BBC Sounds Music Radio Podcasts Hello and welcome to NewsHour from the BBC World Service coming live from London. This is Owen Bennett-Janes and we'll be hearing from NewsHour's Regina Vidianathan in Hungary in half an hour. She's there to cover the big election there tomorrow. And also today... Splashdown confirmed. But now for the four astronauts who've just returned to Earth at the end of that Artemis mission. But first of all, Pakistan and during the post-911 US campaign in Afghanistan, the US military booked the top floor of Islamabad's Serena Hotel for several years. Today, the US is back in the Serena, but this time with some fellow guests from Iran, it's the venue for today's talks between the US and Iran, Pakistan mediating. The Afghan campaign ended with the Taliban victorious. What's going to happen in the Iran conflict? The US is control of the skies. Iran has control of the sea, or at least a key bit of it. The strait of form was where ships can only pass with Iranian permission, the Tehran toll booth. President Trump says the strait must be opened. The Iranians don't want to give up a key bit of leverage too easily. President Assadiq Bal, Pakistani government minister for planning, spoke to the BBC on Saturday morning before the talks began. The stakes are very high. I mean, let's see that if these talks do not succeed, what is the alternate? Alternate is a complete destruction of not just any one country, but the whole region and not just the region, but the whole economy. Even if the oil goes to $200 a barrel, what will that mean to 193 economies? So I am very confident, hopefully, that both sides, if they have travelled so far, if they have come here, they do all mean business, and we will try our best to see that both sides can come to some agreement. The US delegation is being led by the Vice President J.D. Vance. Before flying to Islamabad, he explained the public American position. We are looking forward to the negotiation. I think it's going to be positive. We will of course see. As the President of the United States said, if the Iranians are willing to negotiate in good faith, we are certainly willing to extend the open hand. If they are going to try to play us, then they are going to find that the negotiating team is not that receptive. So we are going to try to have a positive negotiation. The President has given us some pretty clear guidelines and we are going to see. Let's speak now to our Chief International Correspondent, Lee's, who sets come live from Islamabad. I mean, I'm just trying to work out what we could now. I suspect that Pakistan is giving very little away, but format and content, do we know about either? Good evening from Islamabad. Well, what we do know so far, the little bit of information that has been released and some photographs is that, as expected, first the Pakistani officials, most of all the Prime Minister Shabaz Sharif, as well as the Foreign Minister Ishaq Dar, have held separate meetings with the American delegation headed by J.D. Vance, the Vice President, and then with the Iranian delegation headed by the Speaker, Mohammad Bagher Khalibov. Interestingly, there were no photographs released, at least not so far, of that side of the meetings. This is what has happened before, Owen, in what were largely indirect talks at a lower level, when Oman was the mediator last year and then in February this year, both times it should be noted, were shattered by the onset of war. But what would happen is that the Omani mediator would go between the two sides, would have one document and would say, this is what the other side wants, and then would take it back and forth to see what common ground there was, where each side would be willing to make some movement. But what's different this time is that there is a hope that there would be face-to-face talks, that J.D. Vance and Mohammad Bagher Khalibov will sit down in the same room and try to work out some of these difficulties. I think the best they're trying to hope for today, it's only one day, and this has been a very long conflict, six weeks of war, but a conflict dating back decades, is that there's a kind of a framework for future negotiations, the elements that they could build upon for a future agreement. But as you know, when talks like this take place, the two sides come out and well, mediators, if there is a mediator, and they say, well, we've had productive talks and we've agreed to meet again. And sometimes, given the intensity of a conflict, even agreeing to meet again is a good sign, but I think they will want to see more than that this time, because the stakes, it doesn't need emphasis, are so very high, and the risks are an even more dangerous escalation. But are you saying this is a one-day session of talks, or is it going to go on for several days? Well, this is a curious thing. If you look back to see when did the Iranians and the Americans succeed at nuclear negotiations, it was in 2014 and 2015. The talks extended over 18 months of breakdowns and breakthroughs. They sometimes negotiated night and day. So far, all they've been having is talks for a morning when Steve Whitcoff, President Trump's special envoy, when he was negotiating, he'd talk about, he'd go to Geneva or to Oman. And when it was in Geneva, they'd talk about Iran in the morning, talk about Ukraine in the afternoon, and then fly back to Washington. That is not the kind of format that can make the progress and wrestle with the issues. And there are so many issues on the table. There have to be serious sustained negotiations. And