Ep.216 We Are In A Dream (Throwback)

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You're juggling multiple roles, designer, marketer, logistics manager, all while bringing your vision to life. Shopify helps millions of business sell online. Build fast with templates and AI descriptions and photos, inventory and shipping. Sign up for your one euro per month trial and start selling today at shopify.nl. That's shopify.nl. It's time to see what you can accomplish with Shopify by your side. I know you want to listen to your podcast, so I'll keep it short. Because if you think it's important to make a duroze choices, can ASR maybe help? I think, how then? For example, when you're doing a duroze herstellen of the things that you love, you're doing. Will you know more about the insurance where a duroze schadethestel can be? Go to asr.nl. This does ASR for you and a duroze. ASR does it. So, we can now listen to your podcast. Ares 31, me neither. There was 71 pop of golf. Go ahead. If it was anybody that's above us, that passed us like 30 seconds ago. We're 7-1 Papa Gulf, negative. Okay. Top this. UFO. Yeah. It's murdering 1095. Yeah, something just passed over. Like, I don't know what it was, but it's at least 2,000, 3,000 feet above us. So yeah, it passed right over the top of us. 9-1-1. You guys busy? We just called off the vehicle as we thought. Mm-hmm. They're out there, playing airplanes. Can I dispatch? Okay. Bob, I swear to God, four calls in on an unidentified object over Liberty. Four calls? Four calls on an unidentified flying object. No. All right, Matt, take a look. All right, we'll check it out. Welcome to UFO Chronicles, a place where people share their experiences of the strange and unexplained. If you've had an encounter and would like to be on the show, you can email me at ufochronicles at gmail dot com. Hello everyone and welcome to the show, wherever in the world you are listening from. How are you all? I'm Nick Hunter and this is the UFO Chronicles podcast. Adam comes to the show tonight from the United Kingdom and Adam's main interest is out-of-the-body experiences or OBEs and he has several experiences to share as well as a frightening Ouija board encounter and a UFO sighting Adam up next If you enjoy listening to the podcast and would like to help support my work there is a couple of ways to do this Either you can join Patreon and become a patron of the show for as little as $5 a month or you can donate via PayPal. And if you like, you can set up monthly reoccurring payments. All links to support the podcast are below in the show notes and on the website. Any help is extremely appreciated and it helps the show to continue running. Now, on with the show. Good evening, Adam. Welcome to the show. Hi, Nick. Thank you very much for inviting me on. I'm super excited to be able to share my story with you and everyone else that listens to your show. Thank you very much. You're welcome. We're excited to have you on. And you're calling from the United Kingdom. Yep, that's right. So I'm based in the southeast of England in Hertfordshire. Yep, so I've lived in England all of my life. Good stuff. Lovely part of the UK, that is. Now, Adam, you have several experiences to share with us. Would you like to start at the beginning, please, sir? Okay, yeah, thank you very much, Nick. Okay, so hi, everyone. My name's Adam. I'm 56 years old now. And as Nick said, I'm based in England. So I've not shared this story with anyone before. I mean, like some people that are interested in the paranormal, you have the odd chat down the pub, but I've never really given a lot of detail about what I do and what I'm interested in. So this is kind of a first, really. So my intention for my little story today is I hope to be able to help some people that are quite interested in lucid dreaming and outer body experiences. That's the bulk of my experiences. Now, I'm quite an average sort of person, I'd say. I wouldn't say I'm psychic or particularly sensitive. so I'd like to share the methods that I've sort of discovered over the last 40 years in the hope that will help some other people that may want to try and experience this for themselves I would say at the beginning though it does take a little bit of courage I have had quite a few not necessarily scary experiences but when it's three in the morning and you've got some really strange feelings and experiences happening, it does take quite a lot of courage to continue. It's really easy to bail out sometimes. And even now, I do get sometimes I just think I just can't handle this and I'll just stop whatever it is I'm trying to develop. Okay, so I will start at the beginning. but before I do one of the one of the resources I use for out of body practice and there's some really great ones out there but there's a gentleman called William Buhlman or Buhlman probably is the best way to pronounce that the reason I mention William is he bought out a fabulous book over 20 years ago called Adventures Beyond the Body and he's also got a super YouTube channel with some really, really great lectures that he does. So I thoroughly recommend that you pick that up if you can. The reason I mentioned this at the beginning is one of the things that William says is he talks about something called beliefs. So what he encourages people to do is to go beyond beliefs and change a belief into a known. And that can only happen through direct experience. The reason I mentioned this at the beginning of this little chat is I'm just going to jump forward to one of my more recent experiences, which has nothing to do with out-of-body experiences, but it is, in fact, a UFO sighting that I had in 2017. And the reason I mention this now is this is an example of a belief. So I believed in UFOs for many, many, many years. I've done lots and lots of research. I have never seen one, but I still believe that they existed. But