Nutritional Expert Reveals Why You Have Cravings and How To Stop Them | Ed Mylett

Bowser is back! Ha ha! Bowser! Bowser! Everyone calm down! The Super Mario Brothers can take care of the kingdom. Let's go! On April 1st... Toad pack our things. Woohoo! The galaxy... Whoa! Is waiting. Who is this? Nessie! So some cool dinosaur just shows up and he's now part of the group. Cool. The Super Mario Galaxy Movie. Only in cinemas April 1st. This is The Edmillet Show. Hey everyone, welcome to my weekend special. I hope you enjoy the show. Be sure to follow the Edmillet show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. Here's our first guest. Welcome back everybody. You know... It's not easy to get on this show two times. Usually most are one and done. I'm so honored. And the reason I'm having you back was I was just telling you off air that, you know, the first episode we did just like virally went crazy. And I think it's one because of your brilliance. And just the way you deliver very complicated information in a very easy to understand fashion. That is... That's how you know you're a smart person. You don't have to try to sound smart all the time like I do. But the other reason is the topic. And so much of our audience is into this topic. And so let me introduce you so that everybody properly knows who you are if you didn't hear her last time. I don't know. Harvard trained, Cornell trained. I don't know what else you want to know. Columbia. It's got a little bit of an educational background. And her... She's an expert in a lot of different things, but we're really going to talk about today is hunger, your gut, your microbiome, how all of that stuff is connected so you can live better, healthier, with more energy, with better sleep. And there's some really cool stuff we're going to cover today with back for the second time. Dr. Amy Shaw, welcome back. So honored to be here. I mean, your show is just the pinnacle of, you know, mindset and motivation. So, so honored. Well, you helped me with my mindset and I am motivated when you're here. So my female listeners, I had different people on and I've always asked because I'm a man. I often ask about like, okay, testosterone levels, hormone levels related to food. And I had Dr. Lane Norton on recently and I had asked him, hey, how do you feel about exogenous testosterone? And a lot of my female listeners, which is more of my audience than men, ironically, said, hey, would you please ask somebody about female hormone health on the show? And I'm like, yeah, I should be doing that. Should nice since I have a daughter and a wife and lots of female friends. So is there anything food wise, particularly if it relates to a woman that's different than a man or just in general that you say, here's something you should be doing to optimize your hormone levels. Yeah. I love talking about hormones because that was my journey. I felt like my hormones were imbalanced. I kept thinking, how am I going to balance my hormones? But what I didn't realize is that this is all about gut health again. Okay, here we go. Okay. If you transplant gut bacteria from a male to a female, the female will have testosterone levels similar to the male. Without ever doing any testes, transplant or changing their hormone. Nothing. No. Okay. So it is coming from the gut. The gut bacteria can make hormones, can help you balance. So there's very good evidence that when you have too high estrogen, it kind of stops it. When you have too little, it kind of pumps it out. It is your best way to keep your hormone level stable as you get older. Poor gut health is one of the biggest reasons that women feel like their hormones are imbalanced. Maybe their cycles are off, their PMS is exaggerated. I actually talk about women should all know what their cycle is. So in today's world, in 2023, it's no secret that a woman has a 28-day cycle. It's still considered like, oh, don't talk about your period. You know, it's like you have a daughter, you have a wife, you have female friends. So I encourage women to start to learn their cycle, start to learn like, hey, there's a follicular phase for the first 14 days, then there's a luteal phase. And at the end of the luteal phase, that PMS, it's called the late luteal phase, you need to switch up how you do things. Late luteal phase, your hormones have dropped. It's like a free fall that the hormones just go away. Okay. Well, I'm telling you this so you can help your friends, your colleagues, the people, the women in your life and the women listening and watching this. So when you're in that phase, switch it up. Switch it up. So you're going to want to do less stressful activities. So if you like hit training, just lay off. Whatever that means, what it is for you. So if you're doing it three to five times a week, stay on the three or even two. You know, start to do more yoga restorative. Don't do the long fast. Don't do the things that are going to stress you out. Don't, even though you feel like eating a lot of sugary foods to get that mood boost, that's actually not the best time because your insulin sensitivity is also like down in the dumps. Okay. So eating things like sweet potato complex carbs, you know, things that are going to give you that feeling of carbohydrates, but they're not going to spike your blood sugar. So just don't keep eating the highly processed sugary foods because it's going to exacerbate the problem and you're going to get such an insulin spike that you're going to regret it after because people will say, oh, I gained like 10 pounds during my PMS phases because when they feel down, they're trying to replace their serotonin dopamine with food and then you end up really regretting it later. So try to do things that are longer lasting like fats are really good. Like avocado mixed with some complex carbs, eating a, you know, a burrito with beans and rice and avocado. That's a great way to kind of give that comfort food feeling without getting your blood sugar all out of whack. Okay. Thank you so much for that. I want to ask you in general, just make me think, think about my life. So when we were joking there, I was thinking about the people in my life that I talk to most regularly and I'm like, as it relates to gut health and I'm talking about the type of gut health that's obvious to you. Like I know I have gut health issues based on anecdotal stuff you've told me about my emotion level, my energy level, but I don't feel like I have gut health issues. If that makes sense. Like in my gut, I don't have a lot of discomfort or those things, but in my own life anecdotally, it does seem to me, I'm sure there's been no study on this and it's probably inaccurate, but in general, I would say my female friends mention discomfort in their gut more regularly than the men in my life. Has there been any studies about that? And is that just that women are more in touch with their bodies than men or men think it's okay to be bloated and whatever, you know, or is there actually some evidence that says potentially with women because of their cycle? I don't know what the reason might be that they might have more gut health issues. Women have more cravings. Women have more IBS irritable bowel syndrome. Women have met, women visit the doctor both because of convention, meaning like it's more, you know, men tend to not visit their doctor even when they have problems, but women have more of these issues and we're hormonal, gut health cravings. Like when we looked at the cravings research, first of all, there's not that much research on women in general, but when you look at the cravings research, it's markedly different. How much cravings really dictate a woman's life versus a man, it's like double. That's interesting. Yeah. See, I gotta tell you, I was talking to a good friend this morning about our wives and their health and we were both pointing out to one another that our wives, and I think this is just, again, these are over generalizations, right? Yeah, of course. But that women typically put everybody else first and themselves last. Yeah. And so they ignore these issues in their body. They've got to take care of their spouse or their boyfriend or their parents or their children or their grandchildren or whatever it is and they just sort of push away the discomfort or the, I think oftentimes like I'll get around to it, but I've got to care for everybody else and that's why when I bring somebody like you on the show, I hope all the ladies listening to this really take note of it, that you've got to sometimes put yourself in the mix and the men listening to this. If you have a woman in your life, ask her how she's feeling. And if she's got some of the symptoms of these things with energy or anxiety or depression or lack of dopamine or bloating or just discomfort, like whatever these things are, take care of your lady. Yeah. Make sure she's taking care of herself. And so I just really glad that I asked you that because I wondered, it turns out it's true. Let's fix some of it for everybody. What is a pre probiotic? So probiotics is what we talked about. Fermented food, probiotic food, food that has bacteria in it. That's probiotic. So we now know that eating as much, if you can get four servings of probiotics a day, that actually puts you in a category of the healthiest gut bacteria. It actually can happen for you. All of us, anyone who's watching today, they can start to eat. They can start to eat four to six servings of probiotic foods, which is the fermented cottage cheese, the yogurt, the kimchi, you can have apple cider vinegar. Okay. So there's a lot of things you can do. Prebiotics, so P-R-E, prebiotics, they're the food for your gut bacteria. So you and I have different gut bacteria, but we can be equally healthy if we're eating prebiotics. So prebiotics are the fibers in foods, the polyphenols, in foods. What's cilium husk? Yeah, that's a great fiber. So remember about the six foods I was telling you, cilium husk checks your fiber off for the day. Why does fiber make me feel, I feel like I get a triple whammy good with fiber. Yeah. One, stuff starts to get moving better. Yeah. Right. Two, I know the difference, but also I feel fuller. Yeah. Is there any other stuff about that? Yeah. Cilium husk actually expands in your gut. There you go. So we have a lot of receptors, and when our stretch receptors get activated, leptin, our hormone that makes us feel full, gets set to the brain. So you're like, oh, I feel fuller. That's why soup and salads and vegetables just are so good for our appetite control because of these stretch receptors. It's a neurological system. So when you stretch it, it sends signals and creates hormones that actually help you stay fuller. Fascinating to me. Is this good guys or what? Like legit. See, you're hearing stuff here. You don't hear every day. What if you're going, I got issues with this. What type, what doctors do know about this? Or is this stuff like, we got to get on MFing hungry. We got to read the book. We got to take the steps in it. But like, I don't even know who you would call. I mean, is it, I guess, who do you talk to about it? So I'll tell you the truth. The problem is, this is a huge opportunity for any company, any entrepreneur, right? Sure is. We said this last time, you're right. Anyone who wants to kind of get into this field, they can, right? But the, there's no gold standard. There's no test, no pill, nothing right now that you can take. Wouldn't it be awesome to take a, you know, lactobacillus, you know, cocktail of all these things that are going to boost our dopamine levels. Right now, there is a company that sells the stool pills of athletes. So you can get the fecal transplant that you always wanted from your favorite athlete, because you know, athletes will do anything to get an edge. Right? What if someone told you, Hey, you can eat like an athlete, you can start to think like an athlete, you might start to have better hormone levels, like that athlete. Wait a minute. Are you serious? The last time you were here, you educated me and