that's a big question. JD Vance doesn't have the time to spend that much time at the table, and the U.S. has not appointed a specialized negotiator backed up by nuclear experts, experts on Iran. If you really want to do a deal, this is a very idiosyncratic negotiating style. President Trump's saying, talking about a peace deal within two weeks, that's impossible. So yes, for now, it's talk of the day. There's been some comment that if there's some progress made, JD Vance could possibly spend the night. There could be more talks tomorrow. But let's, we have to wait and see. Coswell, it's very, very early stages in the process then, isn't it? And there's been some confusion about assets being unfrozen or not unfrozen Iranian assets? Well, these were the two preconditions. And the Iranians, it has to be said, are still mentioning them that they don't want to engage in direct talks, or indeed any talks at all, unless their preconditions are met, that the ceasefire should include Lebanon, and that their assets should be unfrozen. We understand they're talking about the assets being held in the Gulf state of Qatar, that Iran, after dual nationals were released years ago from Iranian prisoners, that their Iranian money had been transferred to Qatar. It's still not been unfrozen. And Iranian official was quoted as saying, that's been agreed. And then the Americans came back and said, no, that hasn't been agreed. And as you know, and in these sorts of negotiations, one side can say something that they believe is the case. And then until we have confirmation, it's very, it's very risky to conclude that one thing or another is actually going on. Yes, indeed. Thanks very much. That was at least who says our chief international correspondent. Let's just get a taste of what people in Tehran are saying about these talks. So the Tehran based news agency WANA has been out and about gathering some opinions. In my view, these negotiations are a plan to give US forces breathing space. They want to deceive us so they can attack again. So far, they have betrayed us twice and attacked during negotiations. They have been hostile to us for 47 years and have constantly been in conflict and attacking. That is why they can't be trusted. I hope these negotiations are fruitful and positive. The reality is that the people of Iran are right and should reach the demands that have been set. But given that the US has always shown a negative face in past negotiations, it can be said that we cannot be very optimistic about these talks and there is a possibility of further US mischief. And some analysis now from Ali Fatola Najad, an Iranian-German political scientist and director of the Center for the Middle East and Global Order. It's a think tank based in Berlin. Now then, what are you expecting from these apparently may only be one day of talks? Well, the start is quite complicated because the general question is whether the two sides, the Iranian and American delegations, can agree on a general framework for negotiations to seriously start. Because what we know from now is that both sides' positions are very much far from each other. On one side, we have the plan that was presented by the Americans a few weeks ago, which is basically demanding that Iran dismantles its ballistic missile program, its nuclear program, and it also stops support for regional militias, so longstanding US and Israeli demands. On the other hand, we have Tehran's 10-point plan, which is totally talking about different subjects, which is also a maximalist position from the Iranian side, asking for all kinds of things, including the removal of all sanctions, a kind of Iranian control over the Strait of Hormuz, reparations to be paid by the US and Israel, the removal of all UN Security Council resolutions and IAEA Board of Governors resolutions. The Gulf could not be more broad than this. Yeah, but you could imagine, couldn't you, that the missiles, the nuclear stuff, the proxies, the reparations, all those sort of issues could be put into a negotiating process. The one thing that can't really be put into a process that will take months and months is the Strait of Hormuz, because that is a pressing issue for the global economy. Absolutely. You're absolutely right on that. We also have to see whether the Iranians are serious about their so-called preconditions prior to starting talks with the United States and Islamabad, which basically involves accepting Tehran's two-week ceasefire protocol for the Strait of Hormuz, with basically Iran's armed forces allowing the passage of 15 ships only per day after the payment of a toll. The Iranians are making very clear that they do claim some sovereignty over the Strait of Hormuz, which is highly problematic, of course, because this is not in line with international law. Well, there's another issue, apparently, which is that is it clear where all the mines that have been laid in the Strait are? I mean, even if there was agreement, there may be technical issues that are quite problematic. Absolutely. A few days ago, we had a statement from Iran's Islamic Revolverry Guard Corps that actually showed where in the Strait of Hormuz, there was some mining and it's basically close to the coast of Oman. This is why the Iranians have suggested that shipping could pass along the Iranian coast to the north of the Strait. This is also a major issue that has to be dealt with, of course. I'm getting the impression from you. You don't really think this is going to resolve anything. Does that mean you think the ceasefire will come to an end