it wasn't until I had this particular sighting that, you know, once you see something with your own eyes, it becomes an absolute known. And it really shook my reality, even though it was a very, very brief sighting. So I'll just mention I have seen several unknown objects in the sky. They're always during the day. And that's mainly because of the sport that I do. It does involve looking up into the sky quite a lot. So I often see odd objects, never anything that I could say definitively would have been a UFO as such. In fact, I did send Nick a photograph of a strange black ring that I saw in 2016. In fact, there was two of them. They were really high, quite large. But that was an example of, I'm not sure what that could have been. It was just an odd thing that I just couldn't say one way or the other what it could have been. So maybe Nick will share that with the show notes. In 2017, my first real sighting as such, it was an August day, beautiful blue skies in the UK in Hertfordshire. Hardly any cloud cover in August. I looked up and I saw two glittering really high objects they were slightly bigger than stars and they caught my eye and I thought what could that be clearly not an airplane but at this stage I'm thinking I don't know what that could be in fact I laid down on the grass in the park no one else was around and I watched these for at least 10 minutes. In fact, I got my mobile phone out and filmed them as well. But because they were so high on the playback footage, you couldn't really see too much. So I watched these things of interest for about 10 minutes and in the end, I just thought I was going to get on with my day. So I got up again and didn't really bother to look at them any longer because I couldn't determine what they could have been. Now, as luck would have it, about 10 or 15 minutes later, still on the same field, I just glanced up just by pure chance. And I saw my first genuinely unexplainable, no idea what it could have been. It was about the size of a pea if you were to hold it at arm's length. It was fairly high. It was a white orb with a fuzzy defined edge circular. Really highly unusual. Now, the thing was, my mobile phone was on the floor next to my bag. And as I've looked at this thing, I've instantly thought, I need to grab my phone to film this. But this object was traveling so fast. It was incredible. It actually went from right above my head at my 12 o'clock to the edge of the sky, so it was gone in around about eight seconds. Now, I knew that had I jumped down to get my mobile phone, by the time I switched it on, fired it up, got it into film load, that object would have been gone. I knew that within a second of seeing it because it was going so far. So what I did do was I stared at this object really, really carefully, trying to look at every detail, knowing that was the best I could do. So that was my first and only sort of genuine UFO that I've seen. I have no idea what it was. Extremely fast moving. I estimated the speed at around about 6,000 to 10,000 miles per hour, I guess. And I based that on sort of similarly high aircraft that travel across the field quite regularly, which can take, you know, a minute to easily traverse the sky. And they're traveling at sort of 300, 400 miles an hour. And this thing that I saw was really, really, really going. The only thing I'd sort of finish off with this UFO sighting was it really shook my foundations. I could think of nothing else for the next week. Virtually every moment of my waking day was thinking, oh my God, what did I see? If that is real, because I've seen it, what else is also a reality that we just don't accept? so going back to uh outer body experiences and um lucid dreaming so i'm going to take you back to the beginning so i've had a fairly normal life as i say i had a really genuine strong interest in the paranormal evidence i can remember i think when i was about age six or so we had some magic books like conjuring books at my primary school i remember looking at those and uh and reading those I think that sparked my interest in magic, so to speak. So I think nothing really much happened when I was a young lad. I did have a very close brush with death in 1970. Nothing paranormal, but it does make me wonder if there's higher powers at work. We were in our house in Essex. and I think it was a bank holiday Monday, so we weren't actually at school. It was half past eight in the morning. The family was all awake upstairs, it was me, my brother, my mum and dad. And all of a sudden the house shook with a huge crash and bang And we were basically getting ready to go down to the kitchen for breakfast for the day And it transpired that a 20-ton sand lorry had skidded off the main road outside our house, had driven through our garden and completely embedded itself in our kitchen. There was literally nothing left. The driver, thankfully, did survive. But had we been in the kitchen that day, we would have almost certainly have died. So that's probably the only unusual thing that happened to me before the age of 10, I would say. So I think my main experiences with lucid dreaming and out-of-body experiences probably started around about age 14. So that was quite an important time for me. at age 14, you might remember this, Nick, there was a magazine out in 1980 called The Unexplained. And I started to collect these. And that really, really fired up my interest in the paranormal. They covered a vast range of subjects. And I remember reading through it and seeing about astral projection, as it was called. And it just seemed to me to be absolutely fascinating. around about the same time i also discovered some books by a really crazy english mystic called lobsang ramper he i mean he's really controversial but controversial as he was his books did have some pretty good stuff on meditation um instruction in them as well as um out-of-body practice