1122: Fascist Mile High Club

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1:24

This is Brian Tyler Cohen, host of the no Lie podcast, which is part of Crooked Media. You've likely seen my videos online or watch me torture Tommy Vitor as part of our series on YouTube, but this week I've got a really exciting episode. I'm interviewing the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama. So if you want to tune in and hear what he's got to say, including a definitive answer as to whether or not aliens are real. And make sure to listen by searching for no Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.

2:24

What's up, Sydney? Welcome to Pause Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.

3:13

I'm Jon Lovett.

3:22

I'm Tommy Vitor.

3:24

I'm Dan Pfeiffer.

3:26

So this is the final stop on our hopefully just visiting tour. And in the week we've been gone from America, nothing has really happened that makes us want to go back. The president tried to arrest some members of Congress. The attorney General handled questions about Jeffrey Epstein by screaming about the stock market. The Health and Human Services secretary declared war on donuts. And even though the Department of Homeland Security is shut down, the secretary's deportation plane is reportedly still taking trips to Pound Town. We'll talk about.

3:29

It.

4:09

Sure is making a stop. We'll talk about some of these stories tonight, as well as Barack Obama's comments on whether aliens are real and how Democrats can win them over.

4:09

That's the secret plan to win the election.

4:22

Then we're going to stage our very own debate about which Democrat is the best choice to be the nominee in 2028. So, yeah, something to look forward to. What did you say?

4:25

Is that Newsom, Gavin Newsom's here. Stop. On his way back from Munich. Stop by here.

4:37

He doesn't miss a podcast.

4:45

Did somebody.

4:46

Did somebody say Newsom?

4:47

But we're going to start with the question that we keep getting asked everywhere we go on this trip, which is will Donald Trump try to steal the midterm elections? Yeah, the outlook isn't great. As we were boarding our flight the other day, Trump went on one of his insane rants about voter id. In this instance, it was about Democrats in Congress blocking the SAVE act, which would require all Americans to present either their passport or their birth certificate in person at an elections office in order to vote. Trump isn't thrilled that this law is having trouble passing. So he wrote, quote, I have searched the depths of legal arguments not yet articulated or vetted on this subject and will be presenting an irrefutable one in the very near future. There will be voter ID for the midterm elections, whether approved by Congress or not. That same day, Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem, whose department has no role in administering federal elections in America, nevertheless held an election security event in Arizona. And here's what she said when it.

4:49

Gets to election day, that we've been proactive to make sure that we have the right people voting, electing the right leaders to lead this country.

6:00

Can you offer us any good examples.

6:07

Of this kind of fraud in Arizona?

6:09

Oh, I'm sure there's many of them, but we want to make sure that we have.

6:11

Yeah, that's right. So Lovett, on one hand, really alarming. On the other hand, she really is stupid. So what do you think?

6:14

Yeah, I think alarming and stupid has sort of been our decade. So I think what's. She has no role in administering elections, as you pointed out. And we'll talk more about her other roles roles later. But what is clear is like, why is she doing this? It's not because she has some secret knowledge about their plan to steal the election. She's doing this because she thinks this is what Donald Trump wants to see her doing. This is a message event where she's trying to get headlines, doing the thing that she thinks is the kind of thing that Donald Trump wants a cabinet secretary to be doing. Everything about what she does is about how it's going to look. The, the image, her own profile, keeping herself in Trump's favor. So what's alarming to me about this is she's a clod and she's saying it in the most ham fisted way possible. She's going beyond, I think, what even a Trump administration official would normally say, but it's revealing because she's saying what she believes Trump wants to hear. And I think that's right. I don't think she's wrong about that.

6:24

Yeah, Tommy. As for the SAVE act, which has passed the House but doesn't currently have enough votes to pass the Senate, Republicans are now toying with the idea of either eliminating the filibuster or if they can't get the votes for that, forcing Democrats to do a talking filibuster where they have to physically stand on the Senate floor And keep speaking indefinitely if they want to block the bill. What do you make of that threat? And is that a good idea for Republicans?

7:26

So I genuinely find the focus on this confusing. I think what Republicans would say is it's a very popular piece of legislation. They say it's like an 8020 issue, which might be true. But I think if you asked voters a separate question which is like, okay, Republicans are going to blow up the US Senate and the way it functions. Here's a menu of things they could do it on behalf of. People would say stuff like, well, let's make some jobs or like fix the economy or make health care more affordable and more housing and not this. So moreover, like it's solving a fake problem. There is not an epidemic of non citizens voting. I don't know if you guys have heard this, but in America we can barely get our citizens to vote. I think like less.

7:55

Just a few minutes ago we said Barack Obama was trying to get aliens to vote. Now driving your tune.

8:37

Less than half the country turned out in the last midterm election. But this piece of legislation would create real hurdles for citizens to get registered. There's an organization called the Brennan center which is like nonpartisan voting rights activists. They said that like 21 million people could face added hardships because they didn't have easy access to the documents you would need to get registered. For example, like women who are recently married and having and change their names might have to go through a bunch of hurdles. So it could hurt Republicans as much as Democrats. And I know Dan is like dug into this, but regardless, if Republicans blow up the filibuster to pass the SAVE act and I think Democrats will almost certainly respond in kind. And that could mean when Democrats are in charge of passing universal mail in ballots federally across the country, same day registration. Hey, maybe we could take a page out of your book and do a little compulsory voting.

8:43

I know you guys like that taxpayer funded democracy sausages.

9:37

Democracy, yes, democracy sausage with bluey.

9:41

We can't. You couldn't even get compulsory measles vaccines anymore.

9:45

Well, baby steps. And then, you know, you could see Democrats passing other legislation that's not related to voting rights. So it seems. It's a strange choice to me.

9:49

Dan, how do you think Democrats should play it?

9:59

Well, I think it's just worth explaining what this bill actually does. Like to register to vote in the United States. You can do it with only two documents, your passport or your birth certificate. And if you got married and changed your name, your birth certificate does not work and so, as Tommy points out, it's just worth noting, I think this is actually an argument to make to Republicans because we do not want this to happen. Like, I could make a very compelling argument that this would actually help Democrats in the short term because our base is much more likely to be college educated and wealthy. One in four people who didn't go to college has a passport. One in five people who make less than $50,000 has a passport. Conservative women changed their name after getting married at twice the rate of liberal women.

10:01

It still sounded pretty good.

10:43

But we also like democracy. And this would be the greatest step backwards, I think, in recent memory for voting in America. The millions of people we disenfranchised by this and that would and the people most likely be disenfranchised, the people whose voices need to be heard most in the system. And so I think we have two, we have to try to stop this. I think it is very possible they will consider finding some way to jam this through because Trump wants it and they that they're it's word. It's worth noting most of these people are particularly stupid and they don't recognize how bad this would be for them in the short term. And they are fully convinced because they get all their news from all their information from Fox News that there is this epidemic of non citizen voting. All the studies show that it comes out to 0.0001% of attempted attempts. Not even people actually voted, but non citizens attempting to vote. All the studies show it's not a thing that happens. And so we have to make a private argument because we don't want this to happen. But the public argument I think is really important because we want them to feel internal pressure to not do this. I'm going to feel external pressure about what would happen if they do do it. And I think the argument we want to make is that Donald Trump and Republicans want to pass this law because they want to make it harder for you to vote, to take away your power, so that billionaires, corporations, politically connected cronies, elites, the Epstein class, are the ones who get to call the shots in our government, not you. Right. I think we need to take this and put it into the context of our larger narrative about how Trump is helping elites, he's exploiting a broken system, how he's corrupt, instead of trying to make just a pure what's good for democracy argument. Because that has not worked out so well for us in recent years.

10:46

It's crazy because we are nine months from the midterm elections and the states administer federal elections. This thing passes just the amount of money and manpower it would take for every state to set up a verification system to like make sure they're verifying people's passports and birth certificates. Half the country doesn't have passports. And you think the State Department, after they've cut as much of the State Department as they have, is going to start processing passports this quickly?

12:26

They will for red states, yeah.

12:56

Well, that's what's so nefarious about this, is you have now taken the thing you need to vote is something the federal government controls whether you get or not.

12:57

Yeah, but I don't. Even if, even if they make it for red states, I think that the argument that red states are going to be hurt by this and Trump voters are going to be hurt by this is a good one to make because it's true. Like they are, like they do this, they're going to disenfranchise a whole bunch of their own voters.

13:04

But everything will be a disaster.

13:17

Just will.

13:19

Well, this is to register to vote, right? So there's a question about what happens if you are already registered, but online voter registration gone. Mail in voter registration definitely gone. Automatic voter registration gone to vote. Right now under this bill, the only way to feasibly register to vote is to walk into an elections office bearing your passport or your birth certificate, which I'm sure you all have in your home. Right. Like, it's crazy.

13:20

Ridiculous. So speaking of Kristi Noem, we need to talk about the incredible Wall Street Journal story that shed some light on the long rumored extramarital affair between the Homeland Security secretary and her most powerful advisor, former Trump campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski. So these two lovebirds have apparently been flying around on a taxpayer funded deportation plane with a private fuck cabin in the back. That's what's going on there. They've also been using the department's massive budget to not only terrorize communities, but advance Noem's presidential ambitions. And they've been firing any government officials who stand in their way, including apparently a Coast Guard pilot who committed the sin of accidentally leaving gnomes blankie in the plane. But then they had to hire him back because they had no other way to get home. Which tells you everything.

13:44

You can't fire the fucking pilot before you fly home.

