476 - Epstein Docs & A Culture Of Slop

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And I still love everyone. And there's elements of my family. I like. There's elements of the intelligence community that are good. There's factions that are good. But it is good to be here. And we have a great interview later coming up with Ryan Grimm from Dropsite News. He talks about Jeffrey Epstein. Apparently, this guy said that guy was a pedophile. And all of these new revelations are coming out. One of the things I regret not asking Ryan about, because literally it slipped my mind, was this allegation from a limo driver that supposedly Donald Trump got in his limo and got on the phone and started talking about, abusing a woman with Jeffrey Epstein and then the woman was found dead and key for Oklahoma. And the problem with a lot of this stuff right now is that I don't have a way to verify it. And like the Larry Nasser letter, the Jeffrey Epstein wrote Larry Nasser, the gymnast pedophile monster, is widely believed to be fake. There are things in the files that are fake. And there's what's called disinfo where, because one thing's fake, it'll cast out on all kinds of things. The FBI is saying the Epstein letter to Larry Nasser was a fake. So it's hard to know what is real and what is not. There's a lot of things that are very disturbing and that are, you know, true. And like no one's disputing that, right? A lot of the photographs are true. A lot of the people, the flight logs are true. The amount of times people have been on his plane, that are in his orbit. But this rape allegation, it's being reported on by media. And it was from a, somebody who was driving Donald Trump's limo and he submitted it in 2020. It's an unclassified intake report, summarizing information provided. The FBI related to Jeffree Epstein and J. Laine Maxwell, according to the report, a caller relayed secondhand accounts, involving a woman who claims she was raped by Jeffree Epstein and Donald Trump in the late 1990s. The intake also notes, they include statements attributed to a limousine driver who said he overheard Trump speaking, was someone he referred to as Jeffree, while riding in the back of the limo allegedly making comments and abusing girls. The report describes the caller recounting events from around 1997 through 1999, including claims that the woman and her daughters were introduced to wealthy individuals taking a hotel and provided with money. The intake further states that the woman reported what she said happened. She later died January 2000. Her death was ruled a suicide. But according to the document, responding officers reportedly did not believe it was a suicide at the scene. This is a document in the Epstein files. Again, I should have asked Ryan about it. I asked him about other things. I asked him about the Epstein, the Mark Epstein letter, whether that's true or not, to the FBI claiming that his brother was about to name names and he felt that Donald Trump signed off on his murder. Again, I'm not authenticating these documents. That's not what I'm doing. So, a lot of disturbing stuff and what a way to end the year. Let's just take a minute. Let's take a beat. Let's think. Let's marinate. Let's, you know, grab a tea kettle. Let's sit there. Let's curl up with a book. You see all these beautiful families in the matching pajamas. And I love that very pro family always have been. And they curl up in the comfy chair. Let's curl up in the comfy chair and get the hot cocoa and reflect back on a pretty wild year. This is where we are. This is the end of the year. You know, a lot of people thought that the Trump administration was going to be a the most transparent administration in history. That was claimed. But they dragged their feet on releasing this stuff. They said it didn't exist. Cash Patel came out and said there was, you know, no operation. There's no co-conspirators. Nothing's going on. And then after a revolt led by people like Thomas Massey, Rokana, who's a Democrat, you know, Marjorie Taylor Green ends up leaving Congress. This is a big deal. They don't want this out. This unlocks a lot more than, you know, a, you know, story about a creepy, wealthy, well-connected pedophile. There's unlocks a lot of things about the people who rule us. How governments operate the things you read about in the news. So this is a very big deal. And these documents are only starting to come out. Supposedly there's like a million more documents that they found. It's like another million documents that could come out. So this is how we end the year. We end the year, you know, talking about rape claims and people getting shot in the head and limo drivers and Bill Clinton and the pool, which is Lane Maxx. Well, this is how we end the year for all the acquaintance before. I mean, this is how we end the year. What a dispiriting and demoralizing way to end the year. Reading about the ruling class and how they've been behaving. So it's just to reflect on that. The truth is coming out about a lot of people. And I think it will get worse. I don't know. That's not information I have on any good authority. I just believe things like this tend to get worse. And there's a reason they didn't they didn't want these documents out. This is not, you know, this is not, you know, like, you know, we're all clumsy. You know, the whole thing with Pambani. She's a cook and she's clumsy and she's bundled it. Now, I think she was doing what she was supposed to do, which is, you know, keep it from the public. She's bungled it. She's so disorganized. No, I don't, I don't think that's what it is. There was that whole incompetence theory. She's got a bunch of papers on her desk and she doesn't know which ones are which. And, you know, you know, the idea that it was like a three-stooge is sketch and she couldn't figure out what, what file had the Epstein files in it? Wait a minute. No, I think it was chaos. I think it was chaos by design. A million more Epstein documents have been found. Justice Department says, and this is in the New York Times. Democratic lawmakers who had criticized the Justice Department's release and the material accused the Trump administration of violating the law mandating the release of the files. Now, they want Bill Clinton to testify. But Trump came out and defended Clinton the other day. He was like, I don't like all these photos of Clinton out there. These people, you know, they didn't do anything wrong. They're just in a bunch of photos. And I don't like that. You know, I don't like that. So, you do see there is a bipartisan consensus amongst some people to keep this hush, hush. And then there's a lot of people that want this stuff out in the open. And it seems to be generational. A lot of the younger people or people that, you know, are intimidated don't seem to have a problem with putting this stuff out there. But a lot of people are trying to keep this stuff from public view. And it's pretty obvious, you know, and they want Clinton to testify. Now, behind the scenes in the Democratic Party of Hillary and Bill and other people that are going to be going, you can't open this can of worms. This is going to be a big problem. There's a lot of dirty deeds. There's a lot of dirty deeds that come to light with this stuff. It's human trafficking, it's pedophilia, it's arms trafficking, it's drug-running, it's war profiteering, it's murder, it's assassination, it's Christmas. It's Christmas in America. That's what these documents are. The documents coming out are everything I just said, intimidation, and they're coming out a few days before the year ends. And we all have to remember, what is the year and montage of this held year? My father used to love a montage. She used to get, you know, misty-eyed over a montage. When you grew up, there were things, you know, that the television news networks would do a montage of things that happened. Maybe it would include, you know, in memoriams for celebrities who died, you know, maybe if it was a year where they had the Olympics, there'd be some of that. There'd be some things around the world. And in Long Island, we sat on our couch and my father loved a montage. God did that guy love a montage. He loved the year and montage. He hated when people talked over the montage. If my mother was trying to say anything to him during the montage, she hated it. He loved a year and montage. The man could not get enough of a year and montage. Can you find, go to 1998 and see if you can find, I don't even know if they were, you would find this. Find a year and montage from like a news network, NBC, CBS, whatever. I want to show the people what I mean. What are we going to put in the montage this year? It's just people getting killed, wildfires, just documents suggesting the president may have raped a woman and then had her shot in the head. What is going in the montage this year? You know, what is sometimes it would be like somebody winning an academy award? Or I mean, what are we going to do? We can have, oh, what's going to be in the montage? There's going to be a bunch of kids and in God's getting shot while they wait for grain. What's in the montage this year? Is this going to warm everyone's heart? Are they even doing a montage like Russia, Ukraine is horrible thing that happened in Sydney, Australia? This is not exactly a great year for to reflect. It started with the fires in Los Angeles, these crazy wildfires where I lost my house and my wife and my children. They were old killed when they were killed brutally and they were cooked. They were cooked in their home. They were cooked. And I got my rolls Royce and I drove to the desert to start a new life. Nobody wants to have to do this, but I did. I did. I did because it was time. And you know, I do believe that things happen for a reason. I was at that airwant eating a breakfast burrito the morning the fire started. True. And literally I watched this tiny little fire grow into this massive thing. So is this, this is a 1998 year in review? Yeah. Let's see what this is like here. Let's see if this is an actual one of the things I was talking about. New year. All of us at News 4 wish you and those you love all the best for 1999. And as we leave you this evening we take a look back at the year pass. That's right. That's prepared by our talented editor Andrea Tarris. Oh god. Good night. And happy to you. This was my father's favorite in the watch. It was a montage. Somewhere along the line these kids still haven't been taught somewhere to be back for the life of another human. I don't know where that got lost. Say two more. Say just 11 and 13. By any means, 27 bullets in the studio. The rest of the kill in the challenge. The body of one of people parents with a five or count. Well, by the way, pause us for a minute. Even though these stories, even then, were negative, people are just more chill about it. No, I'm like dead serious. People are more chill. It was more of an energy of like, well, that happened. Like my father would be sitting on a couch eating a pint of hog and dust vanilla switch. Vanilla swiss almond. It's late. You had a great chumbrea. Thank you for coming out. But it's vanilla swiss almond excellent. And he'd be eating it and he'd be nodding and taking it all in. He'd be taking it all in. Let's keep watching it. I want to keep watching this. I don't want to skip a minute of this. You're watching Stapple CBS News. I was shooting a took place this afternoon. If you're a staff alone, you're