Traitors S4 Ep 9 Recap w/ Sandra Diaz Twine

Welcome in to the recap for the traders over here. We've got season four, episode nine. I am your host, the Duke of Deception. My bestie for the rest. He is not here tonight as he decided to take it upon himself to go be glamorous and be at a reunion. But I want for an upgrade, y'all. We brought in somebody, a queen. The queen will stay queen and also will be the most faithful of the faithful. It's the one only Sandra here with me tonight. Sandra D.S. Twine. Sandra, how are you doing? I'm doing wonderful. And I'm glad that I saw Rob at the idol hunt. And then we were talking about podcasting. And out of nowhere, he's like, hey, can you cover for me? And I was like, what? Those are big shoes to fill. But yeah, I'm your girl, Sandra, the most faithful of the faithfuls. so happy to have you here Sandra I'm excited this is going to be a fun night for us because I do feel like there's a lot for us to talk about despite coming in I'm not going to lie to you I was like this feels like it's going to be a slow boring episode but we got a lot here tonight oh there was a lot of stuff um you know the recap of how we even got here to Eric um so we're getting into it already i knew eric was gonna take it i knew he was gonna he was gonna accept the ultimatum you don't want to be murdered come on guy there's only like three four banishments left and how who doesn't want to be a traitor you don't have to worry about murders you're you're halfway to the finish line already like that check has your name on it i think especially once he took the cloak off and he sees rob there there's got to be a level of security because he's like oh no one thinks it's you at all including me yeah i want to ride this wave with you i think i can get there and win some money i mean i think for him more than anybody the alternative is you leave which is stupid like you're not going to say no to that uh because to answer your question of who would say no to that pilot pete would say no to that which I still don't understand two years later. It still baffles me, but ask him if he'd say no now. Change this tune, I hope. Yeah. So it was very fun to talk about a world where Eric just declines it, but it was always going to be a yes. And I was very interested about how the two of them work together tonight, because I think that there is a certain level of their team and a certain level of, well, if he also gets caught, I don't care from Rob that I'm getting. Yeah. And not only that, although you touched on it and in my opinion, I feel like Rob was the mastermind behind Candace and Lisa going home. So I don't understand why Eric is forgetting about that. But yes, Eric, he trusts Rob completely. I would, too. I don't feel like Rob is out to set him up and then take whatever the cash prize may be. I honestly believe that because Eric comes off as such a faithful, that they could easily get to the end, bring one more faithful along and, you know, get rid of them. And then they take they take the victory like it's amazing. And I hope it's Mark with them at the end because Mark is blindly following. i yeah i think at this point for me i'm pencil first of all rob is penciled with pen on the finale i think rob makes it to the final fire of truth that far i'm confident of i do agree with you i think mark is one that's following them and and believing everything that's being said in front of him i think the other one for me is maura now we do see a segment where the three of them talk and i've to me it just feels like rob has a lot of friends which is why everyone can be expendable to him because he has like four other people anyway at any given time i think mora is his main um faithful and i think mark is his secondary because him and mark are in a lot of groups of three where people are like i trust these two implicitly so i almost am willing to say that to them these two are the most faithful of the faithfuls is mark ballas and rob roush when rob carried mora at that one challenge where he's going up the hill and she's on his shoulder right then and there I said that's gonna be she to him I mean to her that's a traitor angel right there I know it's the word traitor angel but he is protecting her and that's why she can say whatever she wants at the round table or at the kitchen with no consequences because he's protecting her too and she just doesn't realize it and if she did who cares you're gonna go all the way to the end yeah because like i was also i was about to ask you is do you think she's clued in because i do think that traders will often try and marinate one or two faithfuls to on their side to keep the whole way through who are also going to be seen as very faithful and who their words will defend them at every given point but you know to your credit we've seen some faithfuls have that and then clue into it like i know exactly what this is i'm just gonna string me along go ahead i don't care do you think mora has an inkling or do you think mora just is feels like this is an ally No one has an inkling. Rob comes off as such a faithful. There's no way they just know, like even Eric. Eric is such a faithful. And to me, Johnny and Todd. Well, that's because we're watching on TV and we know they're faithful. I would be looking more at Natalie because we know that there's always a gamer in the turret. And so far, four of them have gone home, banished or murdered, whatever it may be. But they were all faithful. So it's got to be Natalie. Like I would just be on top of that, even if I was wrong, just to survive another roundtable and even a murder. Yeah, I I've been surprised at quite a few turns here from the faithfuls. One being what you've pointed out with Natalie being the last quote unquote gamer there. Surely you assume they're going to want to look at her. But then the other thing for me is Rob voted. Rob got two rogue votes back to back from someone who is not proven to be a traitor because they got voted out in Candace. That never comes up here. Now, it could have been left on the cutting room floor. But I imagine if there was even a little bit of whispers about it, they would show it to us because it adds some intrigue of will he make it to the end or will he not? But he's got them snowed. And also, Sandra, I want to know what your thought is on this. If I find out that someone has had the dagger for like three rounds and not had to use it, I would be very suspicious at the fact that they have been surviving. Brand new. They don't know really what to do with this dagger. And all it does is give you two more votes, but they don't need it right now because they have the votes that they need. if I was in possession of the dagger, I'd only use it if it was specifically for me to make sure I didn't go home at that banishment, you know. But I think because they've never played with a dagger before, no one really seems to care about the dagger or even remember it until Alan brings it up every roundtable. Yeah. See, in my head, I'm like, I would burn it immediately because I don't want anyone to look at me. I don't want the traders to feel threatened by me or anything like that. But Rob continuously is like, what are they going to do? Vote against me. I have two votes now. Well, they're going to be terrified to do anything. And as the numbers dwindle, obviously he's in an even better spot. I think what helps is, again, it should not go unnoticed that he is hard cleared for so many of them for no reason. They just see him as so trustworthy that he can get away with a lot of things that most people couldn't in this game. And and going back to the whole Candace voting for him twice, I would easily say, listen, she was pissed off at me because I voted out her bestie Lisa. That's all that was. And then she was still holding a grudge. And there she came again. You know what I'm saying? Like it just it doesn't even