ICE Murder in Minneapolis

Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the Findout podcast. We have a special guest today that we were going to talk about a lot of different things, but we've got a breaking news situation where it appears that an ice agent has shot and killed a woman in a car in Minneapolis, which it also looks like she was trying to get away. So this is quite an explosive situation, but we're very, very fortunate to have Congressman Eric Swalwell with us today. So Congressman, thank you for joining us. And obviously we were talking, going to talk about a lot of other things that this just happened in the last two hours. So we're pivoting a little bit. So Congressman, tell us what you have what you've seen so far about what's going on on the ground. Yeah, it's horrific to watch. I mean, ice is absolutely out of control, but this is what they want. They go into communities. They're bragging that they've sent 2000 agents to Minneapolis. The goal is to draw the foul is to put themselves in a position like that. And then they just where people, you know, right justly are asking like, what the fuck are you doing in our communities? And then they use, you know, that resentment and that resistance is justification for what they just did. I mean, the son of a police officer, I'm a brother or two police officers. I'm a former prosecutor and I have always had the backs of law enforcement, but what that officer did there was murder. There was no de-escalation. There was no effort to, you know, use any other level of force. It does not appear in any angle that I've seen, you know, that his life was in danger. This wasn't somebody who was your pen against a wall and they're driving at you, you know, 20 miles an hour and you can't go anywhere. He clearly got out of the way he walked away. He was on his own two feet. And look, there has to be consequences now. And so yes, it is the mayor says and we all have his back. Get the fuck out of Minneapolis. Get the fuck out of California. We don't want you anywhere. If you're not going after violent criminals and you're going to do stuff like this. But too, they have to be prosecuted. Local officials have to use their law enforcement abilities. And I've been saying this to attorneys general all over the state. Go on offense. I've been prosecuted these masked unidentified bandits when they commit kidnapping, false imprisonment, assault and now murder. And I also believe that we have to strip them of their immunity. They can't participate in these civil actions and enjoy law enforcement like immunity. They're not doing law enforcement. They're participating in civil actions and now have taken the life of an innocent woman. Well, I want to point out to folks that that maybe they don't know, but the Trump administration had just announced, I think, the other day, that they were sending 2000 ice agents into Minneapolis because of this, you know, this bullshit. The fake outrage that they've had around this fraud issue around daycare centers, which they have, we have known about since 2019 and the Biden administration had started the investigations into and they made up this claim. And, you know, I curious, get your take, but like to me, it seems like because they want to denigrate Somalia Americans and they want to actually want to lift up the outrage of the mega base because his, his poll numbers are plummeting through the floor. And then to send these, these mask agents to be clear, there's all these photos of this guy who did this, but he's masked because they allow them to do that. Now, should we allow law enforcement to be masked in our cities? No, and by the way, Donald Trump looking for fraud is like, oh, Jason Simpson looking for the real killer. Right? Give me a break. Come on. No, I have said that when we are in the majority, I've talked to enough of my colleagues, the masks are coming off and the IDs are coming out and we have that ability when we're in the majority because we have the power of the purse and there's no Democrat. I know who is going to fund ice in a way where they're not accountable. And by the way, they're terrorizing women right now, you know, our, you know, moms, wives, daughters, they could be pulled off the street by anyone in a mask. Without knowing who the hell they are, that that's the environment that ice has created right now. And again, because I come from a law enforcement background, I know no other police agency, the FBI, the DEA, local SWAT teams go roaming around in our communities, unless it's the most extreme environment where their own safety and like the cover of darkness is required in a masked way. They're the only agency that does this. And I also believe when you take the mass off, there's going to be fewer ice agents who are willing to go out in the community and do this. I think they have this invincibility complex right now because they think they're invisible. There's no question. Have they been able to identify this guy because he was master or they not? Is he unidentified? I think I actually saw him drive off and when you're watching the video, I think he gets in a car really really, right off where in most investigations, you know, you would stay at the scene right there. There's a protocol, but that's why, you know, if this wasn't Minneapolis, you know, that's why they hadn't been county district attorney's office, you know, should quickly assert jurisdiction and seek to interview, you know, the officer because that's a crime scene. 