The generation that's coming up now only knows like the instant world of I'm hungry, press a button, food is delivered. I don't have this, Amazon will have it here tomorrow. Every one of us is on social media too much and we see people living their best lives on social media and some of it's very authentic and deserving but you can listen to anybody from you know the Nick Saban's the world, people that are truly at the top of the mountain, like what would be very helpful and instructive is the process to get there. Today, I'm joined by Mike Tannenbaum, who's a visionary NFL leader who rose from a determined intern with the New Orleans Saints back in 1994 to become the trailblazing general manager of the New York Jets, where he orchestrated back-to-back AFC championship appearances and transformed the franchise into a powerhouse through savvy drafts and bold trades. Now the innovative founder of the 33rd team, a groundbreaking football think tank, and a sharp ESPN analyst, Mike continues to revolutionize the sports industry with his entrepreneurial drive, inspiring young dreamers to turn passion into unstoppable success. Welcome to How I Started, the podcast where we share the real stories behind remarkable entrepreneurs and the companies they've built. I'm Conor Boyack, your host and president of the Children's Entrepreneur Market, where we help kids ages 5 to 17 launch their very first business. In each episode, we'll explore how great ideas grow into lasting success, what lessons shape those journeys, and how mentorship builds the next generation of entrepreneurs. Whether you're just starting out, scaling up, or looking to inspire others, you're in the right place. Let's explore the stories that prove every great venture begins with a single step. Mike, welcome to How I Started. Thanks for joining us. Thanks so much for having me, Connor. And congratulations on building an incredible business and network and helping the youth of our country. I appreciate it. The kids love the program and we love to help them grow. Your story is really fun. A lot of our kids are big football fans. I'm sure they've seen you on ESPN. I want to talk, though, how you got your start in this world of football. Can you take us back to kind of the early days, how you started your profession? And then we'll try and draw from that maybe some interesting insights or lessons for the kids who are watching. Yeah, so my start was really twofold. It really in earnest started about March of 1991. I was on the precipice of graduating from college from the University of Massachusetts. I was an accounting major. I had a job in accounting that I absolutely hated. I didn't want to go into that career, and that was my major. and through the sport management program, I was able to convince the Pittsfield, Massachusetts, in Pittsfield, Mass, the minor league baseball team, the Pittsfield Mets, to let me start working for free. So my parents, in a panic, drove 90 minutes from where we lived at a place called Nita, Massachusetts, and just said, hey, just so you know, come May, we're cutting you off. And you had a really good job. But if you have this bizarre, crazy dream of working in sports, you're paying for it, and basically we love you, and you're on your own. And for better or for worse, I have this irrational, stubborn side that when challenged, I react accordingly. So one of the very few connections I actually had was a fraternity brother of mine's father was a postman in Dalton in Pittsfield, Massachusetts at the post office. So I got a job 11 at night to 7 in the morning sorting mail. And then I would go to the stadium and I would put cheese on the nachos. I would lay tarp. And I knew based on that experience that I really wanted to work in sports. And I made enough money at the post office to work for as long as I had to for free, knowing that there had to be a more sustainable way. After I did a lot of research, Tulane Law School had a preeminent program for sports law, went there. My story in pro football, Connor, is really one of luck. So while I was in law school, I tell people this all the time, like it was incredibly fortunate. The NFL had a 75-year run where basically if a player was drafted by a team, they had their rights. And that changed literally overnight with there was litigation in the mid-70s, 1982, 87. Finally, in the mid-90s, players got free agency. So I started as an unpaid intern for the Saints, which was the only sports team in town where I was going to school. There was a once-in-a-75-year event. and basically I drove people to the airport. But while I was doing that, Connor, I was taking notes on how to build a team in the salary cap era, which had never been done before. And so what's interesting to me is as part of that, like you say luck and there's a certain serendipity in that where like the once, you know, in a lifetime, once 75 year opportunity. One of the things that I like to talk to kids about is increasing your surface area for luck. In other words, like it's easy to be like, oh, that guy, you know, had a stroke of luck and I can never recreate that. But if you get yourself out there, if you connect with people, if you get involved in things, if you build your network, you increase your surface area where more quote unquote luck can happen. If you're in your basement playing video games all day, chances are you're not going to get any quote unquote luck. Do you see that kind of relevant to your situation where you were kind of, you knew people, you were getting involved, the fraternity you talked about, you had some connections. How would you relate this idea of luck to this surface area concept where you were putting yourself out there and getting out there? I totally agree with that I would actually add to that Conor because