the world about fecal transplants. And I thought, well, that's like one in a bazillion. There's no way like that's last ditch emergency effort. I've exhausted all options, but you're saying there's sort of a mini one or you're being serious right now. I'm serious. Okay. First, this for definition purposes, a fecal transplant is what you covered on the last show, but let's just do 30 seconds on that. And you're saying more and more that you could actually get a pill that you're getting LeBron James. Yeah. Bacteria in your body. LeBron James, um, stool is, it's 30 to 50% is bacteria in his stool. So the best way for you to transplant his gut into your gut would be to swallow that stool or to have it placed in your gut somehow. I prefer you put it in your gut. So fecal transplant is not currently not allowed by the FDA, right? Because they said it's really life saving for some people who, you know, just there, they have this, um, clostridium difficile. It's a very, very toxic bacteria. So they need a transplant from a healthy donor. So basically what they do is they take stool from a healthy donor. It could be your family member because it's like a blood product. You can, you know, you really can pass anything through it and they take it and they mix it up and then they put it back into you like with the colon, like if you've ever gotten a colonoscopy, they basically put it back into your gut and it basically seeds your whole colon. And now you have a whole new gut bacteria. Whoa. Well, what that does for me is I know that's new, but it tells me is like this part of medicine or science or nutrition is starting to finally progress. That's what's exciting for me. And the company that's doing this, I mean, it's genius, right? You take really great athletes, optimal hormone levels, great dopamine levels, you know, very, very fit and you, you take their stool and then you clean, you know, you make sure there's no diseases in there or whatever. And then you put it in a pill and you know, would you take it? I don't know. Yeah, I think I would be honest with you. I wouldn't, I, if it was in a pill, not the other way said, but all you guys out there and ladies that are getting really fit, hey, maybe there's going to be another way to monetize your fitness at some point. There you go. You're pooping in cups left and right and selling it. Let me tell you this though. If you want to do it the old fashioned way, remember that thing is like you're the sum of the three people you spend the most time with. It's actually true. It's true. So you're saying you'd be the sum of the three people's who's gut bacteria that you put into your body. Start, start sharing their food. Start doing more hand to hand contact. You know what I'm, I'm serious. Like that's why maternal, that's why moms and babies, when they breastfeed that skin bacteria goes into the child, they, it sees their gut when they come through the vaginal canal, it sees their gut. They have found that people that have C-section deliveries, they can tell 30 years later, 40 years later, because there's a difference in their gut bacteria. It's incredible to me. And the last time you were here, in case someone didn't hear it, she did talk often about sharing food with your children and how that's like you shouldn't do it. She's saying, oh no, absolutely you should do it because you're sharing that bacteria. So what is a psychobiotic? Okay. This is probably the billion, maybe like, you know, the diet industry is what, $4 billion. This is probably going to be double that. Okay. Psychobiotics is the next phase of mental health. So remember, in the beginning we were talking about how bacteria can make dopamine and it's much more potent. Yeah, it's great. You can also make serotonin. Okay. It can make GABA. It can make adrenaline. It has the power to change your brain. You can transplant the gut, that bacteria from one human to another and change their entire mental state. Amazing. Schizophrenia can be cured in that sense. Depression, autism, you name it. So now we're doing abysmally bad in mental health, right? We are going skyrocketing up. What if we started to think about it in a different way? Maybe we don't just think about it as like a deficiency in a chemical, right? Maybe we start to think about it as a whole body disease. Like I said, the big picture, the brain, immune system and gut. And we start from inside out rather than just giving them a pill. Yeah. You know, Amy, intuitively this just makes sense to me. Like it's the frontier of health now. So I want to go back for a minute. If you have somebody in your life right now, I just want to give you my layman's translation. You or anybody that you know that is struggling with gut health or they don't even know they're struggling with gut health, but they've got, you know, emotional discomfort in their life, energy, drive, ambition issues, and you've tried a lot of other things. Why not start to eat these six superfoods? Why not introduce more fiber? Why not go the prebiotic route, the probiotic route? Why not begin to do this and give it some time and see if you can really change the gut brain relationship? Because I got to tell you, like for me, I'm thinking of so many people in my life that have really tried almost everything. And also maybe eating wrong too with the way they fast. That's a big one for me. Because it's connected. How does... So you know how when you're doing something that's good for you and then you stop doing it, all of a sudden you feel, what the heck changed? So here's what happened to me. I've been feeling great for like a year and a half. It's because I've been on IM8. Then we moved to our place in Maine and I didn't bring my supplement with me. So if you've been looking for something easy to stick with that actually makes you feel better, this might be it. For me, it absolutely is something I rely on. And I noticed when I missed a few days. So give your body what it deserves with IM8. Go to im8health.com slash ed and use code ED for a free welcome kit. Five free travel sachets plus 10% off your order. So seriously, this is one of those offers you're going to wish you jumped on sooner. That's im8.com slash ed and use code ED for a free welcome kit. Five free travel sachets plus 10% off your order at im8health.com slash ed code ED. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. So you know what everybody? I really appreciate the comments about, you know, I've gotten a lot leaner and built more muscle this year and it was really intentional. And I was thinking, how can I get ahead, you know, on my fitness? Because I already pretty fit and worked out and it was how I'm eating. And that's where factor came in. Factor doesn't ask you to meal prep or follow recipes. It just removes the entire problem. Two minutes, real food, bam, done. And so once I started eating healthier and using factor, not only did I get a lot leaner, but I built more muscle. And the truth is guys, I had more energy. So one other thing I like is going to tell you, you can rotate the meals every single week. There's like a hundred different meals. High protein, calorie smart, Mediterranean. It's awesome. You should be using factor just like I am. Head to factormeals.com slash my let 50 off and use code my let 50 off to get 50% off your first factor box plus free breakfast for a year. Offer only valid for new customers with code and qualifying auto renewing subscription purchase. Make healthier eating easy with factor. When we work out or how we work out affect our gut rhythm or gut health. The best probiotic you can take is exercise. It is better than, and you could spend $150 a month and your exercise for 20 minutes, especially if it's outdoors is going to do a better job because our gut bacteria love exercise. They produce this like happy chemical called butyrate. It's a type of short chain fatty acid that goes all over the body, including the brain to calm down inflammation. Inflammation in your brain is what makes you tired. What makes you unhappy. Have you ever noticed when you exercise, you feel happier, you feel more motivated, but it has this anti-inflammatory effect on your body that is more than just the calories burned. So that is the effect of a short chain fatty acids. Short chain fatty acids is like an anti-inflammatory drug that you could never bottle up, but it happens when you exercise the gut bacteria make it. I got to tell you, I do feel better when I work out and I feel a level better when I work out outside. Yeah. Why? I was going to say when you were saying the change your food, I said, I would say if you were going to do one food thing, one non food thing. The non food thing I would do is start to incorporate a sunny walk into your day. One sunny walk into your day every day and see what kind of magic it does for your brain, for your immune system, for your gut. My mom just today said, I've been getting sick a lot lately. I don't know. All these viruses around. I don't know what's going on. So I asked her about the diet. You know what? She hadn't exercised in the last month when this all started. And I said, it's the exercise. It's not getting enough nature. It's not getting enough movement. You're really short changing your immune system. My goodness. My mom has those issues. Mom, start to walk around that park more often. She's doing it a few days a week. It sounds so silly, right? You feel like there should be a million dollar medication or a savior. I always tell people that there is no one coming to save you. No one's coming on a white horse and they're not going to have a cocktail of pills and drinks for you. They're not going to pick you up. You have to pick yourself up. You got to do the work. You have to move your body. You have to eat the right foods. You have to save yourself. I don't think you're crazy at all. On driving here today, one of my best friends called me. We're both saying to one another, just in a malaise lately. And both of us acknowledged that recently, even when we wake up, like there's been mornings recently, more for him than me, but for both of us, where there's just dread about the day. And for some reason, we both reached the conclusion, we need to work out and take more walks. And I said to him, a very well-known businessman that I know, one of the richest men in the world, now he does an extreme thing. He walks like four or five hours a day. I'm like, that might be extreme. I said, there's been something to his mental health, his creativity. He's in his 80s too. His longevity to being outdoors walking on a very regular basis. And it's just something that actually when I do it and I put my phone down, I feel great. And I think you're a million percent. I don't think I know you're a million percent right. You obviously don't need me to validate your research and your work, but anecdotally, it's exactly right for me. I mean, and the reason why people don't say this, I think part of the industry that we, the world we live in, this capitalistic world, they don't want you to just get better by walking around in the sun. Well, then you won't buy their stuff. So speaking of that, you're reading my mind. What if I'm on medication? I'm listening to this and maybe it's not you, it's your mom or your kids or something, but I'm on a statin. I'm on some medication for some ailment I've got. I got to figure if alcohol is messing my gut up. Somehow medication of any type is jacking with my gut somehow. Is it? Well, let's put it this way. We now know that there are many medications that inhibit the bacterial growth. We know obviously antibiotics is one of them, but now we know that acid reducing medications, they also harm the gut bacteria. Now I wouldn't, the problem with a lot of people is like, they want to just get off their meds, right? You can't just get off your meds. It's really dangerous. And sometimes you need those medications get you through. You need to work with your doctor and you need to say, hey doc, I want to start to reduce my medications. I'm going to change my, I'm going to read this