100% that's a crime. Right. I mean, even from what I saw in the video, it looks like he's already pointing his gun while the woman is backing up, not while she's coming at him. So I mean, this is, I mean, that is, as you said, it's murder. This is it's clear as day. Obviously, it's a defensive position backing up. There's no reason to point your gun at somebody who's just blocking traffic. That's exactly right. And I don't think we have any evidence that she brandish any sort of weapon at him either, right? Yeah. She's in a vehicle and then as I said, I will defend an officer if he's pinned against the wall and a car coming out of work. And I've seen cases where an officer is in a car and a car is racing at that officer in the officer will shoot through their own window. That is justified. This when you just scoot out of the way and you're on your own two feet. Not just. Well, I think and that's the point I want to really hammer home to people and so I'm so glad we have you today because you have this experience. But the use of lethal force has to be like clear and present danger correct. And what I'm seeing from that video, which you kind of see where he is. All he did was step out of the way and hurt and you can even see the wheels on the look like a front wheel drive SUV or are turned all the way around to be getting out of the way. There's not a lot of ambiguity in this in this video. Of course, Maga is all saying he did it to spare his life. But if you look at the footage, I don't know how any rational human being can look at that and say that that was a justifiable act by that is also. No, zero. As you said, the wheels are also turned and you can tell if the wheels are turned and he's looking at the driver, you can also see the hands turning the wheels away from him. And so anyone with half a brain can deduce that she's trying to turn away from where you are. Not to drive right at where you are. It's unfortunate. I don't know who this woman is. I've seen reports that she is a US citizen. It doesn't matter. She's a right undocumented individual or US citizen. You don't die that way in such an unjustified way. But this is what they want. They want to go into our communities. Search these officers and then hope that people resist. And then it gives them the justification and their own minds that they're looking for to commit violence. Yeah, I mean, they're playing with fire with this though. I mean, this to me feels like this, the spark point for something like what happened with George Floyd. I mean, this happened very close to where George Floyd is murdered to begin with. But like I said this from the beginning once this kind of thing starts happening. That's when you're going to see massive resistance from everybody in this country because you know, a lot of people are blissfully just kind of going through their lives and just seeing news headlines here and there. But things like this are the thing that can spark an entire shift. So we need to use this momentum to really put the pressure on. What I have also said is it relates to ice agents and governors and attorneys general. You have so many emergency powers and law enforcement powers. These guys only understand one language either they're on offense or you're on offense. And if they're on offense, that means those vulnerable people in our community on defense, something else that I would do. I call it reveal to wheel. If you have ice agents who are wearing masks and unidentified and you're a governor, take away their damn driver's license. Don't allow them to drive in your state that you make that a revocable offense. Again, they will get the message. I promise you if you put them on their heels, rather than them putting the most vulnerable in our community on this. So that's something I actually didn't know that just as it would be clear like so governor walls who just yesterday announced that he was not seeking reelection partially because maga has been throwing horrible like threats of violence against his two kids in him and obviously screaming the R word. I think at the mansion, which is shows the level of maturity that we're dealing with a lot of these people, but a lot of these people are ice agents too. So Tim walls could if he wanted to take their driver's license away so that could not even. Okay, well that's. You have a lot of states, rights and authorities that affect their mobility. And I think you can do all of that. And again, just go on offense. I don't let them drive the narrative. Well, what did you think about it? I think you said a little bit about this, but I want to be clear. So when mayor at Jacob, right, his name, when he was at an initial press conference today, he literally said the words, he said, I have a message to ice. Get the fuck out of Minneapolis. Now you have you have been an advocate for this type of of, you know, being on offense before. Do you think that this maybe is a turning point because like when I looked at that, I was like, absolutely yes. More of this because I think people have worried that some Democrats, president company excluded, have been too melee mouthed about this. But to me, this is the moment and it seems like the mayor has stepped up and is taking at least initially the right approach. Absolutely, you