This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. Welcome to 40s and Free Agents with Daniel Jeremiah. I am Greg Rosenthal. And after frankly carrying the show the last month or so, because the veterans are more interesting at this time of year, and that's especially true with the Combine set to start. It's draft season. It's cut season. It's rumors. I still think the veterans are more important, but this episode, we do a little preview of the Combine, and I'm going to school with the best in the business, Daniel Jeremiah. What's going on? Greg, you ever get to that point where you're kind of away from your podcast for a while, like maybe you're traveling, you got other things going on, and your feed kind of piles up a little bit, and maybe it's your show that you listen to, and man, I've missed the last two or three episodes. I just imagine that guy getting on the plane right now. He's going to travel. I need something to listen to. And he's like, ooh, two fresh 40s and free agents. Let's see. Oh, I got Greg talking about the free agents. And I've got, well, a combine preview. So, I mean, I think we all know how that ends. And we like to welcome all those people to the show today. I mean, we can see the numbers. We'll see which show does better. It's generally very consistent. But, yeah, we were going to break this up and really make a meal, you know, offense, defense. but let's do the whole thing in one show. I'm excited about this, and it's a great week where I'm just going to be watching you and Rich and Charles and everyone on television. But we're going to start going to school on these players, and we're going to start on the offensive side. And you can take it any way you want, but I'll give you a question right off the bat, which is, is there any QBs just from the pack of QBs that you're curious of? Yeah, I think the player, you know, you can make a case, has the most to gain through this combine is Ty Simpson, the quarterback from Alabama. So I have an updated list that's out there now. My initial list, he was my 40th player. He's still around that range for me. It makes you see how big he is. First of all, we don't have the measurements on him. So is he 6'2"? Is he just over 6'0"? We'll kind of get the measurements on him, how big he is. He played really well at the beginning of the year. And then some injuries. He had a burst of sack in his elbow. He had a back rib situation. So his play kind of tailed off at the end of the year, including in the Rose Bowl where he didn't play well against Indiana and got knocked out of the game. He's only started 15 games, but he's son of a coach. He's going to interview really well. He's going to be very, very smart. Processing is kind of his deal. But getting to see him throw live, as someone whose strength is really the processing, to see his actual strength going through the drills, if he does elect to work out, I would imagine I don't think we'll see Mendoza. so he'll have a chance to really help himself and get himself into that first round conversation. Now, there's a conspiracy theory amongst scouts that's out there, and so I'll bounce it off you and I'll get off my list so I can see your reaction. See if you buy it. So there's rumors out there, and it makes a ton of sense seeing what some of these quarterbacks got that Ty Simpson could have got anywhere from $5 to $6 million if he would have gone into the transfer portal. He's only started 15 games, which is not a lot. So you think, okay, well, why wouldn't you just take that five to $6 million and go into the transfer portal and the rumors? And this is just all rumors with no, you know, again, just take it for what it is, is that, well, the scouts think some team has got to him and said, come out. We will, we would take you in the first round. You'll be made whole. Don't worry about the money thing. We'll, we'll take you. So there's no hard evidence of any of this stuff. This is just a bunch of scouts talking on the phones, trying to figure out why he didn't go into the transfer portal and take the $5 to $6 million that would have been available to him. So that's the crazy rumor that's out there. It is so funny that we have a situation where scouts are now questioning why a player doesn't stay in school because of the money when it used to be flipped. And we see a player like Trinidad Chambliss just fighting tooth and nail to stay, partly, I'm sure, because of that money. I don't think you can hold it against him. if if he does have some sort of hope or promise from a team i wouldn't i wouldn't trust that team but maybe i wouldn't trust it either right i would but maybe it was the advisory committee that the nfl has which i think would have been fair to project him as a late first is is there a guy though that this happens every cycle doesn't seem like there's going to be any debate about the one. So now it'll have to be about the two of like, actually he might be QB two. And, and maybe the combine. Are you looking for this year's Tom Savage, Greg, where we go through like a two week news cycle of how somehow Tom Savage is going to be a first round pick. And I don't know where it came from or how it got there. And, and then it ends up not even happening. But I would say a couple of games in the NFL, Malik Willis at the day of the draft, I remember people were still thinking he might go. I thought there was a good chance he could go up there in the top. And who knows, after