and the fighting will resume? Well, this is very unclear to me because it depends on both sides' willingness to put an end to armed hostilities that both sides understand that the cost associated with continuing the war is too high for the Iranian side. I mean, within the Iran regime, there's also tensions. There are lots of hardline elements that are wholeheartedly rejecting any prospect of restarting negotiations with the Iranian side. But then again, there are other elements within the Iranian regime who do understand that maybe the continuation of US and Israeli strikes would be quite detrimental for regime stability. And also in terms of the economic crisis that is hovering over all kinds of different dimensions, which is also in the medium term could be quite destabilising for the stability of the Islamic Republic. OK, well, thanks very much for giving us your take on what's happening in Islamabad today with those talks. That was Ali Fatola Najad, Iranian-German political scientist based in Berlin. You're listening to the World Service of the BBC. And coming up in 30 minutes, we'll be hearing from a 13-year-old girl in Beirut who witnessed an Israeli strike on the city. We were walking home and an airstrike struck the building in front of us. The first thing we did was run to another building and I just started swearing. I was just so scared. There's an amazing video of that which has been seen by people all around the world, so you can hear that whole story a little later on. Some headlines now. Negotiators from the US and Iran are in Pakistan to discuss a permanent end to the war, but they appear far apart on key issues and divided by deep mistrust. NASA has hailed Artemis II as the perfect mission after the four astronauts splashed down safely in the Pacific Ocean following their voyage around the moon and we'll be hearing a little more about the psychology of being an astronaut in just a moment's time. So the four astronauts of the Artemis lunar mission have returned to Earth safely, having made it to the far side of the moon, with NASA providing a largely, seemed to me, prescripted running commentary of the mission. They were of course on hand to describe the moment the capsule splashed down into the Pacific Ocean after 10 days in space. Houston, Pagardy, splashed down, sending post landing command now. Splashed down confirmed. Copy splashed down, waiting on VLDR. Splashed down confirmed at 7.07 p.m. central time, 5.07 p.m. Pacific time. There we are. That was the description of the landing in the Pacific and Susan Charlesworth is an astronaut trainer and psychologist joins us now. Well, I mean, I must ask you, why does why do astronauts need psychologists more than the rest of us? Well, they are, as you know, have been living and working in such a confined, isolated environment so far from home that it would take, you know, quite a lot of preparation, psychologically, as well as all the technical preparation that they've been through to be able to manage that as they have been doing so admirably. Well, tell us a bit more about that. If they didn't have psychological advice, what would go wrong? Do you think? What are the vulnerabilities? Yeah, so I mean, the first thing is the psychological selection that they go through. So even to become an astronaut, it's really important that they're put through their paces and have all this psychometric testing. We would never select astronauts that would, you know, that where anything would go wrong in the first place. And then to have the kind of training that I provided the European Space Agency astronauts, you know, it's so important in terms of their leadership and their teamwork. So there's four of them, as we just said, you know, in such a confined space, you know, you don't want them having arguments and conflicts and things like that. So yeah, and I wondered whether some of the big issues for a psychologist would would would be now in the after the mission. Yeah, certainly. So they again have another psychological team on hand for them. They're already conducting debriefings, both medical, but also psychological, on the ship that they're on after their splashdown to make sure they're all OK to get all their debriefing of what's happened and how it's been for them psychologically, cognitively, as well as physically and everything else. So really important that they are looked after the whole time, including now, as you say. I mean, I'm not a psychologist, but I would presume that after doing something so intense and after what years of preparation for it, and it's all over in 10 days, is there a depression? Do they get low after that? Not so much a depression. They certainly have like a dip as anyone would after such an incredible mission of 10 days. But as I said, they're very well looked after. And also, they're already looking ahead. They keep saying about this being a test flight. They're passing the Basin on to the next crew that are going to go up. So they are going to be so busy relaying all that information that they have that they're not going to have time to feel too low for too long. And they'll be so delighted to see their families as well. That that certainly helps cramped up like that. They must get to know each other very well, which could be good or bad. You know, I mean, do they have you got any knowledge of whether they become a tight friendship group? You know, a crew goes on very much in touch over the years. They absolutely have. So they were selected. They knew they were going to be flying three years ago. So a lot of