on them. Who somehow made it happen. Yeah, I'm a history of, you know, passion and hope. All right. We are so far. We've got our subject time. Yeah, we're just seeing. The investigators are gathering in conflict in details of the attack. Definitely signature. Left behind by the end of the bomb and their opinion. Tanzania. First time I was with him alone. I saw somebody totally different than I had expected to see. And that's the person I fell in love with. I did not have this. Yes, not again. It was the, uh, the high. A lot of this. And then this would be a moment like as this was happening, my dad would nod and be like, this is, this is. But then there were, we can get rid of this one. This one goes on for a while. There were better ones where there was music and there was just kind of images and something like that. And they would do those on New Year's Eve. But he loved the montage. He couldn't get enough of it because people would, would look back at the year. And they'll do them this year. I imagine it's, I mean, it's going to be ugly. Well, they'll do a montage. But here's the difference back then when you saw a montage. You believed whatever was being shown to you. So even though these were horrible stories about people getting shot or whatever, you know, you know, you know, Clinton got a blowjob who cares. And then they would show some inspiring stuff later on. Like see, towards the end, if there's anything inspiring here, there's all just kind of. Yeah. Yeah, Sunny Bono died. They do the In-Memory and Lloyd Bridges. Harry Carey. Yeah, I mean, all right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, you know, people believed what they were shown. So even though the stories were bad, people believed that they happened. They were real that they understood what happened. And that from that, they can draw some conclusion. And it was, it was a shared reality. We all had a shared reality. And you'd watch a montage and go, yeah, those two kids shot up that school. Bill Clinton got his dick sucked. Harry Carey died. You know, and then some of the montages were fun. Every now and then, there'd be a fun story. Like, you know, or you'd see someone getting rescued from a hurricane. That would go into the montage. But again, we all share the reality. So you would watch something and you'd go, okay. But now, when you see a montage of events, your questioning, what events are actually the things that people say they are? And what events are, you're like, you know, now the montage, you just sit there, you're like, yeah, what was that one? What was that? I really understand that one. That one was weird. That one went away quick. No one really talks about that one anymore. You're still sitting there eating hoggadas. You're still sitting on your couch. And I don't, you know, the end of the year is a time when you look back and you go, maybe you've had tremendous personal growth in your life. Maybe you haven't. Who cares? You'll get them next year. Literally, that's a saying. But it's the time of year to look around at your life and go, what is happening? What's even going on? Like, what's going on? And I think that's the question that most people are asking this year. And that's the question that people weren't asking as much when I grew up. When I grew up, people were like, oh yeah, this is life. Now people are going, what's happening? What's happening? What are the machines coming? What's happening? And I think that question, why does no one have any sex? Why are the young people so angry now? Why are houses, millions and millions of dollars? Like all of them. Why can't anyone afford anything? You know, and it's a weird time because it's supposed to have meaning. But it's only the meaning that's, you know, it's just like, well, it's that time of year. It's all supposed to look around and make a new year's resolution. You know, like, I'm done with this. I'm heading to that. You know, and maybe that's successful. Maybe it's not. Yeah, the astronauts were always in a montage. They always put like an astronaut in a montage. Big, big. They always do an astronaut. There we go. The shuttles taken on you. Sell good. You sell good. You like there's astronauts and there's people playing sports and they're winning. Mark McGuire and the astronauts and no matter what was going on, life made a little bit more sense than it does right now. What is the montage this year? It's just Peter Teal talking about Satan. What is the montage? What exactly is the Mott Sam Altman telling every late night chat show host that, you know, he doesn't know how people raised kids before chat GPT? What is the, there's nothing comforting. Everything now is amazingly uncomfortable to watch, to even look at, to listen to. The theme of everything now is it's like it's disconnected. It does not bring you joy. It does not bring you pleasure. You don't connect with it. And it's, it's, you know, the people have the term cringe. Everything's cringe. It's all brain rot. People are just staring at their phone. And it's just pumping them full of brain rot. No one has any, no one has a attention span anymore. People are chewing at her all in their rooms. They're staring at screens. They're gooning. They're dicks falling off. They can't get hard. They have ED. They're 20 years old. They watch porn. That's incredibly violent. You know, they can't find any jobs. They're getting radicalized in political movements. They're, you know, they're rehabilitating Hitler or Mao or whatever. And, you know, people don't go out. They don't see each other. There's no human community. We live in these silo digital echo chambers where people just get angry. And that's like the new sex is to just be in rage. It's rage. Bade is this big new word. You know, people watch reality shows about people looking for homes. And they can't afford any. And they just watch just 35 shows about people trying to buy houses. And so he's out of touch boomers looking for a fucking lake house. And you're watching that on your catch. You want to kill yourself. Slop is the word of the year in 2025. Marion Webster's dictionary slot. And by the way, they nailed it. They nailed it. Slop. Eat your slop. And that's what it is. I've been using that word for years. But that's really what it all is now. It's content. It's garbage. It's grist for the mill. It's slop. It's sludge. It's rock. It's nothing of any value. You don't even know what any of it is. It all bleeds together. It blends. It's amorphous. It's just, it's a clogged toilet. It's what it is. Truly. Everything. Nobody knows what anything. You know, you pass these, you pass like a billboard now. There's a movie with they put 30 celebrities in it. No one's going to see it. No one cares. Nobody even knows what it is. You know, people, there's those shared cultural moments right now. There's no shared cultural experiences that people are having. Are great. You know, Disney World has been taken over by morbidly obese pill heads that have gender identity issues. You're all walking around wearing diapers and and clogs trying to wedge themselves on it. It's a small world. The kids don't even want to go anymore. They want to stay in their room and read about Hitler. Nobody wants to go to Disney World anymore. Every movie Disney makes is about some non-binary snowflake. All of our celebrities are emaciated. Their eyes are sunken into their heads. They're having buccal fat removed from their faces. They all look like skeletons. They crawl onto the set of some interview show to be interviewed. They're crazy. They speak in like Harry Potter parcel tongue. Those two from Wicked speaking that snake language. And an interviewer like asked some questions, you know, about the fucking movie. All of our cultural moments boil down to nothing. It's all these forever children. People trying to relive their time at summer camp when they were listening to Taylor Swift or like, you know, you have like 40 year olds at somber concerts. Criticizing the guy. They don't like what he does or whatever. It's like, you know, grown adults have opinions on like what child pop stars are doing and how political chapel run it. Well, she didn't speak out about it. It's all crazy. What a profoundly dysfunctional society we have. There's nothing to look up to. There's no one to be excited about. Really the least controversial member of this administration is RFK Jr. Can you imagine he's the least scandal prone member of the administration and every three days there's another text leaking from him where he's like, open your mouth. I want to put my seat in you. And that's somehow the best part of this whole thing. His sex are nowhere near as fucking, you know, scandalous is like cash patelli FBI director is sitting there updating you on his girlfriend's country music tour. It's hell. It's absolutely hell. And Erica Kirk God bless tragic. I'm sorry for what happened. But nobody knows why she's out there in a glittering pantsuit in a recreated tent that her husband tragically was murdered and throwing merch out. She's out there talking to Nicki Minaj. This is people are confused. What's going on? Those are the three words that sum up this whole entire mess that we've created for ourselves. What is business anymore? It's like, go fake. Everybody online is trying to make as much money as they can. In any way they can crypto or drop shipping or bullshit or looks maxing their smashing hammers into their face to give them a better chance to fuck a hotter girl. They're trying to make more money so that they can compete in the mating game and they can get some apartments somewhere in an overpriced city and by their girlfriend boots. I mean, nobody's having children. People are just sitting around and trying to identify with some weird movement. I mean, like Wiggins probably a fine movie. I don't see it. I don't care. But everyone needs to chill the fuck out and relax. What's the big deal here? People are making everything into some meaningful moment and it's not. It shouldn't be. It's a profoundly unhealthy society that we've created. It really is. When you look at it from the outside, you know, all these people, it's not even political, by the way. It's not like I'm telling you like, you know, they're wrong or they're right or they're going to fix it. I've never really done that on this show. But like when you look at the society that we're living in, for example, the last two weeks people are screaming about Somali and nobody even knows what's happening. People are either like Somalis are the best part of this country. What? What is happening? Nobody even, you've had no one. I'm not saying anything bad about them. But like what is that reaction? And then there's a reaction of like this. They're the greatest threat that we've ever faced. And then it's like, well, wait a minute. How about that there's like some scheme, some fraud, some scam that we need to get to the bottom of. Maybe we're just letting too many people into the country. And maybe those people are going to eventually be desperate like the people that currently live here. Okay? And maybe those people are going to turn to some type of fraud or crime. It's like completely natural and normal. But like every reaction to everything is so dialed up in sane crazy. You know? Oh dear, my small business-owning friend. You never grew good business with bad website. I know, but it's really hard. Do not do the despairing. Try a Yonos. Let clever thinking AI will use smart looking professional website that is optimized for more while in no time. And use its many tools to get your business growing super quick. Nice. Know my dialings. This is nice, nice, nice. Try a Yonos. Your digital partner at ionos.co.uk. Greenlight helps kids learn about money the way most of us never did. By actually using it. It's a debit card and money app that teaches kids to earn, save, and spend in real life. Not just swipe and hope for the best. Learning happens naturally in the moment. Parents can set limits, see spending in real time, and guide better habits along the way. All in one place. Without constant check-ins or cash runs. Don't wait. 