we see what he gets in free agency, maybe we'll rethink that and maybe he should have and gone to the right place and it could work out for him. But to me, the two guys that are interesting, you've got Garrett Nussmeier off to the side, LSU. He's a little undersized. His dad is the offensive coordinator of the Saints. I saw him at the Senior Bowl. There's lots of tape on him. Everybody kind of has formed their opinion on him and everybody feels like there's a good chance he goes somewhere. On day two, most likely most teams would say more third round than the second round type guy. So he's in his own thing. But then you've got the big stature guys who have kind of the upside who've had just kind of a winding road. Carson Beck, who was in the national championship with Miami, who won a bunch of games at Georgia and just had some up and down moments, but is a big kid with a live arm and can move around a little bit. And then Drew Aller from Penn State, who's, you know, if you would have gone back two years ago, that was kind of on that trajectory to be a first round pick. And then they've had, you know, they had he got injured, missed most of this last year. Obviously, Penn State's season went down the tubes. But I think he's got a chance to interview well. He'll be big and he'll have a live arm throwing it out there. So I think those two big guys will be kind of clumped together as we go through the process. He feels like that guy. Maybe it's just because of name value that at some point maybe has that cycle. And even then it's like us maybe sneak into the back of the first round or, or pass Ty Simpson. But the quarterbacks are ultimately like not the most interesting position at the common. Are there, are there running backs here that you're just like, you want to see how they're not. It's not a great running back group. I think it's, there's two guys that kind of separate themselves up at the very top. They're both Notre Damers, golden domers, I guess I should say, but Jeremiah love who'll be a top 10 pick more than likely. He's got, you know, he watching him catch the ball. I don't know what he'll do with the combine. but he's legit 4'3 type speed. He's got unbelievable hands, runs routes, does all that stuff. So he's kind of up there by himself. And then his teammate, Jadarian Price, a little more compact, traditional running back build. He can return kicks. He's got juice. So he would be that second guy. And then after him, Emmitt Thompson from Nebraska would be next up. And he's someone I'm anxious to see how he runs. Sorry, Emmitt Johnson. Wrong last name here. uh amit johnson from nebraska getting a chance to see him he's got he's got a lot of juice see how big he is he listed at 200 pounds he doesn look super big when you watch him on tape but i think he run fast another guy who going to blaze uh and run really fast in that group for me right underneath him is Mike Washington Jr out of Arkansas who gives you 228 pounds to go along with that speed and you can see the speed when you're watching him. So those would be kind of some key guys to watch from the running back group. But, again, there's one in the top 10. Jadarian Price has a chance to maybe – he could potentially get into the back of the first round, but I think he's a second-round pick all day, every day. And then, you know, you get to the Johnson and Washington is real interesting guys. But the thing about the combine is, you know, there's every single guy invited. If they're if they're smart about it, the guys at the back end, they're going to be running. And so DJ's got to got to have an angle. He's got to have a little nugget about each one when they come up. So the people like me can can learn about these guys. So how so how is how is the prep for that going? Your little one-liners, your little quips, your one joke that you're going to have about each one of these guys. Or not joke, but sometimes it's more of a serious angle. Some of it just happens. Like DK Metcalf got up on the line and I said he looks like the Batman suit. And that got a long runway there. That got a lot of plug. One of my favorite nuggets I had on a kid was Cam Juergens. And I found out that he had his own beef jerky and it was, you know, so cam jerky. And we kind of had fun with that for the whole, that got us through a couple hours of that one. So you're a mixture of just kind of seeing what you see, hearing guys grunt, which is always evokes Monica Sells reference for me, which probably is a little dated. But we stick to our guns on that one. And the other stuff is just calling around to – I'll call around a bunch of college head coaches to give me nuggets on guys, different friends with college programs, and then actually even agents. Agents will have – well, this guy's brother was this, that, or the other, some of the stray random background crap I can throw out there. I appreciate you keeping the Celest name out there. Thank you. In terms of the start to her career, maybe the greatest of all time. You can make the argument. As a tennis guy, I support it. Wait, you mentioned DK. So like who's going to be, maybe it's tough to be like DK, but the wide receiver that just impresses you. There's so many. When I look at your top 50 list, I think you have 11 or 10. You have five in the 40s, which is interesting, or maybe it was four in the 40s. There's even more that are in that mix. Oh, man. It's a good group of receivers. There's a bunch of