14:44

Get another fucking blanket. Also. Well, yeah, you're spending this much money on the plane and the cabin in the back. Have an extra blanket. Favorite anecdotes in this piece, guys. Anyone wanna start? Tommy?

14:51

So just two Quick things about these individuals. So Kristi Noem, you guys have probably heard that she bragged about murdering her dog. You know that part. When she was governor of South Dakota, she, she also GreenLit an antidrug PSA with the tagline meth comma, we're on it. So that's the intellectual firepower on that part of the relationship. The other half of the tryst is a guy named Corey Lewandowski, who was Donald Trump's first campaign manager, who got busted lying about something in the media and had to testify in front of Congress about it. And he said, quote, I have no obligation to be honest with the media. That was a quote to Congress. So these are the people we're talking about. My favorite part of the story is about this guy, Corey Lewandowski, who desperately wants a gun and a badge because he is a five year old and he wants to be a sheriff for Halloween, apparently. And he is so hell bent on getting this gun and badge issued to him by DHS that he has fired or pushed out people at the department that tell him he's not allowed to do it. And the reason this is so surprising that he would care so deeply is he was arrested in 1999 for bringing a gun to his office, which was Congress, and he said he forgot that it was in his laundry bag.

15:06

Fucking idiot.

16:30

Also, he didn't get well, also, this is also my favorite anecdote. He used the auto pen to sign the permit to get the gun, then he did not actually get the gun. People realized that maybe that was not a good idea. But he's been spotted wearing the badge around town.

16:31

Yeah, he still got the badge.

16:46

He wears the badge in the bedroom, in the bed, in the back.

16:51

I don't want to think about the roles they're playing. Cops and robbers. Yeah, like the thing that, like the desire that she seems to have to want to run for president and the fact that she is truly, like, she just isn't bright, like, she's just not capable of putting together the pieces. Like, to me, when I read the piece, what you take away from it is this is somebody that is trying to like, gain like total control over this department, but does not have the intellect, skills, capability of actually administering it. So it's creating problems all around her. And those problems are embarrassing both to her personally and to the President. And so she can only react by trying to fire people hastily pull together conferences where she's standing in front of like pallets of supplies or like flying around the country trying to do press conferences to impress Donald Trump. But like every. Everything she touches seems to turn to shit.

16:55

She's got. She's overseeing a budget that is now the size of the Israeli militaries because they got all this ice, got all this funding. She is, according to this piece, using the budget, or trying to use the budget to run million, hundreds of millions of dollars worth of ads to burnish her reputation. They were trying to use all the deportations and make sure that they film all the deportations. Like all the cruel, awful, like, deportation porn that the DHS is putting out on social media. This was like, originally conceived to help Kristi Noem's presidential ambitions. And then when they realized that this actually wasn't helping that much because they killed two Americans, then she decided to pivot to fema, to the Federal Emergency Management association and pay attention to that. And so she started going to, like, even though she didn't care about that at first, she started going to all these press conferences, although she told everyone when the winter storm was coming. Don't say the word ICE about the winter storm because you don't want to confuse it. That is an ICE agency, because that's not really popular right now. So that's what's going on at DHS right now, which is now shut down temporarily, I guess, because they, they don't want to accede to the Democrats demands for ICE agents taking off their masks and following the law and the Constitution and making sure that they try to get a warrant before they break into people's homes.

17:53

So their, their red line in negotiation is having warrants from judges, which is a problem because that's also a red line in the Constitution. So they're on the wrong side of a very bright red line. There's also a moment where, and I didn't, I forgot that this had happened where it was after the killing of Alex Preddy. They're at a Cabinet meeting, and in those meetings where Trump goes from person to person, getting them to praise him, he skipped over Christine Ohm in the meeting, which is basically like getting a kiss on the cheek from fucking Al Capone.

19:14

You know, he's still got a job he hasn't fired yet.

19:46

Well, it's just worth honing in on just how fucking banana it is that he gave her this job to begin with. His number one priority is immigration. This is one of the most powerful, biggest agents in the world. He picks someone who has no experience in immigration. She's the governor of South Dakota. I spent a lot of time in South Dakota politics. The Only immigration in South Dakota you worry about is people sneaking across the Minnesota border. It is the South Dakota budget. The DHS budget is nine times larger than the state of South Dakota's budget, and the DHS workforce is 20 times larger than the South Dakota state employees. Wow. Like, she's so in over her head over this. And he only gave it to her because his former campaign manager, who is her alleged boyfriend and wants to be her alleged campaign manager. She runs for president, convinced him to do so.

19:49

First dude.

20:32

First dude.

20:33

Yeah, I just think.

20:34

I think he's second dude.

20:35

And I think he knows that Stephen Miller is really in charge of the Department of Homeland Security. And I think that Stephen Miller. I know, and I think Miller probably likes the fact that he's got a dummy running DHS that will do whatever he says, and he wouldn't want someone that was, like, pushing back and being competent and trying to run the thing.

20:37

Yeah. The core mistake is she was so focused on getting attention and getting press that she is the one that was driving the sensationalist coverage. The. The big, glossy fucking raids, the helicopters. She's the one that goes down to seek out stands there with a gold Rolex on her wrist. She's the one that wants Bavino. And all of that has, like, come back on them so terribly. So she's just tarred from this. But she's not the one deciding how many people they're trying to deport. That is the administration's policy. She's not doing good PR for them. But Stephen Miller is the reason they have a mass deportation policy. And they can gussy it up. You could see swap out Bavino for Tom Homan. If you're trying to deport millions of people, you're going to be deporting people that are just here to do work and do jobs. There's no. There's not enough criminals in the world for them to round up. And so, like, they'll. They'll put like a. You know, they'll try to kind of have her be the fall person for this, but they're doing what the. The. The White House wants them to be doing. Glad to have someone look terrible while.

20:53

Doing it for them. Yeah. All right. We will be back with more news right after this. This episode of Pod Save America is brought to you by Graza. Everyone knows I love to cook for my friends.

21:57

That's all that is. You know what?

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Come on.

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Less.

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Less, but not that many times.

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It doesn't matter how many years.

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Never once, never will cook for once. You've never heated anything up for me.

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Never cook for my wife.

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You handed me a diet.

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I guess I've cooked for my children, but that's about it.

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Well, I cook with Graza all the time. I use it all the time. I use the sizzle, I use the frizzle, I use the drizzle, and it's great. I used it yesterday. I made a Caesar salad from scratch. That's true. I haven't. That's right, too. Maybe mine's worse.

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People are getting pretty crazy with that. I made a Caesar from scratch with Grazza last night, and it was fucking great. Like, I was like, this is really good. I did a really good job.

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I like the drizzle for dipping bread. Love dipping bread in some olive oil. It's a great olive oil to use. And here's a personal endorsement. Lovett's always hosting dinner parties. I am, and I think quality olive oil is pretty essential to his kitchen.

23:37

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24:11

This is Brian Tyler Cohen, host of the no Lie podcast, which is part of Crooked Media. You've likely seen my videos online or watched me torture Tommy Vitor as part of our series on YouTube, but this week, I've got a really exciting episode. I'm interviewing the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama. So if you want to tune in and hear what he's got to say, including a definitive answer as to whether or not aliens are real, make sure to listen by searching for no Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

25:12

Australia and America. Separated by an ocean, but bound by history. We both rejected the British crown, some of us more than others. And we rid ourselves of their fussy, uptight accents, instead choosing to let our vowels do whatever. In many ways, we both take pride in being wild countries with larger than life people and political mayhem to match. Which is why it's time for a game we're calling Ar Gnar. What a shitshar. American and Australian political controversies and scandals. Okay, here's how it's gonna work. I'm gonna come out there. I have questions for all of you about American mayhem. I have questions for my best boys about Australian political mayhem. And we will see who knows each other's countries better. Okay, everybody ready?

25:43

All right, to be clear, we are learning the name of this game, the substance of it, all of this.

26:36

For the first time, they truly have no idea what these questions are. They are learning this in genuinely. It has been kept from them all day. Okay, all right. Who would like to answer a question for Australia? I would like. No expats, please. I better hear the fucking accent. I came a long way. All right. Your hand went up. I'm coming all the way up.

26:40

Here we go.

26:58

Hi. What's your name? Who raised their hand? Oh, hi. What's your name? Olivia. Olivia. Where are you from?

26:59

Sydney.

27:04

Cool. All right. In 1979, U.S. president Jimmy Carter was vacationing near his home in Plains, Georgia, when he used a canoe paddle to defend himself against an attacker who had managed to penetrate his Secret Service perimeter. Who was that attacker? Was it A, a crazed member of the infamous Manson family, B, a swamp rabbit, C, a right wing militiaman from a nearby compound, Or D, a white tailed American deer? Okay, okay. So.

27:05

Uh huh. Always go with me.

27:42

Wow. So you're saying be a swamp rabbit? That's correct. It was a swamp rabbit. In what became known as the quote, killer rabbit attack, said one Carter Stafford to the Times, the President was swinging for his life. Here is a piece that ran about the incident in the Washington Post, illustrated with a parody poster for paws. Now here's something interesting. Only one photo of the incident exists. The Carter White House refused to release it. But when Ronald Reagan took office, his administration released the rabbit files, which show here Jimmy Carter splashing over there on the right is the rabbit. Only one photo exists of him trying to keep the rabbit at bay. All right, now. Bad bunny. Bad bunny.

27:44

Nice.