their training that they've been doing, you know, in Houston and that, they have been doing together. They get to know each other really well. And their families as well is such an important thing for their support. So all the families know each other and get on. They will obviously all their emission control watching them come back down as well. So yes, the collaboration and the teamwork has been so important for them the whole time. OK, some barbecues to come, though, family barbecues. Thank you very much. That was Susan Charlesworth, astronaut, trainer and astronaut psychologist. There are various motivations for space travel, ranging from humanity's desire to explore to national competition. And that latter factor now involves a contest not between the US and the Soviet Union, the USSR, as it was in the Cold War, but between the US and China. And it is key to think of it like this. Some bits of the moon are more strategically important than other bits. There is, for example, areas with frozen water and better locations for charging batteries. So there is an issue now. Who will get to them first? And when they do, can they say that bit of the moon is theirs? The British philosopher, AC Grayling, is the author of Who Ains the Moon? In Defence of Humanities Common Interest in Space. And I asked him first to outline the current state of the US-Chinese rivalry in space. The current state of the US rivalry with China is that the US, the Artemis consortium led by the US, is a little worried about the pace of development of the Chinese-led consortium. They really are steaming ahead and they seem to have technology which promises to put men on the moon. China is planning to do it in 2030, in a way which is less costly and might be more effective than the current plans that NASA has. It's interesting you use the word consortium consortia because this is not just US-China right, this is blocks of nations. That is correct, yes. When the Artemis Accords or rather when the Artemis Project was reorganised, it was originally launched back in 2017. But when it was reorganised, a lot of mainly Western countries, European countries, the UK, Canada and a number of others, got together under the NASA umbrella. And it's not just state actors. It's also a lot of private companies who are developing the lunar landing modules for NASA. They are, by the way, way behind schedule with lots of technical difficulties, which is why the China-led consortium, which has as its principal partner, Russia, but a number of others, seem to be kind of leading the pace. Let's just put it this way. If the Americans, especially Americans, this whole program works, they get onto the moon, they start occupying territory on the moon in a place that is good, it has good battery charging capacity, it has good water capacity. Is that then theirs? Do they own it? This is the big, big problem. Everything to date, including the now rather feeble and out-of-date 1967 Outer Space Treaty organised by the UN. That was a Cold War Treaty. And the Artemis Accords, which is a kind of informal goodchaps sort of set of promises by the artium consortium participants, they all say that sovereignty claims will not be made. But it has been recognised by the UN Committee on Outer Space that when people set up bases on the moon, they are, of course, going to want to have what they would regard as exclusion zones. But that's just another term for effective sovereignty. As soon as people start putting up borders around their exclusion zones, there will be tensions and tensions lead eventually to conflict. This is utterly appalling, really. I mean, you're saying there is a possibility of military conflict on the moon. Yes, absolutely. Could you just give us an idea of the prize? How valuable are these minerals that people think will be exploitable on the moon? Well, the numbers tend to get tossed around, of course, but probably in the trillions. I mean, you're well known, I think, if you're fair to say, as a moral philosopher. It's very interesting that you've gone into this very technical and sort of, you know, quite sort of geopolitical topic of the moon. What led you there? Well, as Aristotle said a long time ago, ethics and politics are seamlessly connected. And in this case, of course, the chief driver here is profit. If one looks across the landscape of history, one notices that when profit is a major driver in what human beings do, the search for profit results in standoffs. And unless we are able to really impose some structure on what happens to humanity's outreach into space, then we're just going to replicate all the bad mistakes we've made in the past. And we will continue in our bad old habits. And there we are from Aristotle to contemporary space politics. That was the philosopher A.C. Kraling. You're listening to the World Service of the BBC. You're listening to News Hour from the BBC with Owen Bennett Jones in London and me, Regina E. Vigdon-Avon in Hungary. You join me from the capital, Budapest on the eve of one of the most consequential elections in this country and indeed Europe's recent history. We're on the banks of the River Danube on a glorious sunny Saturday, looking out across the river at the country's national assembly. It's a stunning white neogothic parliament building. Its turrets and spires were partly modelled on the UK's houses of parliament. And on Sunday, voters will decide which politicians serve here for another term in a Hungarian election like no other. The outcome of this vote being watched closely, not just here, but in