Real Estate Investing for Beginners: From W-2 Engineer to 130 Units | Joey Mack

What up, the Science of Flipping family? I have an incredible guest here. Now, this guest I have known for years. He is a part of the REI Live community. He's an active investor now. He's burnt his boats. He's gone all in, and he's doing some really cool stuff. And I want to share his story with you guys so that you guys can look at him as a beacon of hope that you too can create something really special in your business and in your life. Joey Mack my my REI live member is here brother what's going on hey hey Justin glad to be on super excited yeah uh so by the way when I say REI live when you look it up it's REILive.co co it is not.com so REILive.co go look it up check it out that's where Joey's at so I know you told me when I invited you to be on this podcast you said I never told you this but This was one of my like little boxes I wanted to check being in your world. Yeah, for sure. I've been wanting to be on your podcast since we've been working together since about 2017. So isn't that great, dude? Well, you deserve it, bro. You deserve it. And so I want the people to, you know, understand more your story, your origin story, right? Like from the nine to five grind as an engineer, I will get all the way to real time today, what you're doing and how you're doing it. But let's start a little bit with that origin story so people can kind of take that and look at that about what they're doing and, you know, the moves that they might want to be making. So talk a little bit about that origin story for yourself. Yeah. So I started it. Rich Dad, Poor Dad, a lot of people, right? They read that book and that just starts the trajectory. So I was in college. I was going to be an engineer. I read the book. I got done and I went, oh, my gosh, I don't want to be an engineer anymore. I got to figure out what this is. And I finished school and I had been, I mean, I bought the, I went to the rich dad program. I bought their program for whatever their teaser was. And then I started this process, got on podcasts. That's how I started listening to guys like Sean Terry. And then the way I got connected with you was I had bought up one of his programs and then you and Kent Clothier ended up being the coaches on it. And so I was going through doing the training. I knew nothing as far as doing a deal whatsoever. Didn't know what that looked like. And I started sending out some direct mail in Colorado and landed a pre-foreclosure. And so, I mean, completely no clue what I was doing, but it's about action and just doing it. And so, like you always say, I mean, it's not about what you're doing. It's just taking steps every day. Every imperfect action, right? I think there's a lot of people out there and maybe you were, maybe you weren't. You obviously were not. Ultimately, you were not this person, but there's a lot of people out there that whether it be YouTube or podcasts like this, and they continue to be a student, which is great. But if you don't do anything, then you're going to be a lifelong student and nothing in your life is actually going to change. Right. And so if you're sitting here listening to this and, you know, wanting to hear more of Joey's story, the one of the biggest takeaways, if there's only one takeaway you take away from this is he actually got off his butt and took action right first starting by buying sean terry's course which led to seeing video and trainings from me which led to him researching me which then led to him sending direct mail which led to him not knowing what he's doing but just like getting on the phone with the homeowner which again not knowing he's doing just contracting the property incorrectly so i say all that because what he said without saying it is he did all this stuff incorrectly, but the key is he did the stuff, right? So that's, if you take nothing else, guys, learn this part. So keep going, Joy. So with that first deal, it was in Colorado pre-foreclosures, you have to have a special type of contract. And I was just using that blank, you know, one, one page contract that you get when you first start. And so I built a bunch of rapport. I got to know the people. They liked me. My offer, I had no clue if it was a good offer, but I just threw a number that I thought based on what I knew for the market as I'd been learning. And sure enough, it was a good number because I went to a buyer that I'd met through Craigslist and I called him and he's like, yeah, I'll take it. And then they found another offer. And the thing about pre-foreclosures in Colorado, if you don't do it right, which is what I had done. You have to give them a certain amount of time. And so they had another offer come in higher than mine. I knew that that number would still work. So I just called them. I said, if I can match that, would you still do this? And they were good with it. And so then the buyer came in, helped me with the right contract and getting it set up and then made our way to a closing. And that built a relationship from there that I started doing some deals with them and kind of pressed on further and, and through. Now that buyer, did that buyer continue to buy any deals from you or