28:40

All right, John. Dan. Tommy. The Harold Holt Memorial Swimming center is a pool in Melbourne, Australia. It is named in honor of Prime Minister Harold Holt after he unexpectedly passed in 1967. How did he die? Was he A, bitten by the deadly Sydney funnel web spider while on a bushwalk? Was B, a heart attack while traveling from Canberra to Tasmania? Was it C, drowned while swimming in rough surf off Cheviot beach in Victoria? Or D, stung by the Irukandji jellyfish inadvertently added to marine aquarium at the opening of the since demolished Manly Sea Life Sanctuary? C. It is C. Yeah. You people named a swimming pool after a prime minister who drowned?

28:43

That's awesome.

29:45

Follow up. There has long been a conspiracy theory that Harold Holt did not die in the water that day. What is the most prominent alternate theory? Is it A, he was abducted by aliens? B, he faked his own death to start a new life in America? C, he actually died in a motel with a prostitute? Or D, he was grabbed by the Chinese? C, C, C, C. No, it's D. The Chinese got him. The Chinese got him. The theory is that he was in fact a Chinese spy who escaped Australia on a Chinese submarine. How many people here believe that? Wow. A lot of hands.

29:49

That's why? You need Aukus.

30:27

That's why you need aukus. You gotta defend yourselves. You don't want those French diesel submarines. Now, his widow, Zara Holt, had to refute this allegation. What did she say to deny that her husband was a Chinese spy? That's. Someone called it out. She scoffed and said her husband didn't even like Chinese food. All right, let's come up here. Who here would like to answer a question?

30:29

Hi.

31:04

What's your name?

31:04

Margaret.

31:06

Margaret, That's. That's a thick. Where are you from? I'll give you the accent. Where are you from? I'm from Bexley North. How far is that from here? That's half an hour's drive. Because my. My understanding is the further you get from here, the thicker the accent. Is that about right? Okay. Depends which direction, I guess. Out to sea, it gets less. In 1992, President George H.W. bush attended a state dinner hosted by the Japanese Prime Minister. What went wrong, do you know? I'll give you the. I can give you clues. Was it, A, he fell asleep during the Prime Minister's toast? Was it, B, he accidentally insulted the emperor? Was it, C, he tried to open a ceremonial urn that was 3,000 years old, cracking it in several places? Or D, did he vomit into the Prime Minister's lap and faint? What do you think? He vomited into the Prime Minister's lap and fainted? That's correct.

31:07

Nailed it.

32:01

Yep. George Bush had a chunder. How's that? Okay.

32:04

That picture is so bad.

32:11

It really is. What is Barbara doing? Barbara? I'll tell you what Barbara Bush is doing. She's being a first lady because she did not care if he lived or died. She was going to hide his face.

32:13

She looks like you're trying to snuff him out.

32:24

Yeah, she really. She doesn't. It's. She jumped. If you watch the video, everybody, she jumps in. She jumps in like. She dives. Like in front of a bullet. For. For George. Well, in a sense.

32:26

But that's cool.

32:37

It's cool.

32:38

Wow.

32:39

All right, John, Dan. Tommy. Former Australian Prime Minister Bob Hawke held a Guinness World Record before entering politics. What was it for? Was it, A, most sausages eaten at a cricket match? B, longest continuous speech on the floor of Parliament? C, fastest consumption of a yard of beer, or D, longest distance swum in open water, not including Holt? What do you think, Dan?

32:40

What do you think speech?

33:14

I have no clue.

33:18

Don't look at me.

33:19

You're gonna weigh in here, John.

33:21

Hey, stop helping them. Look how handsome they are. They've earned everything. So blessed. What do you think?

33:25

Can you give us the pounding?

33:31

Beer?

33:33

That's correct.

33:34

I'm gonna say. All right, good.

33:34

The fastest consumption.

33:36

Thank you for the help.

33:37

Thank you for the fastest consumption of a yard of ale. 2.5 pints he took. Did it in about 11 seconds, a record he set while studying in Oxford. Hawk later said this feat was to endear me to some of my fellow Australians more than anything else I ever achieved. Here we have a video of him later.

33:38

That's amazing.

34:06

He gets. Look at that. Look at that. Gets that whole thing down. Look at this guy. There's a torso.

34:08

American politicians take note.

34:23

I don't really follow up.

34:25

All right. Future Prime Minister Paul Keating was Hawk's treasurer. He recalled arriving for a meeting with the PM in a full suit, sweating to find Hawk. In what condition? How did they find him? It was a hot summer day.

34:27

Passed out.

34:43

Nope.

34:43

Naked.

34:44

Naked, Yep. Naked by the pool. He was naked for their meeting.

34:44

I feel like that one probably feels less endearing over time, right?

34:52

Speaking of seeing members in unexpected places, who in the audience would like to go next? I'll come up there. Someone raise your hand. Someone raise their hand coming over here.

34:58

Okay.

35:08

Hi.

35:09

Hi.

35:10

What's your name?

35:10

Elizabeth.

35:12

Elizabeth. In 2007, Republican Senator Larry Craig of Idaho was arrested for lewd conduct in a men's bathroom at the Minneapolis St. Paul International Airport. Accused of soliciting sexual. From an undercover officer in the next stall. He pleaded guilty to disorderly conduct, then tried to withdraw the plea. What was his public defense? Was it, A, he was reaching under the stall divider to pick up a fallen piece of paper, he was tapping his foot, B, to the music on his headphones, C, he just has a wide stance? Or D, he thought the person in the next stall was having a medical emergency? No, no, you got it wrong. It was C, he had a wide stance.

35:13

Wide stance.

36:07

Here he is at the press conferences with his poor, sad wife. Oh, do you guys remember that?

36:07

Yeah.

36:15

Oh, yeah.

36:15

You. That didn't make it to Australia. Do you guys know about this?

36:16

Wow.

36:20

It was bleak.

36:20

It was pretty. It was pretty. There had been a reporter that had been traveling around trying to find evidence that Larry Craig had done this at other places throughout D.C. did he get off? I'm not sure. I mean, not that day. Follow up, what happened after he announced his intention to resign? He just didn't. He just never left. Just stayed till the end of his term. All right. For John, Dan, and Tommy on the 30th of November of 2022, the Australian House voted to censure former Prime Minister Scott Morrison. Why? They don't boo. Why was he censured? A, for secretly holding multiple ministerial positions while serving as Prime Minister, B, for his handling of the Aukus submarine deal with the United States, C, for his missteps during the COVID vaccine rollout, or D, for vacationing in Hawaii during the country's catastrophic bushfires?

36:21

All of them.

37:27

I thought it was for shitting his pants in McDonald's. Drive thru.

37:28

There it is.

37:32

There it is. We thought it was for shitting his pants at the McDonald's. What do you think?

37:33

Was it all of them?

37:39

It was actually. It could have been. It could have been, but it wasn't. Technically. They're, they're. They're all true. But only one was the reason he was censured.

37:40

Oh, Hawaii.

37:51

No, it actually wasn't. It was for secretly holding multiple ministerial positions. How many extra jobs did he secretly have? It was five. It's like Marco Rubio, Health Minister, the Finance Minister, the Resources Minister, the Home Affairs Minister and the Treasurer. Now I have a question for the crowd. Okay. You censured Scott Morrison. Why did your Governor General not get any fucking shit for secretly signing off on this? Why do you never come for the King's representative? Why didn't you? Where's the censure for that guy?

37:53

He's been on this the whole trip.

38:38

He hates this Governor General.

38:39

I hate this Governor General thing. You're a proud people here in Australia. Get rid of the fucking crown. It's outrageous. This is one of the greatest cities in the fucking world. Look what you're building all around you. You still check with the King to make sure it's okay?

38:40

Okay, okay.

39:00

Some think thick inbred freak in London. Finish your revolution, please.

39:01

Hey.

39:12

Hey.

39:13

Donald Trump's our President, you know.

39:13

Yeah, I know. It makes me so sad. Alright, follow up, John Dantami. Scott Morrison did face a massive scandal for vacationing during the Black Summer bushfires. And that killed 33 people directly, hundreds more indirectly as a result of smoke. What were some of the criticisms he faced? A, his office did not notify the public who was acting Prime Minister. B, his office initially denied he was on holiday in Hawaii. C, for saying, thankfully, we've had no loss of life while visiting Kangaroo island where two people had died, or D, for saying before he'd even made it back to Australia from his trip, quote, I don't hold a hose, mate, and I don't sit in a Control room.

39:17

This feels like an all of the above situation.

39:56

All the above.

39:58

You got it?

39:58

Yeah.

39:59

All right.

40:00

Who over here? Who wants to answer a question about America? You're pointing at people. All right, you. Where's that Australian confidence? All right. Hi. What's your name? Rachel. Rachel. Texas Republican. Where are you from? Kangaroo Valley. You guys have a local cheer?

40:01

Yeah.

40:23

Where is. How far is that from here? Like two hours if you go fast.

40:23

By kangaroo.

40:34

By kangaroo. There's Americans, you know, we really kind of. The kangaroo looms large in the child's mind for an American. And I think every American child becomes an adult when we find out that the pouches are gross. What do you think about that? Yeah, they're gross. We know more about wombats. We actually don't have any. Angry. Do you know that wombats poop are cubes?

40:35

Yeah, of course. Yeah.

