4.13. The Dropped Episode

What's up everybody? It's a brand new episode of Nobody Asked Us with Desi and Kara presented by Brooks Ruddy. Woo-woo! All right, love it. That's actually... You have that. Auto, auto. We've just built that into the intro. Jk, Chris is there. Did Chris do that? What? Yeah, I don't have it right now. He's on his game. Next time I'm on, I'm going to add more sounds. I don't even know what. More sounds, more sounds. Okay, well, we are laughing. It's a beautiful Monday. How is it in Michigan right now? It's good. I'm back in Michigan. We had that discussion. You saw the orange-blue wall. Like, where is she? We left Florida. It had the longest drive ever. It was just terrible. Yeah, what is that? I was going to fly and I was like, no, I'm not going to see Ryan for a couple weeks here. I'll just spend some time with the boys in the car, take one for the team. I was like, I'll drive with you. And he's like, awesome, that's great. And then we sat in traffic forever. Everyone was leaving Florida at the same time. So we split it into two days, which was even, I don't know if it was better or worse. It was necessary. So we went to Chattanooga. We got to Chattanooga in like 12 hours, 11 hours. It was insane. Stayed the night and then got up and did the rest of the drive, got home at like 7 or 8 p.m. on Saturday. And we're back in Michigan. The weather's cooperating at least. It's nice here. I've had two nice runs outside on the dirt roads, but yeah, a couple more hours and I'm out of here. Wait, how long does the drive from Chattanooga to Michigan? I want to say 10-ish, 10-11 maybe. Okay, that's a haul. Might have been a little less than that, but there was a lot of traffic. There's just a lot of sitting around in traffic. How are the dogs in the car? Little angels. Oh. Like they don't need to stop. They don't need to do anything. They just sit back there and sleep. They don't like to be next to each other. Rivers loves Boston. Like he wants to be with him all the time and like snuggle with him all the things in Boston. We'll just get disgusted and move in the car. They're just like, wasn't enough space because it's also all our shit from like a month and a half. And so they were like snuggling up together. It was so cute. Oh. And then they got home and they were like, ugh, grab that tree. But yeah, they're troopers. And then like Boston loves a good hotel. He's got a pretty good hotel tracker. He stayed in some pretty, some pretty respectable places. So we stayed at a Weston in Chattanooga. It was like, just book whatever's available. Let's get there. They had some massive event going on there. Like 500 people are using the valet right now. So sorry if it takes a little while or like what? But yeah, anyways, we got in there. Boston took the elevator up to the room. Rivers was there too. But he just jumped in that bed like he was a king. Like he knew exactly what was going on. He was like, okay. Wait, is that the Zoomy picture we saw? We saw a picture on social of one of your dogs jumping on the bed. No, that's Rivers. When he gets his hair wet, when his hair gets wet, he gets like really squirrely. So yeah, that was like the end of his zoomies. And he was just like ripping through the house. Watch out, watch your shins, watch your ankles, close, open all the doors so he doesn't like bang into something. And he just goes. Right. Yeah. Oh. Zoomy. That was fun. So you're about to take off for a long time. Yeah. About. I mean, honestly, it's been like three and a half weeks, which is terrible. Well, will you be, you'll be home before Boston slightly or not? I'm going to fly from Morocco to Boston. Oh, you are? Yeah. I have an event on Thursday, I think Wednesday or Thursday. So I'm flying straight there. Okay. Let's actually talk about the next few weeks for both of us, but most importantly for you. So you fly out tomorrow. Not most importantly, but that's fine. Go ahead. Well, you are actually racing. Well, I'm doing so. I'm doing it. I'm going on an adventure, but yes. Okay. Go ahead. I'm flying out tomorrow. So yes. And where are you going tomorrow? Tomorrow. Which by the way, the Burke recording this on Monday. So. Yeah. So I'll leave Tuesday afternoon-ish and fly. Okay. Through Atlanta. I don't know if you, if you've been watching the news about airports and air travel or if I'm just getting bombarded with all the worst stuff ever. Knock on wood for me. Send a little prayer. Yeah, I am going to knock on wood for you. So the travel gods, but I'll fly through Atlanta and then from Atlanta direct to Marrakesh and I land at like six or seven in the morning. So you get there Wednesday? I think so. That sounds right. And then the rest of your crew is all coming in around the same time. Yeah. So we'll have myself, Magda, Dave, D-Hash on Instagram. Dills. I love his photography. He's great. Yeah. Super good dude. Dills and then Andy Cochran. So two people on the media team, but we'll all get in sometime on Wednesday. Andy and I have good plans to go to a museum and kill some time. Maybe get a Yogan and then hopefully that keeps us up enough to fall asleep at a reasonable time. So you guys are there, but are you there to get used to the time zone change? Because your big run slash race is until the next week, right? No, it's, well, kind of, I think. So that'll be what? Wednesday. And then Thursday we get on a bus at like 10 in the morning. And that bus goes to, I think, either straight to the desert. I think it goes straight to the desert. Okay. And then you do one night of pre-camp in the desert. And then the next day is a technical check day. So like they weigh your bag, make sure you have all your required gear. You check your luggage. So make final decisions on what you need. And then your luggage goes away. Then you have dinner that night. And then the next morning you start racing. So I think that's like Friday. So you start racing on Saturday? Friday or Saturday, I think. Friday or Saturday. I don't know. I'm just going to kind of roll with it. When we're out there, if they say it's time to race, I'll be ready. If they say, hey, you got a couple more days, I'll be ready. And how many days is the race? Six or seven. This is it. I'm in my ish era. I'm ready for this. First of all, my son would kill me if I didn't do this. Because it says six, seven. But second of all, this is the side of Des. I don't really know. Because like for racing on the roads, you're so dialed of the day it's coming, right? And you're like, I don't know. I mean, the way you described it with like the bus trip and then a pre-camp and then a check. I'm like, we're already on Sunday, but you're like, no, I think it starts on Friday. It could be Sunday. I honestly, I like I've got packed enough stuff for every day. I think I'm like a few extras and then I can take stuff out if I need to. Right. So I'm worried about six to seven days in the desert. I'll know exactly when I get there. And, and like, that's it. That's all I'm focused on. I'm like, do I have fucking food for the days? Do I have enough contact lenses for the days? Yes. Everything else is extra. Okay. So you're running across the desert six or seven days, six, seven, six, seven. And then, sorry, I'm a 15 year old. And then even though supposedly it's not even cool anymore, but he still does it to me all the time. Okay. Anyway, then you finish at the end of the desert and then what do you do? So then there is a reception. I think like, so you drive, you drive out of the desert like a couple hours. It's not as long. So you go to a smaller town that