book. I'm going to change my diet. I'm going to start doing the exercise. Can we do this together and then start to do it? Because some people, I mean, you need an SSRIs, those are the type of medications for depression or anxiety. You need that as a bridge. Maybe you're starting to do all that, but you need some time. You yank off right away. You're in the danger zone. Gut bacteria starts to change in three days. No kidding, that quickly. They, a landmark study in nature, which is like the biggest, it's like the Harvard of research journals reported a study where they rapidly changed the diet of people. And they just wanted to see like how long does it take to start to see a big change in their microbiome? Three days. Three days. Was that good news everybody? Cause a lot of stuff in life takes, you know, forever. I mean, I'm sure it's not fixed in three days, but it's making progress in three days. That's when it starts to, you start to feel, oh, you know, my cravings are a little different. And you know what everyone, you listen to my show every week, like, can I just say something to you as someone who loves you and I do the show for you? Do some of this stuff now. Take something we've covered today and implement it. Take at least one of these things. Go get, I'm so effing hungry. Read it. There's stuff in there that I've changed since the last time Amy was here. And it's, you know what? I, I, I think you sometimes have changes and you don't realize it. Like I have a lot of energy. You know, I'm working harder right now at 51 years old than I have ever worked in my life. And I worked really hard when I was young to go from broke to not broke anymore. And the truth is, I can honestly say this. I don't feel like it. I feel really good. Really good for a dude my age as hard as I work and travel. I attribute a lot of this stuff to many of the things you've taught me. Like one, this thing for me, like it was just really simple because I'm a simple person. I'm like, um, taking a probiotic going forward and I'm starting to eat way more fiber. Those, those two things, just for me alone, I'm like, this is a huge difference for me. It's just fiber alone. Like it seems really simple, but it's been a major game changer for me. So thank you. Just one, one, you know, you talk about one more, the power of one more. I mean that the, the thing that I think is so great for people when they hear that, when they read the book is that you can do one more, you know, like, so if you just, like you said, you can have one thing that has fiber in the day. That's, you can take one walk. Right. And the way, the reason I like doing one or two is then if things haven't changed, I know that wasn't the issue. It's the next thing, right? And so I'll go to the next thing. Um, what's chrono nutrition? Yeah. Chrono nutrition is this, uh, time restricted eating in the literature it's called, but we call it circadian fasting. That's chrono nutrition is you are supposed to be eating at certain times of the day. Medications actually work better when taken at certain times of the day. There's a whole, I mean, we never even talk about, you know, when to eat. We always talk about what to eat. Right. So there's a whole, um, there's a clock in every single one of ourselves. And if we're not following that clock, you will feel exhausted. You will feel hungry. You will feel the cravings. Have you ever not gotten a good night's of sleep? Are you reading my dad get mine right now? Cause it's about sleep was my next question. Please go. Yeah. Cause you talk about this a lot in the book. Yeah. Is sleep and things we can do to sleep better. So yeah, like the number one reason I wanted you back here for me to answer your question so that you can give the brilliance now is if there is an element to my wellness game, that there's still a big hole in it is sleep. And I think for a lot of people that they don't sleep well, they don't sleep deeply. They don't get into the right brainwave states early enough and sleep or long enough. They're not really resting when they sleep. So heck yeah, I know what it's like not to sleep well. So please fix this for all of us. Well, I have a question for you. If you want, if you want to share, what is your sleep like? Um, what's the issue that you usually have? Okay. Um, and then I can, we can use you as an example. Okay. Um, well, in my case, my heart rate's too high when I sleep. I don't like my resting heart rate. Um, I've been working on that. Um, I would say it's staying asleep. So I don't have that hard of a time anymore. It's a hard time falling asleep. My mind was racing. I've done things with making the room cooler, making it very dark in the room. Um, trying not to eat for a while before, but for me, it's staying asleep. I wake up a lot in the middle of the night. And, um, and then when I wake up, getting back into any type of deep sleep, I find, you know, once I'm up, it feels like very surface sleep to me. What are the hours that you wake up usually? Uh, a lot. So I would say, uh, I'm also a 50 year old man. So every once in a while, we have to get up and pee in the middle of the night. But, um, I would say that I probably get up, I, it's monitor. I want to those ordering. So it tells me, I'd say I'm up every 90 minutes or so, maybe every two hours, best case scenario. So I'm glad you did the sleep hygiene thing because, um, and that's what you were saying, the blackout curtains, you keep the room cold. You start to not eat. Um, but the other thing about it, and you didn't mention this part is a blue light. Um, are you getting a lot of blue light or looking at your phone, looking at your computer activating? So when you have an activating charged conversation, email, phone call, right before bed, what you're telling your brain is that there's a threat. Um, you know, there's a lion, uh, outside. Your brain's not going to let you sleep. Your brain's going to keep you on light mode, keep you alert so that the little of sound will wake you up. Uh, yeah, I'm blue light till I go to sleep. I'm on my phone until I go to sleep. I'm on my phone in the morning. Morning, I'm a little better. I'm a little better when I wake up. I've got that 30 minute rule where I don't touch my phone most days for the first 30 minutes, but I have to be completely honest with you. That blue lights in my grill till my eyes close. Yeah. Uh, in my bed, I'm heck, it's when I'm reading. It's when I'm doing emails. It's when I'm buying on Amazon, what I want or think about. So yeah, I'm on that phone and I am on that phone all the time as well. What about when you wake up in the middle of the night? I do check it. Yeah. Because you know what? Cause I have this goofy rule where it's not goofy. It's good. I don't check it once I wake up in the morning. But when I get up at 2 a.m. Do I check my phone? Absolutely. So one bout of blue light delays your melatonin by 90 minutes. So when, have you ever noticed that I've, so what you want to do when you wake up in the middle of the night is not look at your phone. Maybe you get a clock. If you need to look at the time of analog, a different, you know, way to check the time. If you're just curious, don't turn on the lights. Do kind of the squint and, you know, walk to the bathroom, dark, dark, dark. Keep your thoughts really clear. Not, you know, not, you're not going into your to-do list at 2 a.m. Don't start to rehearse like, Oh, I got this big guest tomorrow. I got to, you know, you don't want to be in your forebrain, right? Cause that's going to keep you up. So keeping it dark, keeping it kind of, you know, very, very dim and your thoughts very, very calm and then get back into bed and then see what happens. Because when you look at your phone, you activate those frontal centers, those, those are the, that's what's keeping you up. So when you talk about, when people take, um, THC marijuana, cannabis, all, um, uh, all of these aspects, what's happening is it turns off the forebrain. Okay. And so they're able to relax. What do you think about doing that? Taking some, uh, a little gummy before you go to sleep. My, my problem with that is that what do you do when you don't have the gummy? How do you, it's like, I'm fine with taking melatonin and taking, um, you know, uh, oils, uh, taking, you know, whatever you need as a, you know, stop gap method. But what are you going to do for the rest of your life? You can't, you have to learn how to turn that forebrain off, right? Like you have to learn to get out of, if you don't train yourself to do that, then you're always going to have that crutch. That's my only issue with all of this stuff. Right. If you can't socialize without your alcohol, are you really, are you really social? No, right? You're really right. Amy, that's my deal. It's the blue light for me. Yeah. Some people, it's the rooms not dark enough or cold enough or whatever. It's the cortisol, you know, also, I don't know about you, but I have a high stress life. You go to bed stressed, you wake up in the middle of the night because you have a little bump of your cortisol in the middle of the night. And for some of us, high strung people, that bump is enough to kind of wake you. I sometimes wake up and like, you know, especially when I have a lot going on. That's how I know. Me too. I love your work. Okay. Uh, two more questions. I want to go, I want to go four hours, but we can't. So, um, water, hydration as it relates to gut health and wellness. And like there's this thing, drink a gallon of water a day. Yeah. Does that, does your, how big you are calibrated in that? Like, I don't know, you probably weigh a hundred and five pounds or something like that. I weigh 210 pounds. Are we supposed to drink the same amount of water or is there some ratio there that matters? It's ridiculous, right? This whole, it's, it's what we call bro science, you know, drink eight glass of water a day. There's no study. I, I was even surprised because I thought, how could there be no study saying that you should be eating, drinking eight glasses of water. No study. This is just, um, I don't even know how it came about. Basically, if you talk to any, a kidney specialist, his blood specialist, we are trying to prevent dehydration. So you just tell people, drink before you get thirsty, because if you're getting thirsty, it's already a sign that you're starting to get dehydrated. Right. So you want to drink enough for your body that when you go to the bathroom, it's light yellow. Okay. It's not dark yellow. It's not orange. You know, it is, Shouldn't be an odor from it. Am I right about that? Yeah. There, I mean, sometimes certain foods like asparagus odor makes that odor, but really when you're drinking water, even a little bit of dehydration can make you hungry, can make you crave, can make you tired. So you really want to stay on top of that hydration. So for you, it may be a gallon, but for me, that might be a half a gallon. Okay. So you're one of the fittest people that's ever been on my show. And you're telling me you don't drink a gallon of water a day because of your body size, you don't drink that much. I drink to thirst. Like, I mean, I drink before I get thirsty. If I'm thirsty, that's a sign that I got to drink a lot of water. Okay. And also I would imagine when you're eating a lot of vegetables and things like that, there's actually water in some of the food you're ingesting too. Right. Probably not a lot, but there's some water in that food as well. And you know, but, but you have to remember that a lot of us are drinking a ton of coffee, which is a diuretic. So you got to counteract the coffee that you're drinking. Coffee, by the way, is great for your dopamine, because it actually increases the dopamine receptors in your brain. So it's good for motivation, but then it dehydrates. A lot of people drink it to go to the bathroom. Yeah. For me in real. All right. I love when you guys send messages out on social media about the show. And lately you've been getting a few of these messages about my wardrobe. I was wearing this sweater, this