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Try greenlight risk-free today at greenlight.com slash try greenlight. It's completely bad, all everybody wants to do now is go to like a store and spend $75 on a smoothie they want to bio hack and live forever. Why? God, why? Why do you want to live forever to watch celebrities continue to have fat sucked out of their faces by some machine? Why do you want to live forever? What exactly are you planning to do? How? You think this thing turns around? This bio hacking stuff. All these guys micro-dosing everything, trying to level up to the best versions of themselves. I mean, great, more power to you. Do what you want. What exactly is this all for? You want to be here in 30 years? You want to be here when we're talking about the President Jake Paul's administration and why they're not doing more to stem the conflict in the civil war that's happening in our country. Like, what exactly are you people living for? Quite frankly, honestly, rationally. Can you explain to me why you want to be here for the next 75 years? Is that exciting? Is that exciting? It's actually creepy and strange. The music all blends together now and to just a lot, there's some good music for sure. But a lot of the stuff you're listening to, it's just this odd, strange, it's just like corporate drivel. And you're just meant to listen to it while online at a salad place. Before you get in the elevator and it takes you back up to this flex space that you're working in and you get on your MacBook and you just again, you float off into the into nothingness. You do nothing. People are just filling their time and they're filling their time in the absolute worst way possible. There's this idea of what a perfect life is. It's been drilled into these people's heads. They knew the right things all the time. The best schools and the right neighborhood. West Village girls. Like, you know, you need the best coffee. You need the great food. You got to get the table at the right restaurant. Fuck you. I'm embarrassed. Go to New York. I'm embarrassed. These pigs at Corbonyham and Barrett. Spicy Rigatoni. I'm embarrassed. Why would it happen to a great city? Stop. It's disgusting. It's disgusting and repulsive. Your behavior is repulsive. It really is. It's fucking 10 restaurants. You read about on Instagram. You get to wait four months. So you can drag your friends to go to the corner store. You can eat caviar and think it's something. I mean, it's just I'm just completely in about whatever this is. It's nothing. It's not culture. It's not. Trust me. Trust me. This isn't culture. Whatever this is, whatever you think you're participating in, it's not. It's not worth your $7,000 a month rent. Whatever you think you're doing is nothing. You know, I mean, truly, now these Epstein documents say what you want. Say what you want. About Jeffrey and Jus Lane and the trumps and the Clintons, but they had class. They had class. They went to the best places in the world. And they raped murdered and tortured people. And yes, a way that I would live. No, no. Sort of evil, little demonic. But it was culture. It was culture. And it's a bad cult. It's not a good culture. It's not ideal. It's less than ideal. Certainly less than ideal. But that was the culture of our world. We have to accept it. We have to accept it. I don't want it to continue. And I want the people that participated in it to go to jail. But that was our culture. We didn't even know it, but we did. Sam Chris has kind of a great article about that. If you read his stuff and you should. But that's the thing. It's like this was our culture. For a very long time, it was a domination. Evil. Um, exploitation. Bad. Not good. But it was our culture. It was our culture. You know. And you know, we're coming to terms with that. We're coming to terms with that. And it's going to take. It's a little bit of a pill to swallow. Is it not? It's a little bit of a pill to swallow, huh? It's a little bit of a pill. It's a little bit of a pill. You ever get sick as a kid in your mom's like, you got to take this one and you're like, ah, she's like, this one is everyone that rules over. She's a static pedophile. You're like, oh, no, not this one. It's a little bit of a pill to swallow. But that's where a lot of this comes from. This is to run off. What you're seeing now is to run off of people living to pretend that that isn't true. It is the denial of that culture that has produced this culture. Let's not I'll say it again. I'll say it again. I should be paid more for this frankly. I'll say it again. It is the denial of that culture that has manufactured this culture of nothingness. It is the unwillingness to look that in the face that has produced slop. That's what it is. It is the discomfort that comes from facing the fact that your greatest fears are true. And you're unable to process that so you dive into the eras tour. You backstroke through the fucking, you know, restaurant that serves the thing from the app that you saw. You try to vacation in the right place to take the edge off. You know, it is the denial of truth that has delivered you here into nothingness, into emptiness, into a place where do you want to see the amenities? The building is really nice, but you've got to see the amenities. The amenities are really over the top. The HOA is really high, but you have to see it because the amenities are so worth it. The amenities were amazing. There's this amazing room you can use it if you have a party like 12 to 15 people. You want to do a dinner. You can bring in a private chat so you can bring in a private chat. It's so amazing. They'll set right up and they'll do a dinner. You can actually bring in servants in a bartender I've done it before. It's amazing and actually connects to a terrace. What's great about it is it's actually for everyone in the building to use. You can reserve it, but it's very easy. You just do it on the app. Is the world run by satanic pedophiles? There's also a rooftop garden. It's amazing. I go up there. I have coffee all the time. You can go. So you get a special key when you come here and it'll only go to your floor. So you don't have to worry about any of the security. At the top of the building, there's a rooftop garden and you can sit there and you can even do yoga because actually it's super private. There's like alcoves. Right. So let me ask you, do you think that our civilization is run by like evil pedophiles that are murdering and torturing children? Next year, the restaurant opens. So I don't even want to talk about the restaurant because it's literally so amazing and you can't have it right now. But within five months, we have a celebrity, a chef who's opening a restaurant. It's like Mediterranean, but it's also kind of like more on the Italian side. It's like super perfect. It's like amazing. It's great for like light bites in the morning. And then you can like even grab like coffee and breakfast and then there's like a lunch and then there's like a dinner and even I've heard this. I've actually heard this. I've actually heard this. I can't confirm, but I've heard can't confirm. But I've heard that they can actually cater your party in the private amenity space. Like the restaurant can cater your party in the amenity space. Wow. That that that sounds really good. Why do you think that that woman got shot in the face in Oklahoma? Well, anyway, if you want it, just speak to your realtorks. It's going to go really, really fast. We already have so many people coming back to see it for a second and third showing. Cool. And I just heard that around the block, that like super exclusive restaurant that nobody can get into, Tate McCray was there last night. Wow. Well, thank you for this info. You've given me a lot to think about. And it is the denial of that culture that has produced this one. Okay. Looking at in the face is very hard to do. And when you refuse to do that, you can only concern yourself with the minutia, the meaningless, the bullshit, the empty signifiers of status that are splashed across social media ultimately adding up to nothing. But that's the point. Nothing is the point. They don't want you asking any questions about anything real. They want you to play the game not for any reward. Not for a trophy. Not for glory. Not for honor. Not for pride. They want you to play the game because it distracts you from the game. That's the whole thing. You're playing this game. It's called a rat race. Whenever you want to call it, you're distracted from what's really happening. Where the money is going. Who's disappearing? Who's being threatened? Who's being intimidated? Who's being murdered? On whose behalf it's all happening. All the clans and groups and little huddles of people trying to exert power and trying to manifest their reality. All of that, you ignore because you're playing a very hard game. It involves the accumulation of money, the signifiers of status. It involves the right life, the right friends, the right people, the right taste, the right opinions, the right concerts. It involves all of that and it's designed, it's curated for you to participate in. And only have a small glance at what's actually happening. What's actually going on. The things that are driving society off a cliff. That's not by accident. And to think it is, you would have to be incredibly naive. You would have to be incredibly naive. I feel terrible for what happened to Rob and Michelle Reiner. But as a good friend of mine recently said, Ray Combe, he said, the best thing that can happen in this country is for your kids to kill you. It's truly the win. It's truly the win. Have it be your family. It's coming anyway. Have it be your family. It's coming anyway. How lovely to die by the hand of your own blood. In a world such as this. Happy New Year, everybody. We'll see you on the other side. Bye-bye. The sun shining, birds are singing and all feels right in the world. Until the season changes and suddenly you lose your motivation to get out of bed. In fact, one in five people experience some form of depression no matter the season or time of year. At the American Psychiatric Association Foundation, our vision is to build a mentally healthy nation for all. Because we want you to live your best life and be your best you all year round. Please visit mentallyhealthination.org to learn more. At Morrison's, we've got everything you need to cook up a fuss for your mum this Mother's Day. Pick up a whole British chicken fresh from Market Street, for half price. Was five pounds, now just two pounds 50. Now that's a hot deal. Morrison's to shop at Morrison's. Majority of stores and online, chicken 1.45 to 1.65 kilos, ends 15th March. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the show Ryan Graham, who writes at Dropsite News, which has done the best reporting on the Epstein case. This is not even debatable. We talked about one of their articles a few weeks ago, where Jeffrey Epstein was back channeling to try to get a meeting with Vladimir Putin between Vladimir Putin and ex-Israeli the ex-Israeli Prime Minister to talk about the Syrian civil war. We talked about that on the show. And people send me Dropsite News all the time. You got to read this article. Steve Bannon, and again, you guys aren't ideologically aligned, but Steve Bannon has even praised you as a good journalist. People from many different political persuasions, even I think people on the Epstein list are saying this is good. Even the pedophiles are going, he's doing the work. So this is legit. So Ryan, thank you again for coming. I appreciate it. It's the holidays and I appreciate you making time for us. If you could sum up as just an introductory statement for the uninitiated, when you look at this new dump of Epstein files that just came out, number one, tell people, you know, you know, surmise for people, what exactly you think the Epstein operation was if there was one. You know, the FBI says they're, you know, said that there wasn't. But they have all these files suggesting maybe there is. What was this operation? And I don't know how many of these files you've looked through in the new files, has any of your opinion changed with regard to the scope of the operation, the intent of the operation or any of the key players? Yeah, I think that my take on this is actually, usually you go into the reporting and you find out that the story you're looking for isn't quite all the way there. It's not quite as interesting as you kind of imagined that it might be. This kind of has been the reverse. Like this, you keep peeling the layers back and you're like, oh, wow, that was true. That was true. That was true. And on and on. You know, when they say there was no Epstein operation, it's like the guy's been doing a lot of operating for many decades. And at some point, you're going to have to call that an operation. Because it's, he keeps becoming involved and he keeps being found from Iran Contra all the way up to the things that you were talking about. The Syrian Civil War, like a lot going on in Africa, which was a piece of Iran Contra as well, the kind of unspoken piece of it. The fact that he focused so much on Africa really shows that he really does kind of know where power flows and where money commodities and resources flow. So yeah, there's an awful lot there. Part of the question with Jeffrey Epstein has always been about definitions. Is he an agent? Is he an associate? Is he a, what in the, in the murky world of intelligence, what was Jeffrey Epstein? Was he employed by the Mossad or the CIA or MI6? Was he a liaison that worked with all of these different agencies from your reporting? What would you call him if you had to call something? Well, we don't have a W9 or anything from Epstein. And I think that that kind of misunderstands the relationship. Like if you think about Mossad, for instance, or the CIA, like running people, yeah, they, they're organizations and they have, they have ambitions, they have projects. But he was operating at a layer above, I think. The Mossad and the CIA, they're there to serve the major power centers throughout the world and different factions within them serve different factions at different times. But if you think of the kind of global elite as kind of organized around that Davos conference or you know, or you know, this Davos crew out there. Like the CIA, it's more properly understood that the CIA works for them. And Jeffrey Epstein was an integral player in that Davos set. And I think sometimes his, his allies and he himself was, he was waning. He's not doing as well. Other times his power is on the rise. No, that, it's, that's how it works inside an nebulous organizations like this. But he's right there at the center of this, you know, fundamentally, fundamentally, undemocratic global institution. It's not even an institution. It's just this amoeba type of entity. He's right there in the middle of it, you know, and he's, and he still has to jockey for power. But he is then able to deploy his own assets, whether it's Mossad or whether it's people in the CIA, in order to serve, he and his allies own interests, which sometimes align with the interests of Israel, sometimes align with the interests of the US. But you know, they're also self-serving interests. What are the main concerns the primary objectives of the quote Davos set? Is it a monolith or do those people have varied interests? I think it's, well, they're, they're in competition with each other for each other's resources, for sure. But they're also in competition with the 99.9% of the world that doesn't really want them to exist. And so that's, and so what they're trying to do is kind of justify their existence, and maintain their power and justify their existence. That's why when they get together, they often talk about the kinds of things that would be wonderful if they delivered on them. You know, they're going to end-world hunger or they're going to, they're going to end illiteracy around the world. They're going to, you know, they're going to go after disease and amount of nutrition. They're going to reverse climate change. And yet, somehow it just all keeps getting worse, and their power continues, continues to grow and their wealth continues to be concentrated at the very top. So their, their goal is, I think, self-perpetuation and kind of continuing to lock down, you know, their position in the world and to keep the, the public at, at bay, because they're fundamentally an undemocratic entity. Someone, a Catherine Austin Fitz describes some of the people you're talking about as intergenerational pools of capital. Yes. Is that, does that make sense to you? Yeah, yeah, definitely. They are, yes. And they're also, they're very much transnational. Right. Like they, they're not American. They're not, they're not Israeli. They're not Chinese. Like if they're Chinese, they actually have a little bit more strings attached to what they're able to do. Right. But in the Western ones, you know, they're looking for their own sovereignty. And what, what, what, what, what it, what it appears like is going on with, with Epstein and his, and his work with Israel and also the UAE, we're going to have a lot more to come about his, his work with Saudi Arabia and the UAE. What the UAE and Israel both figured out is that when you're operating in this kind of world that is filled with nation states, nation states have particular rights. They, they're, they can vote in the UN, they can set up banks. Those banks can then move money and those banks are then subject to the laws and the judiciary kind of within those states. And if the national security apparatus controls that judiciary, you can basically be a criminal gang like to so the United Arab Emirates, for instance, they're doing enormous amounts of like money laundering like if all of this, all this wealth that's coming out of Africa is, you know, flows right into into the UAE and then they skim off the top. You're like, how is this, how are they doing this? This is basically mafia stuff. So like, well, they call themselves a state. They call themselves a government. So they can, so they can do that. And Israel does a version of that as well where the state is aligned with the companies and they have this protection that they can operate in a way where if they were just private actors, but like, wait, you can't do that. Right. So it's kind of a cartel. Yeah. Right. It's a legalized cartel that operates as a state. What role does sexual blackmail plan this? You know, obviously the Epstein spent years engaging in horrific abuses. And he was, you know, you got a slap on the wrist. You know, he had a very light sentence regard to the crime. They charged him with a very specific crime. There were many victims. He was only charged with right crime. What role does number one, do you believe it was a blackmail operation? And then if, if so, in when we talk about these cartels, when we talk about money laundering, we talk about, you know, people that are trying to evade the democratic process, the legal process, what role does Jeffrey Epstein's sexual proclivities? And I don't, I'm not saying it lightly, proclivities, but his sexual crimes, what role do they play in this larger picture? And your point about them only charging in with one girl is a key one. Yeah. And his lawyers were so successful. They got him charged with the 17 year old, right? Even though there were dozens. Yeah. And some as young as like 14 or even younger. And so then his revisionist friends can say, oh, 17 year old, what a, you know, he didn't know. And then you look at it, oh, that's all he got charged with. Okay, let's go, let's get back into business, buddy, rather than, oh, dozens, even much younger. I mean, he's a fully evil man. And I think, Tislin Maxwell's, like, when you read these documents and even the prior documents, it's very hard to come away with any other picture than that these were evil people engaging in acts of extreme abuse, rape, perhaps murder. We don't know. Things like that. And with total remorse and doing it on a, like, seems like daily basis, right? Remorseless. Yeah, absolutely. 40 to 50 years. But it's interesting. What, what you need a Jeffrey Epstein for going back to our kind of trans, national cartel, operating as a state kind of thing is that if you want to move money, guns, let's, you know, let's say you want to move weapons from Iran to the contras in Nicaragua, or you want to move them to some type of rebel group in Africa when Congress has told you you can't fund this rebel group in Africa, or you've got blood diamonds that you've got to get moving out. You can't really go to the like the white shoe firms for that. Right. They're going to be like, you know, let me get your, you know, your client here. Like, how do we know that this person is in sanctioned? This appears to be a terrorist organization that you're shipping weapons to. Is that, did you say Iran is involved in this? I'm not working. I'm not working. I'm not working with them. Yeah. So what you need is somebody who lives in the gray area. And those people are very useful. And so when the New York Times, for instance, says, you know, there's all these conspiracies about Jeffrey Epstein, but in fact, he's just actually a giant con artist that's missing the point. You to work in that realm of the spy world and in the shadows, you're going to be a con artist. You're going to be the kind of person that pushes things to, you know, to the edge and then, and then over it. And so that's what you see a time and time again with Epstein is that, for instance, we wrote it, but actually, I don't know if we've written about this one yet, but George Mitchell, former senator who was Secretary of State under Clinton, he needed to go to Sudan back in the 2000s because he was running for president and he wanted to broker some, looked like he was going to broker a truce in Sudan. And in order to get in there, he reached out the Jeffrey Epstein. He's like, who's got the jets? You know, who can, who can, who can, you know, move me into a warlord zone. And it's somebody like Epstein. He ended up not using Epstein, but Epstein was able to put it together. And then he announced to completely fake truce that fell apart a day later and used it in his presidential