40:59

Cool. They don't know why. No one knows why it's a cube. That woman thinks she knows, all right? She doesn't know. She's a fucking liar. All right? Texas Republican Ted Cruz faced his own vacation scandal for flying to Cancun during Winter Storm Yuri, which knocked out power for millions of Texans and killed an estimated 246 people. He initially blamed his daughters, saying he was chaperoning them on a trip they'd asked for, but that was later shown to be false. How was it proven to be false? Was it, A, his daughters did an Instagram live to refute the allegation? Was it B, their neighbors leaked the group chat? Was it, C, he actually forgot his daughters at home home alone style? Or D, Ted Cruz emailed the proposed itinerary to Jeffrey Epstein. That's incorrect. It was the group chat.

41:01

Yeah, it's always the group chat.

41:53

It's always the group chat. The leak group chat showed that Heidi Cruz had organized the trip, inviting others to join them at the Ritz. When asked about the leak text, Ted Cruz called his neighbors. All right. John, Dan, Tommy, Johnny. Oh, there he is. There's Ted. There is Ted.

41:55

Nice mask.

42:13

Nice mask. Johnny Depp and his then wife, Amber Heard, brought their two Yorkshire terrors into Australia without a quarantine declaration. Agriculture Minister Barnaby Joyce issued a public threat. What was that threat? Was it, a, a $100,000 fine per dog? B, Depp had to film a public apology video or face prosecution? C, leave or I kill the dogs? Or D, Depp was banned from entering Australia for five years. What do you think? What? Did Barnaby Joyce threaten Johnny Depp pre cancellation? Johnny Depp, giant spider I remember this.

42:13

Because there was like helicopter footage of the house where they were staying. It was like a big deal.

42:57

It was a big deal. It was a big deal.

43:01

Those Yorkies, you think it's the jail or the bail? Kill the dogs.

43:03

Correct.

43:07

Wow. Good job.

43:08

The dogs would be euthanized within 72 hours if Depp didn't take them out of the country. Mr. Depp has to either take his dogs back to California or we're going to have to euthanize them. The dogs were flown out. Depp later insulted Joyce by saying he looked like he was inbred with what vegetable. You guys remember?

43:10

Shout it.

43:32

Tomato. Look at him. I think we read in that.

43:34

It's fair.

43:38

I think we read in that artificially.

43:38

Is that wrong?

43:40

Point to Johnny Depp on that one.

43:41

Yeah, Johnny Depp.

43:43

Got him.

43:44

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44:27

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45:12

America Our cars are as generous as our asses and our roads, like our hearts, are enormous and clogged. According to a recent study in an American medical journal that somehow is still operating in both the US and Australia, we now get more than half of our calories from ultra processed foods. Now, it wasn't that long ago that Michelle Obama led a campaign to encourage Americans to eat healthier foods to get more exercise. At the time, Republicans said you could pry the cheese doodles from their cold, dead, weak, bloated hands. But all that has changed because now we're making America healthy again, as only the Trump administration knows how, by fucking it up completely. And so it's time for. Ok, stop. We'll start with a man, a donut, and a surprise special appearance by an infamous athlete. Mmm.

46:35

What do you think he doing?

47:32

Processed food kills. Remember that? Okay, stop.

47:36

That is what is happening in America.

47:42

War on donuts.

47:45

He looks so genuinely pissed. Like that slap does not seem like a stage slap. Do you know who Mike Tyson is? He's the scariest motherfucker to walk this planet in whenever it was that he was at his prime and not not.

47:46

One of our most upstanding Americans.

48:01

No, no.

48:02

Yeah. I mean, I guess when he. Technically, Evander Holyfield's ear is not processed.

48:03

No, that's true. That is true.

48:09

Yes. That's farm to table, baby.

48:10

There's no joy in that look he's giving us right now.

48:15

Well, he fucking hates donuts.

48:17

He hates donuts. It is just wild that they have declared war on donuts, because can you imagine if. Well, Michelle Obama tried to tell people to eat healthy and she was roundly criticized by the Republican Party.

48:19

Yeah. Imagine the outcry if some bisexual female soccer player did a press conference and knocked a donut out of AOC's hand and said, we're not eating these anymore. It would just lead Fox News for the rest of our fucking lives.

48:32

Lives. Yeah.

48:46

Yeah.

48:47

This just came and went one day. People barely. Barely registered.

48:48

It was on the Super Bowl.

48:51

Well, the.

48:52

The.

48:53

Yeah, the other one was.

48:53

Yeah.

48:54

Also.

48:55

If you're.

48:57

Let's say you're just taking this generous, like, you're just taking this at face value. Like what? You don't know if you're like, who is being persuaded to not eat a donut by this advertisement?

48:58

No one.

49:09

Like, fear of physical violence.

49:10

A man will come to your house.

49:13

Next up, milk, you know, from cows. Trump can tell you all about it, specifically whole milk, and we'll let him explain. I open a refrigerator, say, milk with rice and milk with water and milk with everything.

49:16

And I say, what kind of milk is it?

49:29

That's what I like right there. It's actually a legal definition.

49:31

Whole milk, and it's whole with a W. For those of you that have.

49:34

A problem, most of the media will get that.

49:39

Okay, stop.

49:42

What is the problem? What problem would they have with the milk with an H with the W?

49:43

I think this is the first time he discovered that. I genuinely believe that. Yes.

49:51

I think today was the day he learned that whole, meaning the entirety of the item is not the same as whole in the ground.

49:55

Yeah.

50:01

Also, he opens the fridge and sees milk, and he doesn't think that would go well with a delicious cookie or some cereal.

50:03

He thinks it pairs with rice.

50:09

No, no.

50:11

What I think is he is just discovering alternative milks, and he doesn't know what they are. So it's like oat milk, almond milk.

50:11

Soy milk, milk with rice.

50:18

Rice milk? Yeah. I think he thinks it's rice milk. Yeah. I just think he's confused. What? Yeah. Cause then he goes, because this is the one I like right here. And he points at the jug of milk that is off camera.

50:20

I, like, I realized while watching this video, like, Trump is so disconnected from normal life. Like, forget not driving a car or going to a supermarket. Does he open fridges? Like, does he know what happened? Like, does he ever. Like, maybe other than a drink fridge, like a compact drink fridge filled with Diet Coke.

50:32

No.

50:51

Someone brings him a Diet Coke, he presses a button.

50:51

He's not doing that himself.

50:53

So he doesn't open a fridge and look for food to eat.

50:54

He presses the Diet Coke button.

50:56

Right. So I don't think he's thinking. I think when he. I think he thinks in fridges is rice.

50:58

I also think he probably has not had milk in any form in 70 years.

51:04

Yeah, yeah.

51:09

That's like, no cereal, no glass of milk, no milk in your coffee. I don't think he drinks coffee. He.

51:10

He washes down the cookies with Diet Coke, for sure.

51:15

Yeah, I think that part's cool.

51:18

I mean, this also is worth. Is that this was the executive order to allow people to drink raw milk.

51:21

Right.

51:26

Which has cow shit in it, as far as I can tell.

51:27

Yeah. Just the natural selection will kick in, presumably at some point, drinking raw milk straight from the udder.

51:31

He's not drinking it, that's for sure.

51:39

Of course, with Trump, as always, best do as he says, but not as he does, because as RFK Jr has observed, he eats like there's no tomorrow.

51:41

Who has the most unhinged eating habits?

51:49

The president. He eats really bad food, which is.

51:53

McDonald's, and then, you know, candy and Diet Coke.

51:56

But he drinks the Diet Coke at all times. He has a constitution of a deity.

52:02

I don't know how he's alive.

52:07

If you travel with him, you get this idea that he's just pumping himself.

52:09

Poison all day long.

52:16

From your mouth to God's ears.

52:19

What I like about this, though, is, like, is there no part of this that causes RFK Jr to question his priors? Because there's Donald Trump in his late sense, 70s, UN. Like boundless energy, eating nothing but French fries and burnt ground beef all day, every day. Nothing but aspartame Diet Coke. And he's like, running a mile a minute around this guy. Meanwhile, RFK Jr never doesn't seem like he's on the verge of collapse, having nothing but, like, kimchi and raw milk.

52:23

Yeah, he ferments.

52:55

He. Kimchi.

52:57

Among other ferments.

52:59

Yes.

53:00

Just pumping himself full of poison all day long.

53:01

I mean, it's also just worth just mentioning, like, what this is all about. Right? Like this, the donut thing. RFK Jr here, the raw milk is the Make America Healthy Again movement, which has taken over large parts of our politics and is probably the fact that all of these wellness people ended up as Republicans is like a massive failure of the Democratic Party big time. Well, just like the person who is the primary, like the number one food influencer in America, this woman named Food Babe. That's her. She was sat behind RFK Jr. At his confirmation hearings. She was an Obama delegate in 2008, 2012.

53:04

Oh, wow.

53:42

And just we, even though like we have led on this stuff, we just like stopped talking to these people. And the.

53:43

We wouldn't give them raw milk.

53:49

We wouldn't. Well, the people like RFK Jr pushed him into the like, like, the algorithm will take you on a journey from.

53:51

Like healthy skepticism is where I think.

53:57

Yeah, it takes you there.

54:00

We want measles.

54:02

Well, it starts with like, how do I get like chemical free sunscreen for my kids? Or how do I, you know, how to feed my kids healthy? And the algorithm takes you. And then you're at vaccine skepticism, you're at raw milk, then you're supporting Donald Trump. And the thing that's crazy is like the, is that all of this, like eating, not eating processed foods, that's a good thing, right? Donuts are kind of delicious, but that's not the point. But is that doesn't do you any good if you have an administration that just lets chemical companies pollute your air and water.

