MJ Lenderman CALLS OUT Cameron Winter (not clickbait)

Ever stop and think, should I really be asking AI this? Between work stuff, personal questions, and random late-night thoughts, a lot of us share way more with AI than we probably realize. That hesitation is exactly why DuckDuckGo built Duck.ai. You go to Duck.ai and you can chat privately with the same AIs you may already be using, like ChatGPT or Claude, and it protects your info from hackers, scammers, and data-hungry companies. A win-win. Plus, it's from DuckDuckGo, the company known for protecting your data, not collecting it. Duck.ai from DuckDuckGo lets you chat privately with ChatGPT and other popular AIs all in one place. And I suppose that would come in handy for those totally normal medical questions I've been asking ChatGPT recently. Privacy First AI, Duck.ai, is built for data protection, not data collection. It's designed to help stop your information from being stored, tracked, or misused. Chat privately with ChatGPT, Claude, and other popular AIs all in one place. Well, no signups, no subscriptions, no learning curve. Just visit Duck.ai and start chatting. DuckDuckGo has been protecting privacy online since 2008, raising the standard for trust on the internet. Duck.ai lets you use popular AI chat tools privately, and it's free. If you want to use AI without giving up your privacy, visit Duck.ai slash Adam Friedland today. That's Duck.ai slash Adam Friedland, a private way to chat with AI from DuckDuckGo, where AI is always optional and private. This time of year, I'm trying to stay consistent with eating well, but between work, workouts, commuting, cooking isn't just happening. Tempo gives me fresh, balanced meals ready in two minutes so I can eat the way I want without losing time. Folks, Tempo delivers fresh, chef-crafted, dietician-approved meals right to your door. where each meal is perfectly portioned for lunch or dinner, and ready in just two minutes. That means real food, real fast, without the sad desk lunch or drive-through regret. 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How you gonna make your way in the world When you weren't cut out for working And your fingers are slender and frail How you gonna get around In this sleazy bedroom town If you don't put yourself up for sale Where you gonna go with your scarves and your miracles Who's gonna know who you are Drugs and wine and flattering light You must try again until you get it right Maybe I'll end up with someone different every night But all these people with no home to go home to They'd all love to spend the night with you Maybe I would too Tell me how you're gonna make your way in the world When you weren't cut out for working And you just can't concentrate And you always show up late You said you were an actor Well I believe you are But I thought you would be a star So I Drank up all our money With these phonies In this Hollywood bar With these friends of mine in this Hollywood bar Loneliness and frustration You and I have both calmed down with an acute case But when the lights came up at two And I caught a glimpse of you And your face looked like something death brought with them in a suitcase Oh, your pretty face Looks so wasted Another pretty face French inhaler Stamped and mailer So long, Norman So long, Norman Thank you. Welcome to a very special episode of the Adam Freeline Show. Guys, it's me, Adam. Real quick, before we jump in, low ticket warning. February 19th to the 21st, Helium Comedy Club, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. I will be there. In addition, I'll be in Portland next month, March 27th to the 29th. And Los Angeles, May 9th, they added a second show at the Regent Theater. There's a link in the description for tickets. And as you have seen already, my guest this week is singer-songwriter MJ Lenderman. Give it up for him, guys. MJ actually performed two songs for us in the studio, and the full performance will be released on Friday, February 13th. Friday the 13th? What are we doing? That's what I wrote in here. Oh, you already wrote this in the... Yeah, keep reading it. Way to tick. Friday the 13th. Scream at the top of the lungs? Yeah. So, no, I'm just kidding. It's not scary. We're going to be releasing more live performances with great musicians. We've recorded a couple of them already. How many, Thomas? Two, three, three others. Some of them will be longer episodes of the Adam Friedland Show. Some of them will be shorter, just performances and then five-minute interviews. Guys, it's going to be great. It's Taps Unplugged. Look at the fucking logo. It's Taps Unplugged. For the full MJ Lenderman performance, stick