LaBeouf Takes Louisiana. Plus, Colbert, Crockett, and Talarico.

yo yo yo thought warriors what is up how i learn is on it is i van layton jr and it is me rachel i have a question for you rachel uh-oh where do you go when you want to play but you don't know how to stay. Where do you go when you want to move but you don't know what to say? Where do you go when you want to play? It's Niggertown, USA. I thought I was going to get to answer the question. I'm unfamiliar with that town. I had a dream. That is a dream? The song that was playing in the background of the dream when I did everything with that song, Niggertown, USA. What were you doing? What did it look like? Just me doing different things. What did the town look like? So you know what happened at the end of the dream? I was arrested for eating illegal foods. Niggertown, USA. Niggertown, USA. I was arrested. So at the end of the dream, I went to dinner with the characters from the show Ozark. Nice. Right, Marty Burr, the Burr family. So I went to dinner with them, and when I was at dinner, it was like a Thanksgiving dinner. when I was at dinner, the cops bust in. The cops bust in and arrest everyone. They arrest them for doing what they were doing. Yeah, you were with criminals. Right, and they arrest me for eating illegal foods. What was the food? Just Thanksgiving food. Like I was eating. They said, yeah, exactly. They said, you're arrested for eating illegal foodstuffs. And then later on, it turned out that Kenya Bears, I don't know why this was, is the one that ticked them off. What you trying to say? No, nothing. I mean, it was just weird. I think because last night I was, like, watching Black-ish. I was watching Black as fuck. Black as fuck. See, look at that. Kenya Bears tipped him off. And then I see Kenya. I go, like, so I break away from them. So this is what happens. So I get arrested, and I'm, like, handcuffed. And the Fez is still searching the house. And then I lift the table up. Like, the strength of the Hulk. Lift the whole table up. Mash potatoes fly everywhere. and I run away. I get away. And then when I'm on Twitter, people are like, he is dumb. Like, he got arrested on some minor shit. He should have just, like, fought it. He would be out of jail already. Fair. But then I go to Kenya's house. And by the way, Kenya, for some reason, looks like Trayvon. Okay. It's Trayvon, but I know him as being Kenya. Okay. So Kenya looks like Trayvon. Trayvon Free. Shout out to Trayvon Free. So I go, I'm talking to Trayvon, but Trayvon asked Kenya Kenya asked Trayvon and he goes they just asked me where you were like I didn't tell them anything about they asked me where you were and he was like I saw him with the birds he's hanging out with the birds like I didn't know but they were the cops he should maybe they were the cops maybe they were undercover so after that we pieced it up and then I was like oh shit my bad dog and so then I left and when I got outside that's when nigger town USA picked up again that's the song and then you just like walked off into the distance I walked off into the distance Like, I don't know what happened. Like, what happened in the big time? I don't know what you eat or watch before you go to bed. You know what I dreamed about? What? Skiing. Oh. Which makes sense because I haven't been able to ski this year. And normally this time of year, I'm in Aspen skiing. And I haven't. So, my dream makes sense. Or I know where it's, what it's rooted in. I don't know that dreams are supposed to make sense. Sometimes. I mean, like, sometimes I can, listen, I have wild dreams. Like, I had a dream like you. I had an end-of-the-world dream the other day. I have a lot of end-of-the-world dreams. I dream a lot about tornadoes. But in the dream, long story short, it was like I turned on the water and blood was coming out of the water. What the fuck am I talking about? Just like pouring out of the water fountain. And then something else happened. And when I went outside, it was like I had a feeling. And I said, this is the end of days. And when I said it, it was like it resonated over the whole world, like the whole world, like the sky lit up and the whole world heard me say, this is the end of days. And so people started freaking out. And they were upset. And it was like, I don't want to get into all the details, but like I went to the house, I was packing stuff up. We were running. I don't know where we were going, but then it kind of became a zombie kind of thing. That's what I'm talking about. And then people were giving us tips on as you keep going, you're going to run into the zombie. They're going to be out. This is what you do. You know, kind of like a Walking Dead. Like, you knew how to kill them as things went on. But the way to defeat them, it was weird. And the zombies were only women. It was all women. And the zombie that attacked me, don't know why, was Hannah Storm. I don't know why. This is my type of shit. It was Hannah Storm. This is the type of shit that I'm talking about, Rach. It was Hannah Storm. What the fuck am I talking about? And the tip that they gave us to defeat them was, Because you have to stand up with your back against the wall, and you have to have, if you get the lime green bottle, there has to be orange in your hand. And if you get the regular bottle, and the bottle is Hidden Valley Ranch. Oh, shit. And if you get the white, like with the white, then you could do it with palm up. So people were handing out bottles of, like, Hidden Valley Ranch. and so as soon as like the walls like we were walking through this tunnel and the walls turned around and the women's zombies came up and the Hannah Storm one came after me and I grabbed two Hidden Valley Ranches whites and I put my back up against the wall and they were like all in your face and talking to you and trying to get you to let go of the bottles but I stood firm and then when you when they realized that they weren't going to get you the walls turned around and you were like on the opposite side everybody was cheering because they had they had this i know what this dream is i know what this dream is this is great the women zombies and then after that we were like but what do we do next like what do we do if they come back and then i woke up rachel let me tell you what this dream is first of all what what hit ranch what's the base of ranch mayonnaise boom right i don't eat ranch mayonnaise you got mayonnaise right you got mayonnaise you're being attacked by white women who are zombies they don't realize that they are zombies in their own culture they think they powerful but they zombies they're the walking dead afro-pessimism we'll talk about that a little later on they don't realize that they're zombies they want you to be one of them you have their secret sauce mayonnaise they're coming towards you when they come towards you they don't try to eat you they try to pull you and make you one of them they want you to be a white woman they thought they had you some years ago they were wrong and then what do you do you say no you turn around so this is the brilliance of the dream you resist white but that's not enough because now that you with your people the question is what do we do because resisting white isn't enough we gotta do our own thing or else we'll be our own walking dead zombies afro pessimism this that's a deep ass dream rachel that's a dream that's a dream that says no more one nigga no more one nigga nice it's two of us now who is the two you got another oh yeah yeah it's facts uh so i'm looking in the chat here on substack when people just said this man i listened to the pod this week do you think that rachel has a burner account in katie's group chat she was pretty quick to say it wasn't kd and wouldn't listen to any evidence almost like she was covering up for him there's a lot of people that have reached out that were disappointed not just in you but in me too because they said that we were too quick to cover up for kd because they think that it's actually him would you like to say anything else about this before we move on kevin answered and said he doesn't pay attention he was asked about it he said he doesn't pay attention to it he said he's cool with his teammates they know what's up and then of course people were like oh he definitely did it now that's a dead giveaway no it is not people are i said this on the podcast i think people are going to believe what they want to believe nothing he says is going to be enough they have made up their minds that it is him i believe it's not i am not in the group chat we all know i'm not our ex right we all know that i'm not in the group chat this is nothing other than me just looking at what's in front of me and making a conclusion that it's not him yeah is are you are you biased in any way absolutely so we can move the fuck on um people are asking questions can we criticize without erasure like tyra banks people want to know about have you seen it i have not seen it what is jay what episode are you on i'm on episode two i think okay i'm not going to give anything away. But I posted on threads. I said, I'm trying to sit with, trying to find the exact thing that I said, because this is just going to give you the response of what people are, everybody's pretty much saying. And this isn't giving it away to you. I can't find it. I'm just going to paraphrase. I said, I'm trying to gather my thoughts and sit with how I feel about the America's Next Top Model documentary. And I said, I feel like something was missing. Every response is accountability. the truth, more people from the cast. I think that collectively we all understand that what Tyra did, Tyra's a part of it. I don't know if she's a producer. I'm going to assume she is a producer on this. But I think we all understand that Tyra and the executive producer, the main one that's in it, do not take it. a little bit she does but 95% of it is her not taking accountability for how she did that show how does she do the show I don't know when I used to watch the show all I would see is you know people walking around and trying to be models they're doing different stuff I didn't realize that there was this underbelly of inappropriateness that existed well I mean I believe it was the second season where there's an issue that Tyra acts first off when they say let's talk about Shandy cycle cycle two she she has to gather her thoughts Shandy Shandy Tyra knows good and well she knows who Shandy is not only was Shandy a person on the show that had a big moment happen that you don't see it on any other episode or any other season Tyra also after it was over had her on her talk show and made her relive the very moment that people are talking about right now. So Tyra knows good and well who this person is. Shandy gets really drunk. They're in Milan. They have these Italian models. She's drinking wine. We don't know how much she's drinking, but she's clear that she's very drunk. She's making out with one of the guys in the hot tub. What guys? One of the Milan models. They bring these Italian models. They bring them back to their room. all the girls do they're all in the hot tub together you see shandy making out with one of them the next thing you know you see them in the bed and then when they wake up in the morning shandy's like crying and it makes it seem like when you were watching it in real time that shandy regretted sleeping with this guy because she has a boyfriend which she did and then they have her they had tyra sit and have a girl chat with the girls about cheating and how like everybody cheats and kind of like big sistering it and then later they have shandy call her boyfriend on camera and he just berates her he's like she's crying she's in the fetal position she's like hysterical he's crying he calls her a bitch like all this stuff right she's never the same she pretty much leaves the show after that she comes out later and says that she has no recollection after the hot tub she drank two bottles of wine. This was all on camera. And she felt like the producers should have realized that she was too intoxicated to consent. And the executive producer is basically like, I mean, we told the girls what's up from the beginning. We're always going to keep the cameras rolling. This is a part of your story. There's no accountability of maybe we should have stopped because The Bachelor in Paradise had a very similar situation. They shut down production. And then executive producer lost his job. Producers didn't come back. There was a lawsuit. Like a very similar situation happened. That's not what America's Next Top Model did. Instead, they said, well, it was part of the show. It was part of a story. Her. Her. Her having sex with this guy. Or being assaulted. But they never were like, pulled her to the side. Hey, are you sure you're okay? You look like you drank too much. Maybe you're acting out of character. Is this what you want? They just kept the, it's all on tape from the hot tub to the shower to the bed. and so it's all on tape it's all on tape but i also watch in real time it didn't air they didn't show all of that airing but they recorded the whole thing and instead of taking accountability or maybe having some reflection hindsight 2020 they were like it's a part of the show and then tyra was like well i'm an executive she's like i don't really get into the production side of things that's not my thing but then you watch three episodes of her talking about how she was involved with every single detail and the production. So, like, people are just like, there's just not a lot of accountability taken. And you have other models telling their story about things going too far, how they felt uncomfortable in certain situations, how people made them feel about their weight, their appearance, how they would play into their fears and their insecurities. And, you know, it started out one way. I think Tyra really was trying to create a show about diversity, diverse models, and give people the opportunities that she had to fight so hard for. I believe the intention was there in the beginning, but in making a TV show, the producers, the networks are like, hey, we need more, we need more, you have to raise the stakes, and it just got out of control. It's a really good documentary, but I don't know why Tyra did this and thought she was going to come out okay. Well, it's probably not a documentary at all. And I'll tell you what I mean by that. There's a new wave of documentaries, and people understand what I'm talking about because they're watching. documentaries that are um produced on a subject by the subject let's say i do a documentary on me do you know what the documentary is going to be called van the greatest pickup basketball player ever okay then i'm going to interview all of the people from la fitness and they're going to go they're going there was a three-level score that used to come in here from 08 to 2015 and it was Van Lathan and everybody's going to talk. I might get into some of the controversies at the time there was the fight there and the Hollywood Fitness and the fucking MMA guy hit the fucking guy, split his whole fucking shit. He ran out. He came back in the gym. We let him in the side door because we like to play with him and then they got mad and the whole night. So if I do my own documentary it's going to be from that purview. But if you actually had a journalist do a documentary on a subject or on a thing then what you are going to get is the controversy of that the sort of cultural considerations um then and now maybe a look back at how the culture has changed it will be really interesting to know whether or not that version of america says next top model will be palatable today and all of that stuff but you're not going to get that if the person that is doing the documentary is tyra banks yeah conversation to be had over the last couple of years five ten years whatever it's like we're kind of selling these vanity pieces about celebrities where they look back at their lives which is fine there's a place for that there's a place for that right it's a place for somebody to look back at their own life sit down talk to them get access to them get all the interviews but there's also a different type type of doc that needs to exist as well, one that takes journalism, objectivity and real investigation into the documentary. I do want to note there is an e-docu-series called Dirt and Rotten Scandals that's premiering in March that's going to be talking about America's Next Call Model. And it doesn't have Tyra. It doesn't have Tyra. It has Janice Dickinson on, who is also extremely cruel to these models, but she's not on this, noticeably. And everybody was like, where is she? And to Jade's point, she's on that one. And other models are on that one telling their story without Tyra. Also, to know, bringing this full circle, I did not know this. This is a Vanity Fair article. America's Next Top Model was created by Tyra Banks but developed by Kenya Bears. Kenya Bears. Yeah. Didn't know that. He's not in the documentary. He's been around. He's been doing TV for a very long time. I know that, but I didn't know he was tied to this. So all I'm saying is, you know, we all like docs. We all like docs about people. We like to learn more about these celebrities. but there is a tendency right now for documentaries to lean into worship of these celebrities and not really getting into who they are, real motivations. There's no journalistic thrust to them. We still have docs that interrogate things. If you guys ever saw the Alabama Solution, Perfect Neighbor, all of that stuff. If you guys watch these docs, there are still docs that are doing this, but on people that are of cultural consequence, it's changing and we're losing something. We're losing something. And they don't have to be salacious and scandalous in nature, but they should be at least neutral to a degree. Yeah. I mean, she says at the beginning of this, this was created because in COVID, Gen Z started watching reruns of America's Next Top Model while they were at home. And they were discussing it under the view of 2020 as opposed to 2003 when it came out. So they were hypercritical of it. And they were, you know, like we watched it and maybe we felt a certain way, but obviously things have changed in 2020. And so then Tyra decided to develop this. And what I feel like is it wasn't an opportunity for her to necessarily tell her story. It was an opportunity for her to get back in the spotlight because there was a tension to get out on the show. It's Tyra Banks, man. TB. And that is the one thing that they allude to is that Tyra is about Tyra. You see that from the producers that are talking about it. Yeah, but not everybody's – that's a stereotype. What's a stereotype? You're like, yeah, I said Tyra's about Tyra, and you're like, yeah, she's a model. Well, I don't mean to say that, like, models are inherently self-centered, but it is a profession that deals in self. It's like it's about – it deals in self for the good and for the bad, right? it's something that probably makes you hypersensitive to certain criticisms about yourself which then maybe puts you into a defensive posture in a time that other people, it's not that much different than this you come on here, you talk, you try to connect with the people, they put pictures of your mama on the Reddit and then you're like, what the fuck is going on right, so like you come up here and you try your best to deliver a podcast deliver infotainment and infotainment and do all of this stuff, you sing songs for people you do all of this stuff, then what do they do? they kick you in