253. La crisis de la vivienda en España, un problema global

One of the most depressing activities of the actuality is to go to a home. Coquete studio a barbillado of a square meter to 1000 euros per month. Three windows without windows, a almost 2000. Vivienda hace 50 years, a half million. And luck with the hipoteca. This manor desolador has a name that we know well. Crisis of the house, but how have we reached here? And how can we do it? So today, in this Fin del Mundo, we're going to talk about the crisis of the living in Spain. A global problem. No es el Fin del Mundo, el podcast semanal del Orde Mundial. This episode, I don't know if I'm going to take care of it as long, but prepare the pañal, because it's going to be a long time, and for this trip, the Grosya Bebe Agua, We are with Edward Saldaña. How about Eduardo? Preparándome. And I'm going to go. How about you? I'm going to have to do a pause. Alba Liva. How about Alba? Well, I'm going to be surprised that you are not talking about our decoration of the studio. Or, in the case of it. Because I'm sitting on my own abrigo to be able to get the microphone. Por vanidosa. Di the truth. I'm sitting on the microphone. I'm going to get the microphone. Because it's not the end of the world. It ends. It ends in this studio. I mean. who put it on the screen will have a place quite destartalable autentic hogar, of mudanza like the whole office yes, the office is in the walk in bed basically a little bit of a but yes, because as we have mentioned in another episode we are going to move we are going to change the studio and this will be one of the last episodes that we will be in the original studio of the World of Mundial Aquel que nos vio nacer Es el garaje de Jeff Bezos Sí, ese es el que nos vio nacer Al contrario que él, nosotros sí tenemos su garaje Que eso antes era el office Sí, era la cocina Ahora vamos ahí detrás en una mesa de uno por uno Sí, sí, sí Pues todo eso termina hoy En unas semanas, porque además ahora tenemos varios directos Ahora hablaremos de ellos Cambiaremos de estudio, ya lo verás Un sitio más grande, más luminoso, más potente Acorde That's how to come to see someone to see it It's very cool, it's very cool It's very cool, it's very cool It's very cool, it's very cool It's very cool, it's very cool Yes, of course, you can also join in this So that's also nice because So as you can send us all your gifts And testimonials and postcards And we also want to make that That's a little part of it But we already know what we're going to say Now we're going to be in the part of the destruction That is to be able to do with what we have Because we're going to be able to do with paper And paper and paper And paper and paper But well, little bit a poco. También, vamos con recordatorios porque si la gente no va a ver, hay gente... El centro es muy largo. Bueno, pues soltate esta parte si le interesa. Pero bueno, porque se pongan otra podcast. Claro, eso es. Así venimos. Te vamos a dar tres horas de contenido gratis. Que te lo haga la IA. Te vas a tragar un poquito de chapote. La IA no te hace esto. La IA no es pesada. La IA no es pesada. Eso es. Y encima te va a ir al agua. Claro. Repete. A ver, atención. Esta tarde vamos a estar en Santiago de Compostela a las 7 de la tarde in the Casa of the Máquinas. Directo sobre Geopolítica de la Física. Capitulazo. Mola a montón. Buena bandanga. El Entrar es Libre. O sea, vas allí, te pegas con la gente por entrar. Te pegas con las máquinas. Con las máquinas, eso es. El sábado 21 de febrero, que es ya, en Madrid tenemos presentación del Atlas a las 1 de la tarde en el Bermud Literario de la librería Pérgamo. Es que el Atlas, el Orden Mundial, Bermud... Claro, las presentaciones que a mí me tocan no hay Bermud. Yo me voy a una Libre, que está muy bien, pero no me ponen una cañita. And the card is going to a vermouth. That's a very good. A ver, it's that the Pérgamo se lo montan muy bien. Pablo Cerezo se lo monta muy bien. Hay con sus vermouth literarios. Van a ver los mapas a la vez. Sí, claro. Cambiando la perspectiva. El mapa es 3D y se mueve. No, no, no. Bueno. El miércoles 25 de febrero estamos en Ourense. Vamos a hacer la observación de laslas a las 7 y media de la tarde en la librería Eixo. El 11 de marzo, Palma de Mallorca a las 6 y media de la tarde en el diario de Mallorca. And the 18th of March At the 7th of the afternoon In the Atena of Malaga This is the event that we did not make For the train And then we have Re-located A March And that they are in mind Because the 26th of March On June If I'm not mistaken I'm going to announce With more detail But we're going to make a very beautiful Madrid Yes Very cool Yes Yes Yes For a lot of Peñita So on a lot of Piedla Taylor Swift Yes So we're going to announce But we're going to be But be careful For the June 26th of March in the Palacio de la Prensa of Madrid. That's the central, the one in front of the Cala. No you have excuse. Claro. We also have a trip to travel because we remind you that the trips we are organizing with Wakea Travel have already very few places. Turkey, Semana Santa, 2016, with Eduardo. That's full. We have had a reunion. That's complete. Yes, yes, yes. You go with a lot of... There are some subscribers. Still, the moment of recording. I don't know. I know I know. I know I know you this afternoon. But when I listen to the audience and the people who are listening, they have known. You know, you have seen with whom they are going and that they can't escape. No, you're not in Turkey with you, you're in Turkey with me. That's it. Then, the trip to Balcanes in the summer of 2016 with Marc Casals, is also complete. Then, there are very little places for the trip to Vietnam and Cambodia in the summer of 2016, also with Eduardo. Pobre gente que no sabe lo que hace Pantaloncito oscuro chicos Para la sudadita de culete Eso es, a sudar ahí como si lo hubiese mañana A veras ahí en Danán Como los veteranos Este va a molar un montón También quedan muy pocas plazas para el viaje a Japón Este verano con Blas Así que si quieres ir a Japón Pues que sepas que queda poquito hueco Y también hay pocas plazas para el viaje a Estados Unidos Este verano Que en este caso me parecerías a mí Also very little place, so if you want In a box of places, I'll be in the United States You'll see me the visao That you can't be in the United States Well, you'll see me Well, if you can't leave me in the car, I'll take a jacket Free, free Fernando Free Fernando Subscribe for the deportation We're going to be in the stretch of the area In a train, we're going to be We've lost the track, but no It's very cool because it's just after the World You're trapped and with a You're trapped in a You know what I've had to do I've been I've been I've been But well I'm going to And then I'm going to No, no, no I'm afraid of my My friends That's very good That's very good If you're interested That's a very nice thing In the description of the episode We're going to leave the link To the web of Wakea Travel For that you can consult There are Feeches, prices, itineraries or anything that needs. Or if you don't put it on the web of Guacquia Travel, and there you have it. Okay, this is the part in which we'll be able to do. This is a topic that we've been doing very long, because it's a very important topic. We've been thinking several times. We've had to design it, think it well. And it's time to come. Why do we talk today, in this podcast, about the crisis of the house? Because it's one of the great problems of the present, transversal to Europe and other countries, We have to see this problem as a national and exclusive, which seems to us that it only happens to us and it is so. And I'm sure that many of those who listen to us are experiencing this problem. Think about it in a recent conversation that you have had, which has been the issue of the issue of the house. Praticamente todas. Praticamente todas. In fact, according to the CIS, the house is the main concern of the Spanish in the actuality and at the European level there is also a concern. In fact, without going further, the European Commission includes a house of the housing, which is now a Danish, what is what evidence is that this has been opened in the European agenda, something that is understood as a national, now it is in the European Europe. The fact that it is transversal in many countries at the same time, it is a crisis characteristic of our time. It explains the world in which we live and the challenges we face. The crisis of the housing define our societies actual and therefore defines the future. And we cannot stop in the the crisis of the home, country by country, because it would be a chaos if we are here not three hours, but 150 years. Speaking of the crisis of the home in Slovakia, no, no, I'll say that. Because at the end we think that each one has its particularities, its context, and then, what we're going to do is that we're going to focus on the situation of Spain, which is where the majority of our listeners are, but in the European context, because there are other countries, and also because this crisis has international causes, se enmarca en un contexto global y se alimenta de él. Y aquí también es interesante porque nosotros tendemos a pensar que lo que determina la internacional son solo los grandes conflictos o dinámicas geopolíticas, ¿no? Pero también son este tipo de problemas y también estas crisis que tal vez percibimos como más cotidianas, pero que tienen su importancia. Entonces, tratarlos y entender su complejidad e impacto es importante. A mí me da mucha rabia cuando se analiza este tema en España, en informativos y demás, no se aborda y no se entiende la dimensión internacional del problema. And that is short It's not to understand what is this For that we are here Problem, solution Problem, solution This episode is for the people who travel The people who travel You have to have your two hours This episode is We are leaving the hell of the noise That everyone has to have And we are going to talk Of a serious issue And without us Basically So at the end, in this episode we will explain first what is happening in Spain compared to the rest of Europe. Then we will talk about multiple causes that explain the current crisis. We will also see that there are many and quite heterogeneous changes, that are from the changes demographic in the continent, the tourism, the concentration of housing in pocas hands, changes in the financial world, urbanism, or, for example, the lack or the inadequate of the houses that we have. The impacts of the crisis of the living room also are very varied, as we will see. We don't talk about a large market in the European market, but 27 national markets, each one with its characteristics and its history. So we will say that it is not the same how this crisis is in the cities of the south of Europe, of Europe, which has a large ratio of proprietors and a large offer of tourist tourists, than in Central Europe, in Austria, in Czech Republic, where there can exist a higher offer of social housing or protection, as well as a higher percentage of the rent, but it is true that it is still missing part of the immobiliate. And to look at the solution, we believe that it is worth also knowing what is happening in other countries, if it is applicable to the Spanish case. To have in mind all these variables will allow us to understand what can be done as a solution unique. You know, that basically we can't have a solution for this problem. And also what challenges we face the European Union to solve, I would say, the crisis most important of the last years and of the next. Yes, the idea a little bit about this episode is that you understand all the amplitude of variables and aspects that generate or that incite, that influence in the problem of the living environment and that you can understand the profundity, in profundity, each one of them. Because it's what he said, no are solutions sencillas, no is, is that it's for this. No, no is true. They're all about the same things, and you have to explain them and understand them well. So we're going to dedicate much time to this. But it's true that I think that we have to go ahead and go on a little bit, basically on the magnitude of this question. Why are we talking about a crisis of the house? how much has been subbed the price throughout the last years which I think is something that has seen and has seen many of these even in this table that we also have people who live in casa we are here padecendo this of the feet of a road over a road what I would say is that the living is a good thing that any person needs to have a minimum life like the access to food water, water, hygiene no is the critical that the house becomes inaccessible, that the house does not make the RAM of the computer. And that exceptionality in the house has been very much the context as the solutions. Let's talk a little bit about data. According to the last of the last of the year, the price of the house in the European Union, having in mind, both compra and alquiler, has been up with 64% since 2015. 10 years. In the case of Spain, that's been up with 84%. 20 points Por encima de la media europea Pero lejos de subidas como las que han sufrido En el bloque del este En el mismo periodo Por ejemplo, en Hungría Los precios prácticamente se han multiplicado por 4 Es una locura No comentaron lo de la vivienda Pero sí podíamos hablar con la gente de Telex Porque seguro que están trabajando Aunque es verdad que por ejemplo También estamos lejos de cifras de crecimiento Menos drásticas Como en Francia que ha crecido un 21% or Finlandia, which has reduced 1,7%. Who was finlandish? Sal. Well, it depends. I don't want to be in front of Russia. I have a danger every day. But well, here at the end we have one of the key of this crisis and it's that the price of the housing has been up very above the income of the population in the majority of countries. And if we look at this graph that we are projecting, that our colleagues have seen the ratio between the price of the housing and the income of the population in Europe. We have, for example, that Spain is located in a 14,2%. So that the price of the housing is going to be a 14% more than the salarios. Exactly. That is a very similar to the of Hungary. And, look, flip it with our residents of Portugal, that have a 54,4%. It's the country where the price has been higher than the salarios. It's a crazy. It's a barbarian. Yes, of course, we have talked with Portuguese and they are abandoning the main cities because the tourism is being a beast. At the end, the result of all this, that we have seen in the graph, is that one of every 10 European people can't afford to pay their rent, whether the mortgage or the time, what do you do? All this can be completed with data that I'm sure that I'm not sounding, because even in Spain we're a country of proprietors, the 76% of the Spanish people live in property, it's a percentage that is decreasing progressively and that every time it costs more to access. Today, the price of rent costs about 2.350€ per m2. This price would bring us to that a 70 m2 of rent cueste unos 165.000 euros. En ciudades con alta demanda será más, obviamente. Claro, esto es de media. Esto es de media. Bastante heterogéneos, claro. Claro, claro. Un estudio de Ipsos recoge que 7 de cada 10 españoles no propietarios declaran que no puede permitirse comprar una vivienda en el lugar en el que viven, en la ciudad o en el pueblo en el que viven. Esto lleva a mucha gente, como ha ocurrido siempre, a vivir de alquiler por defecto o bien como una forma transitoria hasta que puedan ahorrar para comprarse una casa. But here are the prices of the alquiler, which in Spain no stops to bat records, which these always are the new record of the price of the alquiler, which is quite a bit of a coin. We have a 9% in 2025 and the square meter to 14,7 euros of media national. Using the new house of 70 square meters, which we have used before, would be a more than 1.000 euros per month. And in other cities like Barcelona, it's already 23 euros per square meter, that by 70 meters would be overpassed to 1.600. A meter is a normal house, that is, that is, that is, that is, for a small family. Recordemos that the net net worth in Spain is around 1.700 euros. Here is the same as the price of the rent. I understand that this is another important factor. We know that in Spain the prices have been disparated in areas like Barcelona or Madrid, that at the end there is a special concentration of this problem in concrete areas. I don't know if this is a general problem, we have pointed a little bit to the beginning, or in our country, or in some of our countries, has some special incidence or has been increased the price. A ver, it's a general problem in all Europe, even in other countries, for example, like the United States, in fact, we will not sound like Azran Mandami, the new mayor of New York, which centred a lot of his campaign on the problem of the living in the city. And this also gives a point, and it's that the problem of the housing is mainly urban. The most important núcleos are the cities where there is a higher concentration of economic activity and labor opportunities, and therefore attract more population. The density attracts density. The most affected are the capital or cities with large centers economic or tourist places, and there are also places that are also destacated, and here is our country, because Barcelona and Madrid are the second and third city of Europe where the inhabitants dedicate the average more percentage of their salary to the alquiler. The 74% in both. The ranking of the top where you don't want to be. Exactly. A little bit, yes. And here we go to Portugal because we're the second and third and only we're going to get to Lisbon, where they dedicate the 116%. I think that's what I understand. No. Is it worth? No, if you have a partner between two people, you can pay a house. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. Or if you buy a home. That's what I do. So, this is, this is one of the epicenters of the crisis of the living environment at the European level. And then, after we go to other cities like Milan, Roma, Dublin, Atenas or Varsovia, with percentages that superan the 50%, which, of course, are quite high. What recommended is this, what they say, what they say in the European Union, is that you in the living environment pay in around a third of your income, more or less, 30, 36, 35%. Here we have that, 70% and pico, 116%. It's a barbarian. That's what we call that. is the impossibility, you have to live with someone, because a person is not possible. The Alba Sáhs who can earn much money, can't live in a city like Madrid or Barcelona. It's important to have this in mind because it is estimated that for 2050, the 83% of the European population will live in cities. It is already 70%, we are a very urban society. It's a matter that if it's put medidas, it's a problem that will go to more It's problematic today, but it's more problematic in the future And it's something that in Spain, as a study, we can see very well It's a tendency to fund it Well, it's that this is a pasajero No, no, it's that basically the tendency is to press there How many people are already in the podcast? I'm sorry, I'm sorry I'm sorry, I'm sorry I'm sorry, I'm sorry I'm sorry, I'm sorry I'm sorry, I'm sorry Well, I'm sorry Joder, if you're not going to be a value I'm sorry I'm sorry And also, you have to take into account that these large networks tensioners no contain the problem, but that the increase of prices expand and irradian, first to the periphery and then to the cities or networks more close. In fact, we don't understand the increase of prices in cities like Toledo or Guadalajara if you look at your proximity to Madrid. Or Segovia is also also disparating. Yes, yes. That's in fact with all the municipalities that are between medias. In a city like Madrid or Barcelona and an area metropolitan area... Yes, we can think about the same with the area urban of Barcelona. I know they have to have a lot of nuclear nuclear weapons. I know that in Sevilla, I know that in Sevilla, Malaga, it's a little so big, that at the end, like a hinterland, that's what we call it. In Cádiz, which we were the last day, we said that the city of Cádiz is empty and all the people have been in Fernando, Puerto Real and other people. Yes, yes, yes, yes. At the end, these are urban dynamics, which, as I say, are, are, are, are, are, no matter of course, not a matter of course, not a matter of course. As we said, the main goal of this episode is to understand why and how we have reached this crisis of housing, which we can see that is transnational and complex. Normally these crises are explained, at least in this case, as a kind of adjustment between the offer and the demand. If people demand houses and there is enough, this is the economic theory that is one of the adjustments of the price. The price tends to increase. And in fact, the European Bank of Investments Estima that they have to do about a million Of houses To support the demand that there is In the European market But I think it is also interesting That even if there is a component It is not only a change Of offer and demand But there are more things What do you do? Because in reality No is that we don't have enough And it is here where we have The first contradiction Aparente of all this issue If we take case to this other graphic that we are projecting now about the housing for every 1.000 inhabitants in the European Union, we see that in Spain we are above the media. It is to say, there are 563 houses for every 1.000 inhabitants. And there are even countries that have more, like Bulgaria with more than 600, or Portugal with 574. It is to say, we have about a average of a house for every 1,77 people. One house close to a house for every 2.000 inhabitants. It's something that also is extrapolated to other countries. The average of European Union is in a home for every 1,94 people. With this, in principle, there would be houses for everyone. If you put it like this, for the data, it would be a data. Well, I'm sorry, but in this case... Let's contextualize the data. Because at the end, there will be one who is listening to us and say, how is it possible that we are talking about a crisis of home if in reality, we are saying that there are a lot of home. And it's that in this apparent sense, we are going to one of the keys to understand this crisis. No nos tenemos que fijar en el número bruto de viviendas disponibles, sino dónde están situadas, el uso que tienen y también el estado en el que están. Por eso es compatible que falten viviendas con ese número elevado tan alto si de ellas quitamos, uno, las que no están habitadas o están en malas condiciones para habitarse. Dos, las que ya tienen un uso pero no es residencial continuado, casa en el pueblo, casa en la playa. Y tres, las que están situadas en zonas donde no hay demanda residencial. Villaculo de arriba. Well, there a lot of houses there are a lot of houses, but the people don't want to go there with much internet super-rápido that they put. That's right. That's right. So if we go to the data of where the land is really empty in Spain, we see that double-cara. In data of the 21st, the INE, the Spanish cities, as well as the coasts where the population is concentrated, the Mediterranean, the Basque Basque, especially, had a percentage of empty empty in 10%. And where are those places with many houses vacíes? Well, in the opposite Smalls smalls of the interior peninsula The area of the Castillas The interior of Asturias, Galicia What I don't like to call it But it's the Spain vaciated You know, the Spain vaciated That has a demographic There is a lot of houses For that we have an idea In the cities of more than 250.000 inhabitants Only there is a 3,6% of houses It's a, where there is a lot of people And probably where there is a lot of people want to live, there is no more housing available. And that pressure of demand against the low offer, does it? There are bases of data, I want to say that there is no longer what you can see. There is a map that has been a lot of curious in Torrevieja, there were more housing vacations than in Sevilla. It's a sense. I think it was the city where I was, in relation to the size, Torrevieja and Estepona, in Málaga, where the most, the most large number of people where more houses are vacated there are. But you think that it's Torrevieja and that it's Cepone and that's vacational. Right. You can't even live in Torrevieja in lieu of Valencia, Madrid or Barcelona. No is the same. And, of course, here for adding something, it's just to recognize that probably there is a proportion of houses vacated that could be in the market. And here, Jorge Burón, in the book... Javier Burón, right. Javier Burón, I'm going to go with him. O sea, in the book... Por his hermano. Su primo, but well. Burón, basically, for who wants to look, the book is called The Problem of the Vivienda, he is saying that it would be unas 450.000 the ones that they sell or sell, especially for two reasons. One is to keep it open, without it, to keep it open for a better price in future. And the other is to be afraid of that there is a occupation or a impago of the inquilinos, which then we will talk about this, which is another factor that plays a role. So that this adjustment causes a lack of a crony, which, in turn, makes impossible that the idea of a living asequible is materialized. Any home that is new or second hand, does it make prices of vieta or alquiler disparate because the demand is so high that it is likely to be able to pay people to pay that price. But that's not sustainable for a thousand reasons. That's why the people have never been able to pay for 30 or 40 years 40 years old, for very high that absorb their rents in an alquiler and difficult much the ahorro, and this is a norm that is more extend in large cities of Europe, but in large urban areas, and also in urban areas, not just Madrid and Barcelona. No, no, no, no, no, there are medias, for so to say it, that also happens to many of those who have invented or with success bought a house in the last years. If you call it, sale un anuncio, llamas, no, es que ya la han reservado, y es como que duran horas. No, no, no, y cada vez... Bueno, y los alquileres también, si eres el primero en ir a verla, igual tienes una opción, pero si eres el segundo o tercero puede que ya te la hayan alquilado, y estamos hablando de pisos que tienen unas calidades... Muy cuestionables. Muy cuestionables, con dudas de habitabilidad bastante profundas. ¿Cómo se llama la Instagram en esta que hace... Ay, es la mejor, no me sé su nombre. Yo tampoco, pero buenísima. La de Corre, que vuela. Sí, sí, sí. If you don't listen to, then you're a good one. But if you have a lot of people who buy or buy a piece of paper, you can't buy a piece of paper. You can't buy a piece of paper. You can't buy a piece of paper. So, if you have a piece of paper, you can't buy a piece of paper. You can't buy a piece of paper. But it's not that people go like that because they know that they're going to take their hands. Basically. Well, we have a little bit of the diagnosis, the radiograph of what is happening. But I think what interesting is what I'm interested in knowing is the reasons. this that we have told, what happened? What causes have we identified that incide in this problem of the living? Well, here comes the melon of this episode. We're going to open it up the melon. We're going to open it up the melon, which are the causes of this problem, of this crisis. As many are and we want to get rid of them well, we think it is better to go abord the different factors one by one, although, evidently, all are related to each other and they are retroalimented. Lo interesante es que vamos a ver qué razones o variables están impulsando la demanda de vivienda y también qué factores están haciendo que no aumente la oferta. Tanto unos como otros hay razones de todo tipo. Vamos a ver que hay factores económicos, que son los que tal vez no se nos vienen antes a la cabeza. Pues la situación de la economía en su conjunto, la pertenencia al mercado común europeo, la arquitectura de nuestro propio estado de bienestar, el mayor atractivo de la vivienda como activo de inversión o el auge del turismo o la movilidad internacional. Seguro que todas estas cosas nos suenan. Also there are demographic factors, that is, the changes in the population and their demand that influence in the increase in the prices. And of course there are political factors, and we could also say that geopolitics, because the policies of housing and urbanism, as well as the international context in which they are marked, have been key to understand the problems of the actuality. And here we will see very well the differences between the impact that Spain has suffered and how it suffers other countries in our environment. Perfect. So, let's start with the most economic, which maybe are the most amplious and the most important thing with this issue. This is what I'm going to say, I don't know if it affects the demand for the housing, but I'm going to call the attention that reference to the structure, architecture of the state of the bienestar. What does our state of the bienestar exactly with the issue of the house? It has to do in the sense that according to the type of state of the bienestar we have, the role that plays the house in it will be one or another. This is what we're going to explain. Spain, as in general, all the Mediterranean has a state of the bienestar based on the family. This implies that, although we have services publics, like sanidad, education, etc., cubrimos sus limitaciones with the network of family support. For example, the Nordic model puts all the weight on the state and that's why the system of goodwill is very generous from the public. We think about the finlandese and their education. There is a lot of confidence in the institutions. That's it. There is another model, that is, for example, the Anglo-Saxon, that puts the weight on the market. The ahorro, the investment, the emprended. The protestant, basically. The ethics protestant. The garage. That's it. For example, many families here in Spain, in order to have the services public of residencies or of attention to people dependents, they take care of them directly. In part, because of a obligation that is very cultural and in part, because the services public are insufficient, they are of mala quality and the private private are very expensive. That's what they seem to be a romanticize, but... A ver. Claro. That's what... I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. but also not romanticizing things that are the result of a precarious and a system that needs more investment and that recae where recae this will be more in future episodes I will be able to and not to be able to this will be more profound this will be able to extrapolate to crises more profound for example during the crisis of 2008 many families depend on the pension of the parents for their parents and that no parents that were families in the end in the end it's a question cultural that has raised in a way of doing politics. As there is no family care, ojo, many times, feminine, it doesn't make, quote, in a way of taking care, more profound. How do you combine this family with the house? What has to do? Well, the families feel it as a safe and safe and indispensable for the well-being. You can develop your life in it, add value to family family, and, as you can help your descendants or family. If you have another house, you can buy it, sell it if you go wrong or to pay for a residence or to get a home. The succession version of Spanish. Yes, that is. All this favorece that we are a country of proprietors. The 73% of the Spanish, as we said before, live in houses of their own property. Although the true is that it is the norm in Europe. For example, countries like Romania, Slovakia, Hungary or Poland superan the 80% of proprietors. This has to do with a liberalization after the communism, after the communism. This is something very particular in Europe. But that they prevalece the mentality of ensuring that they had in that social economy. It's very interesting. But for example, in other cases, like Austria, Germany or France, the price of the alquiler is much bigger. We have systems where the family is much less, we have systems where the state is more. So, we see how the proportion of the living room changes. Of course, in general, their states have been priorized or a state of the garantist, what we said before, many political policies that do not perceive as a risk, even that they promote, or a vision more privatized, like the of the Bages, which has been able to drive the rent and the rent and the rent. That leads you to a market with quite a lot of weight. But it's true that in the Occidental Europe, Spain and the countries mediterranean in general are the ones that have the most percentage of proprietors. And as we have explained, all this is not a casualty. I just want to go a little bit to that, listening to Alba, because it's not a matter of mentality, a lifestyle or a culture concrete, but also of political policies active. And in Spain we have had two very evident two very evidentes, which are the etapa of franquism, the franquism franquist, and the burbless. And here I will recommend an article from my dear Marco Bartolomé, because in 2024 we published a piece that we will leave in the description. Here we are going to find many references and articles. This article is called How Franco converted to Spain in a country of proprietors. and then Marcos explains that the French regime used the construction and the compra of housing as an incentive to generate a social that dejar to perceive a proletarian and would not be considered a class media, more apegated to the mobilization and that would be more important to the security. This, also providing a patrimonial rich to the population that previously didn't have anything, was also less problematic for the stability of the regime. The property conservatism is not that you become a traditionalist, but you are a bit more conservative because you have something your own. You have a security future. The idea of having a future in which you are dead, you are dead. And that is your problem. That is your problem. Curious, this policy was also the reaction of franquism to the changes in the era. In this case, and I will now tell you a story, the exodus rural, which in many periferias of cities, or at the end, it was translated in areas of an aluvian of infraviviendas and infrastructures. I, for example, my grandfather Pedro, he tells you that he built his house. There was a lot of people who came from Córdoba, from Andalucía, from Extremadura and lived a period in Chabolas that was tierra. I mean, it was like that he fell in the water and the water was absorbed. But this people lived there until they were able to get a house. That was an important crisis. I'll put the case of the case of Madrid. The Casas Bajas de Vallecas. It's very famous. The Casas Bajas de Vallecas were all those. They were all those. Chabolas, basically. Yes, basically. Inflavillage. Se cortaba a un bidón, se alargaba, se clavaba en una chapa y con eso se hacía la puerta. Y con unas bisagras. Esas eran las puertas que tenían. Entonces, ¿qué pasa? Lo que se hizo entonces, e incluso en amplias etapas de la democracia, fue construir barrios de vivienda baratos donde alojar a toda esa gente. Por ejemplo, en el caso de Madrid, that is what I know, Zarza Quemada It's Leganés It's a place where you have a lot of people from Jaén, from Córdoba because they were known and they were to those buildings Yes, in the periferia of the city in Barcelona In the Spain of the Tordos Verdes Exactly People from Andalucía, Extremadura, of the rural well, at the end of the periferia of the city Just, and from here we have a key idea The policies of urbanism and living condicionan a lot of how we think and how we live because it's not the same estar alquilado, que es el propietario vivir en un piso o en un chalet en un barrio denso o en un barrio con hileras adosados, con servicios públicos o sin ellos, y de esto hay un libro que es La España de las Piscinas de Jorge Diony, que para quien quiera, ahí también se lo dejamos a la descripción para que lo biche, que aborda un poco esa idea de cómo nos influyen los tipos de barrios en los que vivimos. O sea que hoy no tenemos mucho libro disponible por nuestra condición estructural del estudio Sí, nuestra situación de movilidad nos limita bastante We have to go to the false ondas. We are opening a book for books to order them. I have to go with Blas. Blas and Blas. Because the books are a lot. But yes, the housing, even the urbanism, we have never done anything about architecture and power In some moments In some moments Calm down Fernando What is that thought They are very condicionated to how we understand the world our society our economy in general Here, of course, I understand that in Spain we favor the property in front of the alquiler, a little bit by our mentality, our historical context, the