around Friday the 13th. It's not scary. It's coming out. And there are more exciting guests to come. Including rap. We had a rap. We had a rap on Friday. Yeah. Yeah. So guys, please enjoy my interview with MJ Lenderman. It's really good. He looks like a young David Letterman. All right. Guys. I don't like... I make all the guests do walkouts, and it's actually very... I don't like it. Oh, Zach, thank you. Can you guys get this stuff out here? What up, twin? That was a great performance. Give it up for Jake, guys. When we've had rappers on the show, I get Don Hooley for them, and I wanted to pay tribute. Thank you. No, this is the most expensive one, just so you know. Wait, I don't know how to open this. What do you mean you don't know how to open this? I don't know. I feel like there's probably some sort of... You're not a rapper, obviously. Have you chilled with rappers since you... Just my middle school basketball coach, Rolla Green. Rolla Green? I made beats for him. You made beats for your... Wait, did you have to call him Coach Rolling Green? No, he had a normal name as a coach. What was it? Coach Scott. That's pretty cool. Clay, here you go. Chributes to you. Thank you. Welcome to the show. We had the other young buck in the studio. He watched you. Who'd that be? Cameron, dude. Dude, you said he was taller than you. He's literally one inch taller than you. No, he's not. He's like two feet taller than me. What are you talking about? Oh, this is like... I was standing up here. Dude, we saw the young bucks, and then we saw Unk, my friend Riley, and it was like... I was at a dog park, and you guys were all smelling each other's butts. You're all peeing in different corners. Yeah, it was definitely like, it was like the don look back Donovan Bob Dylan battle You seen that right of course Yeah I forgetting though Bob is like Donovan like playing a really beautiful song You can just see him like not like he just wants to like defeat He wants to destroy it He's like, he's like antsy and then he takes the guitar. That's why Cameron just left. Yeah, yeah. You just, you just, you just don't look back to him. Yeah. And then he peed in the corner. And then like. Have you met any of your goats yet? Since you've become a rocker? Yeah. I mean, the Truckers. That was your favorite band growing up. Yeah. Dinosaur Jr. Oh, sick. Riley's boys with them, too. Give it up for Riley. You went on tour with them, no? Yeah, a long time ago. All right. All right. It's cool that kids are in bands again. We had a millennial conversation with all the millennials, and we're like, I think that there's never going to be another band. And now you guys are all like, I mean, it's really nice that kids like Neil again and stuff. Kids like Neil? Like you. Oh, yeah. Baby bros like Neil. I was like, he's pretty old. You don't like Neil Young as a guy? No, no. I have the Neil Young archives app on my phone. Oh, that's sick. What, because he's off of Spotify because Joe Rogan podcast? He's back on Spotify. I bought it while he was off of Spotify, and then he went back on. He made peace with me. I'm a little mad at him for that. How much was the archives app? I don't remember. $10 a year, maybe? I mean, $10 a year? Maybe a month. A month? That's like Netflix money. No, I think it's a year. It was really nice of him that he became an American citizen so he could vote for Bernie. I thought that was a really sweet thing of him. I don't remember if you... I don't know if you know that. I don't know if you're old enough to know Bernie. You ran for president in 2020 and 2016. He's this Jewish guy. Bernie? Yeah, yeah. Oh, you know him. You're an old soul. Bernie Sanders. Yeah, Bernie Sanders. Yeah, you grew up Catholic in North in Asheville North a cashville North Carolina. Yeah. Yeah, you were altar boy What did you have to do for that you had to like swing the incense? Um, well you start as the You step back away. Yeah, yeah, yeah an acolyte I think acolyte they know book bearers the first one you bring the books up to the priest and that's a little boy That's the young buck young bull and then You got the acolyte that's big bro And then the cross bearer, that's when you're on. You worked your way up to cross? Yeah. I was one of the best altar servers of all time. You didn't drop that shit once? No, but I did put it on sideways. You put the cross upside down? Sideways. Oh, OK. This is like a square base. And I put it down, and then I sat down. The cross was facing me. Oh, my god. You watch Club Shannon? Club Shay Shay. Yeah. Yeah, this is Club Shay Shay. That's what it feels like. We're drinking yak right now? This is going to