your fucking nuts for it, call you a motherfucking sell out the van sucks youtube videos all about the worst moment that you had on the podcast when you said a whole bunch of shit you didn't even mean it you hurt your co-host's feelings you love her and what do people do it's just getting you fucking get your entrails out they get the of your blood all over their neck and so like sometimes you have you get a little defensive so i understand that i'm not setting myself apart from that i understand what she's saying but she's like a model it's probably a fraught thing to be particularly in that time way to bring it back I apologize Niggatown USA okay Jesse Jackson has died it's difficult to do justice to this life Jesse Jackson is and was stalwart in the American movement he was involved from the ground up not from the very ground up but in an unbelievably important time in the freedom and citizenship of black people he devoted his life to evolving the understanding of American existence and he did it with politics we had Abby Phillip on talking about this he did it with politics that were always progressive he did it with politics that were about health care, about housing, about economic justice. He did it with politics that realized that there were all types of people. Of course, the quilt analogy that he would use, all types of people that had wants, needs, concerns, rights that were not being addressed by the American system. And he called upon all of those people to thread together this amazing American quilt where we could understand our similarities and understand the similar goals and wants and needs that we had and let that bind us together. It wasn't essentialist in any way in terms of from a racial or even class or even political lens. Jesse had a message for everyone. And that message that he had for everyone is what he thought was the strength of America. So it was a life well lived. Obviously, it's not a perfect life, which is, you guys, everyone's had their controversies and all of that stuff like that. But it is a life dedicated to people. Yeah. No, absolutely. I'm so glad, one, that Abby Phillips wrote the book, A Dream Deferred, that explored his political legacy. but also that we had her on to be able to talk about it. And if you guys haven't read the book yet, you definitely should. Because as, you know, we were preparing to have her on, and even when she was on this podcast, it really made me think of, I guess, my thoughts and relationship to Jesse Jackson. And I don't mean, like, personal because I never met him, but I just mean of kind of the perception that I have of him because by the time I was born, he was not nearly as much of a public figure or in the eye or in like front and center like he had been prior to 1988. I'm not saying he wasn't involved. Obviously, the Rainbow Coalition existed, and he was still somebody whose opinion mattered, who was there front and center fighting for the same rights and for social and racial justice and economic justice in the ways that he did before. But he just wasn't as present as he had been. And, I mean, he's one of the most influential leaders of our time. But growing up, you didn't see it as much. And I think that there were a lot of negative narratives that followed him, I feel like, that I saw. I'm not going to name them, but more than the fact that he is a hero and a fighter and somebody who, whether you want to question him or not, you cannot question the fact that he dedicated decades and decades and decades. He is someone who carried on the teachings and the mission and the vision and even moved it into his own way post-Civil Rights Movement, right? Like after Civil Rights Movement, it's like we've lost so many leaders. Where do we go from here? It's like are you going to enter maybe the Black Panther Party or in politics or activism? And I feel like Jesse Jackson took what he had learned, what those beliefs were, molded it into something that he believed, which you referenced with the quilt and how everybody represents a patch and all these marginalized people are separate patches on this quilt. And you can't fight the fight alone. You have to all come together to be able to have an impact. And it's amazing that that message was, you know, he started it in 1984 when he ran for president, carried into 1988, and how relevant that is now. You know, it just makes me wonder if we could maybe embody some of that, where we would be not just as a party as Democrats, but also just like as a country. Hmm? Oh, Democrats. Okay. I mean, yeah, sure. I'm registered as independent, but left-leaning, whatever. But my point being is on the left side. But if we could embody some of this and come together as one and be more inclusive and live out, I guess, the vision that Jesse Jackson had beyond just keeping hope alive, but us all coming together. It's crazy that, you know, almost 40 years later, this is so relevant and we're still not doing it. Well, I mean, it's always going to be relevant. Yeah. The hope to me was that America could embrace this sort of progressive populism that Jesse Jackson embodied, where we talk about human rights as being the backbone of American existence and the proletariat, the workers, the people being the focus of American domestic and foreign policy. right we we've joked about it we've talked about it as i talk about housing as right as we talk about uh you know freedom and justice policing justice voting rights uh just economic reform all these things as being fundamental parts of existence not things that you negotiate with power but things that power continuously improves on delivering for you the issue is when you are continuously negotiating your humanity with people, what they're actually doing is figuring out ways to take from you and make you less human. But if you can hold power to account where their job is to make sure the first thing they do is make sure that your humanity and your rights and your expression are prioritized, then everything else, the competition and all of that stuff, we can then talk about how we want to do that. But we do it backwards and we have been doing it backwards. We've prioritized American capitalist expression and consumerism above the basic needs of people. And when you do that, what you're really doing is giving your government the opportunity to take just a little bit more from somebody else than they're taking from you. And that to me is not the message that Jackson or King or a lot of these other thinkers from that, that's not what they were talking about. What they were talking about is understanding people as people and building from that idea out. We will continue to have this conversation in perpetuity if we are unable to hold power to account. So if you guys protect your politicians because they're from your hometown, if you protect your politicians even because they look like you, if you protect your politicians for all of these reasons that don't have anything to do with what they are delivering to you, you will continue to see that people will use the insulation that you give them to grab just a little bit more power every generation, every election, every time. It's telling you. So, you know, rest in peace to Jesse Jackson. Say this about Jesse as well. Man. Did you meet him? I never met him. Tell you this. I desperately wanted to play I desperately wanted to post talk about things that you would have done in 2013 that you wouldn't do now I desperately wanted to post Eddie Murphy as Jesse Jackson on my Instagram I desperately wanted to post it post Jeff yeah I wanted to post because okay so if we're talking about things that couldn't be done that's something that couldn't be done correct it's not what did Eddie have on Saturday Night Live? What was that magic? Can anyone explain that? There are certain people that on Saturday Night Live had this magic that Will Ferrell had it. Eddie Murphy had it. What was it about Eddie on Saturday Night Live that just made every single thing he did super amazingly insanely funny? Even the James Brown in the hot tub burn my flesh even that it's nuts but uh i was advised against posting yeah because it uses a pretty nasty slur that you know it was a part of jesse jackson's story um but that's as much as i thought about all the things that jesse jackson did and said i also thought about the fact that eddie murphy as jesse jackson was part of my introduction Why can't I find a picture of it? Of Eddie doing the song. Don't, you guys, don't, you know. No, no, no, don't. No, I know. I'm just trying to look at it. It was funny. Like, it was funny. Well, I'm so glad, man. Oh, here it is. The title alone. No, you can't. No, I know. I know. I know, I know, I know, I know, I know. I don't want to talk about Justin Jackson that way because everybody is flawed and everybody has made mistakes along the way. And he dedicated his whole life to a particular mission that we already noticed is relevant to today. And that's what I want to, we want to honor and focus on, which is why you could not post that. It's just what, when I think, I just can't think about Jesse without thinking about that. Okay, well, you got it off here. We know what you wanted to do. It's just, it's hysterical. I went back and watched all of Eddie's old, Gumby, just, Eddie is just a brilliance. it man just brilliant brilliant brilliant brilliant never really been another Eddie never been another Eddie Murphy I don't know how we got on Eddie Murphy from this but never been another Eddie no one no one is no one no one to me no one has been at the peak of Eddie Murphy funny at the peak of Eddie Murphy charisma at the peak of the Eddie Murphy experience no one has gotten there yeah no one I agree no one has gotten to that the peak of Eddie with like all of it like comedy acting yeah eddie could carry an entire scene yeah yeah yeah like no one has gotten to that period like there you go come on uh okay another quick hitter we're moving on by the way just let you guys know we have cory bush on the show today she's on the show we're gonna talk to cory bush uh but i have something really important to talk about and it's super duper important now Now, I know that I sometimes I know that sometimes I get on here and I like, you know, bear my heart and evangelize and all that stuff like that. You guys, I really don't try to do that. I really it's just sometimes I get carried away. I don't mean to get on here and either preach or, you know, shove these issues down your guys's throats. But there is something that is serious. And if you never took me seriously before, take me serious now. There is something seriously that is seriously attacking Louisiana right now. and people understand how much I love my home state people get how much I care about the people that live in South Louisiana particularly and what they're going through and right now there is a terror in Louisiana that we have not seen in a long time and his name is Shia LaBeouf he has to be stopped he must be stopped I'm calling upon all of the powers of the Louisiana diaspora from every part of this nation I'm calling upon Anthony Mackie Wendell Pierce Lil Wayne, all cash money all no limit young boy, Boosie everyone, everyone put your armor on, come home Lynn Whitfield, we need you everybody that's out there Bramford Marcellus John Baptiste, everyone put your armor on come home. Sean Penn drove around in a boat after Katrina. One of the wildest things I ever saw before in my life. Sean Penn got in a boat with a shotgun and went out and said, I'm going to save Negroes if the government won't do it. Sean Penn, we need you now. Because over the last two weeks, I have gotten text after text before it became a news story of people saying to me, Van, we need your help. We need your help because there is a white hurricane going from bar to bar to bar in New Orleans, from street to street to street in New Orleans, terrorizing people, challenging them to fights, dancing, rapping when not asked. okay dressed up in garb put some of the pictures out here show some of the stuff that's going on why hurricane shia has decided to descend upon one of the cultural centers of the world and take this city's psyche hostage people are scared do you know how much it takes to scare a motherfucker from new orleans do you know how much it takes i'm sure it's almost impossible They've been seen everything. They've been through everything. But Shia LaBeouf right now is being banned from bars, from churches. We don't know what to do. People don't know what to do. People have no clue. So I'm calling upon all the Knights, everybody from out there that's from Louisiana, Yaya, Luke James, everybody out here that's getting money that's from Louisiana, Hurricane Chris, Jared Leto. No, not you. Jared Leto, we don't want your help. But like everyone that's from the state, the what's the girls, the the reality show girls. Oh, Nader. The Naders, the Nader girls, all everybody. We have to come together right now, because if we don't stop Shia, Shia might stop us. I haven't seen anything like this before. He's got to be stopped. It's going too far. Have you booked your plane ticket? No, not yet. Because you should be leading the charge. While you're calling all these people, which I would say, guys, everybody just relax and stay home. While you're leading the charge, you need to at least be, you know, like show by example that you are willing to go down there and sacrifice your time. God forbid life with the danger the way that you're describing it. And stop Shia LaBeouf. Does that say the same right? This is my problem with you. Okay. So let me get into this. This is my problem with you. this is not the way it goes okay so like so you can't i can't call on you so you can't the whole thing you reached up you reached like the street port and brought down hurricane chris hold on hurricane chris hey baby this is my issue so my issue is this because you haven't seen enough movies you don't know how this goes okay so let me give you some examples i saw holes i've seen it too so so uh let me let me tell you how this goes and almost anything where you have this type of multiversal threat did the avengers go alone no they combined all their heroes when it was thanos did the kids from dairy haha you watch that did they go alone no they got all the losers together and they went to fight pennywise this is the pennywise of louisiana shia labeouf okay did frodo go by himself to get rid of the ring no he got a bunch of people together and they went on a trek together because Rachel we are stronger together so what I'm saying is the quilt Jesse Jackson and the quilt is what I'm saying so for me personally for me to go down there and face this multiversal threat alone it seems like you want him to fuck over me because right now his strength is at altar do you see what this nigga was wearing put the fucking picture up of Shia LaBeouf like put the picture up look what he's got on look at the shit that he's got on look at the stuff that he's doing he's he's like he went and then he's he's slick because after all the bad press came out shia then went and bought african-american art from a local artist in new orleans that's different that's the type of shit during black history month that's the type of shit that he knows can capture the heart of the lower ninth ward right it might be people from uptown New Orleans East, it's like we fuck with Shia. So then when I go down there, I got to fight them too. So I need some other saints from New Orleans to come with me to talk to the people where they're from because I'm afraid this virus could spread a little bit northeast to Baton Rouge or northwest. New Orleans is east. It's northwest. A little bit northwest to Baton Rouge. I'm not telling you to go by yourself. I'm telling you to lead the charge. I'm saying if you're calling on all these people, you have to be the one front and center to lead them. You've got to be at the top of the quilt, okay? You're the one who's calling on all these people to come there. Listen, did you see all the – it's so funny how you call it a virus that he's infecting people because it just made me think of all the coverage that I was seeing where he was taking pictures with people. He was doing local news interviews. He rarely does interviews talking about how he likes the people and the culture and everyone's been so happy in the dancing. I get how people can be caught up in the hurricane of Shia. He really seems to be as much terror as he's causing. He also, or havoc, I should say. He is also very much so warming up to the people, getting the people to warm up to him. So you think I'm bullshitting you? About what? About people reaching out about Shia. Look at this. Look at the text I'm getting. Look. these are people reaching out telling me about shia i believe people reaching out telling me about shia they want they they want me to act on their behalf i'm not from the woods i'm from baton rouge i can tell you right now that shia first of all we don't have as much shit to get into in baton rouge let's be honest okay okay so let's be honest shia i you know if shia want to go around and he want to and he want to dance around cross the tracks by all means but it's not really a place in Baton Rouge where you're going to go put your shit on and, you know, if Shia's going to go to, like, I don't know, fucking Spanish Moon or some shit like that and, like, go around, go up on the yard, they might fuck with Shia on the yard, right? They probably saw holes, too. You know, all of the shit that he was into, Disney shit, but he wasn't allowed into churches because of the way that he's acting, and I'm saying right now, it is a desperate and dire situation, and the Louisiana diaspora, besides Jared Leto, we don't want your help. Jared Leto you are Shia in Jared Leto's clothing we know what you got going on no help from Jared Leto but everyone else even the people that have like called New Orleans like home John Goodman lives there a lot Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie you party in the city help clean the city up Shia all of this stuff Gary Chambers is down there right now whipping votes doing stuff Gino, like Walter McLaughlin, get all the saints together, everybody together. And we meet at Moro's, great restaurant in New Orleans. We meet at Moro's. We come up with a plan. We take out Shia. That's it. We don't have to spend too much time on it. In all seriousness, he's an addict. He's an alcoholic. He has been in rehab. Rachel, look at this picture. Yes. He is an alcoholic. Look at this picture. Look at that fucking picture. With the beer in his hand. He is grabbing himself. He is an alcoholic. He has been in rehab. He has had issues that span years all related to alcohol. I really hope he does get the hope he needs, whether it's with the crusade that you're leading down there to stop him or through somebody else. He clearly needs some help, and I hope he gets it. I hope he gets it too, but right now we got to keep the main thing the main thing. And the main thing is that we need to be able to celebrate Mardi Gras in peace, okay? We need to be able to celebrate Mardi Gras in peace and not with the motherfucker from Transformers running around setting Bourbon Street on fire. It's not going to work. So I hope that he gets the help too. But like on the Chappelle show, we did help him. We whooped his fucking feet. Yeah, I mean. We kicked him in his shit. That is like, you know what I mean? Remember that? Rest in peace, Charlie Murphy. He's like, damn, Rick really needs help. I feel like we did help him. Kick him in his motherfucking thighs