Episode 467 | What Is A Classic? w/ Torae

This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human. I'm Daniela Alarcón and this is my friend is much more famous than I am. I wouldn't go that far. But I'm John Green, co-host of the podcast, The Away End, with my old friend Daniel. On our podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. Together, we'll find out why of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important. Listen to The Away End with Daniela Alarcón and John Green on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. And we are back sponsored by Boost Mobile. Happy end of the week. It is the end of the week, Worry. Mall is very, very disappointed because we have to come in here and start our podcast with Papoose today. But I'm actually thrilled. And we also have a friend of the show. Yes. Joining us today are Guy Tore. Welcome. Guys, the young vet. Thank you. That's the young vet. You don't know the young vet. Coney Island's finest. Because I was 20 years ago. That's why. Thank you guys for having me. I'm a big fan of what you guys are doing here. You know, it's an honor to be on this couch right here. As somebody from Coney Island, let me ask you, how many times have you been to the Bronx growing up? Growing up or in my adulthood? No, in adulthood is different because you could drive to the Bronx. I'm talking about being young, having to take the train from Coney Island to the Bronx. How many times did you do that? Probably like zero to negative five. Exactly. He's the one that ever want to take the train. That's an AGM. I want to turn 20 years into that trip. Because we was talking, I don't know how many weeks ago, but we were talking about how long the train ride is from uptown to Coney Island. That's like a two hour train. No, that's literally from like the start to the end, bro. It's crazy. It's the outfit. You can literally get to, you can take a flight. I'm talking about from my door to my mother's door in Virginia is less than two hours. No, you can get in the car and drive to Philly and watch a sixes game in the same amount of time it take you to get on the train. Especially if somebody jump on the track. That is insane that that takes that long. No, it's a sick time. But like going to Coney Island was a thing like that was like a day where we like, are we going to Coney Island tomorrow? Let's go to Nathan. As you should. You know what I'm saying? But I just want to know somebody being from Coney Island. How many times did you make the voyage from Coney Island to the Bronx? The furthest we was going to train was to Harlem. You know what I'm saying? That was it. That's right. Harlem, the Bronx right this way. And then when I was a kid, I was in trouble. So I couldn't go to like the school trips if you went to the Bronx Zoo or something. OK, I couldn't do that. I had no permission slip. So yeah, I would go to the Bronx Zoo from now. We probably would go to Brooklyn. But just in case on the off chance that they might have wanted to, I still couldn't go. Got you. I was fucked up. All right. Well, that's good to hear somebody from Coney Island that they never made that trip. Just like we probably made that trip. Let's do a stream. City Island to Coney Island this summer. City Island to Coney Island. All public transportation. And not counting me out. Yeah, I'm gonna be on you. How you gonna have service to do that? We'll find a way that we'll talk to Mondi. He's going to give us free Wi-Fi. That is true. I forgot. I forgot that was part of his. We'll get a free sandwich on the way. It was for the streamers of New York City. What for? That was the free. It was the free grocery store that opened one day and closed. Right? Now that's closed. So then we'll get free Wi-Fi on the subway. It's what I got. Crazy. Well, why I was excited to actually talk about this. Papus 50, Mano, Max B, Debacle is because we have Brooklyn bias in here. And we have G-Unit bias. Full G-Unit bias in here. And me and Max went to the same high school. So fair. I'll take Max in this fight. OK. So we will not get a objective opinion from anyone in here. No. What so ever. I was talking to the Maris off mic. I'm really coming in here being objective. She does not think that. But I didn't mind the Mano disc. I didn't mind the Papus one. Thought they were both cool. I'm just sick of 20 years hearing the same exact thing about 50. So. OK, that's fair. But if the marriage started shaking in her chair when I did not start shaking in my chair, I just said, I'm tired of your bullshit because now suddenly every time where there's a rap battle, you have to hear some jaw dropping new breaking news that you never heard before in order for it to be. But that's not what I'm saying. First of all, he said he has herpes. That was kind of a. Just put lies in the disc. We don't need facts. We don't need facts no more. Just lies. It been lies in the disc. Yeah, just lie about it. It's been lies in the disc. What is that about 50? He got what? Herpes and what? Diabetes. Yeah. I've never seen 50s medical records. I don't know. First of all, diabetes shaming is funny. Yeah, that's why. Yo, be like, yo, you got, you got type one. That's not even my fault. It's like I'm taking my shit. Like you're laughing at my pancreas. It's a rhetoric. It is for his mother. That either they said that to my mother. I was like, damn, we can't have the beats no more. Oh, my God, man. Where are we at as a co-op? No, demerits. I'm not saying that. I don't think every battle needs to be post push and Drake or URL where we find out where they went to high school, this and that. I'm just saying it's been the same exact rhymes for 20 years from everybody. 50 or not. When they come to you are. Yo, you only got shot five times on nine times. You're a snitch. You never really went to jail. Like I heard this for 20 years. The way the shots is crazy. You got shot five times. It wasn't not. Like, right? Like, all right, fine. I cool. Shoot me once in the face and you'll never hear the end of it. Yeah, like, no, you only got shot five times. Stop saying not. I got it. And listen, maybe that is true. They even interviewed the guy that was in the car with 50 and asked him that question straight up and he's a friend of 50. He's like, maybe he wasn't counting the shots. Yeah, like, sitting there counting. If I'm 50, I'm counting an exit wound as another shot. If I get if it goes through my leg and there's two, that's two. There's two. I got shot twice. You mean they got shot once here. It went through and then I got shot again. This way. It's both sides. I'm adding up the exit wounds 100%. But that's still then if you that's still bad math. If you guys had five or those terrible one, one maybe just wasn't in it now. We were great. One just stayed in. I was a great one. Stay there. Yeah, what was great stories getting better by the shot. I tell you that. And if you shoot at me nine times, I'm saying you shot at me like empty the clip. That's that's another imagine somebody shooting at you and you hear not you know, you're adrenaline. You heard your own name shot at me 20 times. Like the number is going to change for me in my story every year. The number changes. How long it take to pull off, though? Like how you get that many shots of Salad? Like the key wasn't in ignition. These was like a long time. That's a long time. Well, the guy I think guys name is D.U.V. I think that was his name. He was on Kim Capone and one of those platforms. He was saying he was he was like turning around because they had to go the other way. So he was doing like a K turn. And I think ran into the car of whoever was behind. Dude, I was just driving with. He's driving with that. He all. That motherfucker was bad. That did that move. That was crazy. And no, he backed up into I think the car with the shooter in it and then was kind of like blocked off. And then the shot started and he had his girl in the front seat and I'm not going to pretend I'm like fucking Jason Bourne. If you start spraying on my car, I don't know if I'm going to be able to be Vin Diesel and get us out of there that quick. I might freeze up. Who in a K turn when somebody's shooting at your car? No, but every. I don't know about no law. This is the one way. I'm going with every. No, I think he was blocked in because in the middle of the K turn, he hit the car with the shooter in it. Oh, OK. So he couldn't really get away. Closer to the shooter at that point. So I mean, but again, shooting nine times in a car, that's a couple seconds. That's a lot like a very long time. That's a good one. We debate enough. Right. This look at this. We do debate to the point of like, if I get shot, I'm going to be about 50. It's like what else really is there to talk? There's no new nothing, right? He's been out of the music business. So you can't talk about like what it sells is doing. You know what I'm saying? Like there's no new thing to talk about. So they just talk about the same old thing. I mean, believe it or not. The shows. It's it's it's kind of makes Demani's look more credible, even though Demani's anything that was like super new, at least he did get into post 50s career and how he's moved and who he's put on 50. You could argue as has moved somewhat selfish since. Music sense being selfless. Yeah, more or less, because I think he did do a lot for Bank J.O. and everyone for sure. But he's he's definitely moved for for him and maybe not for the culture. You could make a case. I'm not saying that you could make a case. I'd rather Pat get into that because I think Pat Fuss is a great rapper that could come up with a good theory rather than dog. I like you're not as gangster as you say you are. He's fucking 51 years old and is shooting TV shows. Do you think anyone cares if he's I think that I think the thing is a lot of these guys have had as a writer as rapper, you know, you always have bars for whoever the top right just in case the day. You can't yourself where me and you're going to get into it. So I think this is just the time where we're hearing all of these bars that these guys have had about these and now they got the chance to get it off. Got it. So it's not about saying something new. This is shit they had right here or they have written down for the last 15 just just waiting just just in case. Just waiting because 50 is he's a troll. He's a bully came in with that energy. So every rapper had to be like, all right, if he ever come at me, I got some 10,000 percent, you know, I'm saying. So I think that's what this is. I think these are just bars that these guys have already had. And now it's just the opportunity presented itself for them to get the shit off. Yeah. Again, I just think there should be another angle. I didn't mind Meno or Papooses to be quite honest. To the point about about giving out new information. This is why rap battles are kind of funny when you step away from it outside looking and Papoose saying 50. Why haven't you told the world you have herpes is one of the funniest things I've ever. Can you tell me how he should have done his review? Like, yeah, pass. Like, yo, look at me. Why have you not told the world you had herpes, bro? Like, I don't sounds like a private matter to me. Yeah, that's a wild question. I'm telling you. But this is the whole different level. That's what is going on. And he's like, do do an NBA young boy. Yeah, you know, young boy is one of the craziest people ever just to rap that he is herpes. Like I give him respect for rap and his truth. But I don't think everyone is now owes us a rap about their their HSV. No, if I'm not having sexual intercourse with you, young lady, then I don't need to know any of this information ever in my life. And let's move. Does it matter? Does it matter if if somebody has herpes? Well, that explains me. Well, I hear you're sexually active with someone you should know. No, I mean, yeah, but I'm saying to us, does it matter to us? Do we give a fuck? No, I literally. I don't know about your favorite rapper, Herpes, when he made your favorite album, you think I'm a delete all of this? This thing. I ain't fucking got this. Elmatic no more. Yeah, like what is that? That means don't put that on him. What the fuck does that mean to me? I don't know what you're talking about. I can't even hear Nas's like the same. I don't care who got like we could say that about all rap battles. And we're being hypocrites here because it did not change my life when I found out that Drake had a kid, but I was like, damn, push, got him. Like, OK, I get what you say. But I didn't all right. But that's a little more groundbreaking news. Like you doing all this running around with all the joints and all of that. You got a whole child that nobody knows about, like none of your fans. You know what I'm saying? Especially when he's the vulnerable rapper and he's the hard on his sleeve rapper to not talk about the birth of your child. Obviously a private matter. But you know, I think that was more like groundbreaking. Oh, Mike, you got a kid like for real? Like it's a child. You can't imagine. But it wasn't wild news. It was just more like, oh, it was just shocking. I mean, 50 has rapped a lot about the injuries to his body. Why not his pancreas or a sexually transmitted disease? If we're going through a track record, he does talk about his body a lot. Is the 50 Max B song real? Yeah, yeah, it's small. The video was real, too. The real AI. That's no, that's just how wavy the Max is. He could run. I was in Times Square. I was like, yeah, was that Max B? But seriously, because of this whole AI shit, like we got to start asking those questions. Ten thousand percent. I agree with you. When I saw the video, I didn't know if the song was real or not. Because the video, I was like, the video is fake. Is this a real joint? Yeah. Yeah. It may be. No, is it is it real? It's real. It's yes. OK. All right. It probably is. But I'm not going to say with the confidence that to Mary's is saying because I've heard some some records. I did not think we're AI that were one thousand percent. When 50 posted that video, the video, that's what made me think like, I was this real because. We in this this time now where, you know, people post shit just making a joke. Right. And it's like, all right, is this a real song? No, like that's that's my only thing. Like, is this a real song now? Obviously 50 posted it. So I guess you could call that supporting the song. Right. Max posted it, too. Max posted it. But but again, people troll. That's not put in a fake song on his Vivo page. That's a real. This is a real. Oh, he put it on the he posted his Vivo. Yes. No, but I'm saying 50 could have done the audio as well as the video. It also would not shock me that 50 would take a fanmade song and video, put it on his not on his youth, not on his official YouTube. His it's his. Y'all got 50 fucked up. I'm with the Maristad. Putting it on your Vivo makes it a little different. Yeah, that's a little that's more of like a you stamping it like business. Yeah, because