night, I think, and then I think you do a reception the next day. And then the following morning they drive you to Marrakesh for departures. I'm going to stay in extra day in Marrakesh. I had two extra days and I was like, I found this bougie hotel and like, I've had, I went with my sister years, a couple of years back in like, we went and had like a really good meal, but we didn't stay there. I booked it and I'm like, I'll have some good eats. They had like, maybe I'll get a massage. It could be in the car. Yeah. And just like hit reset. So I thought I was going to have two days and then this event came up in Boston. They're like, Hey, can you be there this day? And I was like, I can be for a price. So what day are you arrived? So you're flying from Marrakesh to Boston. Yeah. And I get in. And what day do you arrive in Boston? I feel like this is behind the scenes work that I should have asked you, but. No, it's okay. I feel like this unraveling is good for me too. I'm figuring it out with you. So, okay, that's this week. I fly on and this is the time zone thing, right? So that never makes sense in the phone. But I get in to Boston, I believe on the 15th, which is Wednesday. And then I have an event the 16th. Okay. Dude, you're going to be so wrecked. Yeah. But what's super exciting in Boston is that we have. Bop, bop, bop. I'm not fine. Yeah. Do you have the details of that? It's not on the 18th. Okay. I'm going to put that at six o'clock. I think. Right. And it's at the bout the. Berkeley. My God, I should. The Berkeley. Yeah. Yeah. That's what it's called, right? I think so. Anyway, Art Center, maybe. Yeah. I had it pulled up. I'm so, but yeah, the Berkeley performance center. Okay. And so everyone should come see us because it's a big venue. So we have lots of seats and it's going to be super fun. We have lots of seats now, but once his pod drops and everyone goes to the show notes and smashes the link and grabs himself a ticket, they'll be gone quickly. So. They'll be gone a lot quicker. Yeah. Yeah. And actually we already sold a lot, but I think there's a lot left. I believe there's a VIP option. There is a VIP option. Which is super cool. And you would show up at five and hang out with us. Maybe cocktails. I heard something about cocktails. Yeah. I think I was talking to Garrett about this. They were talking about it like being a cocktail situation, like a mingling, but the reality is if you guys come, you probably like want to talk to us. Would you rather, or get a cocktail? I think you're still my field to get a cocktail, but I think we're thinking like, you're probably going to want your picture with us and like get your autograph and have a quick chat. So it'll probably be less like everyone's just mingling and more you get your time with us. Like a wine type thing. Yeah. Probably. But I'm excited about it. Ish. Okay. Ish. Something like that. Yeah. So you do the live pod with me on the 18th, which is Saturday. Sunday morning, we do a, you and I are doing a group run from Brooks. I think at nine. 15. Monday. I think you have other stuff going on Sunday. Is he Sunday? Yeah. Okay. So Monday you're running Boston. Tuesday you're flying to London. Yeah. You're flying to London. I'm going on Tuesday. Okay. The writer, are we racing? I hope our planes don't crash into each other. I'm sure you'll beat me there. I don't, I don't remember. I'm like, because I'm trying to stay on United, I go like Boston to like Newark or something and then Newark there. I know. I'm just kidding. You might be on the same flight as CB though. And then in London, I can't remember. Do we have a group run there? Great question. I'm worried about tomorrow. No, it's fine. I feel like this is the planning behind the scenes process, but also it gives people like, okay, hey, like I'm going to keep an eye out for this because I know this information is going to drop soon. Yeah. I'm pretty sure we have a group run. I'm almost positive we do, but I definitely could be wrong. I feel like on that Saturday morning, we might. Yeah, I think we do. I think we have a show and in fact, I'm positive we do. Okay. We have a group run Saturday morning in London and we'll have a show that people can kind of congregate and maybe listen to you in a cool space, but it's not quite cool space. We're not going to be allowed a ton of people in there. Yeah, but you can watch it from the outside and you're going to want to because we have a special guest. So that'll be fun. And then Saturday, we have the group run Sunday. You're running Boston and then are you flying home or sorry, London? Yeah, you're running in London and then are you flying home Sunday or Monday? Monday. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So then you're going home home and this is super funny. I know you're not. No, I am, but I have to fly through Boston. It's just ridiculous. And I actually don't have my Boston to Detroit ticket just yet. So that's going to happen. Oh, Mike, you're going to get stuck in Boston. Nah, even if I did, if there's anywhere that I could get stuck and be like, hey, can I come over and do a laundry? I have people there that I could do that to. You have people. You know some people. Person. Okay. So that is a lot. So you're leaving tomorrow and you'll be gone. You'll be gone for a long time. So London's the 26th, right? Yes. No. Wait. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. What's tomorrow? Yeah. So it's like just under a month. It's like a month. Yeah. Can't wait to pack. I cannot wait. That's going to be great. I can't believe you haven't packed. I am like a pack three days ahead of time. So I don't have to stress about it. That's insane. Cause then I would spend the next three days stressing like, I need to put this in. I need to put that in. And then I would always over pack because I'd be like, oh my gosh. No, I like on a long trip. So like I go this weekend to Bentonville, half marathon Friday. So Friday I'm going to be in Bentonville. If you're there. No, no, I've heard great things. I've never been, but I have to. I actually heard there's some great museums and other stuff, but I'll be at that expo like basically, I think like 230 till close on Friday. I'm super excited to meet people. Then I'm actually coming back home Saturday to try to catch the second half of culture track meet. And then the following weekend I'll be in Knoxville for the entire weekend for the Knoxville marathon. So I'll be at the expo a lot on Saturday. There's like a VIP meet and greet, although I think those tickets might be sold out, but then I am doing like a Q and A and everyone can come to that. And then I'll be at the race too. And then I fly back and then I fly to Boston later than you though. I fly in the day of the pod because Colt has a track meet on Friday. And I'm missing this track season. No 5k. Yeah. So I'm going to watch Colt race Friday, fly out Saturday, do the pod with you. Group run with you. Kid run at night. We moved it a little bit. And then call the marathon for world feed and then fly to London. Okay. Yeah. And then I, I'm like going to do a bunch of sightseeing in London if you're bored. Me and CBR are going to do a bunch of stuff. Wednesday, Thursday. Yeah. Well, I hope she's not on her feet too much. I know. I know. She's going to be a little bit responsible for that. Make good choices. Ryan's going to go to London, but we'll be like a good game to do some, some fun stuff. Yeah. I'm excited. That's like the vacation trip. Cool. But also we're going to get a pod and we're going to be very professional and do a great job. Yes, we will. But we have a couple of days where I actually want to be a tourist because that's where the Olympics were that we were on the team together. And I didn't really see anything because I was mommy and an Olympian. Yeah. And so I'm excited to go to London and be a tourist for a couple of days. Was that the last time you were there? Um, no. Actually, that's not true. I have been a tourist there in 2017. Adam and Colton, I went there for an upgrade ceremony. Oh, that's right. Yeah. Well, champs were there and they had an upgrade ceremony, but we literally found out about it 10 days out. I've repaid an ridiculous amount of money to have Colts passport rushed. And we went, we only spent three nights. So it was a really quick trip, but we did do some sightseeing while we were there. But like, I've never been to the castle or done any of that stuff. And I'm going to do that this trip. So I'm excited. We'll chat. We should talk. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. We should talk about plants. That'd be fun. Yeah. We could do a reel of us just seeing the city. That would be fun. Like, what's the music? Um, I never mind. I was going to say it needs to be a Beatles song. But anyway, yeah. Okay. That'll be fun. Yeah. Okay. So like that's your travel. That's my travel. You're running across the desert in the middle there. I'm not, I'm not, but it's going to be great. We meet together in Boston and London and I'm excited. It's going to be fun. We're going to have crazy stuff to talk about. Um, you got marathons coming up. Yep. And are you going to run any five Ks? Um, I signed up for a 5k Friday night in London. Oh, fun. They have this like Friday night lights 5k, but I, I'm running it with CB and it's part of her like shake out. And so better not. She better not. That's shit. She better not. We're not racing. We're not. I've done it with her once before. Okay. At a different meet. She doesn't race it. She just like shakes out the rest. I just don't, she doesn't strike me as someone who has like the self-control to like just chill. You know what I mean? Well, I feel like she doesn't just be like, let me rip a face off. Like, and that's what I'm worried about a race day. Like I'm going to be like, I swear. I know she's going to run like 250 and I'm going to be like, I see you. Probably. I know. I'm excited. It'll be fun. It's like, I, I wanted to run the 5k in Boston. It's not going to work out for me this year. And I was going to try like race the Boston one, but this one, we're just running and I'm excited more to come on that. We have matching outfits. It's going to be, it's like a whole thing. Okay. But so that'll be fun. And then I probably my only like 5k that I run, try that I run hard for me will probably not be till grandma's. It seems like, seems like as the schedule is churning, that's going to be the only one that I could actually. Yeah. Fun tuning the fitness or Chicago later. We'll see what happens. We'll see what happens. But I definitely have to. Definitely have to embarrass myself and run a hard 5k every year. It's like a thing I've promised to myself now. So I feel like that's not embarrassing at all. It's like, it's kind of embarrassing. It's a flex that you still got it. I don't really got it, but I have to find one. It's either going to be the one at grandma's or probably Chicago. It has to happen because I cannot, I have to do it every year. It's like a challenge to myself. You should do both if you can. All right. Well, we'll see. Okay. All right. Well, you have so much coming up. I obviously we're going to do a deep dive when you're done running across the desert when we talk into weeks, but how are the feels as you head into it? Are you feeling excited? I'm so excited. And I keep being like, oh, it's going to, I'm going to get 10 minutes into it and be like, this is so stupid because I'm preparing myself for the fact that I'm so excited and I should like, I'll probably, probably won't be as fun as I'm picturing it. So I'm trying to like downplay a little bit, but I'm, I'm pretty, pretty amped like all the gears here. I've been like trying to figure out the packing. I have about five to six pounds of when you have like required things you have to have. And then there's some luxury things. So I'm sitting on about six pounds and then Magda and Roxanne at goo made all the food. And I was like, what's the weight on it? And they have it like to the T, but it's right roughly around 11 pounds. So it's going to be looking at things and being like, can I get down to 15 pounds? Like how much can I shave off of what I have right now? But I think I'm in a good spot with the weight. And then it was like pretty touch and go for a while because the pack I'm using, I had a prototype early on and I sent it back for feedback. We dialed in all these things and then they were like, cool, we have to get this from, I think it's from, I want to say China, but it might be somewhere else in Asia. And he was like, it's coming, but they accidentally milled it to my house. He lives in Colorado and he's like, I will try to get it in the mail as soon as it gets here. And that was like Thursday. And then he's like, I didn't get it. Like I think I can get out Friday. And then if not, it's not going to get there till what time do you leave on Tuesday? And I was like, I'm not going to have a pack. Holy shit. But it got, it was at the house on Saturday when I got home. Fits great. It's awesome. It's the raid. It's a raid prototype and I think it's going to be sick. So that's exciting. Yeah. And it's all, it's all coming together. So I'm going to put it all in the bag eventually, but all the pieces are in places right now. So do you think you'll be updating us on social at all? Are you going to just be in the experience? So I'll have Andy and Dills out there doing stuff and I think I will give them my passwords and they can like update for me. Okay. So we'll know if you're alive. We'll know how you're doing. Yeah. We'll give in giving updates and you'll see the suffer fest, I think. Unless I'm just like, don't post that. This is terrible. We'll see. You won't. You'll keep it real. It'll be great. Okay. Well, I'm excited. I feel like you got like fit quick. I think so. I mean, I like, I guess it's one of those things where you always kind of look back and you're like, what else could I have done? Do I wish I had another week or two? Like I would have done, I don't know, more, a longer long run, maybe like 26 to 30. But I have a lot of like back to back days of really like 18 to 20. And so I was like, I don't know. I know how to run for a long time. I don't have to high mileage. The only day I'm really worried about is the 100 K, which I think is acceptable to be worried about. Yeah. Do you have any tips? What day is that? I don't know yet. So they don't tell you anything. I just know they like give you a book. Like they don't tell you any of the course, what the breakdown is, when the long day is, but it's just typically like the third or the fourth day. And then the other thing I've heard is that if like you're running well and you're in the top 50, you start after everyone that day. So like you get a later start, more time in the heat, things like that. So there's like, yeah, there's all these little twists that you find out as you go. Great. Interesting. Okay. So the fourth day is probably around the fourth day is my guess. Okay. Yeah. Well, I'm excited for you. This is like a whole new legit adventure. Like I know you ran that 50 K, but this is like a totally different beast. And