was that more of a one, one and done scenario? They ended, so it's funny one of the buyers, so they were partners, but one of the buyers and I ended up being roommates at a, at a certain point we lived together and we're doing some deals together and no kidding. Yeah. So it built some relationships there. And I mean, I think besides just effort, that's the other thing that people miss out on in real estate is the, the networking and the relationships. And you talked about REI live. That's a huge piece of why I'm so directly connected with that because you build relationships and you network and you find ways to make deals and make connections. Well, and that kind of gives me shivers to hear that, dude, because this is like a life mission for me. I genuinely love it. I know you know that because you're close to me, like to the point where we now have structured a strategic partnership where we're going to start doing deals together. And in the hope is we do a boatload and like create this incredible thing together, right? Where, again, I preach to these people, I don't need to get rich off. You want to get rich with you. That's the phase of life I'm in. And so now that you've been with me so long, we're going to start doing stuff together, but that's because the person you are, right, is you are intentional in creating a relationship. You show up, you do the work, you know, you're not always doing it right. So for those, again, kind of, I always want to pull those things out that you guys can take from these episodes is like, he's talking about being intentional with the people, the networking. Don't just like go to a RIA meeting and exchange a card, like make the call, invite to coffee, sit down with people, start a relationship. Because one of my first mentors in real estate back in 2006, I believe it was. Yes, I'm old. I understand that. But back in 2006, he said not every meeting is a direct connection to a paycheck, but every meeting has potential to be a direct connection to a paycheck. So don't underestimate the meetings you're taking and sitting down. You know, you might go meet with Johnny who you met at a REIA meeting. You're like, I don't know why I'm really meeting with him, but you do. A year and a half from now, you might come across a deal with Johnny and make a whole bunch of money. And it's because that first meeting a year and a half ago. Right. And so guys and gals like be very intentional with this. this is one key way to get actual consistent deal flows by through your network, right? Realtors, wholesalers, buyers, homeowners asking for referrals. So like lean into what he's saying here is really important. Yeah. People want to work with, and I don't know who said it, people want to work with people that they like and trust. And you can't get that from just a phone call or a letter out in the mail. All my best deals have come from consistent follow-up and building a relationship with the seller. Yeah. Now, so that deal gets done. What's the next chapter? You get the first deal. You kind of dust it off like, wow, this actually works. How much did you make on that deal, by the way? Like $5,000. And I mean, that'd be gross, not net. Yeah. But still, I mean, it's $5 million more. And even if you made half of that, right? Like, okay, well, now what I always tell people is now you have certainty and you have confidence. Yes. Like, holy moly, this actually works. This isn't some thing out there that people just sell you. This actually can make you money. Yep. It was the proof. It was that thing that I went, oh, okay, I can do this. Now, how do I do it better and more? That's right. And so next chapter, what do you close that deal? What's the next year or so? What does that all look like? I started working with those buyers a bunch more. So that's how we started developing a relationship. They knew that I was good at connecting and talking with people and building relationships. and so I mean it was a gorilla hustle from there I think just about every deal came in a different lead flow from there I had a craigslist one that came off of it I had a creative deal where I actually leveraged my credit and bought a deal with somebody and then they just refied me out and basically wholesaled it like that was the way I got my wholesale fee yeah man and now are you this whole time are you only doing it in your home market because I think everyone needs to know where you're at i was still in colorado at that time and that's that's the only place i was doing it was in colorado and it was hard to get smoking deals for me i found well it is still to this very moment joey right like think about what you're doing who's getting a smoking deal right like like it's hard it is just a lot of work and so even at my place and like uh i think one of our members Hector. Hector and us, we did a $17,000 deal. These days, that's a nice wholesale deal. That is nice these days, right? Yeah. So smoking deals, right now what we're seeing both in REI Live and our own business, on average, we're somewhere around 10 to 12 Gs total, right? But that includes, that means there's a lot of five pounders in there, six pounders, seven pounders, and then there a 17 right But that the point is today that