Tricky Stewart

This is an I Heart Podcast. Guaranteed Human. I'm being money. We are take. Take round the chat. We are the authorities. All things are in being. Ladies and gentlemen, my name is take. I'm Jay Valentine. Woo! And this is the R&B Money Podcast. Come on. The authority. Yes sir. One of our things. All things. Yeah. All things. All things. Yeah. All things. Yeah. All things. Yeah. All things. Yeah. All things. Yeah. All things. Yeah. All things. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. be nominated to be in a whole of things. Because we know I don't think everybody should be there. Everybody should be there. This person should. But this man here, not only should he be in there, he is. He is in there. He is. He is a gentleman, get him. Tricky Star. What is your plan now? Yes. Yes. Thank you. Yes. That was amazing. Finally, brother, welcome. Thank you, man. Thank you all for having me. I want to start there. I mean, normally we go way back and then move up. Yes. We got to start at the Hall of Fame. Because this is the first platform that you are going to speak on. Going to speak on this. Yeah. This is, this day is very, very special. You know, it's like, it's not what it's like, one of those things that you don't know that you didn't, you didn't think it was possible, but then it happens. You just like, the nomination was going to be incredible just to be like, I've done something that quantifies being thought of this way, but to actually get in to actually be first ballot was crazy. And I'm just like, I'm going to cloud gazillion. Like, everybody's like, you know, you can celebrate to the, I'm like, this is, I'm going to celebrate this for the rest of my fucking life. Yeah. For the rest of my life. So I've never, I've never been called a nominee. So I just want to, I just want to understand the process of, is it, is it like the NFL Hall of Fame where you walk in and you walk into a house and somebody's like, Hey, man, and then one of your family members is there and like, Hey, man. Absolutely. And it has that magnitude to it. And mine was done by none other than John Platt, the chairman. Oh, yeah. So, you know, to get that call, because what happens is, you know, John and I, we've known each other for a long time, but we know each other as people, not as in the business. We don't have business relations like that. But the way that I could tell he was smiling, was like, they knew who to send. Absolutely. Like, you know, they knew who to send because he's so much about his, our is about publishing about what he's put into the game. And so I know I always knew that he had respect for me, but whoever made the call to say, John should be the person to make that call for me. That was it. And so we just, we have that moment that is really, really special and unique that I just feel like they, whoever, whoever came up with notifying him, notifying me, kudos to them. So do you get like a jacket? You know, like a, what are they called a bus? I don't even know. It was, yeah, it's like when they, when they make this like the, the, the, your face or something like that. Yeah, like, I know there, I know there's a museum. I don't, I'm not exactly sure what it's going to be, but the, um, the ceremonies in June, June 11th in New York, I believe it is. And so I remember going to this win Ralph Peer, when I was signing the peer music was there and this is a major, major deal. You know, and this is not a lot, it's less than 400 people in this club, right? And so this is a, this is just something to be with. You think of all the songwriters that people that write songs and to just get included in a nomination. It's just, it's unbelievable feeling, dude. Congratulations. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. And she's amazing to see one of us. Yeah. You know, I'm saying like, man, yeah, and it's, you know, obviously, I think, you know, I'm in the idea of getting things in an inclusive manner like there's definitely some, I could feel that there's, you know, which main going in recently, the Dallas going in, Rodney Jerkins was just acknowledged. It feels good to know that our music is reaching the masses being accepted by the masses. And then you're being able to tell that there's a craftsman, there's a, there's a craft that goes here. And so I look forward to, I think there's a lot of people that are going to get into this to the Hall of Fame now that the, that it's a little bit more diverse, I think. Yeah. I mean, I think, well, I don't know about a lot of people, but I mean, you would have to see some of the people who aren't on there. Oh, sure. Like, you know, I'm feeling a different. Yeah. Yes, of people, you know what I'm saying? But I, but I, but as you say the word inclusion, you know what I'm saying? I think there, we've come to a place to where the respect and the appreciation and the acknowledgement, yes, of who we are and what we've done. Like, there's a real thing. And we've fought for that so long in so many different avenues of entertainment. Absolutely. And I think from my perspective, I could be completely wrong on this, but I think Nile Rodgers being there as the chairman has a lot to do with it. Nile Rodgers for, in, you know, overall context of our relationship and how that ties in when the catalog sales started going crazy and everybody started selling and we did our, I did it. My catalog deal, I did it with hypnosis, which was Nile Rodgers and Mark, Mark, Mark, Riadas, right? And so they are part of, I believe in the sense of they started giving black music top dollar, right? Top dollar and light. People were not selling in distress. People were not selling because they were broke. There was, you know, that was a kind of a vibe of why a lot of times black copyrights ended up in other people's hands. And this was the first time where they were coming around going, these multiples, they were getting paid with those songs actually meant to the generation having Beyonce cuts, Rihanna cuts, Justin Bieber cuts. It wasn't, it was like, it had to be, they were paying for the songs of the generations, like people paid for the rolling stones. And they weren't making a differential between the artistry being, and so I think that kind of influence has helped, you know, this whole, this moment that I'm going to be able to say became possible is just having someone that understood what I did that came up and then ended up as, as in that room as the chairman. So super excited and thank you to everybody that voted in there. Yeah, that's incredible, bro. I love the big jobs and making the call. Yeah, for sure. Is he like, is he like, is big John like the, I mean, especially for all three of us in this room, we can speak to it. He's been important for all of us. Big John is Yoda. Big John. Yeah, he's a big, big, big ass Yoda. Like, big John is Yoda, bro. Now his influence is crazy. Crazy. And his aura. Yes. That's because he's such, he's such a good person in a business that is painted in such a dark way. Yep. Big John is a light. Yeah. And it's always been a light. Every single time I've met him, when I had no accolades at all to maybe having a placement deemed getting some more things going it just throughout the process of my career. Unfortunately, he's always been the same gracious and amazing guy to me. Absolutely. Well, let me tell you one of the things that he's done with us that is just made it amazing is that one day, couple, I don't even know, maybe seven years ago now, we were out here, I was out here during this time like Grammy week and we were just talking. I was like, you said, John, you know, they're really pulling the investment out of Atlanta. Like, you know, like, it's like, it's, we're not a rap town. We got pop songs. I was like, this is the home of we belong together and umbrella and fireworks and all these great songs. And I was like, we're not, we don't have anybody there. So the street influence is really like taking, y'all think we're gonna rap. And so I'm like, no, it's so John, John came, he came down there because, you know, he had so much success early with Dallas and Jermaine in that region. He came down there. We walked the space and the place that people talk about Red Zone, that is now Sony Music Publishing in Atlanta. Oh, wow. And so he's been down there planting seeds with songwriters brought the investment back to Atlanta. So he brought in and at the same time put us in a position to be like, hey, we have a corporate, we have a corporate relationship in Atlanta. These are really like huge things that, you know, if not you, then who, you know what I mean? And I understand that responsibility. It's just been great to have those types of, and these types of connections with him because it hasn't, you know, I haven't, you know, I've always been with the team that I've been with from a publishing standpoint. So our worlds don't cross, but that respect has always been mutual. Absolutely. That's bringing, bringing industry. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's funny though, because he's like, yeah, you know, because this is, it's R&B and popular. Man, you did who that? I'm gonna say you can't use my JT money. Yes. This is, this is man. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I was talking recently. Of course, yes. My first, my first hit was who that, like that was my first major hit. And I love that record. Thank you, man. That was, man, that was just the old days just coming from the strip club and having too much to drink. I saw him as part of my show. Are you saying? Yeah. So when I used to have radio songs in my show, who that was one of the radio songs in my show, you know, it was on that. Wow. So you had to program it. Program it. And it was what it was once you got there. No changing. Right. Would you turn? Would you turn? That's come on. Thank you. You can't, boy. I read that today. I don't know you do that. Yes. You know that. That's the third time. Thank you. Yeah. Okay. You got, you got dirty stuff. Shout out to JT money and soul later tonight. I'm with all of it. I was also put that record out from the hem and 20 Mercedes. That was an independent record. Like they put the money out and eventually put it out with a priority over a capital. But they started that whole thing independent. They would allow me to break sole off of that. That's how sole ended up becoming my first artist. Yeah. So they was your first artist. Yeah. That was the first thing that, you know, I put out on my label like with Gerald Busby and DreamWorks when they went over there to start. And so yeah. And then that. Listen. I'm going to get around you but not. Been in front of you for so long. Yeah. Cause I remember all the DreamWorks stuff. Cause I was at DreamWorks with Jason and Terry and with Draino. Yeah. I'm there at DreamWorks every day. Just walking around and just never ran into you. I'm never in the label. I'm always in the studio. Okay. And it's one of the things that kind of works for me and it works against me. It's like, I've been in the studio my whole life but at the same time, I've always built my own studio. And so I don't have a lot of cross-polledization with people just naturally of like, you know, I've always built a world. I've always been into world building and signing and finding and discovery. And so, you know, sometimes people think, you don't know what that's personally like, you're not going to believe this but I don't believe we've never met. And it's not. I've been intentional but after making records for 30 years in rooms by yourself, you know, or just with a person or two because even as it pertains to like collaboration, I'm not like a two to three person. Like I'm a me and you like, you know, it's like, it's always just been me and the other person, you know, or maybe just a third party but it's always been a very intimate process for me being a creative because I don't know. It feels like it feels like a real thing when I'm in the room. So it's like, it just feels, it's always been a situation where I felt like I'm not giving this shit out to everybody. I honestly don't even like letting people watch me work. And you know, so that's kind of how that all started. And so I wish we knew each other better because you're from Milwaukee. I've always rooted for you. I've always loved your records. There's records that you've made that I've studied like this like, I deserve record in particular. I remember when I came out and I would just be in my hotel room. I would just get super high and just listen to that record about at least like 30 or 40 times in a row before I would just go make a record. Like you know what I mean? Just like, that was just part of my process like being in Las Vegas when we live in Vegas. People talk about that era of trick and dream and all that. Like, that was part of the process. We just smoking a lot in the bathroom because I love the way the reflections of music sounds and the big ass marble bathrooms. But that was that record and that time period. And also obviously, you know, that the remake that you did, I can't make you love me. That's just like, you know, those are just like, you know, two of the, I mean, I think those are two of the best records, you know, from my personal taste like. But we've been talking about it and going back and forth