Juventus Comeback Falls Short

From 30 for 30 podcasts. Brian Pata, senior defensive lineman from Miami, gunned down. The key to this case, it's Brian. An hour before he died, he was on the phone arguing what's about. This might be a hit. You want the truth. They just want a conviction. They're placing the arrest. We had a killer amongst us. Murder at the U. Listen now. Welcome to the latest edition of ESPN FC. I'm Dan Thomas, shown by Craig Burley and Ali Moreno. Some exciting Champions League ties today. We'll kick things off in Turin. Remember, Juventus humiliated in the first leg against Galatasaray, losing five goals to two. They were put up quite a fight today. They're 1-0 up before they are reduced to ten men. Lloyd Kelly, controversy sent off. They then get two more goals, Juve, and that would force things into extra time. Galatasaray in the end though made the most of the extra man Osserman getting the key goal Galatasaray through to the next round Juventus out Juventus though applauded by their own fans at the end of the game given the effort the Italian side put in Gap Marcotti is with us flying his Italian flag basically Gap damage done in the first leg is that kind of what we're saying from this or are we saying Juventus fought hard? I think from Juve's perspective, you saw the reaction there from the fans. I think people are realizing that there is a lot of fight in this team. They screwed it up in the first leg. It's their fault. I mean, getting a man sent off in both games, you can't do that. You will pay the price. But I think they showed enough fight back. They showed character. They played, what, like 75 minutes down to 10 men, if you count the extra time. They certainly had more chances. We saw that five, more than five expected goals in this game. They hid the woodwork. They did everything they could to turn it around. And, you know, this comes off the back of two very disappointing results against Como in the first leg in Istanbul. But that's the thing about football, right? There's always another game where you can do something. It's not going to help them in the Champions League. They're out of it. They'll have regrets. They should have regrets. But hopefully, if you're a Juve fan, you can channel this to finish the season strongly and get back in the Champions League next year via Serie A. I think 10 out of 10 for effort. There's no doubt about that. But 3 out of 10 for losing 7 goals in 2 games against Galatasaray. Turkish football isn't exactly a stronghold these days. You've got Galatasaray and Fernabacchi, the two points between them at the top of the Turkish Superliga. And you've got Nottingham Forest, who can't buy a goal, going to Fernabacchi and beating them 3-0. So when you look at it from that perspective, yeah, the effort was great. But in terms of, you know, had it been a proper Juventus side, and we know they've had their problems and we know Spalletti's not been in there that long. But had it been a really, really strong Juventus side, I think they would have brushed a team like Galatasaray away and dealt with them pretty easily. But it is not. And they paid the penalty for that. But in terms of tonight, a really, really brilliant effort. And I do feel that that was a harsh call on Lloyd Kelly. I mean, unless you're coming down with two feet strapped together in a game with so much on the line, that was a big, big call, obviously. And you saw his reaction when he went off. To me, there was no intent, but the referee saw it differently. What do you think, Ali? In that particular play? Yeah, it's a Kelly's challenge. The defense for Kelly is that he's always looking at the ball. And in that sense, you can see as to why there would be frustration from Kelly and Juventus. The counterargument to that is that he's raking the back of the leg of Lucas Torreira from the back of his knee all the way down to the heel. And the more you see it, the worse it looks. And then the more you see it, you can talk yourself into, well, is that leg supposed to go out like that when you jump? And now you're sort of kind of evaluating how a player jumps and how he's supposed to land. And in that regard, I think this is where we get in this sort of gray area with VAR. But the more you see the leg going down the back of the player, while it is harsh, while Kelly's looking at the ball, it's difficult. if you're the referee, once you send to VAR, not to say, man, that looks bad. It looks terrible. This is a red card. As it pertains to today's game, while I agree that Juventus' effort was outstanding and it was recognized and acknowledged by the fans, I would also say that when they scored the third goal by Weston McKinney and they had all the momentum and Galatasaray were hanging on, even playing a man up, they were hanging on. They didn't know what to do. They were frozen by fear. Juventus did Galatasaray a favor by taking a step back. See, they got to the point to where they tied it up and it felt like, well, job done. Well, job not done. Because you would make it through 90 minutes, but now it's just tied. You have to go and play another 30 minutes and men down when you've done so much to try to get to the point to where you score that third goal. if Juventus were going to advance, they were either going to hang on all the way to penalties or, more likely, by scoring a fourth goal. And I know it sounds crazy to say that playing a man down. But that's how dominant they were, even in that sort of situation. Galatasaray did not want any part of this. This is why you see Victor Ossiman, when he scores his goal, why he's so frustrated. Why he's not celebrating. And it's like, how in the world are we finding ourselves in a situation in which we have to hang on when we're playing a man up? I think there was, I hate to call it like this, and I hate to describe it like this after the effort we've seen from Juventus, but