it's going to be fun. I can't wait to break it all down. Like I promise everybody when she gets back to Boston or whatever day we'll be able to record, we will just, that's all we're going to talk about prompts. Yeah. I guess we should kind of think about the scheduling. We can talk about it later, but there's might be some gaps in how these roll out based on travel, obviously, as we described where we're going to be. So be patient and bear with us as we drop the patient. It seems like the episode where you talk to us about your experience is probably going to be a day or two late for sure. But we'll have, we're also going to have more pods than normal in the month of April because we'll have our live pod and then we will probably try to do a freshy fresh. So maybe this one will be delayed, but then you're going to get bonus pods. So be patient with us, but it should be a great month of content. Yes. Exactly. Perfect. All right. Well, I feel like there was a lot of talking. What do you feel like? I feel like if you were on running social media at all the last week, there was a lot of talk about the situation with Emma Bates and you can, and it got us talking, you and I, about other topics. You know, it got other conversations going for us about the sport and how contracts work and things like that. And so just for full clarity, I believe that Emma's going to be on Ally Feller's podcast tomorrow, which will come out tomorrow. So that will come out before this comes out. But I think we're allowed to sort of like talk about our thoughts on it, but also other conversations that it has led us to. Yeah. So I don't know where you want to start. No, it's good to just point out, like we're kind of speculating because we haven't heard of like a long form Emma interview about this. I mean, I think it really boils down to like one line in front of a post. It was just, I was dropped by my nutrition sponsor and I might even have that right. And I don't know if there was even a mention of pregnancy or it was just like I was dropped by my nutrition sponsor. So I think she said I was dropped by my nutrition sponsor because I was pregnant. Okay. And so that, that's it. That's all we've really know. That's all we've really heard from Emma, unless I've missed something, but we'll get a full story. It sounds like with Allie after this record. So I think that it's fair to say we're just kind of going off that one line. And then also, I guess there's been a little bit of commentary from you can in response. I don't know if there's been like a formal statement or if it's been replies or it's been responses to other podcasts. I haven't seen much like directly from you can. I don't follow you can. I think that at first it was replies, but I do believe they eventually put a post up about it. Okay. And so it has like, I guess to say all that is like, it's a little bit of like a, to me is like right now it feels like he said, she said it's not really like a, like here's the cohesive info, like all the information of what one person went through and experience and then this is what our experience was. So we're reaching for a lot of information that we just don't have. I think that that is fair to say, but yeah, I think that's turn over different topics because of it. Right. Yeah. So I think like multiple things could be true. So like Emma said at the beginning of her video that she got dropped by her nutrition sponsor because she got pregnant. Again, as you said, we're going to, we haven't heard anything else from Emma and we will tomorrow, but it'll be too late. You'll be in the desert. We won't be able to talk about it. So we're going to talk about it today. And then you can first was replying to people saying, we love Emma. She was a great ambassador for us for three years, but her contract came to an end. And then finally they did put out a timeline and I can't remember where they put it. I know that they emailed it to some people who are writing about it and they said, you know, her contract was up in December. We started negotiations in the fall. We told her that we didn't have the same financial situation that we had in the past. We offered her like a reduced contract. We didn't know she was pregnant. This is where it might get murky. Supposedly there was some discussion after, or maybe before they knew she was pregnant at the end of November about, well, maybe we could work out a different contract, but they never, it was never official. And then they found out they did find out that she was pregnant. And then in January, they made her the offer that they had originally offered her and she turned it down. This is according to that, right? So it's like, I don't know. I don't know anything because I don't. You just know what's been put out there, right? What's been put out there? And whether that's true or not, or what it's been tailored to, we don't know. So it led to this conversation obviously about like pregnancy and athletics and then also like, what does it mean when your contract is up with a brand and does it mean that you should automatically be renewed or does it mean that you owe them or that they owe you? And so I don't know where you want to start on this, but it led to these sort of secondary conversations from us. I guess my first thing I think about when reading or hearing Emma's statement is, what does it mean to be dropped by a brand? Because I feel like that's a very specific word that is probably used too much and pretty incorrectly a lot of the times, but it's also like if you're with a brand, it sometimes can feel like you're dropped even though a contract just finished, right? Yeah. I actually think it's very rare for an athlete to get dropped. Right. I think for an athlete to get dropped, for me, this is just my interpretation would mean that you have a contract and they just dropped you. They just stopped paying you. They ended the contract early. That would be my thought when I hear the word dropped because like people used to always say about me, oh, Nike dropped Karen. I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. A contract came to an end and then they tried to get me to sign back on and I said, no, nobody got dropped. I didn't get dropped. The contract ended and I chose not to renegotiate. I think even from a brand perspective, I've been with in relationships with brands and the contract ended and they chose not to renegotiate. That still didn't mean I got dropped. That just means the contract ended and we chose not to move forward together anymore, right? Right. Whether it came from my side, which a couple of times it did, or it came from the brand side, which a couple of times it did. The word dropped for me has a really heavy connotation of something nefarious happened. It's synonymous with terminated, right? Yes. Like this was more in breach of or there was a morality clause or something in the contract was done improperly and thus we've terminated the contract prematurely, not like the end of the services were reached and this contract has been completed. It's like we've cut this off early and terminated the agreement, right? Do we agree on that? That's what I would think. I would totally agree with that. When she said I was dropped, I was like, oh, that's bad. Right. That's bad, bad, bad, bad, bad. You can't do that. Right. Yeah. You don't look through the contract and go like pregnancy, line, whatever, great, right grounds for termination. Yeah. Terminated, dropped. Right. Yeah. That would be really bad. However, it does sound like, because her agent also entered the conversation. It does sound like her contract ended December 31st. Which is typical. Right. Yeah, which is very typical. And then there was some conversation about renegotiating the contract and that I guess is up for debate of how she was offered, what she was offered. But so technically, as far as we can tell, she wasn't actually dropped. She just, her contract ended and they didn't move forward together. That's my understanding. That's kind of, I mean, that's from looking at the timeline of this January or December 31st. Is it 30th or 31st? I don't know. I never get those right. 