so he can't walk around Bourbon Street. Oh, interesting. the messiest fucking primary ever it's getting real messy donnie yeah the mess continues uh steven colbert says that cbs blocked his james tallarico interview over uh fears from the fcc about equal time so this dispute centers on this fcc guidance that will require broadcast shows to offer equal airtime to all candidates if they feature one even on entertainment or talk programs which narrows a long exemption for late night shows and interviews Thoughts Okay. What's the smirk? We need some sound here. What's the smirk? Who do you want sound from first? You know what? I want to know. You give this to the people. Okay. Then you have to add the Jasmine Crockett part to it because that's the other part, right? That is the part that matters. That's the part. So because, like, the FCC thing, the equal time, we know it's been a law for a long time. They're trying to enforce it. We know that late-night talk shows have been exempt for 20 years. I don't think we're going to actually explain that to people because I don't know that they do know. Okay, so this is a rule, the equal time of when, what is it, when you're both running, when it's campaign season and you have candidates running for the same office, they're supposed to receive equal airtime on networks. That's an old rule. But in 2006, I think it was when Jay Leno was interviewing Arnold Schwarzenegger. That was something that was brought up because they didn't also give time to who he was running against. And so they won that. And it was decided that like daytime shows like The View or late night shows like Colbert, Kimmel or something like that, or Jay Leno in that case, were exempt from it. also news reporting is exempt from it. Like the government can't tell you what you can report on or that you have to give equal time to who you're reporting on. So those are the exemptions. But we know the FCC, even though it is an independent agency, that was listed on their website. They removed it when the Senate questioned Brendan Carr, who's the chair of the FCC. They removed that from their website that they were an independent agency because he says he's supposed to take direction from the Trump administration. That is not true. But he is saying that that is true, and that is what the SEC is supposed to do. So in January, they said that they were going to start monitoring daytime television shows, late-night talk shows, and kind of like strengthening their grip on the media as far as giving equal time to candidates. So that's that when it comes to it. So Donnie already explained what the issue was with Colbert. The issue was? And James Talarico. But they're kind of saying that the SEC has opened an investigation on The View based on them having James Tallarico on earlier this year. And now they're doing it again with James Tallarico, with Colbert. So there's also this narrative that they're specifically doing it to James Tallarico because they feel threatened by him. James Tallarico has also alluded to that as well. Jasmine Crockett has been on Stephen Colbert multiple times. She has been on The View, but not necessarily. I think she has been on The View since campaign season, actually, but not Colbert, if I'm correct. So that's kind of what all the hoopla is about this. So I don't know if we have both sounds, Johnny, but if we do, immediately Jasmine Crockett is asked about this situation because you guys know they put it online. Last time I looked, it had almost 7 million views. I'm sure it's more than that now. And then Jasmine Crockett, when she first heard about it, responded this way. We did receive information suggesting that the federal government did not shut down this message, number one. That is my understanding that the federal government didn't shut this down. And we will do an official statement once we get another official statement that we have to say this way to be coming from Paragon. We will read what they say and then we'll go from there. We are understanding that Comer, either Comer or President of the United States, signing the language that they come there. It was because of a fear that the FED may say something to them and that there may have been advice to just have me on. And then they could clear the issue. So it was my understanding that someone somewhere decided we just don't want to do that. Instead, we're going to just do it this way. She then went on with Jen Psaki. We actually received a phone call, and that was a little bit earlier today. And in that call, they explained that they actually told CBS that they could go ahead and move forward with the interview of James Tallarico. So they just needed to offer me equal time. I did not get a request from the Colbert show to go on. As you know, I've been on Colbert multiple times. And frankly, if we would have gotten an offer, that would have been great. But we're in the middle of early voting. So I'm kind of focused on being in sexes at this moment. And I don't know what to believe, that's for sure. But I got that phone call as I was out talking to voters. So there's so many things to talk to you about again, but they called you today, but they decided not to air the interview last night. You've been on Colbert a number of times, as you just said. Did you have any issue when they were going to air the interview last night, when they promoted it or when it was supposed to air, or did anyone from your campaign? No, we didn't have an issue. I mean, we've never run into an issue with Colbert. And even as you talked about the view, you know, supposedly this FCC complaint came about because I had more time than Mr. Tallarico when I went on there after I declared my candidacy. So, you know, listen, I will tell you that I have no love for Barry Weiss. I have no love for Brendan Carr whatsoever. But I do think that, as you also mentioned, Kimmel, it is important that we resist in this moment. And so there were a number of options that could be put on the table. And frankly, you know, the late show decided that this was the option. And I think that it was a good strategy. I mean, look at what happened when they tried to censor Seacott. We found out that you could get a lot more views. So I think it probably gave my opponent the abuse he was looking for. So I think it's probably better that he didn't get on and that they went straight to streaming because we know that when we resist and when we know that it seems like they're trying to change the rules and bend the knee to this president, that it backfires in a historic fashion. So she changed the opportunity a little bit between the first and the second one. Not really. See, I believe she did because not the first part of what she says when she's talking to Jen Psaki on MSN now, but the latter part of you have to resist that there's this that it was a good strategy i believe it she's saying you can't bend the knee you've got to stand up to what the trump administration is doing at brendan carr fcc all of that changes their tune because in the first statement if that had just been the statement alone to me that was problematic because why for the very things that you said in the latter part in that MS Now interview, why would you then believe and take the word of Brennan Carr or CBS when you know what time it is over there? You know what they're about. You know the ultimate goal for them. So it seems beneficial to you to take that in order to then use that as a part of a campaign strategy or, you know, to put you against James Tallarico in a certain way. if that had been her only statement i would have taken issue with it i believe in the second part she was trying to retract some of what she said because she saw how it looked because at the end of the day it makes no sense for you for everything that you stand for to take the word over them versus colbert or even james tallarico's team unless it was beneficial for you in the campaign am i bugging i don't think that like i'm being completely real i read that a totally different way. The second interview? Well, when she says, I have no love for Bari Weiss and Brendan Carr, it seemed like she said that as a pretext to say, but they were right. When she said that, I agree with you. I thought she was going to say, but she doesn't. She says, I think it was a good strategy. She says that, I have no love, and then she goes on to talk about how the strategy was good, what Colbert did. The strategy was good for Colbert to bring more attention to the interview. is what he's saying. But then she also talks about, yes, and to bring attention to what the FCC was trying to do, but also she says, we have to resist. We can't bend the knee. That's what she goes on to say. I think the way, and you guys, if I'm wrong, I'm sincerely wrong here. I'm being for real. The way I read that, you know what? Donnie, play that again. The second part, because I understand what you mean. Play that again. Listen, I will tell you that I have no love for Barry Weiss, I have no love for Brendan Carr whatsoever. But I do think that, as you also mentioned, Kimmel, it is important that we resist in this moment. And so there were a number of options that could be put on the table. And frankly, you know, the late show decided that this was the option. And I think that it was a good strategy. I mean, look at what happened when they tried to censor Seacott. We found out that you could get a lot more views. So I think it probably gave my opponent the abuse he was looking for. So I think it's probably better that he didn't get on and that they went straight to streaming because we know that when we resist and when we know that it seems like they're trying to change the rules and bend to the knee of or bend the knee to this president, that it backfires in historic fashion. so what I read that is is that they that the strategy and that the strategy that was used was used for to their ends which is to get Tallarico more shine and that she's at least a little uncomfortable with that that the strategy that she would have preferred would have been for her to go on for her to go on so like it seems to me that the way I read that is what she was actually saying was the c-cop thing ended up becoming a bigger story because of the perceived censorship from the trump administration just like this ended up being a bigger story because of perceived censorship so i don't know that she necessarily spoke to the idea which is to me the central idea here uh which is that the crockett campaign is alleging that the Colbert show and Stephen Colbert is in the bag for Tyler Rico. What she's essentially saying is that this is not a story about the FCC getting involved, Donald Trump and his FCC getting involved in telling a late night host who and who he cannot put on his show by changing the equal time rule to include late night which is a way that the administration can make sure that who they want to get on these shows can get on these shows right because if you change that rule and you do the equal time law it's not just about jaz and crockett that you would have to put on there you got to put pax you got to put paxton on there you got to put corning on there when you if you do that what you're going to trigger is all those guys having to be on there and look if they want to put those dudes on there cool but the reality is that these late night hosts have typically because of what they do in their jobs been able to put on who they want to have substantive conversations with because it's not news, right? It's celebrity and all of that stuff like that, right? But that's not what she took issue with. She didn't really take issue with the Trump administration's assault on the autonomy of the late night host. She took issue on the fact she took issue with the fact that she felt like that they are conspiring against her. Now, Now, you know, I guess two ways to read it. One way to read it is that, just honestly, one way to read it is that it is smart campaigning to jump in and take advantage of this entire brouhaha that's happening with the FCC, Brendan Carr, and Stephen Colbert. and say, look, I have a place in this too. The Colbert show could have just been like, hey, we're going to put Jazz and Crockett on with the equal time situation, and that would have been a way to fix it, right? That would have been a way to fix it. The other way to look at it is that this is a fundamental problem that we are confronting in our politics. and the problem is that you have people who are um playing the politics rather than concentrating on the main thing to me concentrating on the main thing is that the president is trying to use the fcc to determine who people can put on their shows the president is attempting to do that and I don't know, it was an odd response to it. Okay, so again, for me, and I understand your thinking, I interpret it just a little different. I think that if we had just had that first response, I would agree with when you say there's two ways to think of it, number two with you in what she was doing. When I listen to the second response, I look at this as, I think I think that she is salty that it ended up getting so many views I think that she's salty that it like James Tallarico is the one the story surrounds where I think that where I don't agree with is because in the first part she is totally accepting what the administration and CBS is saying in the second part she's not she's also saying listen we have to resist them we have to stand up We saw what happened with Kimmel. Then she goes on to say, and this is where I say the salty part is, we saw how many viewerships that Seacott got online. He's going to get a bunch of viewerships as well. And I do believe that she wishes that that could happen for her. But in the second part, I do believe she's also saying, I don't agree with what's happening over there or what they're doing, and we have to stand our ground, and we can't let what happened with Kimmel, and we can't bend the knee. We can't do those things. So she's changed her tune in not believing what the administration was saying. The problem with this is, and see, I don't think that Colbert and his team were doing this to boost Tallarico. I think they saw this as an opportunity to shit on the Trump administration and their employer CBS. Whatever was said in the meeting with the lawyers, whether the lawyers said flat out, you can't do it, which is what Colbert is saying that they were told, or it's what CBS is saying where they're like, no, we advised you on what the rule is and what we think you should do. Whatever happened, Colbert, I think, was genius in saying, I'm going to use this as an opportunity to show how they're trying to suppress free speech. So it doesn't matter who said what. He's like, I'm going to use this as an opportunity to show free speech and bring attention to an issue with the Trump administration and to show how corrupt it is and how authoritarian it is and then put this online. And it just happened to be James Tallarico. I actually don't think, and I could be wrong. I mean, we'll never know. I don't think they were like, ah, this is a way to boost James Tallarico. I think that they were like, this is a way to shit on him. It wouldn't have mattered who it would have been. Yeah, I think that's what I'm saying. I think Colbert and them were like, this is a way to shit on CBS and the Trump administration. Now, for Jasmine Crockett, I can see as you're in a campaign that is contentious and we're getting down to the wire and it's the week when early voting open, that your competitor is getting an opportunity to be on a national stage. He's the center point of a huge storyline that is pretty bipartisan when it comes to free speech. And now people are voting on that and 7 million people are getting to watch it and see him. Because what is James Tallarico's biggest thing was against him is that people don't know him. This kind of put him in the spotlight. So I think that she's salty that the result is it boosts him. But I think that she's still standing against the Trump administration. Yeah. No. Well, they disagree. Yeah. I mean, you think that she believes you think just to be clear, you think that she believes that the Trump administration advised them on or the legal team at CBS advised them that they needed to do equal time. They didn't want her. they really want to boost Tallarico so they were like this is what we'll do we'll do what the Seacott thing did with the 60 minute special. That's what she said. And that's what you think that she's saying. Yeah. I don't. And by the way if that is the case then let me put it to you this way I understand that through the lens of politics. Yeah she's not allowed to be upset by that if that's what she believes. What do you mean? If she believes that Colbert is rooting for Tallarico and wanted to uplift him and use this as an opportunity to do it, as his competitor, can't she be upset about that? Well, yeah, that's a, she can be upset about that. That's a hell of a leap to make, though. Yeah, I don't think that's true, and I don't think that's what she's saying. This is where we disagree. Okay, that's a hell of a leap to make, though, if that is the case. Well, that is, she has essentially said that, right? We disagree on that part. Okay. I don't think that she's saying Colbert did that. I think she's saying that Tallarico benefited from them wanting to shit on the administration and CBS. But what she's also saying is that the very simple fix would have been just to put her on the show. She did say that. Right. And so they didn't want to do that. And so the fact that they didn't want to do that, to me, intimates that they have a special interest in James Tallarico and that what they did was to take the splashiest approach to getting James Tallarico more eyes and more viewers. And then she, in my opinion. Yes, that's where we differ is the why Colbert didn't want to. In my opinion, she didn't make an intellectual case as to why they would do that. she said we've seen that work for people in generating a lot of attention in the past we've seen that work and the easiest thing to do was just put me on the show you put me on the show but once again you put her on the show you got to put corner on the show you got to put packs on the show like i'll ask around about the equal time law and why maybe somebody wouldn't just want to say hey because the easiest thing would have been like blah blah blah so no yeah you're gonna put everybody on yeah so so then and if they don't want to do that then they go hey we just take it off linear and because just so people know that equal time you said this the equal time that only covers like what the fcc governs which is what's going to be on these networks and the radio and all that stuff like that so you put it on youtube do whatever you want right um so in this situation i think i feel like once again i'm maybe reading it wrong i feel like she was pretty clear and what it was that she was trying to say. I will say this. That's probably smart politics as far as this whole thing is surrounding James Tallarico in this really important time during this race. Let me figure out a way to make sure that I'm not left out of this conversation, that this is not just a conversation between James Tallarico, Stephen Colbert, and the Trump administration where people have all of this, I guess, you know, good feeling towards them or this warmth towards them because it looks like they're being persecuted. Right. But in this particular race, the way that this race has been going, the how fraught things seem to be down there and how nasty it's getting. it