Exploring the Healing Power of Humor: Wayne Federman's Journey Through Comedy and Life Lessons-Encore Episode

This is what I love about stand up. It's a very communal activity that you get to share with the audience. I'm Lynn Hoffman and welcome to the Comedy Saved Me podcast where we explore the power of the punchline. Joining us today, can't even believe it, is a stand up comedian, an actor, producer, author, comedy writer, comedy historian, oh yeah, also on the side a musician, an adjunct professor and dabbler of podcasts. You've seen him in shows over the decades from Baywatch and X-Files to Curb Your Enthusiasm. It's always sunny in Philadelphia, Silicon Valley, dummy. I could go on here for the whole hour, but I digress. We are going to be speaking with the Emmy-winning amazing man known as Wayne Federman next on Comedy Saved Me. Don't move. This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human. Comedy Saved Me. Right, he feels like he's part of your family. If he feels like he's part of your family, that's because he really is. I mean, you've literally seen this man in every television, film, movie and commercial since the early 70s. Comedy or drama, take your pick. All right, I may sound like I'm exaggerating a little bit, but I feel like I can refer to him as a prolific and expert comedic entertainer who once had Jimmy Fallon as his opening act. Wayne Federman, welcome to Comedy Saved Me. It's true honor to have you here today. Thank you. You know, yes, I was doing comedy in junior high school in the early 70s, but I'm not quite that old that I was born in the 40s or something, but thank you. Thank you for the introduction. Very flattering. I love it. I know that way, but you ever walk up to somebody or see like a celebrity even in your own business that comes by and you've seen them in so many things. Sometimes you don't realize who you think it is. You just think it's family and someone you know. Of course. Yes. Of course. Yes. We have this in common where you're like, I know. Is this a person? Yeah. Well, you are definitely the perfect guest for this show because you've spent most of your life not just working as an actor and comedian, but also teaching and studying and writing about the fine art and history of stand-up comedy as evidenced in your recent book, The History of Stand-Up. Congratulations. Which also turned into a podcast. Just to start us off, I'm curious in your studies as a professor at USC, Adjunct, did you include your studies in comedy about how it has healing powers for both the givers of the comedy and the receivers? And if so, what did you glean off of this? As a matter of fact, I didn't. I just stuck mainly. I know the theme of this show is the power of the comedy. I was more just talking about its evolution and how it went from a very small part of variety shows to now it is the show. It used to be just like the monologist, that's what stand-ups were called, were like part of a variety show even before vaudeville. They were doing it. And then eventually, people really started gravitating towards what these people were saying. And I think it's just the simplicity of one person standing on stage with a microphone and just you get this view inside their mind and they're basically tickling your mind. They're not physically tickling you, but they're mentally tickling your mind with misdirections and observations and embarrassing stories that you might be able to relate to. So it's a very, this is what I love about stand-up, it's a very communal activity that you get to share with the audience. And I was just thinking about this the other day. I'm going to go off just a little bit because I've been thinking, like I was at a street fair the other day and there was a band playing in one of the shelves and there was maybe two people watching the band, but the band was cooking and you could have like the greatest guitar solo you ever do in your life in front of one person or a sound check or anything, but at stand-up, you need the audience. You need the give and take. So it's that human connection that really sets it apart from a lot of the other art forms. Yes, that is interesting. And you know, it's funny you said that. It almost is like even when you're one-on-one with someone and they pull out a guitar and they perform for you, it's still, it's not quite the same, it's not the same thing, whether it's, does that make sense? Like you're sitting near right across- Yeah, of course, of course, because it's, there's a comedian named Dana Gould who would be a great person to talk to on this podcast because he's a very deep thinker, super hilarious, funnier than I am. And just like, just great. And he's dealt with like kind of little more mental health issues than I have. And he said that stand-up is a conversation, but only one person is talking. Wow, that would be really hard for me because I love to talk. Obviously. Can you pinpoint when the moment when you realized that comedy wasn't just something that you enjoyed, but it was something that you needed in your life, clearly you needed it? Well, I don't know. This was my thing. My thing was I enjoyed the attention, the affirmation. Even when I was in high school, I was a funny kid. And that's when this whole dream