31st. 31st. More fun in December, obviously. So yeah, I mean, that's a typical date where you go like, okay, we have been working on this for months and trying to renegotiate and then there's like, interestingly enough, this times up with a lot of people who just resigned or just announced being ending a partnership or the end of a partnership. I think we saw Dom Scott, Clayton, obviously, Brooks, Nell Rojas, left Nike and announced Ultra. So like it's kind of in time with people who maybe had been working on negotiations and then whether or not they, you know, agreed to something new, it all kind of lines up. And I think like, it's interesting to see how different people respond to it. Like obviously Clayton was like, hey, had a great partnership with ASICs, really awesome. I've decided to move on and then announce something new, but wasn't like I got dropped by ASICs and I'm signing with someone new. Right. So I think that solidifies that in my mind that that's the right way to think about it. Yeah, I agree with you. Yeah. And even Kierna Mato said that her contract with You Can came up at the end of this year as well and they weren't moving forward with her. And I don't know if they offered her something and she turned it down because it was a smaller rate. Again, this is all just like speculation and so much of this is private. And I don't know that You Can has NDA built into their contracts. I have no idea. I just know like in the past with Nike, they were built into my contract and like, so it's all secretive, but in the end, I ended up just breaking it so I could tell the story truthfully and I was like, if I get sued, I get sued, but whatever. Some contracts have that built in and some don't. I have no idea. I don't know. I've never worked with You Can, so I don't know. But it made me think a lot of things. Like you just said, like, do you think that when an athlete finishes a contract, whether it's short or long, that they owe a thank you post to the brand? That's a great... I think we've actually had this exact question before and I don't know that we answered it. It was just sort of like, huh, makes you wonder. I don't know. I think it's completely up to the athlete and how they feel about the partnership. I think, I guess, if it was Brooks and my term came to an end and it was like, I've been this brand for 20 years and they just didn't make me a new offer. I personally would have felt like I had a great relationship with them and I would probably say thank you unless I just completely deleted all my social and there was nothing there. I mean, there's other brands where it's like, oh, this is a two-year deal. It was fine, but it almost felt transactional, not really like this is a great relationship. So I can see either way. I guess it's just very personal on how you felt about the partnership. What do you think? I don't think anybody owes anybody anything, honestly. It's a contract and you both upheld your end of the deal. You did the racing, you did the posting and they did the payment. If you want to post, I think that's great, but I don't think it's required on either end. We were talking about this before we recorded and it kind of quietly left Guazelle a year and a half ago and it was one of the harder decisions for me to make, but I felt like for the success of the brand, I thought that they really needed to invest in someone new and I had an opportunity to renegotiate my contract at Brooks that would make my life simpler and reduce the amount of appearances I had to do and it was a really hard decision. And we parted ways very, very amicably. Like you will never hear me say something bad about Guazelle. And there was a discussion between myself and Guazelle of like, well, we want to acknowledge how you helped us grow the brand and we have different ideas, but we're also worried that that'll draw attention and people will be like, well, why is she leaving? They must have done something. You know, and in the end, I said, you guys do what's right for you. I love you. I'll love you forever. You guys gave me my career back. I'm never going to say a bad word about you. I'm going to continue to support you. And that doesn't isn't going to change whether you think me for your support or not. And vice versa. And so we kind of decided to just continue our friendship, but not like making an announcement about it. So I think, I don't know. I think it's all just like really. I think it's really personal. I don't know. I can see it being perceived in the other way too, where it's like, oh, you want to use me for one last NIL name, image likeness, like let's get one more little boost. Like, I know that's super cynical, but I could also see someone being like, no, like we didn't come to an agreement. We didn't come to terms, obviously. Would have loved to, but I'm not going to take away from the next thing I'm doing. Right. With one last like little thing here, or like if it's the 31st and you're like, you know what, I have one more social post for so fine. Right. Get it. But yeah, I don't think there's a right answer, but I can also see people kind of digging into those late ones and being like, oh, what's the motive? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's a good point is like most contracts require social media, right? So if you've already fulfilled all of that, you fulfilled all of that. Like now you're giving them press for free that you were paid for in the past. Or if you have one left, that's like a nice way to like close the loop and give them, I don't know. I just think, I just think we have to remember that these are contracts. You're contractor. You have fulfilled the contract. Like, like you were just talking about Clayton leaving ASICs and deciding to move to Brooks, that doesn't negate the support that ASICs gave him for all those years and it also doesn't negate what Clayton did to elevate ASICs during that time, but they've decided for whatever reason that, yeah, whatever reasons Clayton's going to move on and go to Brooks. And so not, I mean, it's, yeah, I think these are kind of different conversations than that, than the Emma Bates one, but it's just Emma Bates, but it's like, I don't know. I just, I see all these posts about like thanking their sponsors and then I see other posts being like, you know, it is always a little bit funny to me when someone has been like all in on a brand or all in on a product and then like two months later or a month later, they're all in on another one. Yeah. I'm like, wait, what? I thought they had the best shoes or the best this or the best that, you know, but it, that's also just a reminder to everyone following along that you are getting paid to endorse these products. Right. That's what, I mean, that's a very good, like, friendly reminder that athletes are supported by these brands and it's quote unquote sponsorship, but really it's, it's partnership and, you know, you're adding credibility to the brand. You're bringing in an ideal world. You're