there was a wasted opportunity in those last 10 minutes to really push and see if you can make it all the way back. Gab, a word on Kelly's red card. It was obviously already booked in the game. Yeah, and you could say you need to be more difficult, but look, I mean, Lloyd Kelly's, I mean, he's looking, he's not looking at the player. He can't tell what's happening beneath him. So for me, it's pretty straightforward. That yellow card was harsh, and he should not have been sent off. And as to what Ali says, you have to 100% agree. They did create enough chances to win the game in the 90 minutes. You know, we're hitting the post and whatnot. I think at that point, once you go into extra time and man down, you know, it gets really, really dicey. And I think that's going to be a huge regret for Juve. You take a look at the opponents that have knocked Juve out since 2019. It's not exactly a list of who's who of Champions League football gab. No, it's not. And I think, although, I mean, Ajax do have a glorious past. No, and these are the issues. And, you know, obviously in several of those, they had a certain Cristiano Ronaldo. But I think those circumstances are very, very different because, you know, this Juve team are in a rebuilding phase. That team with Cristiano, which was three of those times that they were knocked out, you know, that was a team that was supposed to go and win the Champions League or really challenge for it. I don't think you can argue here that they underestimated the opposition, even though it was Galatasaray. They just laid an egg in the first leg. Like maybe even somehow psychologically forgot that, you know, without the away goals rule, you know, it really is a first half and a second half. And you have to treat it like that. And so if you give up, you know, if you Craig talked before about them conceding seven goals. Well, I think five of those seven goals were conceded at 10 v. 11. You know, you can't put yourself in those situations. If you start losing and you're a goal down, say, all right, we'll get them at home. You have to have, I think, that patience and that mindset. and that was another failing from Juve over these two legs. As I mentioned then, possible opponents in the next round. The draw, of course, is on Friday. It's going to be a Premier League side. It's either going to be Liverpool or Spurs. I wonder which one do one. It's going to be Spurs, isn't it? Galatasaray in the next round. A lot more questions on the Champions League to come, of course, on Extra Time, which, as always, you can check out over on our YouTube channel. Real Madrid 2, Benfica 1 is how it finished at the Santiago Bernabeu, but boy, were Avaloa's side made to work hard for it. In fact, it would be Benfica who would take the lead. Real Madrid though quickly equalised. Thibaut Courtois pulled off some great saves. In the end though, a late goal from Vinicius Junior guaranteed Real Madrid a place in the next round. Frank Le Poif joins us. Craig, it's weird, isn't it? Real Madrid are through, fine. Okay, good. It's difficult not to start this, though, with kind of a negative angle. Because once again, we're sat here and Real Madrid's best player was Thibaut Courtois. Yeah, and if you're into the expected goals, Benfica had the upper hand. Hence, Thibaut Courtois making some great saves. And again, a bit like the Galatasaray-Juventus situation, Benfica, you know, huge club, but hardly a strong arm in European football these days. But gave as good as they got. In fact, they shot themselves in the foot because once they take the lead, they make this horrendous basic error that allowed the two many goal. And that just settled the crowd down a little bit because, you know yourself, you watch Real Madrid. When other teams start to boss possession, the crowd get more restless. And as they get more restless, the players get more tense. But Benfica didn't really allow that to happen by making that mistake. That being said, the game was still on a knife edge until late in the game. But yeah, I'm seeing nothing from Real Madrid that makes me think, apart from La Liga, where there is a title race, that they're going to go anywhere near in this competition. I might be wrong, but I don't think so. I'm seeing nothing that's suggesting that when they come up against a really solid outfit, one of the real big boys that are playing well, whether it be Bayern Munich or PSG up their game, and I know they had the struggles, or Arsenal or anybody else like that, or maybe even Barcelona again, I think they're going to get their comeuppance because they're just not playing very well. They're giving a lot of chances away. And again, they're relying on moments of magic. You know, a breakaway for the Vinicius goal, a mistake for the Chumeni goal. It's not really about the team for Real Madrid at the moment. It's about seizing on opportunities, which is part of the game, but that's kind of how they're getting the results. But is it not an argument people watch Real Madrid fans saying, Look, they're out. No Kylian Mbappe, no Jude Bellingham. Two of their best players. They get through. Get on with it. Yeah, and so if you're those Real Madrid fans that you're talking about and you're walking away from Santiago Bernabeu tonight, are you encouraged or discouraged? You're encouraged that you've gone through. But given the performance, you are discouraged knowing full well that it's not just about this game, that even when those players were on the field, these are the sort of performances that you're getting from Real Madrid. today was about survival for Real Madrid at Santiago Bernabéu. And that in itself, I think, and it's not an exaggeration when I say that it was about survival, it felt like Real Madrid were in trouble today against Benfica. And it took those moments of brilliance that Craig is talking about in order for them to be