I say something a very similar principle which is I think it always about choose a job you love and you never work a day in your life And a lot of times you hear people say like well if I can only get a job I going to wait till I'm 18 or 19 or 20. And if I can't get a job doing something I love, then I'm going to go do something else. And I always say, well, wait a second. Like if you buy one lottery ticket, you have one chance, but if you buy two, double it. So put yourself in a position where you can have as much runway as possible to keep meeting people and keep pursuing your dream. I don't think those are mutually exclusive. I think you have to figure out a way to sustain yourself, pay your bills, but you should also pursue your dream by increasing your service area and giving yourself enough time to see that through. Mike, one of the important things about our program in particular, you know, we're often asked, are you just trying to create a whole lot of entrepreneurs to go run businesses one day, and hopefully, and many of the kids involved in our program will. But one thing I always like to stress to parents, to our supporters, is that I don't think entrepreneurship is only for the business owners. I think anyone in any role can think and act entrepreneurially. Because what does that mean? It means you're thinking critically about what's going on in your company or in, you know, your situation. You're analyzing things, you're making observations. And then when you see problems, you engage in problem solving. You're trying to come up with solutions, whether that's, you know, you're driving people to the airport as you started, right? What's the most efficient route? Can I have some, you know, bottles of water in there for them? How can I make this a better experience for them? So you're problem solving. And then you're doing value creation. How do I make this something that's advantageous for the other person, whether I'm creating value for our customers or my boss or my colleagues, right? Or whatever. So how would you kind of see in your own life, even starting early in your career, certainly now as well. How do you think of yourself acting entrepreneurially? Do you see that in your early days, you were kind of engaged in these entrepreneurial things? Like you said, you had that personality trait of just go figure it out and prove everybody wrong. Like, how do you relate to that idea about thinking and acting like an entrepreneur, regardless of the type of role that you're in? Yeah, the other word I would add to what you say, Connor, is serve. And I think the people that go far, either serving customers as an entrepreneur, or as you mentioned, being entrepreneurial within an organization is asking very open-ended questions of like, what keeps you up at night? What else can I do? What else can I take off of your plate? And then be a world-class listener. Because I think a lot of times, myself included, you're sitting there and when you say something, oftentimes you're thinking about what you're going to say next, but ask questions with authenticity and then listen, and listen in a critical way. And if you say to your boss, hey, what else can I do to make your job easier? You're becoming indispensable. And I think the entrepreneurial approach, as you've mentioned, Connor, absolutely applies to anything you're doing, nonprofit, sports, wherever you are in the form of years, especially in your career. But the other lesson I will tell you that I've learned is not every boss consumes information the same way. Some may want a phone call, Somebody want to text someone, what an email. I once had a boss get mad at me because I didn't give them a timely update. And again, running NFL teams in big markets, you know, a lot of things happen very publicly. And I said, you know, I called you and I left a voicemail on your cell phone. And he said, well, I don't check my cell phone voicemail. And it's up to you to get me the information. And you should know how I consume information. And I thought that was a great lesson because even though I check my cell phone voicemail, I can't assume everybody else does. That's interesting. You mentioned the NFL side of things. A lot of kids who are fans, they've got their favorite team or whatever. They see NFL through the lens of just what they consume as the players, the stats, watching the games. But you're involved in kind of the business side, the front office, all the work. So how have you seen, as you've built and managed these teams, as you've interacted with them. How do you see employees creating value? Like you said, going to your boss and saying, how can I lighten your load? How can I make your job easier? Pick a kid who's listening to this interview right now. Let's say they have aspirations to follow in their footsteps, be part of an amazing NFL team, not as a player, but supporting the business side of things. What would you want to see from a kid like that in getting their start? What kind of hustle? What kind of character traits? How can a kid thrive on the business side of this and succeed? I think the most underrated skill is listening. Like be a critical listener. You know, I talk to my kids all the time about be the best question asker on the planet. You know, be, you know, someone who's observant. And then again, how can I serve? And, you know, we get asked all the time. We have an organization called the 3013, by the way. We have a completely free newsletter that students read all the time. But one of the things we suggest to our students and our interns is when you're talking to somebody and you're trying to, you want to create a relationship and not ask for a job. And the reason for that is if you ask somebody for a job, that's a transaction. And the answer is binary. It's