bringing value to the brand too. So yeah, like you are doing the social posts and saying it's the latest and greatest and that is your job. Um, but it's job, jobs, keyword there. Right. Yeah. All right. What do you think? Um, I mean, I guess there's still a lot of different questions here. So let's say you're renegotiating and this isn't on Emma Bates at all. I'm just thinking like about these kind of sticky decisions and moments and you've obviously gone through this before where you're in a situation, obviously as a female where you're going, like, I want to get pregnant or I am pregnant and how do you like, what, what do you think you owe a brand? Let's say hypothetically you're in between things and you know, you're pregnant, is that something you disclose? Like, do you think that, that you should, should athletes be required to do that? How does that fit into the conversation? Like, and there's different timings, I think for a lot of folks, but obviously this is a very unique one right now. Like if Emma Bates hasn't, and this is just using her name because this just happened, but like, let's just say she doesn't disclose this, that she's pregnant yet and she's in conversations with brands. Like what type of responsibility does she have to say, this is the situation of where I'm at in my running career, this is my physical situation, this is my pregnancy situation, like, or is it, does that not matter? Like, should that not matter to a brand at all? Should you be able to sign a deal and then, you know, a month later be like, Hey, surprise. What do you think? I mean, I think that, I think that there should be a mutual respect on both sides personally. Like when I, before I was ever pregnant, before I went through fertility treatment, I went to Nike and said, I want to have a baby. This is the timeframe. I want to know what's going to happen to my contract. And then I wrote a whole book about this that they told me nothing would happen. And then actually they stopped paying me. But I did believe like, Hey, I'm going to tell you this because I want you to know, and we're so, we're, we're a partnership. And if I can't race for a year, I want you to know, so we can start thinking about how do you promote me when I can't race? Like how do you promote me as a pregnant woman, as a mother? You know, how do we work together in a way where you're still getting value from me when I can't perform? So I like just honesty on both sides. And maybe I'm being a little pollyanna here because I feel like until this conversation just blew up again, I thought there had been a pretty good shift in the way brands were thinking about this stuff. I think it's really valuable for a brand to see an athlete through all aspects of their life. We see brands support people through injuries. We support brands support people through like mental health struggles. So I think it can be really, really valuable. I do think that if you are like really respectful of your brand and they're really respectful of you, it should be an open conversation of like, Hey, I'm trying to get pregnant or I am pregnant. And then they can say, okay, yeah, great. Now, how do we make sure that we're still getting a return on our investment because you're not going to be out there using our product in a big marathon or on a big track race or whatever it is. So how do we how do we like step, take a step back and rethink our marketing of you over the next year and a half? Does that make sense? Yeah, no, I think that that's a really great point. It's just like having the conversation. And I think it's like when you even when you put together a pitch for any kind of like a proposal for any kind of brand sponsorship, it's like, this is why I'm valuable. This is where I can bring eyeballs. This is where I can bring performance and it's not like, and this goes into the whole thing like, are you an influencer? Are you an athlete? And yada, yada. And like some people are down on the influencer side, but I do think that that is a moment where you can say, no, like I also have this value. And it doesn't mean you're an influencer. It's just that you can be a more complete person for the brand versus just this performance athlete. And it's figuring out, you know, like how you can give that story to a brand and say, no, it's valuable. And this is why. Do you think brands are respecting that more? Like, do you think? Do you think if you went in and pitched that and this is what I'm doing as a pregnant woman and then as a mother and then eventually in performance, would you be surprised if brands were like, OK, I get it. I see the value, but we're only going to give you this. And then once you start doing performance, we'll give you that. Like, would that would that bug you or is that. Like a reasonable, I mean, I know every brand would be different, but what are your thoughts on that? I feel like in 2018, when New York Times did a big piece on all of this with Alison Felix, at least Mantania and myself, there was sort of this watershed moment and a lot of brands, like they redid their contracts. I know all of the brands that I was working with at the time. I had a new part to put with my contract talking about protection and just what we're talking about, a shift in marketing, if and when that were to happen. I think I would be surprised. This is just the only thing I'm thinking about is that. Sometimes. An athlete's performance might be declining. At the same time that their contract is up. And then they might also decide to have a baby. And I can see how and I'm not defending. I'm just saying, I can see how from a brand, they're like, well, we were already thinking that maybe you don't have the value you had. And if you're going to take another year off to have a baby, we're not sure if we want to move forward. And then all of a sudden you could be labeled as like a baby hater. Right. You connect the dots in the wrong way. Right. Right. So it gets really tricky because I do think that there should be maternity protection. I actually think it's like, you know, it was crazy when I stopped being paid and I would talk to lawyers and they would be like, there's no way they can do that to you. That's totally illegal. And then they'd be like, actually, holy crap, like you're a contracted athlete. You actually don't have rights that other people, you know, it felt like I was going crazy because I was being marketed as the woman that can do it all. I was on the cover of all these magazines, whatever. And they were like jarred. But I think like with these new contracts, Nike included, you are protected for longer now. I mean, there are so many pregnant athletes right now that have shoe deals. And so I don't know. I can't even remember what your original question was. I just feel like there's always room for improvement, always. But I feel like there was a big shift in 2018. And, you know, we saw like, Wazel signed Lauren Fleshman while she was pregnant. They knew she was pregnant. Altra signed Alicia Montanio and Amanda Bashman when they were pregnant. Solomon just signed Grace and Murphy while she was pregnant. So it's like there's and there's a bunch of girls that like Whitney Morgan just. Is that her name? Right? Whitney Morgan, she was ran for asics and she just moved over to Nike after having a baby. Emily Enfield is pregnant. Alaphine is with Brooks and has been pregnant and her contracts kept going. So that's why I think this story caught so many people off guard. Because although it's not felt like odd, right? Yeah. Although it's not perfect. It feels like