was interesting to see that the left particularly the democratic establishment which is what both of these candidates kind of represent um could not be on message against overreaches from donald trump that what we are doing and what we are increasingly doing And what is going to be tremendously destabilizing if the Democrats do not find a way to put their arms around it is we are having identity brawls across the party. It is leftist versus centrist. It is black versus white. It is black women versus black men. It is this essential battle for who purely has the interests of a party in mind without very many people asking the question, for me at least, whether or not that party purely has your interests in mind. What I would say is the white male candidate, the black woman candidate, the black gay candidate, the black leftist candidate, the black centrist candidate, all of those things come secondly to whether or not we are looking robustly into these people's history in terms of what they voted for, what they've advocated for, who their donors are, what their priorities are. all of that stuff is the thing but god damn we are in our corners just waiting for the bell to ring so we can fight it out in the middle i agree with you but i don't think that i agree with you on the whole identity thing but i think that's separate from this fcc thing because this issue doesn't have to do with identity in particular you are right that battle's happening i sent you a post that on threads of someone posting in favor of black man in favor of talarico like let's put him in, and the comments were attacking him because he doesn't necessarily use his platform for politics, and it was particularly black women who were, like, upset at him. And it's like, well, if he wants to vote or believes in James Tallarico, why is it wrong for him to say that? But I don't think, but I do want to separate the two because I think what you're talking about is a different conversation, and I agree with you when it comes to the way the Democrats are using identity politics versus what happened with the FCC. What Jasper Crockett should have done in this instance is I wish she would have completely erased her first response because her first response was totally saying, well, I got a call that this isn't what the FCC and Trump administration did. So I wish she would have erased that and stood with, you know, Tallarico and Colbert show and what they were saying and said, we have to resist this. And then she could have been like, but it does kind of sucked it. he's getting all these views the week of early voting. People would have understood that. People would have been like, yeah, the timing of it does kind of suck for you and your campaign. And I think she tried to fix that in the second statement, but I know we agree. We have to agree to disagree on that. But I don't think that this particular issue is identity politics, but it is an issue. And I agree with you. What happens for each candidate if they were to lose? if Tallarico loses what does it say if Tallarico loses this primary what does it mean if Jasmine Crockett loses this primary what does it mean I don't know is it higher leverage for either of them to you I don't know if I can say what does it mean I think it's bigger I think the stakes are if Jasmine Crockett loses I think it looks worse for her than it would if James Tallarico loses Why do you feel that way? Well, because she's a national politician. She's done more on a bigger stage than him. I feel like she has more of a bigger presence. I feel like she has a bigger voice. She has bigger impact because of where she's been positioned versus him. Remember, his biggest thing against him, his hurdle, is that people don't know him as much. So what does it say about Jasmine Crockett if having more experience, having a bigger presence, presence, even though he'll be representing whoever will be representing Texas, it'll be on a national level. What does it say that she loses her seat and loses her voice, not just in the state of Texas, but nationally? The stakes are bigger. It's bigger for her. Whereas James Tallarico is a local politician and, you know, he's a rising star and I want to see him in office in some sort of capacity because I do like a lot of the things that he says and believes and fights for, but it's still local. I just think Like, you know, I would hope that if she does lose for whatever reason, she runs again. But I think it's just the fall is harder. You don't think so? I think two things. One, Jasmine Crockett's reputation is well established, right? Yes, Matt Rogers, it is. It's well established. I mean, I'm not talking about her reputation necessarily as being whatever they say she is. I mean, we know Jasmine Crockett. She has name recognition. Like, her reputation is well established. Who she is is well established. There are a plethora and a litany of things that Jasmine Crockett can do if she does not win this primary, right? She's not going to stop being Jasmine Crockett overnight. James Alarico, if he loses the primary, could go down the road of Beto O'Rourke. to where he becomes the darling of new democratic texas politics for a while not just locally almost not at all locally more nationally where everyone looks at him as maybe the future of it but he becomes another guy who's a cool dude but cannot win big races in texas and then a couple of years later we don't remember who the fuck he is. His reputation and who he is is still it's like we know James Tallarico but I just feel like in the overall cultural conversation he will be less relevant than Jackson Crockett going forward. She just has a more dedicated group of people behind her. She has, I think that with him it will be easier for him to fall fall into the also-rans as it will be for her. Do you think that it will be, if Jasmine loses versus if James loses, who do you think has a better chance of getting back on that national stage after a loss? She's never going to be off the national stage. She's on the national stage forever now. I mean holding office. You mean holding a national office? Like, what she has, she's holding a national office. She's a congressman. But her district, she's leaving. She's done, yeah. I mean, I think that he could probably get to that point. But if we're talking about this cannot be devoid of just how difficult it is to win Senate in Texas. Like if you're talking, if we're having a conversation about whether or not this either one of these people can be a senator, we're not having a conversation even necessarily just about them. We're having a demographic conversation. We're having electoral conversations that exist in Texas. we're talking about whether or not things in Texas can be changed or will be changed enough for either one of them to be senators. Now, does that mean that Tallarico cannot be Governor Tallarico or that she cannot be Governor Crockett? Does that mean that like they can't be congressman or congresswoman or they can't head the DNC or, you know, start some political organization that is very important? like how you make political change, how you put these ideas into the world, what do you do to really affect people outside of this? Sure, but if we're talking about specifically being the senator, a senator from Texas, there's a lot both candidates can do, but there's also a lot of change that's going to have to come from outside of their campaigns to make that a reality. You said he'll be a darling. What did you say, she'll be? What do you mean? You said if he loses, he'll be like a darling. you could see him do it being the Beto O'Rourke. No, no, that's not what I said. What I said was that he, I'm saying that Beto O'Rourke was the darling. Yeah. He was the darling for a time. And then when it became obvious, well, not obvious, when it became a reality that Beto O'Rourke couldn't win bigger office, came real close, came real close, they moved on. One of the reasons why that happened to O'Rourke and why it happens to guys like that, O'Rourke, I'm saying O'Rourke. The reason why it happens to guys like that is there's really no, they don't have a base of culture behind them. They don't have like a bunch of people that look at them as specifically valuable because of who they are. Jasmine Crockett has withstood direct attacks from the Trump administration, in my opinion, because she is a black woman and she's fought back against that. People are never going to forget that. So that means that if Jasmine Crockett decides that she wanted to become the biggest political podcaster, I'm not saying that that's what's going to happen with her in a couple of years. If she wanted to, you know, write and sell books and run organizations and be a part of that, I feel like there's a cultural person that she has that is not going to go away. OK, I get it. So like the states are a little bit different in that. Maybe Tallarico, maybe this is the beginning of his rise. and maybe with how destabilizing things are on the MAGA right now, that there will always be people who want a Tallarico to succeed. But I'm just saying there have been these white guys, particularly in Texas or in these other states, that they rise up for a minute, people think, oh, my God, the next John Kennedy, and then no. It will definitely happen for him. I don't know about John Kennedy, but because he is not as known, and this has been such a hot race with a lot of national attention on it, And I think the stakes are higher for her to lose because she already holds the national office. But I think it's a win-win regardless for him because he is not as known. And I absolutely agree with you. For whatever amount of time, whether it's forever or just a short amount of time, his stakes go up even with a loss because of, you know, the attention he was able to garner, that as close as he'll be because it's going to be a close race regardless. You know what I mean? so either way his profile is up after this it's a win-win for him that's why it's harder for her i i actually don't know who it is but i'm saying there's there's on both sides there's kind of a deal i want to play you something from patrick bet david um i just want to get your response to this who patrick bet that you don't know patrick bet david you don't know him you don't know pbd podcast uh patrick bet david people do i need to know him to hear the context no it doesn't matter it was like damn i'm a little spicy i like that shit no i'm not hey no i'm genuinely asking because i was about to look him up nah i was like nigga i said i don't know this motherfucker fuck this nigga yeah hey pbd fuck you i did not fuck value taming bitch i don't need to know who this nigga is just play the fucking clip donnie that's what rake said big rach this motherfucker and by the way this whole thing they talk about the white culture and you know let me tell you it's all about the white culture this and you know we have a problem with this every one of these guys as much as they bash the white culture on america they only marry white people kamala marissa's spouse white ilhan omar's spouse white you know uh aoc spouse white every one of these guys you know you keep talking about them they're trying to go to that white patrick david standing up for uh black marriages he's one of the ones patrick david david said You know what I care about? The union of blacks. You know, I don't believe in this kind of thing because what is the goal of what you're saying? That you, that it takes. I didn't say anything. No, no, no. I'm talking to Patrick. What is the goal of what you're saying? So it waters down their fight, their policies, their opinions, their, what they mean in the culture. Just because they've married or dated or a partner with someone outside their marriage. I you know like I hate having this conversation because it makes it seem like I'm such a proponent I'm like so trying to promote interracial relationships but I just think that it's such a lazy argument to be like oh they've married this so it automatically takes away from what they're able to speak on when it comes to the culture it doesn't they fell in love with someone doesn't look like them as long as they don't change you know you do see people who marry outside of their race and immediately think that they lose their own identity within it. That's not what happens with any of the people that he's named. So, like, I ask you, what's the point of you saying that? Would you like for them to see them date somebody that looks like them? Then just say that. But the way that you're leaving it open to interpretation makes it seem like you're saying they're not as effective in their messaging because their spouse is white. I don't like that. Aerosene is not married. That's why I was like, I don't think she's married. Yeah, she's engaged to Riley Roberts. Who is? That nigga white. Okay. This nigga, Riley Roberts. Oh, Patrick, this is a white man saying this? Yeah, Patrick B. Davis is white. Oh, fuck you. Oh, hold on, hold on, hold on, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. He's Iranian. He's Persian. He's not black. He's not black. Is the point. He's not black. So, I just looked at the video and I'm like, please don't speak on black people. Boy, AOC got a ginger. AOC said, fuck it. Well, that's what they like to say. Gingers are the closest. There's this whole thing on TikTok. I know she's a spicy like that. No, no, no. I do not like, who are you to tell black or, well, you said he's brown. You said he's black. Well, he's Persian. He's Persian. Who are you to tell black people to say what they can and can't do and how that may take away or water down all the things that I said to their message? which I wouldn't have even responded if I had known that that person was not black. Well, hold on, hold on for a second. I should say this. His father is, before we say that he's Persian. Shout out to all my Persians out there. Fucking with you, Layla. His father is Assyrian. His mother is Armenian. He is from Iran, but I don't know that he's necessary. He's brown, he's brown, he's brown. He's brown. I don't like when people do this. Like, I'm looking at you a completely different way if you are of a different race telling me how, as a black person, I am supposed to be or even questioning my opinion, my thoughts, my policies, my message, because, you know, I'm with someone who doesn't look like me. Don't tell me how I'm supposed to be. It shouldn't even happen to anyone who looks like me, but for sure somebody who's not even black. I don't even like that. I wouldn't even respond to it. I was set up. You were set up. Hold on for a second. Wait a second. PBD got a huge pod. That sounds like a black person. What? Patrick Bender, PBD? Yeah. That's what they call him. PBD got a huge pod. He's on his pod. He's always talking. He's going, listen, this is the thing. This is how you're telling me right now that Black Lives Matter in its form right now. Because I run a multi-level marketing scheme. I came in here and I used it. I went to the Army. I did all this. that's the pbd he's got a pod i watch the pod sometimes he has interesting guests on the podcast sometimes all this stuff i've watched the pod sometimes but you feel like this let me ask you this put pbd out of context is him saying all this he's just talking shit on fox like put put do you think that obama would have been elected president if he had a white wife it's a good question let's say that is let's say this is not oh oh obama and michelle let's say is Obama and is Barry and Becky. It's Becky Obama and the kids who are Jennifer and then you throw a little white boy in there because they always have a little white boy. Jennifer and Tony Obama is Barack, Becky, Jennifer, and Tony Obama. And the picture is Barack Obama and surrounding him a bunch of white people. I think black people would have had a harder time voting for him. Gosh, I hate to do this, but I have to say it. Remember when Jesse Jackson was caught on the hot mic? Yeah. And he made the comment about Barack Obama being too white in something that he did. I can't remember. Oh, Barack Obama had made the speech about absentee black fathers or something along those lines. Yeah, I think that they would have had a harder time with, because Barack Obama is biracial. And then if he also had a white wife, I think the white people who wanted to vote for him would still want to vote for him. I think it would have been harder for the black community. Would he have won? Maybe. I don't know. It's hard to say. but I do think that that would have been something that was litigated in the black community of whether or not he would represent us a certain way I do think that, I think he still would have won but I think it would have been a conversation that we didn't have to have because he had Michelle I think he would have not won where would he have lost the votes I think that I think that there was a feeling of so there's a feeling of oneship and kinship who would he have lost the votes from that would have existed there's a feeling of oneness and kinship that exists with Obama because of an authenticity that exists with Barack Obama, even if people can't necessarily one-to-one identify with his story. Barack Obama was raised by a white lady in Hawaii. I don't know one nigga like that. Never heard that story before in my life. I'm sure there's some of you out there, but I never heard that story. However, when Barack Obama lived his life and talked and walked and acted, I still feel like that was somebody that i would know that i would hoop with barack obama playing basketball barack obama got a fine wife with two beautiful black daughters he had existed in chicago uh as an organizer right he had been in the black church there was all of these things that felt very authentic about barack obama where you couldn't really poke holes in whether or not this was an actual black person right that was a reality that's the thing okay a lot of things with him don't really reflect what i would say is the experience that i understand right but that experience isn't all encompassing and blackness and part of obama's rise proves that right proves it um but if he was up there with a white woman there just would have been a lot of people that went nah just another one so who would so you think though he would have lost votes in the black community i think you would have lost votes in the black community i think there would have been people that would just been like nah it's just another one of these guys i'm not saying that that's fair or that makes sense or that's right because there are plenty of of like you say black people men and women who have been married to white people who have uh done tremendous things for whatever that is just a deal i just think people would it would have been harder for people to kind of come to that right but as far as who would have what do you want me to say you want me to say like black ladies i thought that's what you were oh no i think it would have been a bunch of people i think would have been like uh i think guys like my dad i think guys like my dad would have been like i like him you gotta talk about the white woman though you know which by the way is is is unfair that's that is unfair but i think it would have been different so so you say fuck pbd fuck him oh yeah like don't speak on that well don't talk about that shit fuck you pbd i just couldn't imagine being like you said he's syrian i couldn't imagine and Persian. Assyrian. Assyrian and Armenian. I couldn't imagine being like, well, because he married this, doesn't that take away from his culture? I just