54:02

Yeah. Like, as we've seen in a few, like, this is to me a good example too. Like, there was a long running failure of the establishment to address like legitimate concerns about the chemicals in our foods and the proliferation of processed foods. There were no consequences for switching to skim milk. Like, look, there's good reasons for people to not be drinking whole milk every fucking day. But like, we cut fat from all kinds of foods that America gained a trillion pounds. And like we're paying a huge price for it now. And this, now, like, this, there is real reason for people to be like, wait a second, why didn't we address some of these things? Why didn't we pull some of these chemicals out? Of course, these people are also going after like, what is a threat to our society. It's like, it's not an occasional donut. People should have a fucking, fucking measles. It's measles. It's measles.

54:33

But even on the, even on the chemicals in the food, they have done absolutely nothing on the regulatory.

55:26

They've made it worse.

55:31

They've made it worse.

55:32

And. And so it's all just about like.

55:33

You have a public service message from Mike Tyson telling you to get the.

55:35

Donut out of your mouth.

55:38

Right.

55:39

Well, it's just forever. Chemicals all the way down.

55:40

And you have the president not leading by example, which is cool.

55:43

And yes, who better to take health advice from than RFK Jr. A man who always looks, sounds and acts like he is the sole survivor of a cruise ship sinking and was just rescued from a life raft found on the open seas.

55:49

I'm not scared of a germ. You know, I used to snort cocaine off of toilet seats.

56:02

Okay, stop.

56:07

Again.

56:08

I just. I want to know the situation where he was snoring the cocaine off the toilet seats.

56:10

We're presuming he spilled cocaine on the toilet seat.

56:17

That was what I've been saying. I think that he spilled it. He spilled it on the toilet seats. Plural. And he was. Yeah, well, maybe it happened a couple times.

56:20

Or maybe he needed a flat surface in a club. In the club, the Studio 54.

56:26

So many other flat surfaces besides the toilet.

56:30

The floor, the tank. His keys.

56:32

I was gonna say maybe credit card.

56:35

Maybe he likes to cut his cocaine with butt.

56:36

Maybe there's something. There's something thrilling about it. Something dangerous and exciting about snorting cocaine off a toilet seat. Don't knock it till you try it, Dan. Sorry, what was that?

56:40

I didn't want.

56:53

Anyway, this is the person in charge of public health, a man who doesn't really worry about germs because of the places he used to do cocaine.

56:56

The donut will kill you, though.

57:07

Yeah, yeah, Watch out for the donut. Watch out for a little. A little sugar and frosting after, you know, a little treat at the end of the day. Go fuck yourself. And that's okay. Stop.

57:08

All right, so there's no shortage of Democratic leaders sounding off about what the party should be doing right now. Our old boss, Barack Obama, just sat down for an interview with our. With our good friend Brian Tyler Cohen, which is making waves mostly for this exchange.

57:25

Are aliens real?

57:44

They're real, but I haven't seen them. And they're not being kept in. What is it?

57:46

Area 51.

57:52

Area 51. There's no underground facility. Unless there's this enormous conspiracy and they hid it from the President of the United States.

57:52

What was the first question you wanted answered when you became president?

58:03

Where are the aliens?

58:09

Where are the aliens?

58:10

So. So for some reason that we can talk about, Obama, after this, took the rare step of clarifying what he meant there in A follow up post. I can't remember him ever doing this in a minute where he said that he was, quote, just trying to stick with the spirit of the speed round.

58:13

Which has always been a passion of his.

58:39

Yes. And all he meant was that statistically the universe is so vast that the odds are good there's life out there. But that, quote, I saw no evidence during my presidency that extraterrestrials had made contact with us, period. Really? Period. That should clear things up, I think. Tommy, you've been privy to more highly classified government secrets than the rest of us. What do you think's going on here? You buying his answer? Did someone get to him?

58:40

I'm wondering that too. I mean, I. Look, I don't want to disappoint the kind of X Files ancient alien stands out there.

59:13

That's what I expect you to say.

59:20

Yeah. Right.

59:22

Yeah.

59:22

Look, I do not think that Barack Obama was just sort of like casually confirming the existence of aliens in the 44th minute of a 47 minute YouTube interview in the speed round. Right. Like, I love Brian. He's like a actually dear friend of mine. I don't think Obama gave him the scoop of the century in the speed round of the interview. I think what he's referencing there is Lovett can get into this too. The Drake Equation. The universe is very large. There's a lot of stars. There's even more planets. Many of them may be habitable. You do a little math, dipsy doo. Probably some life out there. Maybe they're too far away to contact them. Maybe they came and went and we're all in different eras. We don't know now. Maybe I'm an unwitting tool of the deep state and the deep state.

59:23

Maybe you want us to think the.

1:00:12

Deep state is deeper than we ever could have imagined. But mostly what I learned in government is I believed less and less in conspiracy theories like this because people can't keep a secret and shit leaks constantly. And if they were. If Donald Trump knew that aliens existed, he would have monetized it by now. They were alien. Crypto coin.

1:00:13

Yeah.

1:00:35

They would never tell him.

1:00:36

There's three possibilities. There are aliens and they didn't tell Barack Obama. There are aliens and they didn't tell Barack Obama. Or there are aliens and they did tell Barack Obama, but they didn't tell Donald Trump.

1:00:38

Yeah. Donald Trump would not have been able to keep it secret.

1:00:53

Yeah, I actually, it wasn't until he put out the clarifying statement that I was convinced in my bones that there are aliens. And Barack Obama knows about them 100%. Of all the things to clarify, have you ever in a decade seen him clarify something like this?

1:00:57

I know exactly what happened here. He went from having an entire White House comms office to one guy who was like, I'm so sick of dealing with the incoming calls on this shit. Let's just get an Instagram up and like do it.

1:01:16

Spokesman for the Deep State, Tommy Vitor.

1:01:28

It was a fast clarification too. Yeah, we were like 24 hours out of that interview.

1:01:31

When I said yes, what I actually meant was I actually read something about Fermi's paradox. And.

1:01:35

Anyway, Obama also had some thoughts on the more earthly challenges that we're facing, particularly what the Democratic Party is facing. And he talked a lot about that in this interview.

1:01:44

At some point you age out. You're not connected directly to the immediate struggles that folks are going through. Democrats do well when we have candidates who are plugged into the moment, to the zeitgeist, to the times, and the particular struggles that folks are thinking about as they look towards the future rather than look backward toward the past. Voters are not going to agree with us 100% on everything. And so it is not a sellout. It's not a betrayal to say that we're going to shape our agenda and our message in a way that allows us to build a working majority to get stuff done. And I think particularly around social issues, sometimes we get confused around this. Our long term goals have to be driven by our values and our core beliefs and our ethics and our morals in the sense that every person counts. And short term, we got to win elections. They are doing such crazy stuff that it shouldn't be hard for our side to coalesce around the areas where we agree on and focus on that that is going to happen. If we are effective in winning the midterms, if we then have a robust primary for who's going to be the next Democratic president, we shouldn't be afraid of having a robust debate.

1:01:58

So, Dan, at the beginning there, he was talking about Democrats needing younger candidates. And he said he didn't have a hard and fast rule, but that perhaps the party should look to younger candidates.

1:03:33

Perhaps.

1:03:53

He was trying.

1:03:53

Yeah, he was trying to college during the Dust Bowl.

1:03:54

He was trying to be as polite as possible there, but that's what he was referencing. What did you think about his answer there?

1:03:57

Well, it's obviously true, right? I mean, there is. You can trace almost all of the problems the Democratic Party and frankly, the country have had over the last decade by the fact that the Democratic Party has been led by. By establishment politicians in their 70s. Right. It's just. And that comes in two forms. One, three forms, actually. The first one, Obama makes this really important point, which is the longer you've been in politics, the more detached you are from the everyday struggles of people. Obama used to tell us in 2008 that if he had lost that election, he would not really be able to run again four years later because he would have been so removed from. What gave him real power was that he and Michelle had just finished paying off their student loans at that point. It had only been a couple years earlier. They were struggling to make their mortgage. Like he knew what it was like to struggle. And if you've been in politics for 20, 30, 40, 50 years, you just don't know that. Right. Second, we say all the time that politics is downstream from culture, and that's kind of a trite saying, but it is true in that you need candidates who are connected to the cultural zeitgeist, who can understand, who can relate to people, who can communicate about things other than just policy issues that relate to people. Obama was great at that. Our last couple nominees have not been great at that. And then the third thing is you need someone, a younger person is inherently going to be better at communicating in the modern way, right? Someone who knows how to communicate. And how people communicate now right? To. They understand TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, they understand memes. They just can do it in a way that if you've been in politics for 30, 40 years, you cannot. Joe Biden did understand one single bit of how people communicated now, and that was a huge detriment. Now, I think there's one thing important here, which is young people are more likely to do those things. They're certainly more likely to be culturally connected, to be like, maybe even cool. But it's not a guarantee that all younger people are. JD Vance is very young and he is a fucking goober. Good point.

1:04:03

Yeah, it is, though. It is a function of not just age, but the amount of time you've been in Washington. I do think that is a really good point, because when you spend your life Congress or you spend your life in Washington, like, you just. You have a different lifestyle than most people in the country. And even if you got there, knowing exactly how people in your district or where you're from are living, like, you just lose touch with that after a while. And you see that with people in Congress, like, that's what the way that's the one exception.

1:05:59

He is the exception.