started for me really. And there were other funny kids in high school, but they were very disruptive. And my goal as a class comedian or something was to make the teachers laugh as well as the students. It was easy to make the students laugh. You could just be incorrigible against the authority figure. But if I could get the teachers to laugh as well, I was like, okay, now at least I know I have like an aptitude for this world. And I'm like, let me give this, let me give this a shot. And many teachers encouraged me, but it wasn't like, like the name of your podcast really makes me laugh. It makes it sound like, oh, I was an accountant and I was a distrojorie. And one night I did a knock, knock joke to a colleague and they laughed and it saved my life. It's not quite like that, but I did want to lead a creative life. That was Lynn. That was my goal. Well, it's, you know, it's funny. You said that the funny ones were disruptive and you wanted to make the teacher laugh. The disruptive ones were probably the ones that were just so bored. That's all they wanted to do was disrupt. I love that you wanted to make the teacher laugh because, A, it gets you out of having to study because they're laughing so hard. I used to do that to my mom. We had to go to bed. I'd try to make her laugh so we could stay up later. Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, all my friends who are super, super smart, they were the disruptors. Believe it or not, a lot of those disruptor kids also became stand-ups. I was trying to say that you were stupid or something because... That wasn't my point. I was not trying to... I was saying that you could also be like a juvenile delinquent comedian as well. But I, unlike, I feel like a lot of stand-ups that I talked to hated school and I didn't. I really, I liked learning and I liked the community of it all. But that might have to be because I came from a very tense household. So it was like, oh, this is a place where I can really get some affirmation and community and things like that. So it's weird. It's weird. That's interesting. So you're doing this... Yes, yes, it is. How many siblings in the family do we have? Well, it's a lot. It's very kind. I don't think we have enough time to go through the whole thing. But basically there was four kids. I was the youngest and then my father died very young. Never knew him. And then my mom remarried four years later and had two other kids. So I have step siblings, but I just think of them as full brothers, sisters. It's not like, oh, yeah, yeah. Because I never knew my dad. And so it was a pretty big family. And, you know, I needed attention. Apparently. Well, you were the youngest. I couldn't get it. Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. And, you know, it's so interesting that you say that's the exact same story of my husband. He was 16, but still it's really a hard thing when you don't know your father and didn't ever get to meet him. And it says a lot about who you are today too. I like the way you, in the middle of this, you have to brag that you got married. It's fun. Oh, well, I stalked him for years. So actually he gave in. You warmed down. I love it. I love it. There's a specific set or show or comedic moment where you felt like you finally belonged somewhere and you knew this was where you needed to be. Because you've done so much. It's absolutely incredible and mind boggling when I go through your sizzle reel. Yeah. How much stuff you have done. Thank you. Thank you. No, it's so somewhat. Yeah. I look at it. I was just trying to get the next thing like in the whole run of it. And I am by no means like a famous comedian. I'm a working comedian. And so there's a slight difference in that. Was there a moment, can you ask that question again? Was there a moment I felt like I belonged? That you belonged like that you had found your niche outside of high school with the teacher? Yeah. Yeah. Outside of making Mrs. Forsberg live. Let me think. Yeah. I would say, I would say when I was, there was like a comedy club that I developed at in New York City called the comic strip. And when I started doing like weekend sets, which were the prime sets you could get there and was doing very well on those sets, I was playing the ukulele. I was just doing like silly stuff. And it was, I was like, oh, I think I can, I think I can do this because I gave myself 10 years. I would hate myself my 30s before I would even think of assessing whether this could be a career. I was like, I'm going to give up my, actually until 30. So my entire 20s, I would give up and to pursue this as fully as I could. And then by the, my time as 27 or 28, it was like making a living. I paid off my student loan, all doing comedy. So I was like, oh, I guess I'm part of it. And so funny, you keep asking for these specific moments. And to me, it was more like a rolling rock kind of thing that just like, just kept pushing it. Yes. Like a momentum was going and there'd be setbacks and the rock would roll back over me and I'd keep going. And, you know, so there really wasn't like, oh my God, this one moment I'm performing and George Carlin was in the crowd and he put his arm around me or there was nothing like that. No, I mean, like I saw pictures of you with one of