it not easy to go get a smoking deal Yeah If I can You were on the grind Now, when did you quit your job? Because you started as a W-2 employee. This is your side hustle. When did you make the decision to quit? This year is when we pulled the trigger in April. I quit my job and it was nerve wracking. And I think I've put in more hours and more work than when I was working at a job. but it's it's more fulfilling i'm happier i mean it it's more time with the kids we were just talking this morning you're in bed with the kids and you know it's like listen a lot of people will give their life to their job like they will literally work 60 hours a week for a boss yep meanwhile people in our space of entrepreneurship whether it's real estate or not they just feel like oh i'm doing this so i don't have to spend time working and it's actually the opposite the reality is if you want to make a lot more money or if you want to build something special at all you actually are going to probably put in more work but you get to do it on your own business the pride that comes with that and the enjoyment like you said you're happier now than when you were working at your job and you probably work more yeah that that is like invaluable to be happy i wake up and i start working and i before i'm going to bed i'm working it just i mean hey listen we're doing this podcast on a saturday we're both working right i mean it doesn't stop. It just, but again, it creates the happiness and the joy and the opportunity to do the things that we really do love. Um, so that second year or, you know, you get your first deal, how many deals do you do within that first year to two years? Like, what does that look like for you? Every lead source varied and every deal varied. And I just, like I said, I scrapped whatever deal together I could. And I was working with those buyers that originally bought from me and I started using them to build that relationship. They were teaching me how to run numbers better. They were teaching me about the market and giving me tips on contracts and all sorts of things. And so that just was a huge launching pad further from there as I... So you were leveraging your buyers in what I believe to be the most brilliant way. You understood their buying parameters and you started to go look for their type of deals, right? And that's, this goes back to networking and building relationships. A lot of people in our space, especially at volume, they treat their buyers transactionally. They don't even get to know them. They just take their assignment paperwork. Like they don't even know the person is what they buy, why they buy. They just know they're buying it. I believe that to be a massive mistake. I believe understanding like you give that buyer a call. Hey, awesome that we're getting this done. What is your real criteria? How are you looking? How do you underwrite construction? Do you look at it where you're going to replace everything or not replace everything? Are you doing electrical every single time? And understanding those little things and those little nuances can help you become a better acquisition person. So when you're hustling, you're hustling to go find them the properties that you know they're going to buy. Yes. That's going to be really important. So your W-2, you get what? Your first year, your first two years. How many deals? I don't know if you'll remember, but how many deals do you think you did in your first year to two? Probably about seven. Totally. Yeah, and it was just scraping by whatever I could on any of them. I don't know if I ever actually made a net profit on them, but they were doing deals and I was getting experience and I was learning as I was going. And then that would have been probably that 2017, 18 until almost 2020. And then I took a short break in there and that's when I was more into the W2 job doing what I was doing. And then we started getting back into it. I got married. Actually, one of those buyers was in my wedding. And then, or not in my wedding, but he was at my wedding. And then we started looking for rental properties. And then that's where I had leveraged all the knowledge I had developed. We had connected with you and started doing some trainings with you again. So, I mean, it was kind of a, it wasn't a continual path of you and I being together, but we started back in about 2017. And then in 2020-ish, is that, or what did it do? COVID. So COVID hit in 2020. And I think you jumped into one of my like challenges or something. Yeah. And you're like, wow, okay. if I'd really do this strategy, I can get back to it. Yeah. And so I think you even, I think at some point you even, I don't know if you reached out to me directly or something, but like you came to me with this concept of, um, I have more interest in building wealth through rentals than being transactional. However, I'm aware I need to be transactional to some extent, but my real bigger passion. And by the way, if you're listening to this, like that should be all of our bigger passion. Being a transactional real estate investor, wholesaling and fix and flipping, that is transactional. You can make a lot of money, but it's not fulfilling. It doesn't create much. That should be all