Durango Hellcat Review; Waymo vs Taxi; Mercedes Update

What up everybody? Welcome to the Smoking Tire podcast. Today's episode is brought to you by Off the Record. We love Off the Record here and you guys do too based on the number of emails you send me about Off the Record saving you from getting points on your license from a pesky little moving violation. You see if you get points on your license you could be at risk for insurance premium increases, possibly employment issues if you have to have a clean driving record for your job, and more not to mention the fines and all the other inconveniences. That's why Off the Record is here. If you get pulled over for any kind of moving violation big or small in any state in the U.S. don't plead guilty get off the record. They will connect you to a qualified attorney in the jurisdiction where you got pulled over and they will fight that ticket all the way as far as they can take it and then most of the time it goes away. It's great. They get those points off your record. They have an amazing track record. Go to off the record dot com slash tst that's off the record dot com slash tst for 10 off all legal services booked through Off the Record. One more time that's off the record dot com slash tst. Guys the smoking tire is giving away a 992.1 turbo s in partnership with dream giveaways. We're giving away a $275,000 car with some slick choice mods. The proceeds benefit charity and you don't have to buy any merch. It's a straightforward entry process. So hit the link in the show notes and get entered to win today. Doug texted me he was like why didn't you let me do this one? I would have loved to drive this fucking thing. I drove it. It's so fast. How many how many watchers go? Oh no Dave will get market price. A thousand is what you need to get market price basically. It's a cool car. Good color. The stance is great. It is so fast. Really? Yes. It is. Like skyline fast? Yeah. Yeah. Basically. It's kind of similar. I think this is no. This is faster than a stock skyline. I think then like an R32. Right. Without the teeth. This is probably this feels but it's definitely it's in that family. It's absolutely it's the twin term. It's more like it's more like an Aussie hot rod. You know like one of those fast Falcons or something. It looks like to. Yeah. But it's like but basically that's that is the vibe. It's absolutely the boost curve and shit like that is very skyline. It's that kind of engine but put into a normal car. Right. Which is the GTR is like that was the focus. I mean it seems like it handles nicely and you know it rides well and has decent enough brakes. It's a 92 so you know the thought they're going to be great but the seats are fabulous. Seats like an Acura legend seat. Something like that. But but man when you fucking roll into this thing in third gear. Fucking goos. So talking about the Lotus Carlton that my head of Concierge Concierge I guess is really I don't want to mis-title him but he's selling it on bring a trailer. It's his personal car. Is this little intercooler here right before the school little air air to air. Yeah. Yeah. So it's these this was the fastest sedan in the world in 92. They only made 950 of them. Wow. Fucking real real quick this thing. Cool. It was it was a treat to have a go at it. Yeah. It's very bad. This one's lived in California for a long time. Hi everybody. Welcome to the program. It's only 10 a.m. here in LA but I've already had like a four hour work day. Really. Yeah. No wife this morning. So you're just focused. Yeah. Murderer last night and now I'm free. You know. Is not the move. Yeah. I recommend everyone just you know if you really want to be productive. Life hack. New Silicon New Silicon Valley life hack. Peter Teal says yeah. Peter Teal. Yeah. If you it's always the Scientology guy. No. No. No. Miss. Gavage. David. Miss. Gavage. Yeah. This is new new productivity hack from David Miss Gavage. Make your wife disappear. He kills wife. She hasn't been seen or heard from in a really. Yeah. I did not know that. Yeah. It's shady. Have you seen the thing that the TikTok slash Instagram thing of the kids who are running into the Scientology buildings for sport. Yeah. That's nuts. That's one way to die. They talk about these kids the kids today like they're hopeless. Are you fucking kidding me. That's so dope. People listening. They're speed running like filming and just running through a building to see how far in they can get right. Yeah. But it's a Scientology building. Which is great. But what if they have armed security. What are the rules. They don't shoot kids on video. I don't think they are. That's a good point. I don't think they are. All right. No. Use that. David didn't shoot his wife at least publicly and on video. She's just gone. She has not been seen in public since 2007. Habibi. That's a long time. I thought even like Richard Simmons was seen a couple of times. Yeah. This is two decades. Yeah. Ladies never go on to a Whole Foods like come on dude. Yeah. So just saying. That's just saying I wouldn't say religion. Look what they do. Resolves the world's problems. Especially. Although I run right now I'm rooting for the Pope because it's like well sure he's saying the right things and he's a person and he was probably at the same Pearl Jam show I was at back in Frickley Field in 16. Yeah. Yeah. Leo's all right. Chicago dog. He went to the concert. By the standards of Pope. Leo's all right. You know. Yeah. The entity in general. We'll get to talk about something else. Right. Where did how do we get on that one. Let's go. Durango. You want to talk Durango. Sure. Because cars are coming back from the dead with giant supercharged V8s that go. So I mean obviously for people listening we went racing this weekend but we're going to save all the stories of the racing for next week because we're going to have Matteo Siderman and Tommy Kendall on the show. Yeah. That's like better. Yeah. So that's that's the teaser and that's why we're not talking about it right now. Don't give away what you can sell. We could sell it here. Teasing. Yeah. Yeah. No. Don't give away what you can sell is Jeff Goldblum. The Great White Hype. I haven't watched that in a long time. You reference it a lot though. It should be. It's a rewatch annual. It doesn't. It ages. It ages like like a fine wine. Like a like a Merlo Broham. It ages. Which is also from the Great White Hype. You must watch that film at least once every two years. It's it's remains current. So we got a Dodge Durango Hellcat jailbreak in in Destroyer. That's the same color. I had the charger destroyer. It's battleship gray. Yep. That makes sense. I was writing. I'm writing about the the charger that we talked about last show or last week or whenever it was Dodge has you know they have they have good whimsical names for color. And I think Destroyer is the best name I've heard for this drab ass fucking color. I agree. It's shorter than battleship gray. Yeah. And also it's destroyer which is like rrrrr. And that's what they do. Yeah. It's not as good as Bluedacris which is what which is what I was supposed to get for the charger instead of great. That's fantastic. Bluedacris is good. Wow. Because they sponsor Fast and Furious. That's what the partnership began. The Dodge Color Lab is probably like working in the Taco Bell Experimental Kitchen. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I mean like Doritos Blue Cool Ranch. Right. Like if you're if you're a you know an engineer the dream is to like maybe work at Ferrari right or like Rivian right like the P the pin or if you're into like Formula One maybe you want to like work at McLaren or something. And if you're in the Color Lab like Dodge if you're if you live your job is paints like Dodge is it baby. Well the naming the room full of people that just come up with the names is like marijuana lots of gas station snacks. Yeah. That are crazy colors and names and just a notepad. Yeah. Just go for it. Just maybe they cross over with the Taco Bell people. It's the same brand. It's the same brand. They might share an office. Yeah. Same 22 year old just like. Yeah. Bluedacris. Fuck. You know. Life hack. Here's a life hack people. Start a fast food research agency. A. I cannot tell you if something tastes good. OK. Fast food research agency. You'll be able to make weird shit and eat it all day for sport and money. Yeah. So this is a 700 plus horsepower three row SUV. Yeah. That they've been building in in in basically this this car it goes back to 2016. I think when this when this thing came out. So it's not a new vehicle. And and the reason we got it is because we had three of us. Me, Zach and T. K. tall people. Lots of luggage. And we had to do both a two hour transit each way to and from Chicago to road America as well as run. I wanted a practice car for the HPD day because I knew I would get limited seat time in the race car and all laps are good laps. So I was like I had I had done the track Hawk at road Atlanta in back in 2019. And I was like yeah this thing can handle some some track work. And and I and and Dodge was was a good sport about that. They are good sports. Yes. I have a good time. Yeah. So so it was as I remembered it. We picked it up at the airport. You know and it was it was very much old hat. I didn't take I didn't take enough pictures of it. I mean if I'm honest but it's everyone's seen one. Everyone knows it's a great arango. People listen great arango some racing stripes hood hood scoop. That's it. Yeah. And it's got you know having gone out of the new charger and back to this car. I actually appreciated quite a few things about the way they did it before. I thought the UI was actually a little better in the old car than in the than in the brand new you connect right. Yeah. This was that I think they had the best UI for years until Ford sync caught up but it wasn't until Ford sync v5. Yeah or something that they finally were more even. Yeah. I thought this I thought the seats are very nice and very comfortable and and and all that stuff. The old school the old school cruise control controls are hilarious. They still they have on this steering wheel a button for the adaptive radar cruise control which works well and then maybe an inch away the next button a button that looks very very similar for the non adaptive cruise control like I usually like you can if you have adaptive cruise control in a car you can then go into a menu somewhere and turn that off like you can toggle it off in a secondary menu. It is wild that they have a physical button for Matt because I do you know of people that well when we saw it I think I don't know people at toggle between them but when you pointed this out I think the Hyundai we recently had or the Kia also had this and Volvo has a weird thing but Volvo like hides it in the same button like you tap it a couple times to get adaptive and regular I've seen that but the double button it's not just Dodge and I wonder if they get their their hardware from the same supplier because I think I agree it is nonsense it's very confusing and I find myself tapping the wrong one. Well it's a journalist problem but like you know it just doesn't make sense to have both. I don't know man I think people confuse the gas and the fucking break I think if you are expecting adaptive cruise control and don't hit that button you could have a problematic situation on your hands. But on the way up didn't the radar sensor get covered and so we actually had to switch to two guns from missiles. That's funny. Not exactly it was a check it was a CEL sensor error that happened and and I was like that what we were about to be because it said it said you know sensor error adaptive cruise disabled right some lights set up and then for a moment I was like well this is the perfect situation I guess Dodge is sending me a sign of this is why I put the manual cruise button right next to it it's a backup cannot use it didn't work with the CEL up the regular cruise didn't work either. Now after we stopped somewhere for whatever 10 minutes and turned the car back on the errors went away they didn't come back so it's just some stupid bullshit who knows what was but anyway that's that's a weird thing. But like in general this one is like because it was a jailbreak and somehow this is a special paint scheme and and and whatnot this one was like 90,000 bucks but effectively you can go on Dodge lots right now and these are low to mid 70s right to really buy one of these and in a non special color that underneath is the same car. They're really fucking fast. This how did you notice how did you notice Zach in the race car and well how at what speed you hit the brakes on the front straight of road american. I think it was 130 something. 