structure of the state of the bien-being, which is something that also matters, but I don't want to be clear how that, at the end, that is that, that is that, that is that, that is a property, you know, a factor that explains the crisis of the living room? Well, it's a fair that that's a patrimonialist española favorece two things. The first is that there is always going to be a higher demand of the living room, or as a first living room, or as a second living room, or even as a second living room. The second is a huge break between those who are proprietors and those who want to but can't access to the living room. And this has been a long time, but it's true that, for sure, no es el factor que explica todo, más bien es la base sobre la que se asientan los demás. El primer ladrillo de esta crisis, si queríamos decirlo así, es un poco la base fundacional sobre lo que se construye todo. Hoy no te permito que empieces a construir viviendas con ladrillo y mortero. Es así de fácil. Claro, no, está prohibido. Pero, por ejemplo, si decimos que el primer ladrillo es esta idea patrimonialista de la vivienda, el segundo sería la liberalización del sector inmobiliario en España. Eso también es muy importante. As I said before, during the franquism, the access to the property in property through the construction of protected housing. It is to say, it was built to reduce prices and it was favored access to the credit. Also, although the market of the alquiler was minoritarian, it was much more regulated. There were clauses of the alquiler that allowed contracts indefinidos for the inquilinos, which are those famous contracts of ancient rent. And you can't kill it. You can't pay for 4 euros, you can't pay it. You can't pay it. Well, it's a little bit. What happens? that in the 1980s and 1990s, in the context of that neoliberal, the government of Felipe González, liberalized the market of the living in Spain. On the levels that we had seen before in our country. First, they first eliminated those protected goods and then, with the elimination of the bank of the IPA, the Spain, it was the end of the IPA. What happens? At that moment, it was the private market, so banks and cash of the arroz, those who started to dominate the sector immobiliated. And then there is the next combo breaker of José María Aznar with his Lei of Suelo in 1998, with the end of the market, which ends up with liberalizing the market and opens the door to the construction of the house that was known in those years 2000. That, in fact, they were able to build more of 6 million houses and it's a crazy thing. We can see it in this graph so we can see how it was. We can see it in a graph or in the house of proteges. In the second half of the 90's in the 80's it begins to grow. If there's a little bit of the crisis of Spain, the first half of the 90's will go down, but in the second half of the 90's in the coming of the 2000's, that's what they are. And then we see the caída of the crisis financier of 2008, which is a absolute explosion. The capcracker basically. Here we go to the house of the house, which, as far as reduce the prices, the fire. The floor of the house multiplied by 4 and the house of the house by 2,5. Todo un caramelo para especuladores y para corruptos. Y la clave de esta burbuja fue la retroalimentación de dos factores. Una demanda de vivienda altísima, parte de ella con una lógica especulativa, y una ola de crédito fácil por parte de los bancos, que se lanzaron a regalar hipotecas que alimentaban toda esa demanda. Se llegaron a conceder hipotecas a 50 años y eran habituales las financiaciones del 100% o incluso el 120%. Una barbaridad y síntoma evidente de los excesos de esta época. ¿No se regalaban teles? And the vajilla. And the vajilla. And the sartén. But well, then we're going to the crisis financier of 2008, in which it's already the global market market. By the crisis of the subprime market in the United States, here we also have that connection of situations that were also in other parts of the world. And well, we know all the results. Desahucios, loss of jobs, cuts, cuts, banks and cash, and one of the same accelerations economic of which we cost us to recover more than a decade. I think that those who grew up in this context, Well, obviously, we all remember very well But I think it's a very good That we remember Because we had no idea But I think We're very much I think our generation And even the anterior The anterior arm Those who grew up Those who were coming out of the labor market In these years We're studying In this era Those of the 85, 90 Those of the 15,000 Yes, yes They remember very well This trauma, well, brought a lot of money in terms of housing And it's that it's not to build so much And it's closed all the lines of easy This is what we're going to see It's that it's a trauma in Spain This crisis Yes, yes, yes In part I understand But I think there's a lot of people But there's a lot of people that have been in the end of the year In September of 2006 They gave up more than 126.000 visas Of new In August of 2013 It's a year later The number was 1.600 That's a lot of people A 99% less But in these extreme cases, now in Spain we build quite little, about 10-12.000 houses per month, when in the burglary, the usual was between 40.000 and 80.000 houses per month. In the next we will see why the construction of houses is below the normal, by simple changes demographic and economic growth in the country, the population demand. And in 20 years have been many things and the price has changed. That's right. To make a reference, before we go further, and this is also a very important data, The Bank of Spain estimated that the deficit is of 700.000. It is the difference between the number of new houses available and the homes that are created, the family units. This is today, 700.000. Today, we have 700.000. We have 700.000. We have 700.000. Basically, according to the Bank of Spain. And the 50% of this bouquet is in Madrid, Barcelona, Valencia, Alicante and Málaga, which are the areas with more demand. These cities, these big suburbs. At the rate of the building we now, we would have to take between 60 and 70 years to end with the deficit. Well, we are going to die in the process, folks. The problem is that also that the deficit increases every year. And increases also because there is a restriction of credit. Like the banks are more strict, which also is good, not necessarily a critical, they can't pay off the 80% and revisan that no longer overpassing the ratios of debt. And this difficult a lot, especially young people, the access to a property in property. So for them, the plan B is the market of the alquiler, very liberalized, with astronomic prices, is a cost-offer and that is perceived as a inseguer both by inquilinos as by proprietors for different reasons. And that leads to a trance. Like the rents are not high, but if the rents are not high, the families cannot afford too much and as they cannot afford too much, they cannot buy a house. And it's a little bit. It's a circle of the world of which it's very difficult to leave. This is a very heavy problem here. I know there are young people who understand perfectly this problem. I think there are a lot of people of age, that as they have bought their house, they have been paid for it, they are not very aware of the size of their children. That is, that is, they are seeing their children. Yes, but as something with a certain distance, not with the size of their children. This is a very gourd, gourd, gourd, and very profound. Yes, but a little bit of a little bit. But it is not in the public. Yes, and then we will see, but at the end, many parents have to give their children a house for a home. They pay the entrance, or they make a loan for you to buy that house. Or they make a loan in the house until 32 years that you can pay. Of course, we have the family that helps you, not the state, not the state. Entiendo that this demand of the local population for finding a house, which are many millions of Spanish, is another tendency where Spain also stands, and it's tourism. We also have talked about tourism in this podcast. because of course, tourists come to Spain in some places they have to sleep and in the last years, we have mentioned our country is in full obsession for reaching that number of 100 million tourists which is a lot of people remember that the other day when... I don't know, it's one thing 100 million tourists is a lot it's a lot two times the population of Spain but well, the problem here is that in some way there is to put 100 million people every year, you know? Yes, they have the bad habit of sleeping Exactly In 2015, there were 97 million tourists from abroad Those who have to sum up, the Spanish When we do the interior That we are not saying We do not have a night As we have talked about In 2006, that's the peak of the bubble That year, in Spain, there were a little more of 58 million tourists That is, that has increased a 67% The number of people from 2006 That every year in our country And also, if we have a map of the places where tourists go, this map, which we have in our Atlas, I'll take a promo, because we are here, because we are in the mudanza, coincide a lot with the density of Spain, which is also where the problems of living, and that is where the living room is urban. In those areas of the displacement, yes, are issues related. canada, ¿no? Se puede argumentar que la vivienda y el alojamiento turístico tienen una relación de suma cero, es decir, que lo que gana uno lo pierde el otro. Si hay un solar disponible que se construya un hotel, hace imposible que se construya un edificio de viviendas y viceversa, ¿no? Aunque se podría argumentar que un hotel es mucho más eficiente que en el uso del suelo, ya que es capaz de alojar a mucha gente en poco espacio. Pero sobre todo, hay una suma cero en la vivienda de uso turístico. O sea, una vivienda que se alquila a turistas es una vivienda que no se alquila a personas que quieran vivir ahí. Yes, yes, but... Innegablemente. Claro, entonces, si entendemos que la crisis de la vivienda es un enorme desajuste entre la oferta y la demanda, si seguimos tirando del hilo por la parte turística, vemos que hay cada vez más relación, ¿no? O sea, hemos comentado que el número de turistas creció un 67% entre el 2006 y el 2025. ¿Crecieron en una proporción similar las plazas hoteleras? No. O sea, de hecho, el INE, o sea, con el INE, España pasó de tener 1,25 millones de camas en hoteles en abril de 2006 to less than 1,6 million in the April of 2015. That's a 28% increase. But there are many more tourists and rooms available. Exactly. If you have increased a 67% of the tourists, the rooms, a 28%. We see that. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. There are a lot of tourists, basically. Of course, this has made it more rentable to hotels, to increase their occupancy, but it's not to think that we have managed to accommodate 40 million people with 350.000 more cameras. In fact, the pernoctations have increased more than the travelers in those years. They have been up to 78% of tourists, and they have more time. They have more time, where they have been displaced all the demand of transportation if they can or not pay a hotel. Well, the tourist tourist. There is the peak of the tourist tourist. And this is a central element in the crisis of the tourist tourist. Not only in Spain, but in all Europe. In the areas of the Mediterranean, in France, it has been very well the impact that have had the platforms in the touristification of the tourist. Here we are building a map of the nights reserved in travel vacational in Europe. We have all the Mediterranean as... Airbnb, Booking, Spezia, Tripadvisor... That's all. We have, for example, the macrocephalia of Paris, also as a great tourist tourist. It is a lot of the coast croata. Again, a dynamic that is Spain-European. The aparition of platforms, as said, Airbnb in 2008, has expanded this tourist market, as well as a central model in countries like Spain or Italy, but that also the suffer in in the center of Europe, in cities like Paris, Berlin or Amsterdam, where the prices of the Vienna also have increased significantly. With this issue, there have been different investigations of all types, and it seems, for example, that in Berlin, it seems that the influence of Airbnb, the price of prices have been minimal, but in Paris, it seems to have been quite relevant, that has a very clear impact. The difference between both is that Paris is a very tourist city, and Berlin, not so. So, if this type of platforms play at the tourism heat, and this in Spain has increased a 67% in less than 20 years, Well, we can imagine it. We can say that the more demand is turistic in a place, more can these platforms have more influence in the price. That is. In cities like Barcelona, almost the 40% of the tourist attractions are parking. And those are the 10.000 that are recognized with the tourist tourist. But then there are many that work without licenses. Yes, that is, of course. In fact, the INE is that in Spain there are 350.000 tourist attractions announced in portals. and this may seem a lot but it is 1,40% of the Spanish Park and only half of the breached in the end of the year. This only has an influence in specific areas for tourism. Yes, this is what we will see, but the people say that all the houses become normal, well, even so, even the half of the houses that have left today. But again, here we can see how the number is important. 50.000 is with houses. This is just for adding the mati that this is a factor to have in mind that it is a cause that explains the crisis of the house, but that it is not explained in all the cities. It is this and it is not. And also, we think that it has been a model attractive, because in origin, these tourist tourist places allowed to many small or proprietors to obtain extra extra for their house in a crisis. And then it was confirmed that it was more safe to pay a tourist than a family, because at the end it's rare that a tourist no pay, and menos when the reserve through a platform that has to pay for the payment. And the rentability that could be taken out of the residencial was higher than with a residencial. And that was the sign for the big capital to start putting money on the rents to enter the rents or to convert them in touristy houses. And at that moment, the tourism and gentrification were already imparable. And here I also have a more general reflection. And it's that the crisis of the rents is retroalimenta. But it's not just the calculation of the rentability of the tourism that you're going to leave more benefits than a inquilino, but that every more proprietors see that to buy can be a risk. If we are in a situation in which the prices are not going to be more people perceive the inquilinos desperate as something that they prefer not to be faced. They are those who decide not to buy, but those who have to pay for the prices for gaining more money as to make sure inquilinos of high power adquisitive, they give more security. If you buy a company I mean, medicals, engineers, Spanish, family immigrants with jobs inestables. This is also the structural racism that we see in the alquiler. And this is what it is left out to a lot of people. There are, in fact, there are some stories of terror in the conditions that put a lot of people who are alquiler that they ask you a unicorn, a printer, and a life labor as if you were here. When we looked at in Zaragoza, I was not aware of the techniques mafia, but mafia. It was the AMPA of Vito Corleone that was used. I was like, do you take it or leave? And give me your name and the B. I was like, what are you going to say? I think I have more information about myself than trying to get a living room. And even if you ask me, It's also the idea of the privilege of being professionals blancs with stables. When you take any of these elements, you think of a person racialized with a stable job, and it's impossible to access the market. It's impossible. It's hard. Yes, yes. This is a very extended reality that, at the end, is precisely in all that is not a scarcity and that, precisely, those who want to live in a place they don't have the opportunity to choose, to say, well, if you don't want to do it, you can do it to another person. That's what happens. The opposite is the proprietor that tells you, if you don't want to do it, you will come to another person and you will pay for it. So you will see if you pay or not. And this is quite a lot. Also, this is not only a fund of investment. There are many small proprietors that act in a way of ethical way. Well, and then there are the immobiliations, which are also... Yes. Yes, another... Muerden a one, muerden al who vende the house and the that the alquilates or the that the complements. And they're like, but they're taking... Well, no, no, no, no, no, no. You, like inquilino, you're a peleon. But, well, it's what we said. That, again, this is not only a active of some families for earning a job. This could be more in origin, but this has changed the model, has been evolving, and, at the end, it's the definitive step that we have to understand the living as a business. Here is where they enter the big investors or the investment fund, A whom many times they say also as the most culpables behind this crisis. Explain also what role they play, how much the immobiliated control and basically what is their influence in the immobiliated general. Well, about the role, in the end what they do is basically magnify the problem of the price. Because in the bottom, a small tenant has a limited capacity to influence the entire market. Ojo que esto no quiere decir que no tengan responsabilidad en esta crisis porque no dejan de ser el 80%, ¿vale? Claro. O sea, el 80% de la gente que alquila es gente que tiene una casa o dos. ¿Qué pasa? Que un gran tenedor va a multiplicar sus beneficios mucho más porque cuantas más casas tenga, más capacidad tiene de adquirir otras casas, ¿no? O sea, acabamos con el monopolio. Claro, sí. Básicamente acabas concentrando una gran cantidad de oferta y por lógica de mercado, pues, tienes más capacidad de marcar o influir en los precios. And also, the European Council of Europe Avisa of the risk of that these investors Especially when they are large corporations Internationales They don't invest in the benefits In the areas where they are That is a rich That is a rich that no permeates Tanto in the territory as in other cases It is a extracción of rent And you carry on Who has invested in that They also have to renovate less And to increase the