able to survive this very scary stage of the competition. A stage of the competition that they got themselves into because they allowed late goals to Benfica. So there were a lot of things about this that may have pointed in the direction of Real Madrid being in trouble, given the injuries, given the absences, given Mourinho, given the history, and yet they're able to advance. So from that point of view you say you take a deep breath and you allow yourself to settle the nerves if you will in Santiago Bernardo But it not just about today And I go back to my initial point. This is who they were in the weekend against Osasuna. This is what they have been over the course of the season. So when is it going to get significantly better, consistently better? We are yet to find that answer. And of course, we're yet to find what the best version of this team is when everybody's healthy. Because when everybody's healthy, they have actually looked worse than when everybody's not healthy. So that in itself is a challenge for Arbeloa and for this club. But to Craig's point, this is not a team that you bank on winning this competition. You just feel that any attack can get through this defence. Frank, we saw Trent, of course, starting. He hasn't had the best of times, mainly because of injury since joining from Liverpool. but there are so many errors that just seem to continually happen in defence. You come up against a proper side, Real Madrid are going to get destroyed. Yeah, definitely. We didn't learn anything positive from Real Madrid, and especially from the defence. I found them very fragile, yeah, with strength on the right side, but that hasn't been helped by Asensio, who, if he started very well his young career, is having that right now, and on top of it, he got a big injury today, but he wasn't at his best, and you can feel that they don't communicate very well. They don't cover each other very well, and also in the middle of the park. They weren't, even if Chouamini, Kavimvinga, and Valverde are absolutely fantastic players, I don't feel that they can support and help the defense the way they should do. Fortunately for them, they still have the best goalkeeper in the world with Courtois, and Courtois made like two or three saves today who helped Real Madrid to go through. But yeah, I think it's great we said that. There are no build-up. There is no consistency in that team. It's only something special, something special coming at a certain point. Like Vinicius Junior scoring that fantastic goal and he was the only one creating something. Mbappe would have been there. Maybe it would have been a different story. But I found for most of the game, let's say 80 minutes, Benfica being better than Real Madrid. So, as Ale said, they're going through. OK, they can breathe, good. But if you want to make a bet, right now, I'm ready to bet that Real Madrid won't win the Champions League. What's changed, apart from the name above the manager's door? Well, Vinicius Junior's changed. I mean, he's got better under Arbol. Well, I suppose one or two of the alleged bad apples seem happier. I suppose that's one thing results have sort of gone their way for the most part, they were top of the league there for a little bit, they're in a title race for sure, they may scrape it out in the league, I don't think they may, depends on Barcelona I don't think they'll scrape it out in the Champions League continually playing like that but apart from that everybody's maybe a bit happier behind the scenes because they got rid of that manager, that Alonso guy who's trying to change things but in terms of looking at them playing from where Alonso was to where they are now there's not, and I know they've got some injuries you mentioned, there's not a lot of difference is there? It's kind of the same old bland kind of football, getting outplayed by mediocre teams and again relying on whether it's Mbappe or Vinicius or somebody to do that so I'm special, so we haven't really seen an Arboloh effect on the way they play what's happening behind the scenes might have changed, which I suppose maybe that's what they wanted but I thought that we would maybe see something a little bit livelier and quicker on the field in terms of a reaction. But we haven't really seen that. But, you know, they've got the result. That's what they'll say. But, yeah, there's still a disappointing side to actually watch. It's interesting Craig brings that up because obviously the opponents that Real Madrid could face are Sporting or Manchester City. And you think back to that Manchester City game in December, obviously City going to the Bernabeu winning 2-1. And the big talking point was, oh yeah, but look how hard Real Madrid worked in the second half. They worked as a team. Obviously, they still lost the game. But to Craig's point, what difference have we seen from that Real Madrid side to this Real Madrid side with a new manager? It's very difficult to pinpoint much. Well, I would argue that they were better in that game against Manchester City than they were today against Benfica. But this team right now, it's amazing to see Trent Alexander-Arnold trying to play what some would call defending. That is an insult to defending. He made Sheldrope look like he was the best winger in the history of mankind. I thought it was Garrincha running at Trent Alexander-Arnold. Look, and it's not just that. I have said that one of the things that Arbeloa has done is figure out that, okay, now that you're playing with a proper right back, allegedly, that frees off Fede Valverde to go into the midfield, which should make you, on paper, a better team, and structurally a better team alongside Chua Mene, who I thought was running around all over the place today and cover a whole lot of ground, and Camavinga. And apparently they're allowed to rotate positions in the midfield, and that's all fine and well, so