campaign. But that's the kind of thing you need him for. Like I need, I need to move money. I need to move guns, diamonds, minerals, you know, commodities. We need, we need things have to happen. It has to happen quickly. And it, and it has to be done off the books. And, and that's what people like Epstein are for. And the poor just have no more. Black male. Is he blackmailing these people and keeping the information himself? Is that information then going to another state like Israel? Is it going to the highest bidder? He's photographing and recording people. Where is all this information going? We don't yet have evidence of, hey, I've got footage of you. You need to do X. We do have him being just absurdly aggressive to people like Leon Black and Les Waxner and emails. In a way where you're like, this is not how the power dynamic between an accountant and a multi-billionaire. These are two billionaires. Les Waxner, a billionaire, Leon Black, billionaire. Right. So when he's being uber aggressive in those emails, as a journalist, does that lead you to believe that he has some leverage? What, what you, what you can say for sure is that there is implicit blackmail going on under there. Right. Like because they allegedly are engaged in all of these types of activities. So just by definition, Epstein would know and they would know that Epstein knows what he's involved with now. They deny that, but there's been plenty of reporting that that all his friends, quote unquote, friends, knew what he was up to. Even A. Hood Barak in one of the emails, he's asking how he can win over this banker that he wants to work with for this one, this deal. And he says, ladies is your forte to Epstein. Those like, and people who, who I've talked to, who met him within like 30 seconds, are like, this guy's complete and total creep. Right. Like he's just, he's just oozing creep vibes. So the people that stayed in his life, like very much understood that. And so they know in the back of their mind that he knows that. Now at the same time, what, what the emails and the documents that we've gone through show is that he was actually effective at doing the things he said he was going to do. Like he's going to get you your tax breaks. He's going to get you your meeting with Putin. Right. This is the real question. Jeffrey Epstein is a math teacher at the Dalton school, which is a prep school in New York City, very expensive, very well regarded. He's hired by Bill Barr's father, Donald Barr. Donald Barr wrote a novel about a science fiction novel about the elites of a fake planet using sex slaves on that planet. There was a class of people on the planet that were sex slaves. He was a novelist, whatever. I don't know. Is it a right one? You know, we don't know. But so Jeffrey Epstein is working for this man who's written some questionable literature, whose son then becomes the attorney general. He's at Dalton, which is a private school. He's not a math genius. He's, it's not the guy from a beautiful mind. He's not winning Nobel prizes in mathematics. He somehow links up with less Wexner, billionaire owner of Victoria's secret, the limited brands, the gap, things like that. Then, you know, fast forward, he's got Gisling Maxwell, whose father Robert Maxwell, you know, it's, it's widely believed and, and written about that this man was an Israeli super spy that he was a, you know, a, a hugely influential member of the intelligence community. He was a media mogul. But, you know, he was given high honors with his burial in Israel. I mean, amount of olives, it's all real stuff. So this story for a lot of people feels like, okay, the guy Epstein's clearly a pedophile, he's a monster. How does a guy like that who just gets a job at a high school go to back channeling between Vladimir Putin and the the prime minister, the ex prime minister of Israel? That's the question that a lot of people are having a problem with. Who made that happen? Who allowed that to happen? I'm sure Epstein was an enterprising person. But from your research, what is the story? How does he get to be in this position, this rarified air with the quote unquote Davos set? Yeah. Yeah. So he winds up at bare sturns out of that Dalton thing like the, that bar's dad gets him that, also gets him that job at bare sturns, which was known as like, as I've researched it more like it's kind of the trashiest investment bank, like the one that would kind of cut corners the most. He cut too many corners, gets, gets edged out of that. But as he gets to edged out, and this was in our, in our most recent piece, he goes into business with this guy, Stan Pottenger. Stan Pottenger was a lawyer who is now known to be former Nixon attorney, deputy attorney general, known to be at the center of Iran country. He was setting up, he was helping to do a lot of the moving of the money and setting up the structures for the, the Iran contra deal, which should probably be called like Iran, Israel, Angola contra, like because the people might not realize it kind of gets written out of it. The US didn't send the weapons right to Iran, because that would have been completely illegal. So they came up with this like scheme where they're like, okay, Israel will send weapons to Iran, which is thinking back, it's like comical. Are you serious? Right. Israel's arming Iran. It's insane. So Israel's arming Iran, and then we're replenishing their stocks. And then we're, and then Shimon Perez, they would rock and the CIA are taking the, the, the loot from the profits from Iran and funding the Contras and then also funding these Angola rebels that the CIA was backing, but that they weren't supposed to be backing because Jimmy Carter is saying, we're not doing this anymore. And we're not, we're not doing all these terribly legal things with these terror groups. And so Epstein is in business with that guy. He's also associates with Adnan Khashoggi at the time. That's actually coincidentally Jamal Khashoggi's uncle, one of the biggest weapons dealers of the like 1980s and 90s. He was also a central banker for the Iran Contras scandal. And the New York Times mentioned this in their early article. He also knew Douglas Leese, who was this British arms trafficker, who also had ties to Iran Contras. So Epstein is right in the middle of this. And this is a seminal kind of global intelligence scheme that, that, that now we all acknowledge. Like, oh, Iran Contra was a thing like they did all these things and actually they did more than they've acknowledged. But even what they've acknowledged is how does the end up in business with Stan Pottenger? Do you think it's that Jeffrey Epstein is just a morally questionable guy, who doesn't mind blurring the lines of what isn't is inappropriate? Is there some other connection? Do they know each other socially? Like, what about Epstein makes him, you know, there's probably a lot of people at Bear Stearns. What about Epstein makes him the guy? I think that, I think he was, I think they knew each other socially. That's that's my sense from the reporting so far. And also, Epstein was building a lot of connections at that time. So he was going back and forth. The London a lot, he'd met Kashoggi, he'd met Leese. He's really starting to be somebody. Max Well. Max was like later in the 80s. Okay. Did he know her father? New of, I don't think they met. Actually, somebody like a Whitney Webb who knows this more in a more encyclopedic fashion. But no, I don't think so because I think they met when, yeah, so they met when she came to New York and she came to New York because he, because, you know, things were not going well for her over there because he had fallen off or got pushed off his yacht or whatever. Is it possible they met when he was going back and forth to London? Yeah, but I don't, I don't actually know the details of that early part. But and when it comes to Wexner, there's, this is something else we had reported on that we weren't the first. People like, wow, he does power of attorney for this random accountant. How on earth did this happen? Turns out that about a month before Wexner agreed to give Epstein power of attorney, the local police and the local attorney general, the state attorney, Jell-Aryne Ohio, we're looking very closely at all of Wexner's organization as linked to this like mob connected assassination of an attorney who was linked to a Wexner company. So like, is it about to testify this attorney? Right. Yeah. So the heat is on, he is on big time against Wexner. And so whether or not that had something to do with the decision, we don't know, but like shortly after that, the, the very planes that the CIA was using to do Iran contra, Epstein then transitions from that to running Victoria Secret, lingerie and Abercrombie and Fitch stuff from Hong Kong and China. So like, that's another connection where you're like, hold on, Jeffrey Epstein brought the CIA's like airline to Ohio to work for Wexner. And then when it's done, it goes to Angola where they were also shipping weapons. So when we're talking about the CIA, we're talking about obviously a very large agency with a lot of power. But as you rightly said, they are not usually the author of the story. They are working for a very wealthy people, business interests, things like that. We're talking about the CIA. We're probably talking about a faction within the CIA or many factions. I don't know. You could maybe illustrate this where there's probably a ton of people that show up at Langley every day. They're typing you know, these reports of their analysts and they're saying, what did the guy in Pakistan in the cafe say whatever. Who are the people in the CIA working with Epstein? I'm not saying you even know their names, but can you illustrate who these people are? Are they currently members of the CIA? Are they XCIA? Are they in other parts of the government, maybe the state department, but actually art, deep cover CIA agents? Who is helping him arrange air transport with the CIA front company, this airline and you know, with less wexter in your estimation? There's this like Amibe like overlap between the leadership of the CIA and the kind of XCIA types, you know, who are the former CIA directors, former CIA officials who are now doing, you know, consulting or they're running foundations that have enormous amounts of money like Waxner's Foundation, for instance, one of the biggest funders of pro-Israel causes or Leon Black is, you know, donating enormous amounts of money. Alison, it's the biggest donor to like friends of the IDF. So even if you're not directing a CIA budget, like if you can, you know, through your friends or through your board positions, you can still be moving kind of many millions of dollars. And so it's those people that are former CIA, but they're now in private practice, but they're still associated with the leadership of the CIA, plus then the people who are in the administration in the White House itself, so like the political appointees. And that's the kind of network that comes together to do it. Oftentimes, you know, lots of different operations at the same time and some of them almost at cross purposes and the ones we learn about are the ones that either blow up or are like eventually successful, but you'll get people together like, okay, here's something I'd like to do in Afghanistan, which is another place they were spending the Iran profits, by the way. And so all right, how are we going to fund this Afghan project? I was going to go to