prices much more That the local or particular that maybe they can look for a constant income and long term. According to an investigation from Diario.es, now even these funds control more than a million houses, or 4% of the Spanish Park Immobilist, almost 9% if we exclude the first house, a percentage that in communities like Madrid or Catalonia supera the 10% of the house available. It's a way, recordemos that they don't have enough, because there is a very much market that's tension. Yes, but the 10% of something is scarce, it gives power to the market. It's a 10%. And above all that implies that a fund has a loan, which is what we said, that at the end it is not a loan for the city as a result, because it is not a small property that then it is a loan, I don't know, or something like that, and above all, with contracts more restrictives. And this again is a problem that is replicated in our European countries. In Ireland, about half of the new houses have been bought for investment funds. In Sweden, they have been bought the 24% of the free market of goods, and only in Berlin have 40.000 million euros in immobiliations. Of course. Of course, it is important to know who are these great owners. There are also people who are particular, investors mainly, but the person particular, the person physical, represent only the 17% of the total of these great owners. The majority, according to this investigation of Diario.es, have between 10 and 25 houses. Poco superan this number. They have to have a lot of houses. But it is also significant that there is a whole of investors with between 10 and 25 homes. Yes, yes, yes. The big owners of Verga are the private sector in a 60% and the public sector in a 23%. The first are companies, CINIS, banks and the famous fonds buitre, which have a particularly aggressive activity in the investment of living. They look at high rentability, buying blocks enter and they look at the insurance price and they look at the insurance price. They look at the insurance price or try to expulsar a neighbor. With Blackstone, which is one of these funds and one of the biggest investors in Spain, have been some news related to this type of cases. And then, for example, the bank CaixaBank is the biggest private provider of the country. That, in all, this is not very rare because the banks have a lot of housing available normally for tax payers. In fact, many banks have their own housing to give their money to these active, Solvia, Habitat and all these. Then, the public agencies, like the social media of the communities, remember that in Spain the competition of construction and gestion of housing is of the autonomous communities and not of the state central. And these are the ones that are dedicated in part to housing or asequibles. But in all ways, we don't think that the public housing is particularly asequible in Spain. It also is affected by the problems of the offer and the carecimiento of the construction. In the fact, in the portals, in the immobiliations, you have to meet a VPO in wherever you are. And the price is of all at least asequible. A lot of people are more expensive than the living in that area. But there is no difference. No es una locura. Y con calidades que eso también lo... Sí, sí, sí. Claro. Luego aquí tenemos, por ejemplo, a uno que seguro que nos une mucho aquí en España, que es Lazaret, que sería algo así como una institución mixta, privada, pero creada con capital público, y que es uno de esos grandes tenedores de vivienda. Tiene cerca de 42.000 viviendas y 17.000 obras en curso, pero no ha sido hasta muy recientemente que han empezado a liberar ese parque para vivienda social. Pero de nuevo, pongámoslo en perspectiva, no todas las viviendas tendrán demanda. There are many promotions from 2008 built in places rare, for a pelot of a urbanization perd in the hand of God. That's a sign. That's a sign. There's a lot of people. Yes, yes. But no, there's a vision for a pelot of a pelot. There are promotions in Villaculo del Monte, which this was noted that he did in 2006 to make a pelot of a pelot of a pelot. And then, obviously, then they were eating with potatoes. And then, in the best of cases, this type of promotions would be between a 6% and a 8% of the demand of the actual. is something, no hay que desestimarlo, but no the remedy definitive. So, at these times we start to see how more than a cause or a specific problem, this is the sum of many small small very differentiated depending on where we look. It's a concatenation of elements. What I call the attention is that, of course, the immobiliario has become so attractive, more than from our tradition or culture, for resumption, that the ladrillo has always been considered a kind of investment, tirando conservadora, ¿no? Había poco riesgo y a cambio también hay poca rentabilidad y menos aún a corto plazo. A corto plazo es muy difícil rentabilizar una vivienda. Claro, en personas individuales, en inversores individuales, esto lo puede entender, pero en fondos de inversión o grandes capitales, me sorprende que haya de repente canalizado tanto dinero a la vivienda cuando, lo que decimos, que en general era una inversión más a largo plazo, poco rentable, un poco de chop-chop. Claro, pero aquí hay cuestiones diferentes. At least in Spain, the great investors, for example, are moving towards luxury or a high level of acquisition. It's to say hotels of 4 and 5 stars, urbanization of high standing. If the house is more expensive and costs more access, the high levels of acquisition are the ones that can absorb in a way more simple all those prices. And at the same time, are the houses that better margins will have. You can buy more or less the same and they sell more expensive. So you're in a top zone, so you're in a top zone, so you're in a top zone. But here I'm going to put another variable. We've talked about the demand of national buyers, we've talked about tourists and we've talked about the funds of investment. But there's another part of the demand that comes from foreign traders. So, since 2014, they're representing, except for the pandemic, in around 20% of the rents of our country. It's a bestiality. It's not a bad, right? It's a 20%. Yes, yes, yes. And they're, especially European, British, French, French, British, French, British, British, that buy in large cities and also in the Mediterranean. Or in some areas of Barcelona or in provinces like Alicante, Málaga or Tenerife, they have about the half of the buyers. And this has several reasons. Here I'm going to tell you an anecdote. I told you the other day that there is a trend now in TikTok. Okay. That is the Americans living in Madrid. Okay. And that is a crazy amount of Americans. That is not a tiroteer. No, no, and of course, saying what is Madrid is saying. se está poniendo muy de moda para los Yankees el venirse a vivir en Madrid y es como tú no lo estás moviendo y está pasando ahí, ¿no? O sea, hay varias razones para todo esto que vemos. La primera es socioeconómica. O sea, a nivel de los europeos, también estadounidenses nos valdría aquí. Desde la pandemia se dispararon las tasas de ahorro en toda la zona euro. ¿Qué pasa? Que la incertidumbre ha matado la inversión productiva y muchos pequeños ahorradores pues buscan inversiones más seguras. Entonces, la vivienda es una de ellas y España, pues, So, for our situation of crisis, it offers very good rentabilidades because there is a demand. But then there is another factor, and it's that the Spanish prices for the European context, the same, chicos, are quite reasonable. So, yes. In the first semester of the 25th, the Spanish prices bought a 1.800 euros the square meter. Ojo, ¿vale? The US, Switzerland, Sweden, Norway, Germany, overpassed those 3.000 euros. Those are the Swiss that bought in Spain. Exactly Pagan más Y los de Francia, Países Baja, Reino Unido, Italia Unos 2.400 euros Hay mucha diferencia Claro Y es decir El comprador internacional suele pagar Entre un 33 y un 90% más Que el comprador español Y en las zonas de interés Para estos compradores Esto infla mucho más los precios Es decir ¿Para qué vas a vender tu piso Por 200.000 euros Cuando llega un guiri Que le puedes sacar 300.000? Pues evidentemente Una familia O alguien que tenga ese piso Dice Pues se lo vendo por 300.000 euros ¿Sabes? Pese a que el salario medio en Estados Unidos duplica al español, y el salario promedio alemán es de unos 4.500 euros frente a los 2.300 brutos españoles, ¿no? O sea, en esas zonas, el comprador español promedio solo puede aspirar a quedarse con lo que el británico o el alemán no quiere. Y aquí podríamos meter también ahora las clases altas latinoamericanas que se están viniendo a España. También, claro. Eso parte en Madrid. En Madrid se ve mucho, ¿no? Y si no hay mucha oferta disponible, pues puede que la respuesta básicamente sea nada, ¿no? Claro, lo que te queda a ti se lo han quedado todos los británicos, alemanes, a veces... Y además con esto no hablamos de nuevo de Madrid, estamos hablando de zonas de la costa... Costa Miterránea, pasa muchísimo. Y hay un tercer factor, y es que no se trata de una inversión especulativa o de mil millonarios, no. Muchos de los compradores son renta medias, gente jubilada o que se jubilará en pocos años y que ve en España un lugar agradable, barato, con servicios públicos, seguridad, bien conectado con sus países de origen. In fact, I encourage you to see the amount of international connections that you have in Mallorca, in Málaga, in Palma or in Alicante. When we go to Alicante, you see a lot of hours from your house here. And you say, this random people here in the United States. I tell you two anecdotes. One, no one is going to be the only one. Well, yes. No, it's quite explicative. One is, for example, I told you in the moment a lot of people in the immobiliated sector, that the foreigners bought a house in Spain before they were tourists. That's why a German is exponencial now. 100 million more people will buy. That's the problem. The tourist of today maybe is the buyer within 5 or 10 years. The German that now is love to the coast of the sea will want to buy a house in the coast of the sea? One time, he likes Spain, he comes two, three, four times and he says, the price is good, what would be good if I would like to jubilar myself here? I would buy a house. And this is not only in the coast of the sea, in places traditionally touristy, where I think this is a lot. It's a lot of people. It's a lot of people. But for example, in Asturias, my family is asturian, it was normally the north of Spain no has been characterized by being one of the most touristy of this country, more national tourism, of other people. But with the fact that it is less and it is a place more agradable, in which it is not so much heat in the summer, it is bringing much investment and much people, many European and European countries se están comprando casas y haciéndose casas en terrenos que antes igual se dedicaban a una agricultura de subsistencia o ganadería y ahora están aflorando muchísimas casas de Asturias como lugar de moda tanto para gente nacional pero también muchísima inversión europea. Y es un cambio que se está viendo mucho y que se comenta mucho dentro de Asturias que además no es una comunidad que esté especialmente acostumbrada a ser un lugar turístico. Claro, y de hecho además hay otro cambio y es que vemos como surgen nuevas potencias o países que atraen este tipo, o sea, que vienen este tipo de compradores. Por ejemplo, Polonia. O sea, hace 20 o 30 años veníamos a Polonia como un país en vías de desarrollo, pobre, salió el comunismo y tal. Pero su crecimiento ha sido tan brutal que ha empezado a crear unas clases medias altas que ya pueden comprar una casa en España. and it's a country of almost 40 million inhabitants so I don't know that all those countries well, in fact, we had to go to a country in Carnagena we had a man who was dedicated to the sector immobiliary and he came and he told me what happened with the polacos that they come and they buy the casas and they say, I'm not going to buy casas to polacos in all the places in Murcia and he was fliping the guy but of course, he had 30 years a polacos no paint anything in Spain but now he's done and to all this, also add is a no cualquiera a nivel europeo, pero rentas medias altas que quieran vivir bien y tranquilo. España es un chollazo y claro, eso al final tiene una incidencia muy evidente sobre la vivienda. ¿Y no hay problema de violencia con las armas? Pues sí. ¿Y tenemos a Mandarino aquí? Pues claro. Claro, este es el tema que muchos dirán, mira, yo me piro de aquí. Me jubilo en España y de nuevo, que si quiero estar en Alemania, es que tengo un vuelo a Frankfurt, tengo tres vuelos a Frankfurt al día. Bueno, para un estadounidense. Y estoy en dos horas. Imagine a a estadounidense The most important thing is to cruise From one coast to another Are six hours A New Yorker How many hours are Madrid and New York? Six hours Seven Eight or so I think Six hours of change They're seven or eight hours It's like going to drive in a car A Cádiz from Madrid A little more For them it's like I live there And a estadounidense of New York That has to be able to drive in California Are how many hours of the car Yes, it's the same That probably coming from New York Then we can also We have to do this. Yes, it's that the relationship of time and distance also is important. Let's go. Here, what curious is that all these people, of whom we have talked, they don't stop being immigrants. With much money, everything you want, but immigrants. Before you mention that, as far as economic reasons, there are also very important changes that have been produced in Spain in the last decades. So, I think it's also worth it to look at the fact that we'll be able to repass. Because we'll see that they have also incidences on the issue of the living. Here, before all this, there is a crucial element, which is the unit of measures that we are using, which is the idea of the house. This will be a little bit. I promise. We'll be able to get the definition. We have given the data that the Bank of Spain estimates that they have to be 700.000 homes for the homes that are created in the year. But exactly what is a house? The INE defines how the person or a group of people that have in common a family family or part of it and that consume and share food or other services with cargo of the same budget. One person living alone is a home, as it would be a family, with or without children, and even a group of friends in a shared room could be understood as a home. Now in Spain, there are more than 19 million homes with 2,5 people in each. In fact, if you multiply both, you give the population of the country. Yes, for that we get a little bit of the relationship. It's a check. And the INE is that until 2039, they will create about 250.000 homes in each. Those are more than 3 million homes that need more than 3 million homes that today no exist or are not in the market. Because for that to create a new home, we need a home where we can reside. If not, that people form a part of another home more large. Let's say some examples. One family with two children is a home. Those children grow and each one is independent with their family or with friends. Now there is no home, there are three. And this is what would happen now with our generation. The situation wants to be independent and form a new house, but it can't because to buy a house or to buy it is not acceptable. And that is important because, as there is a strong pressure of new homes, there is also a artificial home that can't create because the conditions can't allow it. And that's where the frustration is. Remember that the age of media emancipation is of 30,3 years, which is one of the highest in the European Union. We live with our whole bunch with our parents. also also influence here the divorce in Spain, they produce between 80.000 and 100.000 in the last decade how is the thing and all those those are rotas need a place where they need to live, so they demand and create new homes I think here, a little bit of a parenthesis before we talked about how the generation more boomers of our parents seems to be a bit a bit a bit a bit and that maybe they start to identify also by their children I also add to that those marriages, those couples that divorce also suddenly suddenly get the front with the problem of the living room I know people that have happened And that there is no people that separate and can't separate or have to go to the house of the people and live together because we are well here but we are not together but we have to share this house because I don't want to allow another thing but well, I'll go back let's say that a house only disappears when they fall in all their members or are absorbed to form part of another or a higher age, people who are going to live with a child or who come to their parents. There is another factor determinante that is, as we said, the immigration and the increase of the population in general. The population needs a lot of people. In the peak of the bubble, at the end of 2006, Spain has overpowered 45 million people and it is probable that throughout the 2026 reach 50 million people. The total of this increase is due to the immigration because we are a country that has problems of natalty quite large. Even so, to be able to reference, because there are discourses that the problem with the living room would be if there were more immigrants. No. Of course, a country that maintains its population, or that no receives any immigrants, for the reasons that they are, can need new homes, for what we have mentioned, because there are people who live in homes, which go to other homes, or people who divorce. It's to say that if the population of Spain doesn't receive any immigrants, even so, they would need new homes for the social dynamics of the population. So that why that creation of new homes It because of the simultaneous pressure of young people who want to be independent families who are and the immigrants who come to Spain to live which are more than the young people who come to work or young people who come to work All of them demand a living, as also does the tourism national or international. Even here we can add to the people who, for a thousand reasons, want to change their living, maintaining their home. That's amazing. I think the Confi was the other day. in Madrid I think they were how they were 100.000 people the year ago they had built I don't know I don't know 5.000 6.000 10.000 a little more but it was very little so it was a a sign and the country also the idea of the Spain is to