matter anymore. They're way beyond that now. Yeah, I want to talk about because outside of Rob being the star of the show, I think tonight was a big episode for a duo, a duo that we have all known the whole season are a duo. But really, I feel like hard launch their friendship here tonight with Johnny and Tara being like, you know what, whatever. We are riding together. What did you think about everything that's going on with the two of them here? It just feels like they've been lying this whole entire time to now bring it up. But we saw they would show us little clips of them hugging or grabbing hands or doing something. But no one else saw it. And even if they did, no one paid attention to it. And it's great that they have that support system because it looks like they both need it. They're both really clueless as far as the game is concerned. They talked about that tonight and I'm glad they're there for each other. But they're both in trouble. They're both in trouble. I would have never said what a tight relationship we had, because now the heat's going to be on you even more. Like, we don't know what's going to happen now that Steven is gone. And depending on who gets murdered, what the next day is going to you know what's going to happen the next day. So I just think that they were premature and disclosed. I would have never said nothing until the reunion. Yeah, I feel like this was a moment of, well, I think we're cooked. we might as well just say it and put a united front on um because i do think that first of all i still don't know and and this episode really the one thing that baffled me is in what world are we legitimately looking at tara lapinski as a traitor she has done nothing to me that looks traitorous at all but kristen kish seems to for some reason think tara's a traitor despite john like you're never gonna think the two good friends are gonna be traitors right you assume maybe one if that but i think that was very interesting to me because the and i think this was a brilliant thing from the trader side of siding with these two to vote out steven over letting johnny go was genius because i think now it keeps the two of them in it they are a duo after all so people aren't gonna they're gonna want to split that up either way they're gonna want to vote one of them to be a trader in the event that they vote one and they're not a trader they can be like well yeah maybe one of them being a trader made more sense anyway they vote the other one out It's a slam dunk decision for them. It really worked out well. I totally agree, but we just got to see who makes it out tonight because they're not in the clear just yet. But wait, Pouya, you didn't say anything about Dorinda getting murdered. Oh, my God. Yes. I feel like we missed her all episode. She wasn't even missed. Yeah. No, I mean, listen, credit to you, because I think I would have forgotten to bring her up straight up. I think I would have forgotten. Yeah, I think Dorinda has been a very weird player this season because I think there's a lot of pressure when you are the one returnee for a season. It's like, OK, they saw something that we didn't. And I think a lot of Housewives fans had advocated for her to me because I'm very unfamiliar with the franchise. They're like, oh, she's a star. You're going to love her. Then she got murdered early last season and then they bring her back. And I feel like she's been a very quiet, very invisible player the whole way. and i mean just with the with the situation we found ourselves this episode there's been three women that have been banished and have been revealed to be traitors we assume that the meta would lead them to think a man is a traitor so they should and will probably kill off a woman here kristen has the shield it remains to be tara won't go because they want to put johnny as a as a person so it really left natalie or dorinda and natalie and rob are close so dorinda being the natural boot there made sense to me especially once the housewives have just left it's like okay they were protecting her it goes on but i don't know what did you think about dorinda this season because i really feel like she did it i feel like she made more of a mark in the last season than this one and she was only one episode last season well i i listened and i read a couple of things about her having like some huge fight on her season on her first episode and then she went home so I think because of the nature of how long she lasted in the game and how it played out for her maybe she was hurt and she was going to come in but this time she was going to know and do better and her doing better was laying low relaxing seeing what happens and if she wasn't made the traitor not to worry one of her bravo girls would be and she'd be okay but the minute her traitor angel again was gone boom she was done but yeah we really didn't even miss her no and i think that the one intriguing thing to me was that we see rob talk about how she loves him and she's someone that people are going to not look at him for because they're very close or at least they have a connection there and we saw this come up at breakfast where i don't remember what the exact phrasing was uh but someone's like that's your girl and like I think again he's in such a good spot that no matter who he murders they're like something yeah yeah yeah yeah and he was like yeah I'm gonna miss her yeah and he did it he did that to her he's so rational in who he picks to murder and why and it never comes back to him that's awesome but she said she was going back to Bluestone Manor so I posted on chat bcc i was like is that her house like my house only has an address i don't like my house isn't called you know bluestone man or i'm gonna have to google a picture of it yeah she has like the the house has its own instagram sandra like i'm looking at it right now it's got its own insta account which couldn't say about my place let me tell you mine is also just an address i live a simple life. How many followers? Uh, 30 K. Oh, Lord have mercy. Lord have mercy. All right. So then they, they go to the challenge. They go to this music box and I, for one thing that the music boxes didn't make a lot of noise. I think that noise was put here by the audio people by, by, I don't think because no one ever mentioned hearing noises on either side of them, you know? so what's funny is so we've seen this mission in the uk version and in the uk version they had someone behind the play behind the boxes with a little drum that they're playing the drum as it was happening to kind of quote unquote like muddy the noise but then here we didn't get that and i was like i just don't think these make as much noise as we think they do um i don't think they're making they're creaking like that and i i was watching the uk one but i usually watch it when I'm at the gym, but lately I've been doing stick yoga. So then I can't be on my phone on the bicycle. But when I get back to it, like when I get, when I do specific workouts, then I put it on the UK. So don't spoil anything for me. But it was pretty smart of them to go Tara, Tara, Tara. See, I wouldn't even play like that because for me, I'm looking at the outcome and I'm like, I need as much money as possible in this price pot. Yeah, I love this move from them to not to nullify all the questions and just go tear all the way because the the faithful gets such little evidence to go off of. They get such little information to work with. And I could you know, you never want to leave a breadcrumb that could even accidentally lead them to a right answer, which could happen. we've seen so many backwards logic decisions lead people to the right trader so why give them anything to work with if we just keep going tara they're gonna be like okay johnny is involved tara could be involved until we get to the last question which i did love the they're gonna make a short list