about it. And I feel like since I'm part of your Hall of Fame career and inspiration for sure. This is time, it's time to actually get on the books and have, and have some Hall of Fame tricky steward music in my repertoire. You understand what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. It's time. I called you remember? I know. I know it's, I know it's going to be expensive. If there's a, I give you a sense of it. But we, there's no way. What's it do it, man? It's nowhere. It's time. It's still it. Let's go, let's, let's go to early tricky. Yeah, let's get to Chicago. Let's go to Chicago. Okay. Yeah. Let's go to where you, you decided, this is what I'm going to do. I decided what I was going to do. I was a football player, right? And so I'm everything for being red zone. It's all football references. I played quarterback my whole life. You played quarterback, you know? And so what ended up happening was I was good recruited by, like I got recruited to high school. It was starting to get to that point. It was freshman year. Everybody came back after freshman year. Everybody was six four. We was all same height. Everybody was six, three, six four. Everything changed. Yeah. So one of those things that I was like, okay, chances of me making it at quarterback were going to be slim. I was probably good enough, you know, it would have been one of those things that would be like, we changed a position. I turned out a corner. I didn't want to do anything other than quarterback. Right. And so it was just a very instant, instant change. And that led me to why I quit high school. That led me to quit, quit high school, not just football. Yeah. I'm out of here. High school and football, the simultaneous, excuse me. I mean, how'd you do that? I was thinking about my parents. I'm like, oh, you alive. Well, the thing is my brother, my brother Laney was started, like, moving downtown. The legend. Do Laney's doing records and doing records at night and writing commercials during the day and all that kind of stuff. So him and Cooke had started, like, breaking out doing their thing. And so ultimately, I mean, I have to say, you know, as far as like quitting school in Chicago, that's not, it's not a good thing to say, but it's not that uncommon because there's some very terrible things about going to school in Chicago that when I went to school, like, for instance, that your first period, you have to, you had to go to swimming class, right? You're not going to imagine your first, you know, you're not going to graduate unless you, unless you, unless you go to swim. Now, if you can imagine at 605 or the morning when school will start for an athlete, then my first period will be me jumping in this pool after the 30 below or 20 below or 10 below, you know, like, let's do this first. Hair all dried out for a resident day. Look at crazy. So, like, I was like, as soon as it didn't make sense, as soon as the sacrifice, the juice wasn't going to be worth the squeeze, I was going to get out of there. And so, once football wasn't the carrot anymore, their music quickly because I grew up in church, my mom's a choir director, we, like, I play drums in church, my whole family does music. Like, and so I was just a round music in every possible way that you could think from the Ohio player's producer, my mother and her and her sister's albums, like, at my house to just being at in sessions, just, you know, that's the way I grew up. And then between choir rehearsal and secular music, just kind of being integrated in both. And so, when I found out it wasn't going to grow, it was like, it was a race against time for me. Like, because I knew I had an extreme, extreme focus, right? Like as a quarterback, like as an athlete, if you could imagine, like, somebody just having extreme focus and just putting it on something else. Like, it was just, it was just a, it was a church. Yeah, I just transferred the thing. And so by the time I was 16 and 17 years old, Laney had things going on back and forth between Los Angeles and, you know, coming out here working for Louisisles, Jr., working on the early Shantay More albums, working on Aaron Hall's album, you know, the record where I miss you and all that. Like, I saw those records happen. Like, you know, that was the stuff I was coming out here for. And it's like, there are those days and the early days, you know, once I finally got put on, that I got put on and I got my salary 45 hours a week. Come on 45. $90 every two weeks, $180 a month. That's what it adds up. You know, listen, I see you doing your numbers. Now, you keep you in school too early. You know what I'm saying? Because there's a relative point to it's like, I remember Laney was coming out here to do a McDonald's commercial for BBD. This is when poison is out, right? And so, no, no, no, a guy. Yeah, it's so Laney at this time is like 22 and we're eight years apart. So whatever that is, you know, he's 23. And so ultimately, I'm doing everything I can to not miss a session. I'm taking the train everything like I'm just making it happen. And I was someone who want to say during that time, it was tricky and set. So I'm doing these things. And the other part that happened was me and my cousin, we quit school together, tricky and set like my shot, you know what I'm saying? I moved by myself. Yeah. And so I actually had like a partner. Was that accountability something like we quitting together? Yeah, no. You had a partner to quit with. How did you have to work with me? No, it was actually, believe it or not, it was actually my mother and my brothers that took me out of school. I say that I quit, but I actually didn't quit. I got to go to school one day and my mother was like, there's nothing else up there for you. She's like, we took you out of school. Yeah. She's like, we took you out of school. Wow. And so from that point on, I started going to a studio every single day. Every single day. And it was about an hour away, you know, like in the cold doing all that, but it's like, they would pick me up eight o'clock. I was still a kid, so I didn't have the discipline or anything to really understand like getting up and being prepared. So I would literally just get in the back of the car like in a robe and just clothes, like, you know, just completely disheveled just trying to get there, but not really taking the, I knew to get there, but I wasn't like professional in any sort of way. So I just started getting my ass to the studio and I realized that I loved it. It was something that I could do like because I had just been around it so much and I love music. Like, I've just always loved music so much. And it's, if it wasn't going to be football, it was going to be this. And so now I've just dedicated my life to both equally. Even though I don't play football, you would be surprised. People are surprised at how much that plays a part in mind in my brother's lives. Yeah. Red zone. Yeah. I did not forget. You know what makes it so glad you said that. So now you're going back and forth to LA with Laney. Wait, I'm tagging along. I'm not going back and forth. I'm not necessarily being given the invite. Okay. I'm just not being told no. Right. Right. It's not, it's not like I'm being invited. The crazy thing is with your back. And the reason why the reason why Mama said the reason why I referenced that that amount of money is because I remember I had to go to my aunt Kitty Jason Weaver's mom. And I was like Jason Weaver, my cousin. Okay. Okay. Who also negotiated to make sure her son. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I love it. I love what these mothers are doing. Yeah. My mother's listen. Our mother's Kitty, Mary Ann and Vivian. Like, Cooke's mom Vivian, Rester So, Kitty and my mom, Kitty and the Haywoods. Yeah. Like, given of something he can feel and all that, that's them with a wreath of Franklin. All the Curtis Mayfield records. Like, all that stuff. Like, you know, you're not just flying. You're flying the friendly skies. Like Jason's mom. Yeah. Like, Coke is it. My uncles and my cousins wrote all those likes bots. Like, we were heavy in Jingles before. Okay. Jingles was the main business in Chicago. That's why, like, so, I mean, this story goes on and on and on. Like, it's the agency's in Chicago. Yeah. So, the stories go on and on and on. But, you know, the story of the record business starts with Laney and Mark and Judy and that team, like, really starting to get Laney's career. You know, we were all, you know, just trying to catch the wave, like, with Laney because Laney was like, Laney was like a phenom. Like, you remember, like, when Rodney Jerkins came out, it was like that. No, so you got at that time. You know what I'm saying? I come from a kid group. Right. And we were signed in, say records, which little stylists signed our deal. Okay. So, we were waiting to get in with Laney Stewart at one point. You know what I mean? You know what I mean? Like, the whole, all of this for me, I'm like, I'm listening as you talk and I'm like, yeah. Yeah. Laney Stewart. Yeah. It's a lot to the story. And I've just been, you know, I've been blessed to just keep, keep moving. You know what I mean? It's a lot of crossroads in doing it for as long as as much as it's changed. But, you know, the love of it and the ability to focus, I think really just has made it where, you know, I was telling somebody I worked with the other day. I can't remember who exactly, but I was just like, man, I feel like I have never made a record before. It's like, I have that type of energy. Like, and I don't know, I don't know where it came from. I didn't have it like that like eight years ago. Okay. But it's like, I'm like, I feel like I haven't done this yet. Like, you know what I mean? It's like, I'm like, damn, I'm capable of fucking run after you hit the Hall of Fame. After you hit the Hall of Fame, I'm capable of a run. I'm capable of a run. I'm capable of a run. I feel very good saying that just because I know what I'm doing, I know what I'm working on. Like, you know, it's been, it's been, I mean, we've been doing, we've been doing stuff, you know what I mean? And it's like, you know, whether it's the stuff that I did on money longs last record, I think really, I'll do it. Take me, yeah, yeah, yeah, cause we got to get to the first sort of, yeah, yeah, yeah, take me from. Okay. You, you, you own Laney's Coletail. Yeah. You know, you, you find the knit, you figuring it out. You know what I'm saying? Working on your professionalism, your studio etiquette, all the cool 180 am I 180 am mom. Yeah. 180. When, when does it become you? Where it's like, oh, it's time for me to either take the lead in whatever this is or kind of step out on my own and do something. Oh, well, let's see. I think, I think there was some, there was some circumstances that led to that, like in the sense when we got out here to LA, when we moved out here, like we had some deals fall through. And when I say we, I mean, particularly Laney has some deals fall through and there was some, there was some drama with a company that kind of had promised, you know, something when we got here, they kind of snatched the rug by the time we got here and it was based, you know, there's no cell phones or anything. And so we're moving across the country and we're like, I'm 17 at this point. We got three U-hauls and about 10 cars of people coming and we get out here, the rug kind of gets pulled from under us. And so what ended up happening is it kind of got into a situation where it was like, it went from, we were all working to, we had to kind of figure it out. And so what ended up happening is when we left Chicago, ultimately it was a situation where we were all working for Laney still. But when we got out here, things kind of, they changed. And so when they got here, that's when the birth of tricky and set happened and that's when Judy and Mark really joined the team because we were all just kind of figuring it out. But Laney wasn't in a position with the thing that just, that kind of, kind of happened. He wasn't in a position to really take care of us the way that he was going to take care of us, you know, as, as if we had a studio, the studio situation that we had went away. He said, we have to figure out a studio and that's how we ended up at back room. And that's where the, you know, some of that stuff starts with my relationship with Brian McNeighan and Robin Thick and all that kind of stuff. But it really started from the idea that when we got out here, it kind of had to grow up quickly. And, you know, it was, it was rough when I first got out here. It was, you know, I went from, like, it wasn't that I was living good, but I was living protected. And I just remember at one point, you know, I used to live up here at 75, 70, 35 Woodley with two prostitutes, you know, when I first got out here, you know what I mean? You know what? And it's like, I just, yeah, yeah, you know, that's, you know, that's the, you know, what changed man? You're looking out, I just lived there. That's what I'm saying. You know, we had to figure it out. That's what tanks said, too. I just lived there. It was rough. It was rough. It was rough. It was rough. I mean, you know, you didn't have a type of threes company right there. What Sean was there, too, you know, that is a