BBC Sounds Music Radio Podcasts Hello and welcome to News Hour Live from the BBC World Service. I'm Rebecca, Kesby in London and Regina Vydenathan is in the Hungarian capital Budapest where the election results are in. And Regina, what a historic result. Indeed, because in the last 10 or 15 minutes the long-serving Prime Minister of Hungary Viktor Orbán from the far right Fidesz party conceded defeat in these parliamentary elections. Now, Rebecca, you join me on the banks of the river Danube in the capital Budapest and I am surrounded by thousands of people, supporters of the opposition TISA party, which is led by the soon-to-be Prime Minister, Peter Magyar. I have to say there's a real party mood here, people are waving flags and a lot of people are drinking beer in plastic cups. We've had the sound of champagne corks popping and I have to say I smell a bit of beer and champagne as well, not because I've drunk any but because it's all getting thrown over on us, because people cannot believe what has happened. Now, through the election campaign here in Hungary, the opinion polls did seem to suggest that the opposition TISA party of which Peter Magyar only started to lead some two years ago, so imagine what a meteoric rise he has had. They didn't necessarily want to believe that those polls were true, because it was predicting a huge lead for the TISA party. And so when that moment came and we saw on the screens a beat set up on the banks of the river here, and you can hear people cheer again because every time a new constituency result goes for the TISA party, people are clapping and cheering here. Well, when those screens turned to Prime Minister Viktor Orban and he delivered a concession speech, people could not quite believe it. Let's have a listen to a little bit of what Viktor Orban had to say. So a little bit of what we heard there from Viktor Orban. He said it was a painful defeat. He said the election was clear, and he said he would serve the nation from the opposition benches. Now, it really is Rebecca Rare for a Hungarian election to generate this much global interest, but in many ways this was an election which was a referendum on Prime Minister Viktor Orban's 16 years in power, but also a referendum on the company he keeps. He was very close to President Putin of Russia, of President Trump, his vice president JD Vance of course visited the country. He's got a lot on his plate right now, but he came here to Hungary in the last week to drum up support as well. But he had a very difficult relationship with the European Union. He was a thorn in the side of the block. And for many people I've spoken to here, even people who were voting for the first time, his closeness to Russia and his distance from the EU was a real driving force at the ballot box. Let's have a listen to what some of those people I spoke to had to say. I'm from Hungary, but I live abroad already for 19 years. I came home just to vote. How do you feel right now? Who did you vote for? I voted for Tissa because I think the wrongdoings of Orban have been so big that you cannot go around it anymore. In the past have you voted for Viktor Orban and his party? No, I never voted. I usually voted left, but this was time for Tissa, even if they are right, a better right direction than this. And just describe the atmosphere here at the moment. Yes, it's really electric. I must say I just arrived and I'm really excited. I'm here with my mother. Can I just get you to ask how your mum, how she's feeling about this today? She has goose bumps. We all have goose bumps, I think. It's a really, really big moment, especially knowing it's not just for the Hungarians, but I think also globally we are being watched. How are you doing? I'm fine. I'm feeling fine. What's your name? Abel Katana. And Abel, how old are you? I'm 18 years old. So this was the first time you ever voted? Yes, this was my first actual vote, yes. How are you feeling? I feel absolutely ecstatic. It is the vote since many years here in Hungary that actually matters and the feeling that I could portake in the change of regime which is about to take place is an absolutely incredible feeling. Better, Magyar. What does he need to do for this country then? Because he's got a big job, hasn't he? First of all, he needs to reclaim public services and all kinds of other institutions to look in Hungarian interest mainly instead of foreign interest, for example Russian interest. The longer goal he needs to achieve is to re-establish the trust between Hungary and Hungarian because the last 16 years of Fidesz rule has created a political environment where people look at each other as enemies and not actually as Hungarians and as friends. Well, I should just say as we were talking about relationships with other leaders and Hungary that we have heard from the EU's Eslavon de Lijn, she says Hungary has chosen Europe. Europe's heart is beating stronger in Hungary tonight. And Emmanuel Macron of France says he welcomes the victory which he says shows the attachment of the Hungarian people to the values of the European Union. Well, I'm pleased to say I'm joined now in the crowds by Zafia Benuta, a political commentator and an activist. In many ways you've worked really hard for this result, haven't you? How does it feel for you today? This is unbelievable. I don't think I ever would have imagined this result and this kind of unity in the country that we are seeing. Just on the way here I saw a cab driver getting out of his car, jumping on top of the cab and started to dance because he heard a two-third majority being announced. Indeed. I mean, people are chanting now and we're crushed in a