actually and around about age 14 i started to uh experiment with uh with meditation nothing really major it was just basically clearing my mind for half an hour and i started to get some fairly quickly some pretty crazy feelings during meditation which scared me a little bit to be honest i used to feel my heart was like jumping out of my chest which i now know is probably the heart chakra being stimulated so the meditation and i've heard it mentioned on the show several times before, I think is really key to developing and discovering your inner self, your inner reality. So I think my very first out-of-body experience happened shortly after that. It was unplanned. I was probably around about age 14. I can't remember exactly. I didn't document this one. I remember waking up in my bedroom. I had a room of my own and I was clearly aware of flying over a field. I could feel the wind on my face. I could see the grass rushing beneath me. But at the same time, I had dual awareness of being in my bed and I was totally confused. The experience didn't last too long, probably just a few seconds. but that I would say was probably my first experience of what you would call an out-of-body experience. Also around age 14, and probably to do with those damn unexplained magazines, I found out about Ouija boards. I am rather ashamed to say I did muck around with Ouija boards a little bit when I was 14, 15 years old. Obviously now with a bit more wisdom, I know that that was a pretty stupid thing to do, and I certainly wouldn't do it again. The experience, my very last time I used a Ouija board was probably around about 14 or 15 years old, and it was quite a frightening experience. My parents had gone out for the day, and I was at home with my brother, and he was quite young. He was probably about, I don't know, 12, something like that. So we'd set up the letters on the kitchen table. I had a glass, usual sort of stuff. We didn't have a proper board, just sort of made our own one up. And we just sort of started the, is anyone there sort of stuff that you do. And all of a sudden, I can still recall this so clearly now, and this is like 40 years ago. All of a sudden, the central heating pipes in the kitchen started banging really loudly, which they'd never done before. If that wasn't scary enough, at the same time, the TV in the room, we had a black and white TV in the kitchen at the time. It completely lost its picture and started going all static. I'll tell you, I'm telling this now, the hair's going back up on the back of my neck. Me and my brother ran out of the house. We were so scared. So we're now outside looking in through the kitchen window and obviously the glass and stuff is still on the table. And it took quite a while, I would say, for 20 minutes before we had the courage to go back in. And that was the very last time that I ever did a Ouija board. So I wouldn't recommend mucking around with Ouija boards at all. Anyway, going back to out-of-body experiences and lucid dreaming, the only other things that happen around about age 14, 15, I used to get a fair bit of sleep paralysis, which I know lots of people have experienced. And for those of you who haven't experienced it, it's not particularly pleasant. It's where you wake up and you are completely aware that you're conscious, but you're unable to move a single muscle of your body. It is really a really, really weird, weird experience. I used to get a fair bit of that, but nothing else. I mean, thankfully, I think I kind of grew out of that phase. But I now know that if I was ever to experience that again, and for anyone that does experience it regularly, I can tell you now you are a gnatic away from experiencing an out-of-body experience. All you need to do is basically instigate a projection technique, and you are almost certain to have a full blown out-of-body experience. Okay, so that takes me up to about age 14. So as I say, experimenting with meditation mainly, trying to do a little bit of out-of-body stuff. But at that point, there's no internet. There's just hardly any resources to call on to know what on earth I was doing. So I didn't have an awful lot of success until probably around about 1996. So I was around about 30 years old, just getting on with my life, still a deep interest in the paranormal. But at this stage, you know, just nothing happened until I purchased a lucid dreaming mask. well so this which was really interesting they don't make these anymore Nick it was made by the Lucidity Institute it was called the Nova Dreamer I remember it cost a flipping lot of money I don't know how my wife managed to agree to me buying it but I was super excited when it came it came with a course that you had to do so basically for those of you that want to experience lucid dreaming There's some really great resources on the internet now, but what you're doing is reprogramming your subconscious to recognize dream signs as you're dreaming. And then once you realize that you've seen a dream sign, it's a trigger for you to become fully conscious while you're dreaming. It's got to be really to believe this. You've got to experience it. Imagine looking around the room as you are now listening to this podcast and everything's clear, you're fully conscious. Lucid dream is exactly like that. You are completely, completely aware of your surroundings in full 3D color smell. It is indistinguishable from everyday reality. That's how real lucid dreams are. I've had dozens of lucid dreams now they're normally fairly short and to be honest normally when they happen I get so excited that I just tend to wake up or just end up drifting back into a dream again the device that I bought it was really interesting for those that are interested there's not many on the market like it now unfortunately there was rumours that they were going to bring out an up-to-date device but I don't think that's