be aware of that we have to be aware of that to attract people and extranjero and tourists are very good but you have to have some way to alojar and that normally the cargo that they make is obvious the potential homes that can be created. We always talk about that there are 100.000 people in Madrid, but no are only 100.000 people that need to be in the middle of the day. There are a lot of people who have a number of ages or have a economic level that can be formed in a home and can not be formed. A lot of people are 130.000 people 140.000 people that every year need to be in a home. Yes, and here, for example, we have talked about the intercourse of the intercourse. The family that lives in Zaragoza wants to come to live in Madrid and wants to live in Madrid. that they need to change their residence and they need to leave a living in a place and then we can go to another we also have the idea of what they offer in the cities we think we have a student that lives in a village or in a city media and that at the end where does it go to study a city that has a university and that student demands a living in a university you are in Sevilla with me yes that this professor that every more students are changing The days of training of the students to concentrate on a whole day because they can't afford a living. So they come from the villages of the area and maybe from Jaén, then they go to a day in the car. Or from Córdoba. Of course, they go to a day in a vehicle and then they go to the university and then they go to the university and then they go to their houses. And that's what happens. In fact, in the city where they are. And many people who go to Madrid and come to study. No, no. And also think about the opportunities lost in that. There are students who are not only allowed to be allowed to be paid for the career. It's not allowed to be allowed to be allowed to be allowed to be allowed. Or where they are in their studies. That's what the university is not only in the university. And that's not necessarily only in the university. Think about in the format of all the FPs. Yes, and also they said they were a factor of competitiveness. People who can't be able to be where they need to be. And people who maybe don't want to work in a place. because if I can't, I don't know, but I'm not a living, but I'm not a living, but I'm not a living. I'm sorry, but your offer doesn't interest. It's a problem for the companies that can't capture new workers. We have to look for a lot of people. That's a factor that also influences a lot. They say, look, do you have a job or do you have a job? Or do you have a job or do you have a job? Yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes. It's a kind of a kind of problem. It's a kind of a kind of problem that's a kind of problem. It's a policy. That's a good thing. Yes, I'm not a problem. In all, I'm saying because those who look for solutions or simple diagnostics here will not find them. Here they will find them. And things more complex. Before you have pointed out with the problem of where is the available offer available. And we find that we have a higher size of the city, in general, less percent of the vacancy of the vacancy, because of that phenomenon of more urban pressure. But also, it's a question if the internal configuration of our houses se adapta a estos nuevos hogares de los que estamos hablando. Aquí la propia casa también influye en dónde queremos vivir. Aquí, Fernando, 12 pisos para arriba. Así. Luego hablaremos de solución, Eduardo. Perdóname, que me adelanto. Te adelantas. ¿Cómo? Ay, básicamente... Grand tower para todo el mundo. Total. No, pero este es otro tema interesante y no solo es un problema de España. O sea, según el Consejo de la Unión Europea, el 85% de las viviendas europeas se construyeron antes del año 2000. Estamos hablando de un parque de vivienda muy envejecido, con una eficiencia energética anticuada, unos tamaños y una distribución que tenían más en cuenta al modelo de familia y de hogar de 4 o 5 personas y no tanto a la persona sola o a la pareja sin hijos o con un solo hijo que tienes actualmente. La familia también cambia. Claro, hay un problema de infraocupación de la vivienda, es decir, ocupamos mucho más espacio del que realmente necesitamos. In Spain, half of the population lives in houses with more dormitories than those that really use them. But this also invites us to another reflection that is a little bit in the opposite of what I would like to say. We have a living room as a dormitory, a place that is used to be for the night. And maybe that idea has been obsolete and maybe we are living in houses with the buildings that we need. Because in the last years we have seen the increase of telework. If we need our house and our house to work from them, and that they don't have to sleep, then maybe... You have a house in your depatch, you also have a room. Yes, we have three dormitories in the house, we have one, evidently, and the other one. It's true that if I had a crie, you would sacrifice the dormitory. The crie is a stall. No, no, no. But what I do is, you have to think about that. Also, a little bit about putting on the table and say, it's that I have occupied much space, or maybe not. No cambian los usos que se le da al espacio de la vivienda, que pasó en pandemia, mucha gente teletrabajando con el portero en las rodillas porque no tenía un lugar en la casa donde poder hacerlo cómodamente. Bueno, pues también las habitaciones sirven para adaptarse a las necesidades de la propia población. Ese es el tema, y esta idea al final de la adaptación también aplica a las infraestructuras de estos edificios. Pensemos que cada vez somos una sociedad más envejecida. ¿Cuántos pisos de las grandes ciudades tienen ascensor? O sea, o espacios que permitan cuidar a personas con necesidades especiales. O también en el aumento de los precios de la electricidad. how many floors are being isolated from the heat, from the cold, from the wind, because if you have to leave half of your income in the parking lot, another important percentage is going to be in the air conditioning, the conditions of life also are in the way. In fact, related to this, there is a habit of a common phenomenon. It is called the attention that around the 35% of the rents in Spain are not in the hipoteca. You see, this idea of... Plaga! I think when I read the news, I think, but the Yes, you have bought a Tocateja. Yes, of course. Many of these purchases are of investors or foreigners that have been paid, but also is often the case of families whose children have been independent, the house that they have is very large, they are paid, they sell for a smaller and cheaper, and at a time in a more quiet zone. Of course, these operations are not in a higher, because the sale of the large house, that is a family of old, you help to pay a Tocateja, not a small house. This also happens a lot. There are people who are going to get married, where it's a point of view that they buy houses more small and they leave it paid. That's also a relief. And also there is the opposite phenomenon, because they can convivize, which is the preoccupation. And this is basically when there are many more people in a living of the normal capacity of this. Well, families entire durmiendo in a dormitorium and things like that. This is due to affect, as we know, more families of low income, more immigrants with little resources, etc. Además, the high prices of the alquiler incentivize, in some way, that there is a subarriendo of dormitorium to pay in conjunto the alquiler. this is... ...varias familias que viven en un piso a mejor cada uno de un dormitorio. Esto se está dando muchísimo. Claro. Curiosamente, España en este ámbito no está demasiado mal. La tasa de sobreocupación de viviendas fue del 9,1% en 2024 y es el dato más bajo en los países del entorno. En el este de Europa es habitual que esta tasa sobrepase el 20, 30 o 40%. Una barbaridad que dice mucho de cuáles son los problemas de vivienda allí. También pensemos un poco en cómo son ese diseño de vivienda vieja en esta parte. Vivienda soviética en Rumanía. of the part of the continent. Well, there will be a problem of renovating the housing housing according to the needs of the population very important. In all ways, the problems of overocupation affect more to the young people and in Spain it's a percentage that has been subbed in the last years. So, even if the proportion is still low, the deterioration is quite evident. It's a tendency that goes more. Yes, it's a tendency to see how there are pisos that offer that suddenly you put a pair of pladurs, divide in a salon to create a extra habit. that maybe not has a window. And then in a room that was thought of in the beginning for a house of three people, now they're living four or five. And that's what we forget, but we already have... My parents or their parents live in pensiones. They're talking a little bit about the pension. A lot of people who have a house with four houses, that person lives in one and the rest are in the alquiladas. A families or a individual who comes to work. The pension as a result is also resurgendo in many of the great cities españolas. It's something that seems to be ancient. No, but it's actually a return by the phenomenon that we see. Of course, we do not do more than find ourselves problems under the stone in this episode. I also want to change a bit of third because if we have talked a lot of the demand of the housing that exists, we have talked a little bit of the offer. There are a lot of people thinking that if the access to the housing is so evident and so palmary, then we build more and there is. But the reality is that no more buildings are built, or at least the increase is very far from the demand that is solicited. What is this happening? Well, again, for another, a concatenation of factors. And for resumption, all the construction process has been increased much. The soil, the materials, the man of work. So, building a price asequilibrium is not as cheap as before. And this is the price of the final price. And it is worth the price of these factors. The first is the soil, which is basic, that is needed for a living. In some place you have to build it. The living room, all that kind of stuff. We can understand that it's a recursive thing, because when building on it, it consumes. This has a lot of features, but it's like more or less. And what happens in many municipalities is that just a little bit of a space for building. And sometimes this is limited by the geography. For example, in cities like Barcelona or Málaga, they have the mountain to their back and the other side. And the mountain to their back. and also finds other municipalities or infrastructures like airports. They can be parceled but they don't have large extensions of terrain. It happens to be like the city of Madrid that also is left without the terrain. And this is important because, of course, we have to remember that the competition of the living room is municipal or autonomous. The municipalities can design what areas are urbanized. Although there is coordination between the different municipalities that are in the same place, this also generates administrative borders to the construction. But asuming that it was a terrain available, the urban laws have been endured. They need more permits and permits to build. This is to enlarge the plages and thus, it is to be clear. And this is also true. It is the reaction to this trauma, to this era of the burbujer, where the recalifications of the soil for building a mansalva foment, as well as the burbujer, a huge corruption political with constructors that subordered alcaldes, concejals and the council. This was the norm of the 2000s. So, to avoid that this is repeated, it made it that the procedures were more farragosed and so, to incentivize the corruption. But those processes now difficult to build more rapidly. What is the series of Jesus Gil, the pioneer? The pioneer. It's a good job. It's a real thing. And it's a little bit extreme, because Marbella was a crazy, but when I saw it, I said, it happened in Spain. This country has been a bit of a year. It's been a long time. It's been a long time. It's been a constant. It's a crazy thing. The level of corruption that has been reached and the mangoneo. Yes, but I was thinking about what Alba said. There is another problem that is added, for example, that I don't know what the other day was, the requisitos of habitationality, that they were putting on, like, you have to have a parking for bifes, I don't know what. Also, at a level bureaucratic, there are things that in a crisis like this, the constructors are saying, if I have to do this, it's difficult to do this. And also there is another issue, here I will go to my house, and it is that the material has been increased. Ah, well, of course. The arena. Yes, the arena, the acero, everything that is going on. Another combination of factors, the reactivation economic of the post-pandemic tensioned a lot. As we have told in other chapters, the... Here comes the geopolitics in this chapter. Tensioned a lot. Toda esa cadena de suministros, la guerra en Ucrania provocó aún más aumentos considerables del precio de la energía. Las industrias de la construcción, acero, madera, hormigón, aislantes, han sufrido especialmente las dos cosas. Energía más suministros. Ha sido la combinación perfecta, ¿no? Y los precios de casi todos los elementos han aumentado mucho. De hecho, desde 2019 a 2023, esos costes se elevaron un 60%. Eso es una locura. And since then it's true that it's been moderated a little, but it's been a little more, but it's been a little more, but it's been a little more, and that's been a huge level of 2019. It's been a little bit of a little bit. Yes, compared with 2019, I'm going to take a little bit of this. Maybe it's a 40%, but it's been a little bit. And this is not only care about the new construction, but also the reforms. So, it's not that if you don't have a loan to build a house, then reform a house that is much more expensive. It's also a little bit. Because it's also the third factor, and it's the lack of money. Here we have a lot of time saying Industry, FP Because we have no idea of this country You tried to supply it with your construction The ladrillos, but it was not I'm sure there are people that are listening to And you try to find someone who has a reform For the new official office of the world You don't know what has been that I think I have contacts But you also You also reformed your house But it's really complicated 20 years in Spain has changed a lot of things. And the trauma of the crisis of the ladrillo is very profound. The history of the past half of a century, all the know, there was a lot of people who stopped studying in the institute, they were in the construction, they were very good. In fact, we had 2,7 millions of jobs in the construction. It is true. And this, like I said, I have no money to work, was that in that moment, when a country with less population, with 5 million people. And in fact, we saw that when the economic crisis was done. A lot of companies were gone. It costed much to convert them and it was dramatic for many families. The reality of today is very different. There are a million and a half of people employed in the construction. It is the number of people from the construction. But it has changed a lot. A million and a half of people from the construction. It is true that, for example, the costs are more high, there is no work in the middle, the job is more envejecida, faltan also specialised professionals. Ahora mismo en España es difícil y bastante caro encontrar disponibilidad para reformar una casa, un baño, lo que sea. Y es porque hay trabajo de sobra. O sea, es que yo he llamado a... Obras pequeñas ya no te las cogen. O sea, yo he hablado con manitas que te dicen, si es que estoy subiendo el precio para que me digan que no y me dicen que sí. Y eso es mi gran dicha la cara y yo decía, pues, pero eso está pasando. Y te hago de manitas, fontaneros, electricistas, de todo, ¿no? Y aquí hay dos variables más. In the bubble, many of the immigrants that worked in the construction were from Europe, from the East, from Roman, Bulgari, Polic. What happens? The current migration comes from Latin America, and also from Marrocos, which is very much to the collect and other things, and Latin America is not so specialized in the construction as in the services sector. If the East, from that time, well, they have improved their situation, or even returned to their countries, because they were not in the same way. They gave up a capital, maybe they sold the living room in Spain and they returned to Romania and now they live there. Or they have been married, they have been jubilated and they come back to their country. And their children have decided to go there because they have more opportunities with the training that they have here. And the second factor related to is that many people who study today don't want to work in the construction. Or, they are physical. That's also something that there is a lot of people who study there are not. And even if they are not paid, many people think that there are alternatives more comfortable. So the reality is that, even if there was a soil available and the materials had a reasonable price, even if we wanted to build houses, it is that maybe we don't have the hands to do it at the speed that we need. And we have to control the no-to-dimension of those hands so that we don't pass what happened in the past. It's a very complicated one, and that's why this chapter is fine, but we have to talk with calm. Claro, sí, sí, pero que es esa complejidad de interrelacionar de factores de que si puedes querer construir más vivienda, pero es que no hay nadie que te la construya porque no hay gente para eso. O si quieres tienes que pagar un precio tan alto para que te lo hagan que al final pues no te renta, básicamente. Bueno, o sea, tú compras, o sea, hoy en día una casa de los años 70 que vayas a comprar que no esté reformada, le tienes que meter más 50, 40 mil euros de reforma mínimo. Sí, sí. Entonces eso, claro, también hay que tenerlo. O hacértelo tú. and I tell you that I don't want to put the floor in my house. I think that's it, I think. I'm very traumatized. We've talked a lot about it. We put the tarima in the SPC. It was a sub-trauma of a year, approximately, because, as you know, the men of the world are a lot of people, they look like they look like, they take decisions vitales at the same time. So, of course, there's a problem. And a problem that is, that's what I'm