long as you know what is it that is your start position when you lose the ball. The goal today by Benfica, Camavinga finds himself in a position like, oh, I'm supposed to go and chase that? I'm supposed to go and defend? Chua Mene is running this way, Camavinga is running that way, Fedor Alverde is running that way, and in the middle there is no presence. So that's no better than what it was back then. I'm only giving you all of this to paint the picture that right now where they are, they're no better than what they were back then. And it goes then back to a very simple concept. Is Vinny happy to play under Arbelova? Yes, he is. He has been impactful. He has changed games. And far better when Mbappe is not on the field. Do they still depend on Mbappe scoring goals? Yes, they do. They very much do. And do they depend on Thibaut Courtois coming up with saves, saving the matches for them time and time again? Yes. None of that has changed. So there is no improvement. To your point, back then against Manchester City, they were better than they were today against Mifika. And they're going to have to be significantly better in this competition. Indeed, they're going to advance. Who are you picking, Frank? If it is indeed City, Madrid. If they play City, are you asking? Yes, sir. Well, City hasn't been the best team either, so it's hard to say. But I would give more chance to City. I think City are getting a little bit better right now than they used to be, well, during the season. And they're getting more stabilised, I would say. And, well, if I have to make a choice, yeah, I would have to go for Manchester City right now. Just a reminder, Barca and Real Madrid, of course, both in action this weekend live on ESPN+. Barca take on Villarreal. They're looking, of course, to extend their lead at the top of the table. Viral looked impressive this season until they come up against the big boys. That's 9.45 Eastern on ESPN+. And then Real Madrid are playing on Monday against Cuitafe, 2.30. Also, of course, on ESPN+. Borussia Dortmund were 2-0 up, weren't they going into the second leg in Italy against Atalanta? Atalanta, though, turned on the style in this game. They'd find themselves 3-0 up, looked like they were going through. Borussia Dortmund got one back as it was looking like then it was going at extra time, but a late controversial penalty was awarded. Atalanta then advanced 4-3 on aggregate. Gab, before we actually say something positive about Italian sides, Frank, penalty or not for you? No, no, nothing, nothing. The ball is touched by the player, he's kicking it away. If I cannot deny that there is a contact and the guy is bleeding, That's the sport contact and on top of it, if you consider that the foot is a little high, I think the head is a little low. So it doesn't for me say that the guy doesn't play the ball, that he has a bad conduct, he plays the ball, kicks it away and the guy put his head. No penalty for me. Craig, do you have an opinion on this? Yeah. Look, it's dangerous play. That's why I'm, you know, when I see some of these overhead kicks, when players or defenders are in the vicinity, I can't get my head around it. Defenders are scared to put their head in. And whilst it wasn't the highest boot, it was high. And the fact that he's got the blood coming off the forehead is a giveaway. I mean, I hear what Frank's saying in playing the ball, But playing the ball alone is not justification for the dangerous play, unfortunately. And I think it was, yeah, 100% a penalty. Gab? I'm sorry, Craig. I'm sorry, Craig. You give a penalty because you see blood on his face. So you don't consider the act of him putting his head down lower? Well, there's a high boot and the studs rake him on the forehead. that's going to always be a dangerous play. Anyway, Gab? Yeah, I mean, maybe that's not a penalty in prison. So, first of all, and we have a World Cup winning defender here. When do you ever clear the ball like that? You clear the ball like that if the ball goes past you, you're out of position and he dangles out a leg. He's maybe trying to scare Scamacca thinking if I put my leg there, but it's so uncoordinated. I mean, leaving aside the dangerous play, which it is obvious dangerous play. I mean, come on, you have a duty of care towards a fellow professional. Now who cares about the way you kick the ball away? You are a defender, the ball past you, you try something, you hit the ball. It's not like he only hit the head. He hit the ball, kick the ball away. And it's like, imagine that your guy is on the floor and you kick the ball away, but because you touch your head, the guy is on the floor and it starts bleeding. Oh, no, that's a red card. That's a penalty because the guy is bleeding. I'm sorry. I hear what you're saying, guys. If the guy was on the floor, it would be an unnatural position and it wouldn't be a high boot or dangerous play. So, Frank. So you're saying that the guy putting his head down his own position. That's a header. Why he doesn't use his chest? Why he's using his head? You know, I can consider and I agree, I know what you're saying. I know what you're saying. And I'm not very surprised that the ref gave a red card and a penalty, whatever he gave. But I'm just saying that if you go there, you can go everywhere and find something who matches or who suits the guy, the forward player. But I was a defender. And the defender kicks the ball away and doesn't matter what's going on after that. And it's like the Juventus player getting red card in the middle of the park. There is nothing. The guy kicks the ball away with his header, doesn't know where the opponent's leg is. and fell on his leg and red card. I'm sorry, I cannot agree with that. I mean, that's part of defending. Okay, all right. Gab, let's talk about the actual achievement for Atalanta, making it through, of course, as I mentioned, one positive