ever going to happen. It was clever. What happened was you used to wear the mask over your eyes at night time while you were sleeping, and it had some sensors in there, and the sensors were able to detect REM eye movements. And, of course, most people know that REM eye movements were associated with dreaming. So what would happen when the mask detected the eye movements? it would flash a red LED directly above your eye if your eyes are closed. Now, what happens is it's really clever. The red flashing light incorporates itself into your dream. I've had loads and loads of examples of this. For example, it could be in your dream you'll see a car and the lights on the car will start flashing red. There's hundreds of ways that it could make its way into your dream environment. and what you do is you train yourself to recognize that any sort of flashing light is an indication that you could potentially be dreaming and often that will trigger full lucidity. When you become lucid from a dream it comes on gradually at first and then very very quickly so you are sort of imagine you're quite rocky in your dream and then suddenly suddenly in the space of two or three seconds, you go from a normal dream to full-on waking consciousness in a dream. That's the power of lucid dreaming. It's really unbelievable and very, very interesting. So I have a dream journal. So I want to give some people some hints and tips on the best way to experience lucid dreaming based on my own results. I think the first thing I can recommend people to do is to try and record as many dreams as you can. At the peak of my lucid dreaming experiences, I was sometimes recording 10 dreams a night, sometimes a couple and sometimes none. But if I really focused on it, I could quite easily record six to 10 dreams a night. And when you get to that stage of dream recall, you're getting close to being in a good place to start a lucid dream. So what else can I tell you there about lucid dreaming? I've had some bizarre experiences in lucid dreams. I've had dream characters come up to me in a lucid dream, someone fully conscious. And I've said to the characters in the dream, do you realize that we are in a dream? And I've had the dream characters argue with me till they're blue in the face that it's completely impossible. and wondering I can recall I remember looking over to a tennis court and there were fish swimming inside the tennis court swimming around and I said to the dream characters and how do you explain that over there pointing towards the tennis court with the fish swimming around obviously clearly impossible even at that point a couple of them still were disbelieving but interestingly a couple of the dream characters did start to come around to my way of thinking You get some really strange things happen in lucid dreams. Okay, so from lucid dreaming, I started to then become really interested in out-of-body experiences. And there's some really fabulous resources now. I will send Nick some links at the end of this little chat. And I'll point in the direction of what I think are some of the best out-of-body training resources, particularly with the YouTube channels. My first really clear out-of-body experience happened in 1996, which was around about the time I started mucking around with this Lucid Dream device. I'm sure there's a link there. What happened here was I basically woke up early one morning and my ceiling in my bedroom had an Artex pattern on it. It's like a decorative sort of plaster finished. I remember waking up and two inches in front of my nose, I'm looking at the artex on my ceiling. And I haven't got a clue what is going on. In fact, I'm sorry, Nick, I did actually swear. I said, what the F is going on? And as I said that, I felt myself quickly receding back down towards my body with the ceiling obviously going back into the distance. I blacked out for about half a second and then sat up in bed for real with my heart racing, thinking of what on earth had just happened, knowing that that was almost certainly my first sort of genuine out-of-body experience. I've got a journal that I keep now, and I can recommend this one. It's called D-I-R-O, D-I-R-O, D-I-R-O. It's on iOS and Android. So really superb for recording any sort of dream experiences. So that comes with a high recommendation from me, really easy to search through the database as well. I was looking through my DiRO entries prior to check to Nick today, and I reckon I must have, I don't know, maybe 100 out-of-body experiences. They're mainly quite minor. When I say minor, I mean they last for just a few seconds, and they're always generally based in my bedroom. And I've got dozens and dozens of lucid dreams that I've also recorded in there. My third out-of-body experience happened after I was experimenting with some techniques by an author called Michael Rudaga. And again, I'll send Nick the link to this. And he's written a fabulous book called The Phase, which is packed full of really good techniques. I thoroughly, thoroughly recommend this one. I was trying some of the techniques from his book. And then I had a dream. And then from the dream, I suddenly became fully conscious outside of my house where I used to live. And this experience lasted for eight to 10 minutes. I was basically fully aware that I was out of body. the environment I was in wasn't exactly the same as the environment as it was in reality but I ended up doing some flying, feeling the wind on my face, crystal clear vision. The thing that makes me think this was a genuine OBE was when I ended the experience which I did consciously I thought I been out for quite a while now I ought to try and get back What happened was there was a tremendous rush of speed and I felt myself rejoining my body in the bedroom. And then I had that same feeling that I explained before where I blacked out for half a second And then I sat up