Washington, Moscow and Brussels. Can the country's long-serving Prime Minister, the far-right populist Victor Orban, hold on to power after 16 years in the job? His Bidest party is facing a serious challenge from the opposition TISA party, led by 45-year-old Peter Maja, who's well ahead in the polls. Well, our Central Europe correspondent, Nick Thor, reports on the campaign. A chill April evening in Somboté in the far west of Hungary, right on the border with Austria. Hungarian Prime Minister Victor Orban is due at any moment in Savaria Square, and a crowd several thousand strong is impatient. Many carry Hungarian red, white and green flags. Betty, a retired teacher, told me she is combining this political rally with a visit to the hairdresser. Victor Orban is a very strong leader. He's the best person to stand up for this country, against the headwinds coming from EU leaders in Brussels. He's modernized the hospitals, supported the churches, and he's done a lot for families and for pensioners like me. Miklos is the mayor of a nearby village. I support him because he helps families, and especially because of the cap he has imposed on utility bills, and the cap on fuel prices now. Standing nearby in the crowd, Kristina highlighted a theme which has been central to the Orban campaign, keeping Hungary out of the war in neighboring Ukraine. I love his personality, how he stands by people. That's why I'm here for the future of Hungary. Everybody wants peace, not war. The Hungarian government is here for us. Victor! In the election campaign, Victor Orban stresses one theme above all. He stands for peace in neighboring Ukraine, he says, while his rival, Peter Magyar, of the Tysa party, would drag Hungary into the war against Russia, with those he calls the warmongers in Brussels. Come on, come on, come on! You're not going to get us, you're going to get us! In such a situation, we cannot allow a pro-Ukrainian government to replace a national government and send your money to support the war in Ukraine. Don't move! Don't move! But in the crowd, mixed with the chance of his own supporters, with the chance of the opposition. Filthy Fidesz, they shouted, a common refrain from those who accuse this government of feathering its own nest. Victor Orban is fighting for his political life. I've come here to Kishkunlotzhazer, just south of Budapest, to see Peter Magyar address a Tysa party rally. The crowd is younger, the candidate is 17 years younger than Orban. He speaks calmly to them, while Orban bellows into the microphone. And he preaches a message of unity, of an end to the division, the constant search for external and internal enemies of the Orban years. In the crowd, I spoke to some of those who'd gathered to hear him at nine o'clock on a spring morning. I really want a big change. Why do you like the Tysa party? Why do you like Peter Magyar? I believe he is a very honest person. He always says the truth. He discovered many bad things that Orban did. There's a big news for the Tysa party. There's a big news solidarity among the Hungarians. The people believe in themselves again. And we can hardly wait for the election, because of the huge corruption of the politicians. They've taken the country in a bad direction. Whatever happens, this government will be out. This nation cannot tolerate them any longer. Driving back to Budapest, I listen to the news on the state radio. It begins with ten minutes devoted to the Fidesz message, with just one minute for the Tysa party. The last weeks have been marked by many scandals. Viktor Orban has long been described as the most pro-Russian leader in the EU. Now a series of taped audio recordings of a phone call between Orban and Vladimir Putin, and between the Hungarian and Russian foreign ministers, make clear that Budapest does Moscow's bidding. András Tálkeš is former deputy director of Hungarian counterintelligence. Hungary is a key asset for Russia. Hungary is functioning as a Russian agent of influence. And that's the worst point. It is the most efficient way for the Russians to divide the EU, to weaken the EU, and to push through the Russian interests. And therefore the Russians do everything to keep Orban in power. And it's not just the Russians. The US Vice President, J.D. Vance, was in Budapest this week to lend Mr. Orban his support. You have stood up to the bureaucrats, you have stood up to the nihilists. And now I wonder, will you do it again? It's strange to see an election splitting NATO, the US with Orban, most other members rooting for the other side. But time is running out for anyone hoping to influence this election. A record turnout is expected on Sunday. Rarely has so much attention from around the world been focused on this small, central European country. Nick Thorpe reporting there. Well, as campaigning enters its final hours, there are posters of the two main party leaders everywhere you turn. On lamp posts, on bus stops, billboards and stuck to walls. The energy really does feel like it's building. Well, as we've been saying, this is a vote being watched closely by other countries, not least the United States. President Trump sees Viktor Orban as a political kindred spirit and one of his closest, if not his closest, ally in Europe. And so while the President is trying to secure peace in the Middle East, he's still able to find time on Friday evening to post support for Orban on his Truth Social platform. President Trump offered to use America's full economic might to strengthen Hungary's economy. And as we heard in Nick's report just then, his Vice