bit of a crowd here. Aren't we on the banks of the Danube? People like you and the work you do, you've worked really hard, haven't you, to overturn a rule that has been 16 years and there were times when I guess people didn't think it was going to happen. I think people, often until the last minute, just didn't even dare to go there because it's just been a relentless fight. And I tell you something, for an authoritarian, the biggest weapon they have is to make people feel small and not believe that they can make a difference. And Viktor Orban, when he came into power 16 years ago, one of the first things that he did was to rig the electoral system single-handedly with his party and he started to capture the media. And so 85% of the media is being controlled by them and the propaganda has poisoned people and made people really fearful and anxious. And this campaign has been really nasty and it's just such a relief. And finally I can say I'm really proud to be a Hungarian. Wow, I think on that note we should end this conversation. Zafia, thank you very much for sharing your thoughts and we'll let you go off and celebrate now. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Well, let's talk a bit more about Petter Magyar, who has had an incredible rise to power. I'm joined now by Miklos Sukodz, an associate professor at the University of Copenhagen. He's Hungarian as in Budapest but he joins me down the line and he's been researching and writing about Magyar ever since he broke onto the political scene. Welcome to News Out, Miklos. Just tell our audience a little bit more about Petter Magyar. Who is he? Peter Magyar comes from the Fidesz political family, interestingly, but his rise was effectively blocked by Orban himself because Peter Magyar was too independent-minded. He was a bit cocky. He had a vision. He was very ambitious. So in an autocratic party, you need loyalists, kind of servants to the regime and Orban just didn't want an independent-minded, young, ambitious politician. So he blocked the rise of Magyar within the party. There is a family story to this as well. Magyar was married to a young lawyer who became a minister of justice in the government of Viktor Orban. So he actually enjoyed quite good perks as a husband of a Fidesz politician with Magyar. But his own ambition, as I said, was always blocked. So he had a growing resentment. And once he divorced his, who is now ex-wife, and the ex-wife also failed within the Fidesz party, Magyar was kind of freed. There is independent-minded vision for a more democratic version of Fidesz. And the Klosso... And in some ways, people here have described him as the insider-outside. Yes. He effectively changed. But I mean, it's possible that people change, especially if they leave an autocratic regime. The 1956 revolution in Hungary, an anti-Soviet revolution was led by Imre Naught, who is a former communist, a Moskvaite communist, and he became a martyr for a democratic, purist Hungary. So, you know, less bloody, but in a similar way, Peter Magyar switched his political career from being a Fidesz loyalist to a democratic-minded challenger, and eventually a victorious challenger to the rule of... But it's important to say, isn't it, Mcloss? He's not a liberal, is he? He still sits on the centre-right of politics here. Well, he believes in liberal democracy and the division of powers and human rights. He comes from a lawyer's dynasty on both sides of his family. So he's kind of a centrist liberal conservative. But I would like to say it's important that the party he created is kind of an umbrella party. It's a large tent that welcomes people from the left and right, feminists and liberals, radical right-wingers and centrist. And it made possible to create a strategy in which Democrats joined forces against autocracy. In other words, Peter Magyar changed the dimensions of the political game because before, Orban had successfully positioned himself as the right, and his opponents were the left. Mcloss, in the time that we have, how do you think he's going to govern? Because he's got a supermajority, if you can say that very, very briefly. Yes, it's very important to have a supermajority, two-thirds supermajority, because Orban's kind of mafia state and autocratic state was created by two-thirds laws. So with a simple majority, it would have been impossible to delete that system and re-institute democracy. But now, Magyar has the same kind of supermajority, so it's very lucky in that sense. But of course, we need to re-establish political pluralism and political competition. So this kind of umbrella or tent party was really instrumental to end the Orban regime and its historical era, but now we need a new kind of pluralism in Hungary again. Okay, thank you so much for joining us. Mcloss Sukodz, an associate professor at the University of Copenhagen. Rebecca, one last point to make. This election had record turnout. It's close to 80%, I think. I haven't looked at the exact figure, but that is a remarkable turnout for an election, which has delivered a remarkable result. Regina Vydenathin, thank you very much. They're live from the Hungarian capital, Budapest. This is Rebecca Kezbi with NewsHour Live from the BBC. Now, those peace talks between delegations from the US and Iran have broken up without a deal in Pakistan. It was the first time since before the war started that high-level direct talks between the two sides had taken place. US Vice President Jay Lee Vance, who led the US delegation, said he'd made the US position and its red lines very clear, but the Iranians had chosen not to accept the terms. But Mohammed Baga Gallibath, who's the