them. I will say that, first of all, just no going in. There's an undersized receiver. You know, he's down way, he'd be way down my list. but Brennan Thompson from Mississippi state, um, who's going to be five, eight and change, maybe 170 something pounds. He's got a chance to break the record. Like he can fly. So he's going to be the, he's going to be the horse that you're watching there to, you know, I'd say it's a small horse, but he's a, he's someone who can absolutely fly. So it'd be interesting to see what he does, uh, on the receiver front. We'll see if McKay lemon runs from, from USC. I love his game. Carnell Tate and Jordan Tyson. Those are kind of the big three. curious to see what those guys do denzel boston's a big receiver from washington he's you know he's gonna be six three you know 210 ish and he's gonna run in the probably the mid four fours casey concepcion is gonna fly from a&m and he's i've kind of talked about him with seattle if shaheed were to leave because you got somebody with return ability had two punt return touchdowns as well as some big time upside as a vertical player so you got those types of guys a Dion Burks is someone I'm a little higher on than probably the rest of the league. He's going to fly. He's going to run really well. Kind of a compact build out of Oklahoma was a Purdue transfer. Zachariah branch from Georgia, former USC receiver. He is going to fly. So we got some real, some real speed dudes here. And then the question marks, you know, the two Indiana kids, I'm curious to see what they run. I really like Omar Cooper jr. He's a really good player. I'm just curious to see, is he high mid high four, four? is he a mid four five i don't know that it really matters other than just curiosity uh because one of the things i do during the during this time is my buddy jack andrade a researcher extraordinaire before these position groups run i have him pull the averages of the top 10 players based off production in the nfl the previous year and there's a bunch of these top receivers who run the four fives so you know i try and put some context on those numbers as they go yeah and and you can now get the the tracking data too from some of these guys and that's helpful sometimes they they play a little faster you know in game put pads on them and they run are there any guys and how much does it really matter in terms of just watching the fluidity especially of the receivers because i would think this is a good spot to compare apples to apples of just like how some of the guys you're wondering how they move compared to others maybe they're big big fast and beautiful as you guys would as you guys would say but you like want to see if they really can move as a receiver does that really make a difference and is there anyone that stands out to you that you want to see like that yeah i mean there's there's always guys who maybe run a limited route tree they don't you know run a lot of different routes so you get a chance to see really the bigger guys can they get in and out of breaks can they work back downhill back down the stem like those are those are things you're looking at to work out i would say the group which will get to corners have the most writing on the actual movement stuff and the workout stuff because a lot of the corners play kind of butt to the sideline and kind of shuffling and you don't see them backpedal. You don't see them have to really open up. You know, you don't see that, you know, what their fluidity looks like with their hips. You can see it in a workout. So that group probably has the most on it, but in terms of a receiver going through things like a Zachariah branch is going to be fun to watch at Georgia. It's just a lot of, you know, quick hitters, bubbles, tunnel screens and quick outs. Like I want to see him really go through the full, you know, route tree and see what he looks like because he's super, super dynamic. Sometimes you can almost be too fast where you almost want – you've got to be able to kind of gear down. So he's one that I would say I'm interested to watch go through the workout. Obviously, it's been a trend of less top players doing the full workouts at the combine. So we don't know if Kenyon Sadiq, the tight end from Oregon, is going to work out. But I've got to imagine he would be a badass to watch. Yeah, he looks like Buzz Lightyear. Like he just kind of like just got like square jaw and a freaking just all muscles. He's got muscles on muscles. But I had a scout one time who said this guy has muscles in his poop in the draft room. I didn't know how to take that. It was very weird. But if somebody did, I would say it might be him. He's I'm curious to see him if he does, though, like he's a little bit tight and he had a lot of drops this year. So even seeing someone like that, just want to see him frame the ball, catch the ball well. But if he works out, he's going to jump out of the gym. He's going to fly. He can run. And it seems like it's a class where there's a lot of different offensive line opinions in general. You have a guard up atop yours, but then there's just a whole swath of tackles who could be anywhere in the first round. Does the combine actually make a big difference for separating these guys? I wouldn't say a huge difference. Look, we'll see what the length is on some of them. I know there's nothing former offensive lineman, uh, that rallies former offensive lineman quite like the arm length