now of four people and i want to commend rob the way this man exudes confidence because we see Eric and he's just, he's bricking it. He's like, oh my God, what did we do? And Rob like I got this We gonna we not gonna put ourselves in it Cause they always gonna think it one of one person on that list list We go with this list And honestly it the right list He puts Johnny and Tara which we know they not going to murder And then the next two likely best candidates to murder in Natalie and Kristen. It was a slam dunk decision. Absolutely. I totally agree. And you don't always have to put a traitor in the mix because it can really go bad. So I agree with them not putting someone in there and jeopardizing their game like there's no need for it because they they're just so faithful that no one will look at them anyway. But, yeah, that same list, I would have done the same for people to anybody that's got heat on them. Anybody that's being talked about at the roundtables, I would let them just banish them. And I would just murder anyone who's just way too faithful straight up. just keep chaos in the castle that's the only way to go and like they've lost a lot of the chaotic characters in this season but we keep seeing new ones emerge and it's good to just keep those people keep the loud people keep the wrong people and keep the people who are pointing at each other spider-man meme style if they're as long as they're doing that and you're not the name there you're fine so because they've got that all set up they do not need new information out there they don't need people being like hmm they said maura for the manipulator i wonder like they don't need to do all that that their life is fine right now to keep it the same so natalie was the manipulator right natalie she was mad about it um hold on who doesn't deserve a place in the final five of them said mora but the one they said was the most manipulative was natalie and she got six votes she was mad which is is a tough pill to swallow but then at the same time like okay i'm the only one that's from a show that's you know gamey so i i'd be like i could get that but i was like really i've spent all this time with all of you and you are not you are not acknowledging that i i'm not a manipulator come on don't be rude puya you should apply for the uh for the civilian traders are you going to no i don't think so i don't think i can handle it i really don't i i think i i know what i'm talking about i don't think i can apply it though you know what i mean I don't think I could do it. No. Once you're in there, forget about it. You'd be running that whole damn castle. Thank you. Thank you. Well, maybe I'll think about it. How about that? Yeah, you should. And then let me see what happened. So, yeah, so the box doesn't open up. They're stuck in there. But they show up in the castle pretty quick. And then they start mingling and getting ready for the roundtable. Like it really happened. Oh, so fast. Yeah, I feel like the episode really was making it seem like it's just a foregone conclusion. Johnny's out this episode. It doesn't matter. But then we see the tides begin to shift a little bit with Steven being the only other name that's in circulation. and really what was funny to me Sandra is that both these people both Johnny and Stephen the main sus that's put on them the main suspicion the smoking gun is a traitor advocated for them to get the shield and a traitor advocated for them to get the gold to get the dagger potentially in Lisa with Stephen and then Candace with Johnny oh but when Candace pulled Stephen they were in the library that too and that's when Rob came in and said can I talk to you real quick you know and then Steven got up and said oh we were just talking about how her name was coming up and then he said I want to talk to her so that's when Dorinda walked in with Johnny and she said I need two minutes or something like that and then Dorinda turned around with Johnny and said that's very telling you know so all of that stuff together no no when johnny said when dorinda said that's very telling candace was talking to um steven yeah yeah and so all these little things they're just putting them together now you listen you want something when you have evidence you want it to make sense and anything you can remember because a lot of times we don't remember crap in that castle from one minute to the next. So anything you can remember and grasp and put away for later, that's what you got to keep. Yeah, I'm very intrigued by this because, you know, we talk about often how the faithful have no information to go off of. But I feel and we've now seen, you know, this would be the fourth season. So they would have seen three seasons of the U.S. at minimum before they jump in. And I'm like, how often do you ever see two traders interact or publicly like advocate for each other to this effect where for me that should exonerate steven that should exonerate johnny but i feel like we we are seeing a lot of if they're seen together if they're advocating for each other they are traitors um which what do you think about that the you know that's hard yeah because i could just be like trying to find out information about what's going on depending on how many traders are out there and if i'm getting i'm not getting the information from anyone else but just being seen with me doesn't constitute that you're also a trader if i'm one um but that's why this game is tricky you gotta bounce around from room to room and you gotta make sure that you have an open door policy with everyone so that people can talk to you about anything and everything so that you know what's going on um but it just so happens that they've been sus on Steven since the gold, since Lisa gave him the gold. And then Candace talking to him one on one. And then I think there was one more thing that Candace had said. No, it was about Johnny when she wanted Johnny to get the shield right because he hadn't had one just yet. Yeah, it boiled down to who Candace was doing the most for. So between Steven and Johnny, that's probably what people remembered. I wouldn't doubt it if she was trying to help everyone out, but those were the ones that they remember. That's what stuck out to them. Which goes with also, you know, once you have your eye on somebody, your ears are going to be a lot more sharp to anything they're doing. So you're a lot more likely to be like, well, I don't know about all that, but I remember her advocating for Steven. That was kind of weird. we also see natalie talk about how she felt like steven's mourning of of dorinda was very fake she did not trust that he was being sincere in his mourning earlier that day grasping at straws again he didn't he wasn't maybe he had to be in tears for dorinda for it to look real I mean, listen, first of all, he shows up to breakfast late, which I used to have anxiety over getting to breakfast late because I knew they were freaking talking about me. You know, I don't want to die today. So he comes in late. There's probably not a lot of boiled eggs and salmon left. And Dorinda goes home. He's happy he made it through the night. He's happy he made it to breakfast. and to Natalie it's like you know he doesn't have the right attitude early in the morning but who's to say what he went through last night like someone being fake is it's just hard for me because I don't sit there and I do look and I do pay attention and I try to listen to what everyone is saying but i can't say for certain who is not acting like so grieve so like grief stricken that dorinda is gone i'd be glad that i'm still there like i don't care that it was dorinda shit i'm still here where's my eggs my toast my coffee and my salmon yeah and i think that's how i see it also it's like it wasn't me i'm still here let me get some coffee in me because i know we're gonna have to do this all over again today um but i