President, J.D. Vance, was here earlier in the week claiming that Brussels is interfering in this campaign. While the European Union is watching closely too, Viktor Orban's been a thorn in the block side, often disagreeing with European positions, including when it comes to support for Ukraine. And as we heard just then, in recent weeks there have been reports that his government's been leaking EU information to Russia. Well, I'm joined now by Zhuzhane Veg, an analyst at the German Marshall Fund, who focuses on Central Europe and Hungary. Great to have you on NewsHour, Zhuzhane. First of all, let's talk about the rise of Peter Madjar, because it's incredible to think that just two years ago he wasn't even leading his party. Yes, indeed. He is actually an insider turned outsider, critic of Viktor Orban. He was a member of Fidesz. He is a conservative person. But two years ago he defected and started to challenge the governing party, mostly on anti-corruption grounds. And he managed to capitalize on a very widely spread frustration in the society and using the momentum. In two years he put in tremendous work to organize his movement all across the country. It's interesting. We were both at an event last night in support of Magyar and there were thousands of people in Budapest. And the theme of getting rid of what they say is Orban's corruption seems to resonate. People of all ages, but what struck me was just how many young people were there. What sort of demographic that's supporting Magyar? Yes, that's very interesting actually, because we see that the youngest generation of voters, people in their 20s, are supporting Magyar in very high numbers. Only about one in ten person supports Fidesz. So it does suggest that the governing party has completely lost the youngest electorate and also touch with them. And of course, Viktor Orban's been in power for some 16 years. He's got the backing of the US and Russia. Do you think those endorsements will make a difference to some voters? Perhaps not those in the metropolitan areas like here in Budapest, but beyond. I don't think that it really would sway voters and definitely not at this point. This is factored in. It's very widely known that Orban enjoys the support of Trump and also Putin. Why it still matters is because it underlines the importance of the election and it may help with mobilization, but not with broadening the camp. I'm talking about the allegations from both sides of foreign interference in this election. In your view, how consequential is this for Hungary's relationship with the European Union? Because as we said just then, it's not been an easy relationship between Viktor Orban and other European leaders, has it? Yes, this is a very complicated relationship, but these allegations regarding the European Union, we also need to know that are unfounded. The frequent claim that the EU is withholding funds because it hates Orban is not true. The funds are suspended because of the governmental corruption and the interference with the judiciary. I do think that this is also an election which is make or break for the relationship with the European Union. If Orban stays in power, this relationship will further deteriorate, but if Peter Magyar gets the chance to form government, then he may be able to revert to a more pro-European course. Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts, Susanna, as we of course continue to look out across the Danube and the Parliament. And of course it won't be long until we find out who ends up sitting in that Parliament and becoming the Prime Minister. Both leaders are holding their final rallies as campaigning is in its final sprint. Well, the latest independent polls do suggest a big win for Peter Magyar and his TISA party. But the only poll, of course, that counts is Sundays and we are expecting to get first results on Sunday evening here in Hungary. The BBC's Chief International Correspondent Leesusette told NewsHour an immediate peace plan is not likely. The best they're trying to hope for is to get a new president. The United States and Iran have begun peace negotiations in Pakistan, but they appear far apart on key issues and divided by deep mistrust. The BBC's Chief International Correspondent Leesusette told NewsHour an immediate peace plan is not likely. The best they're trying to hope for today, it's only one day and this has been a very long conflict, is that there's a kind of a framework for future negotiations, the elements that they could build upon for a future agreement. Some headlines, Russia and Ukrainian forces are beginning a 32 hour ceasefire to Mark Orthodox Easter and NASA has sailed Artemis-2 as the perfect mission. Now its four astronauts are safely back from their voyage around the moon. With the Pakistan talks underway and the status of the conflict in Lebanon is unclear. Pakistan said it was in the ceasefire, Israel said it was not. More than 300 people were killed and over a thousand wounded in a huge wave of Israeli strikes on Wednesday. And then yesterday there were more exchanges between Israel and Hezbollah. The BBC has been speaking to two members of a family from Beirut who were caught up in the Israeli attacks on Wednesday. A 13 year old Naya's proximity to some of the blasts was documented in detail in a video which she made on her phone and that's gone viral. She was with her father filming on Snapchat in a street in Beirut just as an assault began. We hear of bombing so often but this really did bring home just how terrifying it is for a child in the middle of this sort of