now you got in counting streams and that goes into your monetary situation. I was I hate videos, but this one did make me laugh throughout the entire thing. It's like God awful AI that makes it funny. But we actually looking at, you know, shit change in real time because now like how much how much did it cost to create this AI video? I don't know. You know, I'm saying so it's like that's made though. Yeah, like so this I'm saying you have this whole AI video. We don't know who made it probably free. At the time of a kind of pride. Some I made it. Some I made the video for him for. Yeah. So let's say 50. It took two two liters of water from the Midwest to make that. That's what it does. This is this is this one still doesn't have any. I mean, we're watching the landscape of entertainment change though. So different time. Like this is a new element in battle rapping. Now, I could have this video done in an hour to my distract to you. Right. Like this is a whole different element of entertainment now. Yeah. And I'm glad you said entertainment. Yeah, it's not really going to change rap battling in any real way. It was just funny to watch. If you really think about it, I remember what was it? The fuck with Dre Day? What they had the fake Ezel. They had the fake EZE. Right. I can't remember what my name, but it's no different than that. Right. Like before you, we get actors that look like somebody didn't have like Jimmy Walker. And when he was different, this and J. You know what I'm saying? And now you don't have to cast anybody. You could just type it in. You know what I'm saying? So it's really an extension of that with the technology is that I will say as much as 50 doesn't take anything serious. If I may know, I would kind of feel a way of you doing the AI shit and me getting cut in prison. Yeah, the other shit was all just kind of ha ha ha. But like you you typed in may know, getting cut in prison to make a video. Well, 50 didn't make the video. He posted it. He co-signed it. OK. But you say he made it. He didn't make this video. He just somebody made it, sent it to him. We thought like, oh, this is dope. All right, I'm opposed it. Yeah, but that's still co-signing. I mean, he wrapped it. Yeah. You worried about the visual. He wrapped it. No, no, no, no, no, I'm not. I mean, it's battle. Whatever. I'm just saying out of everything that he said was kind of L.O.L.s. I don't know how may know really actually took that entire thing. Even though his record seemed like it was just, you know, replying. I don't know if he's like actually listen, man, this is what this is what happens when you jump in the battle rank. When if you want to battle each other, you want to go at each other, which requires disrespect. Then that's the art of it. I'm going to talk about things that happen to you. I'm going to talk about things that you did, things that you didn't do. Like that's what all of this is. So that's not out of bounds for 50 to rap about that. Like I didn't say it was out of bounds. I just I was wondering if that was something that you just didn't want to see. That may not. I don't care about that. I'm not sure if may know thought that was maybe outside of the L.O.L.s in our rap battle. Oh, no, this is not a lot. Yeah, I'm not. Once you say that is all gloves is off. I can see that is done. It ain't no rules and no women and children. Not everything on the table. Yeah, I'm just I'm just not sure if may know sees it that way. That's all. But I mean, where does this land? Are we going to continue as I actually think Dave East got the biggest diss out of the entire thing? He started the intro, talking about everyone. I'm not talking about you and then put Dave East face up there. Yeah, that was the first person I thought we were going to hear from. Like, well, I'm not even worthy to be dissed. Well, because there's no I mean, 50 probably wasn't even really rapping anymore when Dave started dropping. So it's like, I don't even know. But I was in that that cipher that they did for their podcast, where Fab was. But that's because of the podcast. If they weren't doing a podcast, Dave wouldn't have been a part of that. OK, but do you think that's not a diss, though? Today? Yes. Yeah. OK. It's a slight. It's like, oh, you know, he not even talking to me. But I don't know if Dave was sitting back like, nah, say something to me. I don't know if that's OK. Well, Damani and King weren't around when 50 was rapping, and they caught a bar on the power intro, even though 50 is lying to us and said he wasn't talking about them. He was talking about them. Yeah. But once 50 posted a picture of their mom, you can only expect that those guys are going to jump in the ring, especially if they rap. Big facts. Yeah. That's what I mean. So that point 50 kind of sort of pulled them into it by posting a picture of their mom. So they're like, all right, I rap. I got some bars for 50. But with Dave, it's like, you know, I don't 50 don't have. You don't probably never even met Davies. No, I'm sure they didn't. I'm just saying he probably didn't. I don't know if 50 be around with Dave yet. Do we think Dave or Fab replies? Fab, yes. They don't know if East is going to respond, though. I think he's in quad right now. But why, though? Right now, nobody said 50 didn't say nothing about him. About him is where? Because he's already that's what piss me off. Is that cloud chasing by association? But is it cloud chasing if East put out a record and 50 say nothing about him? Is he inserting himself into it? No. Pause. I mean, God, that was that. We already know it's unsafe to do that with 50. See, you know, it didn't. No, it didn't. Absolutely. But is that not cloud chasing? No, if they like, nah, fuck that. You put my face in your diss video and said, I'm not even worthy of dissing. They own it. So you know what I'm saying? You're not worthy of dissing. That's disrespect. If if he randomly diss him before. Is that I'm just asking the room. No disrespect. No, Dave. Somebody like you're not even worth disrespecting. Disrespect. OK, so I got to go make a record. Yeah, I don't know if you got to go make a record. But you know what I'm saying? I should go make a record. You know the clock. Like we not watching the clock, but you know if the hands start moving, like you know, I'm saying we ain't unplugged. So I'm just trying to try to. If it doesn't reply, I wouldn't think anything. But if he does, I'd be like, yeah, I get it. Yeah, exactly. Which is a good position to be in. I agree with that. I don't think he should, though. Now, for what? I mean, how much did he really say about fab besides the video made it worse? Because it was it was mainly main, you know, throughout it. But like, was the fab shit that that crazy? It was the video that made it nuts to me. Yeah, but fab already put out a record going. Sure. So it's home. But now the round two. Yeah, it's on. It's lit. This fab care enough. I was actually shocked. Fab cared enough to do the first one. I was probably just itching to rap anyway. Yeah, he want to rap. I wish to get his shit off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. OK. He has a series called Soul Tape. Go rap. That's a rap. Nigger. His beef tape. But you want to say that's 2026. That's what we are. But we just and I asked you out as last week, no, maybe two weeks ago now, where does this shit in? That's that's the real question. Where does this one of it all to me like, nah, I'm like, I where does this end is all I'm saying. Well, when I was talking to you about it, it was just the Harris family involved. Everybody else wasn't. But this was before that. Yeah, this this started before the. Yeah, this was this was with Jim and Mayno. In fact, this was before. Yeah, but I thought that was over. This is OK. So this is what I'm saying. It's been three months. We back now. So now what? Like when is this? Because that's why I was like, I didn't think 50 because I told you I didn't think 50 was going to respond. I think he was going to rap. I think he was going to make music. I thought he was going to keep it trolling. You know what I'm saying? Because that's what 50 does. He's a troll. Like he'll say shit on this on on on social media. He did the clever move of, you know, even though he did say that that wasn't about. He's a liar. Right. Why are you like, didn't I tell you? I said, now if I jump out there and respond to that bar, we just spoke about this the last episode. I say he didn't say no names. We don't know what the new power was going to be based at. It could have some Atlanta ties in the new power. We don't know that. Y'all was like, nah, fuck that. OK, now 50 comes out and says that that wasn't that wasn't directed at. Said it wasn't about the Cosby's, which is a crazy thing to say. That's very funny. So I said it. 50 says that y'all like, nah, y'all not jacking that 50 line. I think he's lying. All right, cool. Y'all can think he's lying. I'm just saying he said it. So now I'm saying, does T.I. respond to that? Again, a massive question. No, T.I. already said he was done with it already. So I think this this ends when 50 starts focusing on the T.I. and Tiny Docker. Whatever 50 is about to promote is when it ends. 50 is going to drag this as long as he thinks this ends when he puts the doc. I think T.I. I'm going to give us no, no, no, no, I'm saying this the main. Oh, OK. Oh, OK. Max B, Papu's, Jim Jones. Like, I think this this chapter is just an interlude until he gets to the T.I. and Tiny doc. Got it. OK. This is to fill some time. Like you said, I'm the algorithms. I wouldn't have to talk about me, which I mean, isn't the case, but it's a fun thing to say. Yeah, I think this ends when 50 moves on to his next thing. You know, doing a doc is really crazy. Doing another doc part is crazy. Oh, why is that crazy though? Like, that's what a game is gone to. Like we doing documentaries about he's not he's not 50 is in the is in a whole different space of entertainment now. Right. He came in as a troll, right? Well, how to rob? How to rob was like one of the biggest troll records ever. For sure. So he came in with that energy like I'll go at anybody. I don't give a fuck. I don't I'm not I'm not here to be friends with any. I don't fuck with none of y'all like that. That's always been 50s energy. 2000. Now that he's in a different space in his life when it comes to entertainment. So it's the same trolling just in a different. It's the same energy, but he's just delivering it differently. That's so it's like it's like it's like a disc record. Right. It's just a no music behind. This is eight. It's just eight episodes. It's like, oh, yo, these are the people. Look, these are the nasty guys that you're support. I could have said this in a rat. Yeah, 50 can have said all of this in a rap. Yes, but he's probably looking at it like, but I don't even rap like that no more. I'm creating shows, which is why I'm putting that bar that rightfully so everybody felt like was tailored towards T.I. in the intro song to the new power. That was genius. Shit, very smart. It was like, yo, all right, this is how I'm going to respond. Like if people talk, you're going to hear this song every week. Every episode, you're going to hear this song. Clever, right? But that's part of his brand now. His business is part of the show. For sure. With the documentary coming off of the the the document that he just did about the Diddy Doc. That was number one in how many countries. Like it's about business for 50. Because this is at the end of the day. Yes, it's as wild to hear certain things. This records can sometimes people say things. It goes at the end of the day, it's all entertainment, though. Yeah. Now, the doc is like that's not the entertainment. Yeah, that's that. I don't know. We all going to sit around and turn on our TV and watch it. Like we want to be even though it's it's it's things we're going to hear like, damn, like that's crazy, but it's still a form of entertainment. It's still a documentary that we're learning about things like some of the things that are being said may be a little funny. It might be some jokes in there. But it's like at the end of the day, this is all entertainment. This is but this is 50s. This is the area that he's in now. Never thought the hip hop would take it this far. She's crazy. But is it is it crazy? Really? Don't like this is who you now. If this is the first time 50 ever did a documentary or ever did anything like in that lane with with television, then it would be like, what he doing? Like, but he's been in television. The new version of the beef DVD. Yeah. So he's been in he's been in television for how many years now? He's he's produced how many shows and things like so. This is part of his, you know, the way he can choose to respond. Now, I don't think it's anything crazy about that. Which side are y'all on with the Ditty part? And now to be the T.I. thing that he wouldn't have done these docs. Had he not had an issue with those people? Where do y'all land on on? I don't want to say morally, but how that how that looks. OK, I understand that. Like, if he didn't have an issue with with Ditty or if he didn't have the this latest thing with T.I., maybe he wouldn't have got that info. And he's right. But I mean, yeah, that's the way he chooses to respond now. Yeah. I mean, we briefly talked about it with the Ditty one. Like, yeah, do I think that 50 did that to spite Ditty based off their history and his mother? Isn't that? Yes. But I do think the information that was in that. In that entire. Series should have been out there. Like, I'm glad that info is out there now about Puff. Was it done based off nasty intentions from 50? Sure. But I think the world needs to know these things about then some of our biggest entertainers, a fucking documentary come out every day. Fair old game is this nasty. I think it's a super nasty. I was the boy for years. So it only it only sees the light of day when you have, you know, say when you have a run and when you have an issue with a person, because then that makes you responsible in some regard, because if you have this information, whether you got an issue with that person or not, if you have this information and a platform to get it out there in the means to do it, then why not do it for the greater good? Why? I think 50 just because he's in television. I think people through back channels reach out and say, hey, somebody has this T.I. documentary that they put together. Yeah. 50 is just executive producing. They put money behind it and putting it on a platform. And that's what I think happened with the Ditty one, too. I don't think so. They started from scratch. Nobody said, you know, the director works for Puffer one point. Nobody said I got the Harvey Weinstein joint cooked up. You want to get behind it? Post. Yeah. Which usually they would call Harvey. I didn't have anyone. Right. I don't think those people reached out to 50. Now, when it's rappers, right? And then you have somebody that's already in the world of