think that's really for me that's that might be my tip to anybody who's who goes on the civilian traders listen if people die be be a little sad but do not lead the mourning ceremony you don't need to don't cheers them don't advocate for them i'm gonna say do not toast to them no no if someone initiates murdered just nod and raise your glass and move on with your breakfast like do not do the most you really do anything right in a situation like traitors where every little thing you do and every little thing you say is going to be I mean really what can you say look at Eric I guess I don't know why Kristen would say like you're not acting how you've usually been acting you haven't been saying much I'm guessing they probably had a stronger connection than we were seeing that now she's saying you haven't said shit to me all day what's up with you yeah i think it's interesting because i do think we when we first saw the mark and kristen connection eric was also there was the three of them and i think that really what raises the flag for kristen here is that he changed his mind it sounds like they went into this round table because we do see we see mark vote tara we see kristen vote tara we see Eric do neither of those and go Stephen Not Johnny nor Tara go Stephen And she is like You keep changing your opinions And you talk about wanting to Follow where the vote is Stop being a sheep Advocate for yourself Wait but the same thing could be said for her All day long we've been here for the last few days Johnny Johnny Johnny I could say the same for you I just think I would have thought At this point you abandon your Tara sus because Johnny is clearly like, you know what I mean? Think a little bit about like, if there's like five of us that are looking at that group of two, right? If five of us are looking at Johnny and Tara, three of us are going to go Johnny. I'm just going to go Johnny this round, even though I feel stronger about Tara because we're going to go both anyway. That's how I would go about it. But Kristen's not doing that. I think what I would have loved to see from Eric in this moment was for him to cite some of his poor decisions earlier as a reason why he's being a little more, more quote unquote sheepish, because I would say, listen, remember, I'm the person with the golden ears. I'm the one who thought I heard Tiffany and I didn't. So I don't want to push incorrectly. I'm a little bit scared of doing that. So I'm leaning on people that I do trust. The people that I do think are faithful and what they're saying to follow. I think that would have been a good defense. But here he still sounded incredibly nervous, which I think can be a little tough. But I still think there's bigger fish to fry. I think having the Johnny Terror duo still there gives him some safety. and there's not that many round tables left anyway he just has to survive two of them so he's not in a he's out of a spot golden ears what was the other thing he did he did another this last week with the handwriting he was like oh that's johnny's handwriting i can tell yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah i golden eyes and ears he he's out there but listen i i'm glad that he got picked I when I first saw the pick by Rob I didn't get it but now that I've seen them all you know for the first episode both as traders I think Eric is going to be fine because Rob's going to help him out he's good you know he's going to help him out and if he screws himself up and he messes up and and Kristen stays on top of him then Rob would just have to dispose of him too exactly you know And at the end of the day, Eric can only blame himself because he changed the way he was playing the game. And that's what you can't do the minute you get picked to be a traitor. You have to stay consistent or people are going to notice when there's less people in the castle. We don't have 20 whatever people. How many did they start off with? Twenty twenty three. Yeah, we don't have twenty three people anymore in there. So every single thing, your mannerisms, all of that. Well, it's very interesting to me because I would assume if you get picked to be a trader this late into the game, you've had so much practice being a faithful. Why does that change all of a sudden? You know, like why is he suddenly a little bit more nervous and stuff? Because just pretend that that didn't happen last night. It was it was a dream. You were still a faithful. I just feel when it comes to traders, a lot of times they talk really, really slow to make sure they don't screw up like Portia or who else messed up. So many. Portia did. Natalie at one point did. And Michael Rapoport also did. Yeah, yeah. She got she got saved. It was like a peppermint, you know, you just. And the thing is, they don't even catch it when they make the mistake of saying the wrong thing because they're so faithful and they're speaking freely and they're speaking. They can comprehend. They don't even realize that they just screwed up, you know. So I think that's the problem with Eric that now he said it. Now I got to go into breakfast and be quiet and be careful of everything I say. When you're a trader, you got to be careful. You have to be careful. And I think that, so we end the episode with, we go back to the turret. We're talking about the shortlist. And really there are two options. As much as I do love the show, suspending belief anyone can go. There are two options are Natalie and Kristen. I feel like from where I'm standing, Kristen saved herself tonight by hard accusing Eric and saying Eric was being weird. because then if Eric kills her, if she dies, they're going to look at Eric. And I think Eric now knows that. So, well, actually, he doesn't know the full quote because Rob did not say all that. Rob said she's looking at you. That was it. But I think Natalie is leaving. I think Natalie is the one getting murdered. I think Natalie also, Natalie would be the wisest choice because tomorrow Eric can just get in there and smooth things over with Christian. And listen, if that doesn't work, then she's got to go. because now it doesn't even matter. You saved her for one whole day only for her to go and try to rally the troops and get people to turn on you and banish you. So there ain't but so long you can keep a person that's saying your name. The ideal situation would have been for her to only say that to Rob where they could have handled business, but she said it in front of Mark. And if he goes and if she goes, then of course, Mark is the only person that can bring that to the round table and maybe jeopardize Eric's game. But let's see what happens. But, yeah, Natalie's got to go for me because of, like you said, Kristen saved herself by saying, if I die, look at him. That's like the worst thing you want to, you know. People say that and people do look. So that's dangerous when people say that. i think i agree because i do think that especially if you say that and you're saying that about another faithful then the traders can just murder you and stick it on that person they do not care i feel like people need to be very careful when they do that but in the event that you landed on a trader that can save you and i think here my assumption is that here it saves uh her i have to assume that because i do think that and i do think eric's gonna try his best to smooth things over with Kristen. I think also if Kristen gets murdered the next cycle, that's not that bad because now you can be like, well, now everyone knew what she said and they're pinning it on me. If you're Eric versus if it immediately happens tonight after this incident, I think it's going to be a lot worse for him because I do think he needs to come off more faithful. And I think that Eric outside of Kristen, he seems more faithful to everybody else as far as we've seen. So I think if he exudes more of that energy and does do that