130 something. In the Durango it was 135 okay and in the race car I'm hitting the brakes at about the three and a half board the Durango there isn't a board but it would be a seven or an eight okay so the speed and you began using more boards as the week went on the weekend went on so we'll talk about that. Yeah forget the race car for a minute I don't want to get too much with you but but just as a comparison I had to stop way earlier in the Durango than the race car like hundreds of feet earlier and I saw speeds that I believe were higher in the Durango than I saw in the race car most of the time. I swear you hit 150 on the straight I really think when I rode right seat with you. In the Durango? Yeah no 150. I thought you did. I mean this thing. No I thought I pretty sure I saw 135 on the front straight I don't think I ever saw 150. When we went out for the HPD stuff and like you you know you were giving me orientation basically because I hadn't been here in 10 years you know through the corners in the back section we're getting caught by like a GTO car which was like the most powerful car that was there. Yeah. The straightway shows up and you started gapping this thing. I couldn't catch you. I did gap race cars. You just started pulling away. It's so funny. There were multiple race cars that I oh the prototype car. Oh forget about it. There was a prototype race car that I gapped on the front straight. This is very funny. Yeah those have 200 horsepower or something. Yeah yeah yeah yeah. You know the difference in cornering speed is 60 miles an hour or something but I the handling of this thing is for a three-row vehicle appropriate right. The balance is actually pretty pretty decent. The steering is like pretty communicative. I it does not have enough brakes. The track Hawk has better brakes had better brakes. It costs more money than the Durango. It always did but it had it had it had beefier brakes. It also had I think better tires. This had some like extra extra all seasonies like Scorpion zero something or other SUV tires. They were not particularly sporty tires and but yeah the the the brakes the fluid boiled on about the second stop. So dodge list the brakes as just Brembo four-wheel disc and I think you were saying that the the track Hawk has like 10 pissed in the track Hawk had the beast brakes. It had it was like not quite iris level brakes but it was serious serious business. Yeah it was a big deal when the track Hawk brakes came back to the regular Hellcats. Like they had they were the biggest brakes ever put in an American car at the time or something like that and the Durango to to save to save to make it sit below the track Hawk in the when it first fucking came out the track Hawk's gone but like when it first came out it was below it in the hierarchy and in part of the way it had that was it the brakes were good. So that's why like it's the it's actually kind of why in hindsight Jeep was a little more justified. I thought the word track Hawk was sort of stupid but like it was more like ready for the track. It like it really was. This thing felt ready. I mean I went out with you in the first session. You did many more sessions but then I got in it you know five hours later with Tato just so he could show me some stuff because the race cars having problems. He pulls out of pit. He brakes for turn one and the whole truck goes whoa and shakes. Yeah like these brakes withstand you know breaking force. It was like I don't know fiberboard in a hurricane or something. It was so it was so warped. It was there it was not great. Guys got to take a quick break because support is coming in from Aura frames and you know what Aura frames are. We've been talking about them for a while. They're those digital frames that are the perfect gift for your mom wife or partner. They can capture and relive mom's magic every day. What about throwing in there a candid shot that she never knew you took? A special shot from a moment in your history and Aura brings it back into her purview whenever you want right. You can you can send little blips of joy to the person in your life that is the most important. 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Yeah and I tried as hard as I could to be as easy as I could on the brakes because this is a big SUV but it didn't take very many stops further to go boom boom boom boom and it was like well then it stayed that way. Do you have a little video I shot that we used the trackhawk or the derango to pace the start of the race which was a pretty cool visual actually. He was kind of on it as we came by. Made a great sound. It sounds so good. The guy who was driving it for the pace lap his name was Trucker which is a great name and he came back from running those pace laps just like dude what the fuck is this thing. You didn't know what it was. It is it is a ride. It's a true it's a true hot rod. I would not recommend the derango for actually running a track days but if you if you never took it on a racetrack you would find it to be a fairly dynamic and certainly fun you know family hauler that was essentially the same price as the Genesis crossover I had but it's like 700 horsepower and three rows and you know can tow some stuff and all that. It's like a I don't know it's some sort of weird party like I think the regular RT has enough power for most things. Our gas mileage you know I think we topped out at 16 but at times we were down to like 11 when we were in traffic. Well we had ongoing bets going so we when we first got in the car. Me, Zach and Tommy prices right rules. We all bet that it would be somewhere around 12. Yeah. And but we didn't we thought that was just going to be for our drive to the track. Yeah. The two hours which ultimately we got around 16. We left the Detroit airport we got excuse me with the Chicago airport got straight on the highway and drove two hours and we ended up getting around 16 miles a gallon for a like a pure highway drive which is bad but like better than you'd think. Technically we the EPA rated it at 16 I think we got 16.4 which I mean considering we were definitely going faster than you'd go in the EPA cycle. I bet 11 for the record. Yeah. Yeah. And then and then when we started lapping it it the average was like two. Yeah. Like on the track it was getting two which is unreal. Two is amazing because Road America is four miles. So two is two gallons a lap which is wow which is fucking awesome. So much gas to burn. Even our race car it was like I think probably. Oh the car was pretty efficient. I think our car our race car was probably getting like eight or nine miles a gallon which is probably like two laps two and a half two and a quarter laps a gallon. But famously Clarkson when he reviewed the 4GT got four at like tracks. Yeah. Yeah. This was half fat. Yeah. It's also about twice as heavy. Absolutely incredible amount of consumption but I took a photo of the gas pump. Dude I mean if you're from California you're so spoiled because the race track at the track 91 was 575 up the road here it's 699. So I'm like hell yeah brother fucking fill her up. Let's burn some more whatever. Yeah. Instead of driving you know with the nearest station outside the track was like a couple miles away and it was like 480. Yeah. You know so you wouldn't you wouldn't save all that much. And in case you're wondering how an octane here was 12. So it's not like you know it's not like oh everything was you know it's like no no it's just that's so anyway. Yeah. So we burned lots of gas and then on the way back we got the same you know mileage and so our cumulative for the trip was like 12 4. I think you win. I think I won. I was 11 Tommy was 11 5 and you were like 12 2. I think I was 12 1. Yeah. So I was actually closest but it's it's it's it's you'd be spending so much money on fucking fuel driving this thing around. Yeah. Couple of funny things I know because I wrote in the back most of the time because you guys are taller than me. Backseat is very comfortable. USB ports are still USB A. They didn't cross over yet. So you bring your adapter. The ride in this thing is not great. Hang on the one in the front is a C. That makes sense. The ones in the back. Or kept the ones in the back and said hey save save a few bucks. But I you know it's is it the tracky version. So it should be stiff. Yes I guess. But in the back even over some smaller like just little concrete junctions. It was like good good good. The ride wasn't great. And in track mode the ride was like brutally bad. Like I had even when I went on the track I put it in first sport mode and for suspension and then actually back to comfort. Oh really. Yeah. Use more curb. Yeah. Take a big line. Go with the the gray curve. We're not supposed to touch. Well oh dude. So Ryan the commentator for WRL shout out to him. Me and him were doing the radio and I apparently refer to them as planter boxes and he's like I like that we're keeping that. So I guess now they're called planter boxes. But I like driving on those. You're not supposed to drive on those. Well the inside gray curbing is where a most of them Tato was like don't touch that or could cut a tire. And there's the outside gray curbing which is very ripply and is OK. It's just like bounces you around a lot which I explored many times. I mean like when there's like. Oh and you're talking about the gray where the grass is growing. Yeah. Now that's pretty smooth. Yeah. Yeah that's OK. They had a word for it that wasn't as good like grass creed or something like that. They called it grass creed and I was like no no no. If you're going to call it if you do that it needs to be lawn creed because that sounds like concrete. Yes. And then I was like but I like it is called grass creed. Yeah that's stupid. It should be long creed. These people don't ever think about naming stuff. And I liked planter boxes though. I thought they thought we thought that was better. But that is better. There's these weird extra curbing that and that wrote America. So you could take a fucking big wide line. But it's like it's like cinder blocks with grass growing through them. So you can you can drive on them. But it's like 60 percent grip of the track. But it's way better than the vibratey curbing. So you basically you just if you've got some fucking cojones you just go straddle the vibratey curbing and drive on the fucking planter box a bit. And then it's like a nice nice and then come back and then come back and then it's nice. I like to do that especially on the exit of 14. Nice line there. Oh yeah I did that. Yeah exit of 14. Yeah I didn't do it in the king because I didn't have that kind of balls. No when Tommy did it remember once. And he's like I touched the dirt once and I did not want to touch it again. No thank you. Yeah. But man you know it's despite the fuel economy being such shit I still think this thing at like nine years old or whatever this is is a pretty good value for money still. I like the Durango a lot. I mean I think almost any spec you know it's like choose your fuel mileage engine. Choose the efficiency level you want. It's like a character in a video game. And then looks nice. Helved a lot of luggage. You know a ton of stuff. Yeah. And if you got like just a regular RT I think the towing rating on those is pretty damn good. Well so the RT because I looked at you know this is part of our consideration package for towing. The RT has a higher tow rating than the Hellcat because of the self leveling suspension and like the the tow package option with the sport suspension it just like can't handle as much weight and it's not self leveling. So the Hellcat can tow like 5,000 pounds and the RT tows 8,000 pounds. Imagine the mileage like you're getting track mileage while towing something on the highway. That was terrible. There's gotta be someone who tows the fucking TRX and can tell us what I bet it's just terrible. And also well towing with your Raptor back in the day was bad because it was so soft. Now maybe the TRX has a better leveling system or something but having that much squat I did not enjoy it. No I didn't. It's something to Vegas. It made the steering suck. Yeah. Yeah it was not fun. The uh yeah the the regular the regular Durango RT with the self leveling would probably be a pretty good pretty good tow rig actually. I just uh who was I just talking to? Oh Ryan from Sacramento who said he uh he used to tow his race car which is a which is a track car which is a Cayman GT4 RS with uh with a fucking mccon with a tow package on it. Like it was a mccon GTS with a tune with a tow package and he said like it would tow just fine. It was great. It had air suspension like no big deal. Open trailer not fancy. He said it was about 4,500 pounds. No problem. And he's like I he's like and then I got rid of that and I got a Chevy Colorado. And he's like and it sucks. Yeah it's a forebanger. Yeah he's like even though like the horsepower and torque say it should be fine and the tow rating is fine he's like it is the weasiest motherfucker. You know that is a totally different scenario. He's like he's like yeah I got fun with that truck but and I know the numbers are similar but the the Colorado the bison one like versus the ranger raptor just having more cylinders it just feels more responsive. Yeah it's just one engine is trying its