going to do for months, is that I'm putting the tarima in my house. And then I learned a lot of tarimas For your own What's the price of tarimas? That I don't come back Basically One more Yeah, we talked about the offer The issue of the proprietors Those who don't take their homes For fear of occupying Although it's a small impact It can mean that Decenas of thousands of homes Cerradas by that fear And again, in a context of this case It's a lot of people But until you know At any point, there is a real problem. Because the fear is extended. There is a lot of people and it is a real fear. Let's explain this because it is even a topic where, at the end, there is a disinformation and even economic interests. This is Spinoza. Se suele denominar ocupation, with K, which in reality is a political political quite complex and interesting. We have in some moment a episode of... ...forastrism. A me me parece very interesting the movement of the ocupation. When Alba says interesting, I know that if we are there, we have a lot of debate. Decrecimiento interesante, ocupación interesante Bueno, cada día y cada una No, no, es un tema chulo Modaría hacer algo así Entendemos esto de la ocupación O se lo solemos denominar Cuando alguien entra en una casa que no es suya Y se pone a vivir ahí Esto en realidad, más que ocupación Es delitos de allanamiento Si es tu vivienda o de usurpación Si no lo es o es una segunda residencia En el allanamiento la policía Echa a esa gente en unas horas In the usurpation, it's a few weeks or a few months. What is your house? What is your house? There is a person who has met. They are quite minoritarians. In 2024, they had 16.400 denuncias. This is what would affect a one of each 1.600 house. Well, that's relatively minor. It's a lie. It's a lie. It's a lie, but it's a lie. It's a lie that it's a lie. It's a lie that it's a lie. Then there's another lie that is more habitual. It's the lie that a lie that's lie that they don't pay the rent and stay in the house. That's not a crime. It's a contract, a debt, and a debt, is a normal, is that a few months or years, if the family is vulnerable. That's a crime and not a crime. And it's a crime. In 2024, there were 20.500 deaths by the insurance. And in 2025 and until 2026, there was a prohibition of deaths by families vulnerable without a habit. That people can't pay where they live, but they have a right to have a techo. This creates a fear in some proprietors that they don't want to buy their homes because they think that if the inquilinos dejan to pay, they don't will be able to pay in months or years, having to assume they have the cost of the process. And this is a risk that can happen. Yes. Also, it is more than that in the world there are no longer than the probability of the impago of a inquilino's increase the amount of the alquiler in relation to their income. If in a house you enter 1.500 euros and you take 1.000 euros, it is more likely that you leave a pay if you take 600 euros. And no, the answer can be that you find other places, because in first place, no there, and in second place, the alternative is living in the street, which is a idea that people don't get entusiasm or even say that it is contrary to the right. The search of maximization of the benefit in the alquiler can lead to more risk. It's like more risk. It's like more risk. More risk. It's like more risk. And vice versa. If you're more conservative, probably the risk is better. It's true that there is no correlation, but I'm sure there is a correlation between you and you... No, no, there is a deal of this. Because, of course, it's a crime. It's a crime. It's a crime. I have a person close to who happened, but it was because they were carcass. That they don't pay and two years later, but that is what happens. So at the end, there is to be clear that this phenomenon that exists and has its importance also is made by the interest that exists in that there is a fear in the The owners, they perceive the threat as something greater than it is. And that is impeccable. In the same way there are impagos of the alquiler and the other ones, there are people taking the past from that. Yes. If you have a fear, you sell. Of course. The alarm, the security of the radio, the TV, those are the means that consume the extracts of the population with the mayor percentage of property. There are a constant presence of these types of reports, which are often very aggressive, where... You're going to eat the bread, you're going to have a house. Yes, we're going to have to have a feeling of insecurity. And by not talking about the auge of those anti-occupation groups that threaten inquilinos with the conifed or pasiveness of the authorities and that every time they have more presence, I would say, political in our country. There are agencies that have generated public agencies of anti-occupation. And then that is already the idea that this is a problem that is a problem that is sedating to all the owners of the country. Yes, but the problem of the housing in Spain, as we are seeing, is not that that is the problem. Well, of course, it's what was said Fer at the beginning. But there's a lot of people who have been there. Of course, and that's what he said Fer. It's not only the one that has left in the house, or the one that has no other than the other. Or the one that has people who leave the... There's a lot of crisis and problems that, as well as, you can do more the crisis in general. And this is also important that the audience understand it. That the solution is not going to be, in fact, let's take a lot of people's occupants. That's one part, and we have to do it, cumpliendo the law, of all the money. That's not going to be able to live in the street. No, no, of course. But what I would say is that the gordo is not there No, that's what I mean Here we see also, in Spain In the issue of the law, it's very extreme It's to say, we have to From a permissiveness and a tremendous In the time of the burpher A a brutal restriction In the time of the crisis, especially as reaction And now we don't know Find a point in the middle, because I remember, for example In the time of the burpher, that they created Tribunals ad hoc For the people who are going to buy a house You can't get out, you can't get out, you can't get out, you can't get out When it comes to crisis, it's brutal because there is a lot of agility in the desahucios, it provoca a huge crisis in the desahucios, so decided to leave that. And now, of course, there is no such agility in the desahucios, which also generates a problem for the property. So, we have found a point where all the parties have incentives to collaborate and cooperate a little, but they can't maximize the benefit. So we're between two extremes that are not good for solving the problem. All this that we've talked about, in no sé cuánto tiempo que we've been talking about... No, no, no. No, no, no. No, no, no. No, no, no. No, no, no. Ah, well. Ah, bien, solo, hora y media. Bien, nos queda... Sí, sí. No, este ha sido un poco el diagnóstico con todo un abanico de causas. Ahora creo que debemos avanzar de pantalla y evaluar también otras cuestiones. ¿Qué impacto está teniendo esta crisis de la vivienda en nuestras sociedades? who are suffering more this impact? This we have a little bit before, because we have been ahead. But to start, the crisis of the population is a poor population and consequently a poor population. The more money we have to pay a house, less we have to pay for everything else. And this increases the more vulnerable people. The rates that characterize the social social rate are more difficult to access a house or a house digger. The class, the gender, everything is important. In fact, the property of the house is a mark of wealth. In fact, in a few months, our colleagues at EOM, Raquel Rero and Celia Hernando, took a report on the heredocratia, in which they analyzed how in Spain, almost 70% of the inequality of the wealth is due to the heritage. This heritage is translated into capital monetary, but also in patrimony. Those children who have more houses and the children who have more opportunities will be more than those who have more. And this is what we think about in the future. But in the present, the bretta of the wealth that marks the house the living is very marked by the age. In Spain, the age of age that most have enriqueced in the last years are the more than 65 years. That is, those who have no only the income accumulated in all the lives and in their majority income stable with a pension, but also have a more access to the living that is a component of wealth. And that is not that we part of from a very good situation, because in the year 2000 the Spanish needed to earn 8 years of net income to be able to access to a living room of 100 m2. But today, in order to 8, we need 11. Yes. In countries like Luxembourg or Ireland, they need 16 or almost 19 years of income. We have put a graphic for that the people can see. In contra, we see that the most most poor people are the young, especially the men of 35 years. They never have been above the ranking. No deja de ser el momento en el que estás en edades de comenzar a ganar dinero. Yo, hombre, recién he empezado a trabajar, ¿no? Pues está la habla del dinero. Claro, yo no padeciendo que seas aquí Rockefeller, ¿vale? Pero es significativo, viendo este otro gráfico, el marcado empobrecimiento en la última década de los siguientes grupos de edades de 35-44 y 44-54. Este último ha pasado de ser el segundo más rico en 2002 al tercero más pobre en 2022. Y se ve muy bien ahí en el gráfico. We see how the children of 75 years old in the age of 2000 had a higher rate, but look now. And look at that growth of the older 75 years old. One way in which this is reflected in a clear way is that the young people are more, and it said before Alba, in emancipating from the parents. And again, I've heard how they romanticize it. Ah, the children, how we adapt. We are talking about a very hard situation. Yes, yes, yes. You want to live in your house, and you're fine and well. But that is the issue, that this was something that affect the European countries of the same way, because it has a cultural component, but especially economic component. And now, if the age of emancipation was high in certain countries, in the South and the East, around the 30 years, with the difficulties that they are seeing in these last years of access to the housing, Corre el riesgo de retrasarse todavía más o de que sea prácticamente imposible revertir esa tendencia. O de que te encuentres gente que ya con 40 años y los padres con 75 dicen, ¿para quién me voy a ir de casa? Sí, a lo mejor ya les tienes que cuidar incluso. Sí, pero que eso está pasando y a nivel europeo se ve que hay muy poco margen para solucionarlo. Sí, bueno, incluso cosas como, ahora que hablamos también de la crisis de natalidad, how do you want to have a child if you have a house to live? Or a family stable, of course. Or a family stable, that if you spend 60% of the income income that comes in the sale, how do you create a child? That are a machine to spend money. And also, this is a level sociological level, how do you start to understand relationships? The fact that... The I have a house to have a house. Yes, but it's a little bit this idea. siempre ha habido un componente monetario o pragmático de las relaciones más allá de la potencial idea romántica que tengan pero cuando le añades una crisis de vivienda que tal vez la única forma de independizarte y de formar un proyecto de vida que te parezca atractivo es teniendo pareja ¿cuánta gente toma esa decisión? no necesariamente ¿cuánta gente la puede forzar? ¿qué valor se le da a la pareja en nuestra visión social y qué valor se le da que no la tenga. Eres mucho más competitivo en pareja que solo, claro. Claro, ahí yo creo que también hacen ciertos arquetipos sociales que en el fondo la familia nuclear tal y como la entendemos ya de por sí se valora mucho más por cómo hemos construido nuestro modelo social, ¿no? Pero ha habido unos años de empezar a romper con esa idea y ahora tal vez nuestras crisis económicas impiden que rompamos con esos esquemas. Sí, el oro se casó por eso. I think I'm a romantic. I think I'm a romantic. I think I'm a romantic. Yes, yes, no, but that's a lot of influence. For example, before we talk about the herencias, how we have less children by family, we're going to inherit many houses of our parents and grandparents. What? No, no. That's not a mention. No, no, no. In a long time, and... Yes, yes, God wants to inherit many families. Oh, my God. But that many people are going to inherit, for example, with 50 or 60 years, because people live more, so you have 60 years, why do you want a house? You need a house with 25 or 30 years to form a own life. And it will take a society more of the equal ones because the capital will be concentrated in less people and others who have not had access to housing and have not had capacity to borrow. The tendency is that, a pauperization and a higher inequality. And that, at the end, the class of class is to be a owner or not to be a owner. and that is what you will give a level of acquisition or another. Here we are talking about that the empobrecement of the population, of the cada vez more amplifying the population, affects the rest of the economy, because the more empobrecidad is a society, the more risk exists of the establishment, of the economic economic, of what we have mentioned before, of the employees that don't find workers, of people who can't form, in fact, that are many consequences very important. Well, it's that you before you talked about the idea of competitiveness and it's something that the European Union recognizes, One of the effects regional of this crisis is a problem of European competitiveness, the European continent. At the end, the problems of access to the housing are relentless, they are less income, less income, and less mobility. What is that, later or later, is the capacity of growth and innovation. For example, if a young man wants to study a specific career in a university that is not in his city, now he has much less capacity to move from the city and dedicate the time necessary to form. This, at the end, is a loss of opportunities that translates into loss of talent. And even if he formed, he can live close to the interests of the interests. If he does a lot of money, he can invest part of the same in building a company or get the financing necessary. And this also leads to a key idea. As a living has become a very valuable asset, the house has become a very attractive asset. And this is related to the increase of price, but also a problem in the sense that it is a loss of capital of other investments more necessary for a economy and growth. In the market product, in the market, in the market, speculative, in the market, then you have a problem. Well, investigación, health, ambaces, tecnological, all that money that is something that is going on to the house is something that is not repercuting in other sectors that need to be needed. And then there is another aspect that we have that we have when we talk about the house and the price, and it is the democratic deterioration that is not to abord this issue well and and with all the political and administrative and administrative the inequality between classes and generations is generating brechas that lead to that a more polarization because a polarization that facilitates the increase of populism, the discredit of institutions, those ideas reduccionistic and easy that we solve so, you can't do it. Well, the idea is that the state doesn't make anything for me. But again, and this I always put a little example when we talk about El Salvador and the democracy. of, hey, why do I want democracy if I have a lot of violence? In this case, if the democracy is not able to guarantee the most basic right-wing of many citizens, those policies that seek to destroy that democracy and use this base, they can gain some territory. That's what we talked about in the directs of Donosti with Franco, that if the democracies create positive results for the population, or the people are saying that they are the democracy and that they are not going to govern a lot of the people. basically. We've heard a lot of parties from the extreme right that the blame is only the mass immigration and is something that alimenta a racist that is problematic and that is playing with the content of inquilinos or of thousands of people that cannot be able to buy. It's a factor between the many that we've talked about here. But we can't translate to a huge difference to a generational to a huge difference. It's a huge difference of the blame of the young people who don't want to work or that there is an area of occupations. You can do it with Netflix. Yes, but again, it's a bit, if we only appelamos to those factors, then at the end we don't solve anything and we're atorting and not abording the real problem that one of the main problems that is bringing a lot of attention to us. All this, at the end, it takes a lot of the dialogue, also the trust, which are fundamental for the democracy. And here, who we are listening to, you have to be aware that there is There's a lot of people who live to feed that tension and that these problems are not solved. And that at the minimum that we plant the solutions, we're all about to get the noise. Because in the end, it's the only way that some have to survive economically, politically, or as I can. But there is also a lot of solutions in terms of this crisis. It's what we've said. The fear vends. And there's people who... The polarisation vends. The cabrearte vends. There is a lot of dialogue. Yes, and try to understand the things here. In No is the end of the world, you know that our focus is, it is not catastrophic, the world is a grave feeling, but it is not catastrophic. We will have to die tomorrow, and we will die all. No, that will not happen. And, of course, we will focus the topics in a way that we understand in a rigorous way that is happening to find solutions. Nothing to be solved, nothing to go on the people, here it is important to understand. The catastrophism is mobilizing, but the rabies no. But the rabies have been focused on So I think it goes a little by here There is a little bit of a look And find solutions for that The Lenin De Villalba has to be careful No, but I'm with Laura. In the end it is not to be a complex or a gravestite of things. For nothing. The world is worse. But that doesn't mean that there is no need to understand it. That there is no need to understand it. That