smooth over, then if Kristen does leave the cycle after that, it a lot less likely that they push on him And again I think still right now the they don want to distract from the johnny and tara thing if kristen suddenly leaves and some people are like she said to look at eric i think that would distract from what their bigger plan is but also rob has the dagger rob has many friends so i think for rob it doesn't matter whether kristen leaves whether natalie leaves whether eric is next whether johnny is next i think the main key thing is rob's not going anywhere yeah absolutely and not only that eric can always say well wait a minute yesterday you were on tara now you're on me like which is it like pick one like you're all over the place you're being inconsistent yeah that's kind of sus to me you know that's traitor behavior that's red flags it's signaling alarm bells like i don't know i just throw it on her um but yeah but i'm i'm really enjoying this season um i'm excited how many episodes we got left three or four i think we're left with two sandra i think we have one next week episode 10 and then one the week after is the finale episode 11 and then the reunion yeah we'll have two episodes oh my god i'm not ready for it to end like this no i've loved this season there's nothing else happening yeah actually i want to talk to you about that so you said you're enjoying the season i feel like this has been a very fun season despite the like because obviously when you come into a show with people you already know and are like rooting for to see do well and then they leave early it can leave a bad taste in your mouth but i've been at the edge of my seat this season i've been enjoying every step of the way despite you know that you were who was it that you were rooting for that's gone well rob um of course yeah i think for me rob was a big one i think for the audience a lot of the cbs people leaving early did that um yeah i think but i think that um and i think that we got to a point where it's like oh the people left they might not give us much but i feel like they have delivered i feel like they have delivered and i feel like it's been a very fun season for me i depending on this ending if it's if they stick the landing sandra this might be my favorite season of the four seasons of the u.s potentially me too i totally agree although someone had posted something today about certain players saying that specific things didn't happen and that production is touching the game too much. I don't know if that's true. And they were specifically talking about the U.S. traders. And I don't know what was even being said about certain things not happening in specific orders. Like it was just way too edited. But yes, I totally agree. I'm enjoying this season. I hate that the gamers went out early. I would have loved to see more. I would have loved to see more from like Monet. Another one that went home that we didn't really get a chance to see was man, Michael Rappaport. I kind of miss him. Sandra, please. No. That dude was so wild. I heard he was so fun. That's the kind of castle I want to be at. I want to have fun. Everything can't be serious all the time. I really did miss him. Well, speaking of serious, can we talk about the fact that Rob Roush meowed tonight in his confessional? The man meowed. We heard a meow out of this guy. Yeah, he's amazing. Why was it that he did a meow? What was it that got him? He talked about wanting to be nimble like a cat getting out of the jack-in-the-box out of the jack-in-the-box yeah you know what and when i saw that it was two housewives and a love island person up there i was like oh this is gonna be shit and man i'm just eating my words i got i got tomato on my face is that what it is it's egg on your face but egg on my face yeah i i think that i think and you know um talking about i've seen a lot of conversation about is rob the best u.s trader we've ever seen he is and the other name that comes up with that conversation is sari i think because of season one i think we were not conditioned we were shown that having a gamer in the turret is key because the gamers they're logical they play strategically you need that in the turret and i think from there on the show was like you right we do need a trader and a gamer in the turret for sure in fact we're gonna rely on them heavily and i feel like this season we get none of them and i'm happy because i was like we need to correct this problem because if you do like five seasons in a row of gamer heavy turrets they're never gonna let a gamer get out of episode three anymore like that's just not gonna happen so you have to buck that trend and with that comes a big risk of is it true do you need a gamer in the turret for the turret to succeed i think this season has been living proof that you do not um you can have people who are gamers masked behind shows that are not gamer-esque and i think that that's something that i do love that we're seeing i feel like people often forget that you can come from a you can come from a strategic show and be a non-strategic person and you can come from a non-strategic show and be a very smart intelligent player so i just i'm happy that we got that and i'm happy that it makes anyone a viable option in the future? I'm happy we got it too, because I kept saying, man, when they do the all-star season, I hope they call me. But the problem is that they always point to the gamers in the turret. Like that's an issue. And we saw that play out. You know, we saw it play out. Different gamers went home, either banished or murdered because they couldn't be trusted simply because they come from these games. And you know what? I always tell any survivors that or even in the audience in general, I'm like, before they come after you for being a survivor and assuming that you're going to be in a turret, remind them that every season always has someone from Big Brother in there. Barberty was only in there because Dan and Phaedra brought her in. Alan did not pick her, but the Big Brother was picked and the Big Brother. So I'm like, just fight, fight, fight. That is Big Brother. It ain't Survivor. Yeah. And I feel like of the two franchises, I feel like the survivor traders have done better than the big brother traders have just on just looking at patterns and looking at the way they've played the game. I feel like survivor lends more skill set to the turret than a big brother player does. I think I think in the game in general, being a survivor helps us get further in the game because I don't name a big brother person that got deep. We don't. Do we have one? I mean, I think last season, Danielle ends up being the last traitor remaining of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Dang. I forgot about her and Brittany. They were there to the end. And all the survivors were gone at that point. Yeah. Tony went out, Jeremy went out, then Rob, then Carolyn. Yeah. Yeah. And then Canada, we have had good Big Brother Canada representation. We don't want to spoil anything for anybody, but that's a whole different thing, I think, to compare to the U.S. one. But, yeah, it's very interesting to me where we're going to go from this season forward, because does this embolden the show to be like, hmm, OK, we don't need to put our gamers in the turret. Like, do you think next season we go no no gamers in the turret again? Probably no gamers and no housewives, because then everyone's going to have three housewives in there, you know? so you gotta be careful you gotta move them around to where you can have a season where just it could be anybody you know it just can be anybody um and that's what we want we need a whole gamer season just nothing but gamers i would be very curious how that goes because i feel like the gamers are also the most likely to metagame and the most likely to think about the show beyond the show right like uh i saw in