Congress. We're not going to go to the public and say, here's an idea we have, would you like to use your taxpayer money for it? No, we're going to like find our own sources of money, whether it's through Black ops, through this like CIA hedge fund, venture capital fund, or through our foundations that are friendly with us. And then we're going to see if it sticks. If it doesn't, we'll just deny it. And if it does, we'll deny it. So Epstein in your mind, this is somebody who obviously establishes all these connections with arms traffickers and, you know, billionaires, people like Lesilexner. Then he begins to facilitate operations between former government officials, billionaires, arms traffickers, and he's in this world. And so is he a free agent, meaning like, is this guy working at the behest of Israel? Is he working at the behest of a foreign government? This is something that I know, and I've talked to some smart people, you talked to more people than I do. I talked to a lot of people that are mentally ill, but they're very interesting. And it's hard to know what's what. And some of the mental ill people actually sound really credible now. But there is this belief that Epstein was working for Israel, or at least Israeli interests. And it dovetails with the wexner of it all. The Maxwell connection. Do you think there's credibility to that belief that he's not just a completely free agent that he is working on behalf of at least Israeli interests? Well, he was also politically aligned. So you wouldn't have to twist his arm to do it. But just from a matter of fact of what he actually did, we can count a number of different instances where he was doing things on behalf of either Abe Barak when he was Minister of Defense, or the state of Israel. I think you've talked about this in your show before. We started simple with a little story about security agreement they helped cut with Mongolia. Not the huge deal in the world. Sure. But it's to show how this thing unfolds. He and Adub Barak used their connections to get a meeting actually literally at Davos with the president of Mongolia. Larry Somers was there. I'm impressed, the guy shown that you are friends with powerful people. Then they cut some weapons deals. And then from there you get a security agreement. The same thing happening in other states as well. So you see like other countries perceiving him and perceiving Adub Barak, whose private citizen would go back and forth in and out of government as representative of Israel, of the state of Israel. Funny thing is that Netanyahu would agree with that. In fact, he shared some of our reporting and it created this big scandal in Israel because our reporting connects Epstein more closely to the kind of opposition in Israel. Right. Right. It would Barak and what used to be the labor party and all that. Progressive. And so Netanyahu is like a haxi Epstein. There is an Israel connection, but it's my adversaries. Now we'll have a story out next week about how he connected JP Morgan Chase and Netanyahu as part of this, what looks to be this like giant gas pipeline deal. So it wasn't just, he wasn't only on the opposition side. But yeah, but also Adub Barak, yes, he's his adversarial like in an intramural league with Netanyahu, but he's still out there representing Israel's interests. Right. But now was he doing that first or foremost or was his greater legions to the CIA or something we don't know, but we do know that he was carrying out missions on behalf. And that served the state of Israel like that's that's not it's not a controversial statement. Now what do you make of his relationship with Jislaan Maxwell? You know, you've studied this. You've talked to this. She's looking for a pardon, I believe she was moved to a much more, I guess, a low security or a lower security person. She's clearly angling to be pardoned. Right. What is the relationship with Jislaan Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein from your reporting? Also, what do you think Jislaan Maxwell may or may not have on the president of the United States? Yeah, I mean, they were tight for so long. That, you know, and I think there could be, you know, they knew Melania for a long time as well, like almost separately, the like Epstein and Golan. How do they know her? I think through John Luke Brinnell, some of the who killed himself. Yeah, he was a John Luke Brinnell died, right? He was a photographer. He was a fashion industry fashion industry guy, tycoon maybe in a sex trafficker, and then how did he die? He's dead. Right. Jail still also. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of depression. So he knew Melania could she was a model? That's, that's my memory. Yeah. Okay. And very early, very early stages and and Melania is very sensitive about this subject. I think she sued, she sued who? Michael Wolfe or she sued somebody. Okay. Yeah. She sued Michael Wolfe, I believe. Yes. Yeah. And I think she sued like this another book that was saying that she in Epstein dated or something. So she sued over that. So I think the Trump and Melania probably worried about what's in there as well. What do you mean? I mean, I know that you're a reporter. So you don't usually, you know, you know, extrapolate or say things that you can't. But if you could, and I'm not asking to make wild claims, what would the, what is the fear originate from? Well, so there, did you see the email that came out just the other day from in the latest tranche where it was, there was one pro federal prosecutor writing to others where he said, I just, just as a situational awareness or whatever the words are they use, uh, looks like president Trump, and this was during the first term, um, flew on Epstein's airplane, you know, significantly more times than what's previously known. And he was also on there twice with Maxwell while there were victims on the plane during the time that we're investigating her for sex trafficking. Right. Just just just a heads up like this is something y'all might want to know because this is our boss like at this particular moment, uh, like that right there in a, in any normal world would be utterly devastating. Like the, so this is a convicted sex trafficker, Maxwell, forget Epstein. Um, she's not convicted at that time though. Not yet, but was getting pro, was getting investigated. Now we now we know she's a convicted sex trafficker. And there were victims on the plane while the president or the wasn't the president yet, but while Trump is on the plane. And so, you know, at, at best at that point, you can be like, well, I didn't see anything, but everybody else who's ever been around these folks are like, no, this was like the botchress disgusting stuff. Right. There's no way you didn't see this. And also we know that, you know, he did that whole thing where he's like, yeah, what do you say on Howard Stern? He, he bought Miss teen USA so we could like creep into the locker room. Not an ideal statement. Um, for sure. Is so do you secretly recorded either? Just like, you see the email from Mark Epstein saying, my brother was about to name names. And I think his murder was authorized by the president. I hadn't seen that, but, um, I don't know, you know, that's in there. I guess, yeah, I will, I will say stuff in there, right? Right. I will say that it's, it's hard to believe that with the amount of power and the number of friends that he had that he felt like he had no way out. Like he considered himself to be a smooth operator, a very powerful person. He's got lots of damaging information about almost everybody in positions of power. Yeah. Like I've never seen, I don't know anybody who can get you meetings with Putin, Bill Clinton, Sarkozy, like, you know, Netanyahu. So you don't believe he killed himself. So it's just hard to see. Yeah, anything's possible, but like he was still fighting the charges. And there was no reason I think he was going to spend the rest of his life in prison given the power that he had. Right. What he, when what he, what he could offer, but I, and that, but that's dangerous. But then, you know, it's also very hard to understand, figure out how they could pull it off. But it's very hard for me to get my head to a place where he's ready to just end it. He's at Chelsea Clinton. I'm sorry, just Lane Maxwell as it Chelsea Clinton's wedding. Right. Bill Clinton. There's photos of him swimming in a pool with just Lane Maxwell. Yeah. Bill Clinton's not a rub. He knows that he knows what's going on. Right. Yeah. I mean, he knows who just Lane Maxwell is and what they're up to. Why is, and I know the answer. I think I know the answer. Why is Bill Clinton so cool with hanging out with these people? Yeah. I think, yeah, you probably know the answer. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah. Yeah. So we, so we, we have a problem here. I mean, this is truly a real problem, right? We, we, we have a problem if we're supposed to have a democratic society. Now, let's say it's hijacked by money. We all believe that hijacked by business interests. We all believe that it's hijacked by oligarchs and we, nobody's nobody who listens to this show is shocked to hear any of that. What I do think people are shocked by surprise by disgusted by enraged at is how many of these people seem to be either pedophiles or very tolerant of pedophiles. What about the ruling class in your estimation makes that the case that they, if they're not partaking, they're hanging out with human traffickers and that's okay. I think if I had to put them on the couch, the way they have lived their life suggests to them that there are no rules. Yeah. And I, and I also think partly that once you are a billionaire or once you've been president of the United States or president of whatever country you're from, there's probably a lot of boredom that creeps in. Right. And you, and I, and I would imagine like they start getting their thrills by, by pushing into the forbidden. Right. Like in a, in a world where almost everything is available to them. Yeah. With ease. Yeah. With just and everyone is nice to them. Even the people that hate them. Right. Like that's got to be unsettling. Well, you have Prince Andrew in the UK, who's, this has been a huge crisis for them, right? Because Prince Andrew has been named by multiple witnesses, very credibly and accused of serenacianist behavior. The UK police was just reported are now going to ACFBI for information on some of these UK sex parties where somebody is alleging that he was abused as an underage boy by Gisling Maxwell and Prince Andrew and like tortured, right? Like with electric shocks and everything like this in the UK. Now there's been, there was a scandal at the King Cora boys home in, I believe, Ireland, you know, that the Franklin scandal was another scandal in the 80s in, in Omaha, Nebraska, where Franklin Credit Union was laundering money on behalf of a human trafficker who was peddling children to wealthy and powerful people. Is this something that has been going on forever and this is something that people are now just kind of waking up to the depravity of some of these people? Like, you know, yeah, is this something that you think is, you know, do you have to go back? All the people who said, you know, pedophile shapeshifting listeners around the world, do you have to go back and apologize to them now? Yes, I think you do. Yeah, I think this, I think this level of power also like corrupts people's like souls in their minds. Yeah, sure, which