be like the Cat Williams episode. Yeah. You're going to tell us about all the freak-offs you've been to. Yeah. You're going to tell us about... Did they make you put on the dress? Adam. I'm sorry, dude. There have been allegations that Jay Masekis from Dinosaur Jr. has been putting boys like you on dresses. I don't think we should be talking about that publicly. Are you hyped that there's an American pope? An American pope? Yeah. What are you talking... I'm not even Catholic. I'm hyped on it. It's good for America, dude. Yeah, I think it's more exciting that he's from Chicago for some reason. Yeah. Sufjan. Yeah. Do you think he's ever listened to Chief Keef? The Pope. Yeah, the Pope. Certainly. Most certainly. I mean, maybe not intentionally, but definitely out of a car. He's been like, yeah. What is this crap? No, the Pope is cool. We like him. What's his? Leo? Yeah. What is his old name, though? Chris. Chris no you change your name to MJ no James Jake my middle name is Jacob. Oh what you were afraid of your first name Mohammed Sorry, it's the most common name in the world mark mark mark Jacob. Oh That's kind of fire that but yeah Yeah, when I started releasing music on the internet when I was in high school school. I thought Jake just didn't sound good. Sounded like a jock. Jake Lenderman? Yeah. It sounds like a kid that definitely has one thing on the wall and it's a Pulp Fiction poster. He works at Goldman. Yeah, and he's doing Vive as to watching NFL Red Zone. That's a Jake Lenderman look. I don't know. You think Sinead O'Connor would have been a good Pope, though? She was mad at the Pope. Yeah, I think she was, she's probably mad at the right things. It was a boy, it was child abuse or abortion? Either or. Something like that. Have you played in Ireland yet? Yeah, it's the best. Best country. I was telling a story on stage when we played in Ireland and I was talking about the plane ride over there and I said I was sitting around a bunch of slags. Uh-huh. I didn't know that meant. It's sluts. Yeah. It means hoes. Yeah, I thought it meant something else what did you think of it just like a bunch of you thought it was a racial but no what did you think slag I thought it was like just like like a lazy person hooligans you know like oh no because these guys were like geezers they were drinking at like 10 a.m. it's a bunch of kids they were going from Manchester to Ireland and my bass player was asleep on the plane and one of them was just like you smacked him in the head on the plane as a as a bit yeah he said you He's back because he was sleeping? Yeah, because he was asleep on a plane. He doesn't know what a sleep is. And this dude was drunk as hell. Your great-grandfather was a jazz guy? Yeah. You never met Unc? No, that's OG. OG, yeah. We never met this. He passed away before I was born. Was he like a living hard kind of jazz guy? He was like Heron kind of style? No. Yeah. He played for that with the drums guy. What's his name? Gene Krupa. Yeah. It's cool that you can be a band leader and do drums. Yeah. Like, dude, wait. Come on, dude. Is this bad attitude rock? Before we hit play, he was like, oh my god, I'm so excited to do this shit. You were talking a mile a minute, and then we hit play, and you're like, fuck the B2s. I got the red light fever. No, I know. That's why you want this, right? Yeah. Let's do a shot. Loosen me up. We'll loosen you up. I don't know. It sounds to me like you grew up in a family where they were very supportive. Did they go to gigs? Our sets wouldn't start until like 11 p.m. because we're playing it. You're playing like after your mom's bedtime? Yeah, yeah. But they were always very cool. It's annoying. They never told me not to play a show or something. Did your mom criticize what you were wearing? She's like, you could wear something a little nicer. That's what my mom said to me about stand-up. Yeah, I remember going to school one morning. She was like, you look like you just got your hair wet. They don't know that that's cool. I was like, yeah, I just took a shower. Oh, she's an idiot, your mom? No. Your mom's an idiot? She wants the best for me. Are you going to be one that keeps it real? Are you going to be a North Carolina boy for life? I think so. No, you saw my, I was wearing that coat last night. You were like. I did see the coat. That was tempting. We got dinner last night and I had a really nice coat. You kept telling me. I was thinking about it on the drive over here. I was like, the way you were telling me, like, you got to get another coat. I was like, I was getting self-conscious. I was criticizing your coat. You think my coat's not? No, I was