hardest and I think the Ford engine is like oh I could put a couple more plates on the bar. Just because it can doesn't mean it wants to. Yeah. But the Durango is the opposite. The hell guy is the opposite. He's like I have about three times the horsepower you would need for any given task pretty much. Yeah. A lot of radar bouncing around in Wisconsin. A lot of extraneous radar. My Valentine 2 was going batshit out there. Yeah. Constantly for pretty much no real reason. I wonder if they have sensors along the highway for something that are using K8. Like K8 has gotten so cheap that they use it for that instead of maybe we have to start researching if the effectiveness of K8 radar detectors are somehow declining. One of our patrons in the chat said they used to tow their race car with a McConning at 20 miles per gallon while towing. Yeah. Imagine thinking you need a super duty for something like that. You know it just depends on you know one single car trailer open you can make do and then once you start adding tires tool boxes and stuff like then you need a super duty. Yeah. Not well. There's stuff in between work. Yeah. Thanks Dodge. Letting us warp your rotors. Yeah. A little bit. Other than that we took pretty good care of it. The tires like did not exhibit much wear at all. We probably could have dropped PSI a few you know but like whatever. I think I wonder if this track seems like it's hard on breaks but not that hard on tires. It's a lot of long straights and sweepers and a heavy braking zone. And then you know yeah like the carousel is hard on tires. That's probably really about it. Yeah. No I mean the tires didn't really seem to go you know either in the Durango or or throughout the race really until the very you know I'm sure that there's a difference in lap times but it's like it's not like the car became a sloppy piece of shit. Yeah. Yeah. The tires fell off I think pretty smoothly. We'll talk about I know Tommy brought up some differences between his lap times and Tatos because he's like his ideas are impossible when you're the fourth driver on these tires. Yeah. That's why you put the experienced driver at the end. Very true. All right. So that's that's that. Shout out to Dodge for letting us burn fucking all the gas. Sorry about your brakes. I got an update from Matt Quick. Quick classics down in Tennessee that my cars because there are two of them have arrived. Guys taking a break from the action because support is coming in fast like Jim Farley the CEO of Ford who's now got a podcast and you're always asking me what I'm listening to when not recording this show and right now it's this the new season of Drive with Jim Farley in it. The Ford CEO talks to some of his favorite people about what they're driving and what drives them to succeed like Formula One driver Daniel Ricardo. Listen there is a well-worn trope about racing drivers not being interesting to listen to but if there is one that is interested interesting to listen to it is Daniel Ricardo. I think this guy's takes on stuff and life are great and look Jim is a racing driver also. I personally raced against him like two months ago and it for me a CEO that drives race cars on the weekends is about the pinnacle of CEOdom when it comes to car companies. So the two of them together obviously have a lot of things to discuss on Drive with Jim Farley which you can get on your podcast app. Very easy to find Drive with Jim Farley. Check it out. Here's the first and only photo I have of our E55 donor and as you can see it's like the perfect donor car. It's a very much an example of the crash isn't that bad. It got side-swiped and like sort of like crunched by like a semi-truck. So the suspension on the left side is messed up but like the powertrain is like totally untouched and the body on the left side is like gouged and I think the drivers and passenger doors may not open but again you don't need those. Who fucking cares. It's very much a complete and not that bad E55. Nice. I hopped up because I thought the windshield had a hole in it but it's just the building. Oh yeah no. The glass is I don't know about the driver's side window but the fucking rest of the glass is in there and then you can see on this other like fairly look when you're transporting two shitters you do not spend money on the transport. I'll fucking go enclosed on the way home but on the way there fucking gas is expensive. Look at the difference between your fenders and then the the outer edge of your wheels. Yeah yeah two or three inches. It's we see this sometimes someone like they could afford the fenders to bolt bolt it on and they're driving around but they haven't bought like the wheels yet or they haven't bought the spacers yet and it just looks weird or when I did drifting in my car and I put the narrow wheels on the back it looked like I'd been hit from both sides by a truck. That looks hilarious. I've seen people put wide bodies in their car and then no wheels and it looks really strange. That E46 that was one of the race cars had wider front fenders than an E46 M3. Yeah. It looked like a drift car but it was out there running laps. The white and the white. Yeah. Wide wide widespread in the skill set of the drivers in that car. Wide spread. One guy was like insanely fast and someone else was like what the fuck are you doing. So yeah you can see the the the metal fab and the primer that they did on those and Matt said you know like Sean said I think he said it when he was here last week like why even bother sending brand new bumpers across the country twice when he's just going to unbolt them to put the powertrain in. So no bumpers no lower rockers on the car and then we'll put all that stuff on when it comes back but the the new fenders are made of metal so they're they're on there. Yeah. But fucking stoked that's going to be this car is going to be real cool. It's going to be really cool. I think you'll keep it for a while. I hope so because I'm sort of like pivoting towards like you've got I've got the Porsche that's a keeper obviously. Kuntas keeper obviously between those two that really covers your weekend dynamic sporting needs completely. Yep. And then there's like the Manx for the perfect day fucking bullsh running around here and then I think Hannah probably wants to keep she likes the Taycan actually but if we if we eventually get this Cayenne she'd probably roll that this is the daily cruiser. This is like a combination I think of the Taycan in the Manx. Yeah. You know there's more there's whimsy in it and it's got style and it's custom made and all that shit but you could drive it 50 miles whereas the Manx like you're not going to drive the Manx to Burbank probably unless like for an errand you're not. No you're right. You take this. Yeah. Yeah. No I would not drive. No but I have the Manx is getting picked up tomorrow. So almost all cars are almost I could if I wanted I could have all cars in service at one time right now because we need to get this. You need a ride. Yeah. No. Here's the list. So this car is going to Nashville Lamborghini obviously mid reassembly who the fuck knows the the Taycan has a recall that it needs to get done which is probably for some stupid software bullshit. It seemed non urgent but also when we're going when I'm pulling like into my driveway or a real like kind of articulation the suspension is a little creaky just a little bit and I've tried like power washing it all out in there just to see if it was like mad dusty or whatever that didn't do it and Calvin said that you can it's possible to get like dried out pushing pushing and I guess they squirt grease in them or a copper grease or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. So he said they could just do that. So I got to get that done. But like NBD the Porsche they have Mitch thinks he has this maybe this thing for the cooling system that I'm talking about but also did I have we talked about the gear indicator light thing. Yeah. So the gear indicator light thing I was waiting to get a hold of Rick demand to get the exact ratios he put in so they could program them correctly with Mitch's tune because the gear indicator thing only came up after Mitch did the ninety one tune. But is the indicator not does does it not react just off of where the shifter is positioned. No. Oh I'm guessing it does not. Okay. Because it should it seems like it should but it does not because when I put the car into fourth gear the indicator on the dash is getting confused and going like four three four three four three and it's only for fourth gear. Don't really know why no other no other gear is affected. But I have all I've I've noticed that when I'm in fourth gear in the canyons and I do a hard excel to a big lift there's a bit of a bit of like like a bit of a stumble before it settles into D cell whereas with any other gear when that CEL because by the if I'm going through gears the CEL will come on in fourth and when the things but then I'll put in fifth the CEL will go away like it goes and comes and goes and comes and goes and comes which gears were changed to three four two through five two through five yeah so but only fourth is affecting this thing and any other year goes away. So if I let's say I go in third gear and I do an accelerate a big lift perfectly smooth but in fourth when the CEL comes on and so I would like that addressed so I haven't I haven't I'm not done haven't done anything about it just yet but they're working on that and they're going to have that. The Manx is getting picked up tomorrow to get all those upgrades in time for summer the front mount the cooling system the new tune they don't need to service it because they just serviced it from before ice race and I drove it nine nine miles and then nut and bolt the whole thing because after a thousand miles you gotta not bolt it because it's you know it's a fucking fiberglass thing on a thing and there's a cup recently particularly after ice race there's a couple squeaks a couple new squeaks and then fix my horn my horn spring that flew across the starting line that ejected right before my ice race laps which is a clip of on instagram it's pretty funny so that's getting that and then yeah that's that's that's that's it could be pretty much everything right now. One of our patrons says that there's a speed sensor that tells you what gear you're in so it's an issue I guess you've had before so maybe there's a sensor that's having yeah wonky yeah and that's what talks to it because I was like well you know maybe there's switches if there's six switches where the shifter hits it and it's like I'm in one I'm in two I'm in three but that would add complication there there is a hard sensor that plugs into the gearbox that can get like grime in it sometimes and so they you know they blow it out like a nintendo cartridge they checked that and that wasn't the problem oh okay so but Tim believes the issue is related to the programming of the ratios in the tune and I don't I don't really know but Rick said well just don't put them all in for service at the same time no no and also like there's Hannah's cars you know the power's fine so and the and the delicate pays for itself every day but working properly nice but but uh all the like all the fun cars could be in service at once right now if I really wanted to I don't so I'll be that would be stupid um what else do we have oh uh hey I just I just took a waymo ride to go home to get the tycon and it a it took a fucking weird route instead of taking its normal like pretty direct route it took a it took a roundabout route all the way around there which I thought was very odd it then tried to turn right into my neighborhood and got like sort of boxed out by this car and the waymo we were both going the speed limit and this BMW was x5 was at our rear three-quarter there was room the waymo could have gone but it wasn't I guess enough of a gap for the car to be comfortable and it didn't want to speed there was enough a couple hundred yards there's a there's a little bit of room to get there before as we're approaching the necessary intersection and a regular human would have either goose the throttle for a half a second and gone up or drop down to like 25 miles an hour and behind right get the draft yeah the waymo did neither the waymo maintained its 35 miles an hour it did not move over until and then until after the intersection that x5 goose the throttle to scoot up and then it just moved over and made the next right but by then that was like kind of far out of the way which I mean I suppose it it didn't do anything that was unsafe it did not make an unsafe move it and it did not exceed the speed limit and it did not dramatically dip below the speed limit but at the same time like I feel like it should have if if it's not going to speed I feel like it's appropriate to drop to slow down and duck behind it was a made a very odd choice I've related story so I took a cab from the airport and I'll tell you what human drivers human care so we both flew in I don't