of our reasons to be in real estate is to be able to have that ability to create wealth, generate actual legacy and wealth. At some point, whenever that day is, to be able to let it all go and just sit back and get paid. You came to me with that. How is that journey going for you so far oh man it's so that we got you and i have gotten connected multiple times in in my journey of jesus of doing real estate because it was that initial and then there's a time off and then i actually got connected with one of your students um why am i blanking on his name here out of out of denver we did mobile homes together so i was doing some mobile home flipping with him uh all right i'll get back on broken john broken I'm broken. Oh yeah. John, he's great. We got connected there again. And I think that's how I first got back to following you specifically. And there was a gap. And then this last time was when we started doing coaching together again. Yeah. I got in, we started doing your challenge, your program. It was about, for me, it's about, it was about knowledge and adding on rentals. And that's where we started going. And we've been with you for the wholesale programs and this REI live now. Yeah. It's just built a, the relationship again, relationships from there, networking from there. I've leveraged your knowledge to build out the rental properties I have so far. So then that fast forwards us to our first rental property. We had started working with you. That's when we got our first rental about the same time. We ran the numbers based off of stuff you told us to look at, right? Yeah. So I probably wouldn't have had any clue. And was it a great deal? Probably not, but it's cash flowing. So it's a deal for now. And then we just kept buying rentals from there and have been working with you since. So now how are rentals, right? Everyone, everyone is seduced by having rentals, right? It's seductive and you're building wealth and passive money. And so let's talk rentals for a second. What's been your experience? How many do you have now? Four? I have seven doors. Yeah. I was gonna say like eight doors, but how many roofs? Uh, what is that? Cause one of them is a fourplex. So I got four buildings. Okay. And then we just partnered. Cause I guess I don't know if I mentioned this to you recently, I partnered on 125 apartment units with a group. Nice. Okay. Yeah. What's your role in that? I, so I'm doing the property management for the buildings. So we got involved, connect, it's another one of those networking connections with people. Yeah. And so we, uh, you want to get into that story or just kind of the quick. Yeah. They just a quick, so I, I connected with one of the guys that had some buildings because I was looking to see if I could buy them from him. He was having struggles with his property management, which is probably pretty consistent across the board for most people. And so we do it for our own rentals and we're pretty structured and strategic about it. And so he offered up being a business partner to rent, to manage his building. And then they ended up acquiring a building within a week of us agreeing to do that. And so we went from the seven units to about 130 units that we have under management. That's great. Now, are you going to be building a property management company like a true or just when you get equity, you'll manage it as part of your equity? That's your equity earning. That's our equity earned right now. And so it may lead to a property management company. So it's not the goal right now. The goal is just keep building the portfolio of rentals and leveraging from there. So, I mean, if a company management company happens, it happens. Yeah. I would tell you just as a piece of advice for all people out there, like spreading yourself too thin with too many different verticals can be challenging, right? So making sure you have some level, you know, you guys know my story, but like build down before you build up. because you want to make sure you have enough depth to secure what you're doing, right? If it's all on Joey's shoulders, dude, there's going to be a bandwidth issue, frankly, right? Um, you know, having 130 doors or whatever you have, like, and you're managing all of it, that is not a simple feat, let alone, you still need to be transactional so you can make income so you can pay your bills and all these other things. So be aware of it, right? And be aware of what you're trying to do, because I think most people in this space get in for, I want to get rich or I want to build wealth, but then they get sidetracked with different ways of doing all these different things. So get clarity, I would tell you. Not saying this is bad for you. I'm just saying like, just make sure you're staying in the path of what's going to keep your momentum going. And so part of that is building out systems. We've, we've already got maintenance people. We've got cleaners. We've got people that we're looking at to kind of take over the role of, daily property management. As of right now, that's pretty much me and my wife. Yeah. But we're building that into pushing that to somebody else to where I just manage all the managers or managing people instead of the property Well that great Now