television, like 50 is. And then somebody says, you know, they got a little beef right now. It's like, oh, shit, well, let's hit them up and see if you feel. And 50 is like, hell, yeah, put them in. And did he shot all of this? This this footage, the camera guy, like he was like, wait, I don't have to shoot nothing but a couple of interviews in that. Oh, this is a layer. So you know, so I understand what you're saying. But at the same time, it's like. This is docus. This is stuff that is already being done. Like 50 is just coming in the tail end of it. Like, OK, I'll put some money behind it. Put executive producer credit on it and let's put it up. And it's funny you bring that up because this was a couple of years ago, a very, very, very big publication reached out to me based off some stuff. We said on our podcast about an entertainer and it they wanted to quote. And it appeared like they had an entire article ready to go about some of the sexual misconducts of this person. And I'd never heard anything again. And every now and then they'd be like, damn, it's been like almost three years since they had this entire big publication at this entire thing ready to go and it never came out. So to your point, I do think there are a lot of people sitting around with ready to go articles, documentaries, absolutely. All that just waiting for the right time to capitalize with the most amount of money. Like, hey, I see what's going on over here. Just let you know this is already done. We can get this out in two weeks. So yeah, I think there's a lot of people that have docs waiting on them. Yeah, I'm not mad at 50 for executive producer needs. I mean, at the end of the day, it's the business that he's in now. It's just as a hip hop fan, as a as an MC and a hip hop fan, it's a different route. It's not a route that I thought we would see artists taken. You know what I'm saying? But yeah, I guess it's the evolution of the dissonance. It's the evolution of 50, though. Yeah. Right. It's he's not just an MC. He's not just a rapper anymore. He's an executive producer and television and film. He's an actor. He's, you know, he's a lot of things. It's not just this ain't just boo boo. Just going to the booth rapping. This is not this is not that. And 50 probably look at it like he's too old to probably still be trying to really rap like that. Unless you got a TV show. Unless you got. But then you're going to get the intro. That's part of his business. He's a geeked out. I'm not. But we not mad at that. Like he's giving us classic intros to those to those to those shows. So it's like if that's the way he chooses to respond and do his business style, which is the business that he's in. Listen, man, you got to respect it. And am I crazy to say it is kind of the natural evolution from the DVD era where recipe shorty low is walking through T.I.'s projects. And asking where he's at. Like, is this just the evolution of when rappers were beefed that do disc records, then they do something on a DVD or on YouTube. We go to the neighborhood like this is kind of the natural evolution. Same thing. So now what if all of our favorite rappers or upcoming rappers start doing documentaries like everybody that got a problem? Like if the Kendrick and Drake was it was it rap songs? If it was documentaries? That's why. Bro. Yeah, but it's why because it would be wild if because we've never seen a documentary from those guys. Like if that was the first documentary, it's like, what are they doing? But now the president is there. So now the door is open for people to do that. If it's the evolution of what the DVD is, it's another lane of entertainment. Like when Jay did some some of jam and he had the pictures of Prodigy, right? It's like, oh, shit, that's the first time a lot of people saw those pictures. Right. Right. So now let's just put a documentary. Let's let's interview the ballet teacher. That was his aunt. That's probably his aunt. I'm just saying. That's the piece of Prodigy. Yeah, no, 100 percent. But I'm just saying. Like the legend with their pants. Yeah, but imagine if Jay went that route, though. Like we're going to go and sit. It's like it's still in its funny. Let's laugh. But it's like, what's wrong with a kid? You know, I don't know how probably maybe six, seven years old. Yes, nothing wrong with it. Class. What's wrong with that? Good. Now, if the answer is good, if he left, if he left the infamous video set and then went to go to ballet, then it's like, what are you doing? Like, you know, I think he's showing his range. It is he just put on a lead. It's like, now that's kind of like, but as a six, seven, eight, you know, this like, it was shock value and it was a chink, right? And the armor, right? It did something to his credibility. The street dude, because the street dudes, I know, never took ballet. Right. So as a street dude, as you know, I'm saying, I ain't super nigga. I get shot. Stab, you was in the, you know what I mean? In the dead shoes, we get it. We look at you at a different light. But it's so crazy because it's like at six, why would you look at that in different light? That's what it that's like. I had a choice at six. I had a choice at six years old until my mom, I'm not going to dance. Also, why we don't care about facts. He put up the said, I got the your ballerina. I got the pictures I seen you. He put the photo up. He's not dressed as a ballerina. Definitely not dressed as Michael Jackson. There's not a ballerina in sight. He's literally dressed like Michael Jackson. And we all were like, yo, you're a ballerina. It's like the what? That's a good point. Yeah. That's a good point. That was Halloween. That was Halloween. That's what we're talking about. That was Halloween. That's crazy. You ain't like thriller. Yeah, that was Halloween. Which expected me. I was Michael Jackson. I'm sure whole was Michael Jackson. That was like what? I mean, Michael Jackson. Everybody was at one point. He probably was to Michael Jackson. He probably was that the five might and beat it by two different. I was. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, we'll see where this goes. No, worry about. Maul Boost Mobile is proving that you don't have to overpay for great wireless. I don't know why you do that to yourself. I do do that as a friend. And I'm sitting here. This is an intervention to tell you don't need to do that anymore. Help me. You can unlock savings with Boost Mobile right now, $25 a month for the unlimited plan. It's a permanent price with no contracts and no price hikes. You keep your phone and your number, but you save up to $600 a year compared to any other major carrier. Stop overpaying and switch to a fair price at Boost Mobile.com today. Based on average annual single line payment of AT&T Verizon and T-Mobile customers compared to 12 months on the Boost Mobile Unlimited Plan as of January, 2026. For full offer details, visit Boost Mobile.com. I'm John Green. You may know me as the author of The Fault in Our Stars. And now I guess also as the co-host of the away end of brand new world soccer podcast. I'm Daniel Alarcon, a writer and journalist. And John and I have known each other since we were kids. My first World Cup was Mexico 86. I was nine years old. I watched every game and I fell in love on our new podcast, The Away End. We'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. For us, soccer football is a story we've shared for over 30 years since Daniel was the star player on our high school soccer team. Very debatable. And I was their most loyal and sometimes only fan. I love this game. I love its history, its hope, its heartbreak and above all, its beauty. Together, we'll find out why of all the unimportant things, football, soccer is the most important. Listen to The Away End with Daniel Alarcon and John Green on the iHeart Radio App, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I want to say we were completely wrong about the Jack Harlow announcement. It's a song. No, the album is coming out tonight. Tonight was out now when it was. But we thought we were getting like three singles before this entire thing. We got no music, nine songs. I'm kind of shocked. Jack, after the short albums, but after three years of just like one or two records, no real single. That's not really how Jack's formula has been in the past five to seven years. That's risky, risky or just a different approach. Why is it risky? Why don't you say risky? A different approach as always risky when. Yeah, I guess. I guess it's something different for your audience, something that they're not used to you doing. So it's risky. But I think that we just spoke about it. Nine songs. I kind of I kind of like that, though. I kind of like Jack just giving us that nine songs. I don't know what this sounds like. I love the video he gave us was that last year when he was walking through Manhattan, like, Sinead O'Connor. Yeah. Sinead O'Connor. Any of those songs that he dropped those Lucy's on the track list? And is the song titles out there? Yeah, we have the track list up. It appears that none of the records that came out, not even the just us Doja Cat single is on this. So so nine brand new songs off the whim. Why I say this is risky, because if you go with Come Home, The Kids Miss You, which is one 13. I'm not a numbers person. I don't give a fuck if the music is good, the music is good. I don't care. I'm just saying how risky it can be. But you pulled up the numbers because Jack Harlow is an artist that has entered that world. When you when you're making records like Nail Tech, even if that wasn't Jack's purpose when he went in the studio, he's now entered the world where numbers do matter when you're making records like that. And I thought it was actually kind of great that he put out Paul's Jackman right after Come Home, The Kids Miss You, because he was getting put in that TikTok, Teenie Bopper rapper shit. And he's like, no, I rap for real. Right. And that was cool that it sold 34000, which is great, but not coming off 113. But it was a mixtape. I felt like it was like, let me just throw this out. No promotion whatsoever. I didn't know. I mean, again, not that it matters. I didn't know that it didn't do. I didn't have any singles. It was similar to just putting out something like that. But it felt like one of those, hey, just a reminder, I could rap. It was all chipmunks soul samples. Like I think we should have went back crowds like me that was like, I remember when you used to like rap rap. Yeah, it was joints on. No, I was I like Jackman a lot. I hated the title, but you know. Wow, I would never say it. It's a wild title. So after come on the kids, Miss you, which is about three or four years ago. Yeah, I think you being in the A list rap category, it's kind of crazy to just put out a nine traction with no single. But he put out like a couple of Lucy. So does that not start the rollout? It did. But like when he did what Maul was talking about, the set you free and tranquility stuff when he was in the city. Then I thought when he put out just us with Doja Cat, like, oh, all right, we're starting. You're starting the actual rollout. And I really fucked with that record, but it was still closer to the nail tech stuff. I'm like, all right, the label's like, hey, guy, we know you like to rap. But come on, let's sell some units. That was what year did that doja catch? That was 2025. Yeah, about the year ago. That was that didn't last long enough to then go into an album. This is a completely different project. So I think it's it's risky. I'm excited. I'm excited because it is this rollout. And maybe it's nothing like come home, the kids miss you, but we'll see. We've seen this done. No, we've seen like the pre album rollout extensive. And we've seen the post album rollout. Sometimes you got to factor in like what's going to be more beneficial. Is it really like setting it up and then it drops into a little bit and then you're going to roll or is it like drop the music, see what people gravitate towards and then do your rollout while the music is out. So now every time somebody discovers a new conversation or what have you, they go right to it and now you run up, you run up the strings. I think post these days is way, way, way more important. But with artists like Jack, artists like Bruno Mars on this last project, that really didn't know no pre shit, no real like one single that was two weeks away from the project. You see the difference and numbers matter with those types of artists. Now, like someone like Dochi, Post Promo was so important to her because she was still on the come up and then TDE locked in like not everyone knows this girl. So let's put something out and then work the records that are on this project. That's the best strategy with artists like that. But you need both when you're someone like Jack Harlow. I think Jack, I think this is a. An interesting position for Jack, because I think this project, based on what it sounds like, it's going to tell us which direction they really trying to go with Jack. Is he rap? Is he more pop star? Like what are you actually where is he going? Because when you have a song with Doja. Not everybody can get a Doja feature. Right. Right. We have one of the biggest songs and one of your projects with Drake. And then you have, you know, I'm saying success, like you said, with nail tech and those type of songs and your feature with Drake ends with him saying, you know, Jack is the next one up. Yeah, but this. So now this project, nine songs. What does this sound like? Is this rap rap? Is this, you know, more rap pop? You singing? Is it more melodic? Is it more like, I think this project is important for Jack's his sound, because it's like we still don't know which route Jack Harlow. We don't know where we place him yet. Or where they allowing him to go, you know what I'm saying? Like because there's so much pause riding on it, you know what I'm saying? Like you got, you know, we know what Elinik does. You know what I'm saying? You got Jen now. Obviously, they got they say in it. Obviously, those guys are to make incredible records and make history. So it's like, or does Jack finally have the freedom to do whatever he wants to do on this project? You know what I'm saying? Like we really got to listen to the music and see because it really, you know, I'm saying it's like the triple stance. It could go in any direction. Yeah. Yeah. Because I mean, even with Jen now, like they didn't they didn't sign Jack when he was making music like nail tech, right? Like the sweet action, that was just Jack rapping. To me, I feel like Jack is more Paul's Jackman than he is the nail tech stuff. I agree. That's where I'm on all side of like, this is going to be kind of the defining fork in the road for you. Of do you want to follow the year the next up, darling rapper? Or do you want to just keep rapping? And with no rollout, though, makes me feel like Jack is like, though, I don't really want to do that other shit. Just rapping. Like I think I can make