know if you did like the curbside pickup I went to the cab line our flight home from road you should just tell our flight home from road america story because it is pretty funny it does okay I will it's because it starts with the flight there we get to the airport to fly there and I go I think we're on different flights and you go what you're like why why would we do that which is a valid question and I pull it up and I go well I fly through whatever whatever city you go yeah me too and I go oh huh not sure why I thought that happens to me all the time I'm used to this conversation with my brain so we have the race through Minneapolis we fly there together we're on the same flight we're like two seats apart blah blah blah flight back we we you know our like you look at your flight and it's taken off at 710 and I look I'm like oh yeah 7 0 5 close enough you're probably rounding up and we go to the lounge and uh that says like oh your gates m7 yeah and I look at my thing it says m9 and I go oh app's not updating hmm people know where we're headed so we hang out for a couple hours we go to the gate we're sitting there and then uh when did I how did I figure it out because I had there was a they had a like a 10 minute like boarding delay yeah for the flight to Salt Lake City and you were like and you were like you were like we are going through Minneapolis oh that's right I was like what are you talking about look because you said we go through Salt Lake yeah and yeah and I looked I was like oh man we're going through Minneapolis and you're like no we're going through Salt Lake like we're going through Salt Lake and we're at a gate saying you know this flight departs for Salt Lake and your phone just says Minneapolis they were like what the fuck and I realized our my flight was my return flight was 710 and your flight was like 708 you know but to a different fucking city yeah it was that's when I was like we are on different flights on the way home and I'm at the wrong gate right now and I and I literally stood up took off running see up boom gone I said fuck and like just ran away just fully god and thank thank god the gate was two gates away and not like different terminal and I ran up and there on boarding group six out of eight and I was just like laughing holy shit and then we I land and I'm I sit at the back of the plane I don't get upgraded I'm in 27 takes me a while to get off the plane like everyone around my area is sitting because the European egress has landed in America people go row by row from front to back and people are more respectful remember it used to just be like yeah would rush yeah so I'm just like chilling I finally walk off I walk off I look to my left you're walking off to the minute to the minute yeah oh my god to the minute yeah um oh crazy and driver so I get a cab and I'm like man what's going on today there's like more traffic cab line is devoid of cars which is rare and the guy says oh they're doing construction on three different roads by lax everyone has to go out one way it's just like it's a pan the ass and so we're kind of following the route and meandering towards where everyone converges and all of a sudden we look ahead and there's all these those yellow vertical cones like a block off a lane two have been knocked down and a car drives through that gap and he just follows and and he goes he's like somebody knocked these over earlier and I'm like hey man go for the gap you know and he just like him and all I love it that like nature finds a way and the cab drivers always find a way look the way Mo would not have done that but the everyone's like oh there's the wall has a hole in it yeah I I love the adventure of the yellow cab home from lax so for lax for those this is a little inside baseball sorry but lax has in order to to help try to alleviate traffic within the lax terminal area they've moved all the taxis but also the ubers and everything else to like a side area and you have to either walk or take a shuttle to the side area oh zack has has pulled up the side area it's called la exit which is actually a very good name but like zoom out of it so it's just zoom out a second so it's like you the the the terminals look like a fucking NASCAR track right that's where they should have the fucking la grand prix do the la grand prix around lax we fucking crazy if the world falls apart you and I are doing that yes dude for sure yeah so that looks like a NASCAR track and it's a pretty it's bigger than it looks in a fucking photo obviously but uh then there's outside of it so you have to walk or take the shuttle I like to walk I walk and uh and then you either are get calling an uber or a lift to there or you're grabbing a yellow cab and there are tons of them they're all and it's just easier they're just right there and so I like the adventure because I live close and the cab drivers don't like that so you have to like so negotiate this like you're in fucking Calcutta or something uh and and that's okay man you know I got extra cat I got to take care of you blah blah blah blah and it's it's a fun it's a fun bit of negotiation that reminds you you live in a fucking society I mean ever since I just get in I go I live close but I'll take care of you and I've never gotten no one's ever gotten mad with what I've tipped this guy was like you said it you did it I appreciate that's yes he was Russian so I'm doing his voice you got to pre diffuse that situation then you're good yeah but I've I've had that I before I learned that technique I had a guy get real mad that he had waited for 30 minutes or 40 minutes to get a ride and they're only going fucking this few miles and what the fuck and the guy drove like he was so mad to you oh he beat the shit out this Prius fuck so hard it was wild this guy I asked him on the way I was like what do you how do you feel about the cab versus uber thing and he he said he drives for both and he's like if you drive a cab you are you know you do background checks they do all these things you're licensed by the city the same as a school bus driver insurance all that stuff yeah and the commercial insurance is expensive but he said with uber if they give you a really long drive like hey here's a new a new fare it's really long and you accept it and then it cancels it if you then don't do the short rides they hand you they'll stop scheduling you long rides like they punish you like he had a ride it was like a hundred dollars yeah 40 minutes and he's like okay and he drove all the way to wherever and then they canceled it on him and then they started giving him these really short routes like it's almost like a fishing lure yeah so then what he does he's like when they do that I stop accepting all of their rides I just stopped driving for them for three days they start giving you good rides again to come back they go like yeah they should they will be back this dude is 4d chess he is this is the move yeah this is canceling your serious subscription just a way just to wait him out yeah I'm out of order you're out of order yeah I was impressed yeah that's a get back out fucking respect yep yeah I fuck that I'm not playing your game you fucking you come to me when you've got a good offer he figured it out yeah that's a move I love it I love that shit that's great you see the new that BRZ rally car no but it's all it's got a turbo and all I did and all we'll drive in a sequential gearbox it's probably is it probably just like a Vermont sports car it's not probably not Subaru but like okay but look at badass hey Subaru get at me yeah we have the training this is where fucking this is what they're gonna do for what's his name David Higgins to set some new Isle of Man record in right probably or to give give ride the rally spec z I mean I am I am fucking ready for this lighter than current WRX based cars wow same specs that's a good combination yeah oh yeah it's for the all Japan rally championship yeah but I want to drive turbo motor that's awesome look at the ground clearance dude that would be so fun big big tall fenders but this one this one of the photos has more like a tarmac setup rally wheels right there the motor looks beefy I think they say it's you know they say it's 280 horsepower whatever but it's that's more than sufficient look at that it looks great not yet yeah no they've only this is just this set of photos yeah that'll be cool we will never get this no one will ever get it yeah yeah it's for the one one race that doesn't happen on this continent it would be so it would be so nice to have a turbo charged I don't care it's less balanced but yes it would be nice it would be rad yes I feel like I feel like they could develop that and probably sell a bunch of them for less than it would cost them to develop an all-new car I don't they know people I say that no nothing about what it costs to develop there has to be a reason they don't do it and maybe it's cafe averages or something they know everybody wants it and how good it would be like they're not dumb but come on do something sell a bad easy what if they just put like a fucking gr corolla three cylinder in that sure 300 horsepower you know what I mean sure why not I gotta tell you if you're out there and you want to be RZ don't put a catalyst exhaust on your car because they're one of the race cars had the skip barber car yeah that's one of the worst sounding vehicles I've ever heard in my life and while on the subject if you have an inline 6 BMW and you put a catalyst exhaust on it you sound like a 350z yeah those race cars sounded like shit the the e36 that one like as 406 is it was the loudest most 350z sound yeah dude very farty so much fart extremely farting all brussel sprouts and beans yeah what race cars sounded like really good well the mggt the amg the Mustang yeah the wheelhouse Mustang yeah sounded rad the Corvette could have sounded good it needs a little work to sound good yeah it's just too quiet it had an aftermarket exhaust but yeah they tried to really quiet I talked to the guys about that car there was a so tc Klein's c8 Corvette C8 Corvette which was based on a street car that was turned into a race car which was pretty fucking cool actually and it because of balance of power for wrl it it effectively like had to be they had to cut the throttle by like like a third like they said to me it's for the class we were in it's 10 horsepower at the wheels per per uh wait 20 hundred pounds 280 horsepower so yeah 10 to 1 and so that's what it was for us so whatever it was for them it's still 10 to 1 so they had to cut the throttle output by a bunch in order you can get to that number however you want so whether it's cutting fuel whether it's cutting revs whether it's cutting throttle position like whatever you want to do it because they just strap your car on a chassis dyno and they just check the output they don't really give a shit how you get there so these guys I thought they were cutting revs but they weren't they were cutting throttle pressure so basically the car never went faster than like two-thirds throttle yeah I think they said they pulled timing so if they pushed it past that cut point it just didn't do anything it just stayed there yeah it just stayed there so like it would keep going up in revs until the normal red line but it wouldn't add any like power so it was very so our little two series BMW was dead even with it in the straightaways but then it became a 2020 Corvette with suspension and AP racing brakes and a cage and it we it was breaking 50 meters later than us it was cornering faster than us we did not have much of a chance very true um um but uh I mean actually that that was the car that whatever ultimately knocked us off podium and race one because we had a mechanical and we might have beat it otherwise but that car looks huge when you're behind it in traffic yeah like we're in a modern car but it's a smaller one but it's around e46 is 36 I could not believe the size of the ass on the c8 community other older cars yeah and with the big wing on it and stuff it didn't huge the mustangs too were really big that's true yeah they're gigantic uh we'll get back to the race uh next episode let's go to the people uh let's go to the fucking people out there in patreon.com slash the smoking tire podcast where you can get the show live get the show early get the show extra get access to exclusive uh collabs and special edition moistenedizing that we do uh such as the broson fairy metallic uh canyon from notice that is coming out very very shortly we will have uh we will have news of this watch uh very very soon I just I want to wait until the watches are in hand and assembled that way when you order them you're gonna get one quick oh speaking of watches I bought a watch um you know there's a company called mb and f that's like they make crazy shit like what if a watch was more like a dog yes yeah starting at like $80,000 all the way up to millions of dollars never probably gonna have something like that but the guy who started at max pooser started a subdivision