know, I just talked to the new mayor of Miami last week, Elaine Higgins, and part of her campaign was to protect the most vulnerable and her community who are under attack. And in many of these people are not people who can vote for her, right. And so, I think this has to be a clarion call for mayors and governors across the country that you have to protect the people you represent. And so that, you know, clear, throw, did message from mayor fri. I hope it's echoed across the country. What, you know, people are obviously going to be looking to Democrats in Congress and obviously you are in the minority in both the House and the Senate. But is there and you, you laid out a very clear plan for when, not if, but when Democrats take and you add there's a famous clip of you, you know, I can't remember who you were interviewer talking to in a committee hearing, but basically like, we are going to be in control next year. We're very careful about what you say to us now. And so we know that there's a very aggressive and robust plan post election. Is there anything that Democrats in Congress could do right now to rain in this clearly lawless administration? The margins are so thin right now it's 218 Republicans to 213 Democrats. And by the way, there are a few Republicans Thomas Massey like individuals don't like the lawless nature of this administration. So it's really just a matter of finding two other Republicans to work with, you know, to affect change. So I wouldn't write the other side completely off. I'd write most of them off. But you just need a handful. You know, this is the thinnest majority ever and my Johnson doesn't have a shit together and he doesn't have aligned. And so, you know, where we can get wins, you know, for the most vulnerable. We should be seeking to do that. And one that I think you can do immediately is on the immunity issue. Look, immunity is there for many good reasons for law enforcement when they're doing law enforcement functions. These guys are not doing law enforcement functions. They are taking civil actions, but they have this, as I said, this cloak of immunity that makes them act as if they are invincible. And if you strip that away again, I don't think that guy shoots into that car. If he doesn't have that immunity. I don't think he strips in that shoots into that car. Well, I think one of the disturbing things that I saw that there were at least there were stills of him sort of a, you know, he's still got his mask up and he's kind of just standing there and it's like, you know, maybe he's in shock or something, but like, you know, that he gets in a car drives away like it's just this is just so madness to me. As, as a, like you said, as a former prosecutor, what, what are some things that people should know about their interactions? So if they become face to face with an ice agent, is it the same thing is being face to face with a police officer or they're different things is, are they allowed to just basically walk away or what's what recommendations you have somebody if they come in face to face the mask with a with an ice agent. Yeah, well, first I will say like listen to the, you know, the legal experts in this field, I'd let I miss my days is a prosecutor. But I will say that, you know, these ice agents are theoretically supposed to be taking the most dangerous individuals out of our community and ideally they would have local law enforcement partners, but local law enforcement for I'm hearing across California, they don't want anything to do with these guys because these guys give local law enforcement a bad rap. And, and let me just tell you, again, I say that as a, as a family member of cops, cops in California are worried that the public may not be able to distinguish a different screen in ice agent who's trying to be a local cop and a local cop who is a local cop and that these ice guys are bringing violence on local cops that you, you may really be pissed off and want to take your anger out against an ice agent, not right. I don't condone that, but that you may be, you know, you may catch a stray, so to speak, as a local cop, just because you're a cop and they think you're an ice agent. So that there's all sorts of other issues going on here that, you know, these ice agents are affecting and people they're putting at risk, but I would, I would just say it's important, you know, to, you know, talk to local experts, know your rights. You know, obviously, you cannot just unjustifiably shoot individuals who are moving away from your direction. That's not a lot. I think she was what I forget the exact term, I think it's a constitutional observer or something somebody who's essentially there to make sure that if ice is there, it's their job to sort of get your record with your phone. Yeah, you're allowed to be in public spaces with ice. Yeah, obviously cannot like interfere if they are making a rest, you can't come between them and the person they're asking that you can record it. You can be present, you can be a witness, you can hold them, you know, to account. There's a lot that you can do and they want to do this in darkness, right? That's their goal is to have no accountability. And frankly, what I would do if I was, you know, a mayor of these cities is, is I would, you know, publicize, you know, if you have a public camera system, hell, I would live broadcast the city's public camera system