yes or no. If it's a no, that's the end of it. Whereas if you're more relationship driven and say, hey, Connor, it's really great to meet you. What's a book that you haven't had time to read? because I'd like to read it for you and summarize it. Give me the podcast that is in your feed that you just don have time to listen because I going to listen to it every week and then send you a summary Now all of a sudden you going to think as Mike as someone that could help bring value to you not someone that looking for a job And as you said to increase your surface area, if you do that time after time and you add a person a month to your network, you're going to look back from 12 or 18 months and you're going to have a whole bunch of people that are thinking really highly of you because you're serving them and you're creating value in their life. And I think sometimes what happens is we are sympathetic and think about the world through like, oh, like what's in it for me and I and me. But I think the people that really get ahead are the ones that are empathetic, meaning what's really keeping Connor up at night? Like this is about Connor and how can I serve him and how can I create value for him? And it's a very subtle, but in my mind, very important distinction. Yeah, I can't emphasize enough how critical value creation is, no matter what circuit, even if it's just your family, how can I create value for mom, right? What is mom stressed out about? She doesn't like there being dirty dishes. Can I just go do the dishes without being asked? Kids, that will do wonders, especially when you're married. If you just try and anticipate what type of value, you know, you can create for others. Mike, I want to go back to your early days again for a moment. One of the things that I've experienced with young people is they compare themselves to, let's say they watch you on ESPN and they're like, oh my gosh, look how successful Mike is. I could never do something like that. Or, you know, I could never be that type of person. But you started just, you know, chauffeuring people around before the Uber days where you were just a driver as an intern. What would your intern self as a very young adult say if he could see you now? Yeah, that's a great question. I mean, I've been asked a lot of questions in my career. that's a great question i think hey you did pretty good kid you know like my personality is very much of like the best is yet to come we could be encouraged but there's a lot more work to be done so i've really spent a lot of time thinking about but i would say like i had some economic challenges like paying for law school with loans and you know there was a lot of pressure on making enough money to, you know, so, and I think my ambition candidly is a little bit of a blessing and a curse because I think you have to be able to forgive yourself. I think you have to be able to reward yourself, you know, but I'm a little bit more of like, we could celebrate for about 10 minutes. We got more work to, you know, more work to be done. I'm smiling, Mike, because I can completely relate to everything you just said. My team is often having to like put on the calendar. No, we're going to celebrate this. We're going to go to lunch. You will celebrate for more than three minutes because I'm always like, what's the next mountain that we're going to climb? What's the next peak that we're going to go towards? And I think in a sense, that's okay. I think especially in a team, there's a lot of balance. There's people who are better at pausing and appreciating and reflecting and, you know, and people maybe like you and I are more wired towards the problem solving, the value creation. I get the dopamine hit out of just trying to like tackle the next challenge. But I think to be entrepreneurial, that's actually a net positive trait to have because you're really just trying to solve problems, which has the effect of helping a lot of people. Wouldn't you agree? Without question. And, you know, like there's nothing better than in sports, like, you know, it's always about we and us. And, you know, great reminder for the audience that's listening to this, Rex Ryan, he became the head coach of the New York Jets. And he wanted to talk to the team about the New York Jet media policy. And there's a lot of coaches, Connor that will come in with like these beautiful PowerPoints and you know experts say this your posture and and he goes okay and this really applies to life and I think about this all the time the official New York Jet media policy when Rex Ryan and I were together say anything you want just mention two teammates and one coach and by doing that you have to celebrate your teammates and coach hey Connor that was an incredible touchdown pass well yeah it was but you know the left tackle was able to protect and boy that was a great throw by the quarterback but none of that would have happened if coach Schottenheimer didn't design this incredible play and then when we got to the playoffs the official New York Jet media policy was two teammates one coach and name one other person on the record that worked in the building and it was a great way to unify the organization and you know to give some credit to people that most of the time be in the equipment room the chefs the whatevers the landscapers and you know all the you know trainers sports staff to mention them publicly as well. Mike, what I really like and appreciate about that is you said earlier that we need to be cautious, especially young people about not being transactional, but instead being relational, that ultimately, you know, business, the game of life is about relationships. And if you're going to operate transactionally, give me a job or buy my widget or whatever, you're not going to get nearly as far as