the water, you know? Well, it happened to you two on the text feed. We were all in a text feed and I saw you both, you and Mark were going back and forth, and next thing you know, you both came up with the name at the same time. That's right, that's right, the title, yeah, just from our conversation that day. I felt like a fly on the wall in a creative session, that like, you forgot that I was on the feed. No, no, it was great, it was great. Yeah, yeah, we just kind of by osmosis. And that's the thing as a musician, like always be present, there's magic, first of all, there's magic happening in every human being's life all day long. It's like, I look at it like, if, you know, it's like, oh, I can't believe that, you know, you know this person and it's like, I get more concerned when those things don't happen. Yes. When you don't see those, you know, these connections, these soul connections that we all have and these magical experiences that happen. For example, even the Dick Cavett story, you know, I wrote a song called Dick Cavett. It was on my last record, right? For six months, before the record came out, I was just dreaming, literally at night, day dreaming, never said anything to anybody. I want Dick Cavett, my dream was, my mantra, my internal mantra was, I want Dick Cavett to hear this song. That's it. So I get a call one day, six months after this mantra has been going on, not even, you know, not even realizing, but it's like this loop going on in my head. My friend Rich Russo, who's a DJ at the Underground Garage, calls me up, he says, Mark, well, let me preference this by apologizing. I said, okay, what are you apologizing for? Well, I got an advanced copy of your record. I love that song, Dick Cavett. And I sent it to my friend, who is Dick Cavett's director. He handles his estate, he's his assistant. And I go, I said, first of all, Rich, you're apologizing, but I want to give you a kiss, you know? It's like, you're a magician, you're an alchemist, you're answering this like a prayer, like, you know, like a- Running around in your head. Exactly, exactly. He said, okay, well, keep your fingers crossed, Dick's gonna hear this song in the next couple of days, and I'll give you a call and let you know what happens. He calls me back two days later, Dick loved your song. He, in fact, he said no one's ever written a song for him, and he's inviting you and the band up to his house to make a music video. What was your response when that happened? I was doing a jig, you know, I was exploding with joy. And, you know, I mean, I can't, when I think of that day, it's like, well, this is magic, you know, it's all magic, you know? It's just the fact you're able to do what you love, it's magic, you know? There's so much chaos in the universe. The fact that you can get from your home to wherever, New York City, Los Angeles, flying, you know, these are all magical occurrences, you know? It's like, so much can go wrong. So when everything's going right, you know, it's kind of miraculous. It should be celebrated, yeah, for sure. It should be celebrated, exactly. Wow, well, I, first of all, you gotta check out the, it's called, It's So Easy, Dick Cavett. I ran into him on one of my first auditions at the William Morris Agency in the recording booth. I had to do an audition, and I opened the door, and there's Dick Cavett. Oh, man. He's a little guy, he's so adorable. And he's almost like, what, 90 years old now? And he's still just incredible. Yeah, he's, I think he's probably 89, and I mean, so full of life, and you get why Muhammad Ali, Groucho Marx, John Lennon, why these people revered him. They were, he makes you feel like you're in his, like you're a family member sitting in his living room, like no, you know, he has no heirs of, and he's hilarious, and he's a rascal, and he has a cutting sense of humor, but he's like your uncle, or your favorite uncle. He makes you feel like you're supposed to be there with him, and he makes you feel like a family member. So I can see why Muhammad Ali would, whenever he was off, he would go stay at Dick's house in Montauk to get away from everything, because he felt safe. Yeah, well, when someone like that invites you into their home, I mean, that's a pretty special thing, and a pretty special person to even do that in this world. Speaking of special, so you're working on an incredible documentary film that I cannot wait to see. It's called The Sounds of Valor, and so keep an eye out for that. I'm sure it's gonna be somewhere, Hulu, Netflix, somewhere it'll be on a screen near you soon, but what else does Mark Ribbler have coming up that we can look out for? Well, this will be the fourth year we're doing the American Music Honors, which is, it's part of the Bruce Springsteen Archives. So I'm the music director, so, and I've been using the Disciples of Soul the last four years for these shows. So each year at Monmouth University, we honor the legends, you know, for lack of a better word. The people that got us here, last year was Amy Lou Harris, Tom Morello, Smokey Robinson, John Fogarty. So it's like our idols, you know? It's like, it's my record collection every year. This year it's Deon Warwick, Dr. Dre, the two remaining doors, Robbie Krieger and John Zansmore, the band. So Amy Helm, you know? Oh, wow. Yeah, so honoring the band. You know, we've done Jackson Brown, we've done John Mellencamp. So each year I spend like two months preparing all of the music for the show. And that'll be, that's April 18th at Monmouth University at the Pollock Theater. And then in June we're doing, it's called something like a Concert for America. It's the music, I forget the exact title, but it's the music that got us here. And that'll be two days at the Mac, which is the arena at Monmouth University. And that'll be a who's who of artists. They, none of the names have been released yet, but it's one night it'll be like more like traditional, but it's like the history from the blues through, you know, Rhythm and Blues, Jazz, Country, R&B. It'll be all these artists two days of like a music festival at Monmouth University honoring all these musicians. So we've got that coming up. So there's a lot of preparation going on right now for these shows. Those things take a long time because you've got a lot of people and a lot of bands. And there's so much going on with that. Plus, of course, anytime you turn on Little Stevens Underground Garage, you're gonna hear a song by Mark Ribbler and a lot of other great music as well. So I just love you. I don't wanna let you go, but I know you're a busy guy. So I really appreciate the time and I appreciate you and I love you. And I thank you for sharing a bit of yourself and your story. And hopefully it's inspired someone or helped somebody. And if that's the case, then we've done our job today. Yeah, Lynn, I hope so. You know, and I love you dearly and I'm so happy with the success of your podcast. I mean, it's so deserved and, you know, you're, yeah. Thanks. You deserve all the great things that are happening. I'm so glad we could share it today. And I'll come back anytime, you know that. Please do, please do. Are you kidding me? We have a lot more to do still. Plus, we're working on that documentary. That's right. Sometimes these things take, well, I have a friend working on a show for 13 years and finally made it to television. So I have faith. I know. We both know that everything takes time. And if you're impatient and you're in the music business or the entertainment business, you will be toward patience. Oh yeah. Among other things. Exactly. You don't have to talk about. Yeah. Thank you, Mark Rivler for coming on Music Save Me and we'll talk to you again very soon. Yeah, this has been great. Thank you so much. I'm Buzz Knight and thanks for listening to Lynn Hoffman and the Music Save Me podcast, produced by Buzz Knight Media Productions. Please check out our other shows, Taken a Walk Nashville, hosted by Sarah Harrelson, Comedy Save Me, hosted by Lynn Hoffman and Taken a Walk, hosted by yours truly. All shows are available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and are part of the iHeart podcast network. No gloss, no filter, just stories, spoken without fear. A person who is not generous cannot be an artist. The world will be at peace only when it is ruled by poets and philosophers. Listen to my weekly podcast, the Pooja Bhachon and the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Come for the honesty, stay for the fire. This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.