movie. Yeah. No, it was, it was a lot. And so, you know, what ended up happening is, you know, we were going through some rough patches. We had just signed our first deals. We assigned with famous music. My sign my first deal for, I think I got 15. Come on. 15K. Oh, it was either 10 or 15. I had, before I left, I cashed a whole check. Came out here. You're trying to get a apartment. You're 17 years old. Each application is $75. You don't have any, like, and so I'm like, I'm up against the wall. Like, as soon as I touch down, their money is dwindling. Yeah. And so, and then my dumbass is like, thinks I'm a leader. So it's like the people that he could take care of or that we couldn't collectively be together is like, I'm doing, I'm still like, I'm trying to be like him. You know what I mean? I'm still like, that's how I grew up. Like, Laney took care of shit. You know what I mean? Like, he was, he's the gatherer and the finder of the people and he would put it together and he would take care of everything. So I'm like, big brother, like, well, he can't do it all. Let me do some. And so it's like, it's one of those things where the lifting is kind of going on and you figure it out. But there was some very crazy times during that period. And, you know, we had just signed this deal and Mark called Laney and Laney called famous music at the time and was like, yo, I know with the guys just signed, but can they get an advance? Maybe some more. Because now we got to buy equipment because now we don't have a studio so we don't have equipment. So we have to buy equipment. So and back then, you need equipment. You know, equipment, it ain't a laptop. It was expensive. It's $3,500 per keyboard, like per drum machine. So as soon as we get here, not only did I just sign a deal, but now I got to sign an extension for more years before I started making records just to guarantee you just not going to give you that money. Within, you know what I'm saying? So the irony of the story of what Sony being my tenant, right? Right. Right. Now, in there, I left one letter in there that's from famous music and it says, I'm sorry that our offer will not be enough. But that's Sony is the company that had me and my deal that was like, you know, everybody's talking about hip boy, like I had a hip boy deal, you know, at one time, but I just never talked about it. But I was just, I was a famous music to the point where nobody was there that was ever there. Yeah. Besides, there was not one person there. And the one thing that they could decide on no matter how many different change of errors was, is we not letting that nigga go. But that became you ain't not going anywhere. Not in that deal. And it wasn't until they signed Eminem and Brian P. K. Moe there and Brian Postel, okay, we're there. And he was like, yeah, this isn't good. He gave me my first real money. Nope. I think. And so, but that's why I say it's always important to have inclusion to have somebody that comes in, you know, to see somebody, it only takes one person into to just change one little thing, but they were going to be content with over and over. Absolutely. Just letting me stay in a deal where I couldn't like, you know, take care of myself, you know what I mean? And so, but what all that we hear, you know what I mean? But it's, you know, those days are, you know, I, it's funny that you'll bring that up because I don't even think about those days because it's like, you know, it's, there is side effects from it. Like I could play the hell out of ping pong, but it's because I'm a great, I'm a great ping pong player because when I was living with the positives, all we have with the ping pong table and I became really good at the work in a ping pong table. What? So, yeah, it's no longer back your forfeits with the teller. Yeah. No, back and forth. Yeah, it's, it's side effects to it, you know. Oh, man, it is. So it is. You want to talk about the story. That's the story. So, okay, so you in LA, you getting your deals, you got your studio, you getting set up. How long does it take for you to get your first record though? What do you make my first record? What do you make your first record? Play for real shit. Something that's like, okay, well, it's, it's making a turn for me. Well, I think the first turn, because when we came out here, we were being first off, we had a studio in LA. I mean, in Chicago. So Aaron Hong, Keith Washington, Shantae Moore, all those artists, they were flying there. Okay. You know what I'm saying? Okay. So we weren't coming out here cold. You know what I'm saying? And if you remember, this is the kissing you album. So this thing, so this is like serious production. Right. Like, so we're, okay. Like Laney's being looked at on from the top, top tier level because that's Quincy Jones artists. You know what I'm saying? That's Quincy Jones. That's Jay Brown. That's those guys. That's Madena. That's Quest Records, right? For sure. And so that stuff's having it. We come out here. And so I got a little bit of stuff going on because I'm working through Laney, but I started working the very first project that we did was a song that I had that I did with my cousin, Jason Weaver, called Be My Girl. Be My Girl was cut by the very first person that ever put us on a plane to do a record for me personally was a gentleman by the name of Darryl Sutton and Chris Stokes to work with immature, the original immature. Like, you know what I mean? Like very first, like I met Marcus Houston with that man. Yeah, yeah. With eight years late, eight, nine years old, I'm producing Marcus Houston's first album. And so that's how I know him and Ray Jay and Brandy and all of them. I've known them all since they were like, you know, very young. And so that was the very first time. But I would say the most significant thing that happened was we had done remixes and things like that because Lula started throwing us work. So we had started remixing LA and babyface records. We had remixed the don't be afraid record off of the juice soundtrack and all that for Aaron Hall. But then Lula was like, I'm like, Lula gave us a budget. And these were back then it was all lens. We got a $23,000 budget, which because it didn't really go by producer fees. It went by what the costs were and what the producer managed. Yeah. What deal he cut, which was left was your feet. Yes, I'm on. And so depending on how much a guitar player was, how much a studio cost. So you would come into as the producer, you would come in and go, well, listen, like what deal can I cut on the studio? You cut and deals everywhere to walk in to open them. You go home. Yeah. But back then the average producer fee was $3,000, pretty much across the board that you were bringing down. And then you had people that was get like closer to $7,500. You know, and so, but the producer would get all the money and then make the deals with each background singer, each person. So $23,000 gave us the most flexibility. We knew we were going to be able to make probably at least half of that at the time of what was happening. So that was probably like, we were going to pull down about 12 or 13,000 on a record that we did on Shantay called searching. And it was her very first, there's a very first song on that album, Love Supreme. Like that is a very iconic album. She had that love taken over out record on there. And so these are people in relationships and memories that like really just like change the game in that sense of like, you know, Lul looking at us like that and being who he is in music, you know, that's Belle Bive de Vaux. That's that's Ellie and Babyface. That's Jimmy J. M. Taylor Lewis. That's any heartbreak. That's that's Bobby Brown. So for him to be looking at us at 16 to 17 years old and putting us on his very first artist was just like an anointing that we could never, you know, could have never expected because there's levels to who you work for. And I think, you know, part of my attraction for whatever reason, I think I just knew how to get with people and stick with them. I was just never one of those people that wanted to be all things to everybody. And Lul was just one of those people that put me in position and he put me in position to meet LA. Yeah. And those are like, if you look at my career, that's who I work for. You stay blocked. Like, that's who I work for. And then there's all the little ancillary things but somehow they're certain that you guys are talking about, you know, it's all, it's all happened for me in the in the 90s. And, you know, like, I haven't, I haven't ventured out too much. So did you, you get your own place or did you stay with, you crazy with them? Cause I know what I would do. What you was going to do, you was going to expand it. In Berlin, yeah. Ah, yeah. I mean, yeah, no, no. Dead leads to the next part because we got away from them. And then the next day I knew we were living in over here in Burbank where I had a one bedroom with 13 roommates. What? What? With now you're living in a hostel. But now I think I'm building. I'm always building. Okay. So even though I don't have nothing, I've got, I've always had a coordinator. We always had a coordinator. I've always had a coordinator. I've always had a, I've always had engineers. I've always had producers. That's the one bedroom you had an assistant. Right. I always, we were always tries because of how our family does. Yes. That's what we knew. We knew that you need 18. Okay. We've never seen someone be successful and not build a team. So just because you don't have one doesn't mean you don't need one. So you have to find people that you said that before time for the people that's listening. Yeah. Just because you don't have one doesn't mean you don't need one. And so you take the team at the level that you can play. It's not, it's, but I mean, until every level. Yes. There's teams on every level. Yeah. And so I knew that. And so we, you know, we were buying equipment. We were buying microphones. It wasn't like, we were busy. Like we get 10 for remix 75 for this. Like we have money, but the keyboards are 2800 3500 4600. Like and we're buying everything. Every microphone every so like we're not buying anything. What you need. But what you need, yes, and you walk into the studio. We have racks and racks six feet tall of stuff. We don't have anything like it even like going back to red zone, like red zone. I had, I didn't have a place to live, but I had red zone. I got the, we had the building before we had, before I really had like, I didn't really start sleeping in beds and stuff until I was like 28, 29 years old. Like the studio. The couch when the studio like it's like, all right, let's, let's get it. Like it was just an obsession of music. You know what I mean? It was just, I don't know. That's why you're in a Hall of Fame brother. Exactly. This is why I know. And I love that, that you're so open and honest with us to tell us that story, right? Because I think sometimes people skip over that process of what it, or what it took for you, right? I'm not saying what it takes for everyone, but what it took for you and with someone, especially the younger generation, having an understanding of like, listen, the sacrifices that this man made to get to this point, you saying, I didn't sleep in a bed during my, during my journey till 28, right? And it's funny because I tell a story of when I first came to LA and I slept on the floor for nine months, right? And, and I thought nine months was a long time. You said, well, nine years. You know what I said, well, you were a couch. I sleep on the floor. Yeah, I was on the floor, though. Yeah, I didn't have that. I had enough for it, but I just didn't have one, I couldn't buy two. So there won't go be one there and one there. You know, it was going to be at the studio so I could sleep on it. But you were also hyper focused on, on the main thing. Yeah. You were like, everything's going to go into this. Yeah, for sure. Me early, like, I guess it brought me being an artist too, you know what I mean? I was a writer and a producer, of course, but I was able to reap different benefits verbally because I was an artist that kind of could take me off path. Yeah, I was only an artist to get off the floor. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I wasn't even trying to be an artist. I'm like, but wait, they'll give me a record deal and I go get a bed. Yeah. Well, I mean, I started as an artist too because in the sense, it's really funny, but what ended up happening is I don't know how you know if you know how I know tab and say I'm solter and Robin thick, but it goes back to little stylist again. He had a woman that worked for him. Her name was Madeline Randolph. His, his right hand person. And so I was in a group call flight with me and my cousin who were producers to accept and then two, two like guys that went out to high school with we were like friends. So y'all was calling me bad before calling me bad? Well, this is how I ended up producing call me bad. And so what ends up happening is it's the economic boom of the interracial group. And the economic boom of the interracial group. It was, it was, it was, it was that time. Yes. We met with Madeline Randolph and and she was like, yeah, the other group was kind of whacked with the production is crazy, but I have this other group and she, y'all should produce them. And that other group was a group called Common Ground. And it was tab, Robin thick, it sounds solter and another do name Corey, I believe. And we look at, I'm looking at them and I'm like. But obviously Robin thick is saying, Sam solter can sing. I was the lead singer of Rod Group. So that'll let you know how much trouble we were in. And so it wasn't a hard sell for me to give away my production. I didn't, I wasn't born with what you guys have. But with that being said, I'm looking at them because I'm into aesthetics though. And I'm like, this motherfucker six, three, he's five, six, he's black as hell. I'm like, this one comes. What kind of group is this? You know, like, and so we end up going to the studio with them, made some dope records over the weekend at that, I mean, they gave us like a Friday Saturday and Sunday. And we just hit it off really, really well. Ended up becoming best friends. You know, tab is still to this day. I mean, we're still super locked in. Always like real, real brothers. Robin thick is their, their friend, like, you know, every, every time he touches down in Atlanta, he's going to come through. We're going to see each other. Yeah. You know, I mean, you always see me when you're all on tour together, you know, I'm always there. But and obviously Sam rest in peace. You know, he's not here with us. And Sam is such a huge part of Red Zone. And in the, in the story of the tentacles of where everybody comes from and what the thing was when we got to Atlanta was with Sam. The Sam is what opened the door to LA as an artist. Yeah. And so Sam was the vehicle of the guy that wanted to build an LA that had to rebuild in Atlanta, bringing the kid from Compton, you know, to Atlanta. And Sam was a very just beautiful person, beautiful spirit, super talented, sing anybody. You don't know, just expect to nobody. But not a lot of people had it like Sam. And that's just the truth of the matter. And he was such a, he was a gracious vessel of people's first. Like you know what I mean? It's like my first executive productions, like Katie's first mixes, you know, first time doing strings. You know, like we all like JQ comes from there, like Zeke. This is how I'll know them because these are the people that Sam brought as his attraction as an artist brought us so many people into into what we call red zones. Sam was the Sam was the first person to cut the first underdog record. Which one was it? You know that? I like them girls. Wow. That was the first reason that actually cut it because it was my song. I wrote the record and he killed that record. Cut it on, cut it on Sam first. That's what that's crazy. It started with Sam. Yeah. Which is, and that's how I end up meeting him. I'm 18 years old at the time and I'm like, oh yeah, I know him from the, you know what I'm saying? From the records he had before. And I'm thinking, okay, well, this is going to be like my first, because they were, with that record, we knew it was going to be somebody single. You know what I mean? Like from the, from the rip when we wrote the record, but like this is going to be a single. So I'm like, okay, because I had had like two placements, but they weren't singles. But I'm like, this is going to be a single. And it was, it was Sam. So it was the first person to cut that record. Yes, sir. But that's just indicative of that spirit, that time, but you know, we, it all spawned from that same circle. You see what I'm saying? Like it's all that same circle. And how I even got to Atlanta was, I was working with this group, Black girl, that was down there in Atlanta, but they used to, they used to sing backgrounds. The girl, Tavi, Terman used to sing backgrounds. Tavi. And demos for Elaine Babyface. And they were working on stuff and I was working on, they were coming out here working with, with us because Alison from, with RCA, I don't want to mess up her last name because I can't remember it, but she's remade. So I want to put it out there wrong. But it's the, Alison, I just did the, something we could feel record with Laney. Laney just did that record with Eric Benet and Tamar. And so we, that same, that's the same relationship. Some story short, that's how I met LA. That's what really connected. It was the background singer. It was the her singing backgrounds and me producing her and her coming back on. This is these productions in LA that you got to meet LA. And so LA was like, all right, cool. That comes out here meets, we meet, we meet at four seasons on Don Haney. Of course. Of course. You got to, of course, that's where you meet LA. Was it brunch? Yeah. You got to understand. This is a regular day, family. I mean, LA will be out there. Yeah, I got to get the first seat. And I'm not brunch material. So, so let me be clear. This meeting, this meeting happens in a car. Oh, shit. This meeting happens in a car and I, we don't have the ability to record because recording is so expensive. Everything is 3,000 a day. Get the piece of tape, it's 500 or 400 a day. So we're singing every last record we got on the spot. Oh, shit. Hold on, hey, go on. Wait, wait, what? We got all we got is the beats. This is how you're playing your demo. No, we're, you're the demo. We're walking around in LA. We're singing our songs on the spot, being shot. Like, this is how, and so that led us, he was like, oh, y'all are crazy. Yeah. And we ended up doing this song called, little something on a group call, Few Good Men. Few Good Men. Yeah. And I just fall in love with Atlanta, the studio Bobby Brown studio is called Boss Town now, which is now stank on you. Yeah. And we go down there, cut this record that sounds like an absolute missile at the time. Like, you know, we're starting to, we're starting to make better records at this point. But LA, he just believed in us. Like, you know, he believed from the very beginning and to this day when people look at when they look at Sony, when they look at sessions, the stuff that I show online, the building, LA got us that building to move to Atlanta in order to sign us. So the building came with it. It didn't, it didn't come with it because we wanted to, we didn't want to be signed. And Mark, Mark didn't want us to sign. So Mark at the time was just like, and Mark was very young. So he's just going toe to toe. And this is, you know, this is like LA has had 100 hits. It's LA and baby face, right? Of course. But somehow he gets the audacity. He's just like, look, they don't want to be signed. But they do want to come to Atlanta. He's like, but if you give us the money, because LA it offers a bunch of like cars and a a match it is shit. And Mark was like, nah, give us the money. We're going to build a studio and we're going to pay you back, but we're never going to be exclusive. We're never going to be exclusive. And what ended up happening was, oh big bro. Mark, man, he's right out there. Like, and, and that single, that single negotiation from my management at that time changed everything. Not only, I mean, I, the, the biggest thing that I think had changed is that it allowed me to build a relationship with LA that was always built in business, real business. Like, you know what I'm saying? Not, oh, he took the cars and he took the house. No, it's like, nah, they wanted, they wanted that for the beginning. So from that point, when we started, when he started giving it to us, we never had to look back and we never had to feel like we weren't in the ownership position ever again. You know what I mean? Because someone had already given us ownership. Right. Whether it was buildings, publishing, you know, so we, after, after we got free from the original publishing, I've never, like, I haven't had to sign a publishing deal, you know, since that time, you know, from the standpoint of really understanding, really understanding like, hey, I'm, we're doing something that's unique, that special. And ultimately, I think it's that singular move that let me know because before that, we were kind of, I would say, we were figuring it out, but it was that move right there in particular, I think, let me know that I knew and I know that I have the best manager in the world. And it wasn't that he was my brother. And I was like, this shit is crazy. And that move, when you have equity, you build something, you buy something. Right. Like, the building is worth a lot of money. It's, we didn't pay with what it's worth, but it's like, it's a, you know, that kind of thing can submit your life. You know, having an asset, you know, 15, 20,000 square foot asset can submit your life at 19 years old. Like, I've had that building, I've been in that building for 30 years, over 30 years, every record I've ever made. Like, you're not building now. Yes. Still is building, but now, but Sony is ringing it. Yeah. Still, when he's running 5,000, 6,000 square feet of it. Yeah, we've got 10 more thousand. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then the other part is sessions, sessions of Lyna. And so that's what we do all our, you know, all our music events and listening sessions and crazy. We've never been invited there. Tank of you been there. I haven't been there. This is crazy. But I'm going to change all that though today on today. Yeah. Yeah. There's no way that Josh had come to Lyna and record any place else other than that. Yeah. Yeah. Next week. People like Jake, what are you doing here with Tricky just saying? Jake doesn't say. Oh, bye. Yeah, come on. He's having a pick up a key, man. Yeah. David. He said I got an extra thousand square foot. And I can hang out here. He counts. He counts. He counts. I ain't getting no hotel needed. He's got crazy. I'm not above. I'm not above Steve with other counts. I'm your couch. That's a lot harder to get in now than he's even going to be able to do that. But I put your name on the list. You get it. No, I gotta say they don't, um, they don't play down there because honestly, we really just, we specialize in privacy. Yeah. We specialize in privacy. Our clients do not want to be known. Yeah. And we don't show you anything. I show you what I do. So I won't be there. Yeah. No, you'll be there. No, I know. I'll be there. We won't be showing anything. I'm telling the people that I'm not there, but I'm there. I'm so I won't be there. Go ahead. Yeah. It's ain't won't be there either. We keep it quiet. We won't be there. You're crazy. He got the hood. He's on the hood. He never going to leave that person apart. Yeah. We just, it was great. It was just a great setup. Like that right there. Mm-hmm. It's not as big. Anyway, it's the way that it's the way that it's great as you think. No. How do you get to? How do you get to who that? How do you get to that record? Because I've heard so many of your records. Yes. And you want to know the truth? Yes. I was frustrated. I was frustrated because I'm in Atlanta. Time preference. All these stories. Great. But what's going on around me is what about your friends? friends. It's it's germane. It's it's waterfall. It's it's the biggest records. Up against once you get to yeah, yeah, yeah, I've seen in hearing things. The first night I get there, I hear ain't no thing but a chicken way where I'll cast they in the studio in LA's basement. That's that's my introduction to Atlanta. And then you walk over here and Dallas is working on what about your friends. And I don't know just as a point of reference. I don't know when the last time you've listened to that song. But do yourself a favor and listen to that song and remember that was the bio-introduction to Atlanta. Okay. And so and then then there's germane but I knew germane because now Chris crosses out before germane left. Maybe before I came there, germane and I had actually produced. We did a song with Chris crossing immature together on the baby's kids sound track out here. So I knew germane so when I got to Atlanta for the first time on my recruiting trip because it used to be like college down there. Germane was the person that picked me up and like picked me up and took me to his to his studio which was at his mom's house. And I'm just like man, look at all these cars and motorcycles and stuff he got. And I'm just like like you know, I mean like I said and I'm coming from out here in a germane and then I go to LA's house in country club of the south at the time. And it's like oh yeah. Oh yeah. I'm moving. Yeah. Right. Like there's no there's no question. And so the frustration because I hadn't found a music identity because I'm from the Midwest and I think it's an advantage but it's also a disadvantage right. There's no defining sound. Right. And so I didn't have a defining sound. I knew how to make records but I didn't have a defining sound. And who that was made because I was like man, this rap shit is easy. I could do rap in my sleep. And so one night I just came back to the studio and I was like I'm gonna make some rap songs. That was the first one I made. It was a joke to start. It was me and my boy Deandre Davis and Tav. We came back from the strip club. We was probably I think we were probably drinking or whatever brought a whole bunch of people back to the studio. I let everybody that was at the studio rap on the song. We came up with the hook. Me, Dre, let's us on the hook. I let everybody that was at the studio get a