where ice is so that there's maximum accountability. And maximum eyes on these guys, I don't trust them one bit. We were promised they're going to go after the most dangerous people in the community and they're doing the exact opposite they just killed an innocent woman today. Yeah, you're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right of a plan. No plan. No, we've not heard a plan. And by the way, Donald Trump couldn't run a casino. Now he wants to run a country in South America. No one believes he's doing a good job of running the country. He's supposed to govern in North America. So again, we shouldn't even give him the benefit of the doubt that he can do this. But if you step back and this is what I was saying earlier with ICE, they're doing the exact opposite of what they said. This is a complete betrayal because Donald Trump promised that he would end all wars. And now he has started. He's done the right exit. He didn't he didn't break that promise. He's doing the opposite of that promise. Strikes in Iran, Nigeria, Syria, Venezuela. He said he was going to bring costs down on day one. No one, you know, what no one would say is the first person in the world to break a campaign promise. But he's doing the opposite. A stupid pair of tax that he's put in place has jacked up the costs of everyone. He's old for 350 since making that promise. And then he said he'd release the Epstein files. Again, no one would say he's the first person in the world to break a campaign promise. He's done the opposite. He's buried the Epstein files. He's way past the deadline of when they were supposed to be turned over. So he has, you know, really been the first politician that I can remember who campaigned on one thing, not only didn't do it is doing the opposite. Right. That's the big betrayal of Donald. Yeah. He pretty much believes that whatever he does, it's fine. So go all the way back to I could shoot somebody on Fifth Avenue. It's totally fine. He just, you know, it doesn't really matter to him whatsoever what the promise was. It's just going to execute it. I mean, the thing that I find the most interesting on a national security level is he pretty much railed against anything the Bush administration did because they were very neocon forward type thinkers. And then he's literally just stealing their playbook and doing the exact same thing. I was thinking about that today. And I realized it's not, it's not, it's not, it's not that. So when Trump said Bush, he's not going to have an endless war and the question was sort of gone to Iraq. Right. It's now clear to me that what he was really saying was that Bush should have occupied Iraq and colonized it as America. Yes. His problem with Bush is not that he went into Iraq. Yes. That he didn't, you know, colonize the place and make Iraqis Americans and make their natural resources ours. That's what this is really. Yeah. That's the piece I'm interested in because to me, I mean, obviously Trump is saying the quiet part out loud with the oil element of this whole thing. It's a very resource everything. But then there's also the rare mineral element of this whole thing. I mean, I think the Trump is just looking at it through that lens alone. I don't think he cares about any other factor. I mean, at this point, do you, do you think that like he's truly motivated at this point simply by just, hey, I'm just going to steal your resources. That's the end of the story. Good luck. Or do you think there's a deeper layer to it than that? No, I mean, and so it's not about the drugs, obviously, right? No, clearly not. There's no fentanyl coming to America from Venezuela. Any cocaine going out of Venezuela is going to Europe. It's not coming to America. It's not about democracy for the Venezuelan people. He has kept in Maduro's number two. So let's just accept the argument that Maduro is a bad guy. I sure believe he is. But if you think he's a bad guy, you can't keep his hand chosen person to run the country. The reason he's keeping that person and pushing aside the pro-democracy preferred candidate that most Westerners would like to see run the country is because he doesn't think he can do a drug deal with her. He wants to do the drug deal with the person who's afraid they're going to be the next Maduro and just give us all of the resources. But again, if I step back and tell you what I'm hearing from Californians, going to war with Venezuela or using the military to go after Greenland ranks around 200 from the priorities of Californians, they would say, fuck Venezuela. What about Vallejo? What about the costs in those communities? That's not landing anywhere near top. Yeah, I'm no economist, but I don't think wars make things cheaper at home either. And actually, he broke the record for most countries bombed in a single year by a United States president with eight. So it's crazy. And then also there are reports out this morning that I read that the interim president of Venezuela is looking to purge anybody who might have worked with the US military to allow for the capture of Maduro. So that doesn't sound like somebody playing, I mean, maybe it's a game that has to be played internally, but like it doesn't sound like she's particularly interested in this like ransom list, which they've basically have said, well, we're not going to run the country anymore. We're just going to give a list of demands. And