tan sweater. And I kept getting all these messages from guys going, where'd you get that sweater, bro? So I'm going to tell you where I got it. I got it at Quince. A well-built wardrobe is about pieces that work together and they hold up over time. That's what Quince does best. Here's the most important part. It's affordable. Don't break the bank. Right. Quince has the everyday essentials I love with quality that lasts. Organic cotton sweaters, polos for every occasion, lighter jackets that can keep you warm and changing seasons, everything for everybody. Okay. Go check them out. Quince works directly with top factories, cuts the middlemen. So you're not paying for brand markup. So refresh your wardrobe with Quince. Go to quince.com slash ed for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q U I N C E dot com slash ed free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash ed. Dell PCs with Intel inside are built for the moments that matter for the moments you plan and the ones you don't built for the busy days that turn into all night study sessions. The moment you're working from a cafe and realize every outlet's taken the times you're deep into your flow and the absolute last thing you need is an auto update throwing off your momentum. That's why Dell builds tech that adapts to the way you actually work built with long lasting battery. So you're not scrambling for the closest outlet and built in intelligence that makes updates around your schedule, not in the middle of it. They don't build tech for tech's sake. They build it for you. Find technology built for the way you work at Dell.com slash XPS built for you. I have to tell you something. And then one last question. As I started to eat more the way your book recommends, this is a really weird thing. I crave and dislike coffee more. I don't know what it is, but like, I can't even drink a full cup of coffee anymore. Whereas I'm like a coffee addict. Now I don't know what it is. I think it's because all my stuff, my pipes are working really good without it. Right. That I don't really drink that much coffee. And I don't, I don't, I didn't mind. No one's ever told me it's bad to drink coffee, but like I just, I frankly crave less of it. And when I made my coffee, I wanted like lots of splendor or sugar or something in it. And again, I think my gut health has improved to the point where I don't have the craving for sugar. So early in my day, and that distinction you made between craving and health is huge. You wanted to say something I could tell. I was going to say that I'm sure you say this. Motivation follows action, right? For gut health, that's true because you start to make the changes and then those bacteria start to motivate you. I don't know what it is with you and I today, but like you're, you're right where I'm going, like thank you. So my last question is you say this in the book, that the way you think, so can affect your gut health. So there's that your gut health can affect the way you think, but also the way you think can affect your gut health. That part, you're pushing my ability to understand. So finish with that. How, cause I'm, I'm a think, I'm a mindset guys, you said to some extent, how does how we think impact our gut health and what should we be thinking to impact it the right way? Well, that's why I said the, we're missing the big picture because that brain has so much power to create change in your body. We know our brain has the power to heal us, to make us happy, to make us a better people. Right. They have seen studies already, human studies where you take someone who's generally a happy, go lucky, well-beated. Like they rated their wellbeing as high. They have different gut bacteria than people who generally rate themselves as kind of more negative people. Right. So what you think. Can change your gut bacteria. That blows my mind. By the way, I should have great gut bacteria then. Yeah. Cause I think the right stuff most of the time I'd like to think that I do. That should be more motivation to, you know, hang out with the right people, think the right things, look at the right social media sites because your brain has so much power. I'm so glad you just said that. And I'm really glad you came back on the show. I think you're one of the most interesting people and this is one of the most interesting topics. And I told you, I was really glad the last time you were on that everybody seemed to agree. Yeah. Cause I do think it's so important. And there's a part of me that thought, okay, we're going to talk about stomach and gut and no, everyone was like, oh my gosh, this is incredible. And I think today was even better. I hope so. So I think you're remarkable. And thank you for all my gifts today, by the way, too. I'm so, I'm so honored to be on your show because I'm such a huge fan of your work and you. Thank you. Well, you know that that's extremely mutual and you're going to come on again. It's going to happen again. Everybody, uh, by the way, just first off, very clearly, I want to express to you my gratitude and thank you and thank you for your work and keep doing it because it's changing and saving lives. It just really is. Guys, this is why I do the show right here. It's days like today. Like I know we did really good stuff for all of you today. And the reason certainly isn't me. It's Dr. Shaw. So please go get her book. I'm so effing hungry. Depending on when you hear this, it might be on pre-order. It might be already out. Doesn't matter. Go to Amazon, grab a copy or get one in advance. And, uh, let's make this thing a best seller because the more people that know this stuff, the more people are going to live happier, longer, more fulfilling lives. Very short intermission here, folks. I'm glad you're enjoying the show so far. Don't forget to follow the show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. Now onto our next guest. All right. Welcome back to the show, everybody. Today is going to be one of those shows that you're going to learn a ton about your gut and your mind and your happiness level and your overall well-being in ways probably that you never have before. And so I specifically invited Dr. Amy Shaw to be here today, who, by the way, is the author of I'm So Effing Tired, which you should go grab right away. But we're going to, I actually come here today because this is a topic I want to understand more because I've actually been struggling with it a little bit, frankly, myself. So welcome to the show. Thanks so much for having me. And it was a difficult journey to get here, flying in. I'm here. I'm happy. I got to use some of the mind-gut connection tools that we'll talk about. Okay. Let's, let's get into these tools. So the first thing is, I was sort of surprised because I didn't realize this. You say that the gut has an impact on our mind and even as far as depression and mental health, mental well-being. And I did not know that. Absolutely. I mean, we always talk about mental health and the way of thinking differently or taking medications or, but there are bacteria in your gut. Actually determine what you're thinking, your mood right now, your energy levels, even schizophrenia, um, neurological diseases, anxiety, depression, they can literally change your mood by just changing the bacteria in your body. It's crazy. You can transplant a mood from one person to the other. We're going to talk about fecal transplant later, cause I didn't even know what the term meant until I prepared for the interview today, but let's stay there for a second. So you're telling me that, cause by the way, people that are listening to this or watching this oftentimes are having these emotions and these feelings that potentially they think are triggered by their environment, external environment. Someone cut me off on the freeway or I didn't get a promotion or, you know, I got a negative comment on social media. You're saying, maybe that's what it is, but it can actually be the bacteria in our gut that is actually signaling our emotions. How does that actually physically work? There are four, at least four different ways we know that the gut actually signals to the brain what we should be feeling at any particular moment. It produces serotonin. It produces dopamine. I mean, these are the things that we think about our produce only in our brain, but actually 90% of it is produced in our gut. And what it does is it sends signals. They have ways to signal to the brain through the vagus nerve, through creating little vesicles that go travel through the body and like inflammation. So using our immune system to communicate. So when you're trying to think about, Oh, I'm anxious or I'm not feeling well, I'm not focused or I feel tired. One of the things you should do is start to think about how you could improve that gut bacteria because there's a direct correlation. I mean, there is a bacteria called acrimacia. And it actually has been shown to reverse neurological diseases because it produces this vitamin B three who knew that bacteria produce vitamins in our body, right? And this bacteria, this B three nicotinamide goes to our brain and actually can help with the myelin sheets on our axons in our brain. So it's like protecting those sheets is so important as we age with dementia and with things like ALS and autism and neurological diseases. So this stuff is like blowing open the entire world of how we think about our mindset and mood and even like how we do work because we've been basically ignoring this data for so long. So we're on the track of killing these bacteria and stripping their functions. So basically we're working with a fraction of the bacteria we should be having. So this is so important for those of you listening to this because you're most of my eyes is pretty health conscious. Yeah. Try to eat right, train, you know, they read the good books, they listen to me, they do those other things. You use the term who knew. So I'm going to lay a foundation for that. Who does know and how long have we known? So we've been ignoring the data for a while, but my sense is, and this isn't, you know, this isn't the first time that I've had these thoughts or conversations, but obviously to the depth that you're and I are going to go today. How new is this thinking? How new is this space that you're in? Well, this bacteria that I just mentioned to you, acrimacia, it was named in 2004. So it was just discovered. And the links with autism and bacteria, it was lactobacillus, Ruteri, I think that was in, it was about 10 years ago. So this is new stuff in medicine. Anything 20 years or less is new. I went, I'm going to age myself, but about 20 years ago when I graduated, it was not really talked about. I mean, we didn't really, I mean, gut was gut. You know, if you had constipation diarrhea, then you'd deal with the gut, but you wouldn't think of it in terms of how we're focused or our energy levels or our mood and America is facing like epidemic levels of anxiety and depression. There's a 30% rise in anxiety medications, a 20 something percent rise in depression medications where the unhappiest we've been in 50 years and 56% of Americans say that they have trouble with their mental health. So we're in a bad spot right now. We're mainly treating that by trying to regulate the serotonin levels in someone's brain and instead of potentially looking at their gut health. So let's, let's stay on that for a second. The reverse is also true. You believe that the way that we think impacts our gut also true. Isn't that fascinating? Yeah, it is. To me, it's super fast. You could take people who are, you know, people who believe in God or people who think positively or people who have a well, well-being mindset or self, self-reported. And you can identify them by their gut bacteria. So there was a study that actually looked at their gut bacteria and they said, Oh, they look different in their diversity of how many bacteria there are and the prevalent species. And same with schizophrenia. I mean, they can look at the gut bacteria of schizophrenics