what does your life look like right now What is your main focus to do deals? And by the way, when you got started, to go back to get started, did you have a big marketing budget? Were you throwing $5,000 or $10,000 a month at marketing, or were you just bootstrapping it and just doing whatever it took? Bootstrapped. So when I first started, I maybe was sending out 1,000 mailers a month, which really isn't very many. No. So it's a thousand bucks a month, give or take 500 bucks a month, 600 bucks a month. Yeah. And so, and that for me, it just, I didn't see the return on it. And maybe it was because I didn't have that volume there. And so that's where I really started doing the networking and the guerrilla type marketing. I go through and I do a lot where I look on the MLS. And I think the best tip I can give people for that is don't look at it as, and I think this is real estate in general, too many people go they want instantaneous one time i hit you one time with a phone call and they never touch it again the the big thing is i put them in my system and i follow them until they either sell or they fall out and then when they fall out i call the owner directly and that's where you're going to get your real leads yeah yeah and so we talked about this earlier right is anyone who's going, even a realtor, let's just talk about this, like a realtor, which is free. You just making one phone call, them saying, hey, you know, your number is not going to be where it's supposed to be. And you go on your next call and don't ever actually keep track of that agent. Again, this goes back to the theme of this episode. Like it's about the relationship. Yes. It's not about that listing. It's not about if you send direct mail and the homeowner calls back, you call them, they're not that interested right now. And you just go move on. You don't nurture the relationship and you don't have a constant communication. That's where just the professionals know this side of it. That's why they do deal flow is they know over time, this level of communication is going to be the difference between actually getting a deal and not getting a deal, but coming at, coming at it from a people perspective versus a deal perspective. Yeah. And so when you are doing deals now and bringing in leads and this kind of stuff and like, we have this new joint venture strategy that you and I are going to be doing together. Like what is going to be your sequence with these leads that come in? I try to, I try to hit them hard when I first get them in probably the first week to two weeks, calls, texts, bumping them if I have emails. And then from there, I just kind of start dripping it. I, I reach out, you know, every two weeks after about a month or two, I probably reach out every month and then I just try to stay in front of them. yeah that's all right and listen guys you guys all know this listening and watching but we're in an event in timing business that's what we're in yeah the the time that you reach out to that home and homeowner agent whatever the case may be needs to be at the same time an event is happening and that's it yep and if you drop the ball because you don't have automation reaching out or task yourself to reach out consistently, then you are going to lose that deal to someone else because the event that just happened to that homeowner happened right now. And if you don't have another follow-up for 30 days, cause that's how you scheduled it. Then someone else is going to call them today or tomorrow or Monday and you're going to miss the deal. Yeah. And, and that's the important part is again, back to this point, don't be upset cause they don't want your deal now. just follow up with them because when the event happens they want your deal yeah they'll take it because they're in that position yep that's how it was with one of my better deals that fourplex i think i was in contact with them for about three years before they finally sold it to me talk us through that three years there's almost no one on this call listening or watching this that will stay in a deal for three years what talk to us about that deal I knew them personally. And so about every three to four months, I'd say, Hey, are you getting tired of dealing with tenants and, and messing around with stuff? And it was always, Oh yeah. And you know, and not a big deal. They were good. They were cash flowing. They, they love that. Uh, every once in a while there'll be a little headache, right? They had a hoarder. They had to clean out a bunch of trash. They, every time I'd say, Hey, if you're ready, I'll, I'll take, I'll clean out the trash. You just sell it to me and I'll take care of it. You know? And I would, I would even help them there'd be times when they needed to move some stuff I was like yeah I'll help you move the furniture out I know they left a bunch of stuff is that gorilla and then one day a bottom unit flooded and they just they're like I'm done it's you up is it yep they didn't even we didn't even talk numbers he told me a number that I was gonna buy it for I knew the number was a deal and I didn't even I didn't even haggle I said all right I'll buy it and that's how we did it and so the big takeaway for all of you out there again