of that company called mad designs that is is avant garde watchmaking at a lower price point it's like m dot a dot d yeah mad editions that's it sorry and so they have a new they've got they had this watch that had had the rotor on the front and you have to enter lotteries to get them they you know they're they're more affordable this watch was like four thousand bucks instead of you know whatever so they have a new a new uh watch that they've been doing it's not this one are there is there more on the go to the mish uh mad no that's mb and f sorry go back to mad editions it's the two it's the new one keep going scroll down is it that one the mad two so it has these two these two dials and then you see the little dots around the outside those are on the winding rotor which spin around the back so there's like this like crazy loom light show this spin constantly like as you're moving your yeah as you're moving your wrist it spins it's pretty neat right that's pretty cool so this is like three thousand bucks so they've done for their for the they've done four lotteries so far to get watches i've entered all four and lost so they've just have a new version of the mad two called the mad two redemption which is exclusively for people that have entered four lotteries and lost that's okay if you've entered four and not gotten to win one then they invite you to buy this one and it's a and it's a special color of that and on the back it says something like persistence is key on the back of it so i had lost all the raffles and and and i was invited to buy the redemption which is the red dial version of this mad two and i bought it where don't want to have a picture of it go type uh type mad two redemption and there were a couple news stories about it yeah that's it it's very red it's that one oh yeah i think it's the same pictures that are using they may have just shown it on the other side all right cool so red dial black disc very excited it's very thin nice um one of the other ones look really thick but yeah the well the mad one huge super thick the one with that rotor on top yeah and i really wanted one of those and uh our buddy Jared at neighborhood watch club had one for sale and i tried it on and it was like wearing a fucking abraham lincoln top hat on my wrist i was like i can't wear that motherfucker this is much thinner cool little piece very cool a little logo is cool yeah not not insanely expensive but i love it's like a pot it is yeah totally totally it's cool uh i love max booser and i will never probably be able to afford a real mb and f and so this is where we're at and uh it says delivery april to december of 2026 that's what it says so it'll show up eventually this year my card my credit card was billed so it will show up eventually this year but like and i'm happy to wait i don't mind uh uh max booser has a track record of delivering the products that he's selling to people so it's okay but uh i don't want our customers with the canyon to wait so we're waiting till all the watches are ready that way when we launch it you you actually get the thing you paid for quickly got it this is important to me um so to the people to the people christian says do you guys cringe when you see base model sports cars park with their spoilers up uh i wouldn't say cringe i would say chuckle i chuckle yeah it's a little silly but i get it they're excited it's got a wing you don't want to show it off i've also seen recently a bunch of folks who park and pop their hood in order to ostensibly cool their engines in cars that absolutely do not need that not at a car show not at a car show they just after like yeah after like a drive yeah yeah like maybe a group maybe a group drive and for the record and i want to say i'm not talking about abhi who comes on the road and track drives who was doing who was doing that but he had a ferrari 355 and he was ripping it he that's fine though them shits run hot i'm talking about other a regular modern car it's a modern car will it cool it quicker sure but does it need to need that no i mean at press drives we do track stuff and they never they never do that just cycle people in and out yeah so uh but the spoiler up yeah i drove my spider and put the spoiler up the last time i went up the crest and when i got to new coms i got out of the car forgetting that it was up and i felt like a real loser and got back in the car and put it down yeah open wide throttle dds says uh what do you think of the new ls7 base c8 and ls7 grand sport grand sport x etc what is that going to do to the uh the quote dot one c8 markets corvettes depreciate i mean all all all corvettes depreciate in the short term except uh except the manual transmission zr1 from 2019 but that's for a very specific set of circumstances all c8s depreciate so um you know if if a flood of people go to trade in their base c8 for a grand sport or trade in their z06 for a grand sport uh you know they there may be more on the market and the price of the used ones may go down um wait are they putting an ls7 in the base c8 i'm trying to find the story the the word is that eventually the refresh there will be an ls7 in the base that's that's the word i don't know if it's confirmed yet but for now it's going to be grand sport and grand sport x which has the electric all-wheel drive and then the word is the refresh that will be the base motor okay unconfirmed yeah i don't know if it'll speed up depreciation that much but i mean the current the base engine's awesome i think it's amazing works great put power into it put mods into it but yeah the ls7 does have the lore and it's an impressive engine of course i was talking to surge uh at the race about like what would be because i was like why are why have you guys not like fucking joined willow springs yet and we're talking about like what would be the perfect you know like like weekend track toy and i was like right now dude 5000 miles zero six is like game on yep for your weekend track playing i mean you cannot do better than something like that for a hundred grand that car is so fast it is and i wonder you know because tato races super trafio rear-wheel drive made engine big power car the zero ones i think faster than the super zero zero six excuse me the zero six i think is faster right but it's like at least it's similar yeah you know versus you know he said they were similar he said like in dynamically they were kind of kind of a good training tool big great car tato was also saying that like used super trafios are really cheap that's like a gyardo super trafio like that would be a that'd be a good time for a track toy uh co-ed naked nine six nine i haven't heard the term co-ed naked in 20 years i don't remember if was it from oh you don't know is for for a few years there was a whole theme of like t-shirts there was like fake events that was like co-ed naked volleyball it was like right along the same times as the bar hats and the circle hats oh right that were in favor i haven't heard but i haven't thought about co-ed naked and fucking forever i bet you go on etsy and get some vintage co-ed naked shit you there's a website co-ed naked dot com selling you know nineties themed yeah shirts but they're you know remade co-ed naked billiards yeah okay i definitely had at least at least and there's a slight like it's like co-ed naked billiards and then there's like a joke yeah co-ed naked lacrosse rough tough and in the buff oh it that's the one i had that's absolutely it yeah because i was uh i was lacrosse man god damn i did have that lacrosse shirt yo fucking email me that link we're bringing it back baby and it's gone like i'm offering this shirt i'm ordering it for her god when i was a kid i like fought my parents you know one of those dumb big johnson shirts that was like the least classy and i think i wore it once like an asshole but now looking back like those are just like gross boomer jokes yeah huge like on and for people listening it would be like big johnson crawfish like pinch the back lick the head it's like it's all really overt sexual shit i used to one in one of my first jobs when i was doing graphic design at the firm in in new york city was to not to do like gross boomer joke versions of it but it was like to come up with fake events to make t-shirts for like the shit you see at target like you know some down home fishing tournament whatever the bullshit you know events that are on these shirts but yeah dude go ahead naked lacrosse i fucking had that wow haven't thought about that in a minute let's go back to when your name is too good it sends us on a totally decent you can time travel once to a car related event where do you go and why is it the monaco grand prix 1988 i yeah how about that's a good one how about the nerburgring for that the one how about i am i have the job i have now but it is 1984 and i have been invited by mercedes to attend the 190 e 2.5 16 global launch program at the nerburgring where they will be holding an exhibition race featuring nicky lauda the f1 grid and a young rick rookie called airton senna who might do something impressive now and you they put you in the car at the back you think like were there journalist drivers too or oh yeah no i'm riding right seat oh there we go yeah that would be cool this is a jeff day program i'm riding right seat yeah i think i would choose monaco but in the 70s instead of the 80s uh-huh or like pre-ades pre-ades yeah like i well yeah wattkins glenn you know 69 that's just nuts yeah yeah hold the way they call it the pit whatever it is yeah uh the brains i had went to my head says uh could a tycon uh rear wheel drive or four s be a good enough replacement for a cayman on good curvy roads yes i mean assuming you obviously don't mind uh you know the the lack of fizz of an electric car dynamically steering ride handling fuck to the yeah particularly the rear drive the rear drive car is the super super super sleeper secret because it feels just like a kid and i think not only is a visibility out the front really good but like you see the little pontoon fender so it's a good visual it's a it feels very much like a sports car yeah you know put on the soundtrack of a of an engine uh quadrupholi o-face i bought a 4600 mile 2021 e 63 wagon to replace my mazorati trophay okay i don't like having cars out of warranty and i've never bought a five-year-old car before uh it has one year of cpo left but i'm having trouble justifying buying more warranty when i'm gonna tune it and it doesn't have air suspension am i taking a risk well if you're gonna tune it you're gonna you'd you would mess with your powertrain warranty potentially and if it doesn't have air suspension that's the other really big one on one of those cars that could could be expensive i mean is it risky yeah but it's just math like it is just math like your probably not gonna blow something up that's like 40 000 you're gonna you can you might break something three or four thousand dollars is that gonna really fuck you up i don't know i would i'd refer to the forums and see like is there a weak link especially with the tune that is known for braking or are they known for handling it no problem and running fine for 20 30 000 miles yeah so i would do that yeah i i mean i've owned owned some cars out of warranty and and so far it's been all right you know i have to fix something once in a while but it's not been that bad um i don't think i'd want to own an ev out of warranty because it's still questions surrounding you know what happens if something goes wrong with the battery and what that might cost to fix and there's there's just to me there are some you know uncertainties that i'm not personally comfortable with somebody might be but i'm not but like it's not like an amge 63 is like a horribly unreliable car you know they're not known for being pieces of shit they're known for having some expensive maintenance needs like i'd be more concerned with your brake replacement costs sure dude break if that car has like ceramics on it yeah like brakes could be 20 000 dollars and even when remember we had a i had to i was selling that guy's e 63 and they were the buyers were bitching about how much brake life was left and this and that and the announce and stuff and i would do and i went to the dealer to find out what a replacement cost was on a steel set of brakes and it was like 10 g's that was crazy so like i'd be more concerned about that than i would be about something breaking that it that is unexpected i'd be like because that that amg brakes i was truly shocked by the cost of because those cars don't seem to me like they are quote exotic and those are exotic car brake prices so that was very surprising darien lux says slayer famously did their earliest tours in a camaro hauling a trailer can you get a photo of that what are some other inappropriate vehicles and setups for going on tour that would command the most street cred street cred and going on tour i mean you have to be like if you want street cred and tour like you kind of have to be like