and non and not knowing who's who they were able to pick out the schizophrenic people. Now that's incredible. Isn't that incredible? Absolutely. It's really incredible. The reason that I told you that I've been struggling with this, so this is going to be interesting for my audience as well. I'd found out recently that they, I had H. pylori. And so I was prescribed a huge course of antibiotics. Like I think three at one time, really, really heavy. And I noticed, and by the way, I'm sort of like the king of mental health and how to think correctly and programming your mind and the particular activating system. I know these are the things in your brain. And I found myself having a really difficult time. It's interesting because you were referred to me during this time. This is very recent. I was down waking up with like tremendous anxiety and, and, and I was, I would wake up with this anxiety and not know why I had it. And I'm almost creating things as I was coming out of sleep to be worried about, to be concerned about giving the given day. I'm like, this isn't me at all. And I'm trying every tool in my handbag that I've developed over all these years and they weren't working. And so you would tell me that that is probably the fact that I've wiped out this bacteria in my gut that I need. So this is important for everybody. Let's talk about antibiotics in general and the impact that they might have on other facets of our lives, other than just getting rid of H. Pylori or whatever that we have. Absolutely. And the sad thing is we're giving antibiotics to animals that are going to be, you know, our food in, in dairy and in meat. And we give it to children that are developing their immune systems. I mean, from zero to five, we can change our microbiome, but from zero to five, they are forming the basis of their microbiome. And if you're giving them different kinds of antibiotics and sanitizing everything they do using antimicrobial cleaners for everything, you will change their microbiome in a negative way that could impact them for their entire life. And so that, that's food for thought for us in the last two years. I mean, what damage have we done to our future population? Because we can recover somewhat. But when you're forming that zero to five, that's like the key time that you don't really want to be giving a ton of antibiotics during that time. Yet we give it out like, you know, still in medicine, it's pretty much given out to every single child. It's also given out to adults a lot too, though, right? So like, are, what's your opinion about that? Should we be prescribing antibiotics? And if someone's listening to this is, let's just be honest, probably in the last year or two, a lot of people listen to this, we're prescribed antibiotics for something, right? So what would you say to them? Well, it's like anything. I feel that because it was so beneficial for so many years, because it helped us live longer. I mean, people died it from, you know, diseases that we could have prevented. Now it's gone to the other extreme where there are people who are using antibiotics, antibiotics for things like, you know, when you have a viral infection or when you just want to be safe or just insurance. And that's really a dangerous path that we've taken not only for, you know, for people who have opportunistic infections, um, because once you use a lot of antibiotics, they don't work anymore, but it's also because we are killing that exact. Bacterial, uh, colonies that are making us happy, that are making us, um, satisfied, you know, when you come to hunger and cravings, we know obesity and cravings and, um, you know, eating disorders, they're all related to the gut. Okay. So, uh, we're going to talk about that in a minute about sugar cravings and what not as well. So it's interesting, you say this about antibiotics and the almost use of them, like their vitamins or something. And again, I'm not qualified to know whether or not, you know, it's the degree to which it hurts us. But I had a doctor one time that every time I went to Mexico would give me like prophylactic antibiotics before I went down there. You know what I'm talking about? I wasn't sick, but in case you might get sick, when you go down there, take these before you go and take them while you're there. Uh, yeah. And I think that's why this conversation is so important because I think now, if you know this and I know this next time we're offered an antibiotic, we might think twice like, Hey, let me just wait it out another week and see if I really need it because there are cases you are going to need it. So, um, it's, it's a case of over, overzealous prescriptions and it's really, really hurting us. Okay. So we now know that there's an emotional connection between our gut and our lives. We know that now in our brain. So we've established that, which is, you know, for most people, listen, as probably a revelation for most people, we also know that the antibiotics are going to monkey with those bacteria in there to some extent and potentially could eliminate the ones that serve us. That was a great conversation. And if you want to hear the full interview, be sure to follow the Ed Milet show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. Here's an excerpt I did with our next guest. All right, welcome back to the program, everybody. I'm so excited to have this man here today. You all know who he is. You've seen him. He's one of the biggest health and fitness experts on the planet. New York Times bestselling author. Most of you probably know him from the biggest loser, but if you've not been paying attention, there's another little deal here. This guy was dead for nine minutes. How about that? That'll get your attention if you're driving. Yeah, gone for nine, gone for nine minutes. And so we're going to talk today about one of the most interesting stories you've ever been here in your life. And then we're going to transition and talk about transformation and change because he's maybe a handful of people on planet Earth that are the experts at doing this with human beings. And Bob is one of them. So Bob Harper, welcome to the program, brother. I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having me. I'm thrilled to have you, man. So let's let's get into the most recent events in your life. So you're one of the fittest dudes on earth training, you know, five, six, seven days a week, you're known for helping other people get fit. You're at the gym, the workouts about to end and tell us what happens. This is shocking. Well, I'll tell you what I'm about to tell you are all the stories that were told to me because I don't remember that day. I don't remember getting up that morning, walking my dog. I don't remember going to the gym that day. I remember my friend said that that I was working out with. He said that I was complaining about being really dizzy. And he said that I just seem kind of out of it. The next thing I knew I woke up in a hospital two days later being told, not only did I have a heart attack, but I had gone into cardiac arrest. And so I'll tell you, that was a really eye opening, jarring experience for me. But it was I was in the middle of a workout. You know, I was doing CrossFit. I did CrossFit for years. I mean, I love that style of working out. And it was in that CrossFit gym that I just dropped dead on the floor for about nine minutes. I think sometimes people are listening to this. They're like, well, I'm 26 years old. Why is this applied to me? You're going to know why in a minute? Because there's preventive things you can do. There's some genetic issues for a lot of you. You don't know you have like I didn't know I had. But I'm curious about, did you have any symptoms prior? Were you having more fatigue than normal? Chest pains, you know, anything like that prior to this incident taking place? Looking at me at that time, I was not someone that you would think would be at risk of having a heart attack. You know, you think about you think about that person as being overweight, poor diet, smokes, drinks heavily. You know, I was not I was not any of those. I didn't have any of those qualities. So what I've learned in this situation is that I really need to look at my help from the inside out. And that's why I really try to tell people because it doesn't matter how you look. I mean, I'm looking at you right now with your, you know, jacked arms and looking on super bed and I'm like, you know, what's going on with your with your health? And you told me you had a heart attack. Yeah. Yeah. I had a heart issue since I was probably 30 years old. And it's one thing just for the audience is like, listen, you're all busy with different parts of your life. OK. And, you know, if you're overweight or you've got diabetes or you smoke, obviously, you know that you're probably, you know, in line for some sort of cardiac issues. But if you're fit, like most of the people that listen to this show, you think this is an issue or you're young. Listen, genetics plays a role in this. And you know this as well as I do. Maybe you could even speak to this. There are things people can do in terms of genetic testing right now to find out whether they may be a potential candidate to be in a gym at 50 something early years old and gone for nine minutes of their life. There's genetic testing now, right? Absolutely. I think that it could come down to just getting a simple blood test, right? Like really knowing your health care provider, asking all the right questions and asking questions that you don't even you don't even know to ask. It's like I tell people how important it is to have that kind of relationship with your health care provider because they are the ones that are guiding you into your into your longevity, right? So it's like you I don't claim to be a doctor. I don't have all the answers, but like I need to be around the people that know all the the ins and outs of my health. Yeah, it's obvious that you believe in God or the universe or whatever. You were sort of chosen for this. You like the face of fitness in the country. And then it happens to you after you're and by the way, you are around people helping getting examinations from doctors that were losing all this weight. I just hope everybody hears this. By the way, he has this project he's working on called survivors heart.com. And it's basically these photographs of people that have had these issues. And if you've ever wondered that there's a face of heart issues or cardiac issues, you will quickly find out there is not one face. There's men, there's women. That's one thing for the ladies listening to more and more heart diseases affecting women. I think oftentimes people think this is something that just happens to men because you hear about it. There's two guys talking about it today. You study the data. This number one cause of death in women now is their heart. And so you get tested. And the other thing on testing, and I'll let you speak to this, but the testing is a lot better than it used to be. You know, you're going to it's not just HDL and LDL. There's big particle, little particle, there's lipoprotein, little A. There's all these things that are markers now, guys, that you want to get looked at. Get your labs done. I talk about this all the time on the show. So yeah, I had that was my genetic issue. Lp little A. Me too. You just brought up and that was something that I was not even aware of. I didn't know anything about it. And it's a simple blood test. And it's one of those things that you've got to ask your doctor about. It's like, you know, you're doing these blood tests on me. You're checking my cholesterol. Check my LPA because that's the issue that I had that still a lot of people don't even know about. But it's incredible. You say that because that was my issue. That's incredible because, you know, your average general practitioner, guys, I think they're like, yeah, we'll test your HDL and LDL. There are other things now, and especially the lipoprotein A that you need to know. So now let's know how it