there is no need to be a catastrophe. We are going to do it all. No. What we are going to do to do it all. No arde. Pensemos que hubo una época en la historia de la humanidad en la que había razias en las que llegaban y nos secuestraban, nos mataban. No estamos en esa época. Vale. Estamos en un mundo mejor, pero hay que intentar que siga siendo mejor. Sí, sí, sí. Sí, desde luego. Sin piratas de herbáceos, pues también. Exactamente. Sin que la vida. Es como los que son de TikTok de año 1345. Uno de mis cinco hijos ha sobrevivido a la peste y puedo comer una sopa de lechuga. A la alta edad de 25 años. Claro, pues es un poco eso, ¿no? But what we always say is that knowing the things you give power If you don't know, you feel a little A little bit of what goes on And this is important So, as I've got to get the topic Let's go You're going to talk about rap You're going to talk about Well, well Viendo the complex panorama that's complex That's what we have with this crisis We're going to go with the question of the million How can we solve it? Let's solve the problem I think it's something central in the political agenda. It's a big concern in society. It's a big problem social. No only in Spain, but in Europe. And in the most part of the world, because this happens in the United States and in Taiwan. So, how do we start to put hands on this issue? Fernando, first of all, it's a couple of things. This is what you do when your child... If this one asks you to ask someone, you say, look, the problems complex require solutions. Good afternoon. And until here, the episode here my job is done it's a bit like that but at the end the problem of the crisis of the living is literally that no there is a unique response to this crisis but there are many options for atajar each of their causes you have to do a plan holistic and again no short-clutch it's a solution that will require years and decades to enmend it's a large plan and the second is that there is that there is that there is that there is that potential solution that can be put in limitations or effects in the end of the day, for any attractive that can be on the paper. And that also has to analyze it. Además, a policy can be very effective in a place, but nociva in another, so that the great formulas are not working well in the case of the housing. And more if we extrapolate to a European context. Parting from these two premises, we can distinguish between two types of policies by the public institutions, of incentive or of punishment. And the two types can be directed at the part of the house, constructors, funders, or rentators, or rentators, or compradors. Yes. Let's go a little bit about the parts, or some of the possible solutions that can have people in the head. There is a lot of people who think, hey, let's build, we have mentioned earlier. Yes. Here I have a question, build a more, a more, a better solution. Yes and no. And both answers are compatible. Yes, there is that building, in the future, the deficit of the current and future will not be covered only with the buildings that have been built. Three million dollars. Of course, even in the ideal in which all the buildings come to the market, that would not be covered. Even so, in the next few years, there will be buildings for part of those demographic factors that have already mentioned. So in some moment, there will be a taboo of construction. In that sense, facilitating the soil, eliminating the bureaucratic, would be a that construction gains presence. So, a wide offer of the house would also be able to increase the prices. Or, yes, that no subies. No, that no subies, that no converse with that. But it is not a definitive solution for various reasons. We have seen that it is not possible to build a much higher rate, because, for start, there are people to do it. And it will not appear, from the morning to the end, a million of albaughes. No, it is not possible. In that sense, our productivity is limited in the next years, But also, here there are experts like Buron, again we have said that the problem is not how much is built, but how and where it is. And this is a problem of urbanism. If we build PAUs in the middle of the nada, without equipment, without parques, schools, centers of health, That's a good thing. And they say they live in a Pau. Yes, but there are publics, so we can't build a land without creating where people want to live. That's what is, that they live there because they don't have another. They can create a small minority. In fact, there, I don't remember, this happened also with the boom of franquism, that they built in many villages without connection. There's a... Well, no, there's an asphalt between the streets. There's a lot of people in the film, there's a lot of women. Filming, yes. Yes, but that they were mobilized in the village of Sevilla to achieve that infrastructure. It's a thing that has happened in the history of Spain. It's very interesting, and I think that now, as it's a problem, the audiovisual and cultural production of this country is recuperating stories very interesting of all those vicinal luchas, of all the raval that was formed in torno to a city, in which conditions they lived, which vicinal lucha was made to improve. And we also talk a lot about organization collective and that there is a substrate in this country that is not known, but there is a lot of people who have been mobilized to improve the way. Yes, just. And the city of Madrid that is independent, and it is recognized Fidel Castro. Yes, I do it. Also, building a house, so that we can't keep it clear, it is not to grow the country as the house as who put it on the gallinas, it is to design the cities so that there is people in there. And if there is a problem in Spain, it is to think and to design the future of the cities included. In Madrid, for example, the last in Sánchez has been designed with a plan of finales of the 90s. The new city that we want to have in 2050, 2060, there is to start thinking and also to build them. To regularize the soil without more and that the market does not work. Because we will be able to repeat the errors. And here is another aspect of the infrastructure that I am obsessed with. And it is also the state, the communities have to have money to build new infrastructure that connect to those neighborhoods and maintain all the ones that we have. That is another challenge of the problem derived from the house. Necesitas más casas, pero tienes que interconectar esas casas Y que las principales autopistas, en el caso de Madrid No se te saturen Porque de repente has construido barrios a la periferia Pero no nuevas vías de acceso a la capital ¿Sabes? También influye todo eso Yo creo que uno de los grandes problemas que tenemos Con la vivienda de soluciones es la falta de imaginación Bueno, no se tienen ideas Hay que jugar más al principio Yo creo que hay muchas ideas Fer, esto es opinión totalmente Que los sepan los siguientes Pero el gran problema está en que hay que tener una planificación general and with a consensus absolute and to have clear that it is not a problem that it is going to be solved tomorrow. And to a lot of people say that it is not going to be solved tomorrow. I feel very much. Because it is a very difficult problem. Yes, but more than that, the new barrios that they have been built in these years in Madrid, this area of the east of Madrid, the local, the Cañarca and the other, have six vehicles in the avenida. They have six and eight vehicles. It is that they are in the middle of the barrio. It's a crazy. That in 2026, it is not a way to make a good barrio. What was the article about Benidorm? That was the article that was the model of Benidorm. Yes, Benidorm was, ironically, a model very efficient. No, I don't remember the name. It's going to be a bit of a house. And so that everyone could have... I see that, for example, Llanera, I see what I've been twitteated. That's the area of the East of Madrid. We call it the Oriental. Because they're all very tall, very tall, one behind the other, and that... And that this can be replicated... We're talking about Madrid because... We're talking about Madrid. But that can be replicated in many cities. But that can be replicated in other cities with these plans, and then you say, okay, what was looking for with this urban planning? I mean, like the buildings Zebra, I think it's a little bit of a mistake. We know a little bit what cities we want, so we're going to do things a little bit for a model of the same pattern, and well, we're going to go there. Also, a level, that is what we can look at, but a level of aesthetic, now that you talk about the buildings Zebra, there's the idea of the Spain's fair, no hay una idea de cómo queremos que sean nuestras ciudades qué elementos de cohesión le podemos meter es simplemente vamos a construir y no hay una idea en todos los sentidos equipamientos públicos, las bibliotecas Aldi eso es un supermercado yo aquí os lo compro pero ahora mismo con la situación que tenemos no podré construir pero diseñalo pero hay que hacerlo escalado y ese es el reto que tenemos claro claro pero igual que tú hoy ves los edificios de los 60 and they have been 60 or 70 years, what you have been doing is going to be 60 years. And they are going to be like, how do you see the city in 2060? So, that's what we have to do. We have talked about that building a mansalva and without any kind of order is not a solution because you are going to go to the era of the burbujas. Here we are a little bit in the universe of the, which is another possible solution, of the social housing or protected. We mentioned that with the liberalization of the 90s in Spain this type of housing, the protected housing, goes to be very minoritarian. In fact, even since the burglars no one is built only a house. This is not happening in other countries. No, no, so until we can fix ourselves, copying the social model that is in other places. We are in the political factors of the crisis of the housing. In Spain, the social policy policy, that is inferior to the price of public housing, normally of public promotion, has been quite minoritarian. and, in general, it was something exceptional and peripheral. The social social plan was to provide a solution to families without resources or with other difficulties, not as something central in the policy of housing. In fact, the percentage of social social housing in Spain is of the most low in Europe, close to 1%. Nothing. How much so in the house, then... And here I come to talk about my book. And it's that, in a few months, Álvaro Merino and I did a report in which we compared the model of Vienna, which is one of the great examples of European in terms of social housing with the of Madrid. In Vienna, more than half of the housing housing is property of the Ayuntamiento, 200.000 housing, which is based on the Municipal of the Housing, and in Madrid, only 23.000 housing. In Vienna, there is a policy that has been a more than a century, in which it is a public health care and the demand is updated. Today, for example, it works, no I will stop to explain it here, it is explained in the report. Proceded by dissertation. No, it works in mixed cooperatives of housing. Well, the inquilinos pay a percentage of the construction, have a right to live in that house of life, but it's not a property. It's a universality. The 75% of the population of Viena is eligible and the 60% of the house is eligible. In fact, in Madrid, although the 60% is eligible, only 1,7% is covered by these models. And that's why the construction of social housing of the Ayuntamiento of Madrid has increased considerably in the last few years, a 44%. It's a very intervencionist model, but that at the end has ended up being cheaper. Because Austria costs 45,4€ for a living in terms of housing when the media of the European Union is 160,5€. And for example, models like the British, which liberalized and privatized a lot of this issue, the cost of housing is much more expensive, without any results really attractive. But it's true that this model also has contrapartidas. One is precisely the time that has invested in implementing it and the policies that it is that while in Vienna there was a public land the public park for building new housing in Madrid and in Spain in general it was a liberal or directly it was a completely different of course, it is a question and this is what we talked about at the beginning of the capi of mental health, now we have a market very atomized that priorizes the property, romper with that mentality comprar land, make a promotion of social housing that no one entie like a part check No es nada sencillo Y hay otros factores que hacen muy difícil un modelo así en España Uno es que exige una gestión activa por parte de todas las instituciones públicas Y España es lo opuesto Una función pública pequeña, poco acostumbrada a actuar proactivamente Con muy poca agilidad, con un enfoque muy pasivo Incluso hay un elemento disuasorio en potenciales costes políticos Es decir, ¿un ayuntamiento querría deseducar a familias si estas no pagan el alquiler? Es una movida This approach to the Spanish administration now generates much more pain in the head than solutions. Remember that the Spanish model is on the family and not on the state. It's much more practical and culturally logical that your parents help you with the entrance to a place, that it is the state who gives you that support. Even the institutions public, I have a little read a article in the Confidencial, where it says that the institutions public, the municipalities and communities, no tienen un especial interés en acabar, en que se construya más, en gestionar grandes parques públicos de vivienda, en que baje el precio de la vivienda en definitiva, porque ellos sacan bastante tajada de los impuestos que se cobran en los impuestos de las transacciones. El ITP, que es para viviendas de segunda mano, básicamente, no sé cómo es la SIGA, pero es el ITP, a quien hay que comprar una vivienda, le suena. Eso lo gestiona la comunidad autónoma. Claro. Cuanto más alto sea el precio de venta, como es un porcentaje, Plus the autonomous partyективals. And, although the customer pays their invest in tehd statt of Ninth garden there That is. The first of all responses becomes the internet. And then the cashier costs make it more pay than the majority of the пользовat物. That is municipal. You, in relation to your sinful housing tab, you bought that home for the bigaa talents and you hang in the $300,000, the difference pays the plus-dollar term. Cuanto more하 above the payment, less will increase the plus-dollar entire business. The more somebody pays well until theurogens. Because if the government paysvas hearts its own. So, if in the moment in which the administration also sees the price of the house, then there is a system of incentives that is not well designed. Because, of course, and, of course, they don't have to do anything. It's to say, you don't have to act proactively. No, no, it's like that. You have to pay. Yes, yes, yes, yes. It's very comfortable for the administration to put the case, basically. That's the problem. And, of course, the construction of new houses in its conjunto has also the challenges of the cities. This is another factor that we have to put on in the table. No always there is a urbanized field available, or the one that there is not necessarily responds to the demand of the population. It's a little, or a transport or other services, as we mentioned earlier. It's also a question if, for certain competencies, the municipality is the territorial level most optimal, or at least there are entities super municipally that coordinate. The city of Madrid, Mostro, El Alcorcon, Getafe, Leganés, no well coordinate their policies when, in terms of practicality, all is part of the same territorial of the Madrid metropolitan or the Gran Madrid. It's a sense. I don't know what I mean. There are other cities like Barcelona, that have that figure on the city that tries to coordinate efforts in terms of housing. Another key factor is urban policy. There is also a idea of imagination and conscience. The height of the building that article that was about the revenue. Or the rehabilitation of buildings, or the adaptation of old homes to the present. But all this requires an investment, a public investment, and that, at the end, is a freno, because you have to manage the resources that you have. And... I think that the construction of the height is a possible solution. There is to make more denser cities like if there is no more soil, then you can go to the river, like New York. No, but... We can look and look at the description because it was very good Planteaba como al final, si tú construyes torres de 10 plantas, lo que te permite es concentrar a la gente y el espacio que no ocupas con edificios puede meter parques. Un parque o un equipamiento público. Que esto, aunque es una solución atractiva, no quita que luego tenga otros problemas asociados. Exactamente, claro. Porque esto, de nuevo, todo tiene su cara a ver. Claro, pero que al final las administraciones, no somos nosotros los encargados de esto, pero van a tener que buscar soluciones. And also to understand that our cities have entered in a global model of a global city, which maybe you could see in London or New York in the TV, and suddenly you find out that Barcelona, Madrid, Sevilla or Valencia are great suburbs that at the European and international level are attractive to the visitors or the ciudadanía. Also, there is a problem of mental health, with this of the construction in height. We have bought a model of goodwill that is the house, the sale with piscina. And that's the objective. That's very of the burbuj. That's very the aspirational model that is planned. Like in some moment, I would like to have this. And a little bit of a estadounidense. It's a little bit of a commercial. So, we're talking about romping those aspirational models. Because you can't get the sale with the house with piscina. But to break with that aspirational is important to design public policy. It's quite difficult to think about this. Yes, but there are different solutions that are going to be done in a whole, of course, to go arregling the problem. These are the policies of which we have talked about are of incentives to the offer, basically. But, for example, what are of incentives to the demand? How do you manage to buy or sell in a market that is structurally tensioned? Well, these are the ones that have received more attention in the media. The help of the alquiler is in form of bonus for the alquiler or help of the purchase. can