saying you got to move to New York and get a coat, like a Don Draper style coat. But that's during, like, your troubled period after the divorce. That's during your... I got to get married first. You got to get a... You're going to have a motorcycle phase. You're going to have all... Motorcycle? You're going to have a Christian phase again. Yeah. That's going to come back. Yeah. Then you're gonna have a reggae phase, infidel style Yeah, yeah You'll make a song called Heil Hitler And then you'll No, I'm just kidding Just kidding I really Somebody just did that, though Yeah, but like, that's a phase When that song came out, I was like It's this phase? Alright This will wear off Everybody was like, the song's actually good Did you see Kanye? The song, no The suck my cousin's dick was really good But he should have done it Wait, can I be real? He should have done it the other way Right? Reverse? I think he should have done HH And then everyone's like Fuck, this guy's an asshole And then followed it up with suck my cousin's dick And then that would have really sent it over the top Yeah, and then Because that kind of wraps everything up And explains maybe some trauma that he's dealing with I mean, it's clear that he's having a psychotic break Right Like, I don't think that Kanye was convincing anyone to either HH or suck their cousin's dicks. No. I don't think that that was a winning message. I think it just seemed like a guy was having a tough time. For me, I used to get a CD, right, like at the mall. And I'd listen for like a month, right? And then for you guys, you had Spotify probably. You could like listen to any song. And I wonder if that like, because to me it's like that either makes music way better because you could listen to anything, or it makes it like the kids don't have as much of a focus or something. Yeah, I think focus is totally gone, but I'm thankful that I had the resources to listen to whatever I wanted to at any time. Yeah. We used to have to burn each other CDs. I burned some CDs. Yeah. I burned me and my dad a mix from when we were going to basketball tournaments. Dude, you're obsessed with your dad, dude. Your dad I put this Eminem song on there which track the one from relapse with like the Aerosmith sample Can you go bar for bar? No. Oh that's your big M fan. I was I was the Eminem kid in school really I was awesome He was my iPod background Dude, what was your what was your first M&M album? I think when when not afraid came out That was that was like that was my yeah I knew who he was, but then I got like, then I dug deep and then I heard like a song like Kim on Marshall Mathers LP and I was like this is terrifying I was listening to that in sixth grade Same Yeah I was listening to a song about a man killing his wife and putting her in his trunk I was just so scared of it, but it was like I got obsessed. Do you think that comedy music is good or bad? Do you think funny songs are good? I think so. Because in the comedy community it's looked down upon, but I happen to love funny songs. Yeah, it's weird. I don't think anybody really knows what to do with it. Really? It's like not... For me, it's listen to it. People like music that uses humor, but they don't like it the other way around. Your lyrics have humor in them, would you say? Hopefully, yeah. To me. Yeah. Do you feel like you've gotten better at writing the lyrics? you've I mean you've done four full albums already the first song I ever wrote was called nightmare sick was about I guess it was about a nightmare I had sick but uh my guitar teacher hated it I showed it to him he ripped it to shreds like this doesn't make any sense is it embarrassing that you wrote that how old were you when you wrote nightmare 14 and Metallica is still writing those kind of songs. Right? About like... The riffs are heavier though. Yeah. And they have a lot of money. When do you feel like you kind of like popped for the first time? Was that in the last like three years? Yeah. What was a moment where you're like, oh shit, it's going good. Oh yeah. I mean that keeps happening in a way that's like... What was the moment where you realized people knew who you were? And like how did you deal with that? because it's obviously like stressful situation during like COVID people were talking about online a lot yeah and once we started playing shows again the crowds were bigger yeah I guess and then but especially like my record both songs came out in April 22 yeah and then by the end of it it got put on a bunch of lists and then and I started noticing like a lot of a lot of talk about it like now you have to put up go to GQ man of the year yeah