affects your life. Because I'm just super curious. Two days later, you wake up, you're like, people are probably informing you of what happened. How did this affect you emotionally? It was really, really difficult, I'll tell you, because imagine think about whatever it is that really identifies who you are, what makes you just get up in the morning and it's a reason to live and it's your driving force in life. That's what health and diet and exercise has always been for me. It's like, you know, I love to go to the gym. I love that's my community. It's like where I go and it's my stress reliever. Now put in the most horrific thing that has ever happened to me in that situation. So what happened for me is just dealing with PTSD. Like, am I going to have another heart attack? The fear that I had as I'm walking around, I was afraid to be alone. I could not be alone because if I would have been alone when I had this heart attack, I would be here talking to you right now. People say, oh, you were able to recover because you were so fit and so healthy. I'm like, no, I'm here today talking to you because there was someone in the gym that day that knew how to perform CPR that was aware of an AED that had the persistence because the AED wasn't working on me because I had already a flat line and like an AED won't work unless there's some sort of electric current going on with your heart. And so this man, this doctor who was not even a member of the gym, he was at an event that day, he said that he saw me. I was blue on the ground and he thought, OK, you know what? I am going to do everything that I can. I almost busted my rib cage open when I was when I came out of out of the coma. I had pneumonia because they had to put me on ice because what they tried to do was like, OK, am I going to survive? Then they realized I was going to survive. But then they thought, am I going to be the same person? So they had to put me on ice to try to protect my brain with brain swelling. And so it was it was really a challenging experience. And what I what I would gather during this time was all the people around me, they were very interested in my physical well being and my physical health, which was absolutely what what they needed to do. But it was the emotional turmoil that I was going through, too. It was like, who am I if I am not the fitness guy? Right? Who am I that who is this new person that I had to find a completely new normal and it was super challenging. They use the AEDs on you multiple times, which is I'm just picturing this beautiful soul watching, you know, picturing you, your fit. For some reason, the visual for me really affects me. Just picturing you there and them kind of get you back in the CPR. And there's another part of me, Bob, I'm just thinking this is sort of destined to some way to be someone. You had the combination of your notoriety already. So you have a platform, you're already fit. So you're this face of a heart attack that's different for most people. There happens to be the doctor there. You know, this isn't by coincidence that all of these things happened. But I and I just want to say that to you, just as a friend, as a brother, just like it's got as obvious the writings on the wall and hindsight, like everything in life, right? But at the time, I have to wonder for you, you know, you said it changed you a little bit emotionally, because like identity. Oftentimes, a lot of us, I think our identity is tied to what we do. Yes. Not who we are. And and oftentimes an athlete of their careers over, they don't know who they are anymore, because they can't do that thing anymore. So what process did you go through to kind of figure out? Was this like the first time you're like, who am I? But I got the feeling you had done work like that before. But just I'm curious, what was it like you're discovering you for the first time? Pretty much because I I've been in the health and fitness business for over 30 years now. I mean, it's like it is who I am. It is a part of my DNA. So me having this heart attack, I was I was also very embarrassed. Like one doctor and therapist that I was working with, he had asked me, he was like, give me one word to describe that that whole experience. And the first word that came to my mind was embarrassed. Like, yeah, how did this happen to me? And I remember, wow, I remember my my my team, the people that I've been working with for such a long time, you know, everyone was like, Oh my God, is he going to even have a career anymore after this? Because of what had happened to me. And I remember just like leaning into it, right? I was an open book during my whole recovery time, because imagine this. I wasn't able to do any kind of work workouts. I was in the hospital for over a week when I got back. My doctor was like, OK, here's what you can do. You can walk. And I was only able to walk around a block without feeling super fatigued and tired. And like I was coming from doing CrossFit when I was Olympic lifting. I was like a two hundred and ten pound guy that was like it. And I loved it. And now like I'm living in like, you know, the 170s and I'm having to to pivot. That's the word that kind of keeps coming to into my vocabulary so much of like having to pivot because what I can't do anymore is be the person that I was when I was in my 20s, my 30s or even my 40s. It's like I don't want to keep searching for that dangling carrot. Like it's that. Well, I was able to do all this. Why can't I do this? I'm like, you know what, I can't. And maybe I could if I put the put the time and the effort. But like it just it's not interesting to me anymore. I'm like, OK, you know what, I do I do hot yoga every day now. I you know, I ride my bike. I you know, I do workouts like that. And you know, I feel really good with what I'm doing. But it was just it was having to kind of come to grips with what had happened to me and in learning how to pivot and and not just get stuck because I was pissed. I was pissed that this had happened to me. I didn't want to be experiencing this. I was like, you know, I always thought, you know, I'm a superhero. Yeah, I'm in my I'm in my 50s. And I'm like doing these workouts with these, you know, 20 and 30 years old, 30 year old people. And I'm like, you know what, that was part of my identity. And, you know, that had to change. And it changed really quickly, really, really dramatically. I wonder about the pivot thing because, man, consciousness, human beings right now, there's more people right now pivoting to some extent in their life than ever at any time on the earth. Right. Like either their career ended because of the pandemic or they're shifting or even they're just their whole outlook on things has changed now that they've had more time to reflect on what matters to them. And I get asked this a lot. You know, millions of people listen to this or go to my social media. I'm changing right now. I'm pivoting. Any advice on that? Like, you know, you had to accept, OK, this is no longer my life. I'm in a new normal. Is there anything beyond that you did? Was it creating a new outcome, a new vision for your life? Or was it what was it that helped you pivot? What did you do? I think that I just relinquish control. I'm a and that was very hard for me. I am very type A. I am competitive. I want to compete with not only you, but myself more than anyone. And just kind of like relinquish that control and realize, you know what? I can't do everything. I don't have all the answers. I want to continue to learn as we move into this life and I don't I feel like if I feel like I've learned everything that I'm supposed to learn that I need to move on to something else. And so like my life is like pushed me into a place where like I'm learning things all over again and and that's exciting and and not not trying to like I said earlier, not trying to compare myself to what I used to do. I don't want to live in the past. I have no control over the future. What I have control over is right here and right now. And like and that helps me. That helps my that that hamster that's in the wheel running around in my brain. Yes, it helps that little hamster in my brain going like this. All right, just chill out. It's going to be OK. And so yoga helps me do that and meditation helps me do that. Yeah, because being present is so hard for achievers and competitive people. And I think they just grabbed you and went, all right, dude, this is it. We're going to have to give you a heart attack. Cardiac arrest. Yeah, or you weren't going to change. And it's interesting, I'm 50 now and I'm a control nut as well. And I've just sort of started to surrender a little bit that to the moment. And I say everybody to this, I've started to just just a little. I'm still a nut. I started to start. I started just to surrender that, you know what? The truth is a lot of that control I thought I had was a little bit of an illusion. I was winning and being happy in spite of my control. Freakiness not because of it. And here's the gift. And you just said it. I'm learning a lot more when I'm not trying to control everything. I'm open to more things. There's a more beautiful part of the moment in my life than there ever was before because I was always just holding on to what I wanted to move and do. And you feel the same way? Yeah, absolutely. It's like it's that white knuckle feeling, right? I'm just like, I'm sitting there going like this. I can do this, whatever this is or whatever it is, I can do it. And I'm going to figure it out. But there's always been this like little phrase that my friends say say about me. It's like Bob will actually cut his nose off to spite his face. So it's like, you know, having that just that obsessive type thinking and what what I really try to do. And it's something that I practice all the time. It's not easy. It's not easy for me to not get twisted about the big things in life or the little things. And I have to make a make a conscious decision. I have to think about it every single day. And when challenges do come up for me and I I see myself kind of like white knuckling it again, I'm like, oh, there's that behavior. And just like me acknowledging it, it helps me to release it. Does that make sense? A big time. That's the best anyone's ever said it. Acknowledging it helps you release it. Because I talk a lot about when you're aware of something, it loses its power. And impact over you. But I like the way that you just said that a lot better. I totally agree with that. And by the way, guys, those of you that are obsessive, I think sometimes, you know, when you get to where Bob and I are at in life, a little bit older, you know, it's a different season to some of you that are in your 20s and 30s and doing something to your right. Maybe maybe that obsessiveness, that control thing, maybe at that stage and that season is appropriate for where you are now. Absolutely. It's like, you know, I think about when I started working on loser, you know, that was 20 something years ago, I was, I did it for, I did it for almost 20 years out of my life, which was a really long time. I had no time for anything. I had no time for relationships. I had no time for friends. I had no time for anything other than work. And I embraced that. I just realized, OK, you know, I've been given this this opportunity. I'm going to take advantage of it. I am going to take it as seriously as possible. And I did that. And now I am kind of relaxing more and not feeling like I need to do it all right now. Before we start the interview with my next guest, just want to remind you all that you can subscribe to the show on YouTube or follow the show on Apple or Spotify. We have all the links in our show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. Now on with the show. All right, everybody, welcome back to Max House. Today is going to be very, very detailed stuff. And it's going to be something that is going to impact you in the way that your brain works, your body works, your entire outlook on life is going to be different. I have a very special