note for what has been a miserable time for Italian teams. Yeah, they played, what, six games, and they won two and lost four. But yeah Atalanta I think a lot of this is on Borussia Dortmund too because that going to going to be the narrative in Germany right The second place team in the Bundesliga heading into Der Klassiker Yeah, we've got a title race. And then, you know, they go and they really collapse like this. And I really think it was a collapse. I mean, you can blame everything on Ben Zabini, if you like, but I thought they were unprepared. Atalanta went for it. They went for it without two strikers. One of them, Charles de Cattellari, very important. with arguably their best midfielder, Ederson, on fit and on the bench. And they were rewarded. Tremendous home support. They scored early. They were on the front foot. And they kept the momentum going throughout the game. And they reacted after Adeyemi's goal. And, you know, since we're keen on drawing conclusions about leagues, I just want to remind you, Juventus are fifth in Serie A. Atalanta seventh in Serie A. they did lose to two teams that are in the top two, right? Well, aren't Spurs in a relegation fight? They beat Borussia Dortmund as well, so let's not start waving our Italian flags all over the place, Cam. Exactly. Pono Glypter, top of the league in Norway! Pono Glypter! It's all the same! Oh, yes. It is really a horrible debate that nobody ever wants to get involved in, isn't it? What, Italian? No, no, I mean, it is so stupid when people say, well, the Premier League's there as well. Bundesliga, well, the league is just, it's just so tedious. This is what Kovac had to say, by the way, about the penalty. If you concede four goals in the Champions League, we don't need to talk about the penalty. Next up then, for Atalanta, who will they face? I agree, Nico, by the way. There we go. Arsenal or Bayern Munich. Speaking of Bayern Munich, of course, the Clásica this weekend. Oh, look at that. Wait a minute, wait a minute. Jürgen Klinsmann, Adam Marino, Kay Murray will be at Tom's Watch Bar at 8.30 local time. Be sure just to click on the QR code, that's details, how to register and watch Borussia Dortmund against Bayern Munich. If you can't watch it at Tom's, obviously you can watch it live on ESPN+. Maneco and PSG were home and hosed after that first leg victory against Monaco by three goals to two. The defending champions were made to work hard for their win. Monaco would take the lead just before half-time. They didn't get man-sent off into the second half. From that very free kick, PSG would make it 1-1. 2-1 then after they come out, Skellier pounces on a rebound. Monaco would get a late goal, but they couldn't get a third. they could have late, late on with a header that just went wide. But in the end, it's PSG who advance. Frank LePouf with us, who, of course, kept an eye on this. Frank, it's interesting, I think it was just yesterday, we were talking about whose favourites to win the Champions League, and the general consensus was PSG over Arsenal. But when you see performances like this, Frank, it's difficult to put too much of an argument as to why they can defend their title, because they look, as they did in the first leg, they look off again today. Exactly. It was maybe the worst game that I've seen for a year from Paris Saint-Germain. There was nothing. And I don't know if Koulibaly would have been on the pitch, would have changed anything because it's the free kick. And it's a free kick, let's say, because it touches Hakimi. For me, it's not a second yellow card. It's not a red card, therefore. But Koulibaly would have been on the pitch, would have been maybe a different story. But never Monaco deserved to go through because of that game. they were lacking consistency, they were lacking offensive spirit. Monaco was so good in the first half, you know, pressing them. They couldn't do whatever they wanted. Neves Vitinha was only the shadow of themselves. It's unbelievable to see how those fantastic players can be in existence for 90 minutes. and if Fires would give a penalty away the first leg and forgot to hit the ball, would have scored. Would have been the end of Paris Saint-Germain this season in the Champions League. And it was 10 against 11. So yes, if Paris Saint-Germain wants to win the Champions League, they will have to recharge the batteries and rethink their football because that wasn't the type of game you need to get in order to get some confidence and to be better and to win the Champions League for sure. Next up then for PSG in the Champions League will be Barcelona or Chelsea. No, that's a tie. Whatever happens. Yes. Yes. Yeah, indeed it will be. You know, I'm left with a similar feeling with PSG than I am with Real Madrid. They go through. Yeah. But they go through with a whole lot of questions. And we give them the benefit of the doubt because of what they did last season. And you kind of go, well, they're going to get it right. Yeah, they're going to turn it around. Well, this was an elimination round in the Champions League, and they did not get it right. And this is not a great Monaco team. They have frailties defensively. They are vulnerable through the midfield. And through the midfield, they were dominating PSG, an area in which I think, at one point, certainly last season, they were the best in the world through that midfield. And it's not happening this year. So I don't know how much more we're going to give PSG in terms of equity and say, eh, they'll be fine. Eh, they'll be fine. I don't know if they're going to be fine because they haven't shown to be the same sort of working team with that same sort of urgency, with that same sort of energy in the midfield that we saw last season. It's not happening this season. They may be exposed in the next round. PSG, Barcelona, I'm taking PSG all day. I think that Barcelona