we have shifted to realize that careers are long. People care about people in the long haul. There's all this research of who actually spends the money. It's typically the woman. So I think that's why this Emma's situation like just kind of was like, wait, what? We've done so much work to not be in this situation. So I don't know. I don't know if I'm answering your question. No, I mean, I think I do think that you answered it and that there has been progress. Like you said, it can always be better. And there's just a perception thing, too. Like you said, there is just a reality of the end of a contract no matter what. And like, oh, we were going to move forward with a lesser contract or maybe not resign something at all. But maybe the framing all of a sudden is like, oh, shit, like we can't we can't do that now because we're the bad guy if we do that. And I'm not saying that's the case. I'm just saying like it's a really tricky like time frame wise. That's a tough one. Like I don't know what I would do if I were a brand like to do then feel obligated to be like, shit, well, we got to do an extension for an extra year because the public publicity and marketing on this. Well, it's almost like a tear commitment, though, right? Right. Because you can't drop them right off. You can't say we're not going to renegotiate right after they have a baby either. So I just think like that's kind of one of the things that we were talking about before we recorded is that this situation has led us to think about so many other things. I mean, like how long does a brand. Oh, you. Oh, you. Yeah. Or do they owe you? Like, yeah, I've had, yeah, like if you, I remember I was with noon for a very long time. And then I had a very respectful conversation with the CEO at the time that was sort of like, you're not growing us anymore. You're fan, you know what I mean? Like your fan base knows us, they use us and we need to invest in a different area. And I got it. It was a very mature conversation. I'll admit my feelings were a little hurt for sure. Makes sense. It was like, I get it. They want to take the money they're paying me and they want to go pay a different trail athlete or a cyclist and kind of like expand to a new audience. And like that's business. They actually don't owe me to just keep resigning me. Well, yeah, I mean, I think, and maybe this is too harsh, but we talked about it a little bit before where it's like, if you hired a person to do your windows and they came in, they did them all in your house. And then at the end of it, they were like, okay, what's next? Be like, but we just hired you for the windows. I don't need you to do the landscaping or, you know, the roof. Right. Right. That's this is like, these were the deliverables you delivered. I paid you what I said I would pay you. This is the end of a contract. And it's not that I don't value you. Is that we did what we were supposed to do together. And now I need to work on the hedges. You know, yeah. But it's also really interesting. And this is the question that I think a lot of people have and like kind of look at is like athletes are contractors. Is there a way that ever changes where they can be, you know, like truly employees of the brand? And I don't, I think that's a huge ask. I think it's way more like, how do you become part of a league? Like World Marathon majors, how do we make you a league and then create an athlete like union that way? Or, you know what I mean? Like connecting the athletes into something that they can be supported by and protected with would be great. I just, it seems like such a reach for our sport. Well, and it's like, there's so many athletes and there's so many different contracts. Like, yeah, some are big, some are six, seven figures, but some are like $2,000 in product. You know. And so it's like, if you're, if you're, listen, I wish I hadn't been an employee of Nike because I wouldn't have lost hundreds of thousands of dollars for having a baby, but I wasn't, you know. And so I see how it'd be hard for brands to make athletes employees, especially with some of these smaller short, shorter term contracts. But that's like kind of the million dollar question is like, how do athletes get protection and how do they work together? And I think our sport is really tricky in that sense in which careers aren't, some careers are long, but some are shorter. They're out. There's so many different brands involved. There's so many different like types of sponsorship involved. And it's hard. It is really hard to get everybody. It's like kind of impossible to get everyone together. There's so many different interests that it's yes. It's such a big sport with so many different interests that I think, yeah, I mean, that would be a tough one. But if it could be solved, that would be amazing. That would be amazing. I will say a brand that has been supporting athletes, supports this pod. Emma Bates, Grace and Murphy, I believe. Kira Damato, maybe as well. Yeah, I think you have to hit the website. But Lagoon Pillows, a great supporter of athletes in all phases of their career and supporting this pod as well. So we love them. I love to take the quiz, Kara. And see what kind of pillow user I am. I'm still a chinchilla. I'm still a chinchilla. I want to make sure that, I don't know, maybe I'm a fox sometime, but I can't confirm a chinchilla. You're an otter. Tell us about the other. I love the otter. It's I have like the cooling otter. It's like it's like the Corvette. Actually, I don't know anything about cars, but it's like it sounds good. It's like it's so great. And it's so funny because when we were in Saint Martin, I slept great there. Think because I was like, I never hit my, you know, I give myself 30 minutes of social media time a day and sometimes I override it. Quite often I override it. I never hit my limit there. I think I was just like so tuned into being in the moment. I slept so great, but we got home. And that first night and I laid down, I was like, Oh my God, I missed you, sweet otter. I missed your plushiness and your coolness. And I can't believe I was without you for 10 days. Like you are amazing. So yeah, I love the otter. She's definitely a bigger girl. She has like some fluff. She's going to prop you up a little bit. But I love that pillow. I there's nothing else like it. It's so good. Yeah. I mean, I think we talk about this a lot. Just the price of a pillow, you go to the website, you're like, Oh my gosh, really? Um, I'm telling you right now, sleep goes a long way in recovery and health and performance. I think that's one of the big things that's going to come up at MDS is obviously recovery and sleep is going to be crazy. I won't be traveling with a lagoon. I'll be thinking about it every night as I will be dreaming about it. So I should my neck and try to become like work myself out of a question mark, like curing down into a question mark. But yeah, once I get back home, sweet, sweet chinchilla time. So I get it. And you can get 15% off your first order at Lagoon. Go to the website. We'll put the link in the show notes and use code all caps. Nobody asked us for 15% off your first order with the gun. Do you love it? Do you love my commercial voice? I love it. I'm actually going to circle this back to close the loop on the conversation we just had, which is that Lagoon does support Emma Bates. And so we, you know, there's been a lot of discussion about boycotting. Brands this past week. And if you, this is a way to support a brand that is supporting people in all stages of, you know, like, I don't race