speaker of the Iranian parliament, said the US ultimately failed to gain the trust of the Iranian delegation. Well, shortly after those talks ended, President Trump took to social media and announced the US was launching a counter-blockade of the crucial strait of Hormuz. He said the US Navy would block any and all ships trying to enter or leave the strait. We've voiced up part of his post. I have also instructed our Navy to seek and interdict every vessel in international waters that has paid a toll to Iran. No one who pays an illegal toll will have safe passage on the high seas. We will also begin destroying the mines the Iranians laid in the straits. Any Iranian who fires at us or at peaceful vessels will be blown to hell. So is this an idea that will put pressure on the Iranians or make the current situation even worse for the global economy? Richard Haas is the President Emeritus of the US-based foreign policy think tank the Council for Foreign Relations. And I asked him if this counter-blockade is a good move by Trump. Well, as the person who I believe first suggested it, I think it's a good idea. If anything, I think it's long overdue. The idea that Iran could operate the strait, that it would decide who gets to use it, it would charge fees to others, is simply an intolerable situation. So I think the fact that there will now be essentially a position of either everyone gets to use the strait or no one, including Iran gets to use it, is exactly right. But I suppose some listening would say, well, that's punishing every country ultimately, because even if it is Iranian oil tankers that are stopped, the oil on board is headed for India, China, other countries, everyone will be punished by this. Well, not everyone. There's only a few countries who have been able to use the strait, including India, China, Turkey, Pakistan. And I would hope that they would now try to persuade Iran that it ought to reconsider its position. The rest of the world is essentially doing without the use of the strait. So this doesn't change that. It's what we're basically telling Iran. And I think this is right. You don't get special treatment. Now, I would also be prepared to have some new collective governing authority for the strait in which Iran would participate. You mentioned this idea of having some sort of collective authority over the control of the strait of Qormuz. This would be quite a technical detailed sort of compromise to negotiate, wouldn't it, between several parties? It would take some time. This to me would be a long-term oversight mechanism, but it's not required to open the strait. If you're, you know, the strait's been open for decades without any such authority, my own view is that it's a certain acceptance that the situation has changed. And that if this is the sort of thing that would get Iran to accept this, rather than to continue to cause trouble, then it would be worth it so long as the terms of it were collectively acceptable. We've seen those talks break down in Pakistan today, but is it positive that they took place at all? Could they be reignited? What happens next, do you think? Well, it was positive they took place. The idea that they didn't quote unquote succeed should surprise nobody. I don't know too many negotiations that succeed in a matter of hours or days. What you want to do is get the process underway. I would probably focus first on the strait and on a ceasefire, and then I deal with the nuclear issues over time. Mr. Trump is facing so much criticism, isn't he at the moment over the way he's handled this issue with Iran? Is there a danger that this latest, quite radical measure coming from Mr. Trump, this counter blockade could backfire? And it might be another strategy he has to row back from in the next few days. Look, anything is possible, but I would hope not, because he's not the one in this case who initiated the closure of the strait. One can criticize, and indeed one should criticize, I would say, the decision to go to this war. But once Iran moved to close the Strait of Hormuz, that was an escalation. So I see what was announced today as a reaction to what Iran has done, and I think it's totally appropriate. That's Richard Haas there. Now it's Easter Sunday for Orthodox Christians, including, of course, in Ukraine and Russia. A temporary ceasefire was called to mark the most important Christian festival of the year, but almost as soon as it came into effect, both sides reported violations across the front line, and each side is blaming the other for breaking that truce, while our correspondent Sarah Rainsford is in the eastern Ukrainian city of Kharkiv, and she sent this report. We're at a church on the outskirts of Kharkiv city, and people just arriving here with Easter baskets full of eggs and Easter cake and sausage meat that they're bringing to be blessed by the priest here. But the war has changed everything. Even Easter, this service should be taking place at midnight with a procession around the church, but because of the curfew, because of the war, it's happening in the middle of the afternoon. This year, Russia and Ukraine have agreed an Easter ceasefire until Monday, but expectations are really low. The priest has come out of the church now, and he's blessing people who've lined up with their Easter baskets. Everyone here is laughing because he's soaking them with water, and they're asking him for more. Easter is all about hope and optimism, and that's been in pretty short supply in Ukraine lately, but here people are smiling, they're laughing, and I guess they are hoping that at least for a day they'll be spared the Russian missiles and drones. Larissa