but I yeah that was weird I'd stopped using socials but I do I do don't look I lurk on Twitter just just for Fuentes clips yeah when does high YouTube shorts YouTube shorts is fun yeah my my Instagram reels algorithm is the only safe place for me on the internet it's the only place where it's not scary Twitter my Twitter algo has gone haywire dude yeah yeah it's not good yeah there was like X there was like killings for a while and then so but shorts is still just funny or reels reels is funny it's still people saying things the wrong way and so people falling over the internet used to be funny yeah yeah now it's scary now it's just like slur MJ Lenderman song exactly yeah I'm not saying those are all the same kind of thing I'm just saying it's this is what people are talking about is what people are talking about yeah yeah yeah it's it's it's made a huge difference so to not be looking at that as much I mean it just doesn't matter I mean at the end of the day you just want to make tracks right? Yeah, yeah, it's like and that that just gets in the way it's a distraction It doesn't matter even what people like the people think really you just like as long as Like have you ever felt good after like like finishing a song? Every time it feels awesome to finish a song and then sometimes Within the next couple days like oh, I wasn't that good But right like you look I feel like everything I've ever done I look back on it. I'm like I would change that I would change that I would change that right yeah But it's I think it's cooler to just move forward and you have to just forget about it forget it Yeah, yeah, yeah The worst part is like you get really excited at the beginning and you're like this is gonna be awesome And then you try it you're like I am a fucking loser I have no talent you fight against it and you just draw you you just end a project and you put it out You forget about it. It's the best way to work honestly you figuring that out now is is huge yeah I mean there's there's plenty of things that I've released that I don't love but it's it's cooler to just move forward get better every time you get better every time right yeah yeah if you're just trapped up super concerned with only putting out things that are genius then you'll never put anything out or also you suck too and you suck at music if anyone finishes something and they're like this is amazing then they suck no one like the only way you get what i found is like in the middle stage right with the stage from like this is so exciting to uh whatever the fuck just just put it out um the middle stage is like the gym that's like uh the reps they hate it's the reps right it's like i hate myself i hate the song I suck but like fighting through it is like kind of the part where you get better yeah yeah I agree yeah that's putting up shots yeah putting up some shots a little bit of discipline was reading some books maybe what's your three-point percentage empty gym 50 50 dude isn't it crazy that league is like if they're empty gym it's kind of like 80 yeah they're so good at basketball yeah My biggest basketball game I ever played. Yeah. I had 10 threes. 10 threes? Yeah. You were a sniper? I was a sniper, dude. Really? What grade was that? Seventh. Seventh grade, 10 threes? So you were strong enough not to, like, from your chest? You had form? I had form. Dude, have you ever linked with Steph? He's North Carolina. Oh, yeah, he went to Davidson. Davidson, there you go. He loves Paramore, I just learned. Dude, have you seen that clip of him at the fucking Benson Boone concert wearing the hat? No. I have a theory on the NBA, which is the fact that LeBron is so bad at any type of trying to be cool thing has completely shielded Steph from any type of scrutiny. Steph has been a genius player in an era where there was another genius player, and he's been protected. Yeah, all their energy's put into being good at basketball. They don't have any skills at anything else. I just know that LeBron's team is like, we will be doing creative on this. And it's always just a fucking break. It's like the Hennessy thing you saw, right? Was that when he said he was going to make an announcement? Yeah. Everybody thought he was going to retire. And it was on October 7th. It said, I'm making an announcement October 7th, 2025. And it was an ad for Hennessy. Did the girls leave? One remains. Thank God. Okay. Okay. Dude, we've never had so many girls in here before. I know. Yeah. Zach brought him up. The last girl here was Mia Khalifa. All right. I was telling you last night you should get in an Indie Rock pickup game. I thought you were dapping me. Oh. Yeah. We can