broke right isn't that is doesn't have to be like shitty yeah like you have to have a pretty shitty vehicle so it would have to be like you know old school really terrible vans that's i i feel like i feel like a van like a rolling heavy van from the 70s or 80s is your sort of ultimate touring band street cred right yeah those are rad bands we saw a couple in the charlotte man they just they got a good stance they look fun or if you like i mean if you like a punk band if you're like a three-piece punk band you'd have to go like an old like a x u-haul truck where you're just sitting three across and like you're somehow living in that box i think uh like an ltd wagon from back in the day would be cool with like an exhaust on it shove everything and someone can lay across the back i cannot find a no photos huh slayers camaro a photo of it i find there's an interview where they talk about it but you know they started touring boob 84 uh tom ariah's camaro was telling a u-haul trailer all right duffel shuffle retirement club says what travel destination has the best food because i sure as hell no it's not wisconsin shout out to duffel shuffle retirement club who we met yeah at the race this weekend and uh we won't spell his name we won't dox him yeah but uh lovely chap yep nice to meet him met we met a few nice fans of the race this weekend yeah we did wisconsin people very wisconsin of you uh loved your cheese loved your sausage surgio had a fucking butcher in shabuigan that's amazing bomb steaks and boy if you need someone on the grill normally i'm happy to grill but we had a fucking argentinian i was like that's all you homie and he did not disappoint did not superb uh i mean what travel destination i mean dude fucking italy japan yeah i think new york is amazing i also think la has some of the best most diverse high quality food of anywhere on earth totally um spain i mean it's not diverse but i eat very well every time i go to spain new zealand it's kind of limited menu but every day has grown there for the most part yeah really fresh and delicious yeah uh holy mackaroni uh just watch zack's 2019 video on the miata right uh rf right now 2026 pricing for the same car is 43 to 45 000 out the door is it still a worthy proposition no no the soft top is substantially cheaper isn't it it's it's in the middle 30s isn't it i forget what the last one was that we drove the last one we drove was a grand touring i think right and middle 30s yeah it's middle 30s yeah i mean dude for 40 like i would rather get the soft top if i want a hard top coupe i'd rather get a g r86 yeah for 10 000 15 000 less dollars and the you know not a lot of justification for an rf miata for that much money when you could have the brz or the 86 with the updated engine and stuff that's way better yeah uh harlequin e 63 amg opinion on the decision for mclaren to start making golf clubs and sponsoring justin rose is ours mclaren making golf clubs i say the question is are they making them are they white labeling them and you know launching off of their success just give it a give it a quake i've this is the first i'm hurt i've here heard have i forgotten to talk today did you forget to talk forgot how did you were you fucked up yesterday oh yeah i was i yesterday i was i was sick i felt so exhausted we got home at one in the morning after what was effectively a 22 hour day and uh i was just and then all yesterday i had so much catch up work to do i was like go go go go go go and then at eight i was like oh there's the wall and just fucking done and i slept and woke up and woke up at 5 30 a.m. and i'm fucking crazy still a little wonky okay mclaren irons look at this okay uh uh uh uh the late way okay i just i just let okay i've had the opportunity i mean it it does seem like like it does seem like these are made at least sort of by mclaren pro uh short heel toe eighth mclaren papaya speed mark logo it uh top level designers at mclaren golf who is a designer at home in the golf uh okay i mean this is my life i think it has it's well joining designers at top at mclaren golf so i guess they've been around for a little bit we got to call me dude we got to call mclaren and uh get a press press loan share some clubs let's fucking go all right i would try some mclaren irons you think they make the carbon shafts uh probably i need maybe i don't know uh row row row your bo bachman some people say that cars are wait some people say that cars that are hated new or struggle to sell when now will be valuable in the valuable in the future like the for gt was back in the day what car now fits that mold for the future uh mozorati mc 20s probably yeah for sure uh not hated but like they'll be rare they'll be pretty i mean probably a lot of the m cars people you know the designs are controversial but if eventually we're more electrified people will always look to like what was the last really fast thing that was fun um maybe see well i mean there's there are the cars what do people despise or not buy right now well it's always the things that were like hatches have gone away and we all finally look back at them so small cars the more and more we get more crossovers and larger vehicles we'll probably look back like that specifically nismo z's they don't sell a lot of those they'll probably be valuable they usually hold they hold value really well um you know i think in this this fuel economy maybe you know hellcats and stuff if they're still whatever hellcat powered things um maybe you know maybe some EVs you know maybe the maybe the remac de vera maybe uh lucids lucids those don't see those are struggling yeah maybe that'll be weird but maybe um paul says wait oh are there aesthetic car designs that uh are that that uh are okay i think the wording of the question is weird so i need to change the wording something a little less weird but i know what you mean are there any brand cues in styling that you really don't like for example the grill shape of 2020 10 infinities which is that like oval grill shape i know what you mean uh such as like the the mouth of astin martin's or or whatever um aesthetic designs common was going to given i don't like what most of the hunday key uh genesis brands are doing with the front of their electric vehicles where they're all sort of froggy and fishy except for the ionic five which has got its own sort of that um it's not steampunk uh eight bit sort of aesthetic um that but all the rest of them the genesis and that like the froggy front of the EVs i don't love uh i really don't like a lot of what like for our going on across ferrari's entire lineup right now yeah tonight well tonight's fine i think what i don't like i think kia does it where they split the small headlights up top in a big light down below where it looks like a giant fog light and it separates you know the the headlight design i just think that looks really weird on it pretty much anything i don't like on nissan's suv's that blacked out sea pillar the floating roof design yeah that was a weird choice and they keep doing it yeah um makes the roof look like the the the roof line of a boat over like the over like a center it looks like a center console's roof like a flybridge roof i i still don't love mclaren's you know headlight intake design but it's distinct and the cars are amazing like it's just when i look at it especially the lights off i just go it's weird pocket it's kind of strange i just prefer like the smoother shapes of other things but you know the cars are so good that i will let it pass um yeah every other week i gots to buy new vogue's uh was an m1 13 k ever considered for the mercedes project why or why not that's the supercharged v8 that you got for the uh the 2004 e 55 that everybody loves to modify in tune uh no because it's just so much more power than i would ever fucking need i mean the ause that my mercedes will see full throttle at 400 horsepower more than a handful of times in its life are very small it's a cruiser so and it's gonna feel fast yeah so this is a car that came with a 220 horsepower in line six going to a 400 horsepower v8 and a five speed auto is a it's going to be with a different diff ratio as well is going to be this is going to be a monster you know at the 20 to 80 this will be a very fast car by the standards of does this feel fast or not yes it will feel fast it'll pull a vet um from my understanding about talking with shunt and matt quick the cost of a donor and the complexity because it's a different chassis of vehicle that's it that's now that's now 201 or whatever it is w2 it's the next gen of car the the electronics and integrating the electronics from that gen into this are much more complicated it's way more involved it's way more expensive and the benefit would not be something that i am seeking so a lot of people on the internet were like fucking supercharger or bust but like no it's not that's not needed uh keel and toe says do you think the uptick in values of early 2000s and 2010s mid-engine v8 ferrari's is a sign that collectors don't like ferrari's current hybrid lineup and prefer na v8 engines yes i do think that and i just saw a thing from the intercooler that values of f8s with higher miles are higher than 296 with lower miles yeah the v8 twin turbo people hybrid people want that yep yeah they don't want to deal with the hybrid and they do want to deal with more cylinders and and uh and non-hybridized speed expectant widowmaker uh my wife needs a commuter three days a week 30 ish miles two days 50 miles that's that's easy any car any car would cover sure currently has an outie a4 which she likes what would be a better option than a cheap lease on the new outie electric coop looking to upgrade must be new no suvs or crossovers all right so so electric coops or sedans um well uh that it sounds like you're mostly in the right place here um i mean i i don't recommend tesla's to people but like a model three yeah maybe mochi no that's probably considered a crossover crossover i mean the gen i just mm w what's it called is the new i3 from when is the that's not out yet the new class at all but looking to upgrade in 12 months i maybe this new bmw that's coming out the new i i3 um i mean there's with no all these cars are small crossovers yeah there's not a lot of electric sedans right hunday canceled the ionic uh five unless you want to six six the council the six unless you want to jump to the end which is expensive i mean if there's a leftover ionic six somewhere they'll be given that motherfucker they look weird but drive nice uh i feel like we're missing something besides it's a little it's a little crossovery but i really liked that genesis gv 60 it's not yeah it's not going to be you know just cheap as the as the the cheapest outy one but like i thought it was great um yeah but like when you say if you say it's gotta be a sedan like there just aren't that many yeah especially with ev if you switch to gas there's a few more but there's still a lot of time i mean how about a prius like prius would be like rad i mean they're very comfortable they look nice throw some rims on and if she wants to be more premium you could look at uh lexus you could you go es um es hybrid that's a really nice car yeah i know it's bigger than the a4 but there's a if you do the prius plug-in yeah you'd get like 38 miles of ev so most of those three days a week you're be you're driving ev only and then the two days 50 miles like that's you know what i mean like you still you're still mostly ev there very true i would check on the prius honestly they're fucking giving them shits away um i read an article that uh now that basically all of toyota's hybrid is just fully our toyos lineup is hybridized the prius is like why are we getting a prius instead of just a hybrid cam you know for because a a hybrid camry is not much more expensive than a prius and it's a bigger more comfortable vehicle and you know bless you and it gets like you know 40 miles a gallon or 45 instead of like 52 53 city 50 highway for the camry yep wow look at that that's wild yeah that's awesome so yeah i can understand why not many people want to get a prius but i think the prius looks good it does look cool looks good on rims uh go miffune um live in the upper west i'm looking for a sub 30k weekend car i plan on doing a beginner's track school eventually get some laps at rhod america would i be missing out on some fun with a miata or 86 or should i get a nicest vet i can find for the money if you're a beginner i would not get a corvette i would probably that's a great track car you can grow with for for forever basically but as your first foray into this on a track that has this much speed i would 100 not buy a corvette if you're going to do track stuff in it yeah i mean 30k fortunately is a good budget it's not like you said 10 you know 10 in today's money is not getting you very far but 30 dude the world's mustangs and cameros are your fucking oyster right here 30 is all the money in the world for a used Mustang and some suspension and brake parts and