1:06:30

Well, but I've said this because of Bernie, actually. Right. Because Bernie's. But like Bernie's lifestyle when he goes back to Vermont is very much the same. Like he's still very much connected with the life that he had before. Right. Like Bernie. And so I don't think it's, I don't think it's impossible to be in public service for a long time and still like, and lose touch completely. But you still have to work at it. And I think Bernie proves like the exception to the rule right there. Lovett, do you agree with the Jugurtha Obama on the, on the value of the intraparty fighting and the robust debate, as he said?

1:06:31

Yes, it is absolutely true that I think the Democratic Party that emerged from the primaries in 2007, 2008 was a stronger Democratic Party. I think both the party writ large and also the Obama campaign benefited from the fact that Barack Obama campaigned across the country, including through a lot of swing states, and built a big organization. I do think first of all, the differences in policy between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama were much smaller, especially in domestic policy. They just were. But at the same time, those debates got pretty fucking messy at the end and party had to be stitched back together. Everybody did that. That worked. That's great. I think we have to have be honest about the ways in which intraparty fights play out now. And they are just, they can be like really, really cutting, really enervating. And that's okay. I just don't want to pretend that that's not the situation. And so to me, okay, that's what social media will do. We can say that's not real life, but it becomes real life. What does a politician do to address that? And I think it becomes incumbent on anyone who's going to be part of a Democratic primary in 2028, in 2027, obviously to beginning, middle and end, be talking about the fact that at the end of this process we will be stitching this movement together, that we're all on the same side. I think we have to overcorrect for that in a certain way. And I actually think that often becomes a cudgel. Used to go after the left to say like, you need to unify, you need to unify, you need to unify. I think they do and I think that's a fine argument to make. But at the same time, I think more center left politicians should become more comfortable speaking with, talking to parts of the party that are not going to be Part of their coalition and maybe kind of hostile to them. But even if they get hostility toward them, speak about them as if they're part of their coalition and that their voices matter and are valued, I think like, that has to be kind of overcorrection that people do. Because I am worried about what happens in a kind of brutal long primary in which everyone is extremely anxious, extremely upset about what's happening to the country, extremely worried about our ability to win. And so that to me is part of what it will be the leader of the party will have to do.

1:07:10

I mean, I worry about it from the other side too. From the left. Yeah, well, because, I mean, it's just, it's different arguments, right? The center left, if it's a center left politician and they will say like, oh, well, the left, the left politician, the more progressive politician can't win. This is hopeless. Now why are we nominating this person? This is bad. We're going to lose. They're not electable. And so like, they have to think about that. On the left you get like, this person's a sellout. They're no better than the Republican candidate. Like, so it goes both ways.

1:09:22

No, no, I totally. And I, like, I am confident. Like, it is not the leaders, like elected leaders on the left that are making those arguments.

1:09:53

Like, no, that's. And I.

1:10:02

And like, there's nobody that fought harder for Joe Biden even I think a little too long than like AOC and Bernie, which is like to their credit. And so like, we can't make every activist or every person do the right thing in either direction. There's plenty of people that are, you know, that have loud platforms that are not going to be responsible. That's just part of it. I'm talking about what the elected leaders do. And I actually think they can do a good job of kind of at least modeling the kind of behavior we need.

1:10:03

In fact, I think the two elected leaders that did the best job of modeling that were Biden and Bernie in 2020. Right. Like, they both did a lot of work. Tommy, what do you think?

1:10:28

Yeah, I mean, the intra party fights are always the worst and the most vicious. And that's true for the right and the left. And in part because it's just, you care what those critics say? Like when Ben Shapiro calls me like Tayron Tommy on Twitter, I don't give a shit because I think he's a moron and he's annoying. But when, like, did he do that all the time? But when people on the left criticize you. You're like, oh, that hurts. Like, I respect those people. That kind of. That stings a bit. I do, though, think, like, I think the biggest mistake of all is when the kind of DC class decides that they're going to anoint someone. And I think that the reason, part of the reason some of the 2016 fights feel like they will never end is one, if we had won, all is forgiven, but we lost. You guys remember that. But two, there is a feeling that is, I don't think, fully accurate, but not totally unfounded on the left that the party, that the primary process was unfair and rigged against Bernie Sanders. And that is let this perception linger. So ultimately, I think we need messy primaries. I think you can read all the polls you want, but the rubber meets the road when people vote. And that's when we really learn what people care about and what politicians are good. And the 2008 primary stripped a decade off our lives collectively. But it was great for Barack Obama. It made him a better candidate, made him a better president. I just love it was saying, like, the thing we have to avoid or just call out is the suggestion that you are immoral or, or a bad person or it's a character attack if you disagree on policy. That stuff is bullshit.

1:10:36

Yeah.

1:12:09

I agree with the contours around the debate we should have, but we should be brutally honest. The Democratic Party is in a state of crisis. Right? We have currently have no path to this kind of governing majority. We would need to actually defeat Maga. We have a Senate cap of 53 seats. Maybe in 2032, the Electoral College is going to move 15 to 20 votes in the Republican direction. Like our current electoral coalition, even if it has improved since Trump lost, is not sufficient to actually build a governing majority. We have to have a giant debate. Our party leadership is out of touch and sclerotic and we don't have the infrastructure we need. We have to have a big, giant, messy debate about who we are, what we stand for, and who should be in charge of this party. Because if we don't, we may. We literally, we really could win in 2028 simply because Donald Trump sucks and JD Vance sucks even more. But that is just what happened in 2020, which is we won one presidency, we didn't solve any of our problems, and we were right back where we were before. So we need to think big, and we're only gonna think big. We have a big, messy primary, and we are open to out of the box ideas. Candidates who may not seem electable right away. We just have to have a lot of humility and openness to a real messy, important debate.

1:12:11

Yeah, I agree with that. But a messy debate is we can't have the future you want without a messy debate. But a messy debate is no guarantee that people show up to the table with what we need.

1:13:24

That's right.

1:13:37

And so that, like, to me, yeah.

1:13:38

Well, I think Obama's point there that I found very important is when he said, we have to realize that, you know, not 100% of voters are going to agree with everything we said, which seems like an obvious point. But I think that wherever you stand in the Democratic Party, from your vantage point, you think that, like, oh, yeah, my position is actually the position that is most popular in the party and that can carry the whole party. And it's just. And the other politicians don't actually realize that because they're at fault. And the truth is, like, it's a very demographically politically diverse coalition, and it has become more demographically and politically diverse partly because it has to be so broad to beat Donald Trump's coalition right now. Like, we are just a much more diverse coalition than Donald Trump's coalition politically, identity wise, geographically, all of it. And so because of that, there's gonna be a lot more argument, a lot more lot of different positions. And whether you're on the left, whether you're on the center left, wherever you are, you're just gonna have to realize that, like, most people in the party aren't necessarily gonna agree with all your positions. And that doesn't mean to like, sand down all your positions so that you can be like the lowest common denominator politician and have everyone agree with you. But it does mean that you have to realize that you're not going to please everyone all the time and you're going to take some positions that piss people off.

1:13:40

I mean, you're 100% right. We have to recognize that we need to build a majority. We have to appeal to people who just growth on lots of things. My just operating principle going into this primary is I want to think bigger than just who can win in 2028. Because I think if all we do is win in 2028 and then lose after that, we are fucked. And so you really have to think big about who is the canu. Who has the potential to change the electoral coalition in the way that Obama did in 2008.

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1:16:37

Cohen, host of the no Lie Podcast, which is part of Crooked Media. You've likely seen my videos online or watched me torture Tommy Vitor as part of our series on YouTube, but this week I've got A really exciting episode. I'm interviewing the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama. So if you want to tune in and hear what he's got to say, including a definitive answer as to whether or not aliens are real, make sure to listen by Searching for no Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

1:17:45

Over the next year, we have to focus on winning our midterm elections. We can't get sucked into the horse race for an election that is two full years from now, is what we normally say, but not tonight. And so, in this hat, we have the names of many of 2028's rumored hopefuls and hopeless. We will each choose a candidate, and we will each make our case for that candidate, and then we will duke it out. This is real. We are choosing at random, and we will fight for our candidate. At the end, you will vote on who you believe should be the nominee from this field. Okay. In a segment we're calling Playing the Field.

1:18:15

And also for everyone listening at home, for everyone who could. We are playing a game. We are each playing our role for our candidate.

1:18:51

These are called straw man arguments.

1:19:04

It does not reflect what each of us actually believe about the candidates.

1:19:05

We're just making arguments. I swear to fucking God.

1:19:09

So I will start. And my candidate is JB Pritzker.

1:19:15

My candidate is Pete Buttigieg.

1:19:22

My candidate is Rahm Emanuel.

1:19:29

Cheer for me.

1:19:33

My candidate is AOC.

1:19:37

Wow. Wow.

1:19:40

Okay, Commander.

1:19:43

All right, we're gonna try to. Jon, take it away for 30 seconds, okay?

1:19:44

I think the case for JB Pritzker is that he is an incredibly successful governor of one of the largest states in the country. He has been one of the loudest, fiercest voices against Donald Trump. So he knows how to fight, but he also knows how to govern. He has raised the minimum wage in Illinois. He has also reduced the budget deficit in Illinois. He's passed criminal justice reform. He's protected abortion rights and so on. Issue after issue, he has shown that you can actually govern. And progressively, if you have the opportunity. He has executive experience. He also has. He is very, very rich, which means that he can fund this campaign. And he's not going to be beholden to corporate special interests, which is pretty good. So he's not. And we've had a. We just. You know, he. Class traders are some of the most committed, committed converts. And So I think J.B. pritzker, the reason that he's been getting so much attention is because he's out there. He is not afraid to fight Donald Trump. He's not afraid to punch Republicans in the face. And he also has shown in his state that he can protect the people of Illinois from authoritarians like Donald Trump and that he can also govern in a progressive way that actually has improved people's lives in Illinois.