if we they don't do it, we're going to bomb them, which I think was actually what Trump said. It sounds like they don't have their shit together. It's what you're saying. Shocking, right? But also if you're to your point of this is only going to cost us money, not save us money. It's not like we invade Greenland tomorrow. And then when your landlord says the rents do, you could say, Hey, put it on Greenland's time. You know, the grocery store, you could say, Hey, Greenland's got this again, no one is convinced that the promises he made are being fulfilled by doing shit like this. No, definitely not. And I mean, I think that the only little silver lining in this stuff, I mean, I'm curious if you feel the same way is that this won't work like long term for in terms of the midterms and any sort of election. This is doing damage to the Trump administration, even though they're starting their power in a way that we all don't like. I kind of look at this stuff and go, well, at least in the end, people are going to look at this in, you know, 10 months and go, now I'm not interested in that whatsoever. And that's why he's sitting at 36% right. If you really zoom out, you can say that Trump in his first year has declared war against every country. Because if he didn't attack you militarily, he attacked you economically whatever. What the tariff tax? Yes. There's no relation. He actually, well, I think it was Caroline Levit who I think said that military options in Greenland are no, I mean, she put it at the last, but she did say we're not put it, take it off the table, which I can't even believe I'm saying these words, but is attacking a NATO ally. We would be attacking our own alliance. It's the same. I think that's probably really the goal, right? It's for I know Russia and the United States and Trump's worldview should just carve out the rest of the world and everyone else is a client state to one of those three. I think that's the Trump rule. Yeah. I think you're right about that. And I think that's maybe where you're saying it like that he sort of does overlap with Bush and like maybe Bush wasn't going down that road necessarily, but I think that doctrine sort of overlaps to a certain degree with the, you know, early 2000s neocon approach to things. I actually will say for and Bush's defense with Iraq, I do believe that like the goal was democracy in Iraq. I don't think it was our job to do. He was wrong to go in there. There was certainly oil interests that, you know, were extracted, but they did seek to have democratic elections in Iraq. So it's been a disaster, which is proven why we shouldn't do it. But Donald Trump has not shown any interest in whether Venezuela is a democracy or a dictatorship. It's all about dumb. Yeah. Yeah. As I'll speak and speaking of that, because I want to, I want to pivot to your campaign. So you've announced, you know, it's recently the, you're running for can't, you're running for a governor of California, that election is in November. So if you are to win, you will be the governor of California while Donald Trump is in the last two years of his administration. I'm not going to even pretend about any third term bullshit. What will you do as governor to protect the residents of California against this lawless administration? Yeah. So I see it as the next governor of California has two jobs. First, to keep the worst president ever out of our homes, streets and lives. It's my four year old time. I've got a four year old as well. I know what you're going to do now. And the second job is to bring a new affordable California. And I see that in affordable housing, I see it in small business growth in a state that has the highest unemployment and the lowest rate of new small businesses. And to modernize, you know, the services the state delivers. I want us to be a place where when we say it's the fourth largest economy in the world, that it's not just a stat that it means something. And then you feel like you're a shareholder in that every person in the state, not just the tycoons, not just, you know, the CEOs, but everyone in the state has skin in the game. And so that's my goal as governor. Is to economically grow the state, modernize the services, max out democracy. But on the first part that I said, the only candidate in the field who's in the arena right now, and I don't have to put an exclamation point on what I will do to be a fighter and protector on behalf of the most vulnerable. I was an impeachment manager against Donald Trump. I'm a former prosecutor. I helped lead the Russian investigation. I've got the only surviving lawsuit against this guy for what he did on January 6. So I know how to take this guy on. I think I'm just wired that way. And I see him as a corrupt actor. And I'm not going to let him go through me to hurt the most vulnerable in California. And so that's the goal for the first two years, but to be optimistic enough to see beyond him and understand that there's so much more to California than just being, you know, attacked by this guy. Yeah, and on affordability because that's a, that's the biggest topic. And I think that's probably going to be that in saving our democracy in November, the biggest issues, but a little bit more specifically because my, my influence actually live in Orange County and they have lived there for their entire lives. They bought a house in the 70s. My