man with me here today. I guess he's a health and science journalist. He's a podcaster. He's a researcher. What I know is he's brilliant. And I was telling him off camera, the IQ gap between the two of us is rather significant today. So I'm going to pretend to hang with Max. Today will be the most detailed information you've ever received on your life. On food, your body and how to make yourself more well is the way that I would describe it. So Max Lugavere, welcome to the Max Out Show with Ed Milat. Great to have you. Great to be here. And what an appropriate name. I mean, I feel like we're really going to max out today. We are. We're going to max out. My son's name is Max, by the way, too. So it's very easy for me to remember your name when we're preparing. But I got to tell you in preparation for this blown away. You're when I introduce guests, you know, I want to make sure I do them. Justice, but also tell the truth. I consider you one of a kind right now in the world and the way that you think you articulate the breakthroughs you've discovered already about the body, the mind, and how food in particular impacts it. So today, guys, is going to be very, very special. I want to talk at length, well, in some detail about you went there earlier. And I'm glad we're going to go there. We're going to talk about what we put in our mouths now. And you said process foods versus, you know, really healthy raw, real foods, real meats, real greens, what have you. I eat like a lot of people, I bet that listened to the show. If I started to add up how much processed food that I eat in a given day or week, it's pretty scary. I'm talking about protein bars, protein chips, things that I, at least in my mind, I think are healthy because they're getting me protein, low calorie, really quick, tastes pretty good. It's a snack. But I mean, I, I ate a ton of processed food. Why is that bad compared to eating what you I don't know what you would call it? Real food every single day. Yeah. So I mean, I think it's important to make the distinction, right? Like processed food sort of has this really negative connotation associated with it, especially these days. But when you cook your food, you're processing it. So it's not it's not necessarily that processing is like this, this evil, this evil thing. It's it's the ultra product. When food has just become so pulverized and removed from its natural form that it's hardly recognizable from its original form. You know, when you take a steak or something or a piece of like raw meat and you cook it in your pan, you're processing it. When you put, you know, whole foods in a blender, you're processing that food. The problem with ultra processing, which is what the food industry does is it creates foods that are what are called what food scientists refer to as hyper palatable. It becomes really difficult to moderate your consumption of those foods. These foods are designed to be over consumed. And by the time you've reached satiety when eating these foods, you've already over consumed them. You've already. Wow. Yeah. They've shown this actually recently. There was a National Institutes of Health study led by an obesity research researcher named Kevin Hall. You can look up the study that found that when people were given an ultra processed diet to consume ad-libitum, meaning like you were able to eat whatever you wanted until you reached a point of satiety, they ended up eating a 500 calorie surplus every single day. Wow. When, you know, when just eating to feel full, which is something that every human being wants to feel right when when eating food. I mean, it's like it's a privilege and great thing to be able to feel full. It's something that we all want when we're when we're eating. They in the crossover trial, what they then did was that they gave these same subjects access to a minimally processed diet and to the same degree of satiety. So so eating also until they were full and satiated, they ended up eating at a calorie deficit of 300, you know, 300 something calories. Yeah. So I mean, that ultra processed food diet, which by the way, today is how most people are eating most of the time. 60% of the calories that we consume today come from ultra processed foods. That right there explains the obesity epidemic, you know, because because we're just constantly in proximity to these ultra processed foods where it's really difficult to pump the brakes on them. We end up over consuming them. And and the other problem with these foods is that they're minimally nutritious. So not only are we walking around, you know, with ever expanding waste lines, one in two people by the year 2030 are going to be not just overweight, but obese. And half of us are either type two diabetic or pre diabetic. Ninety percent of us are deficient in at least one essential nutrient. So we're overfed and we're undernourished. And when you put those two features together, that's why you're seeing accelerated aging. You're seeing, you know, I think, you know, just just, you know, just unprecedented rates of cardiovascular disease of, you know, certain cancers and of dementia. I mean, because the brain partakes in, you know, whatever's going awry in the body, the brain suffers the consequences of that as well. And these ultra processed foods, is there an ingredient or two that must be avoided? Like, hey, this is really toxic and bad for your body when we're looking at the the list of ingredients and something chemicals in there. Is there a one or two that are just no no's? Well, I love that you asked that question, really, really getting practical. Practical. I think that the that the that the kinds of ingredients you really want to watch out for are refined grains. So that's one and refined grain and seed oils. So refined grains, you know, the wheat flour, the rice flour, the, you know, the corn flour. I mean, I'm not dogmatic in my approach. I know, eating a piece of whole corn on the cob is one of my favorite things to eat in the summer. You know, I eat white rice on my sushi. Like, I'm not dogmatic about like, you know, grains are the devil or anything like that. But in these ultra processed foods, I think refined grains really are problematic. I'll give you another reason why, actually, just because it's because it's interesting. When you eat, say you eat a handful of whole nuts, right? And you look at the calories in, you know, on the back of the nut package or whatever. And you see whatever we'll just say it's 500 calories worth of whole nuts. You're actually only absorbing about 70 percent of those calories. Because, you know, when you chew whole nuts, the particles are too big to be fully digested. It's a whole food. You actually end up pooping out a significant amount of those calories. When you eat, yeah, when you eat pulverized wheat, corn, rice flour in these ultra processed foods, you're absorbing 100 percent of those calories. Not only that, not only that. So I mean, a calorie is not really calorie when it comes to nutrition facts labels. Not only that, but those calories get absorbed really rapidly and really high up in the small intestine. So it basically sends your blood sugar through the roof before your body really even has an ability to, you know, you're still eating while your body is like, you know, what do we do with this sudden influx of sugar, essentially? So I think it's important to avoid foods that are based predominantly on those on those kinds of grains. Very, very interesting. So a couple of things on going in our mouths again. I've heard you talk about baby broccoli or broccoli sprouts. And this is like some people think this is splitting hairs, but it's not. I don't understand like, is it like sulfatine or the NRIF2 pathways? Whatever the heck it is. But I know a little bit, right? Why is baby broccoli or broccoli sprouts way better than like broccoli in particular? Why eat that? That's a good question. So when you chew broccoli sprouts or any cruciferous vegetable, you basically break apart the cell walls where two chemicals that are kept in isolation in the in the plants unite in your mouth to create a new compound. And that compound, in the case of cruciferous vegetables, is called sulforaphane. And sulforaphane. So yeah, yeah, it's considered an insect, like an insecticide, a natural insecticide that plants create, right? Because plants can't, you know, tooth and nail their way out of, you know, out of being eaten, right? So what they do is they practice chemical warfare. And so they create these compounds that if you are a smaller critter, maybe an insect, a mouse, a mold, the compound would make you sick. And so, you know, when a mouse gnaws on these plants, it creates these compounds, you know, sulforaphane is just one of them. But there's, you know, I mean, the plant kingdom is just full of these, like, natural defense, defense chemicals. What we see is that sulforaphane in somebody like you or me, you know, a big, robust organism, actually has a number of beneficial and protective effects via a mechanism called hormesis. So hormesis is when you consume a plant compound and, you know, if you were to consume a lot of it, it would be toxic. But in small doses, it actually has a beneficial effect. Sort of like a counterintuitive beneficial effect, because here we have this toxic chemical, but in small doses, it's actually good for you. The same thing actually applies to exercise. You know, you could exercise enough where it would kill you, right? It's a stressor on the body. But in small doses, exercise actually makes you more robust, more resilient. We can sing the praises about exercise, you know, for hours. But sulforaphane is great because it's been shown to increase levels of a compound in the body called glutathione, which is the... Yeah, it's the body's master detoxifier, master antioxidant. It's being studied now as a means of, you know, it's it's cancer protective effects. It's also been suggested in a small clinical trial, I believe, to reduce symptoms of autism. So for anybody that has that in the family, I think it's worth looking into, you know, it's just one of the many benefits of eating a varied diet that includes cruciferous vegetables. OK, glutathione. I love glutathione. So I can't explain this. I'd like you to explain it to me. So I do some... I haven't done it in a while just because of COVID, but with all my traveling and I get depleted, I do IV therapy, even just sometime to get hydrated. I'll take IV hydration. One, I'd like your opinion on that. Actually, two, what's your opinion on that? Am I just peeing it all out or does it help? But here's what I know. When they put glutathione in my IV, something amazing happens to my body. There's a calming effect. I can feel that I feel B12 when they put it in, you know, you get all wired. The other stuff I don't really feel. For some reason, glutathione, I can feel better actually when it's in my body. So do you recommend someone supplements with it? Why is that happening? Are my crazy? And what do you feel about IV therapy? Yeah, I don't I don't really recommend. I don't make the recommendation that people supplement with glutathione. I mean, I have glutathione. I take sometimes liposomal glutathione supplements, but I, you know, I'm not I really am pretty convinced that, you know, supplements should be used very diligently and deliberately based on your diet and your specific deficiencies. And, you know, even in some cases, genes. But no, I don't I generally don't recommend that people supplement with it. I just don't think that you need to if you're eating a diet that is supplying the raw materials for your own, your body's own glutathione synthesis. So sulfur containing amino acids is very important. Grass, beef, eggs, things like that. You know, anything with sulfur in it is actually going to be going to be really good for you. Sulfur is a rate limiting element in the synthesis of of glutathione. And so when you consume, for example, cysteine rich foods, you're going to basically be supplying that. Also glycine. Glycine is really