tires eventually or you get a used you get a used gt that has the track pack one or two and they probably have fallen down in the 30s you might be able to find a boss sure two maybe 30 with high miles on it uh 330 ci we talk about a lot you could probably find a camaro ss one le for 30s such a good car that'll be great it's also really pretty fast it is pretty they have the camaro uh the v6 with the one the with the handling kit can only do v6 want to leave rare yeah that's pretty good yeah probably pretty cheap um but but if you if you don't i mean rhoda america is very very fast and so on the one hand like it's more fun when you've got some horsepower on the other hand um as a beginner your consequences there can be very very high if you if you start to push it in a really big power car and i also think you can you'll learn more from a slower car and those lessons apply to a faster car of course yeah a gret six or something look into the whole the mods with the oil uh draw issue but that would be such a great car yeah uh stan gable did nothing wrong uh what would it take to change the public perception of the corvette being kind of white trash many years i mean i think it's look they got to sell a lot of them and i think if there's just a proliferation of something it's just going to attract a label and like they're great cars but they're bought by so many people and there's such a stereotype behind them at this point after decades like how do you get away from that i don't i think the c8 has done a lot to break up some of the trashiness uh the kind of people i see driving c8s are not monolithic at all particularly in this city i see old people i see young people i see men and women i see uh young black men driving uh c8s all the time around this area i see uh asian people uh in la driving uh c8s particularly high spec ones in the beveley hills area i think more people are buying corvettes now because of the c8 then then definitely would have bought a car in the past and i think for the most part gm has not turned off their core audience with the car either i think a lot of those old old guys that would have had the c6 or c7 are rolling into c8s and a lot of the people who come on our road and track events bring c8s um and and now that now that z06 has been out for a couple years now that z our most recent event in the desert we had two zo two zr ones two zo sixes and two base cars so um i think uh i think people are getting high specification cars and you know a fucking full carbon zr one track pack like that ain't trashy that's an exotic car now it's an exotic car because before they were very fast and they kept up with a lot of exotics but they didn't look exotic and now it does look like an exotic car and obviously it keeps up i don't know if let us know in the comments if in your area outside of la if it's if the ownership is as diverse yeah uh chris p bacon says just sold my c5 z06 and used the money as a down payment for a new gti couldn't be happier uh also drove the new m2 and m3 and wasn't blown away by the interior quality considering they're more than double the price of the gti uh at what price point do you start getting diminishing returns on interior build quality good question i think there's not much for most european brands you hit about 50 grand and then it really stalls yep until you hit about 100 to 150 grand maybe at maybe even more because i think these days i think suppliers have figured out hunt is a great example you can get a lot of similar looking buttons um and controls in those cars they figured out how to make quilted you know leather-ish door cards that look like something out of a Bentley essentially so i think you have this gap where everything looks really nice and then at 50 you have to jump to 200 where suddenly the hardware you touch like in the astin you know the wheels feel a little bit more solid and like the resistance on the buttons is just a little bit more perfect and not as you know lightweight and flinty that kind of stuff but i think there's a there's a huge jump you need to on the spend yeah to feel a difference the Honda Civic si i think has a lot of the same materials you'd find in the bmw m3 and in order to go to go up to that you might have to get a 180 thousand dollar alpina something something with the next level materials or something right um Porsche is an interesting one because i actually think the Cayman and the 911 if they you know they're screwed together just as tight as the quality is like pretty consistent so the materials will get nicer as you go up and up the food chain but but even like when i drive a base 911 even though it's like rubberized on the top like the quality is really tight so i'm not as like bothered by it it's like really premium rubber but then there's a really when you go from like 100 to like 400 like when you go to Bentley then it's like okay now here we go you know it's and it's truly exotic materials and there's like no plastic and even the quote piano black is the higher quality yeah it's not just black plastic it's like actually the piano black or like the ceramic white they use in the Range Rover just like things that you do not see in other cars but in general like a a Volkswagen like a loaded up GTI will have approximately the fit and finish level of a 80 or 100 thousand dollar car that's a there's a there's a it's a pretty flat curve in that range yeah and plus when you add the screens in these days that makes yeah your center stack looks as nice or nearly as nice as something from an Audi or more expensive car because it's delivering you crispy information occasionally you'll have a surprise and delight like Volvo's wool or something where you go oh this is a material that goes above and beyond what i'm paying for here you know um a particularly well sculpted seat a thing that's wrapped in leather or sway that is a normally wrapped in leather that kind of thing but like most of the time it's pretty flat up to up to the exotics SIGS inside i want to take my dog camping soon because the girls i date are only interested in glamping or luxury hotels uh oh this is a zack question what what essentials do you recommend for camping out of your vehicle for a weekend at a national park especially with a dog perfect for zack i'm going to pee take it over i mean first of all i see your dog camp well i had a bar mitzvah but not genetically but uh first of all i think you might end up eventually changing the choice of the girls you date um because then you can do the things together there are plenty of women out there that really like camping with a dog but that notwithstanding maybe your your girlfriend wife doesn't want to camp um i don't see the benefit to sleeping off the ground on rooftop tent and i've talked a lot of people that do it i'd say half of them regret doing it yeah you can park your car and once you level it like you have this sturdy platform um if you have to get up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom you have to go down the stairs and getting the dog in there depends on the dog you have depends on the stairs you have for that rooftop or truck bed tent so that i think is a huge point against the rooftop tent also if you want to drive somewhere and leave camp behind you can't um now if you want to camp in the vehicle suv or something like that things to pay attention to it's the same thing as when you sleep in a tent is you're gonna have air going under the car sometimes the air underneath you can get very cold and that cold air will go through the body of the car into the thing you're sleeping on so you need to have some sort of like ground mat or blanket between your sleeping pad and the car also true um on if you're sleeping in a tent but the earth tends to be a little warmer than the air moving around it so those are all things to keep in mind nothing wrong with the tent our dog we slept with a tent if the dog wants to go out and bark at something you just unzip it and it just gets to go so i don't really see advantages to camping in the vehicle except it's like bare proof and more weather proof so that's my thought perfect timing you solved their problem zack i think so great told them to break up with their significant other martin site says 10 years ago when i was in engineering school all the automakers who talked to us at the major focus was advancing materials to make things thinner and lighter in pursuit of better fuel economy somehow cars are elephants compared to 10 years ago being that a design cycle is nearly that time span and they changed their mind on what's important how quickly could we see turnarounds on automotive trends i mean well you can see here's how you i mean you can we just saw it right the tesla model s came out in 2012 by you know 2017 or 18 several other major automakers announced you know plans to build evs and then by 2020 2021 many odd almost all mainstream automakers came out with at least one ev 2022 even more and then it was like then it was like oh by 2030 maybe there's the mandate so they all was like pivot to evs and then now you have trump throwing all that in the garbage and now everyone running away from it so over the course of 15 years we've seen a swing and then a swing back so that's that's the turnaround time right seven eight years i also think and then break them it seems like they've also had so much success with engine efficiency and aerodynamic efficiency that they're getting the mpg they're hitting the goals that they need to hit so they don't really need to make the cars lighter and if people are always going to ask for more creature comforts more gadgets more stuff they're all right well we can provide the the customer with what they want and we hit the mpg targets we don't need to make the cars lighter yeah only we give a shit only journalists drivers really care that the cars are getting heavier right everyone else only cares about features yep yeah uh big ben says i'm doing my first track day in my f80 in june an h pd event i need to provide my own helmet as someone getting into hopefully more track days what do you recommend as a helmet open or full face uh opinion about your criteria about other brands etc okay so for the only reason the only reason that i even own an open face helmet is because i have a camera pointed at my face when i'm on the racetrack outside of that i don't really see a good reason to wear an open face helmet a closed face helmet even in a car with airbags will protect you more than an open face helmet will so um mine is just for television i have no other or for youtube or whatever the fuck there's there's no other reason for it um full face is good the most important thing you know is not necessarily the brand because any of the top brands are going to be are going to be good but um is the fit i mean really it's the fit once you once you i wouldn't buy the cheapest helmet they sell you know i would go up a little bit from that but like you also don't need to go out and get a two thousand dollar custom made anything um you know you it's you really want a good fit and so if possible even if you have to drive you know an hour from home or something i would try to find somewhere where you can try helmets on yeah um there's also i think some kits or maybe some shops where they will kind of measure the shape of your head because so different manufacturers are kind of known for making helmets with slightly different shape like oval shape square shape and i didn't think about this at all till i started researching helmets and my helmet if i don't shove it down perfectly like pressure puts pressure on the front of my my head a little bit in a weird spot because i think it's slightly the wrong shape yeah so if find a way to do that and that will help inform you which brands you should start with and then if you can put it on and leave it on for 20 minutes you know that will inform you on size and shape so that's that's the first one i mean if you can go somewhere to try one on in person if not you know maybe you need to look for a retailer that has a pretty solid return policy and maybe you need to order three or four helmets and try them on and send them back um sometimes if the manufacturer that makes the helmet also makes motorcycle helmets you can go to the motorcycle shop try on their motorcycle helmets and get a sense of how they that brands helmets fit your head and then you can go from there three point um but uh yeah i mean and and and with brands like there's there's the big ones there's bell there's zampe there's a rye there's what do you use racing no bell bell yeah um my my my racing helmet is from a company called impact that i'd never even heard of before so and i love my helmet mine is mine is custom made and actually as i just found out it's expires well but in impact i think you said it was started by the guy that started simpson racing right yeah started by bill simpson yeah yeah so pretty good another good brand yeah so um and i and the other thing is um i don't like personally i don't