in bed and I knew straight away that that was a significant event. And I straight away recorded it into my dream diary. So I've had many, many types of minor events. The secret to outer body practice is basically you want to skirt the fine line between sleep and awake. in fact the ideal state is what they call mind awake body asleep typically when we go to sleep I think most of us fall asleep really really quickly and we tend to do it the other way around so it's your body goes to sleep first and then your mind follows so we're trying to do it the other way around. Starting a business can be overwhelming you're juggling multiple roles, designer, marketer, logistics manager, all while bringing your vision to life. Shopify helps millions of business sell online. Build fast with templates and AI descriptions and photos, inventory and shipping. Sign up for your one euro per month trial and start selling today at shopify.nl. That's shopify.nl. It's time to see what you can accomplish with Shopify by your I know you want to listen to your podcast, so I'll keep it short. 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I understand that you want to listen to your podcast, so I'll keep it short. Because if you think it's important to make a lot of choices, can Acer maybe help? I hear you think, how then? For example, when you're selling the products that you love are, you want to know more about the insurance where a lot of damage is possible? Go to asr.nl slash duurzamekeuzes. This is ASR for you and a more expensive community. ASR does it. So, we can now listen to your podcast. Start selling today at Shopify.nl. That's Shopify.nl. It's time to see what you can accomplish with Shopify by your side. The resources I'll give to Nick at the end of the show tell you how to achieve this state. It's not particularly difficult. The best way to do it is when you are waking up. When you're waking up from a deep sleep, before you become fully conscious, you train yourself to basically remain absolutely motionless and then to immediately try an out-of-body technique. I will just mention one other significant out-of-body experience I had, which is an example of the method I've just explained to you. I woke up at five in the morning and deeply relaxed. And basically, I was absolutely motionless. I was conscious, but I hadn't fully awakened to the day. And I thought, worth a try for a technique here. So I tried what's called the rope technique, which is where you imagine a rope coming down from the ceiling. and then you imagine that you're lifting yourself up on the rope with your hands. I did this and I had an immediate, immediate feeling of upward movement. It was incredibly real. And in fact, it was so real that I was really confused. I thought at one stage I'd physically fallen out of the bed. So I basically felt myself rising up. My vision is very poor, but extremely powerful sense of movement. I slid off the bed. I could feel myself going down onto the carpet. I could feel the carpet under my body. I then looked down at where my legs might have been. I remember my vision is quite poor. But while I'm doing this, it's starting to become slightly clearer. And I could see these slightly bluish legs moving. and I'm thinking, oh my God, what on earth is going on here? And same with my arms. I could see my astral arms, if you want to call it as such. I kept the experience really short because for one, I was getting a little bit scared. And the recommendation normally is when you're a beginner to try and keep the experience as short as possible. And I did that. So I forced myself awake and it's a bit like coming out of a really deep dream but you know that it's more than a dream, that it was an actual experience. So that's an example of coming out of sleep, deep sleep, remaining absolutely motionless, and then instigating some sort of technique to separate from your body. I think this isn't for everyone. Out-of-body experience is, why do it? Well, for me, I'm naturally curious anyway. and I can say it has given me absolutely zero fear of dying and death because I know that there is more than physical reality that we survive beyond the body from what I've experienced. So that has really helped my fear of death and I genuinely believe that consciousness research is the next frontier for humanity. I listen to quite a lot of consciousness research podcasts there's some really good ones out there and there's some really fabulous explorers and researchers it's so so interesting and it's within the grasp of anyone listening to this podcast the techniques you can use are very very simple you've got to have a little bit of courage even if I just say to you just to suspend your disbelief for a little while William Buhlman, he always says in his lectures that you should try an out-of-body method for 28 days. Do it for 28 days on the trot, and then if nothing happens, then at least you can say you've given it a good try. But I'm absolutely sure with what I've experienced, and I'm nothing special, All I have had is an open mind, a willingness to maybe try something that maybe other people are a little bit afraid to do. Nothing bad's happened to me. It's super interesting. And I think that I just think it's a really interesting topic. So I'm just going to point you in the direction of some of the resources that I've sort of found really super useful over the last 40 years. There's three or four books I'm going to mention. Adventures Beyond the Body by William Buhlman. Absolutely fabulous. The Phase by Michael Rudaga. That's a free book, actually. That's a free download. One of your guests, Nick, on episode 188, Vincent Field, he was on your show. He's got a fantastic book called Astral Projection and Lucid Dreaming. That's really, really good. and there's a German guy who lives in England, a lovely guy called Jürgen Wiebe and he's written a book called