dapp later. I wonder who would be in the Indie Rock pickup game. Thurston Moore? He's tall as fuck. He's tall as fuck. He's probably not very good, though. No, he's trash. He's definitely trash at mall. There's a lot of tall guys out there. You're obsessed with other guys' heights that are... No, you said that Cameron was way taller than you. He was one inch taller. You don't think he's taller? You're already 6'3", dude. I'm not 6'3". What are you? 6'2"? I don't know. My license says I'm 5'11". My license says I'm 6'3". Really? Because I'm trying to impress bouncers. You're like, just don't look. Just look at this. Tracking expenses can make one feel bad about past spending. It happens to me all the time. But Monarch keeps you focused on planning ahead and hitting real financial milestones. Monarch gives you a complete picture, budgets, debt payoff timelines, savings goals, net worth, so you can make decisions that actually move the needle. Unlike most other personal finance apps, Monarch is made to make you proactive, not reactive. And that's what I've been talking to you guys at the office about. Proactive. Not reactive. Monarch helped users save over $200 per month on average after joining. 8 out of 10 members feel more in control of their finances with Monarch, and 8 out of 10 members say Monarch gives them a clearer picture of where their money's going. 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Plus, it's from DuckDuckGo, the company known for protecting your data, not collecting it. Duck.ai from DuckDuckGo lets you chat privately with ChatGPT and other popular AIs all in one place. And I suppose that would come in handy for those totally normal medical questions I've been asking ChatGPT recently. Privacy First AI, Duck.ai, is built for data protection, not data collection. It's designed to help stop your information from being stored, tracked, or misused. Chat privately with ChatGPT, Claude, and other popular AIs all in one place. Well, no signups, no subscriptions, no learning curve. Just visit Duck.ai and start chatting. DuckDuckGo has been protecting privacy online since 2008, raising the standard for trust on the internet. Duck.ai lets you use popular AI chat tools privately, and it's free. If you want to use AI without giving up your privacy, visit Duck.ai slash Adam Friedland today. That's Duck.ai slash Adam Friedland, a private way to chat with AI from DuckDuckGo, where AI is always optional and private. This time of year, I'm trying to stay consistent with eating well, but between work, workouts, commuting, cooking isn't just happening. Tempo gives me fresh, balanced meals, ready in two minutes so I can eat the way I want without losing time. Folks, Tempo delivers fresh, chef-crafted, dietician-approved meals right to your door. each meal is perfectly portioned for lunch or dinner and ready in just two minutes. That means real food, real fast, without the sad desk lunch or drive-through regret. With 20 new recipes every week made from nutrient-rich ingredients, Tempo keeps things exciting and helps you stay consistent with healthy habits. Even top athletes like Maria Sharapova swear by Tempo. For balanced meals, they help them stay on top of their wellness goals. So no matter your goals, there's a Tempo meal for you. Protein packed meals with up to 30 grams of protein, calorie conscious, even GLP-1 balanced meals. It's convenient but also flexible enough to fit the way you want to eat. So for a limited time, Tempo is offering our listeners 60% off your first box. Go to TempoMeals.com slash TAFS. That's TempoMeals.com slash TAFS for 60% off your first box. TempoMeals.com slash TAFS. Rules and restrictions may apply. Do girls try to get with you because you're a rock star? No? I don't know. I stay at home a lot. You stay at home. Are you scared of girls? Is it kind of like a hard day's night situation? I have three sisters. My life is ruled by women. Yeah, yeah. They stress you out? Sometimes. And they tell you you can't get any girlfriends? They say I can't have girlfriends. I wonder what it's like. I mean like... It's hard at adding a fourth to the fold. Zach, our friend over here, He told me that girls learned the words to his songs at his gig. Oh, Zach. That's kind of hard. Was there a moment where you realized that the kids knew the words? Yeah, because they're so fucking loud. Sometimes they want to be heard, and it's like I'm trying to sing a song, and I start forgetting the words because I'm like, they're distracting me. They're being lame for knowing the words. It's cool that people are that committed. Are they annoying? Sometimes. Yeah, they're fucking, yeah. What's