tells me there may well be a pause in the fighting, but she's sure the Russians will then hit even harder. We're just driving on the Ring Road around Harkiv City, and it's now completely covered with protective netting. It's like we're heading through a tunnel, and this is to protect the roads and vehicles from Russian drones. We've just passed through a military checkpoint, and we're heading to a village that was occupied in 2022 by Russian forces, and it's now where some Ukrainian soldiers have their base. The drone unit from the Khartya Brigade were busy testing new kit for the front line, practicing sending kamikaze drones at a target. The soldiers admit they're exhausted after four years of fighting, but their commander, Georgy, is also sure that this truce won't last. I gave my people order to be ready, ready for an MS Fire. Because you think that they will? Yep, I'm sure. You can hear the air raid siren in the background. It's just 38 minutes into what's supposed to be this Easter truce, and already this ceasefire seems to have been broken. That's the BBC, Sarah Rainsford reporting earlier from Kharkiv in eastern Ukraine there. You're listening to News Hour Live from the BBC. I'm Rebecca Kesby, and we can get more now on our top story today, those elections in Hungary, and it is an historic result for the opposition teaser party of Petr Maja. It's only two years since he formed the party after breaking ranks with the longtime Prime Minister Viktor Orban, and leaving his Fidesz party. Now, if the projected vote count is accurate, it does look like a landslide result for Mr Maja, and within the past hour, Mr Orban has conceded defeat. He says Fidesz will now serve the country in opposition. We are hoping to speak to somebody from Fidesz. We've got calls in, but it's quite a chaotic scene in Budapest tonight. We can get some European reaction now, because these elections have been carefully watched right across the EU, also in Moscow, which was rooting for Mr Orban, as was Washington actually, with Vice President JD Vance, even joining the campaign trail on Mr Orban's behalf this week. What does it mean in Europe, though? Let's speak to Michael Galle. He's an MEP with the Centre Right CDU Party in Germany. Welcome to the programme, sir. Your reaction tonight. Well, we are incredibly happy. That is an incredible landslide, and it's a great day for Hungary, for Petr Maja, and his teaser party. And it's also a great day for us in the European Union, because one blockade will be gone, and we will be more able to act. It is a defeat for Putin and his propaganda efforts, but it's also one defeat for Donald Trump, and especially also JD Vance, who was here some days ago in Budapest. And I think that clearly backfired. Actually, for Donald Trump, it is the third election abroad that he lost after Australia and Canada, where he positioned himself so clearly in favour of someone who so clearly lost. Okay. I mean, why are you so confident, though, that Mr Maja will have a completely different worldview to Mr Orban, because it's only two years, since he broke from him. He's a former colleague of his. In this election, Ukraine was a huge deal for voters. And Mr Maja didn't say a great deal about Ukraine. He's also rather skeptical about what's been going on there in the past. Well, actually, I mean, they were under such an enormous pressure from the media, from the government, so that they, for for tactical reasons, I would say, they did not speak out so clearly, but they clearly announced that they would not continue the same path. I mean, I followed them. They are in our group and the EPP group in the European Parliament on some votes. They did not vote with us when it was about Ukraine, because they did not want to give arguments at this stage to Orban. But the signals were clearly that they will end this blockade and this veto when it comes to Ukraine. They will still, of course, and rightly so, assume, say that they will support the Hungarian minority in Ukraine. But I mean, the point is that if you go inside the EU with Ukraine, then also the Hungarians in Ukraine will be in the EU. And that is definitely better than being in the war. And in so far, I'm confident that they will change course of Hungary, but they stay loyal to their own convictions. And you talk about that, Vito. That's, of course, the extra finances which the EU nations are trying to get through to Ukraine, taken from frozen Russian assets. And Hungary has put a blockage to that. I mean, Hungary is actually quite a small country, population-wise. It's got less than 10 million people, but it has managed to stall the entire EU agenda. Doesn't that kind of show the one of the weaknesses the EU has got, one of its problems is that it is going to be vulnerable to disunity? Yes, I mean, if there is unanimity required, we have this problem. And that is why we have this constant discussion. But size does not matter. It's the largest or the smallest country that can issue a veto. It could be Malta. It could be Germany. And in this case, it has been Hungary and to a certain extent also, or Slovakia. But I'm also confident that when Orban is gone, that Mr. Fizu will not try to be the bad guy in future, but rather return also to the mainstream. And you mentioned Mr. Vance backing the wrong side effectively. We've heard from the chancellor of Germany, Frederick Merz. He's saying he's looking forward to working with Mr. Madia. Let's join forces for a strong, secure and above all, united Europe. And that is something that is being echoed around the capitals in the EU tonight. Indeed. And Ursula von der Leyen said the same for on behalf of all of