be able to help the clients but not to be another incentive perverse because they end up in the pockets of the proprietors that, as well, can be able to increase the price according to the cost of the bonus. It's a temporary relief that seeks to prevent the price of the price without any results. And the practice is transferring public rents to those who have a little bit of an alquiler that, in the average, have the double of rent that those who live in the alquiler. Also, for a little bit of the myth, there are a little bit of a proportion of the price, the price of the tax is like a kind of person that if you pay, ...se muere de hambre? No. En general, quien te alquila un piso es una persona que va a tener bastante más dinero que tú y que tiene un nivel de vida bastante acomodado. Quiero decir, está entrando un sueldo extra directamente en su casa. De eso también hay que partir de la base. Sí, y que de manera estructural es que tiene mejor posición. Por eso probablemente se puede comprar la casa, porque tenía mayor suelo. Y no está viviendo en el coche. Eso es. También hay ayudas para incentivar la compra, por ejemplo, en el medio rural. Pero, de nuevo, aquí chocamos con las demandas de la población. En una sociedad cada vez más. urban, the rural result limited if it offers a viable way of living. If we want to be able to live the pressure on the urban centers, we can ask what is what they offer, how many opportunities, cultural, or services they offer. And if it is factible, localize some of them, not only to the rural media, but directly to other cities medias. In Spain, for example, attack the macrocefalia of Madrid can be a policy that liberates the capital of the city, but it cannot be the only solution. Also, there is the option of giving incentives, or other types, to those proprietors that put their home in the alquiler. This could be taken from the market to the vacations, which are not sold, nor to the alquiler tourist. The government announced the 100% of the IRPF to the casers that no suban the alquiler, which is like subvencioning alquileres more asequibles. But I would say that if we are going to incentivize the offer to alquiler, no se trata solo de beneficio monetario, sino de generar un clima en el que los arrendadores percibieron también que es seguro alquilar. Y ojo, que esa percepción de inseguridad esté distorsionada no quita que pueda ser un problema como hemos comentado antes. De todas formas, aquí lanzo de nuevo otra idea, y es si sabemos que el sistema de bienestar y patrimonio en español se asienta sobre la vivienda, que suban los precios de la vivienda apuntala a ese sistema a cambio de dejar a gente fuera. Es bueno para el sistema. And here, who knows, that we understand that we are reflecting a little bit and doing a analysis, that is also a bad incentive. If the price is built and the prices are low, a substantial proportion of the families would be able to grow, in order to get more people to enter a game. We understand that this scenario is more just, but what would they be able to do with the proprietors? I have said it in another way, if you are going to get married and you are going to pay 500.000 euros due to that a that competencies, at the end, would you be able to raise $350,000 in order to make much more people buy a house? If that is an investment... A little bit of the trans-virus version of the immobiliated. Yes, it's a bit of that. And this is what I'm planning for that. Let's see if we're going to see it. I don't know until this point to motivate this. It would be a political suicide because it would be a lot of people like a generalization of the country. And it's something in the moment that the housing for many people in their subconscious, even if they're not aware of it, is an investment of a better investment para una mejor jubilación o es un activo que puedes vender para... Si ese activo pierde valor, ojo, porque a lo mejor dices, empiezas en una cascada en la de voy a vender antes de que todos estos planes de vivienda se pongan en marcha y mi casa valga menos y saco un dinero de diferencia. También hay que tener en cuenta eso. Sí, sí, es que, de nuevo, muchas ideas que pensamos, buah, idea acá. Luego en realidad cuando ves los efectos que tiene y dices, ojo, pues esto a lo mejor no está tan bien mirado. Estas cosas hay que plantearlas. Or to have a problem with the problem. Or to have a problem with the problem. This goes, again, by the incentives, but many of the proposals that we have in terms of housing are also by the punishment, by so say it, even by the incentive. I think, for example, in the limitations of the tourist tourist, which we have already talked about, that some cities are doing, or in the top of the price of the parking lot. Even if you have to go to the prohibition of the exchange, this is not to what point are options viables. A ver, this issue is also, again, again, it's delicate. or that if they are effective is dudable, even a few can be regretful, because they are options that give the feeling of that they take quickly and very contundent. It's impulsive, right? In the case of the tourist tour is something that already has put in place, so Barcelona, for example, has no emite licenses of tourist tour, and the actual ones have been to pay for it in 2028. This can lead to think that those tourist houses of tourist tour will pass automatically to the sale of the asequible, but one, not necessarily have to return to the market, O sea, pueden permanecer raras hasta que haya un cambio de gobierno y vamos a cambiar a la ley. O dos, si llegan al mercado, no necesariamente tienen que ser a precios asequibles. O sea, puede ser que para residentes extranjeros, con precios de venta o alquiler, mucho más altos, ¿no? El resultado final puede ser el mismo. Quienes no podían acceder a la vivienda por el uso turístico siguen sin poder acceder a esa vivienda, ¿no? En Madrid, por ejemplo, hasta el año pasado los pisos turísticos se tenían que concentrar en bajos. Now, there can be buildings that combine Alquiler turistic with conventional Or a Lógica in the way that those meet The thing is that this Generate doubts, because it can Incentive to buy blocks Enter to make the food Of a hotel Only of a food This can liberate Cierto space, especially in areas Very tensionadas, but In others, it can not have a sense But we don't go to the problem where we are with that tourist model. We are willing to renounce the number of 100 million people's tourists? It's that here there is a very serious debate with this. You have to take into account that it's 12-15% of the PIB. That's because there are thousands of jobs that would be disappeared, with the consiguiente impact economic. The tourist model that we have, as we have mentioned in this podcast, is not sustainable. No it is. Because it has effect. Yes, in the CAPI we have to talk about, we have to convert it. But desescalar Todo eso también tiene costes Y también tiene riesgos Y hay que saber básicamente que te estás jugando Y sobre todo que al final esto no va de Decisiones maravillosas o absolutamente terribles Para entender que toda Decisión tiene algo de Éxitosa probablemente y también probablemente Algo de coste, o sea el tema es Si estamos dispuestos o no a asumir Como país ese coste por lo que quizás Ganamos a cambio de llevar a cabo Esto, ¿no? También están los topes al adquirir Que mencionabais antes, ¿no? A esto podríamos add the castigos fiscales to those caseros that don't buy or sell their housing. In Spain, according to the Ley of Vivienda 2023, there are in zones tensionadas this type of things, especially in large tenants. But again, it depends on the communities and the communities to implement that. Yes, that many of us do not. Of course, it can be a relief for those inquilinos, but also have two potential effects perverses. They can help a rents more high that live in those neighborhoods and incentivize the use residencial Motivando que los propietarios Busquen mayor rentabilidad de la vivienda A través del uso turístico Es un melón Sí, sí, sí, está como a veces conectado Otra medida que entraría dentro de la idea del castigo Y que organizaciones como por ejemplo El sindicato de inquilinas han planteado Es la expropiación Tanto de viviendas como de terreno edificable Especialmente grandes tenedores Que tengan viviendas vacías O destinadas alquiler turístico Sí, puede ser una forma más directa De obtener vivienda o terreno edificable Donde implementar modelos de vivienda asequible It's rapid. It's rapid. It's rapid and it's effective. But at the same time, it's perceived as something radical that enfad a a market of proprietors very wide. Remember, we have a 73% of proprietors in Spain. Here we go back to the structure of our social state, family and proprietors. A policy of castigo or even expropriation in countries with a higher percentage of inquilinos or a higher culture of the alquiler can be attractive, but in a country with a mental of property, can be torn back in contra. And also, the expropriation is not that the Estado is not with a good, but it is a fair. It is a fair and fair. We have resources for that administrations public buy houses at prices of maximum historic. Is it deseable to use the public resources in EXO and other things? Again, these are questions and questions that we have to make and how we have identified both the benefit that could be given that that is the same policy, so that we can see how complex the panorama. Claro, que puedes expropiar vivienda a lo mejor a, yo que sé, 300.000 euros cada una. Es que tienes que dejar millones y millones para obtener una cantidad medianamente decente de viviendas que luego poder gestionar. Ese es el problema. Claro, es una inversión que, y además de nuevo, el coste-oportunidad, ¿ese dinero podría haber estado mejor gestionado en otras, o tener un impacto más positivo en otras cosas? Pues a lo mejor sí, ¿no? Entonces es delicado. Voy a lanzar la última pregunta, que es un poco la más reflexiva o la que más abierta a debate está, and it is, because many people are asking if you think the issue of the life in Spain has a solution. It can be. What solutions do you have? For me it can be. The problem is that we have a mental, it is a complex, and we have a short-term mentality. And I think institutions in general, the general panorama is very comfortable, or is much more comfortable than what we can look at in the situation in the actual situation. But the problem is that the cost of that this no se arregle is enormous. And I think we are not able to see the enormous cost of that this no se arregle. The cost of the inaccessible, that is a decision. The cost of the inaccessible is enormous. So, there are decisions that will have consequences in a certain point, that will have to be able to face the population, that I understand that there is to do it with cuidado and with surgical responses dependiendo de cada caso, sí, pero hace falta tomar decisiones. Entonces, si nos ponemos, si se ponen en marcha las instituciones públicas al respecto, puede tener solución, y ojo, no va a ser una solución a corto plazo. Eso es lo negativo. Pero si no se hace, desde luego no tiene solución el problema de la vivienda en España. Lo que te diría esa pregunta, Fer, es que ¿cuándo? Es decir, creo que el gran debate de esto es cuándo se va a solucionar, porque tarde o temprano se podrá encontrar una vía, pero esto lo hemos comentado en la oficina alguna vez, And it's the idea that, at the end, a public representative, a government of different communities, a government central, etc., no has an incentive to take this, to take this, to take this, to take this, because who will recoger the results of these measures will probably be another administration within six years. Or more. Or more. So, like that, there is a big difficulty in politics, and it's that they are decisions of the Estado that no will be able to enjoy or not be able to capitalize electoralmente the government of turn, the government in which it takes. So, for one, there is that. And then, the need to take measures already. Because the problem of this is that if not, the cost of the inaccessible, we will see its consequences. And that with the review that we have done, it is clear that the solution is easy, that there are many derivatives. So, it's a solution. Well, probably we'll find a solution. We'll be aware that it's a global problem. And maybe, if we're outside, we can import things. But in short term, we'll have a solution. And I think it's just because we're in the age of the moment of seeing what we do. And it's really hard to see what solution we can have that no pass by a very economic crisis and even so, I don't think that the house has fallen so much. or and the problem is that that is the problem that in reality the solution in the short term is that but the solution in the short term is demodora no deseemos crisis no, no, no no, no no deseemos no deseemos no, no, no but that is the problem that in the end that the solution is more of medium and long term and that is something that we have to have and with this is to say what options have and that those that have to take medidas they take but I think it's very complicated I think it's one of the the great challenges that have all the governments in all the administrations of Spain and outside also because I have a lot of friends in Europe or in Turkey, my friends, my turkeys, they tell me that Istanbul is horrible, disparate, so it's very general, there are 25 million people, but the issue is that, and then we have to have to change our mentality of how are the cities, if cities like Madrid or Barcelona are going to be macro urbs and we have to adapt to that. It's that the cities have changed. Here I think there are... There are solutions in the future of the cities. Yes, yes, yes. There are solutions very imaginative. I think it's Jorge Galindel who said it. That's who also has a book. Ah, yes, he has a book. He said it. He said it. He said it. He said it. He said it. It's good to build... It seemed curious to be able to build... It's good to build a lot of people. Because... Yes, yes. And this, when it's a business, it's a sense. It's a sense. You don't have to compete against the rich. It's a very little house. Any house. Everyone will go to it. People with pasta. with a little bit of pasta. But if you build a luxury of luxury, you don't have to compete with the rich. I mean, the house with a good house and a good house can pay 500.000. But I was going to say, it would also depend on the city. But in Madrid, no, no, no, no. No, no, no. I think there are 100.000 people millionaires in the 2024. I'm going to go to the Mediterranean. I'm going to compete against people with pasta. I tend to see how they can develop their argument. But I have to do it and not me suena especially no, but that are things in the sense different you have to think different because it's a problem so grave that you have to do that that you have to do it you have to do it in the Costa del Sol but well and then other things for example that is what we have talked about here I don't know until that point a crisis of dimension so global the municipality that is the entity that is that is capacity to do it to do it to do it that is that that is that that is that there and then there there there there there Políticamente es absolutamente invencible el hecho de vamos a construir mucho para que así bajen los precios. Creo que eso habría generaciones enteras. Que es donde se sientan los partidos que gobiernan. Ya, no sé, ya hay que lo hacer. Yo creo que es políticamente invencible. Entonces, creo que se irá solucionando, irá habiendo una mayor construcción, pero a corto plazo, o sea, a corto plazo y a medio. Estoy hablando de cinco años. Yo creo que esto va a ser un problema persistente. Creo que va a ser un poco panza de burro. Es decir, se van a quedar los precios en un nivel alto y ya no podrán seguir subiendo because basically no habrá demanda suficiente but it will be to be a level and that you can that you can with the help of parents for example with the help of families and who can you can you can and look at the life let's leave it this is a monologue now no I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm No, no, this is a interesting, complex, there are more solutions. I don't know if in Spain have been municipalities that maybe with some political politics have had a specific success. That's what I mean, if there are examples, then we are not going to find out with the teclas. We are interested in seeing what they think. Yes, yes, yes, to see how they live each other. That, well, I'm sure there are solutions and approaches of all types. Well, nothing, until now, how many have been, Eduardo? The duration? 20 Well, no, no, no Muy asequible ya Sí, podríamos llegar a las 3 horas de haber querido Yo me he metido casi toda la botella Y tenemos que acabar ya, Fernando Sí, hay que ir al baño ya Porque esto va a acabar mal Muchas gracias, Eduardo A vosotros siempre Y suerte buscando casa Bueno, a ver Y muchas gracias también a ti, Alba A vosotros Que este episodio también Se ha hecho en el marco, en el contexto De la beca del proyecto europeo GEN-EU So, for you to know, the European Union, but we're going to analyze a little bit the great challenges that we have in our societies, and also in the European market. Remember, the directs that we have, that we are in Santiago, that in the next week we are in various cities españolas, for the presentations of the book. No, I know what we have next week, because I have a brutal cacao of feces, of the past, and of course. They're in temazos, the truth. They're in temazos. They're in temazos, it's a bit of a wise. What do we want to say? and we're going to vary we're going to vary we're going to vary I know we've been talking a lot of the United States there was a lot of people that had a lot of different things so we've done so we've done I'm going to come to different things well, there it is thank you for listening for being there comment on what is your vision of the house of the house subscribe that also is important buy the Atlas we'll see we're still in this This is a bit of a studio. I'm sure. Yes. And we'll see you soon, in a few days, here in our show. No es el fin del mundo. El podcast semanal del orden mundial. Producido por The Voice Village. Dirección, Eduardo Saldaña. Conducido por Fernando Arancón. Y guión de David Gómez. Alba Leiva. Jara Monter. Blas Moreno. Eduardo Saldaña y Fernando Arancón. Producción ejecutiva, Ricardo Villa. Edición de sonido y sintonía original, Pablo de Diego. And the People çıkart