thing. A combination of her with her puppy dog ears on her picture and a desperate run for cover as the bombs came down did catch a lot of attention. And Naya's mother Ghidamagi told my colleague Paul Henley about the moment she knew just how close her family came to disaster. I received a phone call from her and she was crying and shouting and she said the explosion, a building and then the phone cut off. And that's all I heard and I couldn't reach her anymore. And just minutes earlier I had heard a big boom and at the back of my mind it was either a sonic boom or it was somewhere far as we had gotten used to normalizing those sounds with disregard of the sound. So when she called and she was crying and she said explosion and building. So at the back of my mind I thought that they had exploded our building. How long until you knew she was safe? It took me approximately three minutes until I could reach her dad and then her dad said him and Naya were together and they were safe. But he told me the boys were at home. So I have a 11 year old and I have a four year old and I tried to ask him are they good and he kept on repeating. He said the boys are at home so I didn't quite understand were the boys at home and the house exploded or were the boys at home and they were safe. And what did you think when you first saw Naya's now very famous film on her phone? Look when I first saw the video because Naya sent it to me I only saw it one hour later because I was busy. Ambiances we don't know what was happening. I saw that she sent me a video but I didn't open it. But then when I saw the video I just collapsed and I said everybody needs to see this video. I need to post it online so people can see what actually happened. Naya thanks for talking to us. Tell me about those moments when the bombs fell. Okay basically first I was with my dad because I finished basketball practice and we were walking home. We stopped because a car passed and we heard something but we didn't really know exactly what it was. We continued walking and an airstrike struck the building in front of us. The first thing we did was run to another building and I didn't know what to say so I just started swearing. I was just so scared. I would like to say I'm sorry for saying bad words in the video. I don't think anyone blames you. How long before you felt safe? Tell us about those ensuing minutes. The second we went into the building we stayed for like one minute and we ran the opposite side of where they hit. I was still scared because I didn't know what they could have done next. Maybe they bombed another place that's next to me. I didn't know what was going to happen. So we started going to my house but from a longer way and when I arrived home I felt the safest there. I've never seen a building fall in front of me and I never thought I would ever see a building fall like that. What's your reaction Naya to your video going around the world being so recognised now? I didn't expect it to go that viral but I'm happy that many people are noticing how kids my age and younger are feeling because of this war and how it's like unacceptable that kids this young are experiencing stuff like that. Thank you Naya. Gida, it must have been terrifying knowing that she was so close to disaster. Yes, if that car didn't pass because they were crossing the street to go to the building that was actually hit by three missiles. But because a car passed they had to stop. So once they stopped the missile hit and the pressure from the missile pushed her away from her dad. So her dad had to pull her back in towards him. You'd actually had a conversation as a family the night before I believe about feeling a little bit safer. Yes, we slept with the assumption that there was a ceasefire and we thought that it's over and we thought it's finally done and the leaders are speaking together and everything. So when we woke up in the morning some very good news. This is why I went to my work and the kids were home because they are on Easter holiday. We sent Naya Naya as the basketball player. She plays basketball like eight, nine times a week. So we sent her to basketball practice in the morning at nine o'clock and everything was normal for us. It was just a normal day. Her father was working from home on that day. He decided to go walking 10 minutes from our house just to pick her up from basketball practice and come back. He just stepped out for 10 minutes and then the disaster happened. And how do you feel now? You didn't even go to work today. You were too scared to leave the children. I haven't been to work for two days now because we left Beirut because my four year old and my 11 year old are also terrified because of the strikes also that happened around the house. Seven strikes happened around my house. Seven strikes. So my boys, especially my four year old, he still explains and tells the story of how the booms were too loud and the house was shaking all the time for a long time and how they had to hide in the toilet for safety because they were with the nanny. Is there any optimism left? Do you have hopes for peace talks now still? I'm hoping for that. But at the moment, at the moment, Paul, to be very honest, all I care about is the well being, the mental well being of my kids and myself and my husband. This is at the moment. This is all I care about. And that's Nadja's mother, Gida Margi speaking from Beirut. And she brings us to an end of this edition of NewsHour. So thanks very much for listening. And from Owen Bennett Jones here in London. Goodbye. Thank you.