verse. The song had 15 verses on it. Jason Weaver was out the song. Whoever was at the club. And I was like okay this is this I don't know how it went from a joke to like and you start to resent it like you know you resent it because I'm not getting the tension that I want for myself. So I'll tell you know I'm doing we doing strings we doing orrogans we we doing everything but this song is making the people go crazy but it's not JT Money and Soleil ain't on it yet. It's just people but I got the hook you know what I mean I just got the hook. And so you know my mind is kind of you know I don't I don't remember like super details but I know that tab brought me Soleil. Okay. And Tony Mercedes had JT Money and I can't remember who's ideal it was to get them involved or how I got involved. They got on the song, cut all the rest of them mess away and then Tony Mercedes and Dallas heard the song. They got involved with the song. Yeah. Well they got involved with the song after the fact that I went everywhere making the rounds trying to get the song trying to get somebody put the song out. They were like. Do you were shopping the record? They was like this but with them they were like this shit's right. Like you know what I mean. Yeah they didn't like it and so nobody really liked it and so it ended up in the independent space and it was just one of those things I remember the record came out in December and I didn't really know how records worked but I hadn't you know nothing was happening as far as I was concerned like I wasn't here in the club when I was going and next they got new that summer that thing just took a turn and I had never felt anything like that from the standpoint of just like an impact record and I realized I started to realize like that was I guess when I realized it's just not about what I want it's about it's about what the people want and from that standpoint I was that was the turning point I think and we really understand and how to make records differently going from making music and writing songs and going through emotions but really looking for impact and so that really that's really changed my life because I that's when I realized that you know people always think you gotta have the money you gotta have the money they didn't have the money the Jenny Jackson record and Buster Rhymes want to be record out with delight at the time as the producer like making all those crazy records they had the two million dollar video they had all that we man we was that was a number one record on all formats that's longer the year number one R&B number two pop like you know what I mean like it then I was like oh and that kind of became my seat my my motivating factors like if I have a hit record is can it be number one on all the charts at the same time and so every record that we've ever had at Red Zone I think what we do that's different than everybody is that even if it's break my soul break my soul one number one rap too like it was the number one hip hop record the one dance record no one pop record no one R&B record like if we whatever it was whether yeah umbrella any record like oh we oh break out the champagne like if it's break my soul if it's umbrella if it's baby baby baby wasn't a hit though what baby wasn't a hit oh baby became a hit okay about to say okay became a hit baby was a baby was a radio fail it just so it's so 17 million or 16 million however many you know what but it never charted because there's no kid did you hear what did you say it or whatever 16 cents or whatever it I don't know where it stopped it hasn't but I mean it because it's generational like every kid finds it somehow it's so you know it's a hit now it feels like a hit now but it was very much not in the moment was not like some break out you mean in terms of chart position it wasn't a hit it didn't I don't I don't even know yeah it didn't do nothing on a radio you never heard baby on a radio I just heard it so much I don't know where I heard it you heard it's one of those records where you don't know where you heard it but they don't play they have a rule they don't play kids on a radio impact record though about hit from impact yeah yeah of course but he wasn't coming from Disney to see all those other people bringing all of them they come from Disney he just came out of nowhere I know where nowhere so they like adult radio wasn't you know they were like when I'm playing this and so it was it was never on radio it just kept growing it was I've been first record to a billion on YouTube first one a two billion on YouTube like it was breaking records that's how I knew that YouTube wasn't where I want my records to be because there was no check that ever came with it hmm that was early yeah I figured that out because I was like this is the YouTube like this the YouTube where's the money no like I'll take I'll take number seven you know I'm ready on the chart over over a billion streams over over how many billion wow oh blue can trail yeah oh my god yeah yeah many a show with blue yes that was the same as different yes what made you go there once again that's tap you know most people don't know like the relationship that I have with tab is he finds stuff like it's the same person that brought me Frank Ocean like you know blue was just a voice she was a voice that that that was incredible because she had jazz gospel yeah she had skats yeah she had power she had falsetto yeah she had loaves she had highs and she just knew how to work at all and she that whole situation happened she was her sister I believe we got in a in a car accident and she came to Atlanta because she was up from New Jersey in New York or something in tab and I think my another guy that I work with named Javon Sims brought her in like my mind like on certain things I just can't recall it that much but I ended up with her she came to the studio and I just fell in love with her voice and we did this record call till I'm gone off for her first record and we just spent we spent the next seven days we spent the next seven days basically just making records and by the time we got done we had everything that's on the first album except for hit him up style I had just done who that for Dallas he had just broke that record for me I was like I just signed an artist he I took her over there he wrote hit him up style you know um that track is just yeah super super crazy like and I mean Dallas that's you know Dallas is a fool that's a complete fool easy you know Dallas is the scariest one the scariest producers I ever been around I you know it's it's crazy that we are friends now but I legit used to be like you know scared of him like producers used to be scary you know what I mean like you know you go see you go watch Rodney Jerkis work back in the day you're questioning your life here you do we have the same job yeah do we have the same job are we are we fine for the same thing they'll change your life what it's so I don't that's why I don't like to watch people work up close like that because it could fuck you up watching you know like I'm I'm I'm committed to getting it right I don't get it right at first all the time but I just want to win more than most people though yeah you know I'm saying but when you see somebody you go from soup to nuts and like you know what the fuck just happen here right and like and I I've witnessed that stuff and I'm just like you know I don't want to play that game you know like you know that's I think it's still it's still part of the reason why I don't I think I'm not like the best collaborator because I've just seen shit that I'm like I don't ever want to see that again because it's like it's intimidating but with that being said the blue stuff was just magic yeah you know it when it happened those types of things when it happens it happens quickly that's right yeah um and once again at that time L.A. was leaving LaFace you just exit it mm-hmm new chairman that aristorect just taking cloud Davis's job we just give I just we had just done the no scrubs record because Shakespeare was our producer Mark was managing him he had just done the no scrubs record which Dallas was executive producer of all those TLC records so their synergy and friendship is building right and projects but we're just friends like just exchanging yeah songs back and forth to each other and so we go to our friend and L.A. check this out you know what I mean and blue can't travel his first signing at Eris it at Eris like I'm pretty sure it in number one pop yeah number one R and B yeah number one everything across the world once again once again yeah once again yeah once again and so you know that's the that's the you know I and I think that's something is something in the water to that with you know like with um or I should say in our case in the red clay they taught us that the Atlanta taught us that the main taught us that like the main influence on music let me know that all your records could be big you know what I mean like really regardless of what he did like yeah yeah if he did a slow song he would give you let's get married and then he could give you a remix that would take over the world like you never mean like whatever the record was it's like that was the expectation from Atlanta because we don't have no friends we we are outsiders we don't have no checks we have to write fucking smashers to get in we don't go up to we don't have no there's no place to get a check in Atlanta all we got is studios the same Nashville it ain't Miami and it ain't LA right in any New York so all we have is the smash game right that's how we became the reference city to the most things that people are usually trying to chase i believe because we have to have we belong together we have to have creep we have to have girls run the world you know I'm saying love on top that's the price of entry down there and so when you don't have one you just keep going until you get one but I've never seen nobody not get one they'll figure it out a lot of hits you just made it you just well man man you just named some records that's my city and you said you've been there you said 30 years now I moved that 95 you know I moved back and forth I've never moved from Atlanta but I there's I believe there's always a time to be in LA this is the entertainment capital of well and then you could do about that you know but there's there is a time to be here and there's a time to go home and I was out here and and check some things off the boxes you know I wanted to get into movies and did burlesque and some stuff with Christine Aguilera and did the thing like a man and all those like film productions and score it and all that and and then it was time to figure out because I was losing my voice a little bit like what do I sound like you know what do I sound like and I had to go back to Atlanta to figure out what I sound like again gotcha so while you're in Atlanta is that wind tap brings you Frank Ocean or at this point he's not Frank Ocean yet that he's Lonnie yeah he brought me him out here because I was at the boom boom room you know I locked that place out for some time when we were really out here and was doing a bunch of stuff doing Mariah and some other stuff in Mark and Tab brought him through because they wanted me to write with him and I was working with Dream at the time and Dream what it seems very natural now but at the time it was very hard to it was capturing his essence of his songs with what making the artists feel like is their song but capturing the essence is a challenging job because his voice sits in the middle of people's voices and so Frank had the same thing going on and I was like the hell I I don't want to hear I don't want to spend this time doing this because he had such a unique amazing tone and perspective and everything and ultimately I said look bro in real life terms I love what you do these songs you just play me are incredible but I was like I got no interest in writing with you but if you'll be an artist then I'll be interested so he didn't come to you as an artist mm-hmm purely as a songwriter yeah he came as a songwriter and you're like you yeah I'll do it if you're an artist yeah and he was like I'll do it yeah like he was like I'll do it and I mean we was in a doorway like like that over there like yeah this is conversations happening in doorway and he's like I'll do it and then like a couple minutes go by and you know whatever we're talking and and he's like the only thing is he's like and you gotta understand I've heard some matches from this dude like records that you would be like like Bruno Mars level right because he's writing for other people he's writing to win like he's writing for the industry he said okay I'll be artist but the only thing is I hate every song I've ever written and meaning those weren't gonna be his songs and from that point okay the birth of Frank Ocean I think in his mind happened and that sound that he created that's his sound that's his sound right and he created that like you know you know that doesn't have a whole lot to do with me other than creating and fostering the right stewardship if you will yeah I produced Nova Kane this one of my favorite records you know the breakout single you know you need you still need the sauce of what you don't know but ever since then and everything