in chat bcc a matter of fact i saw janelle talking about hey if there are no cameras in the room you're in a trader's not in there move on that's not a room you should look at i feel like gamers think like that like they're thinking post other things that some people might not be looking for you know yeah but the problem with that is that there's still cameras there there's a person following you around but there are cameras in every room so i don't necessarily agree with that sandra if there's an all-star season and you're on that season and you are your title says the most faithful of the faithful so you're trying to run back that title are you trying to go for a new title would you like to be a traitor in that scenario listen anyone that says that they wouldn't want to be a traitor is a liar. You only have to worry about banishments. You know, you only have to worry about half the game and not slipping up. But being a faithful, you worry more for not only banishments, but also murders. You got to make sure you don't step on any traitor's toes to where they fear you and are like, oh, I got to murder her tonight or whatever. But I don't know of anyone that really Like Jam Jam when he was in the car When the season started He asked everybody in the car Do you want to be a traitor and a faithful Who the hell is going to tell the truth And be like I only want to be a traitor But come on they sit in front of Alan And what do they say Alan I want to be a traitor I'm going to be the best traitor you've ever had Come on Yeah I really think that there's maybe Two or three people in an entire cast that genuinely do not want to be a traitor genuine steven coletti is one of them off the top of my head that was like very clearly he said it and he doesn't want to be i think tara might be the only other one i can think of but everyone else it was like you give me the cloak i'll wear it i'll make it happen i'll make a mess um absolutely that's an easy way to get the money i mean you only just you have to screw up royally to get busted you know i think that's the way to go but the game can be won as a faithful it really can because we've seen that happen too so it's not like the traders have you know the biggest advantage yeah i mean they do have a huge advantage but still if you can just be one of the most faithful of the faithfuls then you don't have anything to worry about but those are the ones that should get murdered absolutely those are the ones that should get murdered i think last season the biggest mistake from that turret was not murdering Dylan Efron. Dylan survived way too long. They gave him way too much leeway and then he stole the game. He stole the game from right under the trailer's noses. Not only him, Dolores and Ivar. Gabby could have been a traitor. She could have been a faithful. She was slick at the mouth. She was funny. She could go either way. But the other three were so faithful. Murder, murder, murder. I do think so. I want to ask you one other thing as far as this goes i feel like the thought is about to fleet to get out of my head though um you know what i think it may have i might get back to it it's fine because we were talking about the previous seasons and the faithfuls and murdering specific yes um so i feel like you just mentioned how it you can win as a faithful and we have seen it true in fact before the season is over right now faithful have won more than traders have uh this show what do you think about this I feel like the traders win or lose the game. And what I mean by that is when the traders turn on each other, that's when the faithful really take control of the game because they leave a lot of breadcrumbs behind a lot of clues behind. And that's when even the most wrong faithfuls end up striking gold and figuring out where to vote. I totally agree. Especially if it's trader on trader arguing in the round table, because then that's they're going to pick up on it and say, I think that was traitor on traitor. Like that was real. Like they're cutting with knives, you know. And if it's not, we still have to give it a shot and check them out and make sure that we're not being fooled. So vote them out, make them go to the circle of truth and let us know what's going on. But, yeah, that was my whole issue with the Rob and Candace thing. I think that the first time he wrote her name down, he saw Candace was very upset. The second time around, he should have just said, hey, Lisa, hey, Candace, if I hear you guys' name like Lisa, if I hear your name running around this castle again today and now there's even more momentum than yesterday and there's no shot that you're going to be saved, I'm sorry. But I can't throw my game in the toilet trying to protect you. And Candace, forgive me, you know, but that's, you know, depending on what's being said, because a lot of times we're at the roundtable and I'd be there and someone would say, I'm sorry, Pouya, but I'm voting for you. OK, so now I know they're voting for you. You know, they would be specific, like, hey, Lisa, I'm voting for you. And if I'm wrong, then I'm sorry, but this is why I'm doing. And then you start to add up the votes in your head to where you can make a good decision on who you know is going to go home. There's no doubt about it. And you want not that it's her mentality, but you don't want to be throwing silly votes like when Natalie voted out Tara just because Candace said Tara was saying your name and it was the only Tara vote. You know, it doesn't make sense. She's not going to go home. You just wasted a vote. You know, don't don't play like that. But anyway. Yeah. So, gosh, I just went rambling. hey that's what we're here to do this is this is the thing i do love about this show this is why i've really grown to love it uh from the beginning to now there's so many new things to still talk about this show and there's so many different ways to look at it and there's so many different win conditions so many different results we've seen and it intrigues me it really does the whole thing intrigues me i genuinely never thought i would see the day where we have a four-person faithful win and last year we got exactly that i was like what do you mean no one's voting each other up for more money here this is ridiculous it happened and i think that that just is a testament to how fun this game can be it's not a strategy none of those four were from the challenge no yeah no one no challengers there to to cut you and take the money and run with the check because that's all that's about it's all about getting that money sharing as little as possible Sandra is there anybody you would like to see on the traders that we haven't seen yet Oh man um I had said when I did my um our media stuff in New York uh two years ago and they asked me who would be great for from Survivor to play in the traders castle and I said Courtney Yates and Jerry Manthe. And that was because they were, they were their villains, not that were really villains, but they were from the villains tribe, just like me, just like poverty, just like Boston Rob. You know what I'm saying? Like these girls, they can hold their own. And I'm sure that they would turn that castle inside out, upside down. And they're slick at the mouth too. And yeah, when they cut you with that tongue, it's deep. that's what i want at the round table yeah i want that and i want good confessionals and i think they would both deliver on that for sure it's crazy how many people from heroes and villains have played because sari and stephanie were the first ones and we're all coming off the same season of survivor which was season 20 you got let me see uh rob parvati me stephanie sari five of the 20 already in that castle And we need we need uh and poverty had mentioned Tyson So she put Tyson name in there So that would have been three more, but yeah, there's a lot of good survivors out there that would