1:19:48

Pete buttigieg. Two things I think we all would, I think, agree about Pete Buttigieg. One, no one has done a better job taking the argument to conservative spaces than Pete Buttigieg. We just, we just went through an election where some of the most important conversations were not five minutes or seven minutes, but they were hour long, hour and a half long conversations. People who have not just a soundbite, but have the ability to actually make a deep and well thought out argument that can appeal to people beyond our base. We know that Pete can do that. That brings me to my second reason. Why do we know that Pete can do that? Because I, we all instinctively view Pete Buttigieg as the smartest, one of the smartest people in Democratic politics. If there's anybody. Now, do I think Pete Buttigieg right now has all the answers for how Democrats win in places we haven't won since Ben Nelson left his, his seat in Nebraska? No, I don't think Pete Buttigieg has all the answers. But do I think Pete Buttigieg is, has the same concern that Dan has and is thinking about it when he's lying awake at night next to a sweet and sleeping Chastain? I do. I think Pete is completely aware of this challenge and is thinking about it. And I think knowing that we have a president that has the capacity to think about these long term challenges and how to address them and how to connect it to the policy and the politics of the moment would be quite a reassuring thing for us to have.

1:21:05

Rahm Emanuel is the most qualified candidate in the field by far. He was White House Chief of Staff. He was a member of Congress. He was the mayor of a city of 2.75 million people. He was the US ambassador to Japan. The man is ready to do the job on day one. He has seen the nuclear codes. Have you guys seen the nuclear codes? No. None of these clowns have seen the nuclear codes.

1:22:36

Also, he's a winner.

1:23:05

In 2006, Rahm Emanuel led the DCCC. Democrats won 30 seats. Bill Clinton won the presidency two times. Rahm Emanuel was the intellectual firepower behind those campaigns. On top of that, he's a fighter, he's tough. People always say, oh, the Democrats are too nice. Not my rum, not My rum. That's why we need him on that ticket.

1:23:07

How do you guys feel about aoc? Now here's what some Washington leads are going to tell you. They're going to say she can't win. Do you know who else? Whatever is right. Do you know who else? They said that about Barack Obama. They said he couldn't win. You got anything else here, let me give you. You know what? Let me make my case, okay?

1:23:40

I just asked who'd you have again?

1:24:06

I don't even remember. Here's the thing. I think the way in which the Democratic Party can regain the majority in this country, how we can return to our roots is we need a politics that comes from the outside, that is reform and that is based on working class people and ideas. And we need a candidate who can actually communicate in this environment, who can go toe to toe with a right wing media machine. And there is no better communicator and no better messenger in the Democratic Party than aoc. Does she have hurdles? Yes, she absolutely does. But I believe she has the talent, the background. She is someone who is a true outsider in American politics. Her time as a bartender is a way in which you can relate to working class people. She can appeal to young people and Latinos. The two groups who abandoned the Democrats in 2024, which is the difference between the big Obama era coalition we had back 2008, 2012, and the ones in which we barely won in 2020, we lost in 2024. And it is a big bet, right, because she is an untested candidate compared to some of these other people like Rahm Emanuel.

1:24:08

But you're goddamn right.

1:25:15

But it is a bet I'd be willing to make because I think she has the highest ceiling of any candidate in this field. The one candidate we've even talked about is the possibility to truly alter American politics in a way that can defeat mega.

1:25:16

Now it's the question round. We'll start with JB Pritzker. Now, Jon, JB Pritzker is a billionaire. His wealth comes from the Hyatt Hotel.

1:25:32

Correct.

1:25:48

Chain. Yeah. He has been wealthy his entire life, from the day that he was born. How will he relate to the struggles of working people?

1:25:49

I want to know which one of your candidates passed a $15 minimum wage for that affected one of the biggest states in the country?

1:26:02

Rob Emanuel did.

1:26:12

Yeah.

1:26:13

Ron.

1:26:14

So Rahm didn't. AOC definitely hasn't. And Pete, I don't know if he did it in South Bend.

1:26:15

So that's it. So that's a Great accomplishment. I'm really glad that J.P. yeah, and.

1:26:20

It'S weird because he's so rich, but he still did.

1:26:25

How is he gonna campaign when he's.

1:26:28

So busy playing poker all the time?

1:26:29

All he does is play poker.

1:26:32

I have a question that's interesting because I think John Lovett wants to hang out with JB Pritzker more than any other candidate. Is that what you said?

1:26:33

Yeah, that is.

1:26:42

Right now it's something. It's called. It's something called the beer test. Right. Who would you want to have a beer with? And I believe you have chosen JB.

1:26:43

Pritzker and as the median American voter, gay podcast host from Los Angeles, California. No, but seriously, I agree that JB Pritzker has great accomplishments, but sincerely address the question of how will JB Pritzker, someone who has never had to worry about money for a day in his life, has been wealthy since the day was born. How does he. How does he relate to people and their regular everyday.

1:26:50

No, it's a straight question. How does a billionaire relate to a country of working class Americans and get elected by those Americans? I don't know how that happens.

1:27:12

Well, I don't think Trump is good.

1:27:24

Right.

1:27:27

I think he's bad.

1:27:28

But is that because he got elected or is that because he didn't pursue policies to improve the economic lives of most people, People which JB Pritzker has in Illinois?

1:27:29

John, can I ask another question?

1:27:38

Sure.

1:27:39

I understand you're talking points here, but J.B. pritzker is the governor of one of the most democratic states in the country.

1:27:40

Yeah.

1:27:44

What is the evidence that he could actually go into a swing state and.

1:27:45

Win like the Bronx. Right.

1:27:49

Well, I'll make like the Bronx.

1:27:51

I'm hearing a lot of attacks.

1:27:53

Like the Bronx or Chicago.

1:27:56

Because I have a fucking answer.

1:28:02

I guess the Transportation Department. That was a tough one.

1:28:03

I guess no answer for how JB Pritzker is going to appeal to the working class is by attacking every other person on the debate.

1:28:05

I think we need a fighter. Don't we want a fighter? Don't we want someone who's going to hit back? All right, jb, there was a. There was a two term president from the same state that JB Pritzker is governor of. I think his name is Barack Obama.

1:28:11

Many people said, yeah, the white Obama.

1:28:27

Anyone else have a question? I don't know, like, I'm still waiting for a good no.

1:28:30

Okay. For Pete.

1:28:34

Yeah.

1:28:36

So Pete. You are not Pete. I am arguing for Pete. You are still ourselves tonight. You're Pete, in this, we are ourselves arguing for someone.

1:28:36

Love it on the streets, Pete in the sheets. So you were part of the.

1:28:44

You were part of the COVID up.

1:28:49

Of Joe Biden's mental decline. Won't that be a problem on the campaign trail?

1:28:51

So that's a pretty salacious allegation for someone that was pretty focused on making sure the planes landed and took off, which they almost all did. I was. I had a lot on my plate. He had a lot on his plate.

1:28:59

Fuck.

1:29:15

He was working on making sure that. That we had rail and trains going where they're supposed to go. And by the way, look, here's the thing. Pete Buttigieg wasn't really like, wasn't there a big train crash in Ohio which he could not stop?

1:29:17

Right.

1:29:34

Yeah, look, obviously.

1:29:35

So he kept most of the planes in the air and most of the trains on the rails.

1:29:36

Obviously, in hindsight, Joe Biden was very old.

1:29:40

Yeah.

1:29:47

What did Pete say after the debate? Did Pete say anything about him after the debate? He said, great job, boss.

1:29:50

We have got to make sure these planes are good. I am focused on the planes. The planes are also old. Not again. Not Pete's fault. But he's going to make sure they land safely. Pete's fault. It's weird, but it's weird because getting our aging, decrepit infrastructure to work as best as it could from the White House to the fucking Amtrak.

1:29:55

Yeah. It's weird though, Pete, I was like, why was he. He was so focused on the trains. But I thought you said he was one of the best communicators in the party. He can go into all the other spaces and talk about politics, but it was. Just didn't do that with Biden. Right. So just did the planes.

1:30:13

And just remind me, when did JB Pritzker turn against Joe Biden? Was it before the debate or long after?

1:30:26

Definitely before Pete.

1:30:31

Well, Pete's in the administration and again, planes, trains, automobiles.

1:30:32

Okay, couple of questions. So one of the things that was the downfall of Kamala Harris was she was in the 2020 primary and she stood on stage, she filled a lot of questionnaires. She stood on stage and raised her hands for a lot of very. A lot of issues that were quite unpopular. Pete raised his hand at every single one when Kamala Harris did. How worried are you? How worried is Pete about having adopted all these positions in 2020 that were so effectively weaponized against Kamala Harris?