father-in-law was a fire fireman and my mother-in-law was a stay-at-home mom. If they were in California today, they would not be able to buy a home, at least not in Orange County. So what are some of the tangible things you think can do to help make a difference to lower those costs so that families like, like my wife's family, will be able to experience the same American dream that her family did. Yeah. I'm going to declare an emergency on day one, all across the state. The governor has done that right now in Altadena and in the politics and we say that on the one-year marker of that horrible fire that we're still rebuilding out of. But I'm going to do that in every county, all 58 counties in the state. And I'm going to tell every agency in the county, you have 90 days to approve or deny every outstanding application. So I'm going to give them a deadline because I believe that a goal without a deadline is a dream. So I'm going to bring a deadline to these agencies and we're going to surge workforce, affordable housing because right now to your point and to your family, in California, the average age for a first-time home buyer is 40 years old. And I want us to be a state where you can take your first job, have your first kid and buy your first home in the same decade. And that has to be the California promise. That's the new California promise that I'm going to make. Also, for people like your in-laws and your family members, many Californians work jobs where they don't have pensions or investment retirement accounts. And it's also costing the state a fortune in how we take care of our seniors for health care and long-term care. What I want to do is have a California prosperity plan where small businesses will have their contributions to their employees matched by the state for the middle income earners. And my hope is that we can give every senior, $1,500 to $2,000 more a month to take care of those long-term health care costs and have less of that coming from the state. So our plan is from housing to small businesses and then modernization. And on modernization, I want to virtualize as many services as possible. Believe it or not, in a great state like California, where the tech economy has defined us, there's no front door app that you can use as a Californian to get your driver's license, fill out your small business, private, file your taxes. And I want us to be a state where it's not just, you know, tech CEOs do really well, but that tech has to benefit all of us economically, but also just personally in the way that we interact with the state. And then on Maxineau Democracy, I really believe that if you can make it safe and secure, we have to vote by phone. I have seen this in West Virginia, I've seen it in Salt Lake City. If you have blockchain, is the way that you secure it? If you have an auditable paper trail where you can look at if there's any issues, we can dramatically increase the number of people who participate in our democracy. Again, we do our taxes, our health care, our banking, everything is on our phone. Through a biometric, we have to vote that way if we can make it safe and secure. So I want to be a governor that really challenges us to be a modern state that leads the way. That's very cool. And I was I was Chief Digital Officer for the State of New York. When I got there, I couldn't believe there was none of this as well. This is a problem across the country. And I'm glad that you're interested in tackling it. I got one question that I'm going to follow up with them. We'll let you go. So earlier, you said that if you were the governor of Minnesota, you would take driver's licenses away from ice. Are you pledging if this is still an issue next year, will you take driver's license away from ice? Yes, I should be on notice that we're going to prosecute you if you break the law. Your masks are not going to be welcome in our state. And your officers will not be able to drive in our state if they conduct a mask unidentified operation. Great. And then finally, how can people support you if they are interested in helping your campaign? Yeah. At Eric Swahwell, one L in the middle on all social channels. And that's also the website. But join the team and share your ideas. And the question I have, and if you want to DM us, what can I do that will bring less stress in your life? And less stress in my life would be my eight-year-old son, the four-year-old, it's not fighting. But what can I do? This is a governor to bring less stress in your life. That's the question I've been asking at our town halls. I have a town hall this Friday at Santa Monica High School. If anyone wants to join, we have one the following Friday in San Diego. So we're trying to be the most accessible campaign. And we're getting 700 to 800 people at every town hall. And it's awesome. Like being in the round in what I call like and ask me anything environment. And that's the best way I can listen, learn, and then ultimately act. That's great. Well, I know our audience will take you up on that order on that offer. So hopefully your team is ready for an influx of DM. But yeah, Congressman, thank you very much. I know this has been a crazy day. We really appreciate you taking the time. And we're going to have to have you back on soon. But thank you very much. Please. All right, Zach. Thanks, Tim. All right, let's talk to you. So much. Thank you.