discussion on social media. Um, but I mean, I'm just telling you it's been in the rooms and it's brought up and it matters to teams. So, um, you know, that be interesting just to see the kind of the measurements on some of them but not to the Patriots Cause you know I wanted them to take Armand Membu I don know what his arms are like Yeah I had Membu as well but we see how that all plays out But I'm going to – like to me, if you're looking – what are you looking for in these offensive linemen? I would say the most important number potentially for them, this whole group would be Caden Proctor's weight from Alabama because he had started the season pretty heavy. And then lost weight, played much better later on in the year when his weight came down. So, you know, we've seen some offensive linemen who've had issues in the league where they, you know, had weight issues and they couldn't control it. So he shows up in a good weight, moves around and runs well. He could really help himself. Whenever an offensive lineman comes into the scouting combine overweight or he suddenly looks much better and he, oh, wow. That's always the moment where I'm like, it's a little weird what we all do here, you know? Yeah, no, this is making news. And I start thinking about my life choices that at least he's out there playing a sport. And this is what he has to deal with. I'm just I'm just talking. It's weird. I 100 percent, especially if you're foreign to like this, the sports environment from the outside. It does not have a great look to it. I readily admit that. But there's also the fact that these are, you know, these are multimillion dollar investments that people are making. I get it. These bodies. But it is it is I get it. I understand the people that get cringed a little cringy. But we're just like what it's like a headline and everything. Of course, you're all talking about it. But it's just like it's it's leading the broadcaster or leading like a podcast. All right. I'll let you fly on on defense. What what what overall like big picture stands out to you from this week? Edge rusher and corner. I think it's really, really good group of edge rushers and corners. And there's a lot of guys clumped in together. So I think there's opportunities here. If you look at it historically, or look at it from this last year, I should say, with the numbers that Jack pulled for me, the edge rushers, the athleticism is almost a necessity there. The top 10 guys in sacks last year in edge rushers, I want to say they, on average, ran 4.55 and jumped 37 inches. This is a traits position. You've got to have some juice and some explosiveness. That can help separate some guys. And like there's a, you know, Cassius Howell. This will be the roller coaster ride of the combine. Cassius Howell from Texas A&M is going to check in and he's going to have probably 31 inch arms. You know, he's going to have really short arms. He's not like Reuben Bain from Miami is going to have short arms. Reuben Bain's almost 280 pounds. He's 275 pounds. Cassius Howell is in the low 250s with really, really short arms, which teams and talking to teams, it bothers them. I think there's a good chance he could crack four or five and run in the high four fours. And you're going to have the arms people and then the speed people. And you're going to look in those boxes at the combine, and you're going to see some discussion going on between the arms folks and the speed folks. What are you? I am a little more forgiving on the length for the defensive ends if they've got a special trait. So if you've got special power, if you've got special speed, I think there's ways you can overcome that a little bit. And look, last year's class was supposed to be incredible. up front it's not it's not an easy position to adapt to i think abdul carter is going to be great still and i think your numbers were good yeah jalen carter i mean not jalen carter uh jalen walker is right on schedule i think um james pierce was productive before now you know who knows when and if he's going to play football again and that was something maybe that that caused him to fall in the draft but i think overall it was kind of a disappointing uh class if you go into the depth There wasn't a lot of production there or from defensive tackle. So you've been telling us these big guys are going to produce. You got to deliver. It's on you. If I tell you about the talent, the talent dictates where they get picked and then it turns into development thing. That's another podcast for us, by the way, is the baseballization of football personnel departments. That's taking place where they're starting to realize we need to invest more in development. Development's been a baseball thing and football. it's been identification and then now it's about development component where you have the smart teams have a position coach and then you could call it like almost like a caddy for every position coach where i've got to coach the guys get ready to win the game and then my assistant position coach has got to be working to develop the younger players that aren't getting all those opportunities but they're getting better throughout the year that makes sense and i i think that was always part of Belichick's secret sauce was he was still trying to coach and teach fundamentals I think and you would always hear players that would come to that team it's like oh they actually kind of coach us fundamentals instead of