my idols as a kid growing up Bob Hope and Gary Shanling and Steve Carell. I mean, like you're, you're just going one on one with the biggest names. And to me, by the way, you said you weren't a famous comedian. You are a famous comedian. You've just been so busy working, you haven't realized who you are. Okay. You might be right. You might be right. I doubt it, but thank you for saying that. No, but what gave you that, that gumption to continue to pursue each new role? I mean, because I'm not exaggerating when I say if you go to WayneFetterman.com, you will just be amazed. You're a part of every part of my life, Wayne. This is, all right. Now, don't make me blush. Don't make me. I'm fangirling on you, but it's true. It's not going to go well for me. All right. So what was your question? When did I know what? Well, all right. I was just overwhelmed by the compliment. So, I'm sorry. Yeah, I know. I tend to do that. I didn't mean to throw you off. Let's just move on. How about that? Okay. Okay. Okay. How has your relationship with comedy changed over the years? You asked these questions that are, that have built in assumptions in them that I don't know if I agree with the built in assumption. Let me think about it. My relationship with comedy, oh my God. I'd never even think of being in a relationship with comedy. I just feel like, oh, I had an aptitude for this as a kid. I pursued it because I just love the idea of it. The first time, even in high school, and I went to, I'm from Florida. I'm like from nowhere, from a place called, this is embarrassing, Plantation, Florida. I know Plantation, Florida. You know it? To cool down, yeah. Oh my God. So, anyway, I'm from Plantation. It's kind of an embarrassing name. And I went to South Plantation High School. I'm from the less progressive part, the south part of a place called Plantation. There's a south part of Plantation High School. Yes, that's right. I went to South Plantation High School. So, it's just so funny. I know, it's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. But they had this, oh my God, I wish I could remember the name of it. But in the guidance counselor's office, like this book of possible professions. Yes. And it was like numerous books. And you would read it, a doctor, how to do, anesthesiologist, if you didn't want to be a full doctor, a nurse assistant, whatever construction, manager stuff. And one of them was entertained, literally, they had entertainer. They didn't say stand-up comedian. But they, you know, and I was reading about it, and I was like, oh, this is actually a career. And then once I realized that making people laugh could be a career, that's exactly what I wanted to do. And I just did two things. I did stand-up, and I wanted to be a good comedic actor, like in commercials, which I also was able to knock on wood, achieve a little bit. So that was my strategy. So I don't know if I have a relationship with comedy. Yeah, I have a relationship. Comedy hasn't called me quite a bit. I'm getting desperate. I keep calling comedy on the weekends. My break up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Comedy broke my heart several times. Actually, comedy's seeing another comedian now. It's really, it's bad. It's bad. I don't know why you would. So I don't really think of it having a relationship with it as more just, I don't know. Absolute affinity for it. Because it's so human. That's what I love about comedy, is the human part about it. It's like you're really, it's part of the human. And it goes back way before, you know, I mean, as soon as they were, even before then, like in all of these societies, like, you know, Incas, Max, they all, the Native Americans, there was always like a funny person and making laugh was part of the human experience. So I'm just part of a small part of this huge wave that's been part of being alive. It's part of being alive. Now, speaking of that, do you feel that people have to be able to laugh at themselves in order to be a good comedian? I try not to. Again, I'm like a bad person for this podcast because I'm a very much a nuanced guy. For the most part, Lynn, I do think, yes, I think, but I do know comedians that are just like to are angry at the world and have a comedic lens in which to vent that anger. And I don't know if they have a sense of humor about themselves. So I don't know if that's true. For me, like, that's, I do self-deprecating comedy. So I'm always- There is no better. There really is no better. Well, thank you. Thank you. That's true, but yeah, so that's what I try to do. But I can't speak on behalf of other, I can't speak on behalf of other comedians. For myself, I like making fun of myself. And somebody once said that it's like, you just can't take your, you know, the whole thing is ridiculous anyway. When you break down stand up, you're just like, if there was an alien who came down and walked into a comedy club and there's one person standing and everyone else and then they're making these involuntary sounds and then once in a while it's clapping like, what is happening here? Like, why are these people, what is this weird ritual that's going on with you? Grunting noises and things and screams and like, okay. Do you love making people laugh? Do you love working