since then it's pretty bit after nostalgia ultra the original mixtape like why we weren't crazy with that thing just getting it to everybody we like we were passing out every CD if I was on a flight with you you weren't gonna get it yeah we were having listening party after I forgot who gave me the CD but I still have it somewhere it was a girl trust me oh that was the plan it was a girl if you got a Frank Ocean CD it came from a girl and she was back you know yeah let's get over that part yeah if it's yeah you know but it's just my life how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about us how about a magic, a real magic. I think we value two different things within the songwriting and production process. And I think the rub of our influences and the rub of our value, what we value at our core creates next level shit. You don't like, Dream is very much into lyrics, storytelling, he listens to country music, he listens to old music all the time, like oldest reading and Motown and got a lot of crazy influences and I am a Quincy Jones, David Foster, Teddy Riley, L.A. and Babyface, like. So that marriage? The marriage of his ability to write songs, like really write and craft from a lyrical connection, mixed with somebody who's obsessed about finishing and about Sonics and about how things get recorded. Like microphones, mic placement, all these things. Like all the stuff you were investing in. All the stuff, that's why I have so many studios and stuff, it's like that stuff matters. I believe that's why we've been successful. You can't polish a turn obviously, but if we get what we want, if we get what we want, I wanna get it all. You know what that meaning? If we got the special song, I don't want it recorded on the wrong microphone because I'm just like, we probably not gonna win the Grammy because I know what they really based on, like when you sit in those rooms and you play it and you're like, yeah, that sounds good, relative to the sound that you've made. But now you're sitting in front of people like me. It's a recording academy. And you don't change the volume when you listen into it and your volume just went way down. So you think you don't know the difference between this mix engineer and that mix engineer. But when you sit in front of a room of people who really know, right? Like they're like, oh that's, you are spitting, oh yeah, you're listening, right now. Look, super. Take notes, please. Take notes. Take a note. And instead of saying they just hate, no me, man. Cause they love that one. They don't know what they, you know, a lot of people want to Grammy, they just don't know. It's the recording. They don't know what their big academy. What is your recording sound like? Yeah, it's not a, it's not a, it's not a popularity game. If it was a popularity game, Britney Spears would have them, right? You know, I've done, you know, a lot of people that don't have, yeah, yeah, no for sure. It's a recording, you know, but when you look at who has them, they value it. But it's always a lot of the same people, like if you look at somebody like Salam Rimmy, you go back and go, well, the guy that did Lauren Hill is the same guy that did Amy Winehouse. Like, you know, the same guy Rick Rubin, the same guy that did the Dixie Chicks is the same guy that's doing Dixie. They're valuable. Now, there's people that's benefiting from things that that's why you have to have a team. You gotta have, like, you may not know. Like, Tidalassine just came over and played me some records the other day. I was like, who recorded this? Because whoever did, they get it. I'm like, this is meant to, this is meant to be respected, you know, in a different way. And so you can hear it when people know what they're doing. And, you know, in a world where everyone can do it, yes, you do have a really good relative sound to what it is that your ear is listening to. But when I have to compare you to the best of the best for recording, that's kind of what that, that's where the rubber meets the road a little bit. What's your first, are you guys first hit together? Me and Vee? It was on brother, right? Is that your first hit together? That's like one of the first ones we have a road together. I'm really. We had never really wrote like, Good Lord. I'm trying to think. Yeah, it was on brother, right? Yeah, everything happened after on brother. Like, I didn't know that I had another record date. No, because what happened was when Dream was developed by Laney, like myself, like we all come from Laney, like that school of like teaching of the craft, right? And so Laney signed Dream to a publishing deal. Okay. And then they had stopped working together for a while. Like they, I mean, they had stopped working. Dream kind of went off on his own. They did an album. He got in, done an album in Japan and he came back. And he's like, man, I want to play you something. And he played me this album that he had done on Nivia. And I was like, man, these songs are really good. Because I never really like was like tapped in because at the time that this time, Red Zone was pretty crazy because we had Rico Love and the corner boys in the back. We had P Magnet in my room. We had Esther Dean and the other one. We had Tile Cruz. Yeah, really? So we all had like everybody there. And Dream was like kind of like the new kid on the block. He wasn't like, he's not the type to hang around. Okay. He's not a, he wants to come in. He wants to do what he's got to do. And he's gone, dip. Like he's not a, he's not like a, you know, a social butterfly. Yeah, he's not a, he just don't hang like that. Yeah, yeah. And so he's always been like whether it's going to a movie or interested in something to fashion. He's just interesting like that. Like, you know, Dream does a lot of things. And live is like beyond music. Yeah, for sure. Like that's, I think that's where a lot of the inspiration comes from. And so, you know, there was a time, and I was just kind of like, I was making these incredible records and incredible writers around. And it was like, hey guys, like, so I started not getting placements, but this is the blessing in disguise. But because I know I'm starting to find my sound. But when you find a sound sometimes, they ain't no customers, right? And so I like started making records that were hit records like who that? Like one of one type things, but like I had mastered the art of bullshit R&B as a producer of getting cuts. What should I read? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know how to place records? Yeah, anybody could place a record if you go do what the people is looking for. But that's the difference between making hits and that. You can't be making something that sound like something to somebody else did. Yeah. And so your thought is going to have to be an original one in order for you to make a name for yourself. Put it in my get dry. Yeah, it'll get dry. And if you in and log enough, it'll get dry several times. But all that just comes with it. But ultimately when we were like trying to find our niche or I was trying to get more songs that I could get money for because I got overhead, I got, but I'm getting incredible stuff and I got this incredible energy going on around. I got to pay the team. But I don't have the, I'm not getting the cuts. Long story short, I kind of asked people to start calling before they come. Everybody got offended pretty much. Like, you know, this is like around Christmas time. Like everybody was like, okay, cool. You want some bullshit? Did it, didn't you? You've been to me in call before you come. Call to the studio. Like you can't just pull up. Cause people you should just be pulling up. They would just pull up. This is before the gates and all that stuff. So they could just pull up. And ultimately we're writing songs, but I got artists in, but I'm not getting what I need. And so dream was the only person that wasn't offended. And he came and it was our very first time that we had ever been alone simultaneously. While this is going on, because I had done the Britney Spears in the zone album where I was expected to have a lot of success because I was pretty much the executive producer of it. And then we got a song from Blood, Shion, Avant that I fought for to get on the album, but that song was toxic. Okay. Toxic Dwarfs, my whole Britney Spears life, right? And so it's like that, like that was all a whole thing. So I had the first single with Britney and Madonna. They kissed on American music world. I'm supposed to have all this hype, but this song comes out and steals the show. Long story short, now dream is the person that comes to the studio. It's really one of the first times that we really got a chance to just be wearing the building alone in simultaneously because I'm not able to pay the engineers that are my top engineers, just that this time, day rates is probably, you know, 12, 15, $1,600 a day for an engineer. And I'm doing three sessions a day, right? In three different rooms all the time. And so that's how Cooke re-enters the picture. And so while Cooke is coming back, because Cooke and I hadn't worked together since I had left California, like Cooke, these guys are killing me, man. I need my family. I need somebody to come down here and record and help me put this together. And he came down and we spent time and we just kind of got back in our groove. And during this time, it's the Christmas time. It's very slow. Nobody's in the building. And when me and Cooke are like, hooking up the equipment, he's rewiring the room. Cooke is really like, OCD with this kind of stuff. So he's wiring everything up, making sure it sounds great and all this stuff. And he's like, man, you messin', you messin' with this logic stuff at all, man. Like, you know, I ain't messin' with this, but you know, this stuff is pretty cool. They got some cool loops. So we're putting up the equipment and everything, right? And James, James, like, could I come through? I'm like, yeah, come through. Dream comes through and Cooke, I don't know how this part happens, but we're trying to test them like. We tryna get the mic tested. Mhm. I'm playin' a requested logic. And playing like this, playing the bass on the left. And Cooves got the loop. Mind you, I've never seen Dream record before. I've only heard him record. And at this time, back to these days, we always just sit down and write the lyrics. I knew that he was a ball of energy and always had things that sounded whatever. But most of the time, because like I said, his personality was like, I did this and he would leave. Me being this smart guy or Laney in certain cases, they're going back, going. Now let's get the writers in here to put the words to the energy, right? So this is one of the first time that I ever hear Dream write lyrics. We're testing the equipment, right? We're recording straight down. Cooquets the loop. I'm playing the keys live. And Dream is writing the song on the spot. That's the umbrella that everybody heard. That was the first thing. He pretty much freestyled that record. No, that's, I thought that. I thought that. Okay. Damn, I love emotional. Yes, sir. Okay. We sound good. So, so it's the three of us in that room. And that's what came out. And then the next day suffocate. And the next day, like it just, yeah, like it just kept happening. And it like, I mean, we wrote, we used to write songs like every day, you know? And I think that one was just like what happened. And so ultimately, after we write that song, because like I said, the part that's going on in the building is that. Now instead of it just being me, I have to, I have other people in the building. I brought in some other people. And so to help me pay rent and people with stuff. So I brought in Jazzy Fay. Jazzy Fay is in now. Yeah. TA is in. Okay. TA has a producer named LOS. LOS, right? Jazzy. This is how Jazzy and me and Jazzy do Jazzy and LOS does bed. And this is now, this is now everybody's coming back. But Dream and I, we've kind of locked in. And I'm like, this dude is incredible. And so at that point, I was like, this has to kind of be about Dream. Like we had all these other writers and different things going on. And it all worked out. It's a beautiful story today. But the truth of the matter is we had to check into Dream in a different way. And that affected Esther Dean, you know, like, and that's how Esther and Polo became so locked in. Because I'm like, I am this right here. I haven't seen this. I haven't seen what I'm doing every day now. And yeah. And so that just became the focal point for real. And so ultimately, you know, we got this song. It was around this time. We were cold as ice. Like I said, the Britney Spears thing is like being really held against me. That's like the pinnacle. Like if you don't get the hit with Britney, it's like it's a it's a gift in a curse to good opportunities that are big because if they don't work, it's like directing Spider-Man. You know what I'm saying? Like it's right. And it's right. And so it's like. So you coming off of that thing. And ultimately, like I'm out now. I'm having people. I'm having Jazzy send the record going. Siddness to Karen Clark. He's talking to Mark. And he's like, but whatever you do, don't tell LA that tricky produced it. I'm like, don't tell them that I did it because LA, you