just assuming they're going to know what we're doing because yeah you don't you don't see that that development always at the pro level I I was curious like Jermon McCoy's coming off uh a torn ACL for Tennessee and yet you've got him sky high He could be one of, if not the first. He could be the first corner to go. Not a surprise at all. I know teams that I've talked to that see him that way. So is that a big week for him to see where he's at? Yeah, just where he is health-wise. His tape is really, really good. So that'll be interesting to see. Mansoor Delane, I don't know if he'll run or not, but I think the expectation is he's probably high 4-4s, not going to be like some crazy, crazy low 4-3. Maybe he does, and that'll get rolling. But those are the top two corners for me. Then there's a little bit of a gap. And then, you know, Cissé, I've got to remember how to pronounce his name. I'll look at the pronunciation when I get to Indy. But the corner from South Carolina is supposed to absolutely fly. So he's going to run really, really well. I love, you know, this is another debate we'll have and talking with Rich throughout the broadcast, but Keontae Scott from Miami is, you know, 25 years old. He's a great player. I love him. He's one of my favorite players. I've watched this whole cycle, but we've got, you know, man, uh, we've got, uh, uh, uh, Mesidor, the edge rusher from Miami. And maybe there's a reason why these teams, you know, are playing the national championship. He's 25 years old. Like they've got some, there's a lot of 24 and 25 year olds in this draft. So when you're comparing, you know, a Mesidor who I like better as a player than a Keldrick Falk from Auburn, Keldrick Falk's like 20 years old, 21 years old. So you've got a four-year age difference. How do you factor that in as you're going through it? And if you look at recent history, not just the quarterbacks, because we could talk about Shuck and Bo Nix as being older, but Peyton Wilson came in as an older player, has been really, really good for the Pittsburgh Steelers. Craig Woodson was one of my favorites from last year's draft, 24 years old, I believe, who went to the Patriots and played great. So I think teams are a little more you know a little a little less worried about that as they would have been maybe some years past i mean craig woodson has to be one of the best day three picks from this last draft in terms of how he produced yeah it's maybe it's a ceiling floor debate and it feels like front offices would do well to get players that can play and and so the floor is higher for some of these older players maybe that you know that they're going to be good i look i think that the players who the teams that have taken the older quarterbacks aren't aren't feeling bad about it i think no and jaden and bonex at the college level i mean that um you know that what signetti has said we had him on our show and he talked about everybody else deal with potential I not dealing with potential I want guys who are productive like who done it And so it the age old question right You want the guy with the high floor or the high ceiling and the production versus the potential. Then again, the second the walls started caving in on Drake May and the playoffs went extremely south, the first thing I went to defensively was like, yeah, he's younger than Cam Ward. You know, he's two years younger than when Burrow made it to his Super Bowl in his second year. And I do think if you're a Patriots fan or a believer in Drake, that is a factor. Like, where is he going to be when he's 25 years old? So with someone like him or some of these prospects, hopefully you can get a little bit of both. What about Caleb Downs? Does he have a little something to prove? I'm curious if he runs. I'm curious if he runs. I don't think he I think he's a really, really good player. but I don't know. I don't get the sense when I watch him that he's, you know, he's some, somebody that's going to run in the four threes or low four, fours. Like he, I'd be curious to see if he does run. I mean, he's a great player consistent at the off the charts with the intangibles and stuff off the field, reliable, dependable, but I didn't think he was a freaky traitsy guy. So, and, and I, trust me, there's been times where I've thought that before and guys have gone out there and absolutely blown it up and, and, and surprised me. So maybe he would, but I'd be curious to see what he actually does there. Not a lot of like premier defensive tackles necessarily. By the way, quick, quick on the safety thing. Dylan Thienemann from Oregon, I think is going to run really well. And, and I really love Emmanuel McNeil Warren, the safety from Toledo. I think those three safeties are excellent players. So I'm curious to see what he does as well. There's there'll be there'll be some guys that roll in this in this DB group. Do you want to talk about linebackers, Greg, since you deemed them the most important position in football on the last episode? Well, I mean, I just want you to allow guys who look like elite linebacker prospects to even play linebacker. Like you're putting Arvel reset on the edge or whatever. It seems like, you know, he could be your LB one. Yeah. And look, there'll be discussion about that. He played off the ball, played on the ball. We've seen that a lot with players over the last few years. I think he's most valuable off the edge. I said the same thing about Parsons