the most annoying? This guy was in, he was at like three shows in a row, and he kept telling me to take my shoes off. He said, let me see those feet. No, maybe he was from the website WikiFeet, though. Maybe he's trying to snap some photos for WikiFeet. Yeah, yeah, he's like, I'm a thorough guy. I need the Lenderman's feet. After night three of doing that, I was like, who is saying this? And I look at the guy, he's wearing every piece of merch that I have. To the show? Yeah. That is the worst look. And then once I called him out, he got embarrassed. What did you say to make him feel embarrassed? I said, stop it. Off from the stage? Off mic. I was being nice. Did you kick him in the head with your shoe? Josh Homie style? Yeah, you're like, I love these shoes. No. So what relationship did COVID have to your career? Like, you were touring and they cut it out? Yeah, but then I was, like, working at an ice cream store. So through working there, I got unemployment. And I started making more money than I ever made in my life. Yeah, no, it happened to a lot of friends. It was the most prolific period of time for me because we had a really, really fortunate living situation, too. You had a nice place? Over by the Creekside Tap House that your boy works at. Yeah, yeah. My boy's brother, I didn't know he had a brother for a while. Yeah, so you guys wrote a ton of music. Yeah, it was like the only, it was a weird, like, view of adulthood because I turned 21 right before that happened. And then now I have all this free time and more money than I've ever had. Yeah. And just time to actually focus on making stuff. And it was a pretty prolific time. But then... Do you feel like you got better? Definitely within that time. That's the best I'd felt about making things. But once Torian came back, I started being like, when am I going to have two years off again? Dude, wouldn't it be nice, dude? Yeah. Wuhan, dude. I mean, I feel like I would do it better this time. It sounds like you did it great. Yeah, I mean, for the parts of it. I started painting. Yeah, I painted a lot, too. I painted, yeah. How was your painting? It was fine. It was nice for the brain, though. I think I was getting ideas while I was painting. I would listen to, I had an archive of Howard Stern. I got obsessed with Howard Stern. Yeah, yeah. Lint Biscuit guitar auditions. And Beetlejuice comes in completely naked. and he's like, this is my guitar right here. We were talking yesterday about Beetlejuice, the Obama phone call. When Beetlejuice says he doesn't like Obama, they get some guy calls in as Obama. Do you have goals in being like a musician? Is there like a thing that like, you're like, next time I'm going to do this? What keeps you like motivated? Just writing stuff, I guess. You want to get better? Yeah, I want to get better. It's the happiest I am is when I make music, but I've achieved all of my goals. Really? I just have to make new ones, I guess, but maybe they're unrelated to music. I think you just need to just keep making tracks. Yeah, exactly. The best guys are the guys that can make tracks. I just want to keep making music that I'm happy about. I don't want to lose. I think it's easy to get successful and then start making bad music. What is the currency that matters the most? Is it like approval of your peers? Is it like... That does mean a lot to me. If a comedian says good set that I like, I'm like, that feels good. Yeah, that means a lot to me. My own validation from myself. Yeah, but you hate all your stuff, right? Yeah, yeah. That means you're good. That's why you're good. It definitely means more with peers that I respect. Yeah. If someone is ahead and they know. Because the guys that are telling you to take your shoes off, it's like why don't you make a fucking track dude yeah yeah I'm like and that guy what to say about me that this guy worships my music and that guy was Brian you know I really I'm a big fan I really appreciate you coming on yeah yeah you have to do stuff like this and you it's it's really I'm not very practiced I'm sorry no it sucks for you you shouldn't have to to do these things Well, this is one that I was excited for because I watched the show. I know, but you like the show, so you're like, Adam's going to be hating on my ass? No. I talked to you on the phone before this. We talked for an hour on the phone. And then more. About what are we talking about? I forgot what we were talking about. Oh, yeah, we talked about Red Bar. He's a big fan. Big fan. Shout out to Mike David. Thank you, MJ Lenderman, everyone. Thanks for coming on. Bye. OK, you have to go to the airport. I guess so. Thank you.