1:30:37

So I think it's a really important question. And look, I think the two biggest liabilities, Pete Buttigieg will have is A, he is connected to the Biden administration and B, he was part of the 2020 primary, which every hand is going up. I do think sometimes that is taken as a, the fact that that was such a liability for Kamala Harris that she could not address. It is therefore a liability others cannot address. Kamala had a bigger problem, which was she was unable to be honest, to articulate a deeper worldview. And she struggled with that in her 107 days. I think she would have continued to struggle with that. Yes, Pete will have to address that. But I think whatever the tag Pete will have for his being tied to the administration, which is legitimate and will be a huge problem for him. I think we all would say that Pete Buttigieg has a kind of a larger worldview that he is going to put forward, he will have to address. I don't know that it was Bidenism. I think. I think it is a center left, kind of technocratic but forward looking, probably abundance style agenda and like, whatever that's worth that. I think that's be what he would put forward. But yes, he will have to answer for these things that will be hard for him to do. It will not be as hard for him to do. Kamala made it look harder than I think it would be. Buttigieg.

1:31:03

One area where, in fairness, Pete is very different from Joe Biden is that Joe Biden was very popular with black voters and experienced. And I think you would agree that there's no winning the Democratic primary at all without black voters.

1:32:14

Or the White House.

1:32:30

Or the White House. And so I'm wondering after his first run where he didn't get almost any black votes and in the polls now down at 0 and 1%. So what's the. What do you think about that?

1:32:31

Nowhere to go but up. Jon, here's the thing. Here's the thing. You ever have a jar of pickles and you can open it, you can open it and you can open it, but you're loosening it, you know, and one day, boom, black votes.

1:32:45

Arguments like that are why Donald Trump's run and train our democracy. You know who didn't run in 2020? Rahm Emanuel. Blank slate. Fresh face.

1:33:07

Okay, Rahm, I have some questions for you.

1:33:17

Sure.

1:33:19

Talk to me about how you're gonna talk. How is Rahm Emanuel gonna talk to the country about aggressively, profanely about Rahm's integral role in doing the following thing things. Passing nafta, passing the Clinton crime bill, adding China to the wto.

1:33:20

Okay, nerd.

1:33:39

I would just add to that list his being tied to police abuses during his time as mayor.

1:33:41

Okay.

1:33:46

That have led many people to view him as a sort of a fundamentally unacceptable choice for the Democratic Party.

1:33:46

Trauma manual, not Machiavelli. First of all, people don't like crime, thus that bill. Okay? Second, NAFTA is half of mostly Canada, and we should be nicer to them, so stop being a dick. But also chief of staff, member of Congress, ambassador to Japan. He's ready for the job.

1:33:52

They won. Here's the thing. I'm being dead serious here, because I was there to see it. Rahm was. He was a very effective chief of staff for Barack Obama. Very effective.

1:34:15

He.

1:34:24

Obama's probably most famous accomplishment is the passage of the Affordable Care Act. Rahm famously, and I was in the meeting where he did it, argued that we should abandon it and take a smaller bill. So, like, how is he can't even. What is his argument when he can't even take credit for Obama's top accomplishment?

1:34:25

Because what he wanted to do was march down to Wall street, grab a banker, put him on a spit, and roast him like a hog on C Span.

1:34:40

But he.

1:34:49

Obama wouldn't let him do it.

1:34:50

Oh, wow. Wow.

1:34:51

Oh, I'm sorry.

1:34:55

The facts offend you.

1:34:55

I assume you have documentation of this.

1:34:57

So Rahm Emanuel, the tribune of the working class in the White House, was stymied by. By the. By the neolib shill Barack Obama. That's your claim. Who believes in aliens? Now.

1:34:59

That'S a possible argument we'll make. Yeah. Okay.

1:35:11

Should we go to that I want.

1:35:15

To say about Pete Buttigieg and black voters? No, keep going. What do you guys got?

1:35:16

So, Dan, this is being recorded, you know.

1:35:21

Yeah, no, I know.

1:35:23

I know.

1:35:25

I know what your single advantage is.

1:35:25

Yeah. Never seen someone so cocky pushing on an open door.

1:35:28

So of all these candidates, I think that the one with the highest name identification is probably yours, correct?

1:35:33

I would say it's probably Kamala Harris.

1:35:40

Of the ones that are on the stage right now.

1:35:41

Yes, that's true.

1:35:43

I don't.

1:35:44

Close call with Pete. I think Pete might have higher a name. I do, but it's close. It's close.

1:35:45

Okay. And who has the worst net approval rating in the country? Who is the romicide?

1:35:48

Who has the highest. Let me ask you this question. Who has the highest approval rating with.

1:35:53

Young voters is just young voters voting now in the American election.

1:35:57

Well, it'd be nice if they voted for us.

1:36:00

Oh, is here. Look, are Wisconsin and Pennsylvania and Michigan. Michigan just Young voters. That's amazing.

1:36:02

All right, slow down there. Okay, billionaire boy. Here's the thing.

1:36:07

Sorry.

1:36:13

Socialists go ahead at the beginning.

1:36:13

We love socialists in America.

1:36:15

AOC has a high hurdle to prove electability. And I think that one of the tests of electability, and she's gonna have to carry that argument in the primaries, in the debates. And I have great confidence that she has the communication skills to do that.

1:36:17

You know, everyone loves her. Well, you're making the argument. What would you make the argument for an electability? How would that. She has never. Go ahead. How would she win? How would she win a. An Obama, Trump?

1:36:31

No one on this stage, no one on this stage right now has won a Republican state or district.

1:36:41

No, I'm just asking that.

1:36:46

There was a large swap thing was, you know, 17, 20% of people who voted for Donald Trump and AOC in her last election.

1:36:48

Let me, let me ask.

1:36:54

And there's a higher percentage of people, I would say, in her district who voted for Obama in Trump, then voted for JB Pritzker in Trump.

1:36:55

Listen, when's the last time a progressive has ever won a purple district? Can you name a progressive, a leftist, who's ever won a purple district anywhere?

1:37:01

Bernie Sanders.

1:37:10

Bernie Sanders.

1:37:11

Which one is that?

1:37:13

What do you mean by that?

1:37:14

In a general election. When is the last time general election, a lefty DSA progressive politician has won a purple state statewide or a district in a House district?

1:37:15

No question that AOC's relationship with DSA is something. She's got to navigate this. There's no question about that. And the way you do that is you prove it the same way. In 2008, everyone say, when could a black politician win a majority white state? And Barack Obama won Iowa, and he proved to people he could do it. The only way that AOC can win the nomination is she has to go whatever the first state is, which is going to most likely be like a Michigan or a Georgia or New Hampshire. Whatever it is, he's going to have to go in and win it.

1:37:27

If Rahm Emanuel went to the Munich Security Conference and got asked about Taiwan, he would hit that over the chucker. Is that a thing in cricket? No, no.

1:38:00

Something else. Yes.

1:38:13

He would knock it out of the park.

1:38:14

There's no question. What I'm saying is that people should believe. These people should go with their hearts.

1:38:16

But so, no, John, to your point, though. Yeah, like, I agree, right, that, like, right now, right. We would say it's an uphill climb for someone on the left as AOC to win a national race. But you would say that she would be a good president, right?

1:38:23

Are you now just arguing for AOC so the fucking audience can.

1:38:38

No, no, no.

1:38:41

But.

1:38:42

No, but I'm saying that this is the problem, right?

1:38:42

That like, if what we're talking about is electability. Electability is not a. Is electability can't simply be a snapshot of how people view politicians before the primary.

1:38:44

Electability is sitting right here.

1:38:55

No, for sure. But like, you would have to then be saying not only is she seen as someone who is divisive or to the left in a way that's not appealing to enough people, but that she does not have the capacity to change that. And like, don't we think, like, if we are going. If we. If things are as dire as Dan is saying in our politics, wouldn't it be worth it to take a chance on the possibility that we can reshape our politics around someone that we all would view as somebody who has kind of politics?

1:38:57

I guess here's the thing. Here's the thing. I'll say it is a. There's no question it's a big risk, but there's no one on the stage who's not a big risk. Right. Is too big a risk. For sure. He's Rahm Emanuel. Whatever.

1:39:23

I agree that Rahm Emanuel would be a pretty big fucking risk.

1:39:35

JB Pritzker is an untested proposition. Who's ever won Republican voters? What I believe is that the way the Democrats have to move is we need a politics based on working class people, working class ideas, and the person in the Democratic Party on this list, in this hat best able to do that is AOC Based on. Based on the fact that.

1:39:38

Based on what?

1:39:59

Based on the fact that she has done it where Barack Obama won Illinois and then he won the country. She's gonna have to.

1:40:00

Do you think Barack Obama's positions when he ran were to the left or to the right of AOCs right now?

1:40:09

Well, I think everyone is. The politics have changed. But he was the most left candidate in that field and he won because.

1:40:14

Of his position on the Iraq war. Right.

1:40:21

He was more liberal on the biggest issue of the time.

1:40:26

And he mogged and he did mog. He was good looking and he was.

1:40:29

She mogs too.

1:40:32

And I would love to get a beer with JB Pritzker.

1:40:33

And I think Pete's brilliant.

1:40:37

All right, from this. This is the final debate stage. You are.

1:40:38

Based on the arguments.

1:40:42

Based on the arguments you have heard tonight, are you voting for JB Pritzker?

1:40:43

No.

1:40:48

Are you voting for Sweet Pete Buttigieg? Are you voting for Rahm Emanuel? Wow. Pretty good. And that was it, right? And aoc.

1:40:50

Wow.

1:41:09

Too close to call.

1:41:11

The swing district of Sydney.

1:41:15

We're gonna listen. Let's see how she does in Brisbane. Honestly, she did pretty well and that's playing the field.

1:41:19

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1:42:46

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