when he came out. I've said the same thing about all these guys. Jalen Walker, to me, I think that's where his value kicks in just because I think he's got tons of upside off the edge. But we'll see how he's utilized once he gets picked. Sonny Stiles is going to be a freak. He's way up there on my – he's one of those ones, probably the distance between where I have him ranked on my list versus where I put him in mock drafts, maybe the most disparity, just because I don't know how teams are going to value it. But he's going to be 6'4 and change. He's going to be close to 240 pounds. He's going to jump out of the gym. His basketball highlights, if you want to have some fun, go watch those. It's ridiculous how explosive he is. So he's going to be a fun one to watch work out. But it's a really good linebacker group there's lots of depth uh again day two you know second third round group it's really really good i i'm trying to think has there ever been a case where like two linebackers from the same team in this case yeah it would be it'd be styles and what about uh what was it who was with simeon rice and uh oh that's the other line there was other linebacker was illinois right they were in the same well rice you know more of an edge rusher right but um yeah but the same same type of a thing where you know you got those two two front seven players and reese does play off the edge some so i'm sure there was two of them somebody miles jack and uh eric kendricks i came up with but oh okay my miles jack fell to the second round because of his knee little kevin hardy thank you gavin kevin hardy and simeon rice how about that how about that poll right there simeon rice just an all-time oh you know what i want where yes what about uh the Miami guys with Vilma and DJ Williams. Were they in the same draft? I kind of forgot about DJ Williams. That's a good call. Yeah, they played together. They played together. Miami was always stacking them up. There will be pro stuff, by the way, something to keep an eye on. Just some teams I'm just going to throw out that this week, fascinating. Eagles, I mean, they got everything is going on with the Eagles. Everything feels on the board. Who's going to retire? Who's not? What are the trades going to be? I just think they're going to be crazy. The Chiefs are going to be fascinating to see this week. I'm just throwing this out there. Your team, the Chargers, they got a lot of decisions on both lines. And they're like the best team that has way too much cap space. Like there's no point in having $85 million in cap space. Well, they got to do a lot to their own guys. Yeah, most of it is our bad teams right now. But the Chargers are a good team that has a lot of cap space. And then the Bears are kind of on the flip side where they have some tough decisions to make. But they're also intriguing. It's go time for them. I think it's go time for the 49ers too. They now have gotten out of their little cap jail and they're trying to win right now. So those are just some teams I'm saying to watch this week in terms of off the field. What's going on? Can I give you one idea what we should probably do right now? Well, it is because we're recording this a little bit ahead of when you're listening to it. Yeah. So something it's the NFL. Crazy stuff happens all the time. So let's just let's just right now real quick so we can just insert this. OK, so you just go about how you're surprised you are. You can't believe what just happened. Then we don't talk about it specifically, but then we're covered. Okay, go ahead. This is bad podcasting, DJ, because it's probably not going to happen. You go ahead. Because you don't want to point out that we're taking it ahead of time. Oh, my gosh. I mean, look, I didn't see it coming. I didn't see it coming. I guess we shouldn't be surprised. I mean, it's a crazy league. It's a crazy league. And we'll see. Look, I have my doubts about how this whole thing is going to work out, but we'll see how it all goes. Oh, you're not even giving the take. I thought you were going to say something like, I can't believe that AJ Brown is now a member of the 49ers or something. It's just a professional move. You know, you just have that in the can, drop that in, keep the episode alive. We don't have to record again. Keep the train moving. This is where DJ's at. He's just phoning in in your, what is this your year doing? It's my 14th draft combine with the network here. A youngin. although he's had that Move the Sticks Twitter handle for a long time How many years have you been here Greg? I mean I've been at the NFL for 13 years but I've been covering the NFL for 22 or so now How sad is it going to be when we go back and listen to this episode and then they've put in the song on the back end in the arms of the angels and they're just playing that over this whole conversation and then it just says a little dash with our start and end dates I love a little gallows humor here on 40s and free agents. Hopefully we'll be back next week. No, I fully expect we will. And we'll be really cranking up just a week before free agency. Good luck with everything at the combine. I will be watching. Our listeners will be watching. This is the Super Bowl for Daniel Jeremiah. Caleb on chase on a Patrick Queen as well. There you go. Oh, that's a good one. First round pick Caleb on chase on back in the day. Now I've got to go make some money in free agency. We'll see you next week.