important. So it's one of the reasons why I think collagen is worth consuming. And collagen is actually a supplement that I think is worth looking into, because we don't tend to eat a lot of collagenous tissues at this point. You know, you stay on that. You don't you don't think that you break down those supplements in your stomach and you're never getting any benefit to taking something like I've had other people tell me, hey, you're taking a collagen supplement. You're not getting any of it. It's it's destroyed before it gets to you. Yeah, you do break it down. So it's not a one to one. You know, it's not like you consume collagen and it becomes collagen in your joints. Yeah. Well, you are increasing your supply of glycine, which we don't consume off of your average person consumes about two grams of glycine every single day. And you create in your body another two grams of glycine. And and that is why glycine is actually not considered an essential amino acid, because we we create it to some degree. But I don't think that we create enough for optimal health, especially today when we consume lots of muscle meat. And the reason for that is so there have been research calculations that that speculate that we need about 15 grams of it depends on your weight and what you're eating, but about 15 grams of glycine a day and that our needs for glycine increase with higher consumption of another amino acid, methionine, which is more present in muscle meat. And we we use we use glycine to create collagen. So by not by not consuming adequate glycine, again, we only ingest about two grams of every single day, you might be actually limiting your body's ability to create to create collagen and collagen is super important. I mean, it's important for I mean, it's like the most abundant protein in the body and production of it declines as we get older. It's important for the health of your, you know, your veins, your arteries. So so yeah, it's one of those things that I think if you're not eating collisionous tissue in animal products, I think it's worth supplementing with. OK, by the way, thank you. I told everybody in the beginning of being like feverishly writing notes. The cool thing about this show is they're listening to it in their car like, all right, well, I'm going to listen to I got to go all the way back in a notepad out and start writing all this stuff down. So I really appreciate it. That was a great conversation. Be sure to follow the Edmai Let's show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. Welcome back to Max out, everybody. My guest today is Dr. Andrew Huberman, and he's a neuroscientist. His lab is at Stanford. Today's going to be one of the more interesting shows for me that we've ever done before because I'm fascinated with this man's work. And he's unique because although he's a brilliant person, he's a neuroscientist. He speaks in terms that people like me can understand. And so he's got a very unique ability to understand information. And articulate it in a very understandable and digestible fashion. His lab and Andrew, you can correct me if I say this in this wrong, but his lab mainly studies two things, which is really vision, literally vision, the workings of the retina. And then secondly, really different states of mind. And is that about accurate, Andrew, would you say? That's exactly accurate. OK, good. And so today we're going to stay on the ladder. We're going to talk today predominantly about states of mind, growth states, peak performance states. And so I'm really honored to welcome Dr. Andrew Huberman to the show today. Welcome to Max Al, brother. Thanks. So great to be here. It's an honor and a privilege to be here. So looking forward to our discussion. I am as well. And we could go so many different places and we will. If you're in your car listening to this or on the treadmill, it's one of these you're going to listen to twice or go over to YouTube and watch it or vice versa because there's going to be so many nuggets in here. Blue and yellow light, would you talk about that a minute when you're talking about getting eyes closed and getting to sleep? The impacts. I mean, this is awesome right here, everybody. The real impact of blue and yellow light and its origins, too. Yeah, so let's start with the don'ts. So here's why you don't want to view lights of any color, blue or otherwise, that are too bright between the hours of 11 p.m. and 4 a.m. The reason is there's a study published by my good friend, Samer Hattar, who's head of the chronobiology unit at the National Institute of Mental Health, so he's a heavy hitter. He found that blue light and bright lights of all kinds in the middle of the night, if you look at them too often, there's a neuron in your eye that signals to a brain area called the habanula, H-A-B-E-N-U-L-A, that literally suppresses the amount of dopamine in the brain and gives depressive like symptoms and impairments and learning and memory for about two days that follow. Now, if you look at some light once in a while in the middle of the night, you go to the bathroom, no big deal. But if you're up in the middle of the night and looking at lights of any color, not just blue light, and those lights are bright enough, you're going to suppress your dopamine levels and it can lead to bad places. So on average, try not to do that. If you're a night shift worker, you might want to use blue blockers. Blue blockers for some people can be helpful in just reducing the overall brightness of light in the evening, but dimming the lights in the evening and actually setting lights low in your environment, not having overhead lights, is good because the cells that read this stuff out are in the, and signal the brain in the lower half of the retina, which we use in the upper visual field. So that I suggest to almost everybody. The flip side of that is during the daytime, in particular, within the first hour of waking, you want to get as much bright light stimulation of the eyes as you possibly can. You don't want it to ever be painful. OK, so if it's painful, you're injuring the retina and you don't want that. But bright light, ideally you get outside. Through a window, you're only going to get about a thousand, what's called about a thousand lux, which is a measure of intensity of light outside. It's about 50,000. Even on a cloudy day in Boston in winter, you're getting more light through those clouds outside than you are with a bright light inside. And it's very important because early in the day, your brain needs to wake up. Your whole system, your biology needs to wake up. And it does that by releasing cortisol in a bump early in the day. That's a good cortisol release. And it sets a timer so that melatonin, which is a sleepy hormone, comes on about 16 hours later. We know from a lot of studies that if you don't get that bright light during the early part of the day, you get a second cortisol bump at 9 p.m. and that second cortisol bump is very closely associated with anxiety, depression, feelings of kind of low affect later. So the things I'm talking about right now are slow. They're slow acting. They work over the course of days or weeks. And so a lot of times it's like people will stay up late watching a movie till two or three in the morning. Fine, do that. Enjoy life. Go out dancing. Well, you know, now no one does that. But when it's when it's safe to do it or whatever your protocol is, enjoy life. But if you're chronically getting a lot of light in the middle of the night and you're not getting a lot of bright light in your eyes early in the day, you're wearing dark sunglasses all day, you're coming inside and you're not getting that bright light stimulation from sunlight. You're setting yourself up for low affect and mental health issues and worse, perhaps, or at least just as bad. The habanula, this brain area has connections to the pancreas. You start disrupting blood sugar rhythms and people start getting hungry in the middle of the night. It's associated with type 2 diabetes. There's a paper published in the journal Nature last year. So. Look, these two pieces of brain were designed to see objects, but their first job was to tell the rest of the brain and nervous system and body when to be alert, when to be awake, how to run its digestive system, its immune system. Get that bright light early in the day for just, you know, five, 10 minutes. Just go outside and get that bright light. Drag your kids out there. You don't have to do it at sunrise. You don't have to see the sun crossing the horizon, but there's so much data to support these behaviors that I'm talking about. We're talking dozens, if not hundreds of studies supporting this stuff. So totally cost free, right? None of this, none of this involves buying anything, but it does require some discipline. Very short intermission here, folks. I'm glad you're enjoying the show so far. Don't forget to follow the show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. Now on to our next guest. Welcome back to the program, everybody. Okay. You ready? You want to live to 200 years old? Did you hear what I just said? Would you like to live to 200 years old? Would you settle for 150? Right? Well, this man doesn't want to settle for 150. He doesn't settle for 120. And I've been fascinated with him because there's so many mutual friends. He's an author. He's got a book out called The Science and Technology of Growing Young by Sergei Young. That gives you an idea of what his name is because I just finished this book in two days. He's a longevity expert. He's the Benjamin Button of Planet Earth right now. He's also founded the Longevity Vision Fund, which is a fund dedicated to technologies that can extend lives and the quality of lives. So I'm so excited to have this man here today. This is going to be a compelling, note-taking, awesome vision-stretching conversation. Sergei Young, welcome to the program. Hi, everyone. I'm so excited to be here with you today. So am I, brother. All right. So let's we're going to talk about things that exist now that can help people live longer. Yeah. We'll talk about some things that are on that 10 year horizon like you like to do. And then some stuff that may be 20, 30 years out. But first off, why do you have this belief? Because average life expectancy now is around 78 years old, somewhere around there. Yeah. What makes you believe that over the next couple of decades, people may live to 150 years old, maybe even 200 years old. What gives you hope and belief that that's possible? Yeah. So basically this exponential power of technologies which finally arrived to this world. Like the science, I mean, could have been exist 30, 50 years ago, but like it's just combination of technology and science which bring us this hope and this desire and finally ability to live longer. Like 30 years ago, like you spent $3 billion of government money to sequence one human genome. Right. And 13 years. Right now, just few hours, right? And a couple of hundred dollars. Again, 20 years ago, this CRISPR thing was available to handful, literally handful of people who had really serious genetic disease. They were like really unlucky in genetic lottery. And today we all, you know, part of global experiment of gene therapy. You know, if you look at mRNA vaccines, which is the like modernized, it's an outcome of gene therapy. So that's amazing. And full disclosure. That like, like the first time that we will be able to check like what, what's the life's maximum lifespan extension that we'll do. It's going to be really far away from here. So I'm 49. So to check if I can break the sound barrier of the maximum lifespan of 122 years that we have to the end in the world, guys, we will need to kind of stick together for another 73 years. It's going to be amazing 73 years. We don't know how the world will look like in 73 years. So like it's, it's all about aspiration. It's all about getting the message across. And the message is we all going to be living longer or radically longer in this world. So let's just be prepared for that.