couldn't imagine speaking on somebody else's culture like that. I wouldn't do it. So the audacity to think that you could do that for us and tell us how we're supposed to be as if you know it because you've lived this experience, it's like fuck off. That happens all the time. You telling me judging my blackness or telling me what i should do as a black person as an outsider as if you true you might understand how to oppress black people but you don't understand what it is to live like a black person and i just get so sick of it because i always see it from somebody who's not black talking about black people when we don do that right black people don do that i don think we do it um do you want to have a conversation real quick can i spring something on you now This is what I going to attempt to do We don do that Right Black people don do that I don think we do it We don Do you want to have a conversation real quick Can I spring something on you Now this is what I going to attempt to do We don do this on Higher Learning We are going to talk about the SAFE Act and voting rights on Monday. Actually, we're going to talk about it with Cori Bush in a second. Cori Bush is going to join us in a second. But I want to get your opinion on something that has been around for a long time, but that is growing. Okay. So new modality, not a new modality of thought, but a modality of thought that is growing. Now, two things I must say. The great FD Signifier, and I have been talking about this. Love FD Signifier. If you are listening to me, go and spend a little time listening to FD Signifier's video about Tyler Perry. It's like four hours long. Break it up. Support FD Signifier if you care. Support FD Signifier. Support Brianna Greyjoy. Support all of the people on the left that are making great podcasts and pushing you. Even if there's things that are in these pods that you guys aren't quite comfortable with, just support them. All right. Now, Donnie, I just sent you a TikTok. what we're going to attempt to do is we're going to play this tiktok but we are going to continue to have the pod conversation about it this tiktok is around a theory called afro pessimism are you familiar with it okay now are you familiar with it no are you familiar with it donnie are you familiar with it no i was wondering why are you familiar with it ct you are white Okay? All right. Yeah. Apologize for that. CT, you are white. Okay? So this has a lot to do with you. You need to open your ears. All right? So we're going to talk about it, and I want you to react in real time to some of these ideas because we had a conversation about this a couple of nights ago, and boy, oh, boy, did it spawn a lot of thought. Who was it? Who did the group comprise of? You don't have to tell me who, but, like, I just want to know what kind of people. Me and black women. okay so it was black women okay okay that's I needed to know yes okay all right this is from Nia Ola whose substack I'm fucking with substack it's called that deep on substack at this is able sex explorer is her on Instagram actually and then on TikTok I think it's at shaking sheets what do I mean is this all the same person sure listen here's the deal yeah at shaking sheets on tiktok okay continue to play it orlando patterson a black sociologist is frequently lauded as the godfather of afro pessimism namely because of his seminal text slavery and the social death theory of the social death is what most afro pessimist constructions have been built around since it's a complex theory but it's namely making one strong assertion that anyone can be owned but not everyone will inherit a proprietary class designation let's look into that a little bit more prior to transatlantic slavery if we look at all other iterations of enslavement so that would be ancient Roman and Greek slavery, the Arab slave trade, and even post-colonial slavery, what we call in the modern era human trafficking, anyone could be owned. The uniqueness of the transatlantic slave trade, what produced this idea of the social death, is that for the first time there were classes of people that could inherit a proprietary class designation. You could belong to a group innately excluded from humanity solely for existing as black. This race was constructed to legitimize the systematic enslavement of African peoples. People who previously were not living amongst each other, folks belong to sub-ethnic groups and tribes and nations. Earth's cultures, diverse indigenous practices and teachings, diverse religions and traditions. Because colonizers were indiscriminately plucking Africans off their shores for enslavement, they couldn't allow them to be in smaller sub-ethnic groups that had claims of indigeneity, but rather in a larger subsumed class structure that decided they were all the same in one specific way, race. Okay. I'm not a good auditory learner. I'm really trying to focus. Okay. So basically saying that there was a unit, the original unifying theory of blackness was for a purpose. Now we have a unifying theory of blackness and that unifying theory of blackness has to do with cultural solidarity. What we hope are shared values providing safety for one another, a lot of things that we've invented along the way, but the original unifying theory of blackness, The reason why the indigenousness and the sub-ethnic and cultural structures that existed in Africa were destroyed was because the unifying thing about blackness was that black people were property. So you couldn't have a bunch of people with competing or diverse social and cultural understandings of themselves because that makes them human. so if you're so even before slavery no no no in slavery she's saying that we were property no just here no she's saying for the purposes of slavery all of that was destroyed okay so we had it before we had it before gotcha gotcha okay okay okay gotcha afro-pessimism reminds us that within the confines of transatlantic slavery the enslaved population live amongst their oppressors they are within the core of the people they have been made the enemy of and the purpose of that isn't just to be in service of them for labor but to serve as the physical foil as to what your oppressor is not and could never be because if they were like you they too would be property it is innately extrusive living a social life as a black person within the empire and the confines of race in totality because you are living the existence as a subhuman person because you are designated as black you can never stop being owned when this is the class unifier you possess currently, which is why I and other Afro-Pessimist scholars consider Black existence to be that of the walking dead. The walking dead. That's what Black people are. The dream. The dream. It's this very fact that explains to us why other groups have such friction within this racial apparatus that is polarized. If you are not white or Black, you are experiencing the friction of proximity or lack of proximity to one of these groups, which you will fight for if the access affords privileges. Pause. Now we intuit that. We know that, right? We intuit that, right? Like, so we get here, nobody wants to be a nigga, like nobody wants to be particularly this brand of black because this brand of black that black America, nobody wants to be that in function. Sometimes in approximation or in cultural appropriation, they want to kind of get closer and they want to be cool but they don't want to be black black equals cool so sometimes they get close to it but they don't want to actually have this experience because the further the furthest away from white that you can get is black correct and when you say black it is the way that they define and look at it not us this is the the central tension i feel like in this because because she's going off of a certain definition of black she's going off afro okay how does she identify so i reached out i have more questions i saw i was calling people she can't identify herself as black well i like how does she wants to be free i have more questions right so i called up i called up mark lamar hill and me and mark are talking and mark knows when he answers the phone that it's going to be me like going he's all right cool i'm like afro pessimism mark went and we started having the conversation about it right so as cory is coming on in a little bit we don't have time to like i haven't i'm gonna do a shit ton of reading right i've already got the books it's happening right just because i'm curious now a lot of the things that are said in this video are things that black like i said are things that we know right right are things that like literally black people told me in like old black people told me like 1987 yeah i know like people are going to push towards being white even some immigrant classes that they come here they come here and the first thing they do is separate from the separate from the black people that are here, the whatever you want to call it. They did it to us on the plantation. They played into this as well. White people. That's the point. That's what I'm saying. A lot of the stuff she's saying, I've not heard this terminology. I think it was extremely negative. Hence, Afro-pessimism. But what she was saying, we know. We know. Other than how she's taking what we know and saying because of those things, we are the walking dead. We have no idea, which I would just push back against and say, then when we talk about the wars. What wars? The diaspora wars. we always say that, then why do people imitate or emulate what we do in America as black Americans with music and fashion? If we're the walking dead, if we don't have culture, if we don't have anything that defines us outside of property, then why do we see so many other people? I mean, look at K-pop. You know what I'm saying? I guess that would be my pushback and I would be curious as to what you'd say to that because you have so many people doing what we do here. So this – so I can't – once again, I don't know that I'm capable of getting to the point that the end of this video gets to. I just think that I'm – What does she get to? At the end of it, the video ends with her saying, if you want to be free, you cannot be black. So that's what I was asking. What does she identify as? Whether or not, I'm sure, but I think the broader sort of scope of it, her, whatever, is one thing. The broader scope of it is if you want to be free, you can't be black. If you want to be human, if you want to be a, fuck free, if you want to be a human being, you can't be black. because the designation of black is to make you subhuman. So this is what I would say to what you just said. A lot of times when we have these conversations, we talk about the way other cultures emulate what it is that we do. Right. And I understand that and I get that. I think the reason why I'm interested in this is because I'm actually looking for something past that. I'm looking for what I mean is I'm looking for. I'm looking for an understanding of the humanity of black people that exists past what it is that we can make cool because that's not working. It's not. It's not like the fact that people want to dance like you or rap like you or eat like you. It's not stopping them from killing you. It's not stopping them from taking your housing. it's not stopping it they murder you while they listen to new tupac right so like the so that that part of it i appreciate the immense cultural influence that particularly black americans have on the world i i appreciate it i understand it i understand that it comes from something that is unique that is special that to me comes throughout the skin of our people but it's not enough. And the older I get, the more I wonder, you know what? What am I going to be able to do? And I'm not saying that these thoughts are the answers. What am I going to be able to do to affect a reality where a generation past this, a young black man is safe, like a young black woman is safe? Is there anything I can do? Or, will it be a hundred fucking years from now? A hundred years from now and I'm going to be watching videos or excuse me, I'm going to be dead, or people are going to be watching videos and they're going to be saying we need voting rights to stop police brutality and we need housing. Like, will it be a hundred years and somebody will be saying that? Because I can tell you one thing. A hundred years ago, that's what they were saying. Like when you like when you go, well, so much not the police brutality thing, but like when you go back and you listen to some of the civil rights stuff, some of the speeches, some of the organizing, you hear people talking about the exact same fucking issues. And if there is something fundamental that is baked into our culture or our understanding of this world that is sort of we're hitting our heads against, I'm willing to listen. Because, like, I'm willing to listen. I don't know that I can not be black. I think that might be for me. No, this is not the way down. Well, I don't know. This is not the way down. I don't know. I don't know what a future – I don't know what that would look like. But if there is structure that is baked into, because I also think we say two things, if there is structure that is baked into our understanding of who we are, vis-a-vis us not creating it, right, then we at least need to be able to hear the argument. But I will say I don't know how something like this, which is why I need to do more work, understand it more, read it more, maybe have her on to speak to her, just open up my mind to different modalities of thought. I don't know how something like this doesn't erode solidarity. My question is, if I'm not black, then how does that, what does that mean for how I feel and relate and communicate with my people? Because what would be the reason why I would do that especially? That whole thing is anti-black. And I don't understand. And listen, I listened to eight minutes of it. I have not read the books. I'm not motivated to want to read the books because I think that there's so much that's flawed in what I just heard. One, we said we already understand these things, but she's getting us to look through it through the lens of you are not human. The issues that I have in what she's saying is, one, it's as if she's talking to black people. and she's telling black people, you have to separate yourself from being black in order to be free, in order to step out of the view of being property. Well, what are you telling white people? Because at the end of the day, okay, I say I'm not black because I reject what has been placed on me the moment that I came into this country. White people are still going to look at me as a black person. They're not going to stop being white. So what the fuck are we talking about? This is why I'm like, the books may say more. But until you get white people to start looking at us differently, to your point, if we have to break solidarity in order to move towards this and almost be anti-everything that we know, that we feel, because when we talk about what is being black mean to you, we talk about it being a feeling. You're asking us to reject all that and to go to something that's foreign to us in order to assimilate. Well, then that takes away who we are as people, our blackness, which is what gives us such pride and joy. But then we're telling white people we want to be like you and we reject who we are, but then they still see us as black. It's still a form of control. So I'm not understanding how this is effective in any kind of way. It's definitely pessimistic. It sure is negative, but I don't understand how this frees us of anything other than our blackness, which isn't that what white people want us to do anyway? And to your point, how it's really sad as you're talking about 100 years from now, people are still arguing the same thing as we sit here and we started this podcast talking about the death of Jesse Jackson. because I said it. I said he spent 60 years fighting for civil rights and 40 years ago, a presidential campaign that is literally still fighting for the same things that we are today. How frustrated and sad he must have been to see that things feel like they're getting worse or they're exactly the same as when he was fighting before. And I don't see this as being the answer to solve that. I'm sure Donald Trump would love for black people to start being like, we are not black. We free ourselves from that. But the white people are still claiming themselves as white. They're still holding on to that identity. So I agree with what I feel like just on its face, because once again, haven't done the work, would be sort of the limit here. And the limit would be like, you know, it's we can't change that construction of ourselves alone. I will I will point out one thing that you said, though. There is just no way. And I don't know what the answer is. There is no way that black people, black Americans or black people worldwide. Can ever believe that appealing to white people. I'm not saying that you said. appealing to white people we're not going to be able to make enough beautiful music to make them respect humanity we're not going to be able to write enough beautiful poems we're not going to politic our way out of it we're not going to as far as an understanding that you are a being it's interesting coming from a whole a whole movement where the actual saying was black lives matter well the question would be why would they not matter like why would they not matter why would it be okay why would it be culturally acceptable to just kill a black person with no sort of repercussion sure because you're not killing a human being correct right so like if if our identity is limiting or if our Since our identity is limiting, I'm willing to listen to the argument. For me, right now, the most important thing about black people is shared safety, which is why when somebody doesn't endeavor into that, it fucks with me so much. Shared safety. What does black mean? It has nothing to do with white people for me. It has to do with our ability to maintain solidarity together, because to me, what black means is that we view each other as human. Yeah. Like we look at each other as human like it. Fuck how white people look at it. We look at each other and come together in solidarity and community and safety and cooperation. Yeah, because our definition of ourself to me is paramount. Yeah. However. and I think there's power in that. I agree. But if we're running up against something that is like impossible or it can't work, I'm at least curious about the origins of it and all of that stuff. Interesting. But I'm telling you. But I'll tell you something. Boy, did that piss people off. Because the Young Bucks are into shit like this. You know? They're into like whatever. But boy, like I couldn't imagine walking in and Terry telling Van Lathan Sr. that like I was I was past being black because being black ain't human. He'd have been like, look, take your subhuman ass out there and go feed them horses. Honestly. I'm not sure you're no human because you're black. Nigga, your fucking grandfather was a human. He built that mother... But I wanted... Would you be into having her on? Sure. I mean, then I'll have to... No, no, no. It is an interesting conversation. I don't want this. I want to shut it down. If it's what I think it is, I think this is very problematic and I think I think I'm not going to say all white people but like MAGA would love this I don't think they would I think that the idea that of them holding us to being black is more I think that the structures that allow people look we're getting into a whole