a nice career for a rapper for a guy who can rap. You know what I'm saying? Like we've seen early on his music, his YouTube videos, etc. For a guy who can really rap when they start saying, yo, you rapping like Drake or you Drake light, you know what I'm saying? That like does something to your ego. That's like, I get busy. Not to say that Drake can get busy, but we know what that means when they say that, that connotation. So yeah, he might be rebelling. He might be bugging against the system like, no, let me just rap. You know what I'm saying? Because I think I mean, it's incredible and deserve that he does like Barclay Center. But I'm sure he probably got a little bit of the Steve Lacey feeling when he was going to his shows on that last tour of like, this is a lot of TikTok kids. This is not really who I set out to rap for. Because I don't think Jack is that. I don't think he's just chasing fame or whatever new record. I think he really just loves to rap. So maybe he's making that decision that I saw who was showing up to my shows. And of course, my core was there, but you can't just have a core sell out Barclay Center unless you're fucking J Cole. But yeah, I'm sure he looked at that crowd and was like, oh, it's a lot of TikTok children in here. And I can't sustain that for the rest of my career. It's going to be tough for Jack, though. Like, if we be honest, it's going to be tough, bro. Why? Because this is when you were a white rapper. Yeah, thank you. Bro, it's only it's like, bro, I don't you can't come in here and try to like Eminem correct, but he was on TRL a lot. Yeah, no, Eminem was a pop star. So this is what I'm saying. So Jack can't fight. He can't buck against the system. I got to go. But Jack did something that I don't think any white rapper has ever done. Correct me wrong. Coming off the cuff. I don't think I've ever heard a white rapper play at the club, play at a kickback, play at a party. Jack Harlow is the only white rapper I know that I could throw on around a bunch of girls. Is he more Mac Miller? Mac Mac with a certain type of chick that I would particularly like to hang out with would definitely fuck with Mac if I threw it on in the car. I'm saying if I go with the I.G. baddies, if I'm on a boat in Miami, I've never heard a white rapper play the way little baby plays at a spot. I've never seen a white rapper do that. Interesting. Yeah, that's a point. That's the point I've never thought about. Of course, there's women that like other white rappers. I'm not saying that. But no, but if you're at the music, yeah, now strip clubs, like everything was it the first class? Was it first class? Like those are pop. It's like first class. They're sampling pop records. So that's what I'm saying. It's like he got to go pop. Maybe he to pop Larry June. I don't know. Yeah. He has to start to run. What's funny is that he can go pop if he wants to. No, no, I'm saying like women like Larry. Women love Larry. They listen to Larry June. They like Larry June. They like his style. You know what I'm saying? It's like, OK, Larry, he got some bars, but Larry is more cool. He a shit talker. I don't really look at Larry June to bar you down. Right. He's going to just talk fly shit. He's going to talk shit on every song. Sound good. He's going to sound cool. He's going to look cool. I don't know if Jack want to be that. If you want to be Mac Miller, if you want to be Drake, if you want to be. I mean, I think he tried with Come Home that kids miss you to capitalize on the moment he had with the two big singles and still try to make music that he like like he brought Pharrell on and try to do his Pharrell. Like he tried to find a good balance. And I think he got frustrated. And then Paul's gave us Jack man right after. Yeah. No, let me go back to soul sample chipmunk shit. I can't keep doing this. Yeah, but especially being able to do that project, they might it might be more pressure for him to come back. Like you can't do that two times in a row. You know what I'm saying? Like we need because we know what he's starting to. We know that we know what they on over there. You know what I'm saying? They like, yo, we need to ring the register. We need especially you are one of our like Marquis acts. You know what I'm saying? Like you can't just do a vanity project back to back to back. Because to the point of him being a white rapper, that means the door is always open to certain things that other artists are not going to get. The opportunities is there to do shit. The other artists not going to get. They're not going to let you waste that back to back to back. They got he had the movie look with white men can jump to. And he was with Ben in Matt Damon. And I forgot the name of the movie. It was a great movie, though. He I mean, he died in the first. This is what I'm saying. It was he still he was still acting with Ben. Like that's that's a thing. So listen, the Just Us Doja Cat record is more in the lane of Nail Tech and first class. Yeah. So I was like, oh, yeah, Atlantic's not letting him. So to me, this is me just giving complete conspiracies. I think because this came out March 21st, 2025. So literally a year. Yeah. So I think he was beaten with a land. You guys are trying to keep me in this fucking lane. I don't want to do this anymore. Because the Doja Cat record did great, but it didn't stick like first class or Nail Tech. Well, you know, I mean, I think he was probably like, see, work that goes along with that. For sure. If the artist is not willing to do it, because the record was a record that they could have made go. Yeah. But if the artist is not willing to do it, you know, I'm saying, like, it's not going to go but so far. But they shot a video. So great video, too. Yeah, he was he was at least into it in that much in that regard. Yeah. I'm curious. Very, very curious where this album is going to go. Yeah, I'm about to say because I like Jack. Fuck with you. But. With this sound like I'm mad drama didn't send us the fucking the album before it came out. But like, I want to know what this shit sound like. Yeah, like Coal Lake, man. Yeah, this is this is this is. All right, Jack, you come on and you give us these nine tracks and you won't hear giving us pop songs that that's where you at. That's what we're going to place you. I also say because I do think Jack Harlow is a great artist. That also maybe tells me he's very confident. To put out nine songs. I got nine songs, no rollout. Here you go. I'm extremely confident in this album. And there's no he didn't. Well, we don't know if there are any features, but he didn't listen. He didn't listen. Nine songs. No, no. What if you don't got no features? I mean, listen, what if he produced it all himself and no features? No, no, no, no, I don't want that. I don't want that. I don't want to be. Maris would lose her mom. I'm sick of only one artist allowed to do that. All you rap. It's one baby thing. You can only be one. Only one. Stop producing your own song. So stop. Like I get it. That's a skill set, but it's OK to like where we spoke to. It's OK to pull other producers in the room and get some. Yeah, it's OK. It's nothing wrong with that. I don't know what we are to feature in the studio of a Jack Harlow song that I don't think is going to be on there due to timing. I don't remember that. That was what three years ago. There could only be one artist I'm talking about. OK. Yeah, I don't think that's on there. That's not on there. Yeah, definitely not on there. I hear it, but the confidence that more responded with. I don't think it's on there. You believe it on there. Ma, who do you when you think of outside of Kanye? Obviously, who do you think of when you think of rappers who are actually able to produce their own records and do a good job and do a good job and do a good job here? None. Really? I like rock, Marcy. I like rock, Marcy. I know. Well, yeah, no production. Yeah, rock. But that's rock is not. I don't ever want to hear him work with all the producers. Because it's going to change who rock is. We go alchemists. But that's kind of that's one in the same. That sound is so similar. Right. It's that boom, back, real raw, like out of the pocket flow. But like, I don't want to hear rock go get like a Swiss beat. No. You see what I'm saying? Like, I don't want that. I don't don't don't do that. Like, keep it. Keep it there. May be conductor. Maybe. Like you said, Al conducted those guys, maybe. But we can't get too far away from the rock sound. But yes, you're right. Rock is definitely his last project in credit. Like with him and Arrow and all of them did like incredible project outside of Southern Playlist, the Cadillac, funky music, Alkast produced. Big boy in three stacks produced every album. I mean, that's Dungeon Family, though. No, no, I'm saying they did Dungeon Family on the first one. Go check the credits after that. It was big boy and in Andre. I mean, they admittedly said the dungeon taught us how to produce. Like we look at really? I never knew that. I thought we thought they had outside production. I mean, you always thought it was Rico and but that was the first project. And then from there, Alkast kind of did their their own thing. I think David Banner is one. I think Pym C is one. I think there's a lot of rapper producers that maybe don't flaunt it the way Kanye did, so we don't realize that they're making all of their beats. Kanye obviously Kanye aside. Yeah, I'll say. I see the best you do it. But but like but like Tori said, rock is probably one that gets it right. And I'm thinking about right like artists in the now. Obviously, I could list a bunch of like classic producer, MC. Yeah, Rock is a legacy. But he's yeah, yeah, he's one of those, you know what I'm saying? Like he's somebody that's still super relevant right now. Put out some, you know, the merch go crazy, the pop ups go crazy. So he's one of those guys that's very much. Yeah, he's just a fly nigga. I ain't gonna lie. I don't want to hit Jack. Do it though. No, no, I don't want to. But I don't think anyone's thinking. He I'm just saying like because that's how we started the conversation. I was just being asshole about it. You know what I'm saying? Because you said no features. But there's very few QTip. Right. Legacy. If he's put it out. I mean, as far as like the Mac Miller is definitely up there. Ladder half of Max Greer. He was producing everything himself for sure. Russ also does it for sure. Russ for sure is up. Oh, yeah, Russ. Russ does great job. But then also Russ is one that I like when he does his Chomp projects and just gets banked and everybody else do that. But yeah, he's there's a lot more than I think people realize. Yeah. Yeah. They just again, don't flaunt it. And it's weird to put your own tag on your own song where you're also rapping. Like I just that just be a song and say this. It's like you're speaking in fourth person. We know we know it's you. Another one that does a good job and people not going to give him the credit because you know, you probably don't look at him as that bit of a rapper. Hit boy. Hit boy. Hit right. Now that's the one. That's the answer, right? The a lot of this honestly. The last project together. They're rapping. No, no, no, no, no, but both of them rap really good over their own beats. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like they don't they don't give away a lot of the beats. It's kind of like, I know other rappers here like I would. I would be crazy on that. Right, right. Exactly. I y'all might think I'm nuts, but I don't think JD is a bad rapper. Jamaica Pre. Yeah. No, he's not. He's not. He can rap. Jadies. I kind of wish he rapped more. OK, that was what I was saying. He just don't rap a lot. Like he doesn't rap as much as he used to. But he talked about it like when he was doing the Magic City like promo. He was saying like for that first album, they made him rap because he was doing so much production and writing and popping and shit. He was he had so much of everything else. There was like the only thing left for you to do is put out your own album. And that's how that happened. But he said he had no intentions on being a rapper. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? I got Wyclef there. Producer rapper. Yeah, we can. He don't rap a lot, though. I mean, but if for what he's put out between Carnival and everything with the Foogees, I'm still put them there. Um, they create I think is there more on the underground side. Right. Manny Fresh, if he rap more. He was right, though. Like with the time is the stuff. I think he's there. He's a hook master, too. We also left out probably the most important one, Havoc. Have. Yeah. Havoc is probably top five best rapper, producer of all time. For sure. But then I'm saying like, if we go in in the classic, then I'm going to throw in large professor in there, then I'm throwing, you know, I mean, EPMD produced all of this shit. You know what I'm saying? I'm going to be there. You know, like if we go classic, then I think it's a lot more. And we rock him. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So I guess for modern, we say Tyler would be number one. Yes. But is he producing? Yes. Yes. A lot of that shit is. So you literally put on the cover of Igor. This was written, created, mixed, engineered like he's a prince. Psychopathic with it. So then he's number one. Hands down. He might be he might be right behind Kanye. Maybe it's I think as far as hands on, I'm not saying what's better or what's worse, I want to make that very, very clear. If you go through their desographies and look at who did the most for their projects, Tyler's probably been more hands on than Kanye West in the latter part of his career. Yeah. But I think I'm fine with Kanye bringing in other people. I think that's part of using. I mean, Tyler really sits there. He does. He does. He's very. Tyler is such a musical person. You know what I'm saying? Like he studies music. He's I'll I'll call him a genius. He's a musical genius because he's he's a student of the game. He's a savant. You know what I'm saying? Like he understands he understands collaboration. He understands instrumentation. You know what I'm saying? Like he knows what to do for his records to take them where they need to go or who to bring in to take them where they need to go. And I think the versatility is really what speaks to me because from Flowerboy to Igor to Cherry Balm to call you know what I'm saying? Like all of these different records have a different sonic landscape to them too. And he's and he's a different. He's embodying a different character each time. You know, I'm saying every time he just get you. He just get you fired. Yeah, he just get you fired. Tyler's deaf and then and then don't don't go to the show because in the show was crazy. That's a whole other production. Yeah, he takes this shit serious. Oh, yeah. No, he's a Kanye for a baby for sure. And I'm not just saying this because baby D is here. I do think J. Cole gets too much flack. His beats are not as bad as people make them out to be. No, we just prefer that level of rapping with that level of producer because his level of rapping, his low production are not the same. He's up here. We just wonder what it could be. But Coles beats are not as bad as people say they are. No, but it's just like you said, for his skill set, it's like, all right, fam, can we not? Can we just go get like Alchemist, a conductor or Pharrell? Or like, can we go? You know what I mean? Like, can we just take the joints? We take it? Can we take this to another level? Like that's all while we stay in rap nerd world. I did see a list on Twitter that said the top 10 emcees without a classic solo album. Started at one grand pooba, two methaman, Jadakiss, Fab, Black Thought, Inspector Deck, Ludacris, Buster Rhymes, Put in parentheses, debatable, Andre 3000, Cannabis. Wait, the top 10 emcees without a classic. Y'all just you just y'all just said I was right next to you in the barbershop. I know we were the reason for this list, by the way. Niggas just told me the same barbershop. No, this is at math. M and J. Cole go to the same barbershop. I thought I sat there. Matt said and other guys in the shop echo descendants that Jadakiss has three classic albums. Did they say three or two? They said three. What was the I think I saw the clip and they said three. Somebody said three and I was like three is a stretch. OK. Kiss the game. Goodbye. What? The last kiss of death and to me, it would be kiss of death. And kiss the game. Goodbye. All right. His first and second album. Yeah, I think the first two. I think the first two. You know what I think you think Jadakiss is first two albums are classics. I think I think the first one more than anything. But I think that classic. Yes, small fuck. Here's the issue. Here's the issue. Let me let me just let me let me say this whole thing. And then you get your man. I think that the anticipation that we met with initially, it was so high was a hard bar to reach because we love him as an MC and we love what he did with the locks. So we was expecting so much when we heard when we heard the album. But if you go back and listen to the album, the album is don't be. They deep is like kiss the game. Goodbye. It's tough. That's my point, though. I think there's a difference between classic and difference between good albums. It's hard to have a classic album. I will put that out more. And if I got a 50 minute drive, I put the album on and let it play and ride out to it. I'm with you. Is it a classic album, though? Or is it just a good album? That's the difference. It's in its own. I think classic is the test of time to like replay value. Like we still going back to it because it's our albums that came out around that time that you I'm not listening to this shit. You know, you might play the single. You're not going to sit and let the body of work play. And I think that certain times, certain albums, certain albums out the date. We call it instant classic out the gate. You know, this shit feel like it's going to be timeless. I listen to this forever. And then a certain shit you go back to and you just like, then this is really rocking. Like, I think maybe we was to I think volume two is another one of those. You know what I'm saying? Or volume one. I think volume one is another one of those where people just was so harsh on it like the way they sunshine. Sunshine is a tough record. Be we hated the video. It was so different from what Jay was trying to do. But it but he had done already. But it's a fucking great. No, he's still getting off for sure. But that's what I'm saying. I I just think that we get so caught up and just thrown out the word classic. Well, there's a question to ask you then. What is the worst classic album in your opinion? So I have a gauge to see if if kiss of death is below or above that. Is that even an oxymoron? It's an unfair classic because, of course, we have the standards that we already know that these we know Elmatic is a classic that goes without saying no one's going to sit there and argue that. What is what would be that but lower than Elmatic? Like, what's the worst classic? You know what? And and and again, we just had this conversation with the fellas at the shop and, you know, and I understood the room. It was it was older guys in there from a different era of hip hop. So I understood why they were saying what they were saying. But to say Jadakiss has two or three have many arms. They said that were classics. And then to say Drake has no classic albums. Oh, yeah. Now, that's why. But you got to know the audience. But right. But you understand what I'm saying is just like, I can understand if that's not your preferred rapper, your preferred artist. There's no denying that Drake is one of the greatest recording artists of his generation of his era, for sure, who has classic albums. So when somebody says, OK, this rapper has three two or three classic albums. And this guy who has dominated music for 15 years has none. Yeah. And it's all subjective. Of course, that was all subjective. You're talking to I get that. But some things are just like, what are we talking about? What's that? But a barbershop in Brooklyn with 40 year olds. Yes, you're going to get that. If you went to the Scarborough Food Court Mall, you make it. You get everyone saying Drake has a classic. You make what you're going to Toronto to get. I understand that. But I'm saying we were in New York talking about kiss. Yeah. But I understand that I'm saying in just music, period. It's a lot of artists that I recognize as being crazy talented. They got classic music. They're not. I wouldn't go see them. I wouldn't listen to it. It's a tease. But I'm there's no doubt about it that this fucking artist is. I don't listen to Beyonce. I probably don't have no Beyonce. And that's unfortunate. That's that's really embarrassing. You're missing. I'm not. I'll listen to it. Right. I don't listen to Beyonce. Like you will never hear me just play it. Put on a Beyonce album, put on a Beyonce song. Like it just wouldn't happen that I'm not her audience. I'm not who she's making out. And I recognize I recognize her incredible. Carter on the way here. No, I'm listening to Halo. I recognize her incredible talent. But I'm not listening. I'm not going back and playing Beyonce. Like what you listen to? I'm not going to hang along. I got that cowboy card in my right. You're going to be like, well, like that's what you know. But you know what it is? You know what? The classic is vast majority, right? Even if there's pockets of people that don't like it might be people that don't fuck with 50, but the vast majority of the population says, get rich, a client is trying as a classic album. Right. So I think it also leans to like, what is the classic? Get rich and die trying is not a classic. If you go back and listen to classic, it's a great album. I'm worried about the fucking swing. You're just talking about it. It's trying to be classic. Because if you go back and listen to get rich and die trying, it's a great album. It's an impact. The impact is why I think people call it a classic. When they drop everything around 50, he's, you know, bulletproof vast. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All of it. All of it. 50 mania. Right. I understand that. I'm saying when you go back and listen to it, the album to me, I wouldn't say that's a classic album. You said it's a bit. I was I was speaking for more. Speak for yourself. Thank you. That matters. What you think about that? Get rich and die trying is a classic album. But that's why coming up with music or the impact. I like let's go through the music real quick. I'm not going to skip any records. I'm not going to do the highlights. I'm just going to read. Starts with what up, gang. So the intro with two quarters falling. Right. What is that? Like who you hit? You know what you want to get into? That's classic. It's a six second shit. And was like, oh, my God. Rory heard that was that two quarters or that a 50. No, it's what it's what Mano put on his single artwork. It's 55 cents. God's crazy. What up, gangster? Patiently waiting with Eminem. Many men in the club. I all the time. He if I can't bloodhound back down. Crazy. P.I.P. Like my style. Yeah, it is crazy. Crazy. Crazy. P.I.P. is a classic song. No, yes, it is. And I love the I hate that fucking song. It's not my favorite song in the album. It's definitely not. It's definitely not. It's with in comparison to the rest of the track listing. It's not my favorite. Is it a wax song? P.I.P. gets a pass. I'm saying we playing. I'm playing. If I if I'm watching the dishes in the album is playing, I'm not running to dry my hand to skip that. That's going to play. You can't say P.I.P. P.I.P. isn't a classic because people's parents know that. That was a huge song. It was a ginormous record. It fits in the body of work like, yeah, nah. Like my style. Twenty one questions. Don't push me. Got to make it to have in bonus tracks. Wankster, you're not like me. Life's on the line. I just tell me what a classic album is. You just read it. I'm confused. I don't think that I think it's a really I think it's a dope album. I got to get impact. The impact. Classic. What's your classic Drake then? I was going to say because I was riding with you with the Drake thing. But if you saying that Drake has classic albums, but get Richard Dytrion is in a classic, then now I just think I think get Richard Dytrion is an incredible album. I don't know if it's a classic, but I wouldn't show a classic. Like my classic albums are like thriller. OK, what's about hip hop? But OK, I'm just a classic album. I keep OK. OK, I thought we were talking about that. Comprehension is important. And somebody told me. I didn't say classic rap. I don't know. I don't think classic R&B. We were talking about classic albums. We talk about kiss. I thought we were talking about hip hop. No, but but not away from that, even I was just saying classic albums. That's what but that's part of the conversation. What I'm saying, like, how can you say Jadakiss has two or three classic albums, but Drake doesn't because Drake isn't bar you down like kiss. He doesn't have a classic album. But more thriller is the mark than where everyone's fuck. Yeah, nobody got all this shit. Because because to be honest, the closest thing I saw in the early 2000s that hit not like thriller, obviously, but like a thriller that wave when get Richard I try and came out, it took over the world. That's why even if you weren't even a hip hop fan, it's the impact. Was incredible. But the music was there, too. Because I get in the music with that. So I think it's a really I think the album is a dope album. I don't know if that's a classic album. OK, so let's go back to your point that you were making about classics being like they have to affect everybody, right? Like you said, you don't listen to Beyonce, but you're very much aware for talent. What would you say Beyonce's classic album is? I want to hear this because you're not a Beyonce fan. What was the one? Um, was it Lemonade? OK, Lemonade to me is a classic as a as a Beyonce fan. I agree with you. So that would be the one was the say. What was the other? Is it Dangerously Love? Was that the name of one of the albums? The first is the first. I think that's a classic album. I think Dangerously Love is a classic album. OK, I think Lemonade, Dangerously Love. And if I see the artwork, I could I could better point it out. She has a few. So you're not so you're you're not a fan, obviously, of the music on Lemonade, but you're aware of the fact that it's a classic album. So you're able to when I say I don't listen to Beyonce, meaning like in my time in the crib or in the car, I'm not turning on Beyonce to listen to it like that. If Beyonce put out tonight, just like everybody else in the world, I'm running to listen to. No, that makes sense. You understand? I recognize her greatness. She's one of the greatest artists ever. When you come to live performance music vocally, she checks all of the boxes. She's a legendary artist like I'm not. But I don't that's not the music that I listen to on my own on a daily basis. I don't listen to Beyonce on a daily basis. But I know she's one of the greatest artists ever. I'm not. So that's what I'm saying in that environment of being in the shop with older guys from New York City from a different time. I get it. But there's some things that are just unanimous, though, in conversation of music, I think get Richard Dijon. So then you can't take away from Richard Dijon. No, no, again, it means because I don't think it's unanimous that drink is a classic. I personally think he is more than one, but that's not a unanimous thing. The way get rich is to the world. So are we talking about I would have said 10 out of 10 people would have said get rich is a classic. Now I'm going to say nine out of 10, because you're the first person I've ever met. It's a nine out of 10. It's a nine out of 10. I think would get a mix of incredible albums. So is it only a classic if the masses, if the masses acknowledge that it's a classic, right? Because the album that I think is a classic drink album will be different from what the masses who would say he has one. The masses would pick take care. I would not pick take care. I don't think he has aged as well as views has. Right. And to me, nothing was the same is a classic in Drake's catalog. Yes. Do you think nothing was the same is a classic? Me? Yeah. He's got the right. What's what's better, P.I.M.P. or worse behavior? Worse behavior. I hate P.I.M.P. I don't know what you heard about me. Worse than P.I.M.P. might be the same song. I'm not going to lie. Word? No, I don't know. I don't know. I'm just like worse. But it's not going to be worse. P.I.M.P. is light gears. I'm going to go worse. That's my shit. That's my shit too. I'm so better. I'm playing worse than P.I.M.P. 305 to my city or P.I.M.P. I played 305 to my city boy. I like it too. P.I.M.P. is just not a good. I'm I will pick P.I.M.P. Oh, 305? Yeah. 305, yeah, I will pick P.I.M.P. I like 305 to my city. I skip 305 every fucking time. I did it. I did it. P.I.M.P. I just I just. I missed that time so much. What a time, bro. What a time. Yeah, I'm just not that I never liked that. What's your quintessential rap classics then? Just so we can get engaged since Get Rich is not there. Because at that point, yeah, I don't think you would ever argue. You kiss has a classic album if you don't think Get Rich is right. Because I when I went to that, that was like, I felt like that was a no brainer. You know, saying when I kissed with that was general consensus that everybody, you know, felt like that was a classic. So just to hear that. But a lot of but a lot of it. But there's like that in our culture and it's just something we do a lot. We'll just say something as a classic because everybody else has a class. Like a lot of people think Scarface is a classic. That movie is not a classic