with other people that make you laugh? Is that sort of par for your profession? You know, I don't know if I use the word love, but I do have an intense, intense attraction. No, a tense passion for it. I do. I do. I'd love, not only do I like doing comedy, which is terrifying at times because when it's not going well, not only do you know it, the audience knows that everyone in the room can feel it. It's not great. It's not great. And I know, and so there's a little bit of a, like you're on a tightrope up there and you can fall and people can tell and it's, you're a Wilenda brother all of a sudden. It's not good. It's not good. So I do love doing it, but I also love watching it. And I know other comedians who don't watch other, don't watch comic. They don't like it. They just want to think about what they're doing. Is it because they don't want someone who's funnier that they don't want to see someone who's funnier than them? I think partly maybe that just like, cause it's, I hate to say it underneath all of this love of comedy and elevated the stuff there is. There's this huge competition and suddenly, oh, that comedian is driving a Lamborghini and I'm still with the Camry over here. So it's, there is that part of it. No question, no question. The goals in comedy is to be big. Like that's your kind of your goal. And so it's very clear who is selling out arenas and who is, you know, not or playing smaller clubs or I don't even know if you know this, not to get into the weeds too much, but there's like a clubs and then what they call B clubs and C clubs. And that's, and with each letter, it keeps getting worse the kind of environment you have to perform in front of. So, so no, it's, and it's all getting laughs. It's all getting from the open micker to Dave Chappelle. They're all doing the same thing, standing up there trying to get laughs, using your mind and your words and your thought, you know, comedic ideas that you're presenting through your, what I call a specific comedy lens. Like how do you see the world? Yeah. It's just like, Oh, I see it focused here. You're looking there. Like, I don't remember what the question was. What does it feel like to you? What does it feel like to you when you do that? Like, have you ever, have you ever bombed and then had to recover? Please. Oh, come on. Give it to me. Please, please. Oh yeah. I mean, I don't want to re, I will tell you the site of my worst show was in Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania at a holiday end. I don't want to go into the details of it, but that's a whole, that's how comedy almost killed me. Should be your other podcast. Oh no. So it was a very, very devastating. And some comedians have an ability like if it goes bad, they'll turn on the audience because they're like, I'm not going to be the one feeling bad about this. You're going to be the one. I'm going to punish the crowd. It's really interesting, Lynn. I was never like that. I was always, oh, this feels good. This is, this means I'm not funny or I don't have the skills to do this or I don't have it tonight. And I will tap dance my way through this the best I can put on a fake smile that everyone sees as fake and try to power through it. And but I try not to turn on the crowd. I try as a rule, like I can't even think of times. I don't think I ever have. And but that's a self-defense mechanism for a lot of comics that they don't, they're like, I'm not going to feel bad. You're going to feel bad because this isn't work. Even if it is the comedians. Anyway, very new one. I've been in an audience of that. You have? I have. I've seen that happen before. Yeah. Out in LA one time. It was painful. Like I cringed for the comedian and for the audience because it was a really difficult. And I give you so much credit for just going back at it. And so what keeps you going in this industry? How have you been able to collect such an incredible resume? Great question. I think one of my skills. I got a good question. You finally have to run this time. Without an assumption built into one of my skills besides being okay at comedy and all of that is I have an ability to recover from rejection. I have that. It's not immediate. It's not like, oh, whatever that thing, brush it off. It takes a day or something, maybe a few days. And if I have a bad set, I really don't feel completely whole until I'm back on stage and had a reasonable set after that. But I do have the ability to and I've had a lot of really very devastating rejections and I'm just like, all right, this is part of this is it. No one knows you. Like show business doesn't owe me a career at all. There's no, you know, there's no thing. There's no guys weighing out. Oh, what's fair or anything like that. So that would be to answer your one good question this entire time. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. To answer your insightful, I would say my ability to handle rejection. Yeah. All right. I got another follow up on that if you're okay with it. Of course. I love it. Let's follow up. The follow up is what would you say to a young person who's getting into the industry who has a difficult time dealing with rejection or you know that they're heading in that direction. What would you say to them? What kind of advice, words of wisdom, sage adjunct professor? That's good. What would you say? I would try again. I try not like I feel like everyone's on their own path and their own way. And just because I did it this way doesn't mean that'll work because obviously the industry changes a little every day. Obviously it's way different now than when I started. I would just say keep creating. Try not to take a person. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Well, this is what's coming into my head is a sidebar because I really feel like younger people have way better connection and ability and tools to deal with negative feedback because of the internet. I know people that they think it's funny when they get hate comments on their TikTok or X videos or Instagram videos. They think it's funny. Others even think it's great. It's like that's how you build an audience. You have to have some people that hate you and some people love you. They fight and that adds to your algorithm or something. Yeah, yeah, the number of impressions you make. I'm sure you know this world. Yeah, yeah. Something I don't know any. I actually would do with the I think I could get advice from young people on how they deal with just making fun of whatever you're most vulnerable about it. The way you look, the way you sound, your material, you're not funny, all of that. I actually think usually younger people are way better at handling that than I am. They're just like, oh, I think it's funny that I have haters. I'm like, oh, well, I'm not that involved. They have thick skin these days. Yeah, I'm not that involved. I'm a sensitive person. I think you can tell. We'll be right back with more of the Comedy Saved Me podcast. Welcome back to the Comedy Saved Me podcast. You had this recurring role on one of my all time favorite shows on HBO called Curb Your Enthusiasm. Yes, yes. And I always wanted to know how, I mean, was the whole thing ad-libbed? Did you just get bullet points? And how do you go up against these titans of television and comedy and ad-lib and feel confident about it? I mean, that must have been, was that harder than doing a stand-up show? No, much easier, much easier. How? Because stand-up show is all on you. It's like the whole thing. You get all the acclaim and you get all the blame. Like it's, I know that rhymes, I just came up with that. So that is the, you know, the high wire act that stand-up comedy. Like you are up there. Just so you know, human beings biggest fear is standing on stage talking to an audience. Like more than death, more than dying in a plane crash, any of that drowning, it's that. That's human beings. And then to add another level, when of expectation that you need to elicit laughter. Now we're talking about a level where people are just, how many times, I mean, people always come up to me and like, I don't know how anyone could possibly do it. I'm like, well, you don't have to. Luckily, you don't have to. Thank you for paying to come to this show. So, back to Curb Your Enthusiasm. That's much easier. Yes, you nailed it. You answered your own question. This is your second best question because I don't have to do anything. I just have to nod. Yes. There is bullet points of what has to happen in the scene and no lines of dialogue are written at all. And all you have to do is just listen and react. That's all you have to do in Curb Your Enthusiasm. That would horrify me because I would be so worried that it wouldn't be good or up to par. And then what does Larry say to you if you don't really give him what he wants? You'd have to do that over again this evening? We do it over and over. And each time he's like, do more of that, do less of that. But he kind of likes what I was doing right. I sort of had an angle on how to play this character, Dean Weinstock, which was, I want to be the worst person in the world, but under the guise of a nice person, like what they call passive aggressive. So that was just like my angle. And it was working right from the start. Luckily, I don't know what would have happened if he would have been like, oh, this is not what we wanted at all. I mean, I guess there was that possibility. So I just thought it was actually much easier to me than acting when you have lines that are written because then I'm kind of worried that I'm going to forget the lines. That's true. I didn't even think of that at all. Think a little bit, please. Wow, sorry. I know. The love of God. I love that you're beating me up. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm going to get bad review. Yeah. So I have, I don't know. You've acted, right? Occasionally. But not anybody. But it's like when you act, you have to say these lines the same way and make it sound like you're thinking of them at the time. And it's. Oh, oh, yeah. I'm a voiceover artist as well. I do imaging for like hundreds of stations and radio and television and stuff. So I guess that would be my acting because I have to read lines and sound important. Yeah. Yeah. But it, but I'm saying on camera, if you don't have the line right in front of you, you want to stand, do you clip it on or do you have what, what's your, what's your technique? My microphone? Yeah. No. I mean, I'm talking about the copy you have to read. Oh, my technique is. I try to be like Don LaFontaine and just do one take. Never works out that way though. I like, I try to just read cold and just go through the lines and react as I naturally am reading it as opposed to thinking about it too much. What a legend that dude used to drive around in that limo to gig take. Oh my God. I know. Amazing. In a world, in a world. In a world. So, so that's it. So yes, I found it very, actually I didn't find it that challenge. I mean, I was thrilled at the situation I thought was funny and I had known Larry when he was doing stand up. So I had already known the guy. So it wasn't like. It wasn't an unknown. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So last question on my God, I'm starting to get a little anxiety because. What do I do? I don't like the question. Oh, I'm sorry. If comedy hadn't found you, where do you think you would be today? What do you think you would be doing? Actually, this is the second to last question because I want more. You can do two can do two bonus. We're in the wing. Going to the bonus round. I don't care. All right. I have a hunch it would be close to what I'm doing now, which is I teach this history of stand up class at USC based on my book, but I've always kind of liked history. It might have been, it might have been like stayed in school and become a teacher or something. I, I like, you know, I know that sounds creepy, but I, I like kids. I like their energy. I just, it's, you know, it's fun. It's creepy about that. I feel the same. I just said to my husband the other day, it's like, let's go to dinner with the neighbors. They're like in their early thirties, they have four kids. They're so upbeat. It feels so great to be around them. You know, there's, you know, there's something to that. All right. I'm curious, where do you live? Where do you live? You don't have to tell me the exact street, but like. I'm in Connecticut. Oh, I was originally from Boston. Oh, so you're all in New York. And then I ended up like in a cello kid. I get it. Yeah. Pretty much a cello dwella. I get it. I say, I know, I know that world a little bit. Wait, what world were we just talking about? No, you were talking to my kids. Yeah. I said that I like kids and that I think sometimes that sounds creepy, but it's true. I, I was a camp counselor and, um, still friends with some of the kids that I was the counselor of years ago. Like it was called racket Lake boys camp. There was a racket Lake. There's a boys camp and Lake and girls camp on the other side. They had socials. It was so, it was like, I was like Norman Rockwell created this place. It's up in the Adirondack mountains. No ragweed. Sometimes I have that allergy. Oh, I thought you meant the smoking kind. I didn't know. No, no, no, no. See, I'm not. I'm sorry. I'm trying to ad-lib with the king of ad-lib. No, no, I get, I get. Do I look like a dope fiend to you? Do I? Just occasionally. Okay. Um, what, Wayne, what do you think the world would be like without comedy? In a weird way, cause I know you also do the music one, correct? Yes. Yes. Yes. And as much as I love comedy and I've dedicated my life to it, I really think music as a human artistic form, despite the fact that it's not a given take is maybe more healing than comedy. And let me tell you why. Because after nine 11, they did a concert on television, a live concert, and no one wanted to hear from comedians, but we did want to hear from Tom Petty and other people, you know, singing, singing, cause that like touches our souls, touches our soul in a way that comedy is more about the mind. I think music is more about the soul. Not that there's not some, and some comedians, Gary Goldman, I'm looking at you and Maria Bamford, they go into that world that, but I do feel like music does. And that's why when you go to see a musician, you want to hear the songs that you heard before that connected with you. Whereas you go to see a comedian, if they do a bit, they did 10 years ago. You're like, can you write something new, please? Please, sir. Oh, come on. You want to feel that way? It's a hundred percent true. You have to have, you have to have new material all the time. And with music, they're like, please, Paul, play, age, you let it be. Lady Madonna, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And if you were a comedian and you want to see, I don't know, Gaffigan or, you know, Malaney, and he was doing his subway bit that he did from 15 years ago. I don't think you'd be that. Yeah, maybe there'd be fans like, oh, I love this bit, but it's, it's a different kind of thing. I know this is so philosophical. I hope I'm not too much into the weeds on this. No, I appreciate it. It's a very refreshing take because it's, it's very different than other interviews I've done with comedians. So I love hearing a totally different angle. I tend to be more on like the agreeable side with you because when people ask me about stuff that I do, I'm always like, so unimpressed. I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how it affects people. I'm not trying to. I'm just kind of doing what makes me feel good. And, you know, but, but the success that you've had, it's a lot. And obviously you've been so busy. Sometimes we get so busy working all of a