if you are building a team, if you're lifting other people up if, as you said earlier, you're serving them. And so what do you think are, like, I see kids today with social media and everything else growing up in an environment where many of the wrong messages are being sent, where they're seeing kind of entitlement and narcissism and kind of self-centeredness, transactionality. What do you think are the struggles that the kids listening to, you know, this podcast and elsewhere, what are they facing in today kind of generation and landscape And what advice if any would you have for them as they navigate this crazy world we in Yeah that super easy Process and results And I very proud My son a freshman player a football player at the University of Virginia I literally talk to him about this three to four times every single day. So the generation that's coming up now only knows the instant world of I'm hungry, press a button, food is delivered. I don't have this. Amazon will have it here tomorrow. every one of us is on social media too much and we see people living their best lives on social media and some of it's very authentic and deserving but you know you could listen to anybody from you know the nick samans the world people that are truly at the top of the mountains like what would be very helpful and instructive is the process to get there like bill belichick who i had the privilege of working for twice talked about when he was with the detroit lions the living room in his apartment was a beach chair. That was where he slept and that was his couch. Coach Farcells, who's in the Hall of Fame, lived in an apartment in Wichita, Kansas that was part of a dental office and he had one room. And not to compare myself to those guys, but I was pulling the tarp in Pittsfield, Massachusetts. So my point is, it's the process to get to where you are. It's not about the results. And, you know, my son's a redshirt player, meaning like he didn't play this year. She has another year of eligibility. I'm like, every day you're working towards whatever, maybe September of 26 or September of 27. It's delayed graphification and embrace the process, not the result. I love that. What do you think sports can teach kids well that translates to business? NFL, your experience is weird. You got the player side, you got the business side, But for like your son, right, he's going through the program. A lot of kids watching, they've done high school or whatever. They play a lot of sports. What does sports teach kids well that can translate well into this entrepreneurial type of business side in their future? Yeah, that's a super easy question. Like adversity, resiliency. Like if I was doing an analysis of myself, I think having resilience is like a critical trait because Jensen Wong, who's the CEO and founder of NVIDIA, has talked about this a lot. he talked about how if I knew how hard it was to, this is the guy that is the head and founder of the most valuable company on the planet. And he said, if he knew how hard it was, he used to work at Denny's. He's not sure he would have done it. And I will tell you, like, you have to make constant forward momentum. And what I mean by that, just constant forward progress and you have to just make a little progress and keep going because you're going to have so many times the ball won't bounce away in sports you'll get a bad call you'll be hurt the ones that win over time are the ones that just keep trying to make progress adam shufter who's a good friend of mine he has 11 million people following him on twitter tells the story that he became a reporter because he wanted to be a manager at the university michigan football team They said no. He wanted to be a manager for the University of Michigan basketball team. They said no. He tried to join a fraternity. They said no. His fourth thing to get involved with at the University of Michigan was the Michigan School newspaper. How'd that turn out? That's awesome. up and coming kids. Maybe it speaks to your same answers before you need resilience, you need to be service minded. And that will be how you'll navigate this climate. But how do you think about this totally different economy kids today are going to inherit? And therefore, how can we best prepare kids to be successful in a world that looks totally different than the one that you and I grew up in? Yeah, Kyle, that's a great question. It's different. But I think the values and the principles are exactly the same. You know, AI is going to make your life better, different. You know, I'm sure there'll be some unintended consequences, but you're using it to enhance the fundamental skills because at some point human thought is still going to be critically important. So, you know, when you and I were, you know, in the formative years of our career, we were thinking about, well, how does a cell phone help? Or, you know, boy, this iPad, like what does that mean? Or how can I use it? But those were tools to help an overall, again, think of it as like a tactic to help a strategy, but the strategy still remains the same, which is I want to build a great career. What tactic and skill can effectuate that result? But at the end of the day, like, I just can't sit here and become someone that understands chat GPT because at the end of the day, like that's a lot of people can do that. Like how can chat GPT enhance some other skills that you can bring to the table again, to help develop, you know, to execute the strategy of your career. I love it. Mike, you've been a great guest. You've got a storied career, a lot of insights to share. Really appreciate you taking the time on how I started to talk to all the kids listening and we'll see you on SPN. All right. Thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it. Thanks, Mike.