Multidimensional Man and some of his experiences in there, oh my God, they are incredible. Talk about otherworldly places and other realities. He's extremely eloquent and a fabulous writer and documenting many, many of his unbelievable, incredible experiences. Jürgen, multidimensional man. I think the last one there just to mention would be my lucid dreaming book that I started off with was Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming by Stephen LaBerge. That's still out there and full of really good advice. A couple of YouTube channels. The very, very best YouTube channel on out-of-body practice and experiences. Unfortunately, isn't active at the moment, but he may come back. but his channel is still out there. It is brilliant. It's called Phase Evolution. Phase Evolution. I thoroughly recommend you pay a visit to that channel. It is packed full of instruction. It is excellent. And also William Bjorman has his own channel with some really good stuff as well. With meditation, I do think meditation is the key. I think had I not meditated, I'm not sure any of this would have been opened up to me. there's a couple of really good meditation resources they're both, one's free, it's called One Giant Mind it's basically it gets you meditating, it's really really good, that's a really good app iOS and Android and there's another really good meditation and sleep app called Balance which is superb, that's available on both platforms as well so the only other thing is the diary for recording all the experiences so also really really good Nick, that's my story. That's great, Adam. So many interesting, useful resources there. To our listeners, I will put the link to the website and you'll find all the resources Adam has mentioned tonight. You will find them there. Thank you, Nick. Thank you. You just couldn't find this stuff. The only place you could really find information like this was, like you said, from the Unexplained magazines. Oh, my goodness. There was nothing there. Even the local library had virtually no resources. It was, it was just, there was just nothing. It was, you had to struggle to find anything at all. I mean, now we're so rich with information, but back when I was 14, that was in 1980, there was just, there was nothing, nothing at all to help me. So I was really sort of stumbling around. I know. I used to remember from the local libraries, I used to go around all different libraries around my county and there would literally be two or three books and that would be it. You'd have to go to specialist bookshops or you'd have to order the book at the back of magazines like the 14th Times or Unexplained. And there was several other publications that you'd get. But yeah, the information just wasn't there. And these days, anything you want to learn. And the good thing about meditation, lucid dreaming, out-of-body experiences, it's something that you don't need to leave your bedroom to do. You don't need to leave your house. That's absolutely true. Yeah, it's something which is very easily explorable. I think in some ways, Nick, there's too much information now. You can almost be overwhelmed with the choice. What do I listen to? Is it this channel, that channel, this book? But I can honestly say the ones I've just mentioned, that is the cream of the cream for me. I've read an awful lot of books, listened to an awful lot of stuff, and they're great. You can just get started with those. I'm almost certain that anyone with a little bit of motivation who genuinely wants to experience this, you will be able to do it. You've just got to have a bit of courage and walk that fine line between wake and sleep. As I say, the best way to do it is what they call the indirect method. And that means as you're coming out of the sleep, that you attempt a technique. The direct method is more difficult, not really recommended by many. And that's where you lie down in your bed for the night to go to sleep and you try and have an out-of-body experience from direct waking to an experience. That's more difficult. Much, much easier to do it as you're coming out of sleep. I've been looking through my notes and virtually all my entries are indirect attempts. And that's where you'll get the most success. So basically, Adam has done the hard work for you. instead of going shifting through endless amount of books, you've basically selected the best ones, the best ones for results. Yeah, I'd be very interested to hear how people get on. I mean, there's quite a few online sort of Facebook groups now and things with people sharing experiences, and they're interesting to see. My dream, Nick, is to attend the Monroe Institute, which you may have heard of, I'm sure, in Virginia. That was the research institute set up by Robert Monroe who written three of the probably the most famous books about astral traveling out experiences Although I must say the books interesting as they are, have very little to do with methods and techniques, which is why I haven't mentioned them. But they have a six-day retreat in the US, which I'd love to go to one day. Actually, in fact, I've got one of his books right here. I was lucky enough that I had a guest on a while ago, and he was kind enough to send me one of Robert Monroe's books, which I read. So, yeah, that was Journeys Out of the Body. Yeah, that's his first one. Yeah, it's his seminal work, yeah. Nick, have you ever experienced anything like that before yourself? I have. I've mentioned it on a past episode where I did jump out the body. I wasn't attempting to do it by no means. I had been previously that year and the year before, but I was just in bed asleep. Right, right. Yeah. And it was during a time when I was suffering from sleep paralysis quite a lot actually over the first few, several years in fact since I was a kid. Yeah. But then the older I got the longer those periods actually stretched out. So