defence will get the horn apart. Yeah, and Hansi Fleck doesn't want this at this moment in time. He's hoping, he might be thinking it might come along, but he has so much work to do in his defence. In fact, I think he could probably be out there 24-7. From what we've seen this season, it's probably not going to get much better. It is going to be heavily reliant on the midfield and the front line doing the job for them and then getting on the prayer mat that they can, Jean Garcia can keep them out at the other side. but Hansi Flick knows if PSG click they could be in trouble but but the question is is they are miles off where they were at this point last year PSG they were really gathering ahead of steam they were really getting that momentum going that was was then going to become this this charge that was unstoppable culminating in was it 5-0 in the Champions League final against Inter, an absolute walloping. That's not the same PSG. But Barcelona will get so many frailties at the back against every team they play. Who would you pick between those two? At the moment? Yeah. Just because of the defensive issues that Barca have, I would have to go for PSG, even in their current state. Chelsea figure where in this conversation, Frank? Well, that's another question. We don't know that. That's us, Chelsea. You know, one day they can be the best team in the world. They did something. I think they beat Barcelona. Am I correct? I think so. And 3-0, like Paris Saint-Germain beat Barcelona. So I think that would be a title game against Paris Saint-Germain. They can do something good if they are all spot on. And Chelsea has proven last summer in a fantastic World Cup that they can beat Paris Saint-Germain. And that was a great Paris Saint-Germain. So everything is possible. That's the Champions League. And that's the word. That's the word of the modern football right now. Inconsistency. Nobody is capable of saying something good or bad about the team because they can change their faith. They can slip, drop the coin and click and suddenly be good. And the day after they'll be the worst. So it's very hard right now, except maybe with Arsenal, to say that a team has a little bit of consistency and can win or lose a game. I think what we can guarantee is that if it's PSG and Barcelona, it's goals everywhere. That's on the middle screen. Both teams. It's not in the Olympiacos. Buy a lever cushion. Olympiacos, buy a lever cushion. Get stuff. Hey, I'm going to ask you. Do you want me to ask you a question? that I don't think any of us would know the answer to. In fact, somebody might know the answer to it. Why are you asking me? Come on. I'm throwing it out of the room. Yes. I should know the answer. But it's this new form. Right. Right. FPSG. Yes. Draw Chelsea. Yes. Who did Barca get? Barca get Newcastle. Yep. There you go. All right. You surprised me. Yeah, because remember we talked about it yesterday and you went on about De Jong and Pedri. Oh, right, right. Hey, well done, Sean. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you, Pete. The next edition of the Gabby Jules podcast is available on Thursday. I think both are turning up this time. Be sure to check it out. That is it. That brings us to the end of today's show. Did the producer tell you or did you not? No, he told me. Oh, come on. Cheat him. Don't tell him again. Stay tuned as we've got Gab and Frank back to answer some of your questions. Welcome to the latest edition of Extra Time. Thank you for all your messages. Gab is with us and as a result, a lot of questions about Italian football, Gab. Not particularly complimentary ones, it's just one. The end of Serie A. How did Nzaghi get so much out of Inter? Nzaghi's a really good coach. I think that's undeniable. Keefe was in his first season. I think Inter are having a very good season. They were terrible against... against BOTO. Actually, you know what? They were terrible against BOTO Glimpse at home. Away from home, those of us who bothered to watch the game in the Arctic on the plastic pitch would note that they hit the woodwork a couple times. And I'll tell you this about BOTO. They're a high-risk, high-reward team that play with so much energy, which they can also afford to do because they've just been on a long break. I would not want to be facing them in the next round, whether I think they could get Sporting or Manchester City, of course they already be. So I'm not saying they're going to go and win, but they are extremely awkward to play against and Inter were clearly unprepared. Can I ask about the long break thing? Because it's interesting that Gab brings it up and who else was it that brought it up? It was, was it Barella as well, I believe? Chivo after the game. It was November 30th since they last played a competitive game. You guys always tell me that it takes three or four competitive games to actually get going in a season before you kind of feel like you're up to scratch so having said that is not playing since november in domestically does that actually give you an advantage uh oh thank you i i don't actually know i don't ask the norm because it's it's it's it's It's six and two threes, isn't it? If Bodo Glynn had gone out, maybe some people would have talked about match sharpness. Right. Lack of competitive games. But they didn't. So then we might be on the side of freshness. Okay. Let me rephrase that. As a player, what would you prefer? A game every three or four days that Inter are having at the moment, or all this time to build up to one game? No, I'd want to be playing. Right. I don't want to be playing because when you come back, you just don't quite know where you're going to be. As it turns out, they were in a good place, in good condition. And they've obviously prepared really, really well. Of course they have, because they knew this was coming. But I still want to be the guy that, I want