anymore. I'm an old lady. I'm probably peri-mon-posal. I don't even know, right? They're supporting me and there's supporting Emma and Kiritomoto and a lot. Dakota Popain, a lot of athletes. But this is just like the one thing that I'm just going to say was driving me nuts about this entire conversation, which is that. It's okay to be angry and to want to support pregnant women and to be like, I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and I'm going to put my purchasing dollars towards Lagoon because I know they're supporting people. But the hypocrisy of some people, if it's easy to say, I'm not going to support a brand that you already didn't use their product. It's a lot harder when you actually use their product. And that's basically all I'm going to say there is that there was a lot of hypocrisy in my eyes. You can go read my threads about it. But if you truly care about this, like women being supported, then you should really be thinking about the way you spend your money. And even if it's hard for you to not support certain brands. That's the point. Right. That's the point. Yeah. That's the point of the boycott. It's like it should be a little bit difficult and uncomfortable. It should be hard. It should be like, oh, I really liked that. But I don't like how they treated these people or these women or whatever. So that I don't even know. I shouldn't have added that. But that was one thing that was kind of bothering me in this whole discourse was like, yeah, it's easy to be like, oh, I'm not going to use that brand that you never used. Right. Well, yeah, I mean, it's easy to post a social media complaint about something that doesn't impact you at all. Right. Like, yeah, I'm just wanting to be in the conversation. That's it. Yeah. It's like, great. Yeah. Yeah. Don't forget about me today. I get in there like, OK, this really didn't impact you at all. I had nothing to do with you, but I get thank you for posting. Right. Yeah. Deep breath. OK. And if you really, really care about supporting women throughout pregnancy, there are women doing really great work in this space, specifically Alicia Montagno and Allison Felix. And so a reminder, especially to the dudes, you could actually elevate their work. Yeah. Because they've been leading the charge here and they have like Alicia Montagno has her thing used to be Anne Mother, but now it's, oh, I can't think because I'm on the spot. And then Allison Felix. Yeah. Yeah. Allison Felix is really big in this space, too. She was given a grant by, I want to say Melania Gates. And I know that's not right. What's Bill Gates ex-wife's name? I think Melinda. Melina. Melinda. Melinda, thank you. God, I'm like saying Trump's wife's name. I'm like, I know this. All right. She gave Allison a grant to work in this space as well. So if you are really passionate about this, you should follow Alicia Montagno and Allison Felix and you can get involved that way. And if you really care, you can elevate their work because they're doing great work in this space. Well, you've done great work, too. And I think that your book is a really good example of that. So also get the book. If you don't have the book, go give it to a friend. If you've already read it, it's a great story and example of people fighting for things that matter and changes that need to happen. And I think it's the full story. You know, it's like this is the blow by blow, the good, the bad, the ugly of how it shook out. And I think, you know, what we don't have in this scenario yet, which more soon it sounds like is the full story. So yeah, if you want a full story in the meantime, go check out Kara's book. Thank you. That's actually a great note. We don't have the full story and we won't any by the time we get it. I don't know that it will even be able to discuss it because so much will be going on. Right. Yeah, sure. But, um, OK, well, should we do a top five? We should. Let's send it home with a top five. OK, let's do something positive here. All right. Hey, negative top five. I'm going to shout out the UMD men's hockey team who I watched them play twice this week. Unfortunately, they lost last night in Michigan and will not be moving on to the frozen four. But I've loved the UMD Bulldogs since I was a kid. I had my UMD Bulldog pins. My stepdad had season tickets. And so whether it's the women or the men, I love watching them. And so the women lost, unfortunately, a couple of weeks ago, and the men lost last night. But yay, Bulldogs. I will always love the Bulldogs. That's a good one. I like that. OK, I'm going to go with my MDS squad. We're all ready to go. Everyone's done the training. But I think my favorite part so far is that we've got this group thread going on. And everyone is just sort of like taking care of each other already. Like, hey, I got extra toilet paper. Hey, I got extra sunglasses. Hey, I bought your food ready. Oh, do you need a long sleeve? Like, it's just like we're going to have way too much stuff. But I just think it's it's already fun to kind of like have built team camaraderie. And we're not even in the same place, which might be the last time we're friends. Because once we get in the same place and we're sharing like like tiny sleeping area and we smell and we're hangry together, it could that could be it. This could be the best it gets. So this is the top five moment for now. OK, like that. I, the last couple of years, have just gone to the major races and grandmas. So I am just going to say to the Bentonville, half marathon and the Knoxville marathon. I'm excited to go to a couple more races off the beaten path a little bit from at least the schedule I've been on the last two years and just hang out with runners. So I'm excited to have the opportunity to see you guys at these different places. Oh, I like that. I'm going to I'm going to piggyback on that and just say live pods, live events, in person stuff. We have the Brooks show coming up in Boston. Check that out in the show notes, probably just check the notes. And maybe it'll be there. Maybe it won't. We'll have some fun stuff in London, but also grandma's marathon Duluth fans pack in the house. They sold that out in like in two hours, three hours. I was like, maybe we need a second show. I didn't say that to us to anyone earlier, but I'm like, do we need to do a second show? Could we sell out a second one? But yeah, one at a time, we're excited for the live shows and we can't wait to see you all there and mix it up. How's that? That's a great one. That's good. OK, for my last, I'm going to bring us home and just say good luck to you because I'm excited for you. You're super brave to keep putting yourself out there and trying new things. And I know you've worked really hard to be ready for this, and it's so different than running on the roads. Like it's nothing the same. So I'm excited for you and kudos to you. I think it's like very exciting and brave and cool to see you try new things. And like you're not a person who's able to do anything quietly because you are who you are. You're an Olympian, you're a Boston Marathon champion. And so no matter what you do, people pay attention. So I just really respect you going out there and trying this really hard thing. And it's going to be awesome. And I'm excited for you. Thanks. I appreciate that. That's super kind in. Yeah, I mean, we'll get to talk about it no matter what, whether it's a great time or whether whether I fail spectacularly on the main stage. But it's going to be fun. I just hope I live to tell the tale. You will. We can't wait to hear about it. Love it.