when I had the out-of-body experience I was in bed asleep as far as I was aware. The next thing I remember I stood up next to my bed and I'm watching myself my wife sleeping. oh wow right i didn't have the more of a shock i didn't really have the urge to leave the bedroom i was just really watching myself sleep and it didn't feel like i was really there for long i didn't really have i didn't have to be honest i didn't really have much of a concept of time i don't think i don't remember seeing my body yeah it's interesting isn't it yeah all i remember is it's just my eyes that was all i was aware of i could look around yeah yeah i don't feel like i was physically turning you know turning my whole body so it's so interesting i say my my diary is full of near misses and minor minor events i mean i've got multiple multiple entries of me separating briefly from my body with partial or full consciousness sometimes lasting for a second sometimes for 30 seconds often i bail out because i get really scared not so much now i mean now i just think do you know what i've been trying to do this for so long i don't care what's going to happen just just go with the flow i do find that your your lives do tend to get in the way of making this a success i mean i'm busy at work family home all that sort of stuff and normally when i get to bed i'm totally naked and i just fall asleep really quickly so if i want to try and do something on the outer body sort of side it does take a fair bit of effort i have to make real conscious effort to do it and sometimes i can feel pretty tired the next day so i tend to focus on the job at the weekends really or astral projection at the weekends or on holiday and stuff i've got a bit more time really so but um lifelong interest and multiple multiple experiences i've had multiple nothing really stunning like some of your guests have to experience but i just know It's within my grasp to develop it further, which I'm determined to do. So I just hope it helps some of the people out there that think, oh, I'd love to do that. I'm not quite sure what to do. You just need to try it. Really, just give it 28 days. Really focus on it and use the methods on these resources. I'm sure you'll get success. You're bound to. You're bound to. That's all I think. Because I'm nothing special. I'm not a psychic or a sensitive nothing like that I'm just an ordinary bloke who sort of took a bit of a gamble on perhaps this might be right and yeah I found out pretty quickly it's definitely something to it yeah yeah I mean with those useful resources I mean just alone that app Diaro is that what you're called? Diaro fabulous for recording dreams fabulous yeah because how often do we go to sleep and there goes oh I write down my dreams in the morning But forget to put the paper there. Forget to put a pen. At least if it's on the phone, it's there then. And then you can just put it all in. Exactly. As soon as you wake up, put it straight in the app before you forget. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Really super, really super. Yeah, I'll just give you one more strange experience, Nick, that happened. I'd actually forgotten about this. It's just worth mentioning this. I went to Australia in 2004, I think. It was a long time ago. We hired this caravan for one night. It was on this caravan park. On our trip, we were traveling up to the Gold Coast. As soon as I walked in this caravan, I got a really horrible feeling. I couldn't put my finger on it. It felt heavy in the caravan, like a sick atmosphere. I didn't mention it to my wife. We were pretty knackered anyway because we'd been driving for ages. Later that night, we were all asleep. There was my wife, me, my son and daughter. And I had, it was really horrible. I'm sure it was some sort of psychic attack. I've no idea even what that is because I've never experienced anything like it before. But I woke up feeling that I was battling for my soul. It felt like a black entity was trying to force its way into my body. and I remember lying on the bed kind of semi-conscious forcing this thing with all my mental might off me and it was touch and go for a little while and then eventually, I don't know after how long, it was probably, I don't know, it was probably 30 seconds. It felt like ages. I woke up realising that something significant had happened And even now, that was 30 years ago, nearly, or whatever. And I can still recall it crystal clear, that feeling of a battle with something that was trying to hurt me. It was a bit weird. I forgot to mention that. How unusual. It was horrible. Yeah. But as soon as I walked in that caravan, I kind of didn't get a good feeling. And I'm not sensitive. But that happened later that night. And I've never had it happen again since. but it was pretty chilling. I couldn't wait to get out of there the next morning, I can tell you. Were you only there the one night? Yeah, thankfully. I think had it been more than one night, I would have changed the caravan anyway, to be honest, because I normally take up feelings with things like that. I think I'm not going to risk that again. Yeah, of course. I wonder how many people actually just had the one night in that caravan. I've no idea. It'd be nice to know, wouldn't it? Yeah, it certainly would be. And how strange, yeah. That's the last thing you need when you're at your most vulnerable. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was quite disconcerting. But thankfully, those things don't happen very often. So I'm still here to tell the tale. That's great. Lob Sam Rampa, I think actually he's he was from the south of England, I think. He was. He was a plumber. He was really controversial, but his books, I mean, even now, I haven't read them for donkey's years. There was some stuff in there that just rings true, even now with some of the advanced teachers that are out there, especially around his teachings with meditation and out-of-body practice. Some of his advice was fantastic. And that's all I had back then. I didn't have any other resources. so I was you know I studied some of his books You Forever was the one that was really good I seem to remember but it takes me back that's such a long time ago I was such a young lad experimenting on my own with no one having any idea what I was doing and I've never shared this story really with anyone but you know you're the first person I've told so and you certainly wouldn't be the only 14 year old that would be experimenting this kind of thing at that age I know I did and I'm sure a lot of our listeners would explore in those days. Yeah, yeah. I just want to finish on the note, actually, Nick. My daughter's also quite interested because of me in the paranormal. And I've shared some of the techniques I've told your listeners and yourself about with my daughter. And she's had some really close calls. And in fact, she started to get quite scared. So she kind of stopped because she was having some big success with out-of-body experiences. partial projections, partial separation. She was getting the vibrations, all the feelings that come prior to a separation. Several times she was getting those. So it just goes to illustrate that if you do stick with these methods, you will get results. You don't have to be psychic or special. I just think it's a natural law. I think if you do it and you're in the right phase of mind, it will happen for you. Absolutely, yeah. these things are accessible to anyone absolutely yeah yeah absolutely yeah and there's of course you know we've mentioned it before about all the benefits to do with meditation and and lucid dreaming oh yeah absolutely you know so number one the stress you know relieve your stress deal with the stress i know a lot of people out there deal you know large amounts of stress and so this can certainly benefit you oh for sure for sure yeah i highly recommend it i i wish i did more now but I'm so busy. It's a crap excuse, I know, but meditation is the key to so much. Hear it so many times for people on your show. They start meditating and it starts to open the door, start quieting your mind and then interesting things can happen. Time is the hardest thing. We all, you know, do long hours and we all have family and things we've got to take care of in normal life. Even if you're just starting on maybe 10 minutes on your lunch break, sat in your car on lunch break, just start off small and then just try and make time as you get it. As I say, that app, One Giant Mind, is really, really superb. I think it's a non-profit organisation, but it's super. They get you meditating, you know, 10 minutes a day, and it's lovely, really, really good. I really enjoyed that. It's a good way of forming a habit of meditation. That's it, yeah, it's habit, isn't it? Another interesting thing is the dream characters that you mentioned. Oh, my goodness, yeah, it's so crazy. lucid dreaming it's so bizarre the way that i was arguing with them and and i'm fully conscious knowing that it's a dream it's i've had that a few times it's really strange really strange sometimes a crowd of dream characters will gather around you and you're telling them it's a dream and a few are skeptical a couple might be interested it's really strange honestly have you experienced a lucid dream nick it's it's unbelievable I've certainly experienced lucid dreaming that's for sure it makes you wonder if they don't know they're in a dream it's a bit like the Matrix isn't it when you think about it it is yeah it makes you wonder if that is actually their reality honestly Nick sometimes I think I think it could be maybe some of the places we visit when we are unconscious and dreaming who's to say they're not different realities I mean some of the dreams I've had the guy that did the multidimensional man Jürgen Zeebe, some of his realities he's visited you couldn't make it up it's just incredible just incredible accounts it's certainly food for thought food for thought indeed, yeah absolutely yeah let us have those resources when you get a chance, even down to the apps actually, because people will benefit from this and they will be interested in this I know. Absolutely, I'll get those sent over to you and I just wanted to say once again thank you so much for letting me have a chat with you, your show is brilliant The way that you're just quiet and let people tell their story is wonderful. So many different accounts out there. And as I said at the beginning, if you can physically experience something yourself, take it from a belief to a known, it just opens up your reality, makes it so much wider. You think to yourself, my crikey, if I experience that myself, what else is out there that people are describing that could be just as real? It's incredible. consciousness is such a strange thing and we know so little but there is so much to explore and exploring can be done by ourselves you know with out-of-body experiences lucid dreaming you're exploring another level of consciousness it's wide open for you um you just got to have the courage and a bit of motivation just have the courage that's wonderful adam i hope that helps yeah thanks a lot adam i really appreciate you coming on sharing that for our listeners thank you goodbye goodbye take care adam that is all for today keep updated and connected with the show on twitter facebook and instagram and if you have an encounter that you'd like to share on the podcast you can email me at ufochronicles at gmail.com or you can reach out to me via the contact page on my website at ufochroniclespodcast.com a big thank you to adam for sharing tonight and thank you all for listening i will be back next week till then stay safe and keep watching the skies. Goodbye. Thank you. 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