to be in a team that I know where we are. And as Gab said, they're in a good position in Serie A. They're just not as strong a squad as they were. They're a bit more of an aging squad. They've lost some key players. And as I said in yesterday's show, I think it's underestimated the job that Simone and Zagy did with his squad rotation, with the way he set his team up, with his substitutions And that been a big loss for them as well certainly in the Champions League I think it really dependent upon the quality of the preparation ahead of this one game I can tell you and I can just give you an example from my own experience. In preparation for Copa America 2011, it was an intense preparation for about a month. And I mean, we were, by the end of it, we were kicking the backside out of each other. And we just wanted somebody else to play against. and it was like caged animals, we were ready. We just needed opposition. If you have that kind of preparation and you just let the animals go, then that's when you get this sort of energy and intensity that we saw from Boto Gwyn at home. The other thing that they have in their favor is that their preparation would have been most of it on the artificial surface, which some people may suggest, ah, how big of a deal that can be. Well, it can be. It is different. And if you're not used to it, and if you're not anticipating where the bounce is going to be, if you're not used to the speed of the ball and the speed of play and the speed of movement and how you cut back and how you're able to manipulate the ball and how your body reacts to the turf, it makes a difference. They know how that made a difference for them, and so therefore they're able to play at a higher level and a higher pace, higher intensity, higher energy than a team like Inter that is just trying to figure out, okay, where is this pass going to go? Where is this ball going to go? And then once you build a lead in the manner in which they did, then you put all the pressure on Inter. The pressure was never on Bodo Glynn. And then Inter were not able to deliver when the pressure got high. Frank? Yeah, I think on top of it, they had like two and a half months to prepare. So I'm guessing that they had some rest and then they started to play. And maybe they went away to play some friendly games before. And maybe the coach asked them, they said, guys, it's not friendly games. It's games to prepare the Champions League. So therefore, you have to give 100% in order for you to be physically, mentally, psychologically ready. So maybe, yeah, it's something awkward, I would say. And I agree with Craig by saying that I prefer to play games than to rest. But the freshness on top of the preparation that they had could be even better than just playing games like we do in our championships. But they were fresh and on top of it, they were kind of thriving for games and they wanted to get it. But I'm pretty sure that friendly games were very serious games. Gab, we had Jurgen Klinsmann on yesterday who suggested that tactically Serie A were being left behind Okay Did you say that? Yeah, yeah, he did I don't remember him saying that Yeah, yeah, he did In what sense? In a sense that other teams have involved basically, other teams you feel have kind of have got to move forward as opposed to Italian teams that are just kind of stale Well, I mean, Inter were in the Champions League final last year. Napoli were excellent on the way to the Scudetta. I'm just repeating what you said. I'm not Jürgen Klinsmann. I don't remember. You are listening. No, you are translating. You are translating from German to English. Oh, no, see, that's a problem. That's a problem. Right. Frank, which club has been most impressive since the new managers came in? Chelsea or Manchester United? Oh my god. I want to say Manchester United because they are so bad results, so bad way of playing their football. It's kind of a miracle what Michael Carrick is doing right now. Even with Maresca, Chelsea had good games. And if he's getting better with Rosinior, I would say that they haven't evolved like Manchester United evolved into their games. So I would say Manchester United. Gab, why isn't Victor Osserman on a better team? Before we get to that, Gab, he doesn't need his mask anymore, no? But he just wears it for fun? Is that true? That's like saying Iron Man only wears his get-up for fun. What do you think makes him so good? Oh, I'm sorry. So if he's so good and has these superpowers, why is he at Galatasaray? It's because I wrote a whole column about this. You can go look it up. No, he was on an enormous salary at Napoli. I mean, a really, really big salary, which for different reasons, certain clubs were unwilling to match. Some people also blame his agents. Napoli were holding out for a huge amount of money. There was a whole thing with his extension. Napoli were going to leave him out. So Napoli sent him on loan in Galatasaray. He did really, really well at Galatasaray. Galatasaray said, well, there's only a 15% tax rate in this country. We can afford it. We'll play Napoli in installments, and we'll work out a way to make this happen. And, you know, I think that's the reality of it. other clubs when you make so much money there's only so many clubs that can afford you and so if you're a Manchester United and you say hey I like Benjamin Sesko and you're Liverpool and you say hey I like a critique at hand Isak and you're Arsenal you say hey I think Victor Gjokeres is better than Victor Oseman hey that's where you put your chips down you know we can debate whether these were the right decisions or not personally I think no no no and no but because I think Oseman is one of the best center forwards in the world top three or four easily but hey uh that's just me so once you get out of that you get into that situation where you know it's either Saudi or or it's clubs like