shout out to Camille remember Camille said this I think we're getting into a if the goal of this is to assert yourself of the goal of pessimism is to assert yourself as first and foremost a living human being that has agency rights beyond property i think that would be deeply deeply troubling to maga i think part of what even the way donald trump talks to black people is that he is the person that can best take care of them and one thing that we don't that sometimes it's hard for us to contend with when we're dealing with white people is white people don't, when we say make more tables or sit at a table and stuff like that, they really don't think you belong in the table. They think that they make tables for you and then they dictate how you sit at them. They take care of you. They are your masters. You will be better off if your masters are more amenable to the things that you say. You will be better off with better masters. You won't be better off being the master of yourself. Like what you are normally what you are choosing is the person that is going to do you the least amount of harm, not the person that views you as the most sentient. That to me, that's unassailable. That's how they look at it. That is the central operating theory of white supremacy. It is of white supremacy, but if your way to combat that is to deny your blackness, that's where you lose me. I think a lot of people are not going to be into hearing that. Yeah, I believe in the mindset and what we need to do and the togetherness and all of that, and I believe in what you said in defining what white supremacy is. But if the way to do that is to define blackness, then that ain't it. Let me give you a crude analogy. this is crude okay this is crude crude analogy all right this is just me playing black devil's advocate all right black devil's advocate crude analogy if you yourself are a hoe you call yourself a hoe but you say hoe doesn't mean what it traditionally means it's different it's something completely different you call yourself a hoe you are a hoe like hoe is whatever it is you know I'm a hoe that's all I say you know I'm a hoe it would be you could have that conversation with other hoes you could have that conversation with other people who call themselves hoes you could never have the conversation about what hoe means with a pimp. Oh, oh, oh. You could never, ever, ever look at a pimp and say, hey, I'm a hoe, but this is the type of hoe that I am. The minute the pimp hears hoe, I own you. That's what it is. And so what it is is you have to, now, if you come to the pimp and you call yourself something different and you have a different set of thoughts and beliefs about yourself, you might make them. But the moment that you identify yourself as the theme that they deem you as, that they own, you're going to shut their brains off to who you actually are because they're going to be like, I know what you are. You work for me. I invented you. This is the thing. I turned you into a hoe. So, of course, you're a hoe. Yeah. And not only are you a hoe, your daughters are hoes, your sons are hoes, your grandparents were hoes before you, even if they didn't know it, your grandchildren will be hoes. It just will be a different conversation, a difficult conversation to have with a pen. You're right. It's a fantastic analogy. And it lets me know that you've been watching Joe's College Road Trip. I did watch Joe's College Road Trip. All right, guys, we are appreciative. blessed and appreciative to have Corey Bush joining us today on Higher Learning. How are you, Corey? How are things going? Look, I'm great. I'm better than I thought that I would be, you know, at this time trying to run again for the seat that I'm running for. I am amazing, actually. Love that. Now, you are running against Wesley Bell in Missouri's first congressional district. Am I right about that? You are running Yes, you are correct. In Missouri's first congressional district. That's the only after this redistricting. Will that be the only Democratic? Yes. OK. That'll be the only damn seat for Missouri in Congress. OK. Now Wesley Bell is a black guy. OK. So people that are looking at this race, like black people that are looking at this race from a bird's eye view, they see black Democrat running against black Democrat, and they would go, what are the differences between these two candidates that are running? If I was posing that question to you, Cori Bush, what would your answer be? My answer would first start with the fact that I was the incumbent in the seat, and I was challenged by this person after already bringing $2 billion to the district, after being the first black person to carry the Equal Rights Amendment legislation in its 100-year history. Even though Shirley Chisholm worked on it, she never was able to be the sponsor. I was the sponsor. I was able to introduce historic reparations legislation. I worked on houselessness and so many other areas that I was able to champion. And I spoke up for the people of Gaza. I spoke against the genocide, but I've always spoken up for the people of Gaza. But in this moment, because I was also someone who spoke out against Project 2025, I spoke out against Donald Trump and the administration from even before I ever entered Congress. You know, people where I had already pissed off so many people. So one of the differences between us, I'll say, is leadership. You know, I champion issues. I work hard on issues. I dig in. I put my reputation on the line for my people, for the people of St. Louis. I don't care about a name or a title. I care about people getting their needs met. And so I'll lead on the issues. I'll run to the front and push for the issues. He'll just participate. Why did he primary you? What did you say? Why did he? I know the answer to this question. Why did he primary you? Why did he run against you in the first place? Once again, black Democrat versus black Democrat He was running for a state Senate seat He then changed and decided he was going to get into the race Against you, why did that happen? So he was running against Josh Hawley In Missouri for the Senate seat And called Josh Hawley To paraphrase him, the greatest threat to democracy But what people in our community have said Is that that wasn't true He wasn't actually running against Josh Hawley. It was just a way for him to raise money quickly. But he was actually running against me. So but when when you know, when I introduced the ceasefire now legislation, the ceasefire now resolution in the Congress in order to stop a grand invasion of Rafa in Gaza. like all of a sudden there was this onslaught of attacks and he came out and said that he was running against me because you know he needed to stand 100 with Israel um we're talking about Wesley Bell we know that he received like outside spending and support from pro Israel groups and that played a major role in the last race how are you preparing for that dynamic in this rematch And then what did you learn from the last race that maybe shaped how you're campaigning or maybe not campaigning differently this time? Yeah, so we know that money is being filtered in, being filtered in already. We just saw with two million dollars filtered into it, like to a candidate in New Jersey, 11, just recently from APAC or the affiliates. And so we know that that money is there and that more money is coming. We also know, though, that we don't have to out-raise the person, out-raise my opponent. We don't have to match dollar for dollar. We need to be able to organize enough. We need to be able to be on television enough, get the message out. But one thing that's different this time, and thank you for asking that, one thing that's different this time is two years ago, or two years ago, people weren't really making the connection between APAC, this amount of spending, and then spending in races, especially Black, races with Black Democrats. Now people see it. Now people know it's all over and people are pissed off about it. So we don't have to match a dollar for dollar. We just have to have what we need to be able to organize. So that's something that we've already started. We started earlier this time. Last time I was working hard on the ceasefire and just doing a lot of work there. and I also had this, you know, just all of these things, you know, that the Republicans were throwing at me at one time. I don't have all of that right now. So we are able to focus on this race to be on the ground. One thing that was that was different last time is I had to be in Congress, you know, so I was away from the district a lot. But not only that, we were championing so many issues that, you know, we weren't just existing in Congress. We were really working hard. So I was away a lot this time i'm at home i'm on the ground i'm with the people and the people are with me uh last question i'll ask you about the past how much money was spent against you in 24 15 million dollars oh my god 15 million when this race usually costs about one to two million dollars um okay uh all right okay so let's move into the future we like you just said or to the present and the future. We are in a different situation with people's opinions on not only the genocide in Gaza, but people's distaste, roundly, basically, with the state of the economy, with ICE, with a lot of the politics of healthcare, the current Republican Party. What do you see your candidacy and your message to people being about right now? So bring it like local to my district. I understand the national side that people want to hear, but when we're talking about my district, I'm so St. Louis and that's where I start. Yeah, absolutely. Nellie Murphy, Lee, T. Juan, St. Louis. So St. Louis is still reeling from the effects of a devastating tornado that hit us last May. And it hit through the, who thinks of a tornado coming through the inner city? But that's what happened to us. And so our communities were already, you know, just already under-resourced, you know, and struggling in a lot of ways. And those people, so many of those folks lost their homes, didn't have insurance on those homes. And, you know, people are living in tents, people are living in hotels. almost a year later. So first, how we manage disaster response, getting those funds from FEMA, pushing FEMA, pushing the president like that has to be somebody has to be willing to fight for funding for our communities. Also, you know, so so many businesses lost. So how are we making these small businesses whole that were that were there for the community? So rebuilding back that way. We struggle with food deserts. When we have communities where you have to go 15 to 30 minutes out to try to just buy groceries, that is a problem. So everybody talks about affordability now. We weren't necessarily calling it that. A few years back, we've been talking about the economic injustice in our communities. My community is a black plurality, and we've been talking about those issues, the disparities for such a long time, but it's been exacerbated by the devastation coming down from the Trump administration. When we know over 300,000 Black women lost their jobs over the last year, and the second biggest group is Black men, that has hit our community, a community that already still was trying to rebuild from COVID years ago, just like so many other communities. So my work is there, but also the gerrymandering that happened, that you brought up that happened in our state. Just for Donald Trump to be able to say, I need another seat, I need a Republican seat, and then the Republicans move to make that happen, like, you know, like in an instant. So what does that do, that voter suppression? You know, who does it hit? It hits our community so hard. So those are the things that I'm working on just like right in the here and now. I really love that you spoke to the local issues and what's at home, because I think that we see criticism with politicians. And maybe you've received some of this criticism before, too, of that sometimes politicians are more focused on things on a national level than they are locally in their district. So I love hearing you talk in particular about things from where you are from, which we know, like, as an activist, the activist you are, you are boots on the ground. What do you what would you say maybe to I guess what misconceptions do you think that voters or maybe people have of you and maybe particularly when it comes to being progressive? Yeah, thank you. So I remember when I first started running, people were like, oh, but you're the activist. Like you're the Ferguson protester. You can't govern. You can't lead. You, you know, you just want to go disrupt. The thing about it is as activists, we we do actions, we show up, we protest because there is a need to. That's just a part of the fight. So what I am and someone said to me, well, we need you this time. Don't be the fighter. Like, you know, be soft. And I'm like, I'll be soft with my husband. with the with for my community no i'm going to be hard because what's coming at us this this train coming to hit our communities that is something that we have to fight now i'll so people um people have like misjudged my um desire to see change now that you know that that that um fierce urgency that I have now for just wanting to be like a quote-unquote rabble rouser. No, I know what it's like. See, that's the part that people miss. I've been unhoused living in my car with my two babies, hoping that they didn't die in the middle of the night because the temperature dropped so low, you know, and I couldn't keep the car running with the heat on. I know what it's like to only feed my kids and not feed myself for a couple of days at a time because we were just so hungry, We didn't have food. I know what that's like. I know what it's like to be on the receiving end of gunshots being, you know, coming my way from a domestic abuser. I've been choked out and left for dead, you know, at his hands. I know what it's like to be to be uninsured and need medical care. I went through covid uninsured in and out of the hospital. So I've been in so many of the different areas that in the struggles that people in our communities face every single day. And I'm not willing to sit back and allow. I don't care if you call me undignified. I don't care if you you know, you call me whatever you can call me. But what you won't be able to say is I wasn't effective that I didn't that there was no impact. So you you use your words. I'll use my actions to bring about change. Part of your policy priorities here is something that I actually didn't have as much experience with when even, you know, to continue to advocate for utilities to be recognized as a human right, to make utilities remain accessible and affordable. I introduce utilities as a human right resolution. This legislation positions water, electricity, heating, cooling, broadband, and transit as basic human rights that should be treated as such. What happens if we treat utilities as basic human rights? I mean, all of these are provided as the public service for low cost or for free, which includes access to the Internet. Give people your vision on that. Yes. You know, when we have to make the decision whether we are going to allow our community members to freeze in the winter or, you know, suffer from heat exhaustion in the summer and hopefully neither one die and neither time people die. That's on us as a society. We don't ask for our bodies to, you know, to get too hot or to get too cold. We didn't ask for that the same way that we don't we didn't ask to have a headache or whatever it is. We deserve health care. We deserve our use. We deserve to have our utilities. And so, yes. So having having low cost utilities that don't change, that aren't able to be, you know, that where a company can't make the decision that we need more money, that we need that, you know, for purposes of greed, for purposes of their stakeholders to be able to make that this person who lives in this home with this high ceiling. I remember at one point I lived in a home with really high ceilings and I think I was paying about $900 a month for rent. I had to get on budget billing for my gas bill. My gas bill on the budget billing, which means it's every single month, it's the same amount. It's not different, you know, different parts of the year. It was $1,800 a month just for the gas bill. I couldn't afford, there's no way I could afford that. And so why do people have to suffer in that way? So, yes, public, there should be public utilities to where that those utilities don't change based upon the greed of of the company. Also, transit, when we see. We see bus stops being shut down in certain communities, we have people that have to walk long ways just to get to public transit, to be able to get to work, to the clinic or wherever they're going. That's on us as a community. We should be making sure that people have access to get to where they need to go. We're not making any it's not making anybody rich and it's not taking anything away from somebody else. This is just making sure that we provide decency to members of our community. Having experienced Congress from the inside and then now campaigning from the outside and watching it from the outside during this Trump era, I can only imagine how frustrating that has been for you. If you were currently in office, what would be your top legislative or oversight priority? So what I think that I would be doing is looking at what is, so Project 2025 is like about 51% complete. At least that's what the Project 2025 tracker is saying, about 51% complete. So what's next? So we weren't able to stop the things that have already happened, but what can we stop? What areas can we dig into? Who can we pull? We should be working with, and I'm not saying folks aren't, but I'm talking about what I would be doing, working with grassroots organizations around the country. These folks have been digging in some of this work for decades. They should be at the forefront, working with attorneys, working with different advocates to be able to stop what we know is coming. Some of the things that are happening, it's too late to try to hold those things up. But some of the things that are coming, that's what we should be working on. So that also I would be fighting, you know, fighting what's happening with ICE. You know, we you know, I am a I am a abolish ICE person. I've been saying abolish ICE for years. This is not new. I didn't jump on the bandwagon just because now it's a little more popular. We've been saying abolish ICE for years. That that is an area. Because we have to look at not just what happening right now Some people say well it doesn affect me It doesn impact me Oh yes it does Why are they building trying to build so many detention centers Like if we're if people are being deported, why do we need so many detention centers being built all over the country? What is what is the end goal with this? When we look at what's happening with Haitians, we look at what's happening with Somalis. Do we think that that is that that's just going to stop with, you know, or is it just going to stop? No. So we're not going to give the blueprint. So those would be some of the areas that I would be pushing back on. And the Epstein files. Absolutely. I want to applaud Summer Lee for the work that she's done in the Oversight Committee. Ro Khanna and Thomas Massey and so many others that are really pushing hard. The Epstein files I'm a survivor of domestic Violence and assault myself And You know The way I look at it is There is only one person that is The representative from that district In the