turn that castle upside down and inside out. Alan wouldn't know what to do with himself. I know. And the thing is, I feel like, I feel like Tyson now, you know, he's about to be on this upcoming season of house of villains. So I feel like his foot's in the door. I think I could see him being the next ask. I think that with his resurgence, with however it's going to go for him on 50, I feel like coach is someone that I could see them like looking into, um, bringing, he's going to be a spectacle at the round table for sure as well. I think your season might end up having like more than half of it on by when this is all said and done. Yeah. If they want, I mean, it's to this day, to this day, season 20 still has the best cast ever in the history of survival. So I would definitely look there for their next couple of survivors to come into the castle. Yeah, I think that would be I would love to see it. I wonder how many of them end up on the same season versus like spread across, because that's something I'm always concerned about is when they bring people from like the same franchise. But when you bring too many from like the same circles, I'm like, OK, are they going to get targeted especially more now that there's a goal? They were on the same season. um only other who would know that though the housewives wouldn't know that they don't watch survivor it's interesting because i feel like and we never got to the bottom of this but i feel like we like caroline talked like she knew who rob was or at the very least someone told her who rob was when uh this episode when the premiere happened and and they were going up to look at the secret traitor boxes she was like he's a mastermind we need to rely on him i was like because I'm like outside of the podcast wait a minute Boston Rob no no no no Rob Sestronino everyone knows who Rob Sestronino is come on isn't he labeled the smartest guy to never win survivor yeah but wasn't that mentioned like around like season 9 like that was a long time ago so I'm like that is almost a deep cut for someone that is not familiar with our world I feel like we know who he is and so we're tapped in but it's like you know it's like being an online person there's different pockets of online like there's housewives online there's survivor online you know why when you said carolyn i'm thinking about survivor carolyn i forgot you're talking about that housewife that was there yes oh yeah yeah she came in saying that he's the one well well according to what rob had said it was because it was something jam jam had said right he heard that which i mean if and if we go off that then i'm like if there's like two or three people from like they played the same season all it takes is one person to whisper that to other people and now it's out there now they know um and then it's a problem but i will say i can't remember the tony jeremy boston rob thing being a big deal last time they were all in the same season that never that didn't seem to be like a we need to look at this group as a problem um well because um tony and jeremy play together and although boston rob was there he's from the other side he's from like boston rob is with parvati and tyson and ethan to where tony is more jeremy sarah me you know what i'm saying we're all winners but we're on different sides of the island yeah yeah yeah so let's be real um yeah that's why man it hurt me when I saw Tony go out and he told Rob, you're a sellout because he was hurt. You're a sellout. That shit. Look, I feel it right here still. That was a lot. You want to play with the gamers. You should want to play with the gamers because who else is going to have your back if they don't? Yeah, I think that's the big difference for me between the gamers and the housewives because they are the two groups that come in with more numbers. And we see historically, the housewives typically will not vote each other almost like on a code level basis like i'm not going to do that whereas the gamers i feel like so quickly they're like one of us is bad i think it's you and instead of being like i'm gonna work with them no matter what for the minute i think there's a lot of accusations that get chucked out and then they vote each other and then they're you know one or two of them are left and now they're in trouble yeah yeah i totally agree well we know that uh if i ever go back to the castle i'm definitely going to go back to rob has a podcast and listen to all the different podcasts and get all the the good intel and try to figure out how do i find these damn traitors you don't need the podcast sandra you do quite well on your own we know this we literally watched you have a whole segment where you put people on game of hey this is how a numbers game works let's ride these numbers Oh, that was only because that only came from Peter shutting the door. That's all that came from. And then I was like, wait a minute. If they have one or two traders over there, we're screwed. But hopefully we have the bigger numbers and we have one or two traders on our side. Our traders have to know they got to get that other trader out. But there was nobody over there. We had the traders in Parvati. We had the traders in Phaedra, Parvati, and Kate. We had them all. Yeah. And I think that that was a very important season. That was a very important moment because I do think it allowed people to see more behind the scenes of the game. And what I mean by that is just because you are all faithful doesn't mean you should ride with everybody. Because if these five are locked in, you are not going to have a chance to win as a faithful regardless. So you need to find your carve your own way to the final fire of truth. I would read the comments from the fans and it would be like, oh, no, but they're supposed to be finding traders. Well, listen, yes, we're supposed to find traders and we hope we get some along the way. But at the end of the day, I'm trying to get to that last of the fire of truth. That's that's day. What? 18, 19, episode 11. So faithfuls will have to fall. I just don't want it to be me. But they can't grasp that. They want you to get a traitor episode after episode after episode. and it just does not work like that yeah i think that for me in my head the way i would describe the game is find the traders but prioritize your path to final four essentially um and if you have a couple traders and they happen to you happen to survive and they happen to survive well you know who you need to get out of final four but i think ultimately it would be foolish to you know and i this is why when people backpilot Pete as a great player, I push back because I'm like, he was playing a good trader hunter game, but he was not playing a game that was ever going to get him the win. And like, what's the, I don't care. It wasn't a gamer. He didn't understand. You know, who knows that strategy? Trish shell. She should have helped them out a little bit more. Cause it was Peter, Kevin, Bergy, Trish shell. And, um, what was the old man's name from John? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. and i think that's really that's really what it did for me i was like i you know i respect this for you as a trader hunter but if your plans do not have you in the center of getting to final four then who cares like that doesn't matter like i'm not and this is the same thing with colton where colton's doing the most i was like you doing all of this outside of gaining tv time is not doesn't doing it for me because you are not putting yourself in a position to win you don't care about the win and if i go out episode four because i was doing the most and then at episode 11 two faithful win you know what i can't say we won because i'm not there as a faithful it doesn't matter that i was on that team initially yep i totally agree but there's so many ways to play the game but yeah we were just backed into a corner and i used that to just secure my spot i was like our traitors if there's a traitor over here you can't allow anyone right here to get murdered or banished and then that night we didn't even have a vote i think that was the night where they stopped all the voting that was going to happen there was one night where they forgot that between like poverty and peter because we're going back and forth and nobody went home um which they shouldn't do that there should always be a banishment there should always be a murder it's similar to like you know the thought about tribal council you should always still have someone leave at the end of the cycle like the amazing race all these u-turns and and survive no somebody's gotta always go or it's it ain't right it ain't right when production medals like that no absolutely not sandra are there any other thoughts you have on this episode before we wrap up here that we didn't talk about No, I liked Lala in that box. She had her own. She was in her own Jack in the Box box. She's such a cutie. She doesn't bark. She doesn't bother. She she's always at all the missions, all the challenges like Lala's everywhere. She's so cute, but no, I'm grateful that you guys invited me. I appreciate it. I'm always, I enjoy talking about this stuff. Not that I know a lot. I just know a little bit. And look, I'm tired of seeing those, those wish lists that don't have me on them. They need me there for diversity. diversity aside great character and someone who is being very humble and and not you know knows a lot more than she's giving herself credit for but all the reasons are there absolutely i grew up playing clue i did and i always found out who murdered who in what room with what damn tool so um i mean but traitors is different because sometimes you can be fixed on somebody And it ain't what you think it is just because of their personality or how they're acting or what they said or even how they dress. I mean, look, all I did was take a sip of water and I was labeled a traitor. Like, that's the silliest thing ever. But that's how crazy that castle is. But thank you for inviting me. I had a good time. I enjoyed myself. Rob needs to go out of town more often when Traders is on. Listen, we'll make a note of that. And in the event he doesn't, I would like to say you are always welcome here. Sandra. Just let me, let us know. Absolutely. I do know Sandra, correct me if I'm wrong. You do a podcast yourself about the traders also. No, I go live. You just go live. That's your style. Yeah. Oh, and Carolyn calls me whenever jam jam can't do it. Okay. I was going to say, I've seen you on with Carolyn. Yeah. Usually cause it's her, it's her and jam jam kicking and screaming podcast. And then if he's busy, which he should be at the reunion, she'll probably call me tomorrow like hey can you do 30 minutes and i'll just jump on you know we're retired i'm always home when i'm not on vacation so but no i don't have my own podcast well maybe you should yeah you think i don't know sometimes i feel like i didn't say anything constructive i don't think that i don't i think you underestimate how important that is that's not that important i feel like vibes matter way more than knowing what we're talking about then making jokes and calling back to stuff that's kind of the order for me yeah yeah well thank you for that i appreciate it of course um well we do finish this recap here but y'all already know we have a lot of things coming up this week um but let me go ahead and start the plugs off here you know our our faithful leader may be gone to do some fun stuff this weekend but his book is going to be around and available soon. Come rob as a book.com. Make sure you get geared up and ready for what that drops. I know I will be reading it and I famously have not read in a minute. So, you know, I need to break that sooner rather than later. Also this episode, we have been seeing this lead up to 50. They're really doing a lot with it. They put an episode out there in preparation for the season. And it is a heroes versus villains episode that Rob brought on. three people from the season and Colby coach and Stephanie to talk about the premiere of heroes versus villains, which, uh, which Sandra did talk about, um, one of the best casts in reality TV history. Absolutely. Mm-hmm. Um, also we are there, you know, we have all these live events coming up for 51 of them being in LA, the return of the live know-it-alls should be fun. I believe, I don't know how many years it's been since Steven's been at a live show. It's been a hot minute. Um, so, It's going to be interesting. Make sure y'all are tapped in for those. Rob is a website.com slash events for the tickets. And that includes Toronto. Toronto is currently only available to the patrons. LA tickets are available to all, but keep your eyes peeled because once those tickets go live, you're going to want to cop them if you are not already a patron, because those tickets usually do go fast. So make sure you are clocked in for that. Also, Rob has dressed very, very quintessential Canadian spring for me. So I do appreciate that in this graphic tomorrow, the Q and a, as I said, Rob, my bestie for the restie not around this week. So I will be taking his place at the Q and a. So if you were planning on calling in and now, you know, I'm going to be there or not, Rob, call in anyway. Don't just be like, I got other stuff to do. I'm still fun to talk to. That'll be tomorrow, 3 p.m. Eastern. Bring any questions you have, whether it's the traders or something else. You know, I like to chat. You know, I like to talk. So we'll make it happen. but we'll make it fun and we will make it good. All right. And then there's me and Liana over on the Puyin Liana Lounge. We had our Valentine's Day episode recorded. It's going to come out tomorrow. So make sure you're tuned in for that. We tier listed a bunch of Valentine's Day items and whether or not they were good or bad. Very interesting questions and sorry, answers with those. So make sure you check that out. See what exactly we talked about there and extracted with Marion Chappelle. Y'all advocated for the show to get full season coverage. And that is happening. Obviously some familiar faces over on extracted. So make sure you are tuned in, checking those out as well. And Sandra brought it up. I brought it up. Join the chat BCC. We're having a lot of fun there this season. I will say the first couple of weeks kind of went wild, got a little wild in there, got a little intense, but we're chilling. We're still chilling in there. So make sure you come in and check that out over on the chat BCC side. make sure you see everything that's going on, including our conversations, our trivia, and our questions. Okay. All right, cool. Sandra, thank you so much for joining me. I really do appreciate it. I know you had a good time, but I want you to understand that this is surreal for me getting to talk to you. We're just big chilling. Like we're like, as if we could ever be equals, like, you know what I mean? Like, I know, you know, it just felt great. I had a good time. And Rob might have some competition for this co-host spot. Just saying. Okay. And tell him to change that extracted picture to me and Nina in the HQ. Okay. I will put that request in person, Elise. Or at least this one, like with Amy, because she's such a good player. This one, like the bear with the... Ooh. Yeah. Because those bears are everywhere up there in Canada. My God. all right well thank you so much sandra thank you everybody for being here we'll catch you we'll have a feedback show this week we have interviews coming along i have one tomorrow actually uh i will be talking to well actually i won't tell you just in case so be on the lookout for that and obviously q a tomorrow 3 p.m eastern make sure you're tuning in for that everybody take you have a good one catch you later