there's a couple here but like go rewind and watch this but one of these things is being conscious when you don't ask for what you want they don't tell you right so meaning you won't give the other person this goes for all conversations if i want joey to sell me his home and every time i call joey i say what's up dude How are the kids? How's the wife? What's going on? Great. All right. Bye. And I never, Hey, are you ready to sell yet? And I never say that to him. It doesn't give him any opportunity to tell me that he's interested in selling. Yep. So the thing is a lot of people will have a conversation, but not ask for the thing they want and, or not let them know the thing they want. Right. So like raising money is a great example of this. People like, I have such a hard time raising money. You know, my family's not rich. and I'm like, I don't know if I've ever borrowed any money from family ever. Like my family's not rich. They don't sit around like, but when I make a post on social media or I let people know, like I'm about to make a post real time today about a Raleigh apartment that is phenomenal. And it's an opportunity for people to invest in. I'm just going to let them know there's an opportunity. They can take me up on the opportunity or not. I don't, I'm not selling them, but if they don't know I have the opportunity, right. Because we're contracted on this apartment in Raleigh, how are they ever going to lend me money? How are they ever going to invest in that deal if they don't know? So what you did brilliantly, dude, is you kept having come. Hey, you guys ready? You guys ready to get rid of that headache? You guys ready? And you joke, but that means you are going to be top of mind when their basement floods and you go, I'm in. And that's a big takeaway for all of you guys. If you just don't ask or even let people know you have interest in buying an apartment or raising capital or buy whatever the thing is then the homeowner the friend the family member the call they don't have an opportunity to fulfill your ask yep you're actually harming yourself and that is what you did so brilliantly there it might have taken three years yeah but it got you across the finish line right i know you're a guy of faith like i am and it's biblical right if you don't ask you won't receive there's there's just nothing there you got to put it out there and be willing to get rejected. I think that's for me, when I was first starting, that was my hardest thing. And I think it is for a lot of people. Oh, am I going to look stupid? Am I going to give them the wrong number? Am I not going to be able to do a deal with make it happen? I know those thoughts ran through my head rampant when I first started. Eventually, you just got to go. I got to ask, right? And if it's wrong, then that's fine. I'll either make the correction or it's not a deal and we just move on past it. And what got you over that, right? And you don't have to say, oh, Justin, what you said, and maybe that seems to be like, everyone comes across this wall, everybody. And it's this fear of like saying the wrong thing, getting hung up on, being judged, being laughed at, doing it wrong. But really internally, that's them, frankly, because I've done a lot of therapy personally. That's their own self basically saying, I'm judging myself. I'm not good enough. Right? Right. And that's what they're scared of is if I do this, then again, I'm going to show myself I'm not good enough right I'm not worthy yep which is all bullshit right and that we all know because as a godly man yourself right like it's not even about us he made us in his image right so we are as perfect as again he forgives us for everything so who cares move on yep but let's remove that right just but like what got Joey over these these like I don't know if I'm even gonna do this right but I'm gonna make a call what what was it I think there are two things. So I've done jujitsu for a long time. I have a jujitsu black belt. I'm sure you know that. And so there's just kind of a headstrong. You just got to keep showing up. And that's it carries over into my real estate is whether I did something wrong or not. I just I had to show up. It was it was a requirement to at least just show up and make the task. And so that jujitsu build definitely a mentality for me. So that helped me over time. And then I think the other thing was is, and I don't know who told it to me, but somebody said, you know, we're both humans. You know, whether it's Donald Trump, the president or billionaire or some other random person, we're still just a human, right? Yeah. We're just people. And so I think we get this conception in our head that these people are better than me or, you know, I can't do it because I'm not capable. I've never done it. I've never done my first deal. Well, how are you ever going to do your first deal? You know, you don't you don't just become a billionaire. You don't just become president. You don't just any of that. You don't do your first deal until you've done a deal. Everybody has to have a first deal. So yeah I just started saying OK well I just make I just have the conversation And if it doesn work it doesn work Yeah that I mean that so the human part That part