us. All right. Very good to speak to you. Thank you so much. That's Michael Gala there, MEP with the Center, right? CDU Party joining us live from Germany there. Let's move on to our other big story of the day. And that is President Trump's proposed counter blockade of the Strait of Hormuz earlier today as peace talks fell apart between the two sides in Pakistan. Mr. Trump announced on social media that any and all ships trying to navigate in either direction through the strait will be blocked by the US Navy. And we can speak live now to Caroline Tuckett, who's an associate fellow in international security at Russia, Defense Think Tank here in London. She's also former legal advisor to the British Royal Navy. Welcome to the program. First of all, this proposal by Mr. Trump. Is that legal? No, not really. I mean, it's really important to emphasize here that the term blockade under the law of naval warfare is a very precise term. And when it meets all the requirements in international law, it is a lawful method of naval warfare. But to be lawful, it involves targeting the coastline or port of your enemy and your conflict. And here what seems to be threatened is not the blockading of a coastline, but rather the hindering of freedom of navigation through an international strait. And that is not lawful. Right. But surely the current Iranian control of the strait is also illegal? Or is it? Absolutely. It's what the Iranians try to do is also unlawful. So there is a certain irony here that what President Trump has suggested has the same, is this equally illegal? Right. So most of the oil tankers that have been getting through the strait are Iranian, but they're carrying oil for other countries like China and India in particular. Those countries may have already paid for the oil in the tankers. Does that confuse things legally too? It could do. I think it's particularly confused by the statement by President Trump that he intends to send the US Navy to stop any tankers that have paid a toll as they go through the straits. It's very clear in international law that Iran should not be exacting a toll on those ships. And so those ships shouldn't have to pay. But the fact that they have paid doesn't necessarily make them a military objective, which the US Navy can then go and seize and search. So it does make it more complicated. It does sound very complicated. I mean, it is worth pointing out that neither Iran or the US have ever signed up to the UN convention of the law of the sea. Why not? Different reasons on both sides, particularly in Iran's case, the straitful moves for them, they don't wish to acknowledge what's called transit passage, which is a certain type of passage through an international strait. And on the US side, they've had concerns particularly about access to natural resources on the seabed. But even though neither have ratified the treaty, it is one of the most widely ratified international treaties in the world. And its provisions are considered to be largely customary international law and therefore binding on both states. And in this particular case, the US, for example, have always been a staunch defender of the right of continued passage through an international strait, including in a time of conflict, which it seems to be a right that they now wish to restrict. Good to speak to you, Caroline. Thanks so much. That's Caroline Tuckett there from Rusey. Now, gun violence in Chicago has been described as an epidemic. There were 124 shootings in March alone, according to the city's police department. Now a group of people affected, some of them former perpetrators themselves have come together to record an album of songs, poetry and prose about the problem. One of those involved was Kobe Williams of the Cure Violence Global Organization. He's been speaking to the BBC's Martin Venard, and he spoke to them about the Chicago gunfire survivors and their album, The Forgotten Parts. I was part of the violence. I was making them choices in my life at a young age because we was told that that's the way you got to handle situations is through violence. My father went to prison for a murder. My father came home for prison and he got killed. You know, that's all I knew how to handle business is violence. And this album was recorded in October last year, just around the time that President Trump deployed the National Guard to Chicago. Isn't he right that something needs to be done about the violence in the area? It's the community that need to continue to come together and people need to support more of the community violence intervention organizations who do the work to put out a lot of fires in these communities. Say if somebody say, oh, in Chicago, here, 400 shootings, guess what? If it weren't for the people out there doing the work, the violence prevention groups, there probably would have been over 1,000 or 1,500 shootings. It's all about relationships and people out there every day talking to the young men and the young ladies in the community, helping them change their mindset and their thinking. We need more resources to employ a lot of these young people in the community. When people get laid off and programs get cut, you see a ship and violence going up. I'm on one of the tracks. So what I say on that, you just don't never know what's going to happen. You just don't know. Walking up the street and sometimes you don't even know if something going to hit you with a bullet or make you fell. There's a track called Stop the Violence, Put the Guns Down, which is sung. Yes, this guy who owned that track is a good friend of man, J. Miner Allen. He was one of the program managers who was running one