Galatasaray who can pay those very very high wages because like I said that's sad top tax rate in uh Turkey 15 15 is that better than Luxembourg Frank Oh, here we go. Excuse me, Luxembourg? No, no, but overall, it's very sad. No, no, no. No, no, no, no. Don't talk about Luxembourg or Switzerland, you know. It's not good nowadays. But I want to say something about Victor Ozyman. That's very sad. I mean, I understand the way that you want to put everybody more secure in your family and your future, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. but I would have loved to see Ozyman in the Premier League or in La Liga. With all due respect to Galatasaray and the Super League, the Kentucky Super League, but really, that's a little waste. Yeah, money is important, but it doesn't make all. And when you love football, you want to play for big, big, big, big, big, big teams like Real Madrid, Manchester City, Liverpool, maybe Chelsea. So that's what it is. And I feel frustrated to not have seen Ozymen playing for those big teams. Can I ask a question about your mask situation? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Your mask has binoculars? Well, it's quite thick, his mask. Didn't we have? We spent far too long to have a killing Mbappe's mask. I know, but I thought you were a cup. I know, but you weren't, you know. Yeah, but how do you define a mask if you don't have a bit of girth to it? Well, that's goggle shit. That's goggle shit. Yeah, no, it is true, but how do you... I need a little bit of thickness. Okay. Would you choose to wear that? What? Mike? Mike? Go it out? Dan's mask? Where's Craig gone? Oh, where's Matt's gone? Thank goodness. Now we know who he is. There was reporting, quoting an unnamed Spurs player that the squad felt like they didn't have to train as hard under Thomas Frank as previous managers. Is that more condemning of the Spurs squad or Thomas Frank? This is a story that comes out after every manager that is allowed to or told to go and out the back door and say get, there's always some player that says something whether the training session was too hard or wasn't hard enough. As compared to, say, Spurs when they had Antonio Conte and they were doing sprints up and down the field, I guess, I'm sure that the training was not nearly as intense. But this happens in every circumstance in which a manager is let go, that players have something to say about or leak information about how the trainings were either too hard or not hard enough. Yep. Yes. Craig, would you like to see Millwall go up just so Don would have to be on comms for those games again? Millwall fans hate Don, by the way, because he used to play for West Ham. And then he went back to West Ham. But the thing is, he wouldn't mention it. Not at all. It would be fun. Actually, they've just moved into, I believe, they've just moved into third in the championship. Yes. It does look like... It's them a whole Ipswich-Wrexham, isn't it? Well, it looks like Coventry-Middlesburg probably gonna go automatically but not a guarantee but it does look like Millwall might if they put a really good run together they could get an automatic but they're definitely gonna get into a playoff and then it's a bun fight. We've got to send Don to a game. Of course we do, that'd be awesome. We'd send them to the new den. Millwall West Ham, off you go Don, enjoy yourself. Get them a position as close to the Millwall whatever it is, ultras. Well, they're all ultras down there. They are, yes. He wouldn't go, would he? You think he'd go? He'd make some sort of excuse. I don't know. I'm worried about my safety. Final question, Gab. We know it involves a mask, but apart from that, what does a perfect day off look like for you? I'm sorry, could you repeat the question? Yeah, I know. What's your perfect day off? A perfect day off? Yeah. Wow. I think I would go for a nice meal, a walk in many beautiful parks and amenities that we enjoy here in West London. Lovely. And some reading, perhaps by the fireplace if it's cold or out on the terrace if it's sunny. Oh God, blow my neck. Could you see you sat by the fireplace with a book? Oh. And a pipe. Goodness me. Frank, please speak something more exciting. For me, I'm going to the gym, then having a nice lunch with my lovely wife. Then after, I'm going to play with my grandson and go back home and going to see a movie with my wife. That's a busy day. That's a lot. And I won't say the rest. That's a lot. It's not really a day off, is it? Yeah, it's not. That's a day on. I'm worn out. Stevie's, of course, would just be in bed. Well, that's a working day. Yes, what's yours? 36 holes? Not in this weather. No, that's very true. When's the snow going to stop? Yes, yeah. It would involve golf, I assume. A day off? Yes. Yeah, very unlikely. And then the evening reading by the fire. No, it's... It's done by the fire. It's definitely dog walking in golf. Oh, yeah, beautiful. Ali? Golf in the morning, Brazilian steakhouse for lunch. Nice. And then final round of the match. Brazilian steakhouse? Brazilian steakhouse. Is there any of those around? Yeah, Carford have got a couple. Oh, no, they've got, yeah. I'm just saying, if day off day happened anywhere. There we are. Carford. No, thanks. Brazilian steakhouse and then the final. Well done. What about you, Dan? Dan, what about you? I don't know what my best day off would be. I just love working, Frank, and we'll be back tomorrow. Well, you know, when he has a day off, he likes the head for a liver transplant. Just hang around, see what's going on. ESPN FC back on your screen tomorrow. Is there Europa League and the other league tomorrow? Guess who's back. Stevie, out of bed. Shaq! Allegedly. Oh, Shaq is back tomorrow. Allegedly. And the power rankings, of course. Will he still get a cake? F&D has foot on American soil. That's it. Gab just tear off his microphone. That's it. We're off.