Congress It's only one person represented 750,000 People so if you won't do the work Somebody else should be And so for me that would be the thing What is it that I can do in this seat that I couldn't do? What impact would not be there if I'm not in the seat? If I'm wrong, Wesley Bell kind of said something positive about ICE, right? Yeah, he was one of the 75 Democrats who thanked ICE. And they thanked ICE. I think the part people forget is when they thanked ICE when ICE was brutalizing people all over LA back in the summer. Tough. I want to ask, before I get to asking your question about voter ID, I want to ask you this. We saw you lose your seat. We saw Jamal lose his seat. Yes. So a direct attack on the squad on a particular set of progressive policies that existed in the Democratic Party. The thing is, I didn't see a lot of pushback from the center, the power of the Democratic Party. Do they support you guys? Is there understanding of the priority, as people's views of this stuff, the populism that we're starting to see, continuously has to do with basic human rights, Medicare, ICE, Medicaid for all, should I say, ICE, all of this stuff. There still seems to be a great deal of hesitation from the power brokers in the party to embrace this populism, to embrace where the base is on a lot of these issues. How do you overcome that? You know, for us, because we don't take corporate PAC money, because we are not funded by big farmer, big real estate, big oil, the war profiteers, you know, and now ICE contractors, because those are not our people. There is this disconnect. There is this, you know, there is this split that shows up sometimes within our party. And it looks like, oh, those folks over there that don't take corporate PAC money that, you know, it's almost like we are beneath, you know, we're treated sometimes like we are beneath the rest of the party. When in fact, what we're saying is we don't want to be hypocrites for our own people, for our community saying that we're fighting for your human rights and your civil rights, but I'm taking money from the people that's coming against them. You know, so us wanting to hold our party as accountable as we're holding ourselves should not be something that brings about like this physical reaction in some folks in our party to where they get pissed off with us. But it's a very real thing. How we overcome it is we just have to get the big money out of politics at the end of the day. We have to overturn Citizens United. It has to happen. And because we haven't seen enough, we don't have enough people right now really pushing for that, what we have seen is in certain states, in certain communities, that they have been able to come up with ways to be able to go about making their elections a lot more fair But when lobbyists can come in and tell you, you know, hey, this is how I need you to vote because we gave you X amount of dollars, that is not democracy and that is not being accountable to the people you represent. That's being accountable to the people who donate to you. Do you think that it's I mean, maybe it's mainly the money is what you're saying, but do you think that it's just that? Or do you think that also there is this loyalty to tradition or the establishment or what the Democratic Party is supposed to be that causes maybe, at least my opinion, the establishment to be a little bit more hostile to incumbents? Progressive incumbents, I should say. Yeah, yeah. I think that, yeah, it's there is this thing of loyalty, of loyalty to and and I think it is is more loyalty to those who have the seniority. Those who are the ones that have been there the longest you've been there, you've you know, you you have the title or you're the or you're the darling for the title. You're the one that they're going to anoint or have anointed. It's the loyalty to those folks that that I will say. Yes, the one one because one thing that is hard is sometimes we would see the Republican Party not face leadership decisions or put people into position based upon their seniority, based upon how long they've been there. But the Democratic Party would, you know, you would hear, wait your time. but this person is great in this particular thing. Like this is the area of expertise. And this other person, that is not their area of expertise. It's just they've been here longer. We should be putting our people in place where they excel. Like we have great communicators in the Congress. They should be the ones delivering the messages. We have constitutional lawyers. They should be the ones helping to work on Project 2025. And they should be on the forefront speaking about that. We have folks who are great on social media. And let them be the ones that are doing the message there. like and we have ones that are that are the flame throwers let them throw the flames when it's time you know that's how we should that's how the party should be operating and we're just not we're not seeing that it's the same people over and over and over again well it's my turn well no it's the people's turn why is it like that because we allow it's like that because we allow it well and also it's because people who feel they've been there a long time they feel that they have been patient and they have waited, which I understand. They waited for the people in front of them. And so they're like, okay, finally, it's me because I did my job waiting. And I get that. I understand that. That can be a hard thing. So I get that. But what about us? Yeah, right. Exactly. This that is happening is hurting the people. How, if you can't mitigate, if you can't stop the harm, you have to mitigate it. And you can't be the one in the way. We as a caucus, we as a Democratic Party cannot be the ones in the way of the progress for our own people. It can't be about us. It has to be about them, and when it becomes about you, you're in the wrong spot. Yeah. Alright, I'm going to say something to you, and I want you to respond with an honest assessment of what you feel like your political views on this particular issue are. People say the Democrats are against voter ID. They don't want voter ID. People say that Republicans say we want everyone to prove who they are so they can vote, which seems like something that people can easily glom onto. And the Republicans say, the mad Republicans say, Democrats don't want voter ID so they can be mass voter fraud and the people go out and vote who are undocumented, vote 50 times, Voting different states all kinds of stuff What is the Actuality On the issue of voter ID From your perspective And from the perspective of people Who you share political values with Yeah and so I'll first Say that there is no evidence Of mass voter fraud And so that is another Boogeyman from the Republicans they have all Of these they're What they do is they try to scare their constituents into doing what they want, into some type of submission and loyalty. No. Voter ID is the restrictions that come about because of voter ID. Stop people from being able to vote. What they want to do now, if you have to have a passport to be able to vote, there's how many millions of people right now don't have a passport? How long does it take? When I was in Congress, we were trying to push, people were waiting six months to get their passport. After going through the process, after paying, they were still waiting six months to get the passport. So when we say people have to have a passport, you have to, you know, all of these things, your driver's license isn't good enough. You have to, you know, the real ID isn't good enough. When we understand that we have people who, we have people who are unhoused. I've worked with so many who are unhoused that wanted to vote, couldn't find a place to vote. They had to have an address. How do you make sure that people who want to vote are able to access what's needed to be able to vote? Are the Republicans going to make passports free? Are they going to add to the workforce to make sure that those are able to be processed within a few days? And then when we talk about the voter ID, if you have to put forth money to be able to vote, that becomes of poll tax. You know, how are you, you know, who are you trying to stop? Who are you trying to hurt? But one thing that I did see, and I have to look into this a little bit more, that the largest number of people who don't have some of these things, that would be what the Republicans will call for to be able to, you know, to vote with new voter ID laws. It would hit the South really hard. Yeah, yeah. That's what I was going to ask you is I was like, help me if I'm misunderstanding this. But when you look at the statistics of, I guess, lower socioeconomic, you know, American citizens, it does affect the South. And then they're also saying women who are married who have changed their last names and maybe not have done the paperwork. A lot of that is from the South, too. So I was like, I'm not actually understanding why they're pushing forward. I mean, I do. But are they not also seeing how this affects a big part of their base as well? You know what? They've been throwing their base under the bus, under the table, ever since Trump was elected. You know, we're only going to go after, you know, criminals. You know, we're only going to go after criminals. ICE is only going to go after criminals. And no, they're not. You know, we're going to bring down the price of eggs. No, they didn't. You know, all of this. So they have been backtracking on the things that they've the promises they've made to their own base. So I don't even think I just think that they have an agenda and they don't care who gets pummeled in the midst of it, especially because I feel they believe that no matter what, that their base is going to stay there, that their base is going to be loyal and they're just going to they just want to hurt everyone else. And they let's be real. So many there are some Republicans who have publicly said they do not want women to vote. They do not want women to be able to vote. There has to be one vote from the household. Yeah, we are not going back to that. We're not going back to that. I'm keeping my vote. My daughter is going to have her. My daughter is going to have their votes. You know, my mom has her vote. And, you know, like right now, my birth certificate does not have my marriage name on it. I served people when I was in Congress who we had to fight to try to get birth certificates for them who grew up in the South, who were children in the South, who, you know, who moved further north, whose birth certificate had the wrong name, whose birth certificate was an X. there was no name on it because of, you know, so there are so many issues and so many barriers to this voter ID, you know, crisis really that we're having. Right. Let me ask you this. Okay. So when is the primary, Corey? Like when does it begin? The primary is August the 4th this year. August the 4th this year. How are things looking? like guys they never like when I ask how are things looking how are things looking how's the momentum how is the fundraising how are things going right now for you to take the seat back things are looking really good if you would have asked me this before I decided to run if you would have asked me this a year ago I would have questioned what it would look like because I thought it was going to be this uphill battle. I thought it was going to be really tough because it was tough, really tough last time. It's not like that at all. People are like, we're so glad you're running. People that didn't support me last time that said, oh, I was listening to the ads saying that you were, you know, that you were, you know, anti Joe Biden or the ads that said you wanted children to drink contaminated water from lead pipes. And I was listening to those things. Now I know that those things were false. So people are coming back saying, you know, Corey, we're with you. The momentum is with us on the ground. We out-raised in the last quarter, we out-raised the incumbent and most of our money, I think like 83% of our money was through like grassroots donors. I think he was like in the, like, I don't even know if he hit 10%. I think it was more like 2 or 3% of his money was. So we out-raised him And he took money from corporate PACs. He took money from these organizations. I mean, these companies that are known for or have been sued for contaminating, you know, land and contaminating water. And but Dan will stand in our community and say, I support those who are victims of exposure to radioactive waste. He's taking money from, you know, from all of these companies that are harming the same people that he claims he wants to represent. And people see it. And I don't know if you all saw it, but let me say this. He did a town hall back in August. My goodness. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then and then some of his own constituents were brutalized by his own security. And he never apologized. He never said anything. He never stepped in to help. so I got one last question explain to me the toasted ravioli thing so listen shout out to all my people in St. Louis shout out to all of my people I go to St. Louis, I travel around the country when I travel around the country I get into the food of the area and it's always interesting, you go to Chicago you go like what should I eat and then Chicago has like factions they have chicken factions this is the real thing there's chicken factions in Chicago There's Uncle Remus Chicken. There's Harold Chicken. Harold Chicken. There's Chicago Chicken Wars. Okay? So you go to different places. You go to Philly. They got cheesesteak factions. They got sandwich gangs in Philly. People that are oriented around the sandwich. Then you got to go here. You got to go there. You got to go there. And they get very upset when you don't eat the sandwich that you've been directed to eat. in St. Louis there seems to be an understanding that the toasted ravioli is the thing that you have to try okay one of one of it's one of okay it's one of it's one of it's one of okay yeah you take the ravioli and you fry it you fry the ravioli you fry the ravioli ravioli and then you eat the ravioli yes it's meat on the inside though it's not cheese it's meat on the inside You fry the ravioli, and it's like oregano and Parmesan cheese on it, and you dip it in marinara sauce. Okay. And that's the food of St. Louis is what you're saying. It's one of them. Okay. What's the other foods of St. Louis? I want you to advocate for more. This is a big deal, Corey. Advocate for more than just the toasted ravioli. Okay. Tell them something else. Oh, yeah. I have whole TikToks on my food. It's my food situation in St. Louis. So another St. Louis thing is our Chinese food. St. Louis Chinese food St. Louis Chinese food is the best Yeah, absolutely You come to St. Louis, get you some duck fried rice Get you some crab rancun Get you some wings, and you've got to get a St. Paul What's a St. Paul? A St. Paul is a sandwich, it's egg fuyang It's the patty You just got to deal with it It's onion, it's tomato Some of them put a little lettuce maybe But it's white bread Okay, let me look this up real quick. St. Paul sandwich. St. Paul sandwich. It is the best. And just the smell will make you want it. It is amazing. I don't know. I'm a picky eater. Corey, this is tough. You got to try it. Corey, this is tough. Okay. And you get chicken. You get the chicken. Chicken will be in it or shrimp or, you know, whatever meat you want. Looking at this right now, Corey. Corey, I'm going to come out there. I'm going to try this sandwich. Yes. This looks tough, Corey. Is this from the outside looking in? Yeah. This looks tough, okay? Just wait until you try it. Wait until you try it. Okay. Yeah, you got to try it. So outside of the ravioli, you got the sandwich. You got Chinese food, which I didn't know that that was a thing in St. Louis. Okay. Yes. And those are the things that you're advocating for because this is going to be a big deal. It's going to be a lot of people. Yeah, it's a big deal. We do Emo's Pizza, which is a square pizza, flat. So everybody does Emo's Pizza. At least that's a St. Louis thing. And then also, we're a big barbecue place. That's true. Like St. Louis barbecue is a thing. And so I'm big on ribs. Right. So ribs and rib tips and pork steaks. Pork steaks is a St. Louis thing. You got me. This beef. Oh, I got it. I got to go. See? I got to go. Last thing I'll say, we talked about Nelly at the beginning. When you win, have Nelly perform at your celebration event. Because he's got to redeem himself from being at that Liberty Ball, okay? Bring it back home. Are you still rocking with Nelly? Are you still rocking with Nelly even though he did that? Like you were representing St. Louis. How did you feel when you saw St. Louis' very own Nelly perform for Donald Trump? What did you think? You know, I had feelings. I did. I had feelings. But I'll say this. I heard something that he said and it made me think, you know, for him, at least what I heard was that he felt like I got to pay, take care of my family right now. He had just had a kid. He had a new wife. I'm trying to take care of my family. And so, you know, to each his own with that. And I know that we have canceled people for doing that. I just it's a little hard. I got different feelings because, you know, Nellie and the St. Lunatics have have been there for the community in so many different ways. And so, like, I just think as a community, we have to figure out what that looks like. And I would love to have that conversation with Nellie about it. But, you know, the St. Lunatics, hands down, are always, you know, they are true St. Louis and they have been like Corey supporters. and so I appreciate it because when nobody else will pay me any attention like the same lunatics care you know Ali, Kiwan Murphy Lee they would be right there with me they didn't care what other people were saying so we got to deal with that as a community well this would be a start this would be a start when nobody else cared the same lunatics cared I like it so we're going to come down here and eat this egg sandwich I guess. All right. Cori Bush, the primary is in August. Early voting begins when? Okay. Early voting is a little different. They're still making changes with the early voting because of the gerrymanders. So I'm not really sure about what that's going to look like just yet. We don't even know what our maps look like right now. We just know we have a date for the election. Okay, thank you so much for joining us on Higher Learning. Continue to advocate for people and hope, hopefully, we can shift some power around and get people their basic human rights and help them ascend in America. We appreciate your voice. We appreciate your work. Thank you, Cori Bush. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Wow. The St. Paul sandwich, huh? I'm looking at it. Yeah, try it. I'm going to try it. You know, I'm picky. I'm picky. I'm going to try it. That pork steak, I'm down. I have a pork based diet is what he said it's a simple pork thing is this big I'm down I can talk thank you all thank you so much wow oh my god as soon as I said it I was like oh god in front of a congresswoman Bernard doesn't help Bernard starts laughing Tough. Whoa. Oh, wow. That's not what we asked for. Okay. We had asked what you were capable of. Tough. I'm done. Wow. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. Break that out. No. Like, break that out. That's tough, tough, tough, tough, tough, tough. Just so we know, we touched on it a little bit just so you guys know, a little messaging here. like Corey said, voter ID is not an issue on one side of the aisle. There's no one who is advocating for you not having to prove who you are to vote. That is not true. Right, right, right. The question that a lot of people are asking is what is the range of acceptable ways for you to prove who you are at the polls? There are two different frames of thought. One is a really restrictive way, right, that prioritizes certain proofs of citizenship, passports, birth certificates, things like that. That, to me, is voter suppression. Right? There are other people who believe that there are all types of different ways that you should have to prove, that you should be able to prove that you are who you say you are so that you can vote. Every state, country, city, you have to prove who you are to vote. Right, right, right. Right? Like, if you're talking about utility bills, driver's license, school IDs, liberty cards, name, address, date of birth, bank statements, Medicare, Medicaid ID forms, like gun IDs, military IDs, all of that stuff. The question that's fundamental to me as far as this fight goes is that how much money you should have to pay to be able to prove that you are who you are, which also gets back to this really insidious belief that it is the people who hold the most in the country that should be able to vote to elect its leaders. Yeah. I mean, even going back before that, as it stands right now, we know, and Corey talks about this, there is no widespread voter fraud. No. And we know the 2020 election was not stolen. We know that Trump challenged it over 60 times, and all times except for one, and it wasn't even related to voter fraud, a judge threw it out, right? The election wasn't stolen. There is no evidence of this mass voter fraud in our country. So as it stands, what's in place is already enough. More than enough. You're right. So anything, in my opinion, past what we have is voter suppression. It should be, and we know this, voting should be accessible. It should be easier for you, for citizens to be able to access voting. And what they're trying to do now is take away mail-in registration, online registration, DMV registration, which is how I normally do mine, and making it harder for you to have to go into an office, which I wouldn't even know where that is, to be able to do that. So they're taking away – this is why I say anything past this point, and you could maybe argue as it stands, it's already there, especially when it comes to redistricting, that voter suppression already exists. But anything further than where we are right now is voter suppression, period, because voter fraud is not an issue. And it should be really difficult for you to be removed from the voter files, voter rolls. It should be really difficult for that to happen. Republicans do not believe that. They believe there should only be a handful of acceptable forms of ID, birth certificate, real ID, photo ID from one source, DMV, government or a passport. Like there are states that only have the say only ID from schools accredited within the specific state are eligible to vote. That would mean that, like, if I'm from Louisiana, but went to college in Minnesota, my Minnesota student ID would not be an acceptable form of ID. The baseline for this should be, does the ID prove that you are who you say you are? And there are many, many, many ways to do that. Right. But many ways to do that. this entire fight as you guys already know is about being restrictive to who can vote so that then you can cook the books the question is and i think what happens is when people hear well shouldn't you have id to vote the answer in here it's gonna be yeah yeah don't let them trick you into that yeah you already have to you already have to have id to vote you already have to have ID to vote. There's already in every place that you go to vote, you have to have ID. The question is, how many acceptable forms of ID should you be able to use to prove that you are who you say you are? And you have to take into consideration, there's something else I see people doing all the time going, you think that black people are too dumb to register to vote? You think that black people are too poor to have their birth certificates? What we are talking about is structural and societal realities that exist where we are. No, they're obviously not too dumb to register to vote because they're already registered to vote a lot of times. We need to register more of them, but the people that we're talking about are registered to vote and they're attempting to vote. Voting is such a fundamental part of the American experience that it should be something that politicians want everyone to do. And if anyone is trying to restrict voting rights in any type of way and make it less accessible, you should be asking yourself why they're doing that. Yeah. And highlighting also, too, that a lot of this is about how you register to vote, which is why I said. Very true. Which is why I said you can't mail in. You can't do it online. It would even take away some of these drives, voter registration drives, which a lot of people do. I mean, I left a grocery store the other day. They were registering people to vote. It would hinder all of that. And if you are already registered, this is where it becomes a problem. Your passport that you need or your ID does not match your new name. things like that are on your voter registration card or your address is different that's when it would hinder you if you're already registered to vote like stuff like that is where where it makes it harder so i want to highlight the fact that it's about registering more than just the idea yeah the registering the you register you're automatically registered you should be registered online all different types of ways to get people out there and voting so that we have the most accurate representation of American leadership that there could possibly be. And when people are talking about taking that away from you, you should be asking the question why. Alright, before we get out of here, a Tyler Perry movie was playing in the other room. Mama was watching a Tyler Perry movie. My mother's in town. My mother's 70th birthday is this week. Happy birthday to Mama. Happy birthday, Mom. Happy birthday to Crystal Ellis. I used to call her Crystal Latham. she would get mad. She would be like, that's not my name. It's a divorce. Crystal Ellis. Say something else. My mother wants me to remind you guys of something. I'm talking about how my dad and all of his brothers, like a lot of the latent men, didn't live to be 70 and why this milestone for my mom is so important. She told me to stop fucking saying that. She said that on her side of the family, they live a long time. Yeah, because how old is oh the man we're talking about the man no no no the men and the women she's like on her side of the family they live a long time and i was like i don't know if i should say that mom because maybe that's like a a diss to like uncle craig and the rest of the guys and she's like no it's not anything like that she's like uh you should just remind people that you have longevity yeah that's part of it you know but she is correct she is she's very correct will she be making gumbo while she's here so here's the thing about making a gumbo it happens and i don't get any i'm gonna be upset no i mean what we might do is say that she's making a gumbo and then the night before uh you tell her you're not anyway that's she come over we could have a whole party so here's the thing about making a gumbo in uh los angeles that frustrates my mom something else i tell people about the gumbo that they're making out here okay the question is can you really get what you need in la to make a really competent gumbo now i've had a lot of gumbo is out here and the gumbo is to me gumbo is not a restaurant food in the first place it's not i will agree to that but when you're in louisiana and you're making the gumbo everything that you need is at your local store you can go get it it's like a gumbo place the whole gumbo aisle just so that we can make the gumbo different types of filet different types of all of that stuff so you can get the gumbo stuff that you need okay it's there so sometimes mama because she's a little frustrated when she's in California because she wants to make the gumbo, but she doesn't want to make a diet gumbo. She wants to make the gumbo like the gumbo tastes back home. A lot of times you don't even get what you need out here to make the gumbo. It's like different. You know what I mean? Oh, she finds it. She'll make something. She'll make something. We'll put her to work. Not on her birthday week, but okay. We'll put her to work. Okay. Joe's College Road Trip. Joe's College Road Trip, Tyler Perry movie. There was Cursing Up a Storm. I didn't know you telling me that I'm missing something. I didn't know that Tyler shit was spicy like this. So you were shocked. Yeah. I was hearing it. I was like, yo, what the fuck's going on in there, man? Tyler going crazy. As I referenced earlier, Joe, I mean, if you know anything about the Joe character within the Madea franchise, he is the spicy, inappropriate one. He is. Okay. So you already know from this trip, I mean, from this movie, it's centered around him. So it's going to be a little bit more risque. I believe Tyler Perry at the beginning of it put a disclaimer because Madea movies are typically family oriented. And so he was putting this out there like this goes off the beaten path. And it does. And you were shocked because most this this is, I guess, the most provocative movie to my understanding that they have. With like the Madea character and all of that stuff like that. You've done other films, but like with the Madea character and stuff. I was hearing Madea, and then I was saying, fuck that nigga. I was like, whoa, what the fuck? He's a pimp. He has hoes. He's cursing. It's very sexual. You know, they go to a brothel, like all the things. But I was telling you that this is not even close to the spiciest thing that he's done. Because you have not seen Beauty in the Black. I have not seen Beauty in the Black. Beauty in the Black is a television series. Jade watches it, a television series that is on Netflix that always tops the charts. It is so dramatic. It is so wild. It is, it's like so bad it's good. And I've seen it, and I can't stop watching it. But there are scenes, because it centers around a strip club. And Kimmy, the main character, she finds her way out of this strip club, right? This isn't giving anything away. You should all watch it. But she finds her way out, right? and you go through this drama and this journey with her it's so unrealistic but it's so good it's a soap opera and at this strip club they have this area first off it's a man and woman women's strip club so the men and women are dancing together but somebody did note that the women are always covered and the men have their dicks just out swinging like i mean just everywhere so the women the women hold on just one second like the women have like their tops But the men are out here swinging. So one second. In this strip club, in this show, the women are covered. More covered. More covered. But the men have their cocks on it. Like you see women's albums, but you look and you're like, that thing is sweet. And the woman next to them is just like, they're on the stage together, right? But the men stand out. Then they have this thing. Now, I've been to many of strip clubs, okay? We know you have private rooms, all of that. they have something to my knowledge I've never seen before you go outside to the parking lot of the strip club and they're fucking on top of the car they're fucking in the car on top of the car on the side of the car strippers and the customers so the strip club is also a brothel I mean an outside one but it's just so so that's why I'm like if you think that this was something this is like it's soft core porn at times and And even the way that they talk to each other, it's just, I was shocked that this came from, because you have to remember, and I want to look this up to be sure, everything comes from the mind of Tyler Perry. Right. He usually directs, produces, creates, and writes. He owns his own universe. And I think he did this one as well. I just want to be sure. And so it's like, wow. He wrote, directed, and produced. So it's like. Going for it. Okay, this is what we're going to do. This is what we're going to do. This is what we're going to do. Okay. First of all, I want to say something real quick. As long as we're talking about black. Black. Okay. As long as we're talking about black stuff. I'm going to be at ABFF this year. I'll be at the American Black Film Festival of Miami Beach, May 27th to 31st. I'm going to support my brother Jeff Friday. This is the American Black Film Festival's 30th anniversary. That's amazing. It's insanely amazing. It's insanely amazing. A lot of big time creators got their start there. Ryan Coogler, Issa Rae, Ava DuVernay started out in the business. If you're trying to break into film and TV, you want to be there. I'm serious. ABFF.com is the site where you go. So I'm going to be there this year. You guys want to come talk. I don't do the personal plug thing, but ABFF 30th anniversary, gigantic deal, black filmmaking. This is the premier center of black filmmaking, and it's in Miami. so got in there in miami and may never been there is miami and may is amazing it's hot as shit it rains as hard as you've ever seen for 10 minutes then it stops and then you go back out into the pool and then you're chilling you're drunk it rains for five minutes like a fucking torrential downpour and then it stops and it does this all day long okay but it's a great amazing beautiful place everybody's everywhere you see everyone there okay cool i think that we should do something. When does the new season of Tyler Perry, Beauty and Black come out? When does it drop? When is it coming out? Because what I know is that this won't be covered at the ringer. You won't see this on the Prestige TV podcast with Joe and Rob. Fantastic podcast. Part 2 of season 2 premieres March 19th. We are doing it. What? I'm so, because you have to catch up. I'm going to watch the whole show. You'll get through it. I'm going to watch the whole show. Alright? We are going to cover on this show, this show is going to be the preeminent show for coverage of Tyler Perry's Beauty in Black. Great. We're going to cover this show. Great. We're going to be shocked. The twins, all of this stuff. You have to come to higher learning. Now, is it a binge? You can binge it on Netflix. Wait, I'm saying, do they all come out together or is it week to week? Yeah, it's a binge. It's a binge. Oh, shit, so we can only do like two episodes on it, but that's fine. But I would love to have some of the actors come through. Who's on this? You've got Richard Lawson. You've got Debbie Morgan. You've got Richard Lawson on this motherfucker? Not Richard Lawson. Yeah. I know. See, Richard Lawson, that's who you would want on something like this. He's not participating in any of the things that I'm using. Oh, really? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's happened. Okay. I'm excited for you to get into this. You've got Debbie Morgan on it. Debbie Morgan, fantastic. I'm looking at this. We are going to cover the show on here. And I'm just letting you guys know. So, wait a minute. As you finish the first season. They got 24 episodes of this bitch? Well, because they come out in part. They come out twice a year. Okay. So, that's why you have to catch up. Oh, I see. But, but, but, when you finish the first season. How long are the episodes? Are they now? Yeah, we got one. When you finish. When you finish. Hold on for a second. You can watch it on a flight or something. I'm a guy on YouTube. I'll tell you this. I binge watched the first season of it. I'm saying this. I need a YouTube. I'm not 24. That's 24 hours of TV, man. Y'all didn't even see like it was one season. This motherfucker. I binge watched the first season on a trip to Bali. Like, you can watch it quick. Okay. You can be into it. You just got to go right after the other. It will keep you going. It will give you the biggest cliffhangers in the most. It seems like it will give you the biggest something else. Well, maybe so. Maybe so. Okay, so when you finish the first season, then we have to talk about it. Okay. And then we'll do the same for the second. And then you've got time. You've got a month. Okay. But we have to, yeah. So when is it? Okay. So I'm going to watch it. So I'm making a declaration right now. This is the preeminent podcast of Tyler Perry's Beauty in Black. We cover it here. We cover everything else that involves Tyler Perry, too. We're going to cover all of it, right? We talked about Straw. We talked about FD Signifier Video. But now we are going to talk about Beauty in Black. This is the beauty in Black Pot. Okay? That's where we are. So if you're on the show and you're trying to come on this motherfucker, hit us up. We're going to put you on here. If you are Taylor Williams, Amber Rain Smith, Xavier Smalls, Stephen G. Norfleet, Richard Lawson, Charles Malik Whitfield, Terrell Carter, all of these people. Charles Malik Whitfield was Otis in the Temptations movie. Hold on. Let me see. Let me look at him. That was him. oh shit I fuck with him not just because of the temptation movies but many other things that he has been in I fuck with him Jules wow now you've committed now so I don't care what you see you can't stop you must keep going okay see what you say it like that you know what I'm saying you must keep going because I don't want you to quit. You committed too much. It's crazy. Like, ridiculously crazy. Oh, yeah. T.S. Madison's in it, too. I forgot. Oh. T.S. Madison. Love T.S. Madison. Love T.S. Madison. Okay. All right. Cool. All right. I'm into this. All right. Beauty and Black. Tyler Perry. Beauty and Black. Like, we are the Beauty and Black podcast because, like, you know, I'm so excited about this because, like, we have to cover this stuff. We have to make spaces and stuff at the ringer, man. Okay? We're going to start covering these shows. We're going to start. We're going to We're going to do our own shit. We're going to cover the shows that we don't cover on the Midnight Boys or other places like that. So Tyler Perry, you have a home with us. Whoever else has shit, too. We might start covering micro dramas, like the vertical videos and stuff like that. You don't want to do it. Okay, cool. I'm looking at this. This is a micro drama. I'm looking at this post on Tyler Perry Reddit. It says, just finished Beauty and Black. I've never seen a TV show worse than this. That's what the thinking is. I said it's so bad, it's good. Yeah. Tyler Perry's subreddit is up in flames. He's going. they're looking at it i i promise you that this will be a show that you'll bring the white board out for oh you will bring the white board back for this nice nice very nice very nice okay thank you for uh cory bush to coming on the show today uh thank you guys for listening to the conversation around afro pessimism it was a conversation that like you know still the beginning of the conversation we played a whole video for you guys you guys were patient listening to that thank you guys for listening to us rest in peace all to just tell us we ain't black rest in peace to Reverend Jesse Jackson and once again I meant what I said about Shia LaBeouf I'm not stopping until the virus is removed from Babylon take it from Caps off with Do Not Stop Learning I am Van Lacy Jr. I'm Rachel Van Lacy