of the pure violence sites. And he always used to snatch the bull horn and talk about put them guns down. I said, stop the violence, save the children, save the babies. And there's a track, May You Rest in Peace by a woman who's lost both her sons to gun violence. I'm sorry. This is so real. She lost her kids, man. So she don't want to see no more mothers suffer or go through what she's going through. And there's another track that I would describe as poetry. I have a clear view through my window where violence consumes the land and all the young boys carry guns for toys and kill whomever they can. That track, one of my close friends who I grew up with, his name Doc, he's doing violence prevention work in the community every single day, making a difference. You know, he'd be around a lot of young guys every day and just that's the reality of things. Are you optimistic for your part of Chicago? I'm definitely always optimistic, my part of Chicago and all over the world where we do violence prevention work because always tell people it ain't how you start this, how you finish. And I'm not giving up on my people and let people know this. They not alone. And even in this damaged state, I still have faith that a change will come in time. I have a clear view through my window. Colby Williams there, one of those speaking to Martin Venard about that project in Chicago. Now while the fragile ceasefire between the US and Iran seems to be holding the propaganda war between the two has continued apace. We've mentioned before on this program the video game style social media posts put out by the White House. Now the BBC has managed to speak to one of those behind the pro-Iranian Lego style videos. One of the latest ones, what looks like a Lego version of President Trump is shown he's injured in hospital. It looks as if his life is supposed to be flashing before his eyes. At one point he's depicted as a circus clown jumping through a fiery hoop held by what looks like a Lego version of Benjamin Netanyahu. You get the picture what they're all about. Well the company behind these videos has told the BBC that the Iranian government is one of its customers. The BBC podcast top comment interviewed a representative from explosive media who calls himself Mr Explosive and I've been speaking to the BBC's Laurie Callas who's the producer of that podcast. It was the first time they've spoken to a major news organization on camera and prior to this they've always denied any direct connection to the Iranian government. That's something that we pushed them on but when Matt our presenter had been speaking to them on Instagram they told us that they'd done some projects for the Iranian government and so we pushed them about that on air. They initially denied it and then when there was a little bit of a back and forth with their translator forward slash potentially handler, right, minder, she jumped in and they clarified and they said no the Iranian government is a customer of ours and that's the first time they've said that publicly. Okay so slightly gray area there but it there's certainly pro-Iranian in nature. Why have these videos been so successful and sort of taken off? They're very disparaging about the United States and particularly President Trump but there is a humor, there's heavy rap music usage, why are they so popular? Well we've spoken to a few experts about this and one of the things that they say is it's particularly successful because it allows the viewer or the audience to kind of dissociate from what they might expect from the Iranian regime so you see these Lego inspired characters which they the creators describe as kind of like a universal language and then also they do pick up on these things that are really kind of hyper current in the news and in the conversation so whether it's the Epstein files and different strikes that have happened and the Dandaman, I think another reason is they've been able to train this stuff using AI models created by Western companies. We know them that you know open AI Anthropic, all of these big companies that have given these LLM backed technologies massive scope what it means is Iran which has always done propaganda now has an access to a Western audience with cultural appropriate trained data on Western sources that allows them to pick up on things that they think will really resonate with that audience. It's really interesting I mean we've also seen quite a lot of propaganda coming from the United States as well also using sort of cartoon imagery and that was coming directly from the White House. Yeah absolutely the gamification of warfare and kind of diplomacy is absolutely something that the White House has done themselves from their official accounts as you say. One of the things these creators claim is that they're acting defensively the Iranian creators they say we're responding to the US and others manipulating the truth manipulating the narrative and what we're doing is no different to what they're doing that's what they say. They talk about hyper reality which is this concept from the French philosopher Jean-Baudrillard what they're saying is that they're creating a version of the truth that is more convincing to the audience and is more faithful to the audience even if the things they are actually depicting didn't happen. That's the BBC's Laurie Callis there just before we go the man set to be the next Prime Minister of Hungary Petr Maja has been speaking in the past few minutes let's take a listen. Today my dear friends we you have achieved a miracle in Hungarian history. There we go a new government set for Hungary that's it for this edition of News Hour.