is another argument for like actual democratic checks on their power on their own behalf too. You don't like, we're trying to prevent you from being shriveled up pedophile reptiles. Is there a quasi religious element to this? And I mean, not, and I don't get into the woo woo stuff all the time in the sense that like defiling and abusing innocence and innocent children and committing these horrible acts, this obsession with death. You see it with the skull and bone stuff. And I always thought I was kind of rooted off as kind of like childish and kind of trying to be edgy and whatever it is. But this obsession with death and these images of, you know, somewhat of the occult and the weird Bohemian Grove stuff where it's like, we all stand and everyone goes, well, it's just a frat party and it's a bunch of guys blown off steam and they're standing there and they're worshiping the out of mollock and mollock. Is a biblical symbol and it's talking about child sacrifice? Truly. Now I'm not trying to sound like crazy. And I know that you're a reporter and you're only going to talk about what you've sourced and what's out there. But like, is there some strange, you know, I mean, genuinely like, is there some strange belief system where these symbols keep popping up and these people have this weird and Tony Podesta's got weird art in his house. It's just very odd. I mean, truly, right? It's like, odd. It's like, I've, I've been in a lot of wealthy people's homes and I've never seen a picture of a demon holding a baby or what this art is very strange. Um, where the artist literally said, I'm working through my own trauma with this art. I don't know. I'm not trying to draw all of these, you know, associations. But like, do you look at any of this stuff that you're reporting? Do you look at any of this stuff in a new light now? Um, where you go? Oh, yeah, they believe certain people are disposable, expendable. If you're a 14 year old girl that grows up on the wrong side of Palm Beach, your life is meaningless to them and they can do anything they want to with impunity. Is there some overarching belief system that that fits into? I do think so. I think it is like one of the strongest arguments against inequality against this runaway, like, insane level of inequality that produces a class of people that is unique, separate distinct from the rest of the population. And it's got to mess with them. It's got to get in their heads because they don't have to worry about the pedestrian concerns that people have of like, making your mortgage and like, right, just staying alive and like keeping your marriage healthy and like spending enough time with your kids and like, there's the normal things. So then they have to like develop all of these pathologically, like, depraved activities to just keep them to let themselves know, to let them know they're alive. And this has happened to over generations. Yeah, generational problem. And it's happened also for thousands of years. Like if it was just legalized with, you know, herums and all that over, over, you know, the long-ark of history, the difference then was like, it was like, oh, that's what they do. How bad does this get for the Trump administration? I mean, I they're saying that there's a lot more files that still have not been released. Looking at the material, do you think this gets much worse? Do you think this makes him a lame doc president? Do you think there are calls for impeachment or resignation? What do you think happens? I mean, I don't, I don't think we're looking at impeachment or I think it's deeply damaging. I think, you know, there are a lot of people who are like single issue, right? No pedophiles, voters. That makes sense. Yeah. You know what? Clinton's going to be called a testify. And I think, and yes, they're trying to get them to. And it would be, you know, Steve Bannon went to jail for refusing us a pena to testify to Congress. It'd be wild if they refuse in life. What do you make of that relationship? You know, people talk about Steve Bannon advising him. There's hours of that's a that's a very good question. Wow. A cat. It's a black cat who comes in. Watch out. It's massage. That's what they do. All right. So Bannon and him. What's that deal? He I think I think Bannon, I mean, obviously, this is deep into people knowing what Epstein was all about. Yeah. I think Bannon understood like what an operator, like what an operator this guy was. Right. Like Bannon was, if you remember after 2017, he's trying to go to Europe and become this like right wing kingmaker and turn Europe into this, you know, right wing utopia. And he he's often working with Epstein, Epstein's connecting him to all these guys. But then he's also giving him all this advice about like how he's going to, you know, it's public image. And then he's like when Ahood Barak wants to run for Israeli Prime Minister again, he and Epstein like Bannon and Epstein are talking about working like Bannon wants to work for Barak. Right. Like to support Barak, which is like wild also. Yeah. And he is successfully dodged a lot of this scrutiny around this. I think and I think it's because there's no evidence that he was like parting, partying with the guy or involved in like that part of the problem. Right. He was just kind of having some, I don't know, advising him to whatever reason reason. Like because he, I think he correctly understood how powerful a role he was playing in the world at that point, which is what so many people like deny as a, as a reality. Do you think there's any chance that Jeffrey Epstein isn't dead? No, that, that would be wild though. That'd be a nice, that'd be a nice ending to this. I was told by someone, I was told by someone very high up that it was that they didn't think this was the case, but there's a small possibility that he's living on Wexer's estate in Ohio. It's so big. Just I would, I would assume they kill him again. If, uh, interesting, like what's the point of letting me live right? Like, top, yeah. Okay. Like, all right. Hey, we saved your life. We're taking a wex or the state. Oh, and then we're killing you right here. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Right. They don't want him. He's, he's dangerous. They can't have him around. He knows that he certainly, he certainly knows enormous. Like it, as a reporter, it's been, it's been interesting to get such a window into the type of machinations that are usually shielded from the public. Right. Yeah. He, he had, there were so many things he could have shed light on. Do you think this scandal, and I think it does, but would you agree that this really shed light on the way the world actually works in a way that maybe no other scandal has before? I think so. And I think, and I think when he was arrested in 2019, people got the, got this hope that they were going to get that look at the way the world actually works. And then it was slam shut. Uh, and now the window is kind of being forced back open a little bit. Uh, by the do, I do think that's right. I think that, um, this is the way that this Davos set, uh, operates globally. Um, and the, the more we know about it, the better. Um, but would you, would you say that this is also the way the country's like Russia operate and China and all of these big powerful countries? Yes. I think because we are, because we in Western Europe are, you know, nominally democratic. Yeah. We have a slightly greater need for people operating in the shadows. Right. Whereas I think that, you know, paradoxically, Russia and China can be a little bit more explicit about how they're going to manage their operations. Right. It's like, what do you say about it? Like this is, this is what we're doing. Right. Right. But I imagine that, you know, when he's back channeling or supposedly trying to back channel with Putin or back, like, he, this is, this is a guy whose there's no, he's working with everybody. Right. Yeah. He immediately got a baroque, this like two million dollar deal with Victor Vexelberg, big oligarch in Russia. Like as soon as he leaves the minister of defense position, he's like, I need money. Like I got your guy. Right. We're gonna, we're gonna hook you up with Branova. Um, he's, he's tight with Putin. And it's like, how, like what? Think, the have to think about like that, that alone is like, he's tight with the Clintons. It's tight with Trump or it falling out supposedly with Trump. And he's tight with Putin. Like what, how does that square with our understanding of what they tell us the world is? It's still tough. And you've done such a brilliant job of reporting. And I've read a lot of your stuff. It's still difficult for me to fully understand how that becomes the case. Right. It's still like when you say, oh, he's building connections to the, and I'm, he is clearly, but it's still difficult for me to understand how this happens in the sense of like, you know, he seems to, you know, how many people in history do you think are, have been like Jeffrey Epstein are currently like Jeffrey Epstein? Like how many Jeffrey Epstein's do we not know about? Right. Is he a one of one? Is he a one of a hundred? Is he, how many people are, would you say, with that deeply connected? And, you know, how does that, how many people? It's, it's a good question because it takes decades to build those connections up and to build that, to build that trust up, to get both sides to believe that this person's going to actually make this thing happen. You probably saw the one email that, to me, there were actually two that were striking to me, where Putin wants to meet with Epstein at this conference. Yeah. He wants to meet him on the sidelines of a conference. And Epstein tells Putin's aid, no, you know, if, if Putin wants to meet, like it's got to be at his palace and like we need to set significant amount of times that we can really hash things out. Right. I'm not doing like a little brief catch up. Right. At this conference, and meanwhile, he set up a, Barack, and I think it was Sarcosi, not Macron, and a banker for dinner in Paris. And he just blows it off. Epstein's supposed to be there. He's like, I'm not feeling well. Good God only knows what he was doing instead that night. Right. But, but he, he's just blowing off presidents around the world. And how, so how many people in the world are doing that? It can't be that. Nicholas Sarcosi have his own sex scandal. Or am I completely wrong? He's it. Yeah. And he's in prison right now for something. I mean, so it's just again, it's like this. He's this figure that is, you know, obviously he's a pedophile. He's a monster. He's trafficking women. What is this island? You know, he's got this strange island. He's got Phoenician symbols all over. It's like an odd. What is this? What role does this island play? Getting high level scientists, people in the tech community to this island? What is this guy? You know, what is he doing? You see, is that island? Do you think it's like a pleasure island where these billionaires are going in there? You know, meaning underage people. What is he doing with his island? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, he's definitely doing like what we think he's doing, right? There's lots and lots of evidence of that. And I think it's a way to set yourself apart in that billionaire class. Yeah. You got to have an island. Right. You got to have jets. You got to have a helicopter. You got to have an island. The ranch in New Mexico, I think, serves some of the same purpose. Right. But that's a little bit more pedestrian. Like having your own island. He also, as we've found in a lot of his correspondence, was figuring out these tax blue poles and tax incentives for these island-based bio-pharmaceutical, like you can call something like a biomedical company. Right. And then all of a sudden, you can move billions of dollars through it and it's completely laundered. And so, and people have not say, oh, like he's not a real accountant. It's like, because he wasn't a real accountant. He was willing, I think, to break the law in a way that other accountants wouldn't. So he was actually able to find, like genuinely innovative, quote-unquote, innovative solutions for these billionaires to be like, hey, the US version of islands, you can move your money right here. And I know people, and I can I can shelter it here. And then all of a sudden, now it's not taxable. And you also get these incentives. And so he's constantly blending. And as his survivors will tell you, he was like often on the phone while he's like getting these, you know, starting with the massage and moving into the abuse. So like people are often like, how do you have time to like be a part such a global operator when he was also like on a near daily basis of using girls? So he was literally doing them at the same time. And you read his emails. If you look at some of those, there's not a single sentence that doesn't have, isn't shot through with typos and grammatical mistakes. Like you can imagine him just like engaged in abuse and just like firing off emails to like prime ministers and arranging these meetings. And what do you think this? How does this shape the political reality going forward of the US Israel relationship? Does it have no impact at all? Is there a slight impact? Is there no impact? Does, you know, because that was one of the questions. Obviously, people are very unhappy about what Israel's done in Gaza and people are very happy about unhappy about people like Maryam Adelson and whatever. Do you think there's political, diplomatic fallout from this tranche of documents that's going to come out where people go, you know, this is a damaging, you know, this is damaging the US Israel relationship, or do you think it won't? I mean, I think so because I think eventually the rest of the press is going to have to start reporting on the the reality of it because it'll end up being similar to the lab leak question actually where you, till still, maybe to this day, do not have mainstream media approval for the idea that COVID leaked out of the lab in Wuhan. Yet if you do a survey of the American public, something like 80%, I think at this point, maybe higher, are like, yeah, it came out of a lab. And so even if I think you could see the same shift here, like, even if the mainstream media refuses to touch any of the like public information, public documents and correspondence that connect him to working on behalf of Israel, a year or two from now, you poll the public, you know, was he working on behalf of Israeli interests? I think you'll get like a 70, 80% doesn't mean it was solely working on behalf of Israeli interests, but yeah, so I think that they won't be able to hold that back. And so, and it coming in the context of both the genocide and also this like insistence that you're not allowed to criticize the genocide is just going to add up just too much. I don't know what, I don't, like what political party is going to be on an apologetically pro-Israel going forward? I need neither of them really. Yeah, it doesn't feel like it'll be a popular position. Two more questions and I appreciate doing this. Having done all the reporting you've done on Epstein on his connections on the extent to which he was involved in in global politics and the way that that network of people you talked about X intelligence, X, you know, leaders of countries, do you feel at a certain point, and again, this is asking you to kind of pontificate that that system is going, there's going to be a threat to that system and that is that that because we have more technology, we have a new media landscape, the, the, you can't control the narrative as much as you could, is there going to be a threat to that system? Or, and I would be the cynic and say not really because they don't really care. Like that, that's my thing. My thing is they don't care. They know that we know, we know that they know that we know. It doesn't, it doesn't seem to matter to them. Do you think it matters to them that we can get millions of people to watch this or listen to this or Rogan can get, do they care at all or not really? I think it bothers them a little bit because anything that they can't control unsettles them. I think that you're right that they still have things firmly under control, but they don't have everything under control. And so I think that bothers them. And I think, and it's no secret. I'm not a huge fan of Donald Trump, but I think a lot of the public thought that Donald Trump was actually going to be a threat to this system. Well, that's yeah, been extremely demoralizing to people to see the opposite come about to see him be an obstacle. What do you make of JD Vance out of curiosity? Since he's not connected to this, he could at least make hay out of it, right? But I think he's probably boxed in because he can't get ahead of Trump on this. So he's kind of stuck as well. He can speak in generalities. And now he's probably unleashed a little bit. Now that Trump has been pressured into releasing the files. But before that, he had to walk this fine line where he wants transparency, but he can't contradict his boss either. What do you think? Yeah, how do you think he's handled this? Well, I think he's in this interesting position, right? Because he has, he's got to have loyalty to Trump. But I also think that he's seeing his own political aspirations get negatively impacted by this. Right? I mean, that's obvious. So I don't really know, but it seems to me that he's in a weirdly untenable position because Trump's not running again and Trump's old and Trump's made his money. I mean, and I don't know, I don't know what exactly how far he'll dis, I don't know how damaging this gets. That's the real question, right? How bad does it get for the White House? And then his JD willing to go, hey, not me, you know, you know, uh, final thing, there have been lots and lots and lots of, there's been lots of speculation about two events. Now, I know that I don't know how much you've looked into any of these events. One was the attempt, attempted assassination on Donald Trump. The second is the, the assassination of Charlie Kirk. These have inspired lots of discussion across multiple platforms with many high-level people weighing in. And they've caused massive, you know, problems within the conservative movement. And there've, and even to a lesser extent, but even, you know, on the other side, you have, I think, certain fishers over issues like this, where you, you know, have people that are accused of conspiracy mongering and doing it for profit. And you have people that are like, well, no, I'm going to accept the official narrative of, of the FBI, which is now being run by cashmaterl. And, and I think you, you, you find a lot of people somewhere like I find myself in the middle of not being an investigative journalist, but also having no faith in cashmaterl and the FBI on those two issues. Where would you put yourself? I've, I've actually found it really interesting that the, the, in the two cases, like the one, the Charlie Kirk one, to me, does actually seem pretty straightforward. There's the FBI bungled it from start to finish. And some of it is like weird, but it does seem like to me, like what looks like to have happened, like mostly to me is what happened. Whereas on the Butler one with Trump, that is a complete mystery. Like it's a ghost of a person who doesn't exist on social media for the most part, nicks the guy's ear from, and climbs up there casually from 150 yards out. And that one is the one that was just kind of moved, everyone's kind of moved on and from it. But, and instead, focuses on the Kirk one, that, that, that, that part to me is, is, is kind of an interesting, that's not how I would have expected them to check out. And Trump never really brings it up. Yeah. And because I guess they never were able to like, if it would have been a liberal kid, then, or, or even if it had been a right wing kid, like, you need something, there's, there was nothing to grab onto. Does Israel bomb my ran before the midterms? They certainly want to. Right. They're, yeah, they're, they're, they're agitating Netanyahu will be here on Monday for what his sixth trip. What do they have on what, why is the president so docile when it comes to Benjamin Netanyahu? I don't know. He doesn't seem to like, like him interpersonally. Like when you look at their body life, which, and yet, and it's, it's, it's, it's, it's truly amazing. I actually, I saw your clip about him and Maryam Adelson, and which was still delightful. It is lovely. I mean, our friends, here's the thing with him and Maryam, they're just buds. You can tell they, you can tell he actually likes. There's very few people you can tell Donald Trump actually likes. I think he really likes Maryam Adelson. I think, I think he's also, yeah, I think he's also amused by her and by her late husbands. Yeah. Like obsession with Israel. He's always, he always likes, nags them about it. Like, man, you really love Israel. It's like the only thing you care about it. Yeah. Yeah. It just seems very interesting to me that he's such a, you know, you know, like, you know, wildly unpredictable guy on every single issue, except this one issue. Like he's been foreign against things. He'll go, we're doing this. We're not going to do it. I like this person. I don't like this person. He gets infused quickly. He fires people, but he loves Maryam Adelson. I mean, he's got 250 million reasons and counting. That's right. Yes. His whole selling point was that wasn't who he was. And it's like, we can't even get that. Is anyone going to be the president when that's not who they are? I don't know if it's if like, right, I guess the whole problem with, you know, he was so overleveraged and struggling in 2016. Like he wasn't an actual billionaire. So we need, we need some actual billionaires, I guess, if we're going to, that's what you've heard it here first, Ryan Grims, more billionaires, more billionaires, more billionaires. Well, it's enjoyed a holiday. In one place, we can put cars around the place. Happy New Year. Where can people follow your work? You're doing some of the best reporting right now in the country on this. That's very kind of you. Yeah. We're drop, we're at DropsiteNews.com. And then, you know, Monday through Fridays, where we're putting up shows at breaking points. But yeah, we're reader, reader funded. So let me put an app, reader funded over at Dropsite. So if you can, everything is free, but if you can become a subscriber or a donor, it's a nonprofit. Hey, you still have a few days to get your charitable contributions in. Get your charitable contributions in. I wish I could subscribe. I've given my yearly charitable contribution to Israel in the form of my agent. And that's where my money will go. Ryan, thank you again for making time to do this on a holiday weekend. I appreciate it. Yeah, it was my pleasure. All right. Thank you so much.