know, that's my friend. Like I could say like LA. I love you the death, but he's hot and cold. He likes hits. And when he don't wears the hit. And if you don't have them, where's the hit? It's like, ultimately, it's like it kind of goes away. You know, not that not the relationship, but the access. And so at that point, it was really about like him just hearing the song for the song. And Jazzy sent it, Mark sent it. They both sent it to Karen Quatt. Karen was kind of going crazy over it. I believe. And then she played it for LA. LA loved it. And as they say, the rest is kind of history. And that led to us being able to, you know, like I said, we were building insolent. So now I got this amazing vocal producer and cool. And you know, the thing got smaller. You built more of a team. Yeah. And so now we're ultimately like, we're kind of given the opportunity to, however it ended up happening. Like people are hearing bed, right? And dreams voices on bed. And if you ever heard dreams of original version of bed, it's just like the biggest smash ever. Like, no, no shade to Jay Holiday, but it was just like a runaway train. Right. And it's like, you just knew what that was. Yeah. It's probably like the records that you had like them girls, but you just like this somebody single, right? You know what I mean? And so now it's like, that's what led to dream becoming an artist. Because like I said, at this time, it's like, there's not that many voices out there. So you like, is this for a kind of who? Right. Like you know, the very distinct voice. And so when we got, when we got to do love, hate, that was kind of like, I still can't get away from that. I drove love hate is one of those albums, man, where it don't matter if it's you in the homies. Are you in it? Your girl. Yeah. This album plays through because you know, we all do music. And I was really like, yeah, this is me, my girl just right to this. And if certain rounds was like, you know, homies, we ride this. Y'all covered ground. Love hate is special. But I just wanted to tell you that. Thank you. I'm going to leave that dream since down with us. I'm going to tell him that too. Love hate, bro. It's a generational album. I think so too. So please proceed. I think I had to tell you that. Yeah, I mean, that album, that album changed our life. I think just making it let us to another level of creativity. Mm hmm. You know, it was, it was basically just the, the four of us him, myself, Lose, engineer named Tech, that was the recording engineer and then Dave, Pensado and Jason. That's all the hands that touch that project. It was just, it was magic in the wood. People don't, you know, I see people always want to segue their albums. I don't think what people understand is that we created the album in the same session. You can't do it after the fact. The session was that long. We wrote the songs in order. It could not be changed. What? Oh, shit. We couldn't, it was one session. So every, we were automating the key changes and everything, like every aspect of that. And you know, that's why I say Tech is a part, is an important part of that because Tech was the most technical, smartest engineer that I thought I could get my hands on. That really, when I, I was like, we got to do something crazy. And I need somebody that's like next level. He spoke your language. I didn't know what, I didn't know what language I needed to speak. But I knew I needed somebody that had spent a lot of time messing with stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Messing with stuff. I knew I wanted to mess with stuff. And that's what, that's what led me today, Pensado and Jason. It's like, I knew, I knew who mixed like what, right? You know, I had been doing records and I knew, I knew how to send a mix to one of the guys and get back a really good version of what I got. But I was looking for somebody and for people to add layers. You did it. Y'all did it. And so, you know, that was, that one was amazing. That's my, I would say that's my crown jewel of everything that I've done as far as, like being the most proud of as a, as a whole album. Yeah. Do you think, or been part of, I should say, do you think, and I know this is going to be a tough question. But do you think you get enough credit as an executive? I don't know. It's not credit as something that I really seek. You know, I just recognize that. But I, but validation. I think is something that can happen without credit. Okay. Sometimes I still feel invalidated. Okay. And I asked that because we, we going down the line. Yeah. And you were a part of a lot of new artists becoming staples and icons and, you know, people that we look to as like, oh, this is amazing. Wait, it just keeps going back to tricky stores. It's finds its way back. Yeah, I think breaking artists is difficult. That's what I like to do. That's what I like to do. And it's been part of the, I just think it's like, you know, I have two parts of the shit. Like I got the business shit mine. And I had the creative mind. Yeah. I've always looked at it like towers sky the skyline. Like being part of. Re honest skyline. There was no beaver before there was us. There was no Frank Ocean. They were like dream. Like whatever it is, like, like I didn't join the careers. I helped make them. Yes. And so it's like that. I spend my time working with the artists that are developing because not that I want the credit. I do want the credit internally. Okay. Like because I, that's the way that I can challenge myself. I believe most can do a good job working on beyond say seventh album. If you get the call. Yeah. But to do with Rich Harrison did. I think it's completely different. And so. Shout out to Rich Harrison. Yeah. And so I think to do that is where I like to live my life as a creative. And if it doesn't, if it doesn't time me all the way through, I haven't worked with Bieber since the very, I did one time. Did baby. Mm-hmm. And. Cook executive produced his Christmas albums and we did all that and I haven't worked with him since. But. I would rather be at that part of the story. Mm-hmm. Then be on the story right right now, even with whatever the latest single is that he's going to the Grammy's for. Like I would rather have that moment and be connected to that mentally for me. Yeah. Yeah. You're going. Yeah. Yeah. Not that I'm the reason that I'm part of the eye of discovery. I'm not going to believe you have to know which one is right for you. You know, there's a lot of artists and I try to pick the ones that are right for me. Yeah. And right for us. Well, you've done an amazing job. My brother. Thank you. Of picking and choosing. Because the, oh, man, so many careers have been launched. It's my favorite part. That's the part that still has me like the most motivated. That's why I feel like if I was going in to work on, you know, the same stuff or just like a continuation, that wouldn't, that wouldn't have me with the mindset and the spirit that I have. But it's like it's the relationships that I've had and, you know, with Tyler and just going to Africa and find it, introducing her to believe and, you know, just helping her find that sound and what her and Sammy Sosin, what water turned into in that whole movement. And really like Zeke put me in that play. And he was like, look, like Zeke was like, I don't even know if I want you to produce. I just need you to figure it out. Oh, just go to Africa. He's like, I got a house. I got all the dopest producers in Africa coming. Just figured out, just sort it like just figure it out. And I went over there and fell in love with her team, Colin from the African agency and everybody. And you know, it's just, we figured it out. And as you can see, it's, it's, it's continued to figure itself out. And now they got it and they run. But I still, I think my part of you did your part, you know, man. And I think also it's about mindset, right? You know, there's so many people that get bitter because they think just because you do something with somebody, you know, one time that you spoke to Colin back, you know, listen, just be, do your part. Do your part. I like development. I can't look at, if I write on Brella, I can't be looking at you going, damn, she got an umbrella deal. No, she's, no, no, she's right. You better go back, yeah. You don't count how she was money. Yeah, like, man, like what part, what part do you like? She didn't bring me one. I want to bring me one of my brothers. Like, I like the part, I like the part that we've played, you know, and yeah. I play it better by design as I get older, you know, like I do realize that there's an opportunity. And I am going into the publishing game this year, you know, I had left publishing alone for a while just because. You know, at the end of the day, it's, you're, you're taking on people's lives. And, and I know how seriously I take that and it's a focus. Right. And I want to focus on having and create a place for people that need to be advocated for somebody that's going to scream your name at the top of their lungs. Doesn't need anybody else's validation. I didn't need anybody's validation to tell me that the people that I picked were it. I just had to keep saying that they were, keep putting them in an environment to flourish. And I feel like I can do that better than anybody in the world. I don't know that I've let anybody know from an executive standpoint that that's what I want to do. But I think that's the next move for us, you know, is doing it for real. Not just doing it because I'm a producer in a, in a vehicle for it, but actually go, you know what? I'm going to try to identify the next ones and don't give them the same personality that I have, which is insular behind the door. Like, you know, not, you know, these people like to collaborate really help them get into the room that they really want to get into. Yes. And I think I have enough favor throughout the industry and relationships to give some people some advantages in that way so that they could be heard at the highest levels. And so in 2026 and beyond, I think that's what myself, Mark and Judy will be doing in a real way. Yeah. Because it has been by, it has been a little bit, you know, you've announced it today. Yeah, here it is. Yeah, here it is. It will be announced soon, but we're really, we're really focused on it. We've changed our company structure to get in position. You know, you have to, you have to be in the positions that you have to be in. And so, you know, I know I'm like behind the scenes, but as, you know, if you guys watch my social media, I'm doing a lot more socials. I'm saying you, man. Yeah, I'm coming out, you know, like, I'm just, you have to tell your story. Like, you know, we'll all, as great as the songwriters Hall of Fame is in all that, listen, we'll all be forgotten. Truthfully, you know, as well as speak about Lil Sa, there's so much because, you know, Lil has been largely has not been, you talk about not being given credit. He has not been given the credit for any heartbreak and for Bobby Brown and for Ellie and face of Jim Lewis. And just all that whole MCA and Andre Harrell and those guys at MCA, the MCA that we know they now call Universal, but it's really built off of the, it was built off of the black music. Absolutely. Okay, from 777, Lincoln. Yeah. I mean, cause let's, let's be honest before Lil really got in position to do with Lil, end up doing it was, you know, throughout the industry called the music cemetery. Yeah. Of America. Yeah. Like, that was like a turn. Because we did our deal there. People were like, wait, y'all signs to the music cemetery? Yep. Like, no, no, no, no, no, Lil Sa was over there cracking. He get this name going. And he had every music. Johnny Wattley. Johnny Wattley Pebbles, BBD. The thing that you hear today, when you hear poison, just know that that happened. Yeah. Like, that ain't a little of some novelty record. Come on, Spider-Man and freezing. They came out. They came, they, that record was made. Yes. And he put it out. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. On a group that the world was not looking for. No. No. No. Really by accident. That group is by accident. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, you got there, you know, that's why we have this platform though, right? So that we can, we can highlight sometimes the forgotten in this whole thing, right? But we haven't forgotten them. Or, you know, they haven't had their chance where somebody put a spotlight on them. Right. So, you know, you coming here and being who you are and being able to say this. Yeah. And being able to talk about this and us to have these conversations is so important, bro. So we, so we're glad that you're outside. Man. That's, that's the, that's why you say you outside. I'm not outside. I'm here. Yeah. Yeah. But you know me and Tavy, I, we got out here. Yeah. One last thing. You know, the segment portion of what we do. We, we, we have something in common. What's your got in common, man? You know, I am, you know, doctor. Oh, here we go. Here we go. Here we go. And the honor is a doctor. If somebody don't hear me, give me what he got. From that college of art and design. Yes. I just want to salute you for that, my brother. Thank you doctor. The time that you have put in the work that you have done. The art that you have created. Yeah. Yeah. Has awarded you this doctorate. Yes. Make super proud of that. Make no mistake about it. You earned this. Are you talking to me as you're talking to him? Yes. Man Howard. Yeah. Countless man hours. Absolutely. Huh. Absolutely. Oh, the couch. Listen, he helped me. He a fellow dropout like me, man. Okay. Fuck all that. That's the most amazing man. Absolutely. I'm doctor. Mr. Tricky. I'm not. Hey, my wife. Mr. Tricky. My wife. He's making some butterbeaks. You got so many names. I don't know with the call your ass. No. Doctor. Tricky. Stillwood ladies and gentlemen. That's just a fellow doctor. I'm not going to a doctor named Tricky, man. When they tell me that Dr. Tricky, I'm like, I'm going to a doctor named Tricky, man. I'm like, I'm going to a doctor named Tricky, man. I'm like, I'm going to a doctor named Tricky, man. I'm like, I'm going to a doctor named Tricky. Doctor Tricky. I'm gonna be like, nope. I think he used a little bit too requested to go in the Doctor Tricky trick. the trickie trickie I'm like you might be after he might be under something I'm gonna go over there too it's going oh my god you never know you know I know it could get tricky you know I know oh my animal alright man go ahead and be talented dog oh shit oh this is great hold on let me get my high got it are you looking at my castle like that bro come on man it's me and you this don't look like one in thirty eight hundred dollar he more it's not that's right it was by it is not this is just to remind us of humble beginnings just trying to get it the way we lay yeah yeah yeah out their park what was that a hundred and eighty dollars a month we just trying to 45 hours a week do what we can afford brother tricky still would you have written and produced and and put together some orchestrated orchestrated orchestrated songs and music history we also know maybe doing it that you have been inspired yeah a lot of songs from the past president future we want to know come on we what those songs are and here on the army money podcast yeah a community we like to call this what we call it champ that's all we call it top five your top five ...fine ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... Top five R&B Singers. All right now you know this R&B thing is subject to picking some stuff But it's your word. The mind. Yeah, okay. My top five R&B singers no particular order. Mm-hmm I'm gonna have Stevie Wonder on that list. Come on, come on, come on. Living in the sky himself. I'm gonna have rhyming night on that list. Come on. Yes sir. Yes sir. I'm gonna have L. D'barge on that list. Yeah. Yeah. Charlie Wilson's on that list. Charlie Wilson. Yes sir. I'll come to him. Yes sir. And in their prime. I have JoJo and Casey. Hey. Who? Yeah. Who? Yeah. I say this all the time. There is no other JoJo and Casey. There is there are people trying to be like there are people who sound a little bit like there is no other JoJo and Casey. Yeah. Nope. We're talking R&B like R&B voices. Those are some of the ones that popped off. I love I love a lot of people. I tried Jo to see harmonies but they're not going to be Jo to see harmonies without JoJo and Casey. Yeah. I mean your list was technically six. I love seeing you. I tried to put them as a group. Okay. Well they're attached after hip-dome. That's Casey and JoJo. Okay. Your top five R&B songs. Oh. Well this is a little bit more complicated. Let me go. Let me get. You can name one of yours too. Our five of yours. I mean you got. It ain't that one. It ain't that one. Let's go through the fire. Yes. Yes. Let's go Stevie Wonder. Let's go Stevie Wonder. What's the song Joy? I'm John. I'm John Blake. I'm John and completely like. I don't have my phone. Ruben getting it for. I'm a joy. But not overjoyed. Yeah. Overjoyed. Overjoyed. Look at me being good. Look at me. Yeah. Overjoyed by Stevie Wonder. I'm going to go with. Coming talk to me. You. Original remix. Original. Okay. Okay. It's not your list. I'm asking him bro. I know you're both doctors but come on. I'm talking to Dr. Mr. Tricky right now. I'm going to have to say. I have to say. This is a different type of army song but I'm going to have to go with. Like man in a mirror. What's different about it? It's just. Sometimes. Yeah but sometimes people like because even with Mike like I didn't put him an army singer but Mike is like my favorite like you know I'm saying like. You know people forget. They forget. Because of the career was so even though it was short. It was so long. People forget how amazing his vocals were. Absolutely. How many have I done so far? Three. I got to go purple rain. Come on. Come on purple rain. Come on purple rain. And then I'm going to go. I'm going to go. I'm going to go. Roni. Bobby Brown. That is life changing record. Oh that's really. That is one of my favorite records all times. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. I'm tripping. I'm tripping. I'm tripping. If it isn't love can be put in the R&B dictionary as just a if you want to say what a R&B song is. Play that record. An R&B up tempo record. Play just just. If someone has never heard R&B music. They should hear if it isn't from production. Everything. Yes. Yeah. That's my listen. I'm sticking to it on five. Yeah. I can do five. No, but the truth is I can do five. With everybody that I have respect for and like everybody off the list. Yeah. I have a top five for every single person in the scenario. Because there's just so many people who have done such great work and dedicated themselves to be an amazing. Yeah. You know, it's like if all I had I could do just baby face. Of course. And never. And never. Of course. Touch another person. Absolutely. Absolutely. Okay. Let's make a Voltron. Dr. Tricky Stewart. We're going to make a Voltron. We're going to get the characteristics from any artist since the existence of time. Yes. What one vocal are you going to get for your super R&B artists? Whitney. Hmm. Are we going we want power? Hmm. Global massive flat. I'm using from the hood. I'm using from the hood. Whitney's voice. Yeah. Performance style. Onstage. Oh. Saying like Whitney and dancing. No. Okay. You're saying. No. You're saying building artists. Yes. That's a cohesive artist. Not like my favorite person. Like the two. You put in all the characteristics together. Okay. You're going to make your super R&B artists. Oh, super. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Let's strike that. What else we got next? Strike Michael. We're going to start over. Not. I know. Okay. I'm going to start with Beyonce's voice. We'll start with Beyonce's voice. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Chris Brown. Fly a young brother. Stay fly. He's like internationally. Yeah. All of these fly everywhere he goes. Everywhere he goes. The passion of the artist. Who will mean? Prince. Hmm. Yeah. You know it rained at the Super Bowl for him. It's never rained ever at the Super Bowl during a halftime show ever. But it rained for him. It didn't rain on him. Daring for rain. It rained for him. I like the way you put that. And he practiced in the rain for the moment and he was ready for the moment. How about that? Prince. Prince. And who's producing this artist? I'm going to go with Timberland. Timberville, the king. Timberland. My favorite. Of all times. Because I want it to be like. Aggressive. Indifferent. Yeah. I want to get some amp futurist. Yeah. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. Exactly the sign. That's a pick you. Yeah. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. Timberland. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I want to get paid. I said no name we was We were what you did don't say she Yeah, I said no Yeah So we had a very important part to show my radio Will you tell us a story? Funny or fucked up? Are funny and fucked up But the only rule to the game is UK saying on that My story's got to be so obvious because I have so much love right? Just K say today Let me see I think One of the craziest things I've ever really experienced was Being with one of the biggest artists in the world. Okay And Like oh no here it is the The story is I'm working with one of the biggest artists in the world and At this time when I fly into New York I get car sick sometimes, so okay I opted to take To this artist session A layover from LA to New York like I stopped And so some happened the flight plane was late then the plane was late again Okay, but at this time in my life I used to sleep on the plane All the time I don't do that anymore, but I was exhausted. I slept on a plane got on the next plane and We're super late, but I'm sleep so I don't really know that we didn't take off like we literally sat on the on the tarmac and I'm just You know so I'm landing New York now I think But I didn't hear that we weren't landing in New York So my phone's going off like where are you everybody's here? Where are you? Yeah, I'm like I just landed Even I'm not in New York. You don't really know. I don't know where I led it so So I so I have to call back and I get like so I have to call back and go you're not gonna believe us But I got diverted to Buffalo. I'm not in New York And so I was like I don't know what I'm gonna be there but I'm gonna be there I get so now it's another hour goes by I get there I get there Russia studio When I get to the studio When I say everybody's there This is what are the biggest artists in the world yeah, yeah, yeah, and everybody who cares about this artist is there And all the biggest for the producers that there's a producer it like producers there that are On fire yeah And I'm coming in Lake as like latest hours late and I Went into the studio. I didn't even say hi because it was just like the energy was so thick And I went in the studio And then I did one quick track like it about three minutes and I did another track Really really quickly And that first track that I did Came in it changed everything because It was a song that Everybody started waving their hand to eventually And they started going like this Yeah, but one of the songs that got you into the Hall of Fame Ha So saying is when you do this record with tank we need to make sure you get done But when I tell you the energy yeah, we'll stick yeah, I mean From the the management label head of course anybody that you can imagine is sitting there waiting For me what you got yeah, yeah, so the pressure's on and What do this in front of them? I mean, I would just what I went directly in the room and then Came in and then that was we go we go like his name out Yeah, I'm sorry Like you walk into the room where it was set up and got the cook and I went in the other room I went in the low room. Yeah, you know what I'll just start to be room. Yeah, hold on one second. I know I was late Give me two minutes guys Seriously, that was the first one Wow, you know the first one was just to make sure you were sick Hey listen, it was game. It was game time. I was going home right and I knew that You were talking about the lip you are sick. It's a dire dire head It was dire Yeah, you're like Bro you you're different you're tricky you're different bro. That was a lot. That was a lot I've had some moments. That's a lot different bro That was a lot You threw you threw a hit up No big one leave bro We are first of all glad that we were finally able to do this I think the timing of it is just perfect man, you know, you getting into this hall of fame and being able to have that conversation here with us on our Money is just there's really dope really awesome man as you can tell we are fans Love what you do as well as peers, but you're you're you're one of them ones man And so we we respect you we respect everything that you've accomplished We respect all that you will continue to do yeah, and this place is your place Whatever you ever need from us man Period, thank you brother. I appreciate the party And I appreciate you guys like creating this platform. It's important to get These stories out there man, you know, I don't like to talk, you know I'd like to let the music do the talking but at the same time there is a time when you need to be heard in your own words Yes, sir. I can't Interpolate Always through other people and so you know, I will one of the things I wanted to let you guys know too I will be doing an album this year my own album like it's the first time That I've ever like not singing but just like doing you know how producers do you know? Yeah, I'm realizing you know, and I would love to maybe do something with you like it's just no, don't maybe me Don't maybe me. You know, don't maybe me maybe me Check our check our text chain. Yeah, it's okay secure my slide. I see you at all. I see you on the 16th all right cool Yeah, you you perform it down there on the 15th. Okay. Yeah, at the arena. I'll be there. Yeah, I'll come down done All right, you'll see a picture of us on Instagram because he's on the gram now. He's out. He on the gram like this. Yeah I'm outside so I can stay inside Love that ladies and gentlemen. My name is tank. I'm Jay Valentine and this is the Army Money Podcast via authority The on all things Capital THR and B and hall of fame. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Dr. Tricky Stewart Yes, sir Thank you This is an iHeart Podcast guaranteed human