is you know funny enough I always been asked from like a childhood like even my friends would be riding bikes and there be a group of girls at the park and I would go up and say hi you know not old enough to like I eight years old nine years old But at the age, you know, you get a little shy and whatever. My friends are like, how did you do that? and it was kind of what you said i'm like i don't know what is the what's the worst they're gonna say no like yeah like i just didn't have that care right because i'm only human i'm saying hi girls what's your name right that's the example i'm giving where that like freaks people out right there's a lot of guys today as adults they don't know how to go say hello and it's as simple as that yeah but it's the mindset of like you're just a human being like go say hello and introduce yourself yep and if you don't then you again don't have the opportunity to get the thing you want so you got to pick and choose right like this is goes back to the it's all hard conversation right all of it is hard yeah so are you going to show up every day which is really hard yeah are you going to put in the work which is really hard are you going to mess up and maybe look a little silly which is really hard or are you going to not have what you want ever and be mediocre your entire life and not have anything that is worth anything and have no experiences and just kind of exist on this planet until you die yeah very hard you just have to choose it right and if if anyone here can lean into joey and listen to what he's saying is like he just was brought up with this mentality to show up every day whether he does it great or not that's everything it literally will be everything for everyone listening to this is what joey is talking about has it changed for you say what has it changed for you i mean do you know is everything perfect do you always have the right decision yeah yeah there's still mistakes you just got to show up and fix them and make them happen well and then it goes into the the argument of most of the people that might be listening to this at this point are newer right like they're just breaking in and that's where i'm hoping they can lean into joey's story and his experience and lean into that right uh and if you are newer go to rei reilive.co it is 97 a month 97 a month is the lowest plan so like you have nothing to lose to work with me joey's there every day i'm there every day reilive.co we're doing deals every day five days a week hands-on training where we you get to ask questions and do deals if i would have had that in 17 i would have been launched even further already and it's one thing to have a training video, but to have its live time with you every week. Yeah. Just like this. Yeah. Just like this on a zoom. It's how it gets you in the room. It's a big piece. You got to get in the room. Absolutely. So, but this, you know, when you ask me, is it perfect with me? Like when you reach new levels, this new again, right? Like when I'm going after what I was going after in 2024, and I put my head down in 2023 and said, I'm going to go do at least a hundred million in assets in a three-year period. That's what I told myself. That's what I wrote down. I'm going to go do in 36 months. I'm going to go acquire a hundred million dollars worth of assets. Every day of that moment was new for me because it required something new for me because I've never done that before. Yes. Now, was it perfect? I think we all know if you've been watching me, absolutely not. Right. There have been a lot of mistakes on that journey and some of them, some pretty darn big mistakes but if you guys are listening to this episode and watching me on social media like own up to the mistakes again we're just human yeah I wasn't trying to do something bad it just the mistake happened right so I hope that encourages all of you guys to take a step back and say okay I can get going right I can be Joey part two I can show up every day and and through that joey wouldn't you say like by just showing up you basically would just learn because you were doing it enough and you'd course correct every day so yeah you fill out the paperwork wrong okay well now i know how to fill it out because i just got it wrong so now i gotta fill it out the right way i won't forget that again wouldn't you say like just your learning curve by just doing it like drastically increased in speed oh yeah since since we started working back with you again in that 21 to whenever that time frame was for this most recent time it's it started going exponential because before it was just kind of humming along and then I just been consistent enough and I didn't give up and to where now I'm starting to see the upward trend right and more and more stuff is changing and it's changing faster and more things are coming onto my plate more opportunities I mean the getting in the room is how I got on this podcast that's right so yeah it's uh so what do we what do we have in store for Joey what's the next let's say 12 months, right? Like what do we see 2026 looking like for you? What's going to be your focus? And then how are you going to go achieve it? I would say the shift is to the business building side of things. Cause