movie. That movie is actually terrible. I don't think you're wrong. But with Get Rich, I don't think that's the case. That's what I'm saying. Not saying that. I'm just saying in our culture, what we do a lot. A terrible movie. Once we see the master say, yo, not that's a classic. A terrible movie. Movie why? Storyline, the way it's shot. Like, what are you basing it on? The storyline is the story. I mean, the acting was OK. But just the storyline. Terrible. The acting. No, I said it was OK. But I mean, you got you got two of the biggest actors of their time with Al Pacino and what's her name? Shit. I forgot her name. Michelle Pfeiffer. Michelle Pfeiffer. But it's just that when you go back and look at it, you're like, this shit in real, this ain't no classic movie. But because so many people in our culture deemed it a classic, we see the poster. People got the poster in their house in the barbershops. We see the imagery of the movie so much. Right. We like, nah, yeah, that's a. No, no, you can go back and poke holes in it. You know what I'm saying? I still think for what it worth, for what it's worth and what it did. And the impact, no, the things like is definitely classic elements to it. But it's the greatest movie I've ever seen in my life. No, like people make it out to be. You could go back and poke holes in it. But again, like so there's also like impact and staying power and replay value and all those things go into it. You know what I'm saying? But movies are a little bit different than music. And why was it different? I think it's just different levels. Music is like writing with the vocals sound like and the production around it. You know what I'm saying? But like you got the acting. You got the casting. You got somebody who did a great job in the scene and had a terrible scene partner. So now do you say Al Pacino did great? But we didn't fuck with Manolo in the scene. Whereas when it's an album, for the most part, you you you were responsible for carrying the weight of the project as the artist. I'll get that. But they put that on the lead actor sometimes before they'll put on the director just because the actors are more famous when they say that movie. But if you're not in a scene and it's like at the same time, that actor just showed up to do his scenes. He wasn't involved in the handling process. But if you're not directed, you're not going to take they're not going to blame you for a bad scene if you're not in it, even if you're the lead actor. All right. So Nas gets a lot of flak, even though I disagree with it. It's it's a narrative that's been going on. He picks bad beats and they put that on Nas. He didn't produce it. Is it a matter of whether it's a matter of the classic? You picked the director. You picked a script. I'm asking a question because I'm getting I'm just let me just get in my position because when I answer, I'm asking, I'm asking a question. How you answer? I want to want to leave. Is Illmatic a classic? Absolutely. OK, so so Illmatic and kiss of death are on the same level? No. No. I think there's a spectrum of classics. That's why I asked what the worst classic was. Yeah, that doesn't mean they're on the same level because something. I think they're not a source, not a classic. It's a good album. But that's like saying this is not an Illmatic on the same level. They're not from a rapper perspective and then from a pop star. Yes, I think it's the same. I think that a kid that was however old Nas was, you got the music and then you got the impact of it and then you got the reach of the music. Illmatic is a classic. I think I think the community. You can't play it like anything off a thriller. I think I think Illmatic is a classic to the culture to right. Every MC after that, that was old enough to know when that album dropped and feel that I think that Nas inspired every MC after that. OK, to even try. That was like the goal. That became the soundtrack of your life. You moved to wherever you was at with that music in your head. Right. OK. To me, that's a classic. I don't think people moved around. With a kiss album, like the same way they moved around with Illmatic. I don't think so. Not saying kisses kisses an incredible MC. One of the greatest rappers ever. But I'm talking about the music. I don't think the music lived with us from his albums. The way the music lived with us from Illmatic, the way the music lived with us from reason moved out. I think that's I think that's I think the unfair thing to when you compare things to Illmatic, my only caveat in that is that Illmatic changed hip hop music and albums because of the way that they went about the production of it. Yeah, we had never seen an artist go handpicking plucked producers from other camps. I'm going to take the hottest guy out of Gangsta. I'm going to take the producer to Gangsta. I'm going to take the producer to Pete Rockin, C.L. Smooth. I'm going to take the producer from Main Source. We had never done that every up until that. Right. Trial was self contained. Main Source self contained. Balmsquad self contained. We had never seen that. So it changed the way people went about making their album. So that in itself makes it impactful in game changing. You know what I'm saying? So it's unfair to compare certain albums to Illmatic because of what the Illmatic did to change it, turn the tide in hip hop. Yeah, even Bad Boy being the sell out version of that still mainly just use hitman. That was the first time you got a list producer. Right. He built a production team. You know what I'm saying? Of different, all these different guys, production team. But where I also think it's unfair is the age gap as well. Because yeah, people my age, kids of death came out when I was 14. My age moved around with kids of death, probably the same way y'all moved around with Illmatic. I'm not saying that kids of death is on the same level of Illmatic, but you also have to put that into consideration that hip hop is unlike any other genre where 10 years is 100 years. Right. Like that's a huge gap between 94 and 2004 of listeners. Kids of death meant a lot to us. And yeah, we moved around like this was the soundtrack to fucking life. And is it is it fair to say that there's different pockets of everybody in different pockets is going to say that a different album is a classic. If you go down to certain parts of the South, they would never say that Illmatic is a classic, but somebody from their region that they grew up hearing. So we're never going to a long story short, we're never all going to agree what a classic is, depending on age, depending on demographic, depending on where you grew up. Like everybody is going to have different classics. No, but see, that's where I think that's where I think the conversation is different. I think no matter where you from, a classic is a classic. No matter where you from, like undeniable, a classic is undeniable. I don't care if you from the Northwest Coast, East Coast, South. When we see Kevin Gates rapping, reasonable doubt bars and he's from the South, that's letting you know. Like, he like, we was listening to that. So that narrative of in the South, we wasn't listening to cut that shit out because Niggas was listening to that. But people would tell you E 40 and the Klett guy classic albums and you will fight against that. And you fight against that. I would if someone in New York said 400 degrees, juveniles on a classic album, the South would lose their motherfucking minds. I play crazy. You say it like. But I mean, like to most point, yes, like I don't think no matter where you go, I think people would say AT aliens is a classic album. Right. Aquaman is a classic album, no matter where you're at. I think most people would say the chronic doggy style. Those are classic projects. But I think that's a nineties thing. I think once we hit the 2000s, it just got so spread out. I'm not even saying when it got to the Internet yet. Hip hop just got so big, the pockets happen and I got classics in the 2000s. Yeah. Yeah. No, I mean, yeah, he's not the only one. Yeah, he's one of the ones that has a classic in the 2000s. I think in Good Kid Mad City during the the interludes, they're talking about T.M. 101 like and that's in Compton. Up here, we thought T.M. 101 was a classic out the gate. I'm just saying as the years went, the term hip hop just got to too much recession, the classic is sidebar. No, I think it's a good album. OK. I think it's a second best out of the recession. I don't know if that's a class. No, no, that's my asking. I'm asking. I think it's a second best. It's my second favorite at the T.M. 101 for sure. And then weirdly enough, I have T.M. 103 as the third best album. I know that's very widely unpopular. But. No, warrior. Today's show is brought to you by a presenting sponsor, Hard Rock Bet, which is Florida's sports book. March is here, mall. So you know, the madness is going to take over. So angry. College basketball. So mad. Center stage. Every day we have games. I cannot wait. The temperature is rising. 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Gambling problem called 1-800-gambler, Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, Michigan, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee and Virginia. I'm John Green. You may know me as the author of The Fault in Our Stars. And now I guess also as the co-host of the Away End, a brand new world soccer podcast. I'm Daniel Alarcón, a writer and journalist, and John and I have known each other since we were kids. My first World Cup was Mexico 86. I was nine years old. I watched every game and I fell in love. On our new podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. For us, soccer, football, is a story we've shared for over 30 years. Since Daniel was the star player on our high school soccer team, very dependable. And I was their most loyal and sometimes only fan. I love this game. I love its history, its hope, its heartbreak, and above all, its beauty. Together, we'll find out why of all the unimportant things, football, soccer is the most important. Listen to the Away End with Daniel Alarcón and John Green on the I Heart Radio App, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. How do you guys think about this list? Because we went on a tangent. Yeah, we didn't even. Andre, Andre, they killed me for that. I used to have three dollars in my top five. He doesn't have a solo album. I used to have them in my top five. Right. But without a solo album. No, I saw that. Yeah, it's only been so long. You know what I'm saying? It's only been so long. You can rest. This is not this is not this. Does Busta have a classic album that's going to pay me for my answer? When disaster strikes. What was the debut album? The Coming. The fact that you have to think about it. The fact that you have to think about it and let you know now the answer is no, babe. Now I'm thinking Buster is a goat. Buster is one of the greatest. It might be ever had. He to me is in that Chris Brown category of you are a goat. You've given us so much. You've changed the entire genre. You are an elite artist. You've never given us that body of work that your peers have. Because you're in the conversation with with everyone that is a legend. And Busta should be there and will always be there. But he's the Chris Brown. I think general. The answer is no. But I think there's probably large majority of people that will say he extinction level event might be Busta's classic album, like his magnum opus. But I don't think it's a it's a vast majority thing. And that's what you know, that's part of the criteria. Yeah, you know, I'm saying he also had such a heavy like output that it gets tough when you have 30 fucking albums. Ludacris, man, fuck you. Yeah, chicken and beer. I'm going to say the class chicken and beer. I think is the one back. I might be a classic word of mouth. Classic, though. She I chicken and beer is a classic. The other ones are great. I'm classic. Can we just pull up the word classic? Because I like to use the word. I'm in that era of my life. I want to say the right. Right. I don't want to just. Yeah, like I don't want to just keep saying shit. Like what do these words mean? OK, classic, judged over a period of time to be the of the highest quality and outstanding of its kind, remarkably and of struck, instructively typical. That's different. A work of now of work of our recognized and established value, a school subject that involves a study of intergrate, whatever. So it has to be judged over a period of time to be of the highest quality and outstanding of its kind. OK. Chicken and beer to me is a classic to me because I was there. I don't know in in 30 years if it's going to stand like, who let these holes in my room? I don't know if that's going to like make it for the rest of the world. Right. If you go through blow it out, stand up, splash, waterfalls, hard times, dominant back, screwed up, pussy poppin, hip hop, quotables, black man struggle, hose in my room, teamwork. This is a classic album to me. Yeah, I'm not fighting you on that. To me, to me, this is a classic shit on this. But I can tell you that all is saying, right? I don't know if if an asteroid hits the fucking planet and we can put albums in some shit that's going to survive, they're going to take chicken and beer and illmatic and be like, these are these are the same. Yeah, yeah, nah. And that's all I'm saying. But they're going to say, this is that. I don't think I'm like, this is this was good. But I think they're going to listen to other classes. I don't know if it's so many things, but I'm a fight. I'm a fight to the end. You're going to fight for. For get right. Just a long fight. I don't think the good album, 1000 percent impact, incredible. But just the mute. No, I just don't classic. I don't know if that's it for me. Do you think there's a little bit of a nostalgia that comes with classic? Like, for example, like we were talking about bad movies that are maybe classic. Scarface is a classic, even though you can go home, go back and poke holes in the story. It is a classic belly horrible movie. It's still a classic movie. And Scarface are actually very similar where they're there are a lot of great moments. Yes, there's a storyline, but it's just a bunch of cool moments in a bunch of cool moments. But they also still belly still affects like cultural conversations to this day. It's still quoted to this day. There's people who emily that open. How hype shot it is how people to this day shoot movies and music videos. Yeah. So you can't. So yeah, you can say that in as a cinephile. Yes, it's bad. It's a bad movie, but it's still a classic. Like you you can't take classic from it. I'm with you. Inspector Decker. Look at my face. If the flood didn't happen, maybe. I just think if DMX and Nas was not casted in that, we wouldn't even be talking about that movie. Of course not. But that's a lot of things. Yeah. OK. If hype didn't direct it again. Yeah. If anybody else did train today. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no Yo, I got shot in the leg. Let's go to Africa. Africa's fire. Don't do that in T-Bot. What are we talking about here? Now you say Africa now falls? You said it, nigga. Pull up the mileage. He disagree with anything, yo. Pull up the mileage is crazy. I just think it's a good move. I don't know if it's a classic though, but I get it. Because it's so attached to our culture with DMX and Nas, me and you. But hood classic exists. Yeah. Hood classic is a classic. That's the real thing. But I don't want to take away from, see, I don't want to say hood classic because belly and scarface are about the same amount of bad. And why only one of them got to be deemed as a hood classic? Scarface is a hood classic too. Yeah. Scarface is only a classic because the hood says so. Because the hood made it a classic. Nobody is suburban American thing scarface is a classic movie? That's not true. Snickers is not Jack and Scarface and Malkisco. They're not Jack and Scarface. I don't know what happened in the 90s, but whenever they put like Scarface posters out, then the whites got into Scarface. That's really what it was. Well, because the whites like hip hop and posters. Yeah. So but because we said it was a classic, you know, but if you start talking to if you ask the caprio with Scarface Lance, he loves Al. I'm sure he allows his guy. But he doesn't go to Scarface when he's talking about Al. He's probably like, that's Al's worst movie. If you ask the cap, I'm probably embarrassed in certain rooms when that's. Yeah. Like that's what I'm saying. It still is a classic for what? Yeah, it's a classic for what is worth for what it is. It's a classic because we said it was a classic because the impact that even if it's not good, you can put something. I think music is a little different from movies because people put on bad movies and enjoy them even even though they know it's a bad movie. Like we'll put on belly knowing belly is a terrible movie and still enjoy watching it. Putting on bad music and enjoying it is cringe. It's kind of like that's different. You can't enjoy it. I'd rather look at Keisha and that lingerie than to fucking listen to some subpoena. But the other watch Keisha and listen to P.I.M. There's a classic that crossed over though, because I think, OK, my dad loves Scarface. My dad loves dead presidents. My dad likes paid in full. He's probably not going to sit and watch belly with me. Like there are hood classics that I think have crossed over. Dead presidents being one, paid in full being one and Scarface being one. Poetic justice. Is that a hood classic? Don't piss me off. I'm asking you now right now, Ma. I'm asking is that a hood classic? I think it is. Yeah, it is. It's a class. Wait, would someone say it's not? Some would say it's not. Yeah, some will say that. What about that is not a hood class? I don't know. I don't. I'm just saying some people. I think that would be the bar. But you know, Justice, is it great? You think it's a great film? Yeah. You cool? No, I'm asking them a question. Is your birthday here? You want to make it out like what's wrong with justice? I thought we were celebrating your birthday. Why we have to like exactly you know that I can't pose a question. What's wrong with party justice? Nothing. I love poetic justice. I just wanted to make sure that the room the room was a great movie to make sure the room is all right. He's taking the temperature. It's hot. Yeah, but I think I think in the conversation of classic albums, though, I do think some things are subjective, but at the same time, some things are just unanimous, though. Now, for sure. And and again, back to, you know, Jadakiss having three two or three classics versus Drake having none. He put that list one more time. I just want to see who else was on that at this time. Grand Puba, Method Man, Jadakiss, Fab Black, Black, Black. To Cal is not a classic. It's like, see, that's an argument. That's an argument. Some people say to Cal is a classic. You know, I think Peach, please don't make this a clip. I think that Cal is not a classic. I think to Cal is in that time. I like to go. It was looked at as underwhelming. But look at what Jezza, Rayquan and Ghost did at that exact same time. It is the worst one out of all of it. That's a great point. Don't make it a clip. That's a I don't want to get fucking killed again. Great point. You can't go to Shilin no more, but it's a great point. I was in Staten Island this weekend. You can't go this weekend. I don't think to Cal is that I think Method Man, again, is one of those like Buster. You're your goat goes without saying, but to Cal, be the closest. OK, Method Man has good album to Cal is a great album. Let me put it that way. See, why we can't just say that about a lot of other people? That's my whole point. Why I got to be classic, classic, nah, but great. Is it Cuban link? No, it's certain shit. Like I wouldn't go. I wouldn't fight you to the nail on Grand Puba. Real or real, but I fuck with real or real. I listen to that album. I still think it's dope. The fact that I can listen to that. I'm a 2026 and still think it's a dope album means I think it's a dope album. But when people what I fight to the nail to say it's a classic. No, I'm not dying on that hill, but I think it's a great album. I think the impact that it had. I mean, obviously we can't count brand new me an album as a Grand Puba solo because it's brand new me. And but he really carried that album. You know, I'm saying as far as him coming in and being the elder statesman in that crew, you know, I'm saying having a solo record and doing all the shit that it did. It set him up for a solo project. But yeah, nobody's going to. I don't think a lot of people are going to say real or real is a classic. But it's a dope Grand Puba album. Grand Puba might be one of the most underrated artists that we have. That's unfortunate. Let's change that. Let's change it today. Like when you talk about everything that he bought to rap, different style, style is tone, sound, fresh shit. Like knowledge itself. He popped off while brands. He popped off Jebo crazy. He popped off. He'll figure crazy. He brought that type of fly shit into the book bag. Fly shit. You know what I'm saying? Like the preppy hood mixed with the hood shit like Rob Lee's with the with the with the with the with the dad. Had and and and honestly, the crazy shit is he was so instrumental in Mary J. Blige's career. You know, saying, yeah, like what's the 411 and and what's the joint the other days he joined? Check it out. Check it out. Like those two records without those. Grand Puba was a far bigger artist in Mary J. Blige. His credibility gave her validity in those spaces. You know, saying like him popping off arguably one of our crown jewels in the culture speaks as a testament to how important Grand Puba was in that moment. You know, saying so. Yeah. Like he's different. Puba is one he probably talking that shit. Yeah. And he was talking that shit. He's probably one of the most underrated. So it was good to see, you know, him on this just mentioned. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of people, you know, they don't. And I'm you know, I'm an 80s baby. So I know exactly what what poob. I did this gentleman put him in number one. Number one of great greatest MCs without the classic. Now is this in order or is he just naming 10? I'm not sure. But I don't know if he thinks Grand Poob. Our rap is better than Black Thought. I don't know. Well, that's that before we get off this. This was my last point. Is it unfair that Black Thought is on this list? Unfair. Yes. Yeah, it is because he's the front man of the roots. Like he's the MC in the roots. That's like saying every album to him is kind of a solo album. Yes. He's he's he's carries the weight of the of the roots for album for every album. Like I hear it when if you're in a duo, when you don't have a soul like Andre on there, whether or have a prodigy, whatever. Yeah, you. But he's the MC of their dice for you had other people there every now and then. Right. That's just like a feature. Mm hmm. Why is every roots album not technically right? Because there's been plenty of MCs that had just one producer, but they didn't name them as a group. Right. But they had their their production squad. Right. The entire time. You think about like Keras one as opposed to Boogie Down Productions. Yeah. Those BDP albums are still Keras one album. Keras one of them. You know what I'm saying? They just not deemed as solo, maybe it's production, maybe it's whatever. Or like I had another point. But basically this certain yet a certain artist that carry the bulk of the MCing on a project, but because of the way the group is labeled or named, it's not, you know, the roots. The roots is Black Thought is verse wise. Yeah. I mean, if you want to make the case that it's a duo based off the amount of musicians that came and went, it's Black Thought and Questlove. But even then, like, OK, Black Thought's the only one. Raping. Not rapping, you know. And of course you got all of the other MCs that were there. You got Dice Raw, you got Truckin' Off, you got Dan who just passed them. I'm having a brain fart. But you know, there were other MCs that were part of the collective. But Black Thought, even in those records, it's not like there was a bunch of solo records from a bunch of other people. Black Thought is the bulk of the MCing and the roots throughout their entire catalog. To me, that's like saying doggy styles, not a solo snoop album. The same thing. You have one producer that produced the entire thing. It's labeled as a snoop album, though. So that's that's where the difference is. But that's like saying, you know, you can say you can say the cry. It's the music. It's the music. It's one producer and one rapper. Right. Amir and Black Thought. Dr. Dre Snoop Dogg. Is there a difference? Just because the label said roots versus Black Thought? Now you make a good case. Black Thought, every roots project is a solo Black Thought album. Public Enemy, right? Those are Chuck D. Those are Chuck D albums. Flav jumped in, you know me, Ad Lib. He had not one as a joke. But for the most part, Chuck D carries the bulk of the MCing throughout those projects. You know what I'm saying? Or Gangsta is a group, but preem didn't drop no raps. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Like those are as Guru MCing, you know what I'm saying? Like Guru MCed on those albums. Yeah, this this is I love very close this combo. How many classic albums you think J.D.K. has? If I got a if I got a fight for it, I'm gonna say one. I'm gonna say the debut. And you said which one is classic? I think Kiss the Game Goodbye and Kiss the Death. My I have personal classics and then I have classics. They're under personal classics for me. If I were doing a classic like Top 20, I don't think I'd put Kiss the Death or Kiss the Game Goodbye. I think 35 year old me being overlooked. I think Ghetto Fabulous is being overlooked. That doesn't have a. In these conversations. I have a. That's OK. How do you say that so fast? But then that's hard. I think Ghetto Fabulous is being overlooked in a lot of these conversations. I was going to go real talk. I think Street Dreams is being overlooked. Street Dreams. Yes. It's Clive. All right. Then you think Kiss the Death is classic. This is some shit. I'm just saying. I'm just saying, bro. We got great albums. Great albums. We won't call them Clive. We won't say the C word, but they're great albums. And that's all. I just I just want people to stop using the word classic so loosely. Right. Unless you're talking about get rich or die trying. Then please call it a classic. If you do so. If you feel that way. Like I said, it's also. I'm not even from Queens. My I'm just saying. It's all subjective. It's all subjective. You could be from Queens in the UK and that's a classic album. OK. Before we get out of here, I'm asking this because I know the listeners want to hear from you more. I'm interviewing at this point. This morning, Charlemagne had mentioned that he talked to somebody that heard Iceman and that future was on it and it's been going viral all morning. This is this is in real time. Can you confirm or deny that future is on Iceman as of March 12th, 2026? Dupy sigh. Big fact. Is he on is he on Iceman as it stands today? March, I just said March 12th, 2026. He might be. OK. I mean, I personally, the information I have on the album, it's. He's on the board. He's on the whiteboard. It's not a new record. It's not new record. He's on the board. He's on the whiteboard. It's on the whiteboard. I guess I guess I guess There's a whiteboard. There's a parentheses and asterisk. What is what I did? I guess our ideas are being created. Yes. Let's say the ideas Are being created have been created Some are they write future on the whiteboard or say Hendrix? Well, no, I don't know about that, but I know ideas or his full government have been created ideas Continue to be created ideas have been pivoted from Got you. Um, so yeah, it's it's it's not matter that where you went to media training school at They still like they still open or they like shut down well and the well told them that no, that's just a fact It's just ideas of me created. It's no the album is being You know fleshed out. It's still a process Interesting, that's all but I thought because this isn't even information that like we had behind the scenes I thought it was kind of like known that Drake and future piece it up That's how everyone was like, yo, what the fuck how could this happen? I thought they hate it Wasn't that like kind of common knowledge on the timeline? They were that they were cool again. Oh, I don't know that. I don't I don't know about that But you know, I don't think there's I'm tapped in with the twitter rumors that that was going around everywhere that Future and Drake were cool again. I don't think it's far fetched that they may work together again I don't think that's a far fetched idea music music is is Exponentially better when those guys are cool I would I would hope to god Drake and future our friends and make more music need that um Again before we leave I've noticed mall is more like ebro than I than I ever thought Because I saw this wild clip of ebro today Are you trying to get him back for saying get rich or die trying it was in the class No, that's why I'm starting to realize that that mall just his speech off to get rich It like that we don't know what we're talking about. Did y'all see this this ebro clip today? And salute to ebro. That's that's my guy. Love love you ebro This might be one of the wildest clips I've seen this month. Can we play this? But that's why in hip hop there has always been gatekeepers because some of y'all don't deserve a fucking opinion Because you haven't been doing this professionally consuming Playing and critiquing hip hop as your life. You're just a fan Your and we love you. You're just a consumer. You're a customer as we call them