sudden. It's like 10 years ago by and you're like, what happened? You know, what do I need to get caught up on? Cause I'm so into what I'm doing. But I just disagree with you about the feeling because you feel like stand, you feel like comedy is more for the soul than for the mind. I just think that when you hear that song or that you've had incredible belly laughs, it's the same feeling that you just feel healed in some way. Maybe. I mean, obviously people get, there's some cathartic experience going on and with comedy when you're just losing it and stuff. Yeah. So, I mean, that, that is true. So maybe, maybe I'm underselling comedy a little bit. I just think of it, I think of it a little more as a less elevate. I know this sounds horrible because I've dedicated my whole life. He, my, you know, my few hours, as I like to say here on this planet to this. It's a good question. It is a good question. I guess for some people, comedy is obviously healing and reinvigorating and life affirming, right? Of course, of course, but to the level of music, I don't know. I don't know. Sorry. I don't know. I mean, it's not, there's no right or wrong. Obviously it's just Wayne with his stupid opinions. Well, Wayne, are you going to be teaching anytime soon a class at USC, that little college out in California? Yeah. Anytime soon? Yeah. I'll be the next week. I'll be, yeah. Well, I think you should add to your syllabus. Tell me. I think you should. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Okay. Get it. I got the paper. Let me write this down. No, it's not going to be that or shattering. I just, by the way, I use the flare pen. Are you familiar with this? Uh, did you do a commercial for that one time? No, no. I've never seen a flare pen commercial. I don't have a flare pen. Do you know what it is? It's the very hard to come. It's really good. It's very sweet. What do you use? What do you use? What is that? This pen says JC mobile auto. That's a promotional pen. Okay. A little different. No, I think that, um, in all seriousness, what if you studied a little bit of the physical effects, the scientific effects of the power of comedy? Oh, okay. You know, can you, is there any sort of, um, uh, research on that? Is there any sort of scientific research? It now? No, no, no, no. I thought you were like, Oh, you have to study Brenda Borg's paper where he talked about maybe a scientist could come in like somebody who does study the, the effects of laughter on the human body. Okay. Could be like taking you in a whole new direction. You never even thought of it. I will, I'm writing. I wrote it down. Yes. I can't even believe it. I think it's a good idea. Of course. Of course. Well, on that note, don't they always say you should go out on top? I always heard you leave a monty more, but you say go out on top. All right. Going out on top. Well, just in your eyes, Wayne, because I do want to leave you with good feelings because I am such a huge fan and I'm so grateful to have spent this time. And he's just so easy and disarming to talk to. And, um, you're like just normal kind of guy who's been in probably every television show and commercial and movie I've ever watched. So I really do appreciate the time. Well, thank you for reaching out. I know this, this was like a month ago we were going to do this and we kept missing each other and stuff. So thank you for making time. Oh my gosh. Wayne Federman from South Plantation High School. South Plantation, Florida. Exactly. Um, if you want to know everything about Wayne, just go to WayneFederman.com and, and you will just laugh and you will just be taken down memory lane and, um, see all of his incredible work and what he continues to do. What else can we look for for you in the future here? Well, uh, I would say two things. Um, by the way, I'm also my favorite credit outside of curb is there's a movie called legally blonde, which I am in. Of course. One of my favorites too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I play it's no joke though. If you were to stand here and just say the name of everything that you have worked on, we, I, we, I would have to time it because it would go on for a long time. And you don't look old enough. So that's another crazy thing we can talk about next time. Thank you. Thank you. Wayne, that's it. And there's going to be an updated version of the history of stand up. That's coming out January 15th. I've added a new chapter because I ended it right during COVID, which was around 2000. So now there's been another five years of stand up. Fantastic. So are you going to have that as a podcast as well? Um, I mean, I mean, I do do a podcast. I guess, I mean, but basically it's the book basically is the book and the audio book. I have never released it. It's an audio book. So I'm going to be doing what you do, staying in front of a mic, reading, dang, that's awesome. We'll enjoy. And if you need a stand and I'm happy to do it. Oh my God, you're too nice. You're too nice. Thank you, Wayne Peterman for being on comedy saved me. And we'll see you next time. Maybe you come on music, save me and we can talk about your musical career. Now, it's not as deep as it obviously might say my comedy career. Thank you so much. All right. Thank you again. Thank you.