now we're starting, we're at that point where we're making money and we're able to stand on our own two feet, you know, and now it's the putting systems in place, putting people in place to take over some of the roles that I'm doing and spreading my bad with too thin and then adding in the direct marketing and the stuff we're doing with you where we're where we're adding more leads and uh hitting more sellers that are direct to seller yeah yeah i think as you start to grow the reminder for all of you out there but even you joey is just make sure you build down before you build up right because if everything lands on joey there's just a tipping point where you can't carry all the weight you can't carry all the water and then you're not being efficient and that's where mistakes happen. Right. And you're not trying to make the mistake, but you didn't build down first. So make sure that those things are implementable or executable, right. Whether it's really build out and I don't know what CRM you're using and, you know, make sure that there's some level of automation there that pings you every time. Make sure your phone gets the notification. It's not just in a CRM that waits for you to get home. Like these types of things are important. Yes. Especially as we're going to start be doing, you know, 50 leads a month that I'm going to be bringing into the relationship that you're going to be banging the phones and, and, you know, let's go get some deals. But yeah, um, I would encourage you going into this year, really start thinking, you know, we have two months left. We have November and December. How are you going to finish? And then how is it going to start and start, start that process now, writing it out. Like I have a whiteboard here, writing it out. Like, what does it look like? Who's it involved? How does it go? What's needed to hit these metrics? um don't wait till next year right like don't be the gym owner or the guy that's gonna go i'm gonna lose weight january yeah we all know how that story goes uh and dude i'm first of all i'm incredibly proud of you right because it's not a straight line to success you've stuck in it you kept showing up uh and you know you you've built some some wealth in in some assets and we all know is not passive. Yeah, it's not passive. Now, with all that said, are you going to go continue to buy single family assets? Are you going to change trajectory when it comes to stuff you own and acquire? We're starting to try to shift from just the single family and more look at the multifamily. And I think with where interest rates and things are right now and what's kind of shifted within the market for probably where balloon payments are going to start coming in and how the market has softened for a lot of places i think there's some serious opportunities that are coming for those that are just they're just doing it every day yeah they're calling people they're looking there they've got their eyes open and they're trying to find it yep that's going to happen this is going to be listen it's not going to happen next week or in january there's not going to be some catastrophic event like by the way i don't have a crystal ball but yeah you know, there will be another seismic event at some point in the real estate space. And what I would encourage all of you to do, and Joey and I will be together rocking it. Be ready to take action when those events happen. But if you're on the sidelines waiting for them, then you're not going to be ready. Right? That's like, you know, that's why in football, as an example, or you could probably in saying jujitsu, there's like you warm up first, right? Like essentially football teams have a practice before the game because they got to get their bodies right and stretch it out and start getting physical and hitting each other and like be ready to play if you guys are sitting on the sidelines you're not ready to play so again whether it's reilive.co or or something just get going because it when that moment happens joey now will be running head down face forward crushing it and everyone else is going to be waiting so i encourage you guys and by the way joey you're a great dude like i'm sure if people want to reach out to you they can reach out to you uh where where would they go to reach out to you and find you uh so if they just want to find me personally on facebook it's just joey mack j-o-e-y m-a-c-k or my for my real estate it's mack m-a-c-k buys real estate on facebook so yeah dude well you should definitely be proud of yourself your wife i know is proud of you and your kids think you're a god so and that's all it really matters right yeah that's it so i do it uh this is gonna be a fun journey dude we are gonna be together for a very, very, very long time. So this will be fun for us. All right, dude. Well, I appreciate coming on offering some nuggets here. That is Joey Mac, everybody. I am Justin Colby. This is the Science of Flipping podcast. And if this has helped, I would love for you to share this with at least two of your friends. We will see you on the next episode. Peace. If you like the show, please take a moment to rate, review and subscribe. It really does help the show to grow. Thank you for listening.