That's why sometimes your opinion customer Doesn't fucking count because you don't fucking do this for real And that's why when people who do this for real get around and they start looking at the the nuances of what an album actually is And what it should mean and what the person is saying through the album and the picture that it's painting and the lyrical breakdown And them being able to stay on topic and who the producers are and what it means and what and what it serves in time And all of these things when you critique Complete bodies of work not just collections of great songs That's when you get into like what is a classic album in general and a classic hip hop album Maul, I felt like you you kind of sounded like that To us today talking about gay rich Like we don't know what we're talking about I said, y'all don't know what y'all talking about I'm that never came out my mouth one time. I never said that What is what is ebro talking about? I mean, I don't know what he read or what people are saying to him online Maybe he feels like people that you know, haven't Been in or around music and the business of music as much as he has or as long as he has Don't really have Anything that they could say to him because again, you're speaking from a different perspective of it One is a true consumer. First of all, we're all consumers. We all consume. We all consume this but Ebro has been on the other side. He's been in the music business. He's been Program director at radio and you know things like that. So he has a different Sense and a different, you know connection to the pulse of music and just the the the energy of music So I understand what he's saying to an extent Um, I don't know who he's talked. I don't know where this came from I don't know if somebody says something based on something. Ebro said and responded to him And got mad at something he said on his opinion But these are all just opinions It's all about opinions, but again, some things are a little crazy to say. Yeah Y'all feel like me saying give rich or dodge trying is not a class. Even though I said it's a great album I just don't think it's a classic. No, this is good barbershop debate. That's one thing I think that people talk with a certain level of certainty that don't know having no idea what the fuck they talk about And in that regard, I gotta agree with him because I'm in the music business. I'm a rapper. I've been on the road. I'm a songwriter. I'm friends with these artists I know what happened in the studio why this song didn't come out, etc You have people that respectfully You work at fedex You go get your hand cutting the barbershop and you talk with this level of certainty about things you have no idea about And that shit pisses me off because it's like And god forbid you fucking buy a microphone in the in the computer in the camera and now you have a plan Yeah, god forbid you got wifi because now you talking and now you got an audience and now you got people chiming in And now people are taking your word as some type of factual thing when basically you really just talking out your ass And I think that where it gets convoluted and that there's like a disconnection is that you have certain people That do have a certain pedigree and do have a certain regard for this business With the knowledge and access that goes along with it And they youtube come up right after the other person who just talk about shit in a room and people Value those things the same way when it's not coming from the same place So I understand where you're coming from as far as like talking about behind the scene Shit that other people may not be privy to but they get on a mic and like fans come on and say all types of Conspiracy theories with artists and all types of shit first like they're talking for sure And I have no idea what the fuck they're talking about right with that I agree but when it comes to the music in the ear The artist should never be creating music for his peers or for the people to Who work at radio stations to critique it? Yeah, we want you to play it, but it's not for you It's for the little niggas in the barbershop to debate whether kiss the death or kiss the game. Goodbye is a fucking classic years later It's not for us. It's it's not for they hate that we even talk about their shit They don't create it for us. They create it for the fans something more more often Especially now for the casual fan So to say that those people don't have the right to critique music when they're the ones who started critique and music Before it became a job that pays ebro all of that money. That's stupid to me I'm sorry if that's if that's his argument that yeah, everybody has a right What's the artist out there? Everybody with ears has the right to critique it and and you're right in everything that you said But to me that's a very very small small small part of the people that consume music We're consumed in that world whether it's content reactions this and that the fans that have now become reaction Commenters and that that youtube world. Yeah, it's a big thing gets a lot of views But go through the streams of an artist versus streams of a reaction Neither here nor there most people are driving their kids To school going to and from work and are there to just listen to the music and have every right to critique the entire thing I'm not saying ebro was wrong. It was just in the way. He said it was such entitlement Where he doesn't realize we are the least important Part of this entire process we as in who the critiquers the media people The commenters that are on these microphones. We are the least important out of this whole process Matter of fact, ebro was more important when he was a program director and was able to play certain records for artists At that point he was more important than someone that could could critique The two most important people in this group is the artist number one And then the consumer that's listening to it and buying it right because a lot of times People in front of microphones will start listening to records. They've never listened to they're only doing it to critique They're not a consumer. They're a content creator, right? Especially when I'm listening to this because I have to comment on it I'm not a consumer that we are the least important And that's also why I hate I'm going to go against our own shit. That's why I hate pr people now You think doing don't do it. Yeah That bad buddy was ringing. I know what you're talking about from Cuba then he's going to be good at bad buddies throwing papers out Um with pr people, I think they're disconnected. Do I love that? Artists want to come up here and talk about stuff. I just don't think that's as important As y'all think it is because a lot of our fans are content fans They're not music fans If someone comes up here and and isn't able to play their music because you can't do that with youtube Netflix anywhere It'll get whitelisted hustling backwards. You can't even tell your label to let us clear a song that we could play on our show right What that's not a music consumer. You're selling music right now. You're coming up here Just to try to be funny so you can get some views that doesn't right that does not move the needle on selling records So we literally have been this conversation with the artist like dude. What are you talking about the game is so fucked up, right? Because like, you know god, I'm on serious xm right? It's a radio platform. It's a national platform We play music the music once it plays If you wrote those songs or you're the artist on those songs you will get paid from those songs You'll have an artist that'll dub coming up to series to come sit with y'all No, I'm just saying in general right because Y'all hot or they know the clips is going to go whatever whatever That's not going to ring the register. Nope, you know I'm saying and so that shit is like the whole shit is Is convoluted and twisted but back to your point We also I mean, I don't look at myself as a media personnel even though people do I'm an artist I create art but I think I have enough Cache in the business that I do have a opinion to talk about it as well But I think that you you talk about those people those people also The consumers are important because they go out and consume right now. We all stream and so it's different But they'll still go buy a ticket Yeah, I'm gonna fucking not buying tickets to shows y'all calling the label y'all calling the manager y'all going in for free And you want access too you want to go backstage you want to adapt the artist you might want to yeah You might want to get some content, you know what I'm saying like so Yeah, you're right to that in that regard like we're the least important people because if you're if your objective is to put out music so that you can financially support yourself and your family Then the consumer is who you need to be focused on And to me also it's contradicting of what Ebro does that I admire about Ebro with his apple show outside of what he does with nadesca low and everyone He also does his one-on-one interviews with artists that are still teetering on the line I appreciate that Ebro will interview artists that are not a-list and I think that does help them because on The apple platform you you can play the music afterwards because it's on their streaming site And it's more important because we can't play music up here because we get flagged Ebro can do that with his stuff and I think that's important But why Ebro is doing it outside of him also making money as he should he has a family It is to get that artist in front of people that will consume the music the same people that Ebro is just shitting on right now Yeah, I will Know the context of where the person that's supposed to have an opinion You're trying to show them the artist. Well, it appears that he that he was also involved in the classic Conversation of an album and I'm sure people disagree. Well, everybody can have an opinion on that Well, we're all music snobs and I also will not have conversations with certain people that I know don't Love music the same way. I agree. Okay, there'll be plenty of people like. Oh, I see where you're at with shit I'm not even There's no point in us even having a conversation I literally I get that there But I don't shit on them as a human being to say that they do not matter and are not allowed to listen to music Or have an opinion anymore. I sit in the bar and don't say one word So many times I'll sit there having four hour conversations and debates about shit. I know how to get mad when you don't speak I know a to z no, I get my cut. I get out of there But it's just so I'll be so fortunate when I'm in the chair because then I can't really talk But I'll be hearing people talk and I mean to very very High regard and disagreement about shit They just don't have any idea about and I just be like, y'all know what the fuck y'all talking about I felt like that with math But I can't argue that because it's music subjective, right? So I'm just like, how can y'all say that this artist has three or two or two or three classics and this artist has none You just want we took my classic albums not rap album not r&b album a classic body of work To me it's just like and in that moment I was like, you know what I get it Like it's all we all are gonna experience and hear things and and and take from art differently than others So I get it so we can have the conversation just because it's all entertainment for shits and giggles But it's like certain things. I'm just not debating certain shit I just don't get him when people speak matter of factly about shit that they just don't know especially like business shit We can talk about opinions on music everybody can have their opinion on that Yeah, I'm talking about Nah, because you know son stop fucking with son because he did this or they did the record and That shit is annoying as fuck, but to me to me that's not talking about music. That's content. You're in the content game You're in the gossip game. You're in you're in the wendy williams world Did wendy talk about music? Sure, but wendy was in the gossip world to me. That's what those people are in We dabble in both we dabble in music 26 wendy looking like you know a lot of fucks she was talking about Oh no, her gay list is But But I mean to me again, I'm the same way in barbershops I will just stay quiet because it'll be a lot of shit that infuriates me I'll be like, you don't know what the fuck you talking about, but I stay quiet because music I'm a snob. Yes, but I realize that music is not necessarily for snobs the way maybe the art world is that's very niche Music is for the whole world the volume of music that comes out every day is not the way basquiat paintings come out Like yeah, you could walk into a gallery and be like brah I don't my two-year-old could draw this We don't fully understand the fucking point and this and that Whatever music is for everybody to just listen to It can't be critiqued at the same snob level that Someone like ibrone myself or anyone else in this room feels it should be it's for the average consumer It's not for the snob. Well, if you want that then fucking go watch whiplash and ghost Shit on timothy chalamet and say opera is the greatest thing of all time. I don't know. Go be a snob where snobs are But hip-hop is the biggest genre in the world. It's not for snobs anymore You can't shit on the consumer if you want to keep the shit moving if we all still want to have jobs We can't have snobs. Well, I mean we're am bars. Listen. I should rap. We all Man, we all consumers at the end of the day. So I mean I get it. Some people can speak matter of factly some can't but I look at it. It's all entertaining Even if you say some crazy shit and I want to laugh. I gotta laugh out of it. It's like, all right, cool. I'm not gonna lose no sleep I'm not gonna get upset. It's like that's how you feel That's how you feel Uh, tory want to thank you for coming by man. Thank you. Thank you guys for having to come back soon man So we could talk some more shit. I got a chance Hopefully I get a chance to hug the marriage. That's the only reason I came in It's the hug baby Listen, man, she's a hug and I was all from 12 to I think five so you might have just Just call him just call it. Yeah, she goes in an overtime. We it's double for the after that time We talk to y'all soon be safe be blessed. I'm that nigga. He's just ginger. That's tory I'm Daniel Alarcón and this is my friend is much more famous than I am I wouldn't go that far But I'm john green co-host of the podcast the away end with my old friend daniel on our podcast the away end We'll share with you the magic of international football all leading up to the 2026 world cup together We'll find out why of all the unimportant things football soccer is the most important Listen to the away end with daniel alarcón and john green on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts This is an iHeart podcast guaranteed human