like tinted visors i don't i don't ever drive with a visor down and if i so i wear sunglasses inside my helmet i on the opposing side i swapped a tinted visor this weekend and i loved it but that's because whatever is with my helmet shape and also the glasses i was using they were fitting weird and putting pressure so make if you do that like make sure the glasses like you do wrap around your head yeah and really hide back there yeah um my helmet wasn't crazy expensive another thing is weight yeah look at the weight of the helmets because when i bought my bell i could have spent 200 more dollars or something for like the entry carbon but it weighed more than the one i got and i'm pretty sure the store owner was like it's because it's carbon on the outside of plastic yeah like sometimes the entry level carbon helmets aren't carbon it's like aesthetic carbon bullshit carbon yeah to like 1500 to two grand for a lighter helmet you know weight will matter but how much does it matter to your wallet yeah um and i have some vents on the top i think that's important for anybody they don't have to be complicated expensive things but like venting the heat out of the helmet is very handy yeah when you're i mean it doesn't matter so much for track days you're if you're in the car your visor will probably be open anyway but like dude when you're doing an endurance race and you're doing a driver change and you have to have your visor down and you're breathing hard and it's hot and you're trying to like do your fucking harnesses that are going to keep you alive and you can't see those things behind the tiny fuel reset button black button on a black dashboard yeah these things matter yeah um wheat city night court uh the ferrari f80 is starting to hit the streets in various colors have you changed your opinions on the design since the initial announcement no ugly car that's an ugly car and actually i saw um i've seen more photos of the testarosa that's gotten worse in other colors can you notice these nuts great um it flows pretty well oh sorry that's oh uh tappin z's nuts sorry so other nuts i don't have a budget for ppf what are some ways i can protect my paint and current condition the uh ceramic coating um is a lot cheaper than than ppf and offers some protection not not from rocks or impact but from uh bug splats and things like that and also just like washing your car a lot just keeping your keeping your car generally very clean there's some salt there's some good waxes out there too right that'll prevent it protected against like little sand blasts and things yeah i mean wax wax was the thing for 50 years and it does work for sure and coatings work too i mean ceramic coatings ammo reflex we like you can you can do ammo reflex at home by yourself you don't need to go to a professional to do it larry has a great video on it you can just follow his tips and do it yourself without messing stuff up so i have ammo reflex on my cars um okay don't judge an engine by its valve cover i'm looking at turro a c8 corvette for a vacation how tight do we need to pack in order to fit our bags in the c8 or is there plenty of room so okay you got your frunk and you got your trunk i assume the c8 is not going to be an eray or a zero six assume it's a regular can you just get like i think for the trunk it's not the trunk is very roomy but so your frunk can hold one roll aboard oh look there's a can hold one roll aboard okay in the frunk or may a pair of backpacks right and maybe a pair of backpacks and a purse and then in the back the shape of it is a little odd so that's someone's that's a specific luggage set to fit the c8 so you want to be a baller you order the 1360 dollar roadster bag and then you have her royal highnesses fitted luggage for the rear outside of that your roll aboard is not going to fit in the trunk so when i took the c8 eray to on my scouting trip i had to bring soft sided luggage and i mean like duffels i brought two duffels here's a this is a totally common away roller board and you know they put it in the middle but i think if you tried to flank you can't fit two of these end to end right no no you could fit one in the middle standing up on its end so my recommendation but but it is a pretty big trunk if once you bend the bag in there so you got to go big duffels that's your only move but there is a that once you once you shape it in there then you're then you're all right see this person mid-engine corvette forum dot com has a good a good photo here of a of a three duffel solution that i like yeah and it looks like autoblog did a luggage test with one so i would refer to that and then you can inform your partner how much or how little they bring tl dr you can fit a lot you just have to get the right the right flexibility in the shape of your bag these are the last three okay last three zaks sandwich based humor the affordable sport compact segment is essentially dead uh and when viewed from today's eyes what do you consider the sport compact champ from 2000 to 2010 civic si probably the 2000 civic si was the jam also the like 2004 r32 volkswagen was the jam that was a that was a cooler car handling wise i think we get destroyed by the civic but yeah it was a cooler car yeah remember the focus zx3 uh that was a pretty rad thing i liked the i liked the rsx type s a lot i thought that was a great car um oh when do they stop making no rsx took over for the integrity of mine um i'd go civic si for the champ yeah still raced the best all the time yeah oh wow a lot's happening here okay explorer i hardly newer uh i noticed a trend with automotive journalism recently okay notice a trend with automotive journalism recently to take what nissan is doing lately and add an asterisk to anything they do i e the z is an older platform that's been inter in uh updated therefore it's a lesser car because it's not modern enough although the same journalists complain that sports cars are too tech focused and overly complex and a more old school vehicle is what we desire etc um the armada nismo is called silly and i haven't seen the inside of that vehicle i haven't called it anything uh aside from uh but even though almost every german luxury automaker does basically the same thing from my perspective there's a double standard for nissan who are making an effort to get away from big ultima energy and uh and they're not getting enough credit this truck let's see the looks that's that's a crazy looking vehicle so the nismo the niz our moda nismo imagine getting wanting a nismo armada but can we see the inside what what what do we have to go on here yeah i mean it looks like yeah kind of the same as everything else red seats red it's you know it's it's yeah it's whatever i don't know i don't like japan like japan seems to be go if it's a sporty sporty car we do the red seat you know it's a civic type r armada nismo it's you know far right as it too it's like it's the color of the passion i mean it oh so the question is the exist the existence of the armada nismo is silly even though there's an you know a g 63 and we don't think i think that we call those silly i think that's the question the question is like why do it seems like people give nissan unfair criteria we go hey the new z is an old refreshed car it's not a new thing that's not great and then we drive brand new cars and we go i wish they were more like the old way yeah so here's what i think what is going on and by the way if you go look at my review of the z i wrote about it favor favorably because of its trueness to being a nissan and not being platform shared or too similar to other cars i think i said the supra was objectively a better car that performed better but the nissan has a more unique character to it and it was very much reflective of the values of the brand so i said that i mean you can probably go read that on rodentrack.com um what these folks want is it's not that it's not modern enough it's that they're saying it's a bit lipstick on an older platform they want a new chassis that's analog a new lightweight analog chassis like like for instance like when me when mazda came out with the n d that's what the they want nissan to be doing what mazda is doing with the miata which is where you are doing entirely new platforms and chassis and stuff every whatever six to ten years um and and to have those values of being an analog lightweight engaging sports car that's not too complex the complaint of the z is that it's it that the basic platform goes all the way back to 2003 which is a different thing you're you're that that's happening well because then you with the new platform you get more rigidity they usually can improve you know hard points or things that might have led to complaints about the cars um it also means when you're comparing apples to apples you go well this car be over here from this company is a whole new thing it's totally rethought re-engineered i get newer materials i get newer newer thoughts whereas the other one you know the nismo you go well it's it's better but it's still an old thing so for my money what do i want and then i think uh oh i had another thought that i forgot about oh i mean then you know the the complaints about the old car still you know can remain because you go okay well the thing's kind of heavy the engine design is a little bit old they added turbos to it but they're not changing some of the fundamental complaints sure yeah i i think i can see why you think like that but i don't think that you think the journalists are saying exactly what they're saying i think they're not saying that it's not they're saying the the platform isn't modern enough not that the idea of a rear drive stick shift sports car needs to be somehow more techy like i think mclaren's a good example price point's different obviously but it's a carbon tub thing it's made with more modern materials than for i still use aluminum for a lot of their their unibodies and chassis um so it's made with very modern materials but then they go the steering is going to be old it's going to be hydraulic the dynamics are going to be compliant kind of an older style they are they take all the best of the old sports car attributes and then they use the most modern materials to make those attributes yeah yeah uh sarong sing i'm looking to make my next car purchase it'll be a daily commuter but uh need some space for hobbies outdoor stuff fishing kayaking camping surfing etc from new jersey uh i want i've always wanted a last gen lexus gx but i can't stop looking at used rivian r ones any reason i shouldn't get the rivian sure two of them one doesn't ev fit your lifestyle i mean you're doing all these activities with an ev is that gonna work maybe it is maybe it's not i don't know how far you have to go to do those things right and how long how long do you camp for yeah are you gonna drain the battery and then be stuck in the middle of i don't know northern new jersey away from a charger right also uh are you aware of the fact that rivians are just about the least reliable vehicles being sold today i mean literally they're at the very bottom of the and people love their rivians and i i've driven press rivians and i go i know why people like these my friend brad has lemoned two of them and has a third yeah like they love them i had a question on the driver's test show consumer report said that rivians were one of the least reliable cars in the world like in the united states right now but the driver satisfaction was the highest yeah it's inverse they got you know people are hooked they're in the club and they want to stay yeah um so you know at least if you were to buy a used one and you have a great warranty and blah blah blah maybe you could avoid some of these issues but you're talking about buying a used one my concern would be that it's problematic so you know make sure your warranty is uh is intact and very very long and very comprehensive and you know that uh that you factor that in in when when spending one of these when it's used when spending money on one of these um you you may have some issues that need addressing and they may or may not be covered under a warranty and man these things break a lot so that's it thanks folks long show today had a lot of talking to do it must have been all the caffeine don't forget we're giving away a Porsche hit the link in our show notes uh 997 turbo s the drawing is happening in august still have plenty of time to enter it is very straightforward there's a charitable component uh if you win you get 75 000 bucks that covers the federal taxes um and this car is a brand new uh 991 excuse me 992 dot 1 turbo s uh in ice gray with an amazingly optioned up interior all the luxury features rear wiper glass roof uh super super super fucking fast car and uh you can buy it buy it buy it you can win it wow my i think i need another day of rest before we do another show fucking hell um that's it folks thank you for listening we appreciate you all thanks to our patrons for asking such good questions and we'll see you next time bye